not a fugue just complicated Bach. Organ music is often played with the hands on two different keyboards and the feet working the pedals. One one have to look at the music to see how many of the keys in the upper 3 parts are being played at any given time in which keyboard. They are programmed with different sounds by levers to choose the instrumentation then stored on "stops". On a pipe organ the rank of pipes is chosen by the lever. They generally mimic string and wind instruments.
Without wanting to sound too stupid, this piece is very symmetrical (the orange and brownish lines are usually going in opposite directions). I love the whole sound.
I just love it when people voice their opinions on others. Forcefully. And against the opposing persons will. Sort of like what im doing right now. Damn it.
My God, I have to wonder if Bach could have`written a piece that was anything short of sublime even if he'd tried to. Even cheesey computerized synthesizer effects can scarcely dim his genius.
(Apologies smalin; to my mind "cheesey synthesizer effects" is pretty much a tautology)
ah, this is the melody that will be heard in the everlasting halls of heaven by those who believe in Jesus Christus, the only Saviour of man, and keepeth his commandments in this short life.
In German class, I remember watching Amadeus, portions of Immortal Beloved, and portions of a movie based on the life of Bach, but I can't remember what the title of it was. If someone could let me know what movie it is I'm referring to, I would much appreciate it.
@pellicanification I never said "Amadeus" was based on the life of Bach. I know it's about Mozart. I said that I also saw a movie about the life of Bach, but I couldn't remember the title of it. That's what I was asking.
OK, I get it now. See, I thought that in a previous post to someone else you were saying that each section has the same melody as every other section but in a different voice, which clearly isn't the case. You're saying that there is a different melody and each voice carries that melody once in each section. I can see that, although I didn't see it before you pointed it out. It's a little hard without the benefit of dynamics or differing instrumental timbres.
@CronosPrime1 Can you hear what I described in my comment to chopnandliszt? If you can recognize that each of these sections is based on a different melody, then it should be obvious that they are different sections. If you can't hear that, then ... well, it's not going to be obvious.
@smalin Do you have a favorite composer? You seem to post a lot of Bach. For me, Bach is definitely my favorite though you could find something to like with all composers.
@CronosPrime1 Section 1 ends at 0:58, section 2 ends at 1:52, section 3 ends at 2:37 and section 4 ends... well,.. at the end of the video. Maby that will help.
@CronosPrime1 This is not a mood piece about Jesus Christ. It's an organ chorale prelude (a liturgical genre) on the chorale "Jesus Christus, unser Heiland". My comments from 7 months ago explain how each line of the chorale is treated in a separate fugato "section", as it's being naively called without a clue as to what these sections are about or what this piece is about or what an chorale or chorale prelude is.
Excuse me, but I wanted to ask, do you, or can you sell the music that you have made on youtube? I'm just curious if you have a website where you can sell mp3s from, or does the copyright makes it impossible to do such a thing?
I could sell the music I've put on YouTube (at least, the performances I've done myself), but I don't. I don't think it would be worth the trouble; I just let people steal it.
I think many of Bach's pieces are as hard to understand as today's atonal music. I don't understand the point of all those downward, upward scales being played "against" each other. However, I do know there's more to Bach than to the extent any ordinary people can understand and I blame this lack of understanding of Bach on my own narrowmindedness.
That being said, can you explain what you find so ingenious in this? I'm not saying anything against it. I just want to know more about Bach
Like all other composers of music, both classic and modern, there is feeling behind each sound made. All the sounds are suppose to describe their emotions, both the physically expressed emotions and the internal feelings they feel.
This is how he feels about Jesus Christ, and the hope he has because of him.
Looking upward, towards the celestial sky, where one is not shackled to death and despair, is described in the rising from low notes to high notes.
Every man's relationship with God and Jesus Christ is different in some way. I think we can understand Bach's relationship with his Savior by listening to his music.
@HerrQuixote Bach was a devout Lutheran and Paul's letters probably would have meant a lot to him there is a recent biography I can check you would agree he believes Jesus Christ is Lord?
The body as well as the spirit is mortal. The spirit lingers a little after the body has decayed, but the spirit itself will dissipate and go the way of all the earth.
Only God is Immortal and Eternal.
it is only in the mind of God that we are preserved. Whether or not we are ressurected after we all die is completely unknown. Hence, faith in Jesus Christ while we are alive.
Well what you say is of real interest--still the question is what did Bach himself believe. He used to write praies to Christ and God on all his Ms. He probably would have disagreed with your understanding of the economy of salvation and of the risen Lord--but perhaps he is dead to the world and alive in Christ I hope so--I think he professed that but what do I know? I could well be wrong.
It's true that he did believe in Jesus Christ. That was part of his identity. But to call him a devout Lutheran would be inaccurate.
He was devout. No question. But people are often misrepresented by their labelled religions.
Catholics do not all believe there is a God. I find that hilarious and upsetting at the same time.
Now I feel Bach would of my same mind on many issues. Being alone as much as he was, I feel helped him see reality. Reality is hopeless. Jesus Christ gave him hope.
oh well, i wouldn't call that lifestyle but much more tradtitions given to them from their ancestors (parents mostly)
I think you are right, there are a lot of Christians (not only catholics) who pay the church taxes even though they do not believe in god.
i myself am an atheist, my parents are too, and they let us children choose for ourselves, which mentality is unfortunatly not often shared by parents who are believing Christian. but nor every Christian forces his children to believe in god..
Force is too broad a word to describe all the doings of Man.
I advocate Hope not Despair
Atheism is the default and natural state of man. It is as cold and as bitter as the sunless skies. True Atheism is without clouding, and is therefore the best of ways to see the Heavens. Still, it provides no way to get there.
It provides no warmth of Hope or Love to spark into flames the ether of our spirit. It does not make so that we may ascend from the dust or illuminate shadows.
Strict Atheism conceptually leads only to the unhindered death of the individual.
Most Atheists are not this naked in relation to their identity...where hope and love shelter and clothe the bare identity from the cold and bitter winds.
You must have some sort of Life Philosophy, where the identity(soul) in some form survives....
oh well, i personally never saw Atheism as bitter or something because first of all, i am Used to be not Bound to anything except the Physical and Social Boarders (Law and Order)
i Actually see Religions as a way for humans to satisfy different Needs.
so either a Atheist doesn't need that way because he hasnt as many needs, or he has another way to satisfy those needs.
thats actually why i personally never ever thought of joining a Religious community.
Which "needs" are you referring to? Aren't the needs of Man the same for everyone? The only difference between individuals, is which needs have already been satisfied.
I would love to hear this logic from such a rarity on youtube.
I would never Judge a Person only because he is a Part of a Religous community, but i don't like it, if people wan't to persuade me of their religous thoughts with a fanaticism and persistence, even when i told them not to keep on.
I like objective discussions about religion (and many other things) but not talking with someone who dosn't listen to my thoughts, but only harping on their thoughts.
I believe each and every individual must have his thoughts and feelings be edified by each and every individual.
If I am spurned, then I will dust my feet and never speak of the subject again with them, unless they wish to return to it at a later time.
If both people's are in agreement about the discussion, then the discussion should last for as long as both are willing to discuss it. If there were things left unsaid, then shame be on both persons.
So logically, I am taking reality as we see it now, and putting the Divinity factor in there. Even if there was no Bible, I'd still come to that conclusion.
I can show you exactly what I understand to be spiritual. Basically, if there was something "spiritual" it is best understood as the way* or pattern* that matter is arranged. It isn't the matter itself but the information enscribed with the matter.
I hope you find this logic \ coherent (which isn't often the game when God is involved) and to your liking.
Just keep in mind that spirit and element are inseperably connected much like how energy and matter are never seperate.
For instance. Take a rock and hit another rock with it. The energy transfer was sent in many different directions (because of the sound of the rock hitting the rock, you know some of the energy traveled into the air in order to produce sound waves.)
the energy left your body and eventually was shot off into an infinite number of directions.
If you are familiar with the Theory of Entropy, you would understand that EVERYTHING breaks down. (with an exception to the Divinity factor).
Since we know all things turn to dust, and we do, because we watch everything turn to dust....if there is a divine sentience...God, who is all perceiving, then he can "remember" the totality of an identity and give it form again via ressurection.
The "person" is generally composed of these parts.
spirit = arrangement(logic) of composition
body = the composition itself
mind = patchwork of information w/ a theoretical central processing that refers to itself as just that. The Self.
When I said each man's soul is his own, I meant that he had an entirely independent patchwork of information (memories) and an independent central processing unit.
Humanity is a collective of redundant systems called People.
To understand a piece like this is learning to hear what's going on in it.
There are four sections (starting at 0:07, 1:00, 1:52, 2:38); in each section, the main melody is played once by each voice, in the order tenor, alto, bass, soprano. The soprano (yellow) only plays when it has the melody; the other parts play throughout.
So, learn to hear where the sections are, to recognize the main melodies, and to hear the melody move through the parts.
@smalin The "main melody" is actually a "cantus firmus" consisting of the 4 lines of the traditional Lutheran chorale "Jesus Christus, unser Heiland." Each line is treated as the subject of a short 4-voice fugue in which the unadorned subject appears in the pedal part. The music illustrates the chorale text. E.g., the chromatic scales in contrary motion depict "through his bitter suffering he spared us the pain of hell."
Music really is the personal expression of the composer. Emotions can be replicated, but only if the original pattern is preserved....(i.e. sheet music or passed down folk songs amongst other sources.)
No matter the music, there is a basic interpretation you can have that anyone can conclude and agree on. However, if you listen to things as being more complex, you can notice a high pattern, in which creates the details that make every song distinct from other songs.
If you want to know more about a specific individual, Bach for instance, you have to learn his personal history and assume the basics first, then listen to his music, and learn that only certain types of sounds come from certain types of experiences.
The overall tone of the music expressed the tone of their life...at least on the personal level.
Music back then was VERY personal. You had tons of time to be alone composing notes together, and the strongest feelings you had, were personal.
@chopinandliszt One should not assume that all music was intended as entertainment or that the music can be appreciated without regard to it's purpose or the musical aesthetics and musical language of the period.
This is not a salon piece, like a Chopin waltz, nor a Liszt concert piece.
@chopinandliszt This is music for the Lutheran liturgy of Bach's era. It belongs to a specific liturgical genre known as the organ chorale prelude. This is what the organist would play before the congregation sung the chorale.
@chopinandliszt This Bach chorale prelude on the traditional Lutheran chorale "Jesus Christus, unser Heiland" presents each of the 4 lines of the chorale as the subject of a short 4-voice fugue in which the unadorned subject appears conspicuously in the pedal part like a plainsong.
@chopinandliszt The counterpoints spun around the chorale tune illustrate the text. If you consult the chorale text (which was well-known to Bach's congregation), and know even a little about Baroque affectations, rhetoric & musical expression, you would understand "all those downward, upward scales being played against each other."
The scales you refer to did not appear out of nowhere. They were counterpoints to each of the 4 appearances of the fugue subject of section 3, which ends with these scalar counterpoints presented in both parallel and contrary motion.
The "point" is that the scales were counterpoints to the fugue subject aka point.
@chopinandliszt Well...bach is one of those composers who always has a story with his pieces .. not the title "Jesus Christus Unser Heiland" In a german translation that means "jesus christ , our saviour" Which is obviously a religious aspect to the song, Now the upward scales being played against eachother could mean a struggle against your self on what to feel , or it could mean something mysterious. You need to listen to the music with all this in mind to get it.
After 2:07 you can see several "crosses" or X formations, a technique known as "Chiism" (fancy way of saying "crossism" or "X-ism") that Bach often employed in his music.
Some have taken this to reflect Bach's religious persuasions, but whether it does or not does not add or subtract anything from the music for me.
@pedantologist What you're observing is voices moving in contrary motion, a common feature in music, especially contrapuntal music.
But contrary motion is often deliberately exploited for dramatic affect or to illustrate the text. Take a clue from the words of the chorale "Jesus Christus, unser Heiland." E.g., the chromatic scales moving in contrary motion illustrate "though his bitter death he saved us from the pains of hell".
@pedantologist You may have been referring to the passages where the voices cross, which is also common in contrapuntal music.
In baroque vocal music the vocal bass to sometimes crosses above the upper parts for purely melodic reasons. This does not disturb the harmony because the continuo supplies the true bass an 8ve lower.
@redaverages - Agh, but most devout Christians do not know any better either. In fact, most of those bible thumpers are just as ignorant and bigoted as the loud mouthed athiest. In fact, the other day my wife was told she should burn at the stake while attending a Christian Christmas Concert to support some of her friends who were singing in the choir. The woman over heard my wife's conversation and surmised that she was pagan. How is telling someone they should burn any less ignorant?
I can tell you we get idiots and uncharitable people in all extremes of belief and in the middle. I am pretty conservative doctrinally but would have burned with shame if I heard someone in a church do that, in fact it would have earned a pretty stiff rebuke. Some people have in their heads that they should do better than Jesus Christ himself, but they don't have His love to people. And then of course they slip right up.
@Presidentjh While one might appreciate the piece without reference to religion, this organ chorale prelude was written to serve the liturgy, not to entertain. This is not abstract music. It's directly related to the text of the chorale in both it's fugato treatment of each line of the chorale and in it's expressive means. E.g, the harsh chromatic scales moving in contrary motion depict "through his bitter suffering he spared us the pain of hell."
@Presidentjh So many of our own kind are so...ugh, I can't think of a word to describe this. A war of words...a seemingly endless debate because of a title. It wasn't the author of the title that made the comments offensive, it was those who misunderstood. I've heard that many countries that rely on the internet take it seriously. Where I live...I can understand why so many call Americans thoughtless brutes.
If it wasn't for the church music would have taken much longer to come. This is coming from my agnostic self :D In other words, be happy the church used music as part of their service so frequently.
Oh sweet, that's really awesome as I'm a follower of Jesus myself. : ) . It''s been the best decision of my entire life... I've never had more joy knowing my soul is saved for eternity and experiencing the life that God gives you even on Earth. Thanks for the reply so soon!
@smalin - As for whether everyone at this time was a Christian or not - yes, in name only, pretty much everyone was. However, based on actions and true devotion, one can tell the difference between a true Christian and those who were simply going through the motions of society. A modern example would be Sweden - 72% of the population is a member of the Church of Sweden, yet upwards of 80% claim to be atheist. Are these people true C
@smalin - true Christians? I would say not. Maybe in name only, due to cultural traditions of being a member of a church, but in actions and deed, certainly not. As for having true knowledge, I could argue all day that Christianity, or even diesm, is many times more logical than atheism, so that point is obviously debatable. However, I agree, the price for one's beliefs should never be the need to insult others. BTW, I appreciate your work on here, great job! :)
@redaverages - Do you think people who called themselves Christians in Germany during Bach's life were "in name only" Christians? Or that they would have said that they were atheist? What if someone said you were Christian in name only? How would you demonstrate that they were wrong?
@smalin - As I said, I believe some Christians of Bach's time were "name only" Christians, much like today. Further, it is more accepted to be an atheist today than before, so I would guess that many who doubted then would have been more silent about it, though there were several prominent atheist/agnostic/doubters (Diderot, Voltaire, etc) - after all, this was the Age of Enlightenment. As for demostrating if i was a true Christian, it is simple - follow the teachings of Christ!
Voltaire was not an atheist nor even an agnostic but a deist (as I, an atheist, would also have been had I lived in his time).
Voltaire, living a century before Darwin and lacking any knowledge of modern biology or geology (to say nothing of astrophysics) concluded, reasonably enough for the time, that the appearance of a design strongly implied a designer, even going so far as to insist (again quite reasonably given the information available to him) that marine fossils...
@smalin - My point was directed at lardhat, who was, apparently, making the point that today, people "know better" than to be Christians. That somehow, our atheistic and largely anti-religious society has become enlightened in some fashion. However, as I implied, somewhat sarcastically, that his bigotry and profanity prove that he does not "know better." If knowing better means that we must insult other people and their beliefs, than I'm pretty sure that I would rather not know better.
@redaverages - well, there we differ --- even if the price of knowledge was that I'd have to insult people who were ignorant, I would choose knowledge over ignorance. I don't think that is the price, though ...
Your pronouncements are said with the utmost arrogance. Fortunately, your comment will be no more enduring or proving of your point than mine will of mine!
i need something to say i have heard all kind of music in this world but this style of music fugues is so strong just 1 note with the other one that can make each other so strong and keep further to make 4 voice fuga and its keeps going more stronger, thats why i like fugas and the mass fugeus of beethoven in his missa solemnis
oye QUE OSTIAS YO SIEMPRE IMAGINE UN METODO PARA VER LA MUSICA DE ESTE TIPO MAS BIEN ME LA IMAGINABA ASI. PENSE QUE ERA YO NOMAS EL QUE SE LE OCURRIA ESTO. NUNCA CREI VERLO EN REALIDAD
si en verdad asi es como se ve la musica compuesta en computadora, (MIDI) creo que de ahi salio la idea para mi es una buena forma de estudiar musica me parece mas claro
Beauty is in the ear of the listener and for me the more sombre interpretation by Walcha has a greater emotional impact which harks back to my original comment.
I am intrigued and excited that you, the performer, would come to a new feeling about the piece. This is something that I do not think happens often.
Really? I wonder whether I'm unusual. I change my interpretations of pieces all the time, especially if I listen to other performers' performances a lot. I'm working on Scott Joplin's Heliotrope Bouquet right now, and after listening to a bunch of YouTube videos, I changed a few things. It may be that because I have a relatively poor memory, I'm not so much influenced by my own previous conceptions.
I do not know who is playing in the Adalbertt version but it is not Helmut Walcha. I was referring to the recordings made in 1950 and 1952 by Helmut Walcha for the German company Archiv Produktion at which time this version of Jesus Christus Unser Heiland (BWV665) was played at 5'13". (In 1971 Walcha did a re-recording at 4'45").
I expect I would agree with you. My tempo is ca. mm=60; Adalbertt's version at mm=50 is enough to show how much "bigger" the piece can be if given the time. Walcha's 5'13" version would be ca. mm=40 ... wow, that's slow.
I originally performed the version here with a sampled pedal harpsichord sound, when I was 37. I'm now 55, and I'm sure I would play it slower today. Maybe in a few more years, with a real organ (a bigger one!) in a place with lots of reverb, I'll be in Walcha's universe.
Er kommt bald, freuen wir uns. Jesus.
060Tom 2 months ago
not a fugue just complicated Bach. Organ music is often played with the hands on two different keyboards and the feet working the pedals. One one have to look at the music to see how many of the keys in the upper 3 parts are being played at any given time in which keyboard. They are programmed with different sounds by levers to choose the instrumentation then stored on "stops". On a pipe organ the rank of pipes is chosen by the lever. They generally mimic string and wind instruments.
createsjg 6 months ago
anyone wants a political discussion that's about some conspiracy theory that has nothing to do with the music? anyone?
vanburikwouter 8 months ago
It would be GREAT if you try to do a video like this, based on "Ricercare a 6" from "Musikalische Opfer"
Psykarl88 10 months ago
Without wanting to sound too stupid, this piece is very symmetrical (the orange and brownish lines are usually going in opposite directions). I love the whole sound.
Markell1991 1 year ago
@Markell1991 No, you don't sound stupid when you say that. The symmetry is what makes it sound so nice. :D
ResidentPyro 10 months ago
I just love it when people voice their opinions on others. Forcefully. And against the opposing persons will. Sort of like what im doing right now. Damn it.
GenocidegingerInc 1 year ago
thank God for Bach
stargirlsusan 1 year ago
My God, I have to wonder if Bach could have`written a piece that was anything short of sublime even if he'd tried to. Even cheesey computerized synthesizer effects can scarcely dim his genius.
(Apologies smalin; to my mind "cheesey synthesizer effects" is pretty much a tautology)
polymath7 1 year ago
Eargasmic experience.
melancholyhumour 1 year ago
ah, this is the melody that will be heard in the everlasting halls of heaven by those who believe in Jesus Christus, the only Saviour of man, and keepeth his commandments in this short life.
billybee 1 year ago
What the the title translate into?
RoyalRanger136 1 year ago
@RoyalRanger136 Jesus Christ Our Savior
smalin 1 year ago
BACH is GOD.
200min 1 year ago
In German class, I remember watching Amadeus, portions of Immortal Beloved, and portions of a movie based on the life of Bach, but I can't remember what the title of it was. If someone could let me know what movie it is I'm referring to, I would much appreciate it.
drfenderfunk 1 year ago
@drfenderfunk You must be mistaken. Amadeus is the second name of Mozart, and I've seen the same movie, and it's based on the life of Mozart.
There's maybe a movie about Bach, but it can't be called "Amadeus".
pellicanification 1 year ago
@pellicanification I never said "Amadeus" was based on the life of Bach. I know it's about Mozart. I said that I also saw a movie about the life of Bach, but I couldn't remember the title of it. That's what I was asking.
drfenderfunk 1 year ago
Rather Macabre
Ronin27x 1 year ago
What was the original intended instrumentation? Was it organ like here?
CronosPrime1 1 year ago
OK, I get it now. See, I thought that in a previous post to someone else you were saying that each section has the same melody as every other section but in a different voice, which clearly isn't the case. You're saying that there is a different melody and each voice carries that melody once in each section. I can see that, although I didn't see it before you pointed it out. It's a little hard without the benefit of dynamics or differing instrumental timbres.
CronosPrime1 1 year ago
Can you explain what you base your explanation that there are 4 different sections on? How do you know they're different sections?
CronosPrime1 1 year ago
@CronosPrime1 Can you hear what I described in my comment to chopnandliszt? If you can recognize that each of these sections is based on a different melody, then it should be obvious that they are different sections. If you can't hear that, then ... well, it's not going to be obvious.
smalin 1 year ago
@smalin Do you have a favorite composer? You seem to post a lot of Bach. For me, Bach is definitely my favorite though you could find something to like with all composers.
RedWasabii 1 year ago
@smalin
i belive it is called polyphonics if i understood your explanation .
truebrightdreamer 1 year ago
@smalin I don't believe that he would be able to hear a written comment : )
Flutenatic 1 year ago
@CronosPrime1 Section 1 ends at 0:58, section 2 ends at 1:52, section 3 ends at 2:37 and section 4 ends... well,.. at the end of the video. Maby that will help.
Flutenatic 1 year ago
@CronosPrime1 This is not a mood piece about Jesus Christ. It's an organ chorale prelude (a liturgical genre) on the chorale "Jesus Christus, unser Heiland". My comments from 7 months ago explain how each line of the chorale is treated in a separate fugato "section", as it's being naively called without a clue as to what these sections are about or what this piece is about or what an chorale or chorale prelude is.
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
is this a double fugue?
abluesman100 1 year ago
@abluesman100 No.
smalin 1 year ago
@smalin xD
KyougetsuYoru 1 year ago
you are amazing... i love the way the auditive sense and the visual sense are conected, leads you to sublime hipnosis. Congratulation
khpo17 1 year ago
@HerrQuixota
tnx :)
desertstormpawnage 1 year ago
This is fabulous - the animation makes it so much easier to follow. Bach could read the mind of G-d.
richmondie 1 year ago
Excuse me, but I wanted to ask, do you, or can you sell the music that you have made on youtube? I'm just curious if you have a website where you can sell mp3s from, or does the copyright makes it impossible to do such a thing?
jefcon3 2 years ago
I could sell the music I've put on YouTube (at least, the performances I've done myself), but I don't. I don't think it would be worth the trouble; I just let people steal it.
smalin 2 years ago
The crosses have been put in there by the Lord. It is a sacred message from our saviour.
Oh, wait, is not... it's just music.
shapein 2 years ago
a man put it in the music, because he felt inspired to do so. The very name of the song is in honor of Jesus Christ you fool.
HerrQuixota 2 years ago
Yes. Bach was great. I stand corrected.
regards.
shapein 2 years ago
thanks. Not many people are honest and humble and insightful enough to see they were mistaken.
But then again, not many people are honest and insightful like me. (or as arrogant, puahaha)
HerrQuixota 2 years ago
I think many of Bach's pieces are as hard to understand as today's atonal music. I don't understand the point of all those downward, upward scales being played "against" each other. However, I do know there's more to Bach than to the extent any ordinary people can understand and I blame this lack of understanding of Bach on my own narrowmindedness.
That being said, can you explain what you find so ingenious in this? I'm not saying anything against it. I just want to know more about Bach
chopinandliszt 2 years ago
Like all other composers of music, both classic and modern, there is feeling behind each sound made. All the sounds are suppose to describe their emotions, both the physically expressed emotions and the internal feelings they feel.
This is how he feels about Jesus Christ, and the hope he has because of him.
Looking upward, towards the celestial sky, where one is not shackled to death and despair, is described in the rising from low notes to high notes.
The title gives the setting of the music
HerrQuixota 2 years ago
yes--what was it he wrote on his manuscripts? For the Glory of God" I forget Bach would agree with St Paul "Our life is hid with Christ in God"
vivascargill 2 years ago
God made us as individuals.
Each man's soul is his own.
HerrQuixota 2 years ago
So I'm not sure if Bach would agree with St Paul.
Every man's relationship with God and Jesus Christ is different in some way. I think we can understand Bach's relationship with his Savior by listening to his music.
HerrQuixota 2 years ago
@HerrQuixote Bach was a devout Lutheran and Paul's letters probably would have meant a lot to him there is a recent biography I can check you would agree he believes Jesus Christ is Lord?
vivascargill 2 years ago
He probably did believe Jesus to be the Christ.
He's dead now. He can't believe anything.
The body as well as the spirit is mortal. The spirit lingers a little after the body has decayed, but the spirit itself will dissipate and go the way of all the earth.
Only God is Immortal and Eternal.
it is only in the mind of God that we are preserved. Whether or not we are ressurected after we all die is completely unknown. Hence, faith in Jesus Christ while we are alive.
HerrQuixota 2 years ago
Well what you say is of real interest--still the question is what did Bach himself believe. He used to write praies to Christ and God on all his Ms. He probably would have disagreed with your understanding of the economy of salvation and of the risen Lord--but perhaps he is dead to the world and alive in Christ I hope so--I think he professed that but what do I know? I could well be wrong.
vivascargill 2 years ago
It's true that he did believe in Jesus Christ. That was part of his identity. But to call him a devout Lutheran would be inaccurate.
He was devout. No question. But people are often misrepresented by their labelled religions.
Catholics do not all believe there is a God. I find that hilarious and upsetting at the same time.
Now I feel Bach would of my same mind on many issues. Being alone as much as he was, I feel helped him see reality. Reality is hopeless. Jesus Christ gave him hope.
HerrQuixota 2 years ago
@HerrQuixota actually catholics believe that there is a god , or you can't be catholics . During the mass we say :
We believe in one God,
the Father, the Almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all that is, seen and unseen.
luteguitar 1 year ago
@luteguitar
"actually catholics believe that there is a god , or you can't be catholics"
Here is what I actually said.
"Catholics do not all believe there is a God."
Some Catholics are Atheist, yet practice all the "traditions" simply to be socially accepted.
It's like that, all over Europe. Trust me. I've spoken with many Atheists from there.
It's a Lifestyle to them more than it is their religion.
Are we clear now?
HerrQuixota 1 year ago
oh well, i wouldn't call that lifestyle but much more tradtitions given to them from their ancestors (parents mostly)
I think you are right, there are a lot of Christians (not only catholics) who pay the church taxes even though they do not believe in god.
i myself am an atheist, my parents are too, and they let us children choose for ourselves, which mentality is unfortunatly not often shared by parents who are believing Christian. but nor every Christian forces his children to believe in god..
Zwangsworkaholic 1 year ago
@Zwangsworkaholic
Force is too broad a word to describe all the doings of Man.
I advocate Hope not Despair
Atheism is the default and natural state of man. It is as cold and as bitter as the sunless skies. True Atheism is without clouding, and is therefore the best of ways to see the Heavens. Still, it provides no way to get there.
It provides no warmth of Hope or Love to spark into flames the ether of our spirit. It does not make so that we may ascend from the dust or illuminate shadows.
HerrQuixota 1 year ago
@Zwangsworkaholic
Strict Atheism conceptually leads only to the unhindered death of the individual.
Most Atheists are not this naked in relation to their identity...where hope and love shelter and clothe the bare identity from the cold and bitter winds.
You must have some sort of Life Philosophy, where the identity(soul) in some form survives....
HerrQuixota 1 year ago
oh well, i personally never saw Atheism as bitter or something because first of all, i am Used to be not Bound to anything except the Physical and Social Boarders (Law and Order)
i Actually see Religions as a way for humans to satisfy different Needs.
so either a Atheist doesn't need that way because he hasnt as many needs, or he has another way to satisfy those needs.
thats actually why i personally never ever thought of joining a Religious community.
./.
Zwangsworkaholic 1 year ago
@Zwangsworkaholic
You then, are not a Strict or Militant Atheist.
But I ask you a very important question.
Which "needs" are you referring to? Aren't the needs of Man the same for everyone? The only difference between individuals, is which needs have already been satisfied.
I would love to hear this logic from such a rarity on youtube.
HerrQuixota 1 year ago
I would never Judge a Person only because he is a Part of a Religous community, but i don't like it, if people wan't to persuade me of their religous thoughts with a fanaticism and persistence, even when i told them not to keep on.
I like objective discussions about religion (and many other things) but not talking with someone who dosn't listen to my thoughts, but only harping on their thoughts.
so as a final word: Lets share thoughts =)
Zwangsworkaholic 1 year ago
@Zwangsworkaholic
I believe each and every individual must have his thoughts and feelings be edified by each and every individual.
If I am spurned, then I will dust my feet and never speak of the subject again with them, unless they wish to return to it at a later time.
If both people's are in agreement about the discussion, then the discussion should last for as long as both are willing to discuss it. If there were things left unsaid, then shame be on both persons.
HerrQuixota 1 year ago
@Zwangsworkaholic
If you read my channel message (it's incomplete I assure you) you will have a general but not whole idea of my position on most matters.
I'm assuming you believe in Evolution? Darkness before Light? Chaos before Cosmos? Silence before Words?
Emptiness before Fullness?
Ignorance before Knowledge?
Death before Life?
HerrQuixota 1 year ago
LOL!
desertstormpawnage 1 year ago
@HerrQuixote Interesting. How do you know all this? About us only being preserved in the mind of God and so forth.
Bobstew68 1 year ago
@Bobstew68
This is IF there is a god in the first place.
So logically, I am taking reality as we see it now, and putting the Divinity factor in there. Even if there was no Bible, I'd still come to that conclusion.
I can show you exactly what I understand to be spiritual. Basically, if there was something "spiritual" it is best understood as the way* or pattern* that matter is arranged. It isn't the matter itself but the information enscribed with the matter.
HerrQuixota 1 year ago
@Bobstew68
I hope you find this logic \ coherent (which isn't often the game when God is involved) and to your liking.
Just keep in mind that spirit and element are inseperably connected much like how energy and matter are never seperate.
For instance. Take a rock and hit another rock with it. The energy transfer was sent in many different directions (because of the sound of the rock hitting the rock, you know some of the energy traveled into the air in order to produce sound waves.)
HerrQuixota 1 year ago
@Bobstew68
the energy left your body and eventually was shot off into an infinite number of directions.
If you are familiar with the Theory of Entropy, you would understand that EVERYTHING breaks down. (with an exception to the Divinity factor).
Since we know all things turn to dust, and we do, because we watch everything turn to dust....if there is a divine sentience...God, who is all perceiving, then he can "remember" the totality of an identity and give it form again via ressurection.
HerrQuixota 1 year ago
@Bobstew68
The "person" is generally composed of these parts.
spirit = arrangement(logic) of composition
body = the composition itself
mind = patchwork of information w/ a theoretical central processing that refers to itself as just that. The Self.
When I said each man's soul is his own, I meant that he had an entirely independent patchwork of information (memories) and an independent central processing unit.
Humanity is a collective of redundant systems called People.
HerrQuixota 1 year ago
To understand a piece like this is learning to hear what's going on in it.
There are four sections (starting at 0:07, 1:00, 1:52, 2:38); in each section, the main melody is played once by each voice, in the order tenor, alto, bass, soprano. The soprano (yellow) only plays when it has the melody; the other parts play throughout.
So, learn to hear where the sections are, to recognize the main melodies, and to hear the melody move through the parts.
smalin 2 years ago
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wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@smalin The "main melody" is actually a "cantus firmus" consisting of the 4 lines of the traditional Lutheran chorale "Jesus Christus, unser Heiland." Each line is treated as the subject of a short 4-voice fugue in which the unadorned subject appears in the pedal part. The music illustrates the chorale text. E.g., the chromatic scales in contrary motion depict "through his bitter suffering he spared us the pain of hell."
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
Music really is the personal expression of the composer. Emotions can be replicated, but only if the original pattern is preserved....(i.e. sheet music or passed down folk songs amongst other sources.)
No matter the music, there is a basic interpretation you can have that anyone can conclude and agree on. However, if you listen to things as being more complex, you can notice a high pattern, in which creates the details that make every song distinct from other songs.
HerrQuixota 2 years ago
If you want to know more about a specific individual, Bach for instance, you have to learn his personal history and assume the basics first, then listen to his music, and learn that only certain types of sounds come from certain types of experiences.
The overall tone of the music expressed the tone of their life...at least on the personal level.
Music back then was VERY personal. You had tons of time to be alone composing notes together, and the strongest feelings you had, were personal.
HerrQuixota 2 years ago
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wcbroccoli 1 year ago
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wcbroccoli 1 year ago
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wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@chopinandliszt One should not assume that all music was intended as entertainment or that the music can be appreciated without regard to it's purpose or the musical aesthetics and musical language of the period.
This is not a salon piece, like a Chopin waltz, nor a Liszt concert piece.
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@chopinandliszt This is music for the Lutheran liturgy of Bach's era. It belongs to a specific liturgical genre known as the organ chorale prelude. This is what the organist would play before the congregation sung the chorale.
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@chopinandliszt This Bach chorale prelude on the traditional Lutheran chorale "Jesus Christus, unser Heiland" presents each of the 4 lines of the chorale as the subject of a short 4-voice fugue in which the unadorned subject appears conspicuously in the pedal part like a plainsong.
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@chopinandliszt The counterpoints spun around the chorale tune illustrate the text. If you consult the chorale text (which was well-known to Bach's congregation), and know even a little about Baroque affectations, rhetoric & musical expression, you would understand "all those downward, upward scales being played against each other."
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@chopinandliszt Here are the 4 lines of the chorale and the corresponding prelude sections:
1: Jesus Christ, our Saviour,
2: Who turned God's anger from us,
3: Through his bitter suffering
4: Spared us the pain of hell.
'All those downward, upward scales being played "against" each other' correspond to "through his bitter suffering".
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@chopinandliszt
The scales you refer to did not appear out of nowhere. They were counterpoints to each of the 4 appearances of the fugue subject of section 3, which ends with these scalar counterpoints presented in both parallel and contrary motion.
The "point" is that the scales were counterpoints to the fugue subject aka point.
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@chopinandliszt Here are the approximate start times of each fugue/section:
Fugue 1: 0:07
Fugue 2: 1:00
Fugue 3: 1:52
Fugue 4: 2:37 (subject begins on the red d' in last chord of fugue 3)
The subect of each fugue appears, in order: red, orange, purple (the pedal part),yellow
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@chopinandliszt Well...bach is one of those composers who always has a story with his pieces .. not the title "Jesus Christus Unser Heiland" In a german translation that means "jesus christ , our saviour" Which is obviously a religious aspect to the song, Now the upward scales being played against eachother could mean a struggle against your self on what to feel , or it could mean something mysterious. You need to listen to the music with all this in mind to get it.
whythewar1 1 year ago
@whythewar1
I love Well-tempered Clavier and like Brandenburg Concertos, but I must say, I find a few of his pieces a bit hard to understand
chopinandliszt 1 year ago
Enjoyed it!
Mike2008and2008 2 years ago
Wow, bach literally DREW a cross in the music, eerilly as if he had music animation in mind.
pedantologist 2 years ago
@pedantologist sorry but where does this occur
theiceman259 2 years ago
After 2:07 you can see several "crosses" or X formations, a technique known as "Chiism" (fancy way of saying "crossism" or "X-ism") that Bach often employed in his music.
Some have taken this to reflect Bach's religious persuasions, but whether it does or not does not add or subtract anything from the music for me.
pedantologist 2 years ago
Lots of pieces of music have this pattern; it's not uncommon.
smalin 2 years ago
@smalin yes but bach was one of the first people who used it extensively
MegaKlak 1 year ago
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wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@pedantologist What you're observing is voices moving in contrary motion, a common feature in music, especially contrapuntal music.
But contrary motion is often deliberately exploited for dramatic affect or to illustrate the text. Take a clue from the words of the chorale "Jesus Christus, unser Heiland." E.g., the chromatic scales moving in contrary motion illustrate "though his bitter death he saved us from the pains of hell".
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@pedantologist You may have been referring to the passages where the voices cross, which is also common in contrapuntal music.
In baroque vocal music the vocal bass to sometimes crosses above the upper parts for purely melodic reasons. This does not disturb the harmony because the continuo supplies the true bass an 8ve lower.
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
Ahahah!
I wonder how this religious debate got started on this video's comment..
I assume because "Jesus" is in the title?
-sigh-
fratboyfrat 2 years ago 3
Nope... because these guys need something better to do.
LockLoaded 2 years ago
@redaverages - Agh, but most devout Christians do not know any better either. In fact, most of those bible thumpers are just as ignorant and bigoted as the loud mouthed athiest. In fact, the other day my wife was told she should burn at the stake while attending a Christian Christmas Concert to support some of her friends who were singing in the choir. The woman over heard my wife's conversation and surmised that she was pagan. How is telling someone they should burn any less ignorant?
Kaempfer89 2 years ago
I can tell you we get idiots and uncharitable people in all extremes of belief and in the middle. I am pretty conservative doctrinally but would have burned with shame if I heard someone in a church do that, in fact it would have earned a pretty stiff rebuke. Some people have in their heads that they should do better than Jesus Christ himself, but they don't have His love to people. And then of course they slip right up.
usenetposts 2 years ago
Sigh. People see the word "Jesus" and the entire video comments area turns into a stupid debate.
Just enjoy the music, be you Christian or atheist or anything.
Presidentjh 2 years ago 3
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wcbroccoli 1 year ago
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wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@Presidentjh While one might appreciate the piece without reference to religion, this organ chorale prelude was written to serve the liturgy, not to entertain. This is not abstract music. It's directly related to the text of the chorale in both it's fugato treatment of each line of the chorale and in it's expressive means. E.g, the harsh chromatic scales moving in contrary motion depict "through his bitter suffering he spared us the pain of hell."
wcbroccoli 1 year ago
@Presidentjh So many of our own kind are so...ugh, I can't think of a word to describe this. A war of words...a seemingly endless debate because of a title. It wasn't the author of the title that made the comments offensive, it was those who misunderstood. I've heard that many countries that rely on the internet take it seriously. Where I live...I can understand why so many call Americans thoughtless brutes.
wiseman2131 1 year ago
@Presidentjh
If it wasn't for the church music would have taken much longer to come. This is coming from my agnostic self :D In other words, be happy the church used music as part of their service so frequently.
6000pounds 1 year ago
Woah!!! I got it!!!!
I'm not just stoned! I really understand it! There's the music! I really had not seen it before.
Sorry, guys. I can hear now, and it's great!
Perhaps it was Jesus' miracle. xDDDD
lardhat 2 years ago
Just wondering... what does 'Jesus Christus Unser Heiland' mean in English?
gametime6o4 2 years ago
It's usually translated as "Jesus Christ Our Savior."
smalin 2 years ago
Oh sweet, that's really awesome as I'm a follower of Jesus myself. : ) . It''s been the best decision of my entire life... I've never had more joy knowing my soul is saved for eternity and experiencing the life that God gives you even on Earth. Thanks for the reply so soon!
gametime6o4 2 years ago
If you're a follower of Jesus you should speak in tongues (and cast away demons), like Mark 16:17 says. Don't ask what the title means.
I didn't like this piece at all. So boring...
Yeah, nobody said Jesus was supposed to be fun, but at least he was supposed to be good...
lardhat 2 years ago
If you look through the comments, you'll see that not everybody shares your opinion.
smalin 2 years ago
I know, i know... I even know the flaw is mine if i can't enjoy this piece of... music...
You all seem to see something i can't. Quite frustrating. To me those sound like almost random notes.
I don't get it... :(
I usually love Bach...
lardhat 2 years ago
Listen HARDER, lardhat!
KremeDeMentia 2 years ago
@smalin - As for whether everyone at this time was a Christian or not - yes, in name only, pretty much everyone was. However, based on actions and true devotion, one can tell the difference between a true Christian and those who were simply going through the motions of society. A modern example would be Sweden - 72% of the population is a member of the Church of Sweden, yet upwards of 80% claim to be atheist. Are these people true C
redaverages 2 years ago
@smalin - true Christians? I would say not. Maybe in name only, due to cultural traditions of being a member of a church, but in actions and deed, certainly not. As for having true knowledge, I could argue all day that Christianity, or even diesm, is many times more logical than atheism, so that point is obviously debatable. However, I agree, the price for one's beliefs should never be the need to insult others. BTW, I appreciate your work on here, great job! :)
redaverages 2 years ago
@redaverages - Do you think people who called themselves Christians in Germany during Bach's life were "in name only" Christians? Or that they would have said that they were atheist? What if someone said you were Christian in name only? How would you demonstrate that they were wrong?
smalin 2 years ago
@smalin - As I said, I believe some Christians of Bach's time were "name only" Christians, much like today. Further, it is more accepted to be an atheist today than before, so I would guess that many who doubted then would have been more silent about it, though there were several prominent atheist/agnostic/doubters (Diderot, Voltaire, etc) - after all, this was the Age of Enlightenment. As for demostrating if i was a true Christian, it is simple - follow the teachings of Christ!
redaverages 2 years ago 2
@redaverages
I.
Voltaire was not an atheist nor even an agnostic but a deist (as I, an atheist, would also have been had I lived in his time).
Voltaire, living a century before Darwin and lacking any knowledge of modern biology or geology (to say nothing of astrophysics) concluded, reasonably enough for the time, that the appearance of a design strongly implied a designer, even going so far as to insist (again quite reasonably given the information available to him) that marine fossils...
polymath7 1 year ago
II.
...discovered in the Alps must surely have been carried there by early humans.
As for following the teachings of Christ, that is of course a far from simple exercise.
Which teachings, and how interpreted?
polymath7 1 year ago
Bach was is and always be the greatest composer ever and he was a follower of Christ I don't think that's a coincidence...
jamesjddong 2 years ago
Of course it wasn't a coincidence. At that time and place every fucking moron or genius was a Christian.
D'oh!
Now we know better.
lardhat 2 years ago
Yes, your incredible use of profanity and bigotry clearly demonstrates your ability to "know better."
redaverages 2 years ago
@redaverages, I'm not sure I'm getting your point. Are you saying that at Bach's time, in Germany, every moron and genius *wasn't* a Christian?
smalin 2 years ago
@smalin - My point was directed at lardhat, who was, apparently, making the point that today, people "know better" than to be Christians. That somehow, our atheistic and largely anti-religious society has become enlightened in some fashion. However, as I implied, somewhat sarcastically, that his bigotry and profanity prove that he does not "know better." If knowing better means that we must insult other people and their beliefs, than I'm pretty sure that I would rather not know better.
redaverages 2 years ago
@redaverages - well, there we differ --- even if the price of knowledge was that I'd have to insult people who were ignorant, I would choose knowledge over ignorance. I don't think that is the price, though ...
smalin 2 years ago
Your pronouncements are said with the utmost arrogance. Fortunately, your comment will be no more enduring or proving of your point than mine will of mine!
KremeDeMentia 2 years ago
Right, but 'Heiland' is very old-fashioned. You actually rather say "Retter", that means 'savior' as well.
Fechteli 2 years ago
Jesus our savior
jacovannimwegen 2 years ago 2
I just LOVE the sound of instruments in harmony! especially when they sound this good.
animevideogamefan 2 years ago 2
i need something to say i have heard all kind of music in this world but this style of music fugues is so strong just 1 note with the other one that can make each other so strong and keep further to make 4 voice fuga and its keeps going more stronger, thats why i like fugas and the mass fugeus of beethoven in his missa solemnis
thegoddescomposer 2 years ago
...sounds like carnival music crap
c18aztec 2 years ago
What do you suppose it would sound like to a person who had never been to a carnival?
smalin 2 years ago
ahah hes liike "uh you know dumb probably" haha
JCthrowdownhour 2 years ago
Very good for a chorale prelude! I also recomendthe 12 variations (bwv 768)on "Sei gegruesset, Jesu guetig".
ahgblopes 2 years ago
umm....good for you that your thinking into the future ._.
1234m1234m1234m1234m 2 years ago
i want this prelude to be played in my funeral
symir547 2 years ago
But played less mechanically, I hope.
1401JSC 2 years ago
AMAZING!
MAX96MENDES 2 years ago
esta musica es exce,ente para hacer matematicas, jurado que si!!
This music is excelent for doing maths homeworks, i swear it!!
ikaro342 2 years ago 2
The yellow notes are my favorite. melancholy
wendyful04 2 years ago
I LOVE Classical music now! thank you, Smalin!
animevideogamefan 2 years ago 3
He wrote this?! Holy crap, I can't tell you how much I've heard this in my old Church of mine...
NicoleMichellePea 2 years ago
Well it is entitled 'Jesus Christ Our Savior' In german of course
AnytimeMinutes 2 years ago
I would like to thank you Smalin for uploading all these videos. It puts color in my Maths Homeworks, and makes me discovers classical music.
masterastros 2 years ago 7
More cowbell!!!
darkknight91 2 years ago 3
Would cows play it?
smalin 2 years ago
I love to sing Bach´s Mathäus Passion!
JohnPaul0livier 2 years ago
Love it!
watsonsammy 2 years ago
awesome
reject118 2 years ago
oye QUE OSTIAS YO SIEMPRE IMAGINE UN METODO PARA VER LA MUSICA DE ESTE TIPO MAS BIEN ME LA IMAGINABA ASI. PENSE QUE ERA YO NOMAS EL QUE SE LE OCURRIA ESTO. NUNCA CREI VERLO EN REALIDAD
soydechileyque 2 years ago
si en verdad asi es como se ve la musica compuesta en computadora, (MIDI) creo que de ahi salio la idea para mi es una buena forma de estudiar musica me parece mas claro
zut25 2 years ago
vc e comico esta e matematica kkkkkkkkkkkk.
alarico696 2 years ago
Hey smalin, do you know where could I get the music sheet for this piece? or could you tell me what BWV number is it?, thanks.
p0rel 2 years ago
see the (new) FAQ
smalin 2 years ago
thanks :)
p0rel 2 years ago
I wish today's music were like this.
ABDACOM 2 years ago 5
Wow. This stands out from a typical slow interpretation. You added a lot to this piece, and I don't just mean that figuratively.
For what it's worth, which isn't much coming from me, I really enjoyed this. Thanks, Smalin.
EpsilonKnight7 2 years ago
i love this song
CleanUPWashington 2 years ago 2
Amiguito Bach, que ganas de haberte escuchado en vivo
alesitospirit 2 years ago
sounds like an old video game theme song
skimboarder3210 2 years ago
remember this song it's older than the video games duh!!!
And the very first video games used music like this...... real music!!!
BSBFANMEXICO 2 years ago 4
Better than Disney's FANTASIA.
incrediblub 2 years ago 2
guitar hero oder?! ^^
TheWayWhichYouGaveMe 2 years ago
Organ hero, will be out for X-mas. Takes a bit of space in your living room, tho..
rumbidzai 2 years ago 15
haha
XTXcalVinXTX 2 years ago
debil
artsebski 2 years ago
I'd buy it.
direngrey4569 2 years ago
Orchestra hero ftw.
IncredibleGoliath 2 years ago
lol.What about violin hero.That be kick ASS.
KissMePeinguin123 2 years ago 16
violon hero? omg worst wannabe thing ever
chenierchenier 2 years ago
wonderful, you have done it again smalin.
MillyProductions 2 years ago
Beauty is in the ear of the listener and for me the more sombre interpretation by Walcha has a greater emotional impact which harks back to my original comment.
I am intrigued and excited that you, the performer, would come to a new feeling about the piece. This is something that I do not think happens often.
capekurtz 2 years ago
Really? I wonder whether I'm unusual. I change my interpretations of pieces all the time, especially if I listen to other performers' performances a lot. I'm working on Scott Joplin's Heliotrope Bouquet right now, and after listening to a bunch of YouTube videos, I changed a few things. It may be that because I have a relatively poor memory, I'm not so much influenced by my own previous conceptions.
smalin 2 years ago
Just gotta say, these things are so awesome!! I didn't even like piano music very much before I saw your vids, now I love it!!!
SpinnTehWheel 2 years ago
Hehe, you mean Instrumental (In this case Keyboard) music. This song is composed with the pipe organ.
Daftlife909 2 years ago 2
really nice! 5 stars for the graphics
Friedtunafish77 3 years ago
I find the impact of this interpretation diminished by its fast pace.
Compare the slower interpretation by Helmut Walcha.
capekurtz 3 years ago
Is that who's playing in the version posted on YouTube by Adalbertt (v=LfEnd62zy9U)?
smalin 3 years ago
I do not know who is playing in the Adalbertt version but it is not Helmut Walcha. I was referring to the recordings made in 1950 and 1952 by Helmut Walcha for the German company Archiv Produktion at which time this version of Jesus Christus Unser Heiland (BWV665) was played at 5'13". (In 1971 Walcha did a re-recording at 4'45").
capekurtz 3 years ago
I expect I would agree with you. My tempo is ca. mm=60; Adalbertt's version at mm=50 is enough to show how much "bigger" the piece can be if given the time. Walcha's 5'13" version would be ca. mm=40 ... wow, that's slow.
I originally performed the version here with a sampled pedal harpsichord sound, when I was 37. I'm now 55, and I'm sure I would play it slower today. Maybe in a few more years, with a real organ (a bigger one!) in a place with lots of reverb, I'll be in Walcha's universe.
smalin 3 years ago