Jhn 15:21 But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me.Gal 4:29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him [that was born] after the Spirit, even so [it is] now.
well said. We can even look at the disciples. They were persecuted and lost their lives but they didn't view God as cruel for allowing it to happen...they glorified God in it. They knew something better was waiting for them and they loved not their lives unto death.
There is so much we have to learn and those stories really help us understand the mindset we should have when it comes to these things.
No matter what happens good or bad...the Lord is with us through it all.
two things happen sacrifice cease and a war to the end and the begining of the 1290 days in Daniel 12:11 or the aprox 184.3 weeks within the two prophets are prophecing within the temple beast does not enter in until he kills to prophets leaving approx. 4.3 weeks or 45 days to setup abomination that maketh desolate in Rev 13:15 Rev 11:14 The second woe is past; [and], behold, the third woe cometh QUICKLY.
1290 is within the 2300 days shown here and same words of Rev 11:2, Rev 13:5 Dan 8:13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain [saint] which spake, How long [shall be] the vision [concerning] the daily [sacrifice], and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be TRODDEN under foot? Dan 8:14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed
Dan 8:14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed. (or 2300 days or aprox 76.6 months ) NOTE How those that say there are 7 years are wrong they add the time in Daniel with the time in Revelations 1290 days plus 1260 equals 2550 days or 85 months which is greater than the 2300 days in Daniel therefore you cannot add them.
Nicely done.. I was starting to think I was the only Christian that believe in Post-Trib. Its not that God wants to be cruel.. if we went with that logic, then God would just take us home as we accept him. Because of this lack of knowledge there will be a great falling away. A great delusion is coming, and I don't think most will know what hit them.
@conradpilapil You are sooo right!! This pretrib rapture has already deceived billions. I feel so hopeless because the deluded pretribbers become absolutley vicious if you challenge their delusion! They are going to be lost I fear.
Can someone read Zach 13:88 Two-thirds of the people in the land will be cut off and die,” says the Lord.“But one-third will be left in the land. I will bring that group through the fire
and make them pure. I will refine them like silver and purify them like gold. They will call on my name, and I will answer them. I will say, ‘These are my people,’and they will say, ‘The Lord is our God.’” Also read Isaiah 48:9 Then we'll see the rapture take place. Shalom
Did Jesus rapture out those who suffered in the Holocaust,or those who suffered in the dark ages? Christians were fed to the lions, burned at the stake. We were never promised to avoid tribulation, especially not the tribulation of man.
@Myhopeisinhim God would be cruel if he made us suffer throughout the whole tribulation. Im sure he has some way in protecting us from the wrath of the antichrist. 3 false years of peace and then 4 years of nothing but pain for God's children...that doesn't sound anything like God's plan....he is going to protect us some way...some how.
You echo what half the unbelievers of the world say. If God existed, he wouldn't allow the children of the world to starve and die before they have a chance to live. If God existed, he wouldn't have allowed my husband/wife to die. If God existed...if God existed, he wouldn't let this or that happen....
My friend, you are on dangerous ends of falling away if and when the tribulation does start, even if its not the great tribulation. I fear for you.
We're told in the bible that the saints are going to be handed over and many will be killed just as it occurred in the early church, but that we are not to fear as those who have no hope. Our hope is not to escape persecution or trial, but that we have everlasting life in Christ and no man can take that from us, even if they kill this body.
That when Christ comes, we will be raised from the dead and enter into life because of him.
The world thinks God is cruel because they don't understand why certain things happen the way they do, and to them it seems like he does nothing to stop them. But as believers we know better than that even if we don't understand all things yet.
@Myhopeisinhim I assure you i am not a unbeliever brother. I am 100% for Christ and i believe that God is not cruel in anyway..I believe he will protect us in some type of way if pre-trib rapture isn't true
@bobcatallstar7 God is not cruel a all, a cruel person that likes to kill and torture for the fun of things is cruel. God has a purpose for the things he does and this is judgement we are talking about, you know like if you did a crime? If you steal you go to jail as a consequence, is the court system cruel? No, you broke a law and deserve punishment for that action. Are parents and guardians cruel when they punish? No, they love you but you deserve punishment for your actions.
@bobcatallstar7 I personally feel that,if tribulation happens in my lifetime and I have made that step to serve the most high LORD fully,I am not expecting to be saved,I will seek him for strength of endurance,and I'll teach my family or kids to do the same.I do not feel God is cruel in what he does at all,I may have fear or do not fully understand, but that is what God is there for,to give you understanding and strength even under persecution.If I must die for God, take my head.
@bobcatallstar7 We should learn from those who trusted in God in the bible, when Hananiah, Misha'el and Azariah were going to be burned to death for not worshiping the gold idol, what did they say? “O Nebuchadnezzar,. . . ” they said respectfully, “the God we serve is able to save us from it, and he will rescue us from your hand, O king. BUT EVEN IF HE DOES NOT, we want you to know, O king, that we will not serve your gods or worship the image of gold you have set up."
@bobcatallstar7 The didn't say "well it would be cruel for God to allow us to be burned to death. They kept their faith and pretty much said, well God can save us from you, but even if he doesn't we still won't disobey God. To them it didn't matter, even if they were to die, and they didn't see God as cruel if God did not save them. Now, of course people being human beings do not want to be tortured or beheaded, whipped etc but if it happens and it's disobedience vs obedience->
@bobcatallstar7 So be it, take that death. It's hard to say or to watch a loved one get killed or such, but this is not a play on the heart string matter. God can protect us no problem, but scripture is scripture, it doesn't matter what we read into it, it is what it is. If we have to suffer tribulation, so be it, if only some people, so be it, if none, so be it. The problem I have is when people start lying, twisting things or leaning towards New age anti0Christ type beliefs.
@bobcatallstar7 And the example of the bible story and the furnace is more close to the point I was getting at then the previous explanation of breaking a law.Those 3 men were men of God, they didn't break any law to be subject to punishment by Nebuchadnezzar,yet were about to be killed. They were saved by God, but they themselves made it clear that God did not have to and that even if he didn't they would not disobey him not indicated that God was cruel if he didn't save them.
@bobcatallstar7 I'm sorry, but this line of thinking is what will cause the great falling away.. "For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect."
POST-TRIBULATION RAPTURE!!! 7 SEALS OF REVELATION!!! 7 TRUMPETS!!! LAST TRUMPET ITS IN HIS WORD!! READ IT & QUIT LISTENING to all of these FALSE PROPHETS!!!
Check out MidnightWatcher's Blogspot and read through a few of the articles in the "Theology and Eschatology" section, particularly the "Not Appointed Unto Wrath" and "The Revelation of Jesus Christ and the Rapture of the Church" articles. I challenge anyone to refute them.
Whatever you believe; whether pre, mid or post-tribulation... it will not affect one's salvation through Jesus Christ. The question is, what doctrine will make a Christian more faithful and radical for Christ. The early Christians during the time of the Apostles undergone great tribulation or hardships, martyred for Jesus. Post-trib will make one courageous and faithful until the end. Matt. 28:20 "I will be with you until the end of the age."
@juna17th The most scareful are thoose who are so into the pre-tribulation belive that it will damage their faith so much even some will loose their faith. If dosent happen pre. Witch i doubt.
2 thess 2 says that that day will not come (trib.) until mass apostasy as outlined in matthew 24 in 2:7 the spirit wll be taken out of the way (spirit seals the church until the day of redemption) and then the wicked one will be revealed..if the spirit goes the church goes. God doesnt judge righteousness and christians r under the blood. the day of the lord is jacobs trouble, times of the gentiles and all evil doers.
Matthew 24 states 2 distinct comings: One via Ecclessia in greek which means assembling or gathering which goes against 1 thess4:17 and 1 cor 15 because the angels are sent at this time to gather the elect (not thechurch) from the 4 winds. the second is made mention of 2 in the field one taken the other left which would support the other verses which comes from the greek harpazo and latin raptus which means rapture...also found in 1 thess 4:16.
The bible is clear first the old testament saints are in heaven from their dispensations...ephesians 4 Jesus led captivity captive...and other verses which support this theory not only in revelation but also hebrews 12 etc. The church will be the only group of people from the church age in the rapture which can occur at any time. the church will NOT be in the rapture because God will spare his people. Rev 19 has us in the chambers with the bride groom also isaiah 26:17 down. also in matthew
@boxermn You can block me all you want, but are wrong and can't admit it! Open your ears, or you just might be left behind. Do you read all the Bible so haphazardly like this??? If I were you, I'd quit listening to false & ridiculous videos, teachers, and people who do NOT understand the very Word of God! Good Luck to you, 'cause you're sure going to need it.
There will be a "gathering". Read it again. Start with Genesis 49:10
Now read the Parable of the Tares. "Gathering" again.
Just like the days of Noah. Was Noah removed? Or was the EVIL removed.
Now Proverbs 2:22; Now Proverbs 10:30; Now Revelation 14:3, Mt Zion is on earth. The 144,000 are on the earth when the earth is reaped. How else can they see "one like the Son of Man" on that cloud in Rev 14:14?
In the parable of the 10 virgins, oil in their lamps, 5 of them did not believe the groom was coming then. He did and because they were not ready, they did not go into the wedding feast. Post and mid tribulation rapture believers, beware...
@boxermn I know many think the "oil" is to represent the Holy Spirit. However, the "foolish" virgins are "asking" for some of their oil. It is impossible for anyone to "give" someone else their Holy Spirit. The "theme" of the parable is to BE READY - Matthew 24:44. How is one to "be ready"? Over & over in Revelation 2 & 3, Christ tells the different kinds of Christians to REPENT. We are NOT to be living in sin, or He will come & catch you sinning. Revelation 3:3. Christ comes for the FAITHFUL
@JesusHoldMyHand1 Remember this is a parable. Jesus used parables to dumb it down to the apostles and later readers. Oil truly represents the Holy Spirit in life, but in this case it was just part of the parable of lamps, etc. The 5 left out, did not really believe the groom would come, so they did not bring extra lamp oil. A good clonusion is, Jesus will take only the proactive Christians to the wedding to marry and then the feast. I will message you a good video detailing this point.
@boxermn I know what a parable is, and I'm telling you that the "oil" is NOT the Holy Spirit. A parable has truth & meaning behind it. The 5 foolish virgins didn't do what the Lord had told them. Instead they went clubbing, drinking, doing things the Lord does NOT approve of. Remember, it says He was gone for a "long" time. The Bridegroom, of course, is Christ. Unfaithful Christians WILL go through the Great Tribulation, unless they're dead when the Rapture happens. The door, Rev 4:1 SHUT
@JesusHoldMyHand1 Do a web search on Holy Spirit Oil, for the full details to this: Oil
Most Christians regard oil as a symbol of the Person and ministry of the Holy Spirit. Throughout the Old Testament we see oil being used for holy purposes. The priests were consecrated and ordained unto God as oil was poured upon their heads … You have a view of the parable I do not agree with, so be it. THE END
@boxermn It seems to me you don't care what the Lord says. The Holy Spirit can NOT be given from one person to the next. Don't you understand that? If it could, then those 5 wise virgins were stingy.....like not giving someone money, food, clothes, etc. It does seem to me that you DON'T understand what the Lord is saying. Please go back and read it. Matthew 25:1-13 - BE READY for the SON OF MAN will come when YOU LEAST expect Him. ALL 10 virgins were Christians, only 5 were the BRIDE.
@boxermn Since when does anyone BUY the Hoy Spirit. Matthew 25:9-10 is VERY clear. They were NOT ready!!! The 5 wise virgins ALL READY bought their oil - NOT the Holy Spirit!!!!
@boxermn I'll tell you right now, you have been mislead, and taught wrongly. You are the stubborn one, so I will give a couple days to think about it. Just WHERE do you BUY the Holy Spirit. Just answer that one question. I'd like to know so I can give Him out to my unbeliving friends. Thank You
For those who take Luke 17:34 where it talks about one will be taken and the other left as the rapture you must read on to verse 35 where it says two women will be grinding grain one will be taken and the other left. The deciples ask Jesus where will they we taken. Jesus replied where the vultures are. Also Matthew 13 parable of the weeds First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles then gather the wheat in my barn. we don't want to be the first taken.
PRE-TRIB RAPTURE is a Satanic lie. There will be a mass abduction of people and UFOs will be involved. This will be deliberately done to weaken the faith of the 'believers', not to mention what these demonic entities we refer to as 'aliens' will do to the people they abduct--probably some form of human sacrifice.
@cmchambers777, How do you know that Aliens will be involved? I think the antichrist will proclaim himself as a god incarnate and will have crazy powers to perform magic tricks. Who knows? Maybe demons will disguise themselves as angels and help perpetrate this lie. I think the antichrist is middle eastern by the way.
You would think the desire to go through the tribulation would be as popular as the desire to jump into a pit filled with vipers and broken glass. As illogical as it may seem, there appears to be a large number of Christians that fully expect to get roughed up before Christ returns.
Many Christians argue strongly for the right to suffer persecution at the hands of the Antichrist and the one world government. "Because Jesus and His disciples suffered persecution, we should expect no better."
How do folks that read the Bible find a pre trib? That would mean He comes 3 times, only comes twice, 1st advent, then POST trib. If everyone flies away, then whom is left here for satan to tickle? Does he tickle those he already has? NO! Therefore, you fly away doctrine folks WILL be right here in the mud. Look around the trump and bowls are in action NOW....uhhhh...you still here arent you! Dont take 1 scripture and build a case, ie Thess...read EVERYTHING for correct context.
This is what I think...I don't believe in pre tribulation rapture...I don't see any test of faith with a pre tribulation rapture. People who are so insistent that God will deliver us from everything, I think its a possiblity they lack faith. What will they think when it hasn't happened yet? Will that lead them to take the mark?
@natalieanne101 Exactly. Do you think that God is pleased with the church in it's current state? The great trib is all about refinement. He's coming back for a church without spot or blemish and the great trib is going to be the fire to purify out all the gargabe and get his people back to what's important. God Bless.
they want a pre trib rapture because the modern church is so soft and indulgent that the idea of the Bride of Christ so much as breaking i fingernail, so to speak, is anathema to them. If the trib is in our lifetime we will indeed be martyred almost to a man. I also reject the idea that the rapture is secret. We will rise visibly before the very eyes of our persecuters who will dread his wrath all the more because of this, and it happens at the second coming, Matt 24 is clear, crystal clear
When I read Matthew 24 I do not see a secret coming nor two separate comings...I only see the one coming of Christ which shall be heralded by the sound of the Last Trumpet and the righteous elect of God will rejoice and the wicked will mourn. The dead in Christ will rise first and faithful servants who are alive at the time will be "raptured' or caught-up and meet Christ in the air as he descends and forever be with the Lord. The key is to be ready ... that His coming not take u unawares. Simple
skydiver626 is correct with this subject. You literly have to twist the scripures to get them to support the pre-trib rapture. Jesus himself said I will raise them up at the last day 3 times. And Paul clearly taught that the dead in Christ go before those who are alive and remain. And the dead in Christ are not raised until the Last Day! So how can those who are Alive and Remain be gone 7 years before thoses sleeping in Christ? They can`t...And there are so many more flaws in pre-trib teaching!
ive seen that it could also mean the "first fruits" as in the 144000 taken up before. i have studied much and still not 100% maybe that's the Lords way, to have intelligient and dilligent study and debate. JUST BE READY !
What if they are right? Check out Dr Owuor on here, that should help u to see the truth. Stop being used of the devil before it's too late. Check out this guy and see if u still believe.
This has always been so confusing and anoying Because the question is do the believers get raptured away before the tribulation or christ come at THE end meaning after the anti-christ reign
So 1/2 of mankind is dead and probably unburied. Tthere are no super markets because it hasn't rained in 3 years and famine is worldwide. 1/3 of the H2O is poisoned and Im a bit thirsty standing in the middle of all these dead people. I don't notice the peace in Israel or a temple is erected behind my back. Prince charming died and came back to life. I cant barter because I won't take the mark of the beast which leaves me hiding in a cave. Wouldnt' we sort of be getting suspicious of his return
How can the two comings be the same? At the second coming every eye shall see him. There's going to be such terrible times at the second coming that nobody is going to be partying, drinking, and worrying about getting married and all that stuff. At the rapture, people are going to be partying, drinking, having a good time, not even thinking about the coming of the Lord just like it is now. The second coming, People are going to be so scared it's not going to be funny. Acts 2:38.
@rossdaboss1959 Then you oppose the very words of Christ because even Jesus stated in Matthew 24 that at his second coming - IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE GREAT TRIB, they (unbelievers) will be doing exactly that: eating and drinking and marrying (vs38). You see, the trib is designated for the true church. Those who submit to the beast system and take the mark will not be persecuted and will go about their daily lives until the 2nd coming.
@skydiver626 I believe that you have got it backwards, the trib is designated for the lost and those that have received the mark. The saved during the trib will be killed because they dont take the mark. But at the rapture the saved of all ages will be caught up in the sky to meet Jesus in the sky and will be with Him during the trib.
1954phyllis That is exactly why he uses the term.Those who are "alive and remain".The antichrist will overcome the saints and cause them to reject Christ & take the mark or be put to death.But some will make it to the last day and be raptured out.After those that have died in Christ are raised and they will meet the Lord in the air.Just before the wrath of God is poured out! Tribulation & wrath are not the same thing.The dead go before the living.Jesus said,He would raise them The Last Day!
@HumbleHeartMinistry I beg to differ with you on this topic. Jesus will come for His saints before the tribulation. Those Christians that are killed during the tribulation are the ones that refuse to accept the mark of the beast. Please read 1 Thessalonians 4:16,17. I really don't understand where in the Bible you get such a notion. The dead and the living saints will be raised at the same time in the blink of an eye.
@1954phyllis First of all we are brothers in the Lord who do disagree. And thats ok because the bible says to contend for the faith. The scripture you gave me to read very much says in 16 "the dead in Christ shall rise first" 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds.They rise first then we meet them there. The whole point being that the dead do not raise up according to Jesus himself until the last day.Not seven years before that.John 6:39,40,54
@HumbleHeartMinistry "For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord." 1Thess. 4:16,17 The living and the dead saints will be raptured out of here in the blink of an eye.The saints that will be killed during the trib will go to be with the Lord
@1954phyllis The dead in Christ do not raise from the dead until the Last Day! If they don`t raise until the Last Day and we don`t get raptured until they raise,How can it be possable that there is still 7 years?Keep on reading as not to take it out of content.In1Thes 5:2 it clearly says that its taking about the Day of the Lord. Read 2 Peter2:10-15 about what the Day of the Lord is.And compair it to the other many accounts of it in the old testiment.
@1954phyllis The dead in Christ do not raise from the dead until the Last Day! If they don`t raise until the Last Day and we don`t get raptured until they raise,How can it be possable that there is still 7 years?Keep on reading as not to take it out of content.In1Thes 5:2 it clearly says that its talking about the Day of the Lord. Read 2 Peter2:10-15 about what the Day of the Lord is.And compair it to the other many accounts of it in the old testiment.
@1954phyllis Jesus was ask about the signs of the end in Luke 17. He used Noah V27 and said they ate and drank ect. until the DAY that Noah entered into the ark,and the flood came and destroyed them all. Then he used Lot V29 The SAME DAY Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all. V30 Even thus shall it be in the DAY when the Son of man is revealed. We are caught up the same day just before the world is burnt up for its unrighteousness.
@HumbleHeartMinistry The earth is not burnt up until the lost are cast into hell. During the tribualation there are some people that will be saved. The ones that will be saved will be killed and go on to heaven to be with the saints of all ages. Remember how Enoch and Elijah were caught up into heaven:well all the saved living and dead will be caught up just like they were and we will be with Him forevermore.I don't know where you have got this idea that there won't be a rapture but it is wrong
@1954phyllis Dude I`m worried about you! Where on earth did you get the Idea I`m saying there is no rapture? Nothing I said in my comments was saying that. I am simply saying that the pre-trib rapture is a fairy tale. Those who are Christs are caught away(raptured) on the Last day.Not 7 years before.We will go through the tribulation. and some of us will be killed.But some of us will not before the Day of the Lord.Those who are not will be raptured but not until the last day!
@HumbleHeartMinistry I'd like to ask you a question please, why would Christ wait until He has defeated Satan and bound him for a thousand years to rapture His saints out of this world? No the Christians that are saved before the trib will be raptured out of here before the tribulation starts. Again I say why would Jesus wait until after the tribulation to rapture us out of here?
@1954phyllis Don`t you know that satan is already defeated? He was defeated at the cross! Look my friend the rapture is like when Noah entered the ark. He was not put in the ark 7 years before the flood came.He entered the ark the same day the flood came. Same with Lot. He was takin out of the city and the same day God rained fire from heaven down on those cities. I believe Gods word. Not the teachings of man.You go ahead and believe the doctrine of man that started in 1830. I will believe God.
@HumbleHeartMinistry You are totally wrong The Christians are taken out before the tribulation starts. Read 1Thesslonians4:1,17. I beg your pardon but the pre-trib rapture is Biblical. Are you saying that ST. Paul is a liar? No you are not believing God.
@1954phyllis How many time will you give me the same scriture that you are taking out of content? Just 3 scritures further in the same book-- 5:2 clearly states Paul was speaking of the "Day of the Lord". I love ya brother! But you are wrong! I tried to show you but you got your mind made up. So when you see the Antichrist proclaiming to be God. Remember, You are in the tribulation. But my going back and forth with you is doing no good. So you have a great day!
@HumbleHeartMinistry You are partially right, however this is how it goes: The rapture will happen first before the tribulation, and all those Christains who are ready will be raptured. However after the rapture some of God's people will still be here, some will miss the rapture because some wont be ready, and also some of Gods people will be here as a remant and those who missed the rapture will have one last chance and in that time, they will be killed, if they confess to be Christian
@HumbleHeartMinistry the remant of God, is those that God appoints to be here during the tribulation to led all the others. So yes, some of us will still be here. But God is calling his people to prepare now, but many wont take heed and they will miss the rapture but praise be to Yeshua, that they will have another chance, but they must not take the mark of the beast and because of their refusal they will be killed, but they will not die they will join the others who was already raptured!!!
@kreynold True, but they join us in Heaven in Spirit & Soul only. They are not "resurrected" until Revelation 20:4-6 Their bodies are never "Raptured".
@skydiver626 Jude 14 "Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men: "See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones (saints KJV) to judge everyone, and to convict all the ungodly of all the ungodly acts they have done in the ungodly way, and of all the harsh words ungodly sinners have spoken against him."
@Kr0n1k4Lyfe: Also, Isaiah 26:19-21 is a pre-trib Rapture in the O.T. and the rooms mentioned are the same ones from John 14:1-3. I believe the Rapture will be in the first half of 2011. It has to be soon. I just made a video outlining my reasoning. I'd appreciate any feedback you have.
@skydiver626 Jesus said He is coming as a thief in the night. If the post-trib is true, then people will know exactly when He will come. They just have to count exactly 7 years from when the Antichrist signs the treaty with Israel. And then they know Jesus will come. There's no surprise factor there.The Bible says NO ONE KNOWS THE DAY OR THE HOUR. And how can there be partying and drinking and marrying during the great trib. The whole world will be in utter chaos.
@skydiver626 In Matt. 24:32, Jesus starts to reiterate what He had said before with a parable. He is now done explaining the trib. period and He starts to talk of what it will be like before these things start. V. 38 is the same as Luke 17:26-30 and then He even tells us about the snatching away in Matt.24:40 and that before He comes for His Bride (different than every eye and mourning for Him) things will be as normal. Will things be normal after the trib. when 3 bil. corpses litter earth?
@chefjimmie1 Your absolutely right - jesus does reiterate the things he had just stated in parable in matt 24. What did he say? Immediately after the great trib, the son will descend and gather his elect. He then likens that literal description with the parable of the 10 virgins - which by the way can be found mentioned again in Rev 19 and is again found to be in context with a post trib return. You see, matt 24:29 and on is describing Jesus' post trib return yet you try to twist into pre?
@skydiver626 No, I am not trying to twist anything. Matt. 24:29 IS the post trib gathering of those that were saved during the trib. Matt.24:37-42 describes the PRE TRIB RAPTURE, when things are going on as normal and there is a sudden snatching away. After the Trib. those few who are left alive will be expecting His return again because they will have figured out that before everybody dies, He will come back. This confirms the 2 comings that I was trying to explain, no twisting of anything.
@chefjimmie1 Where in the world are you getting the idea that Matt 24:37 switches gears and talks about a pre-trib rapture? Jesus was in strict context with his post-trib gathering of vs 29-31 when he uses the analogy of the fig tree and then lastly, the comparison of Noah's day to his coming. He NEVER deviates from it. If Jesus wanted us to know about a pre-trib rapture, he would have laid it out in great pre-tib detail before discussing it. Read it again.
@skydiver62624:40 says "Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other one left, 41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Taken where? Taken with Jesus in the Rapture leaving the other behind to go through the Trib. Can't you see that these are two separate events? In the rapture, Jesus comes in the clouds; in the second coming, He comes to the earth. In the Rapture, He is not seen, in the 2nd coming, every eye will see Him
@chefjimmie1 Jesus will descend with a SHOUT, with the TRUMP of God and with the VOICE of the archangel and yet he will not be seen? Seriously, where are getting these ideas from? Please provide scripture that rapture of I Thess 4:16 is secret please. Actually, let me give you a verse. This is for all you pre-tribbers out there: Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the SECRET chambers; believe it not.
@skydiver626 I have a theory why people hold to this post trib doctrine, maybe some of them aren't ready for Christ to return at any minute and they are hoping to see the things talked about in the bible about the tribulation so that they can totally commit to Jesus at that time. I am ready to see Him NOW! I welcome His coming, do you? I am looking forward to His coming more than anything in this world. If by some chance you are right, I will then regroup, and go through it but that isn't
@chefjimmie1 That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Post trib promotes a yearning for spiritual preparation for what's to come. We're not looking for an excuse to goof off until the tribulation kicks in. The fact that death is imminent for every human should keep any believer in check about how they should be living their lives no matter if they're pre or post. Anyway, good luck and I urge you to do a study on the day of the Lord because that's what the Apostles were looking for.
@skydiver626 Amen. If we go through the tribulation we need to be prepared to have the AntiChrist make war with us, and we will be persecuted, and may have to die because of our faith. That doesn't sound like a broad path to me.
@skydiver626 What the bible says is going to happen. Seriously, are you afraid to die? Why would you argue with the bible saying what it says. Are you afraid that you are not ready? If you are not, you better get ready because He is coming in the clouds for His Bride and He will hide us in our chambers (Isaiah 26:20) for a short while until his indignation be overpast. They will explain our disappearance as being "evolved" to a higher spiritual state or will say that aliens abducted us.
@chefjimmie1 Once again, you just quoted a verse that's in strict context with the post trib day of the Lord. In fact, the whole book of Isaiah strictly concerns that day and the millennial reign. It has absolutely nothing to do with the great tribulation. You see, every verse you try to use to prove pre trib will always have a mention about the post trib day of the Lord close by either directly or indirectly.
@skydiver626 Truthfully, I am OK with it if I am wrong. If I am wrong, so will millions of other believers but we will realize our error at that time, but post tribs say that we won't be ready because we have all been believing something wrong. No. I will just change my thinking and wait another 7 years for Him thats all. Not a big deal. I am done striving. Christians must not strive but be gentle so I am already outside of God's will arguing. This is the last. See ya in the rapture, maybe.
@rossdaboss1959 The real question is how can the their even be 2 separate comings when those who propogate the secret "part a" return are taking verses from the "part b" coming (the real second coming), ripping them out of context and trying to build their own doctrine with them which is exactly what you just did? You tried to use a verse (matt 24:38) that's clearly (and strictly) in context with Christ's post trib return and apply it to a pre-trib rapture.
@skydiver626 There are two separate comings. It says in the Bible that Jesus comes like a thief in the night. How then, if he comes during the tribulation will he come like a thief. Everyone will be seeing his wrath's and angels in the sky. I think those who are left behind will flee to the wilderness, not the church. There will be people left behind like the 144 000 Jews who will finally know their God and will not accept the Mark of the Beast. Remember Noah, God always protects his own.
Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2 for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 While people are saying, “Peace and safety,” destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape.
But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. 5 You are all children of the light and children of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness. 6 So then, let us not be like others, who are asleep, but let us be awake and sober.
7 For those who sleep, sleep at night, and those who get drunk, get drunk at night. 8 But since we belong to the day, let us be sober, putting on faith and love as a breastplate, and the hope of salvation as a helmet. 9 For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ
10 He died for us so that, whether we are awake or asleep, we may live together with him. 11 Therefore encourage one another and build each other up, just as in fact you are doing.
@skydiver626 11 Now may our God and Father himself and our Lord Jesus clear the way for us to come to you. 12 May the Lord make your love increase and overflow for each other and for everyone else, just as ours does for you. 13 May he strengthen your hearts so that you will be blameless and holy in the presence of our God and Father when our Lord Jesus comes WITH HIS HOLY ONES!"
If Jesus says you know not the day nor hour Jesus comes, not even he knows, then we will not know when Jesus FIRST comes. He comes at the end of the trib WITH HIS CHURCH, and everyone will see him and trust me, it will be NO SURPRISE.
"Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth."
"Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed- in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality."
This verse is NOT talking about the second coming of Jesus. It is talking about when the dead are raised after Satan is cast into the lake of fire. It is AFTER the events of the tribulation.
@rossdaboss1959 i believe just like you said. The rapture is the beginning of the wedding of Jesus Christ and his bride the church. Why would he suffer his bride when he already bought her with his very own blood? Our tribulation is now trying to spread the word and deal with the heartaches of people that dont know or want to know Jesus Christ. We come back with him when He is riding the white horse and on his thigh is written Faithful And True.
Paul writes of a Trump in 1st Thess and in 1st Corr. Does anyone out there do a Greek-Hebrew-Jewish bible study regarding the Feasts? Who was Jesus speaking to at the time of his ministry? (Greek, Hebrew, Jew) Those who believed that Jesus was the Messiah also knew he was referring to the Feasts that take place each year when he spoke in parables regarding the "Bride" or the virgins. I challenge you to research The Feasts in Israel and then read these bible verses again.....
@mparker469 This comes from the Perry Stone school of thought who has become a master of the scriptural "run-around." In short, if you want to see it, you'll find a way to see it, no matter how many literal interpretations and parallelisms you bowl over in the process. When Paul describes the trump of God in I Thess 4 he immediately speaks about the times and seasons of that trump, directly linking it to the post trib day of the Lord in chapter 5 verse 2. It can't be anymore clear.
@skydiver626 Why did'nt you include the following verses after verse 2? Just be ready, and watch for the Lord. He is coming soon, and pray that you are worthy to escape the wrath of God
@mparker469 Do you need me to included the other verses? Because they are ALL speaking about the post trib day of the Lord. Indeed, we are not subject to the wrath of God but notice that that verse (9) is in clear context with the day of the Lord of verse 2? Paul is stating that the church will not be overtaken like a thief (which is contrary to pre-trib imminence doctrine) and is not subject to the wrath of God ON THE DAY OF THE LORD. Why? verse 10 - the resurrection and rapture. But When?
@mparker469 part 2: Again, but when? Paul had already spoken about the "times and the seasons" of the church rapture at the begining of chapter 5. and I quote: "For yourselves know perfectly that the DAY OF THE LORD so cometh as a thief in the night." Paul is clearly linking the church rapture with the post trib day of the Lord there. As soon as you make that very simple connection, you're whole world will change. God Bless.
@mparker469 what is the wrath of god?? in 1 thess, paul does make it seem like the coming of our lord is eminent, however in 2 thess he tell the church at thessalonia not to worry about that because certain events will precede it. and the wrath of god is associated with the day of the lord, which is clearly at the end..
I was taught pre-trib but never understood it (there's a reason it is confusing). I asked God to show me - just me and my Bible - and I quickly saw that the Lord's coming and our being gathered/caught up are one and the same event. This can be seen plainly if you are not already indoctrinated with man's doctrine. If you are, it takes prayer and a sincere heart to break through the confusion.
Before the end, "there shall be a falling away". Most of the people who will fall away from the faith in Jesus, will be those who bet their souls on a Pre Trib Rapture.
I believe the Bride of Christ consists of the following....
1: The dead in Christ
2: Those that are alive and remain.
The 'Dead in Christ' would also include all of the Old testament saints because Jesus is God incarnate,and they were also saved by their faith that God would one day send a savior to redeem them.
It's ridiculous to think that only the Church would attend the wedding,while the other Saints would be left out.Christ will return only ONCE to claim all of his children.
2: Some Pre Tribs then try to make the argument that the Bride of Christ is only those of the Church that were saved From Jesus's time,until the Pre Trib rapture.This gives them an excuse to have the unprepared left on earth while they attend the wedding.
Therefore they draw a distinction between the Old testament saints and the Tribulation Christians saved after their Pre trib rapture.Nice try,too bad there is ZERO evidence to support this claim.
Two more points I'd like to make that I believe will shut Pre Tribbers up.
1: Aapparently he Bride of Christ consists of EVERY person through history that has put their faith in God and Jesus.Unfortunately for Pre Tribs,this also means the Tribulation Saints.
And seeing as there is only ONE final resurrection of the righteous seen in the bible,this means that the Rapture and rebirth of the dead saints will occur AFTER the Tribulation saints are beheaded.
Great videos! I have noticed that most people who believe in pre-trib rapture also believe they are saved while continuing in their sin. It's like Satan's lies go together: eternal security and the pre-trib rapture. Both false escapes for sinners. Another reason why I believe we are in the last days. How much worse can the world get than so many people believing they are Christians yet on the way to hell and hating true Christianity that stands against their sin.
Ah, nothing like the good KJV to get the true word of GOD. :-]
The pre-trib bunch crack me up because as you just showed, the WARNINGS to us about the tribulation were meant for us TRUE Christians who will be alive in those days.
We, however, will NOT be here for the WRATH of God poured out upon the Earth. Jesus will come for his elect first.
Amen. Good video. This was in related to sanderson1611's recent video. And looks pretty spot on.
I tottaly agree hy there is going to be a great with you sir that. You are quoting the scriptures correctly. That's why there is going to be a great falling away people are going to expect the Lord at a certain time or event and he is not going to come. No wonder Jesus did the parable of the wicked servant.
AHHHH 3:07- 3:22 this video maker makes an ASSUMPTION that the Last trump is the trumpet in Zephaniah 1:16 but it is only an assumption and can not be proven. Post tribs do this all the time. They either link scriptures incorrectly or accept that they don't have an answer for some things and get mad at the pre-trib position because we do offer an answer. 0:22 Mystery of God is the Church? Another assumption. the Mystery is just that A MYSTERY! God's wisdom and power of resurrection God in Flesh
@MinWilliamJosephWWM The Trump of Zeph is a trumpet associated with God's wrath. If you study the last trump of Rev, you will quickly find that "God's wrath is come." Secondly, there are 4-5 parallels between I Cor 15 and Rev 11's last trump that pre-tribbers have to explain away. As for the mystery, Paul reveals the mystery quite clearly in Ephesians 3. It was made known to him as the CHURCH!
Good logic here. The most obvious problem with the pre tribulation rapture theory, is how adamantly it is defended, that there CAN ABSOLUTELY be NO OTHER OPTION!! That leaves everyone unprepared. There is not even a discussion of 'what if', to make sure we are ready, in case, as the scripture exhorts us to be.
Therefore we have to carefully watch the language of the scripture when Christ mentions it in the book of revelation. If so you will see that he only mentions it accordingly and never will mention Great tribulation if it is not in the context. Paul never mentions that, the, or Great when he talks about his own tribulation or the tribulations of the saints. Read it carefully and you will see...Saying this I believe both are correct..post and pre. The sealed will be before and washed saints after.
The biggest contradiction people run into when speaking of the post trib is when Christ clearly mentions that those who repent are not cast into GREAT tribulation. Rev 2:22. Now one may say.."there is only one tribulation and thats when the antichrist reigns". This is a false statement. 1 Samuel 10:19,Romans 5:3,Ephesians 3:13 all speak of Tribulation'S. Paul spoke of enduring tribulation. Paul is not present during the GREAT tribulation but says he suffers through tribulation.
Heres the thing. Tribulation/s and Great tribulation or "the/that tribulation" ( "the"signifying greater importance) mentioned by Jesus and Paul are two different things. Tribulation/s go(es) on in the lives of saints today. But when Christ speaks in revelation of the time when the beast is revealed he always uses Great or The/that...not just the word tribulation/s. I myself am neutral on the tribulation and just believe that one should always remain holy instead of guessing the time.
It's funny how most of the scripture you're quoteing to back this up isn't fully written, and how you're looking into this through mostly uninterpreted. No man knows the day or the hour, so I'm ready wiether or not I have to go through half, all or the Tribulation in it's entirety. But make sure you're all reading the Word of God in total understanding, not just with what you think it means, because who gave us these prohecies? The same guy who knows when the Rapture will happen. I'm ready, You?
What's ironic is you admonish me for my lack of interpretation and yet you yourself use the "no man knows the day or the hour" and try to push an imminent "any-second" return with it. If you consider the actual context in operation around that phrase in Matt 24, you would soon realize that Christ wasn't pushing an imminent return but was strictly stating that no man knows the day or the hour of his post trib return.
Thank you so much for posting this. So many are deceived as to the timing of prophetic events. Pre-tribbers don't even realize they're being set up to accept antichrist (remember Paul said antichrist would be revealed FIRST, then Jesus would return). Perfect love casts out fear, post-tribbers are ready to accept death for the sake of the Gospel. Pre-tribbers fear pain and death and are ready to flee a deceived world for a fantasy.
Uhh. no.The antichrist promotes staying on earth and peace. All saints post or pre realize that Christ only promotes leaving this vile earth. So how can pre tribbers be fooled into taking the mark if Christ never said he would come back and create peace within THIS world. I think you should read up more on your bible before making generalizations.
God Bless You. Beautiful video telling it as the Bible tells it.
I like your insight that the "mystery of God" is the church. I would add to it by saying the mystery is finished by Christ's second coming. When he is REVEALED the greatest question of all time is answered.
Jhn 15:21 But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me.Gal 4:29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him [that was born] after the Spirit, even so [it is] now.
thetruthimpart 2 weeks ago
they knew thay no matter the outcome that there was hope in the resurrection and that brings peace as long as they are faithful.
Myhopeisinhim 2 weeks ago
@shadowlooker12
well said. We can even look at the disciples. They were persecuted and lost their lives but they didn't view God as cruel for allowing it to happen...they glorified God in it. They knew something better was waiting for them and they loved not their lives unto death.
There is so much we have to learn and those stories really help us understand the mindset we should have when it comes to these things.
No matter what happens good or bad...the Lord is with us through it all.
Myhopeisinhim 2 weeks ago
This is a fabulous well done video! At last, someone fights back at the pretrib lie and does so with scripture!! God bless you!!
deniwest57 2 weeks ago
@Shadowlooker12 i agree with everything you jutst said brother, thank you and God bless.
bobcatallstar7 2 weeks ago
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two things happen sacrifice cease and a war to the end and the begining of the 1290 days in Daniel 12:11 or the aprox 184.3 weeks within the two prophets are prophecing within the temple beast does not enter in until he kills to prophets leaving approx. 4.3 weeks or 45 days to setup abomination that maketh desolate in Rev 13:15 Rev 11:14 The second woe is past; [and], behold, the third woe cometh QUICKLY.
thetruthimpart 2 weeks ago
note that day Rev 11:2 Note without the temple 2Th 2:4 sets in temple
thetruthimpart 2 weeks ago
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thetruthimpart 2 weeks ago
1290 is within the 2300 days shown here and same words of Rev 11:2, Rev 13:5 Dan 8:13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain [saint] which spake, How long [shall be] the vision [concerning] the daily [sacrifice], and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be TRODDEN under foot? Dan 8:14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed
thetruthimpart 2 weeks ago
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Dan 8:14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed. (or 2300 days or aprox 76.6 months ) NOTE How those that say there are 7 years are wrong they add the time in Daniel with the time in Revelations 1290 days plus 1260 equals 2550 days or 85 months which is greater than the 2300 days in Daniel therefore you cannot add them.
thetruthimpart 2 weeks ago
Nicely done.. I was starting to think I was the only Christian that believe in Post-Trib. Its not that God wants to be cruel.. if we went with that logic, then God would just take us home as we accept him. Because of this lack of knowledge there will be a great falling away. A great delusion is coming, and I don't think most will know what hit them.
conradpilapil 1 month ago
@conradpilapil You are sooo right!! This pretrib rapture has already deceived billions. I feel so hopeless because the deluded pretribbers become absolutley vicious if you challenge their delusion! They are going to be lost I fear.
deniwest57 2 weeks ago
Can someone read Zach 13:88 Two-thirds of the people in the land will be cut off and die,” says the Lord.“But one-third will be left in the land. I will bring that group through the fire
and make them pure. I will refine them like silver and purify them like gold. They will call on my name, and I will answer them. I will say, ‘These are my people,’and they will say, ‘The Lord is our God.’” Also read Isaiah 48:9 Then we'll see the rapture take place. Shalom
edgarh509 2 months ago
Pre- tribulation is the right one becuase God will not make his children (Christians) suffer the horrible events that are coming.
bobcatallstar7 3 months ago
@bobcatallstar7 its happened before in history what makes you think it wont happen again?
ibrake4rappers 2 months ago
@bobcatallstar7
Did Jesus rapture out those who suffered in the Holocaust,or those who suffered in the dark ages? Christians were fed to the lions, burned at the stake. We were never promised to avoid tribulation, especially not the tribulation of man.
Myhopeisinhim 1 month ago
@Myhopeisinhim God would be cruel if he made us suffer throughout the whole tribulation. Im sure he has some way in protecting us from the wrath of the antichrist. 3 false years of peace and then 4 years of nothing but pain for God's children...that doesn't sound anything like God's plan....he is going to protect us some way...some how.
bobcatallstar7 1 month ago
@bobcatallstar7
You echo what half the unbelievers of the world say. If God existed, he wouldn't allow the children of the world to starve and die before they have a chance to live. If God existed, he wouldn't have allowed my husband/wife to die. If God existed...if God existed, he wouldn't let this or that happen....
My friend, you are on dangerous ends of falling away if and when the tribulation does start, even if its not the great tribulation. I fear for you.
Myhopeisinhim 1 month ago
We're told in the bible that the saints are going to be handed over and many will be killed just as it occurred in the early church, but that we are not to fear as those who have no hope. Our hope is not to escape persecution or trial, but that we have everlasting life in Christ and no man can take that from us, even if they kill this body.
Myhopeisinhim 1 month ago
That when Christ comes, we will be raised from the dead and enter into life because of him.
The world thinks God is cruel because they don't understand why certain things happen the way they do, and to them it seems like he does nothing to stop them. But as believers we know better than that even if we don't understand all things yet.
I pray that he will strengthen you to endure.
Myhopeisinhim 1 month ago
@Myhopeisinhim I assure you i am not a unbeliever brother. I am 100% for Christ and i believe that God is not cruel in anyway..I believe he will protect us in some type of way if pre-trib rapture isn't true
bobcatallstar7 1 month ago
@bobcatallstar7 God is not cruel a all, a cruel person that likes to kill and torture for the fun of things is cruel. God has a purpose for the things he does and this is judgement we are talking about, you know like if you did a crime? If you steal you go to jail as a consequence, is the court system cruel? No, you broke a law and deserve punishment for that action. Are parents and guardians cruel when they punish? No, they love you but you deserve punishment for your actions.
Shadowlooker12 2 weeks ago
@bobcatallstar7 I personally feel that,if tribulation happens in my lifetime and I have made that step to serve the most high LORD fully,I am not expecting to be saved,I will seek him for strength of endurance,and I'll teach my family or kids to do the same.I do not feel God is cruel in what he does at all,I may have fear or do not fully understand, but that is what God is there for,to give you understanding and strength even under persecution.If I must die for God, take my head.
Shadowlooker12 2 weeks ago
@bobcatallstar7 We should learn from those who trusted in God in the bible, when Hananiah, Misha'el and Azariah were going to be burned to death for not worshiping the gold idol, what did they say? “O Nebuchadnezzar,. . . ” they said respectfully, “the God we serve is able to save us from it, and he will rescue us from your hand, O king. BUT EVEN IF HE DOES NOT, we want you to know, O king, that we will not serve your gods or worship the image of gold you have set up."
Shadowlooker12 2 weeks ago
@bobcatallstar7 The didn't say "well it would be cruel for God to allow us to be burned to death. They kept their faith and pretty much said, well God can save us from you, but even if he doesn't we still won't disobey God. To them it didn't matter, even if they were to die, and they didn't see God as cruel if God did not save them. Now, of course people being human beings do not want to be tortured or beheaded, whipped etc but if it happens and it's disobedience vs obedience->
Shadowlooker12 2 weeks ago
@bobcatallstar7 So be it, take that death. It's hard to say or to watch a loved one get killed or such, but this is not a play on the heart string matter. God can protect us no problem, but scripture is scripture, it doesn't matter what we read into it, it is what it is. If we have to suffer tribulation, so be it, if only some people, so be it, if none, so be it. The problem I have is when people start lying, twisting things or leaning towards New age anti0Christ type beliefs.
Shadowlooker12 2 weeks ago
@bobcatallstar7 And the example of the bible story and the furnace is more close to the point I was getting at then the previous explanation of breaking a law.Those 3 men were men of God, they didn't break any law to be subject to punishment by Nebuchadnezzar,yet were about to be killed. They were saved by God, but they themselves made it clear that God did not have to and that even if he didn't they would not disobey him not indicated that God was cruel if he didn't save them.
Shadowlooker12 2 weeks ago
@bobcatallstar7 I'm sorry, but this line of thinking is what will cause the great falling away.. "For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect."
conradpilapil 1 month ago
POST-TRIBULATION RAPTURE!!! 7 SEALS OF REVELATION!!! 7 TRUMPETS!!! LAST TRUMPET ITS IN HIS WORD!! READ IT & QUIT LISTENING to all of these FALSE PROPHETS!!!
SoldierofChrist12345 3 months ago
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Check out MidnightWatcher's Blogspot and read through a few of the articles in the "Theology and Eschatology" section, particularly the "Not Appointed Unto Wrath" and "The Revelation of Jesus Christ and the Rapture of the Church" articles. I challenge anyone to refute them.
MidnightWatcher322 3 months ago
Whatever you believe; whether pre, mid or post-tribulation... it will not affect one's salvation through Jesus Christ. The question is, what doctrine will make a Christian more faithful and radical for Christ. The early Christians during the time of the Apostles undergone great tribulation or hardships, martyred for Jesus. Post-trib will make one courageous and faithful until the end. Matt. 28:20 "I will be with you until the end of the age."
juna17th 4 months ago
@juna17th The most scareful are thoose who are so into the pre-tribulation belive that it will damage their faith so much even some will loose their faith. If dosent happen pre. Witch i doubt.
lyon2k 4 months ago
2 thess 2 says that that day will not come (trib.) until mass apostasy as outlined in matthew 24 in 2:7 the spirit wll be taken out of the way (spirit seals the church until the day of redemption) and then the wicked one will be revealed..if the spirit goes the church goes. God doesnt judge righteousness and christians r under the blood. the day of the lord is jacobs trouble, times of the gentiles and all evil doers.
djfine100 4 months ago
Matthew 24 states 2 distinct comings: One via Ecclessia in greek which means assembling or gathering which goes against 1 thess4:17 and 1 cor 15 because the angels are sent at this time to gather the elect (not thechurch) from the 4 winds. the second is made mention of 2 in the field one taken the other left which would support the other verses which comes from the greek harpazo and latin raptus which means rapture...also found in 1 thess 4:16.
djfine100 4 months ago
The bible is clear first the old testament saints are in heaven from their dispensations...ephesians 4 Jesus led captivity captive...and other verses which support this theory not only in revelation but also hebrews 12 etc. The church will be the only group of people from the church age in the rapture which can occur at any time. the church will NOT be in the rapture because God will spare his people. Rev 19 has us in the chambers with the bride groom also isaiah 26:17 down. also in matthew
djfine100 4 months ago
Please watch this video series youtube.com/watch?v=bcqeI5LB6gM
It is made up of 5 parts.
Watch it all and try to come to a conclussion.
ruflychux 4 months ago
@boxermn You can block me all you want, but are wrong and can't admit it! Open your ears, or you just might be left behind. Do you read all the Bible so haphazardly like this??? If I were you, I'd quit listening to false & ridiculous videos, teachers, and people who do NOT understand the very Word of God! Good Luck to you, 'cause you're sure going to need it.
JesusHoldMyHand1 4 months ago
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THERE WILL BE NO RAPTURE.
THE BIBLE DOES NOT EVEN USE THE WORD.
There will be a "gathering". Read it again. Start with Genesis 49:10
Now read the Parable of the Tares. "Gathering" again.
Just like the days of Noah. Was Noah removed? Or was the EVIL removed.
Now Proverbs 2:22; Now Proverbs 10:30; Now Revelation 14:3, Mt Zion is on earth. The 144,000 are on the earth when the earth is reaped. How else can they see "one like the Son of Man" on that cloud in Rev 14:14?
themanningsjdsjjj 5 months ago
In the parable of the 10 virgins, oil in their lamps, 5 of them did not believe the groom was coming then. He did and because they were not ready, they did not go into the wedding feast. Post and mid tribulation rapture believers, beware...
boxermn 5 months ago
@boxermn I know many think the "oil" is to represent the Holy Spirit. However, the "foolish" virgins are "asking" for some of their oil. It is impossible for anyone to "give" someone else their Holy Spirit. The "theme" of the parable is to BE READY - Matthew 24:44. How is one to "be ready"? Over & over in Revelation 2 & 3, Christ tells the different kinds of Christians to REPENT. We are NOT to be living in sin, or He will come & catch you sinning. Revelation 3:3. Christ comes for the FAITHFUL
JesusHoldMyHand1 4 months ago
@JesusHoldMyHand1 Remember this is a parable. Jesus used parables to dumb it down to the apostles and later readers. Oil truly represents the Holy Spirit in life, but in this case it was just part of the parable of lamps, etc. The 5 left out, did not really believe the groom would come, so they did not bring extra lamp oil. A good clonusion is, Jesus will take only the proactive Christians to the wedding to marry and then the feast. I will message you a good video detailing this point.
boxermn 4 months ago
@boxermn I know what a parable is, and I'm telling you that the "oil" is NOT the Holy Spirit. A parable has truth & meaning behind it. The 5 foolish virgins didn't do what the Lord had told them. Instead they went clubbing, drinking, doing things the Lord does NOT approve of. Remember, it says He was gone for a "long" time. The Bridegroom, of course, is Christ. Unfaithful Christians WILL go through the Great Tribulation, unless they're dead when the Rapture happens. The door, Rev 4:1 SHUT
JesusHoldMyHand1 4 months ago
@JesusHoldMyHand1 Do a web search on Holy Spirit Oil, for the full details to this: Oil
Most Christians regard oil as a symbol of the Person and ministry of the Holy Spirit. Throughout the Old Testament we see oil being used for holy purposes. The priests were consecrated and ordained unto God as oil was poured upon their heads … You have a view of the parable I do not agree with, so be it. THE END
boxermn 4 months ago
@boxermn It seems to me you don't care what the Lord says. The Holy Spirit can NOT be given from one person to the next. Don't you understand that? If it could, then those 5 wise virgins were stingy.....like not giving someone money, food, clothes, etc. It does seem to me that you DON'T understand what the Lord is saying. Please go back and read it. Matthew 25:1-13 - BE READY for the SON OF MAN will come when YOU LEAST expect Him. ALL 10 virgins were Christians, only 5 were the BRIDE.
JesusHoldMyHand1 4 months ago
@boxermn Since when does anyone BUY the Hoy Spirit. Matthew 25:9-10 is VERY clear. They were NOT ready!!! The 5 wise virgins ALL READY bought their oil - NOT the Holy Spirit!!!!
JesusHoldMyHand1 4 months ago
@JesusHoldMyHand1 THE END - That means end of discussion with me.
boxermn 4 months ago
@boxermn I'll tell you right now, you have been mislead, and taught wrongly. You are the stubborn one, so I will give a couple days to think about it. Just WHERE do you BUY the Holy Spirit. Just answer that one question. I'd like to know so I can give Him out to my unbeliving friends. Thank You
JesusHoldMyHand1 4 months ago
@JesusHoldMyHand1 YOU ARE NOW MESSAGE BLOCKED - THE END MEANT THE END
boxermn 4 months ago
The pre tribulation rapture is a prophetic event that will happen very soon, no doubt about it. You reap what you sow! Gal. 6:7
paulojose1955 6 months ago
For those who take Luke 17:34 where it talks about one will be taken and the other left as the rapture you must read on to verse 35 where it says two women will be grinding grain one will be taken and the other left. The deciples ask Jesus where will they we taken. Jesus replied where the vultures are. Also Matthew 13 parable of the weeds First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles then gather the wheat in my barn. we don't want to be the first taken.
mvmof2 7 months ago
hey people the point whether pre, mid, or post is be ready and to evangelize not waste time in debates about our savior.
icysilver1 7 months ago
PRE-TRIB RAPTURE is a Satanic lie. There will be a mass abduction of people and UFOs will be involved. This will be deliberately done to weaken the faith of the 'believers', not to mention what these demonic entities we refer to as 'aliens' will do to the people they abduct--probably some form of human sacrifice.
cmchambers777 11 months ago
@cmchambers777, How do you know that Aliens will be involved? I think the antichrist will proclaim himself as a god incarnate and will have crazy powers to perform magic tricks. Who knows? Maybe demons will disguise themselves as angels and help perpetrate this lie. I think the antichrist is middle eastern by the way.
Nashhinton 10 months ago
at 1:48 it's actually 2 Thessalonians 1:4 ;)
speyder1 11 months ago
you have to be a speed reader to keep up with the video... >.<
razblack 11 months ago
You would think the desire to go through the tribulation would be as popular as the desire to jump into a pit filled with vipers and broken glass. As illogical as it may seem, there appears to be a large number of Christians that fully expect to get roughed up before Christ returns.
Many Christians argue strongly for the right to suffer persecution at the hands of the Antichrist and the one world government. "Because Jesus and His disciples suffered persecution, we should expect no better."
Bhatch2007 11 months ago
btw, nice vid, Sky
Maybehapsso 11 months ago
How do folks that read the Bible find a pre trib? That would mean He comes 3 times, only comes twice, 1st advent, then POST trib. If everyone flies away, then whom is left here for satan to tickle? Does he tickle those he already has? NO! Therefore, you fly away doctrine folks WILL be right here in the mud. Look around the trump and bowls are in action NOW....uhhhh...you still here arent you! Dont take 1 scripture and build a case, ie Thess...read EVERYTHING for correct context.
Maybehapsso 11 months ago
Great presentation, bro! I also liked how you used the KJV.
SuperChristianMetal 11 months ago
I disagree wtih you 1st we are not appointed to wrath.,
1- Study ancient Jewish wedding where the groom takes the bride away for 7 days then comes to publicly declare their marriage- you need to study this.
2- Feasts of the Jews - Jesus fulfilled some of them the next one is Feast of Trumpets Rosh Hashana where 2 witness view the new moon
3- The Trump of God refer to Trump of God not trump of the angles of Revelation. God also sounded his trump once previously in the old Testament
incognita1989 1 year ago
This is what I think...I don't believe in pre tribulation rapture...I don't see any test of faith with a pre tribulation rapture. People who are so insistent that God will deliver us from everything, I think its a possiblity they lack faith. What will they think when it hasn't happened yet? Will that lead them to take the mark?
natalieanne101 1 year ago
@natalieanne101 Exactly. Do you think that God is pleased with the church in it's current state? The great trib is all about refinement. He's coming back for a church without spot or blemish and the great trib is going to be the fire to purify out all the gargabe and get his people back to what's important. God Bless.
skydiver626 1 year ago
they want a pre trib rapture because the modern church is so soft and indulgent that the idea of the Bride of Christ so much as breaking i fingernail, so to speak, is anathema to them. If the trib is in our lifetime we will indeed be martyred almost to a man. I also reject the idea that the rapture is secret. We will rise visibly before the very eyes of our persecuters who will dread his wrath all the more because of this, and it happens at the second coming, Matt 24 is clear, crystal clear
Strefanasha 1 year ago
When I read Matthew 24 I do not see a secret coming nor two separate comings...I only see the one coming of Christ which shall be heralded by the sound of the Last Trumpet and the righteous elect of God will rejoice and the wicked will mourn. The dead in Christ will rise first and faithful servants who are alive at the time will be "raptured' or caught-up and meet Christ in the air as he descends and forever be with the Lord. The key is to be ready ... that His coming not take u unawares. Simple
Cmedic57 1 year ago
Amen! I Believe in a post trib rapture! If anyone cant see the scriptures, then they are deceived!
jsmccarty82 1 year ago
skydiver626 is correct with this subject. You literly have to twist the scripures to get them to support the pre-trib rapture. Jesus himself said I will raise them up at the last day 3 times. And Paul clearly taught that the dead in Christ go before those who are alive and remain. And the dead in Christ are not raised until the Last Day! So how can those who are Alive and Remain be gone 7 years before thoses sleeping in Christ? They can`t...And there are so many more flaws in pre-trib teaching!
HumbleHeartMinistry 1 year ago
ive seen that it could also mean the "first fruits" as in the 144000 taken up before. i have studied much and still not 100% maybe that's the Lords way, to have intelligient and dilligent study and debate. JUST BE READY !
zackrowe1 1 year ago
awesome video. not many ppl study to show themselves approved. awesome work
clark4christ 1 year ago
What if they are right? Check out Dr Owuor on here, that should help u to see the truth. Stop being used of the devil before it's too late. Check out this guy and see if u still believe.
rossdaboss1959 1 year ago
This has always been so confusing and anoying Because the question is do the believers get raptured away before the tribulation or christ come at THE end meaning after the anti-christ reign
LALJERK 1 year ago
exactly, they have a strong delusion and rather believe the lie(rapture) than the word of Jesus
rolling422 1 year ago
So 1/2 of mankind is dead and probably unburied. Tthere are no super markets because it hasn't rained in 3 years and famine is worldwide. 1/3 of the H2O is poisoned and Im a bit thirsty standing in the middle of all these dead people. I don't notice the peace in Israel or a temple is erected behind my back. Prince charming died and came back to life. I cant barter because I won't take the mark of the beast which leaves me hiding in a cave. Wouldnt' we sort of be getting suspicious of his return
TheEzekiel38 1 year ago
There is not a post tribulation rapture, because why would there be a post trib rapture when that is when Jesus is coming to earth with His saints.
1954phyllis 1 year ago
excellent
preacherpete1 1 year ago
excellent,brother in christ
preacherpete1 1 year ago
How can the two comings be the same? At the second coming every eye shall see him. There's going to be such terrible times at the second coming that nobody is going to be partying, drinking, and worrying about getting married and all that stuff. At the rapture, people are going to be partying, drinking, having a good time, not even thinking about the coming of the Lord just like it is now. The second coming, People are going to be so scared it's not going to be funny. Acts 2:38.
rossdaboss1959 1 year ago
@rossdaboss1959 Then you oppose the very words of Christ because even Jesus stated in Matthew 24 that at his second coming - IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE GREAT TRIB, they (unbelievers) will be doing exactly that: eating and drinking and marrying (vs38). You see, the trib is designated for the true church. Those who submit to the beast system and take the mark will not be persecuted and will go about their daily lives until the 2nd coming.
skydiver626 1 year ago
@skydiver626 I believe that you have got it backwards, the trib is designated for the lost and those that have received the mark. The saved during the trib will be killed because they dont take the mark. But at the rapture the saved of all ages will be caught up in the sky to meet Jesus in the sky and will be with Him during the trib.
1954phyllis 1 year ago
1954phyllis That is exactly why he uses the term.Those who are "alive and remain".The antichrist will overcome the saints and cause them to reject Christ & take the mark or be put to death.But some will make it to the last day and be raptured out.After those that have died in Christ are raised and they will meet the Lord in the air.Just before the wrath of God is poured out! Tribulation & wrath are not the same thing.The dead go before the living.Jesus said,He would raise them The Last Day!
HumbleHeartMinistry 1 year ago
@HumbleHeartMinistry I beg to differ with you on this topic. Jesus will come for His saints before the tribulation. Those Christians that are killed during the tribulation are the ones that refuse to accept the mark of the beast. Please read 1 Thessalonians 4:16,17. I really don't understand where in the Bible you get such a notion. The dead and the living saints will be raised at the same time in the blink of an eye.
1954phyllis 1 year ago
@1954phyllis First of all we are brothers in the Lord who do disagree. And thats ok because the bible says to contend for the faith. The scripture you gave me to read very much says in 16 "the dead in Christ shall rise first" 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds.They rise first then we meet them there. The whole point being that the dead do not raise up according to Jesus himself until the last day.Not seven years before that.John 6:39,40,54
HumbleHeartMinistry 1 year ago
@HumbleHeartMinistry "For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord." 1Thess. 4:16,17 The living and the dead saints will be raptured out of here in the blink of an eye.The saints that will be killed during the trib will go to be with the Lord
1954phyllis 1 year ago
@1954phyllis The dead in Christ do not raise from the dead until the Last Day! If they don`t raise until the Last Day and we don`t get raptured until they raise,How can it be possable that there is still 7 years?Keep on reading as not to take it out of content.In1Thes 5:2 it clearly says that its taking about the Day of the Lord. Read 2 Peter2:10-15 about what the Day of the Lord is.And compair it to the other many accounts of it in the old testiment.
HumbleHeartMinistry 1 year ago
@1954phyllis The dead in Christ do not raise from the dead until the Last Day! If they don`t raise until the Last Day and we don`t get raptured until they raise,How can it be possable that there is still 7 years?Keep on reading as not to take it out of content.In1Thes 5:2 it clearly says that its talking about the Day of the Lord. Read 2 Peter2:10-15 about what the Day of the Lord is.And compair it to the other many accounts of it in the old testiment.
HumbleHeartMinistry 1 year ago
@1954phyllis Jesus was ask about the signs of the end in Luke 17. He used Noah V27 and said they ate and drank ect. until the DAY that Noah entered into the ark,and the flood came and destroyed them all. Then he used Lot V29 The SAME DAY Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all. V30 Even thus shall it be in the DAY when the Son of man is revealed. We are caught up the same day just before the world is burnt up for its unrighteousness.
HumbleHeartMinistry 1 year ago
@HumbleHeartMinistry The earth is not burnt up until the lost are cast into hell. During the tribualation there are some people that will be saved. The ones that will be saved will be killed and go on to heaven to be with the saints of all ages. Remember how Enoch and Elijah were caught up into heaven:well all the saved living and dead will be caught up just like they were and we will be with Him forevermore.I don't know where you have got this idea that there won't be a rapture but it is wrong
1954phyllis 1 year ago
@1954phyllis Dude I`m worried about you! Where on earth did you get the Idea I`m saying there is no rapture? Nothing I said in my comments was saying that. I am simply saying that the pre-trib rapture is a fairy tale. Those who are Christs are caught away(raptured) on the Last day.Not 7 years before.We will go through the tribulation. and some of us will be killed.But some of us will not before the Day of the Lord.Those who are not will be raptured but not until the last day!
HumbleHeartMinistry 1 year ago
@HumbleHeartMinistry I'd like to ask you a question please, why would Christ wait until He has defeated Satan and bound him for a thousand years to rapture His saints out of this world? No the Christians that are saved before the trib will be raptured out of here before the tribulation starts. Again I say why would Jesus wait until after the tribulation to rapture us out of here?
1954phyllis 1 year ago
@1954phyllis Don`t you know that satan is already defeated? He was defeated at the cross! Look my friend the rapture is like when Noah entered the ark. He was not put in the ark 7 years before the flood came.He entered the ark the same day the flood came. Same with Lot. He was takin out of the city and the same day God rained fire from heaven down on those cities. I believe Gods word. Not the teachings of man.You go ahead and believe the doctrine of man that started in 1830. I will believe God.
HumbleHeartMinistry 1 year ago
@HumbleHeartMinistry You are totally wrong The Christians are taken out before the tribulation starts. Read 1Thesslonians4:1,17. I beg your pardon but the pre-trib rapture is Biblical. Are you saying that ST. Paul is a liar? No you are not believing God.
1954phyllis 1 year ago
@1954phyllis How many time will you give me the same scriture that you are taking out of content? Just 3 scritures further in the same book-- 5:2 clearly states Paul was speaking of the "Day of the Lord". I love ya brother! But you are wrong! I tried to show you but you got your mind made up. So when you see the Antichrist proclaiming to be God. Remember, You are in the tribulation. But my going back and forth with you is doing no good. So you have a great day!
HumbleHeartMinistry 1 year ago
@HumbleHeartMinistry You are partially right, however this is how it goes: The rapture will happen first before the tribulation, and all those Christains who are ready will be raptured. However after the rapture some of God's people will still be here, some will miss the rapture because some wont be ready, and also some of Gods people will be here as a remant and those who missed the rapture will have one last chance and in that time, they will be killed, if they confess to be Christian
kreynold 1 year ago
@HumbleHeartMinistry the remant of God, is those that God appoints to be here during the tribulation to led all the others. So yes, some of us will still be here. But God is calling his people to prepare now, but many wont take heed and they will miss the rapture but praise be to Yeshua, that they will have another chance, but they must not take the mark of the beast and because of their refusal they will be killed, but they will not die they will join the others who was already raptured!!!
kreynold 1 year ago
@kreynold True, but they join us in Heaven in Spirit & Soul only. They are not "resurrected" until Revelation 20:4-6 Their bodies are never "Raptured".
JesusHoldMyHand1 11 months ago
@skydiver626 but isn't the tribulation supposedly so terrible at 3and half mark
LALJERK 1 year ago
@skydiver626 Wow, that really clears up any confusion. A very valuable point. I did not see that before...
CrackerJayherber 1 year ago
@skydiver626 Jude 14 "Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men: "See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones (saints KJV) to judge everyone, and to convict all the ungodly of all the ungodly acts they have done in the ungodly way, and of all the harsh words ungodly sinners have spoken against him."
Still think there is no "rapture"?
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
@Kr0n1k4Lyfe: Also, Isaiah 26:19-21 is a pre-trib Rapture in the O.T. and the rooms mentioned are the same ones from John 14:1-3. I believe the Rapture will be in the first half of 2011. It has to be soon. I just made a video outlining my reasoning. I'd appreciate any feedback you have.
watch?v=NGdZmnM5jPQ
nitdiver5 1 year ago
@skydiver626 That makes no sense. After the Tribulation who in their right mind will be having a good time? Certainly no true believer in Christ.
Bhatch2007 11 months ago
@skydiver626 Jesus said He is coming as a thief in the night. If the post-trib is true, then people will know exactly when He will come. They just have to count exactly 7 years from when the Antichrist signs the treaty with Israel. And then they know Jesus will come. There's no surprise factor there.The Bible says NO ONE KNOWS THE DAY OR THE HOUR. And how can there be partying and drinking and marrying during the great trib. The whole world will be in utter chaos.
melaygrovecourt 10 months ago
@skydiver626 In Matt. 24:32, Jesus starts to reiterate what He had said before with a parable. He is now done explaining the trib. period and He starts to talk of what it will be like before these things start. V. 38 is the same as Luke 17:26-30 and then He even tells us about the snatching away in Matt.24:40 and that before He comes for His Bride (different than every eye and mourning for Him) things will be as normal. Will things be normal after the trib. when 3 bil. corpses litter earth?
chefjimmie1 9 months ago
@chefjimmie1 Your absolutely right - jesus does reiterate the things he had just stated in parable in matt 24. What did he say? Immediately after the great trib, the son will descend and gather his elect. He then likens that literal description with the parable of the 10 virgins - which by the way can be found mentioned again in Rev 19 and is again found to be in context with a post trib return. You see, matt 24:29 and on is describing Jesus' post trib return yet you try to twist into pre?
skydiver626 9 months ago
@skydiver626 No, I am not trying to twist anything. Matt. 24:29 IS the post trib gathering of those that were saved during the trib. Matt.24:37-42 describes the PRE TRIB RAPTURE, when things are going on as normal and there is a sudden snatching away. After the Trib. those few who are left alive will be expecting His return again because they will have figured out that before everybody dies, He will come back. This confirms the 2 comings that I was trying to explain, no twisting of anything.
chefjimmie1 9 months ago
@chefjimmie1 Where in the world are you getting the idea that Matt 24:37 switches gears and talks about a pre-trib rapture? Jesus was in strict context with his post-trib gathering of vs 29-31 when he uses the analogy of the fig tree and then lastly, the comparison of Noah's day to his coming. He NEVER deviates from it. If Jesus wanted us to know about a pre-trib rapture, he would have laid it out in great pre-tib detail before discussing it. Read it again.
skydiver626 9 months ago
@skydiver626 24:40 says "Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other one left, 41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Taken where? Taken with Jesus in the Rapture leaving the other behind to go through the Trib. Can't you see that these are two separate events? In the rapture, Jesus comes in the clouds; in the second coming, He comes to the earth. In the Rapture, He is not seen, in the 2nd coming, every eye will see Him
chefjimmie1 9 months ago
@chefjimmie1 Jesus will descend with a SHOUT, with the TRUMP of God and with the VOICE of the archangel and yet he will not be seen? Seriously, where are getting these ideas from? Please provide scripture that rapture of I Thess 4:16 is secret please. Actually, let me give you a verse. This is for all you pre-tribbers out there: Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the SECRET chambers; believe it not.
skydiver626 9 months ago
@skydiver626 I have a theory why people hold to this post trib doctrine, maybe some of them aren't ready for Christ to return at any minute and they are hoping to see the things talked about in the bible about the tribulation so that they can totally commit to Jesus at that time. I am ready to see Him NOW! I welcome His coming, do you? I am looking forward to His coming more than anything in this world. If by some chance you are right, I will then regroup, and go through it but that isn't
chefjimmie1 9 months ago
@chefjimmie1 That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Post trib promotes a yearning for spiritual preparation for what's to come. We're not looking for an excuse to goof off until the tribulation kicks in. The fact that death is imminent for every human should keep any believer in check about how they should be living their lives no matter if they're pre or post. Anyway, good luck and I urge you to do a study on the day of the Lord because that's what the Apostles were looking for.
skydiver626 9 months ago
@skydiver626 Amen. If we go through the tribulation we need to be prepared to have the AntiChrist make war with us, and we will be persecuted, and may have to die because of our faith. That doesn't sound like a broad path to me.
harmono 8 months ago 2
@skydiver626 What the bible says is going to happen. Seriously, are you afraid to die? Why would you argue with the bible saying what it says. Are you afraid that you are not ready? If you are not, you better get ready because He is coming in the clouds for His Bride and He will hide us in our chambers (Isaiah 26:20) for a short while until his indignation be overpast. They will explain our disappearance as being "evolved" to a higher spiritual state or will say that aliens abducted us.
chefjimmie1 9 months ago
@chefjimmie1 Once again, you just quoted a verse that's in strict context with the post trib day of the Lord. In fact, the whole book of Isaiah strictly concerns that day and the millennial reign. It has absolutely nothing to do with the great tribulation. You see, every verse you try to use to prove pre trib will always have a mention about the post trib day of the Lord close by either directly or indirectly.
skydiver626 9 months ago
@skydiver626 Truthfully, I am OK with it if I am wrong. If I am wrong, so will millions of other believers but we will realize our error at that time, but post tribs say that we won't be ready because we have all been believing something wrong. No. I will just change my thinking and wait another 7 years for Him thats all. Not a big deal. I am done striving. Christians must not strive but be gentle so I am already outside of God's will arguing. This is the last. See ya in the rapture, maybe.
chefjimmie1 9 months ago
@skydiver626 The bible clearly teaches 2 different comings of Christ one before the great tribulation and one after.
chefjimmie1 9 months ago
@rossdaboss1959 The real question is how can the their even be 2 separate comings when those who propogate the secret "part a" return are taking verses from the "part b" coming (the real second coming), ripping them out of context and trying to build their own doctrine with them which is exactly what you just did? You tried to use a verse (matt 24:38) that's clearly (and strictly) in context with Christ's post trib return and apply it to a pre-trib rapture.
skydiver626 1 year ago 2
@skydiver626 The rapture and the second coming are two separate events.
1954phyllis 1 year ago
@skydiver626 There are two separate comings. It says in the Bible that Jesus comes like a thief in the night. How then, if he comes during the tribulation will he come like a thief. Everyone will be seeing his wrath's and angels in the sky. I think those who are left behind will flee to the wilderness, not the church. There will be people left behind like the 144 000 Jews who will finally know their God and will not accept the Mark of the Beast. Remember Noah, God always protects his own.
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
Thessalonians 5:1
Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, 2 for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 While people are saying, “Peace and safety,” destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape.
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
Thessalonians 5:4
But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. 5 You are all children of the light and children of the day. We do not belong to the night or to the darkness. 6 So then, let us not be like others, who are asleep, but let us be awake and sober.
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
7 For those who sleep, sleep at night, and those who get drunk, get drunk at night. 8 But since we belong to the day, let us be sober, putting on faith and love as a breastplate, and the hope of salvation as a helmet. 9 For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
10 He died for us so that, whether we are awake or asleep, we may live together with him. 11 Therefore encourage one another and build each other up, just as in fact you are doing.
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
@skydiver626 11 Now may our God and Father himself and our Lord Jesus clear the way for us to come to you. 12 May the Lord make your love increase and overflow for each other and for everyone else, just as ours does for you. 13 May he strengthen your hearts so that you will be blameless and holy in the presence of our God and Father when our Lord Jesus comes WITH HIS HOLY ONES!"
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
If Jesus says you know not the day nor hour Jesus comes, not even he knows, then we will not know when Jesus FIRST comes. He comes at the end of the trib WITH HIS CHURCH, and everyone will see him and trust me, it will be NO SURPRISE.
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
Revelation 3:10
"Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth."
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
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1 Corinthians 15:51-53
"Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed- in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality."
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
1 Corinthians 15:51-53
This verse is NOT talking about the second coming of Jesus. It is talking about when the dead are raised after Satan is cast into the lake of fire. It is AFTER the events of the tribulation.
Kr0n1k4Lyfe 1 year ago
@rossdaboss1959 i believe just like you said. The rapture is the beginning of the wedding of Jesus Christ and his bride the church. Why would he suffer his bride when he already bought her with his very own blood? Our tribulation is now trying to spread the word and deal with the heartaches of people that dont know or want to know Jesus Christ. We come back with him when He is riding the white horse and on his thigh is written Faithful And True.
SusanRichardsDay 1 year ago
i hope all of the human race is ruptered so i can be the only human left on earth
iamveryangery777 1 year ago
Paul writes of a Trump in 1st Thess and in 1st Corr. Does anyone out there do a Greek-Hebrew-Jewish bible study regarding the Feasts? Who was Jesus speaking to at the time of his ministry? (Greek, Hebrew, Jew) Those who believed that Jesus was the Messiah also knew he was referring to the Feasts that take place each year when he spoke in parables regarding the "Bride" or the virgins. I challenge you to research The Feasts in Israel and then read these bible verses again.....
mparker469 1 year ago
@mparker469 This comes from the Perry Stone school of thought who has become a master of the scriptural "run-around." In short, if you want to see it, you'll find a way to see it, no matter how many literal interpretations and parallelisms you bowl over in the process. When Paul describes the trump of God in I Thess 4 he immediately speaks about the times and seasons of that trump, directly linking it to the post trib day of the Lord in chapter 5 verse 2. It can't be anymore clear.
skydiver626 1 year ago
@skydiver626 Why did'nt you include the following verses after verse 2? Just be ready, and watch for the Lord. He is coming soon, and pray that you are worthy to escape the wrath of God
mparker469 1 year ago
@mparker469 Do you need me to included the other verses? Because they are ALL speaking about the post trib day of the Lord. Indeed, we are not subject to the wrath of God but notice that that verse (9) is in clear context with the day of the Lord of verse 2? Paul is stating that the church will not be overtaken like a thief (which is contrary to pre-trib imminence doctrine) and is not subject to the wrath of God ON THE DAY OF THE LORD. Why? verse 10 - the resurrection and rapture. But When?
skydiver626 1 year ago
@mparker469 part 2: Again, but when? Paul had already spoken about the "times and the seasons" of the church rapture at the begining of chapter 5. and I quote: "For yourselves know perfectly that the DAY OF THE LORD so cometh as a thief in the night." Paul is clearly linking the church rapture with the post trib day of the Lord there. As soon as you make that very simple connection, you're whole world will change. God Bless.
skydiver626 1 year ago
@skydiver626 The rapture will not be after the trib.
1954phyllis 1 year ago
@mparker469 what is the wrath of god?? in 1 thess, paul does make it seem like the coming of our lord is eminent, however in 2 thess he tell the church at thessalonia not to worry about that because certain events will precede it. and the wrath of god is associated with the day of the lord, which is clearly at the end..
cjbrake 1 year ago
Excellent!
I was taught pre-trib but never understood it (there's a reason it is confusing). I asked God to show me - just me and my Bible - and I quickly saw that the Lord's coming and our being gathered/caught up are one and the same event. This can be seen plainly if you are not already indoctrinated with man's doctrine. If you are, it takes prayer and a sincere heart to break through the confusion.
God bless!
Jimvesterstallone 1 year ago
Before the end, "there shall be a falling away". Most of the people who will fall away from the faith in Jesus, will be those who bet their souls on a Pre Trib Rapture.
Hooverdarnit 1 year ago
I believe the Bride of Christ consists of the following....
1: The dead in Christ
2: Those that are alive and remain.
The 'Dead in Christ' would also include all of the Old testament saints because Jesus is God incarnate,and they were also saved by their faith that God would one day send a savior to redeem them.
It's ridiculous to think that only the Church would attend the wedding,while the other Saints would be left out.Christ will return only ONCE to claim all of his children.
richiefranklin76 1 year ago
2: Some Pre Tribs then try to make the argument that the Bride of Christ is only those of the Church that were saved From Jesus's time,until the Pre Trib rapture.This gives them an excuse to have the unprepared left on earth while they attend the wedding.
Therefore they draw a distinction between the Old testament saints and the Tribulation Christians saved after their Pre trib rapture.Nice try,too bad there is ZERO evidence to support this claim.
richiefranklin76 1 year ago
Great Video!
Two more points I'd like to make that I believe will shut Pre Tribbers up.
1: Aapparently he Bride of Christ consists of EVERY person through history that has put their faith in God and Jesus.Unfortunately for Pre Tribs,this also means the Tribulation Saints.
And seeing as there is only ONE final resurrection of the righteous seen in the bible,this means that the Rapture and rebirth of the dead saints will occur AFTER the Tribulation saints are beheaded.
richiefranklin76 1 year ago
Great videos! I have noticed that most people who believe in pre-trib rapture also believe they are saved while continuing in their sin. It's like Satan's lies go together: eternal security and the pre-trib rapture. Both false escapes for sinners. Another reason why I believe we are in the last days. How much worse can the world get than so many people believing they are Christians yet on the way to hell and hating true Christianity that stands against their sin.
God bless you!
jforsy01 1 year ago
Ah, nothing like the good KJV to get the true word of GOD. :-]
The pre-trib bunch crack me up because as you just showed, the WARNINGS to us about the tribulation were meant for us TRUE Christians who will be alive in those days.
We, however, will NOT be here for the WRATH of God poured out upon the Earth. Jesus will come for his elect first.
Amen. Good video. This was in related to sanderson1611's recent video. And looks pretty spot on.
GodGunsGutsGlory777 1 year ago
I tottaly agree hy there is going to be a great with you sir that. You are quoting the scriptures correctly. That's why there is going to be a great falling away people are going to expect the Lord at a certain time or event and he is not going to come. No wonder Jesus did the parable of the wicked servant.
MrRedjordan 1 year ago
One of your best videos yet! thanks for posting!
truthseeker370 1 year ago
AHHHH 3:07- 3:22 this video maker makes an ASSUMPTION that the Last trump is the trumpet in Zephaniah 1:16 but it is only an assumption and can not be proven. Post tribs do this all the time. They either link scriptures incorrectly or accept that they don't have an answer for some things and get mad at the pre-trib position because we do offer an answer. 0:22 Mystery of God is the Church? Another assumption. the Mystery is just that A MYSTERY! God's wisdom and power of resurrection God in Flesh
MinWilliamJosephWWM 1 year ago
@MinWilliamJosephWWM The Trump of Zeph is a trumpet associated with God's wrath. If you study the last trump of Rev, you will quickly find that "God's wrath is come." Secondly, there are 4-5 parallels between I Cor 15 and Rev 11's last trump that pre-tribbers have to explain away. As for the mystery, Paul reveals the mystery quite clearly in Ephesians 3. It was made known to him as the CHURCH!
skydiver626 1 year ago
Good logic here. The most obvious problem with the pre tribulation rapture theory, is how adamantly it is defended, that there CAN ABSOLUTELY be NO OTHER OPTION!! That leaves everyone unprepared. There is not even a discussion of 'what if', to make sure we are ready, in case, as the scripture exhorts us to be.
bonners11 1 year ago
Therefore we have to carefully watch the language of the scripture when Christ mentions it in the book of revelation. If so you will see that he only mentions it accordingly and never will mention Great tribulation if it is not in the context. Paul never mentions that, the, or Great when he talks about his own tribulation or the tribulations of the saints. Read it carefully and you will see...Saying this I believe both are correct..post and pre. The sealed will be before and washed saints after.
gregthesenior12 1 year ago
The biggest contradiction people run into when speaking of the post trib is when Christ clearly mentions that those who repent are not cast into GREAT tribulation. Rev 2:22. Now one may say.."there is only one tribulation and thats when the antichrist reigns". This is a false statement. 1 Samuel 10:19,Romans 5:3,Ephesians 3:13 all speak of Tribulation'S. Paul spoke of enduring tribulation. Paul is not present during the GREAT tribulation but says he suffers through tribulation.
gregthesenior12 1 year ago
Heres the thing. Tribulation/s and Great tribulation or "the/that tribulation" ( "the"signifying greater importance) mentioned by Jesus and Paul are two different things. Tribulation/s go(es) on in the lives of saints today. But when Christ speaks in revelation of the time when the beast is revealed he always uses Great or The/that...not just the word tribulation/s. I myself am neutral on the tribulation and just believe that one should always remain holy instead of guessing the time.
gregthesenior12 1 year ago
It's funny how most of the scripture you're quoteing to back this up isn't fully written, and how you're looking into this through mostly uninterpreted. No man knows the day or the hour, so I'm ready wiether or not I have to go through half, all or the Tribulation in it's entirety. But make sure you're all reading the Word of God in total understanding, not just with what you think it means, because who gave us these prohecies? The same guy who knows when the Rapture will happen. I'm ready, You?
TheFoilGuy 1 year ago
What's ironic is you admonish me for my lack of interpretation and yet you yourself use the "no man knows the day or the hour" and try to push an imminent "any-second" return with it. If you consider the actual context in operation around that phrase in Matt 24, you would soon realize that Christ wasn't pushing an imminent return but was strictly stating that no man knows the day or the hour of his post trib return.
skydiver626 1 year ago
Thank you so much for posting this. So many are deceived as to the timing of prophetic events. Pre-tribbers don't even realize they're being set up to accept antichrist (remember Paul said antichrist would be revealed FIRST, then Jesus would return). Perfect love casts out fear, post-tribbers are ready to accept death for the sake of the Gospel. Pre-tribbers fear pain and death and are ready to flee a deceived world for a fantasy.
marc0483 2 years ago
@marc0483
Uhh. no.The antichrist promotes staying on earth and peace. All saints post or pre realize that Christ only promotes leaving this vile earth. So how can pre tribbers be fooled into taking the mark if Christ never said he would come back and create peace within THIS world. I think you should read up more on your bible before making generalizations.
gregthesenior12 1 year ago
Last trump means at the end of the trump. first the dead will rise and the at the end of the trump we will be changed (rapture).
7181481 2 years ago
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7181481 2 years ago
God Bless You. Beautiful video telling it as the Bible tells it.
I like your insight that the "mystery of God" is the church. I would add to it by saying the mystery is finished by Christ's second coming. When he is REVEALED the greatest question of all time is answered.
baqashchokmahelel 2 years ago
Excellent Video!!!
Pepsifx357 2 years ago
Amen. Amen. Thanks for the video.
JCproMG 2 years ago
great music!!! great message!!
what track is this?? movie soundtrack??
AntonTasos 2 years ago
"Resurrection" - John Debney - The Passi