Ares V model launch ends in destruction.

[soverato3]

HAHA just like the real one!!!

[Mikeatk]

Usually adding some weight to the nose will stabilize it. That what I used to do as a kid flying rockets in the 60's.

Good luck, it's a nice looking rocket. Well look great flying straight up.

Mike

[24kGoldenRocket]

I use a trick, other than fins, to move the center of gravity one caliber ahead of the center of pressure...I add weight to the nosecone. Do the "swing test". Determine the rocket's center of gravity by finding the balance when hanging from a three foot cord of string. Swing the rocket in a circle. If the rocket tends to want to lead with the tail then add more weight inside of the nosecone. Keep adding weight until the rocket leads with the nosecone first. Is that Ton Noteboom's design?

[MichaelCox]

Hard to really judge. Although a good mock-up, the real thing is much larger, has very VERY sophisticated and expensive composites and computer-controlled gimbling nozzles and is designed to carry payloads to orbit, so it's hard to make a comparrison here. This rocket looks like it should hit maybe high supersonic, but the physics is tricky up through that point.

[Landotter1]

I know that optics will fool the eye but the nose cone looked way off center and un balanced in the video. CG must be off and to one side. I'm not sure about rockets but the RC airplane folks hang their plane by a single wire to find CG and imbalance on the roll plane. I would think big rockets would be the same. Find CG than hang it from a string to see if there is any weight trying to force it to lean in any direction so you can balance it. Just my thoughts. You know more than me. :-D

[myxboxforlife]

So lats a lot of destuction!

[myxboxforlife]

so lats a lot of destuction

[PaisGreenapple3]

Don't ya just Love explosions...

[11AMERICANO11]

ummmmmmm 20mph wind? wtf..

[Zoomer30]

I had one of those Estes Space SHuttle rockets, with the SRBs and the orbiter, never got one good flight with it, flew like a spooked goose.

Well you save NASA a lot of money, now they dont have to try to make the big one :)

[24kGoldenRocket]

@Zoomer30 Check out my video. Search Estes 1284 24kgoldenrocket to see a good flight of the Space Shuttle. The trick I used was to modify the kit to accept a 'D' Engine. (24mm instead of 18mm mount) Estes' Space Shuttle with Stack was notoriously underpowered. It requires 'D' Impulse. There are more than enough free card models online to modify and fabricate the discontinued kit.

[Scorpiuszeroone]

Wow. When I was a kid my dad reluctantly bought me the Estes Pershing-D rocket because it was expensive. I spent all summer building that sucker to perfection. It looked great. Flying it was another matter. IIRC it took 3 D engines...? We "flew" it twice. Lawn dart both times.  What an ego crusher...

[arnold02000]

Center of gravity problems, maybe?

[r0ck3tsm0k3]

Winds too high, launch rod too short and too thin, fins too small and too high, CG probably not forward enough, thrust too low, and you did not use electronic ignition. Don't you want to keep your rockets safe and keep flying in this place without the police showing up? :) You will improve the design and launch system and will get this to work. Keep at it and keep safe! Don't ask for advice on Youtube people are too rude, check a rocketry forum.

[tombonavita]

Yeap, as noted before fins need to go to the aft of the rocket and more fin "real estate" will certainly help.

What I didn't see mentioned in any of the comments is the rocking motion at launch. Look at 2:01 and the rocket is rocking forward, already getting it out of sorts.

[aa5821]

Don't see any info regarding the second flight... And yes, this is a year late... But most of this has been covered. I didn't see what engine configuration you used, though.

1. Winds were too high.

2. Launch rod too short.

3. Fins appear too small and too far forward.

But it's a nice-looking rocket. Hope you got it figured out! Please keep sharing your work. I'm just getting back into the hobby and enjoy watching the videos.

[GenoKatz4]

1. Why would you launch with winds that strong in the first place? Especially a small rocket like that on it's maiden flight?

2. You need fins on it. The real one is designed not to have fins because the actual engines move on the bottom of the rocket to keep it stabilized. The real ones also have gyros in them to keep them on the right path.

3. For any future models, you may want a longer launch rod. The longer the rod, the straighter the flight... Generally.

[senoritafish]

Its okay this stuff happens to every one all the time ( but it happends to me ALL the time to me)

[aalexxanderr]

Maybe The reason of why launch was failed is that SRBs of ARES V were NOT ignited :P

[areafortyone]

oh well, shit happens...He needed some clear plastic fins on that rocket, something that couldn't,t be seen but that would stabilize it during flight.

[McdonaldSpecial]

Dude is like 40 years old and hes talking about sound suppression and flight recorders for a model rocket made out of cardboard and balsa wood. LOL.

[24kGoldenRocket]

@McdonaldSpecial I belong to a Rocketry Club in Southern Cal. The average age is about 45. You can LOL all that you want but the hobby has become much more demanding. We use the same propellants as the Space Shuttle SRB's. The ATF does not like us too well. We have to get FAA clearance in order to fly. Yeah...Cardboard and Balsa. Right!!! When was the last time that you flew?

[krashdown102]

I know nothing about this kind of thing... but it looks too top heavy and too tall, perhaps it was a little unbalanced aswell.

but i guess you cannot do too much about that if your trying to be accurate to the real version. it also it looked quite windy.

[Nidhogg13]

Setting the fins farther back as laboo69 will work, or you can add weight to the nose to shift the CG forward, such as by sticking heavy clay in the tip of a hollow nose, or for larger rockets, a mixture of epoxy and lead shot.

[laboo69]

MusicalFan1701;s comment is the closest of all of them. However, you need not rule out the use of clear fins right away. The issue that's visibly obvious is that the fins are mounted too far forward. Move them aft as far as you can. It looks as if the center of pressure is forward of the CG, thus when the motor fires, the air pushing against the fins causes it to loop. If the fins are close to the nozzles, it'll probably be stable enough. Will be happy to answer questions, good luck!!

[jxvwp]

Can only come up with one solution but thats waay too complicated. Making the SRB's the engines and give them steerable nozzles so they will try and correct the tumbling. Or give it a form of RCS place near the nose that also will correct the rocket if it begins to tumble.

By the way looks great and hope you can get it right. and if you do, post it on youtube and please send me a link

[MusicalFan1701]

Clearly you are an expert model rocket builder, and the 3-D surface detail is impressive on the boosters and center section. These features will cause stability issues at high speed. Even at low speed, the line of thrust from the motors does not line up with the CG of the structure, which is very difficult to achieve with a 3-cylinder model rocket. Clear fins are insufficient. I'd suggest adding a torus-shaped mass around the base of the central motor casing to lower and center the CG.

[Zoomer30]

Abs forget about the high power engines, you need a fereking permit to even BUY them, and FAA clearence to fly them, and with this rocket all you would get back is confetti

[Zoomer30]

Model rockets need fins to go stright (and yes they need to be balenced well)

I had a kit of the space shuttle and ET/SRB and to fly that you had to stick fin units in the SRB nozzles

[skyprop]

Great Videography!!!! But First off I have to say is Who lights their rockets off with a wick anymore??? First thing get a decent electronic launch controller. Second item is the launch rod for this rocket is too short. Double the length of the rod next time. Third, This rocket was underpowered. for a rocket like this, forget Estes Engines and go for an Areotech reloadable. For something that size I would at least start with a High "E" or low "F" class. As u said watch ur ctr. of G. u should be

[DarkAngelSeries]

A note to everyone in regards to the missing fins on this rocket. The fact is..there are fins placed on the main body and boosters. They are of clear plexiglass to give the rocket a more real look without "fins" per say, to see. Thanks everyone for the feedback.

[99fixit]

@DarkAngelSeries Did you do any tests for aerodynamic stability befor flight? If you suspend the rocket at its center of gravity and place it in a wind stream, it must 'fly' straight if you have any chance of making a powered flight that is stable. Stability can be improved by adding more fin area that is aft of the cg. See Estes Technical Report #1 (available on the web in many places) for more details. You seem to be rather advanced and probably already know this, but it just might help.

[indiasucksalways]

Yes, and you will need fins. Real rockets have gyros to keep them stable.

[indiasucksalways]

Use The string test. The center of balance must be in the middle 3rd of the rocket. Add weights to balance it. Also use an F engine.

[UndergroundChemist91]

Adding small motors to the boosters (just size A or size B) might help stabilize it. Without boost coming from the boosters, they create a lot of drag on the rocket that the main motor(s) cannot overcome. Also, model rockets without fins have never been able to perform stable flight. Real rockets have gimbaled nozzles meaning they can move to redirect the thrust in order to keep the rocket on a programmed flight path. You might want to add fins made from a transparent material to your rocket. :)

[NewFrontierRocketry]

That was a totally impressive effort, DarkAngel. We are also pursuing our own Project Constellation here in East Tennessee. Good luck with your future flights, and keep those videos comin' in!

[dragonkingofthestars]

news flash thouse kind of guys got us to the moon you know the silver white thing in the sky. and gave us Hubble,Voygers 1 and 2 not to mention galloe MORE POWER THE THE ROCKET GUYS!

[dragonkingofthestars]

so are you a modle rocketry

[wimicon]

nice launch

[travsrms]

brilliant design, too bad about the flight, good luck on ur next flight

[toddi1971]

center of gravity must be in front of center of aerodynamic pressure

[DarkAngelSeries]

Going for launch #2 on Friday morning. I'll keep you posted with the results!

[ewtng]

2:20 Thats exactly what mine did. You're launch failure was virtually identical to my launch failure. It cleard the ambilical tower & performed two full loops and fell to the ground. Thats very intresting. If not funny, in a weird way.

Well... It seem you & i have the same problem.

Lets troubleshoot this one together.

What do you say?

[DarkAngelSeries]

Sounds good. Here are a few changes thats I'm gonna work on. First, reduce the length of the upper stage (my rocket) by 4-5 inches. Second, I'm gonna reinforce the engine mount, it looks as though it moved a bit, and thirdly, gonna set the fins to form a v shape off the boosters. Anything else, you can add?

[DarkAngelSeries]

The Ares after review of the rocket, is fully intact after impact, so I'm gonna try again with the new design and minus the engine cover for the second try. See ya soon.

[tube087]

That's true! Rocksim is a must! If he'd had that program, he wouldn't have had the "CG" problem.

[simav8r]

Great looking rocket. What a shame it was unstable. It might not be perfect for what you're doing (since you seem to use mostly home-made components), but you might be interested in a computer program called Rocksim. If you Google it, you should end up on the website of a company called Apogee Components. From there you can download a 30-day free trial of the software. It lets you test fly the rocket virtually and check it's stability before you even build it.

[DarkAngelSeries]

Thank you for the needed information. I will check into this software. Might be of great value!