The Future of Astrology

[KellyLeePhipps]

The people that practice astorlogy professionally or as a hobby for self-understanding and cycle-navigation have no problem with consciousness being a force in the universe. If you are here to understand the archetypes we welcome you and would love to share our findings and experience, because we are loving this inner view of how life is created and flows. But if you are here to cram your indoctrinated western, mechanical universe science down our throats...please...don't bother posting

[KellyLeePhipps]

@SatyajeetGaur Ah, interstellar astrology is a fascinating subject. I would love to meet some alines born in a solar system with say 4 or 5 planets to see how the universal archetypal spectrum shows up in their being, or imagine a planet with three moon signs and you had three different dimensions of emotion within you. That would be way cool. As for being born on a space ship, you cast the chart from where you are in the solar system...so you would even have an earth in your chart..way cool

[SovereignBeing]

i dare anyone who is skeptical to let me do a report for them and they will see how in depth and how accurate astrology is on a daily basis.... or do your own at astro.com..

of course a few generic lines in a paper is nothing to go on, and most people seem to base their awareness of this science on that, absurd really...

[VenusAsABoyFilms]

In Age of Aquarius, I think there will be much interest in Astrology in the future.

[uranusisnotfunny]

Isn't it interesting that people who've never taken the time to study astrology are are so sure that it's complete nonsense. Maybe if a competent person read their chart they would be shocked by the things revealed.

[SatyajeetGaur]

@uranusisnotfunny Very interesting. It is mainly because of the assumptions it is based on have no scientific basis and it almost always makes no verifiable predictions. If any of these two arguments were false we would have had physicists studying astrology.

[uranusisnotfunny]

@SatyajeetGaur i have no desire to convert people. i have found after more than 20 years of studying this beautiful art/science, that it is not only valid, but extremely useful! i could spend the rest of my life pointing out examples of "experts" fallibility, but it serves no purpose. better to spend time and energy embracing what is magical, and allowing others to create their own destinies. the scientific community refuses to acknowledge studies that have been done, so i can't respect them!

[KellyLeePhipps]

@SatyajeetGaur I was a physics major, and I became an astrologer, so we have had physicists studying astrology, including Ph D ones like Will Keepin.

[SatyajeetGaur]

@KellyLeePhipps Ok, maybe some do. But what I meant to say that it would become an area of research in the mainstream science otherwise.

There is really nothing preventing it from becoming one, other than the shotcomings of the subject itself.

[SatyajeetGaur]

@SatyajeetGaur *shortcomings

[KellyLeePhipps]

@SatyajeetGaur Astrology has had 2000 years of religious oppression, combined with 300 years of Scientific oppression combined with 100 years of stumbling through its own mediocrity expressed as Sun Sign Columns that make ordinary people think that's the crux of astrology. With religious people thinking it demonic and scientific people thinking its superstition, it's no wonder the only research applied to it, is to discredit it, and even then they don't learn authentic astrology to do so.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@OneApostate You should be posting this drivel on religious websites, at least astrologers honor and utilize science... I think you just have it out for astrology.

[kuwaimaha]

@KellyLeePhipps no ASTRONOMERS honour and utilize science. Astrology is psuedoscience

[KellyLeePhipps]

@kuwaimaha AH but before there was astronomy (ala the invention of the telescope) there was only astrology...the science or field of knowledge that included the Body-Mind-heart-Soul connection. Unlike modern science, with its linear rational focus on the material world, astrology is a science that sees and works with the holistic human being as a living organism, not some random machine...

[KellyLeePhipps]

@kuwaimaha Oh you mean KEPLER who was a mystical mathematician and astrologer and did charts for royalty and discovered the three laws of planetary motion working with his mentor Tycho Brahe's work. You mean GALILEO, a master astrologer who did charts for a living, and who invented a telescope and discovered moons around Jupiter (the true beginning of so called ASTRONOMY). Oh you mean Newton, an alchemist and astrologer inspired by the idea that planets can have an influence at a distance...

[KellyLeePhipps]

@KellyLeePhipps the list goes on and on back to Plato, Aristotle, Jesus, Ptolomy, etc...all ancient world thinkers who had to learn astrology in their time. It was common for a sage to study the science of the movements of the heavens and their interpretation. What scares modern science about such a spiritual view of the cosmos is that its core Cartesian mechanical universe paradigm would have to be left behind.

[SatyajeetGaur]

@KellyLeePhipps I think you mean to say pseudoscience.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@SatyajeetGaur No I mean to say SCIENCE...which implies a field of knowing....astrology is a field of knowing too...just because the modern world seeks to discredit spiritual sciences like alchemy and astrology, does not mean we practitioners have to stop using the terms in their ancient sense. We give little credence to the limited scientific world view that sees man and the universe as some kind of classical Newtonian physics machine.

[SatyajeetGaur]

@KellyLeePhipps True science has an additional characterstic that it gives falsifiable predictions about the universe. Science is not only about knowing but also about knowing when you should correct yourself. It has inbuilt mechanisms such as preer review, double blind trials, repeating experiments etc., to facilitate that.Astrology fails all these tests.That is why it is not a science.

I have no problem if you practice this as art, but I will keep contradicting you if you say it is a science.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@OneApostate The proof lies in the inspiration and contact with the numinous that one derives from the art, and astrology has inspired me and millions of others in a major way.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@KellyLeePhipps We are living beings with hearts and minds and souls...if you want to be a machine, go ahead, but don't come here and try to force your beliefs onto others...

[KellyLeePhipps]

@OneApostate Also, astrology is part science (orbits, cycles, etc) and part mythic art (mythology, archetypes, character expressions, etc) so it's really a hybrid field of knowledge that stretches back to the first stargazers, and as an art it is rather unintelligent to say that an art form cannot be "proved" Who asks if you can prove painting or music?

[KellyLeePhipps]

@OneApostate Astrology has not been dubunked, otherwise why would millions of souls find inspiration and meaning through using it. Those soldiers who died were serving as part of a nation, and that nation had a birth chart, and astrology has a field of knowledge now to deal with the charts and destinies of nations called Mundane Astrology.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@OneApostate Gravitation is a mere servant of the Consciousness that pervades the universe. COnsciousness is the FORCE, the Unified Force, that allowed you to make that post and think those thoughts, even if full of error. Obviously you have not experienced the magic of a professional astrological consultation. If you did, your close-mindedness masquerading as culturally-indoctrinated skepticism would rethink it's position...

[Stepper11]

@hmann09 Again,this opinion is based on poor info. This is not about us being so important that the stars decalare our stories,past and future, to the breathless cosmos.We are part of the cosmos, which operates according to set laws, principles, and cycles. We like to pretend we are so important that we live above these limits. We don't, but we can respond to them w/ will, creativity, & intelligence, in a sense allowing us to rise past or at least apply them.

[Stepper11]

@Stepper11 I have come to think of it like a clock. The hands do not pretend to shape the time of the rising or setting of the sun, but if operating properly, it serves as a gauge to help us order our days. It tells us when it's time for our fave TV show, but it can't make us watch. Its face is purely a reflection of time, even though it does not control time. The Cosmos can be likened to a great clock. Whether we wake or sleep is our choice.

[hmann09]

Astrology relies on a geocentric view of the solar system and cosmos. So if you don't believe the sun orbits the Earth surely you have to call shenanigans on this fraudulent bunkum.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@hmann09 Actually astrology relies on a perspective centered in the consciousness of the individual whose birth chart is being interpreted, a relativistic view of the solar system based on the sensitive dependence of initial conditions defining the first moment of life. Relativity trumps mechanistic thinking again...

[SatyajeetGaur]

@KellyLeePhipps I think you mean to say, "sensitive dependence on initial conditions" in chaos theory. Ironically, the chaos theory states that even a slight perturbation in the initial conditions of a non-linear system would lead to a large difference in the later state of the system i.e.the butterfly effect.That is why the weather forecast is often so unreliable.And that is when they are trying to predict something based on mathematical models.I don't even have to say anything about astrology.

[summerofplums]

I doubt whether many astrologers could attract the same type of client, or achieve the same level of income as Steven Forrest does. He has written several popular books which formed his reputation. Trying to persuade other astrologers to raise their self-esteem and charge what he does will not work unless they also have a similar reputation. This is what his clients are really paying for.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@summerofplums Actually there are plenty of professional astrologers earning good to great livings all over the world. I've been doing this professionally for 17 years, and studying/researching for 27 years...and I haven't missed a meal yet...LOL

[nikkinubs]

Very intelligent guy

[lightcatcher3]

People who discredit astrology have never really studied it. Just because you don't know how something works doesn't mean it's false. There IS a lot of crap associated with some astrology and with the watered down junk you see in popular books. But, there are many good reasons why people all over the world watched the stars and planets for many thousands of years. There are cosmic energies we cannot see, but they are powerful and reach across space Our atoms came from space.

[katarche]

Steven Forrest's assertion that theory is easy is clearly wrong imho. If we need to be better counsellors and communicators then we need to study these subjects in and of themselves. After 25 years of offering readings to my clients, the easy part is presentation, the hardest part is in doing GOOD astrology. The premise here is both flawed and ill-conceived, and my reading of Forrest's books is that his grasp of astrological technique is distinctly 20th century and psychological. Enough said!

[garciaalvin3]

you know who i want to see fight,that dude and randi ,its an AMAZING sorcerer tussle!

[twinkiefly]

great editing style :) love your videos!

[pyromodder]

Was refuted, or was simply not found?

[camij79]

Please explain more of the Peter Hartmann astrology results. That would be good. The Great Britain Astological Society would differ from the emails that David Hartmann sent them re birth times and even birth dates published on their website. The birth times were not given and some birth dates were not given if they fell on cusps of signs.

[camij79]

Have tried to post a comment 6 times - what is going on??!!

[alchemistra]

Read his books...probably one of the world's best astrologers next to Dane Rudhyar.

[NoMoreLTTE]

Human emotions control the whole world!

[Stepper11]

Most critics of Astrology don't get it. They form an opinion based on hearsay and the morning tv shows' pink-sequined, bleached blonde goofs talking about Julia Roberts and BrAngelina. Study the real art for a while and you get a very different picture. Even if you don't come away as a believer, at least you learn to respect its pedigree and coherence. Cosmos and Psyche by Richard Tarnas is a great starting point for a skeptic who cares to approach the subject w/ intellectual honesty.

[Dorfkanal]

The latest scientific large-scale study on Astrology might be a good starting point for gullible idiots. In 2006, Peter Hartmann (University of Aarhus/Denmark) published their results from 15.000 probands: 'The relationship between date of birth and individual differences in personality and general intelligence: A large-scale study' and found no evidence or whatsoever for the claims of astrology.

[camij79]

Date of birth given but no time? Very important you know to an astrologer . Makes a whole lot of difference to the horoscope ie Ascendant, planetary houses, rulers of houses ,moon sign and aspects therein? Guess it is very difficult to find 15,000 people of which most know their time of birth. Not a very good scientific experiment from an astrologers perspective.

[Dorfkanal]

Read the study before you talk bullshit. The time of birth was included as well.

[Zeno1999]

Michel/Francois Gauqulin ( French ) did study to debunk astrology but ended up proving it to be a powerful science.

It was a ingenious and tedious data processing. Astro-physicist has a strong and compeling evidence as to how astro works. Its all abt how u approach the subj; many scientists r closed minded skeptics.

[GodCarnage]

THANK YOU, how can you accurately test something you your self know nothing about. most skeptics i have seen test the validity with something irreverent or even if releveant cannot properly desipher the cause of there result and because they want it to be wrong they deem it so.

simply put, there limited perspective gives them the limited results the were out to prove, why don't they get a good reading.

[Zeno1999]

*Astro-physicist Percy Seymour's book on theory to explain workings of astrology...

Yes, poor public can't benefit from this science as they would from "star B4ck coffee" .. thanks to "windbag critics" and "paid pimps of ivory towers" who r not letting it to be a mainstream helping profession.

[AstroMen2911]

A true scientist observes and concider other points of views. A skeptic is a pseudo intellectual who enjoys proving people-of-experience wrong.

[hmann09]

@AstroMen2911 All scientists are sceptics it is in the nature of rational thought to begin from a point of disbelief. Pseudo-intellectualism is a more apt description of this nonsense.

[hmann09]

@Zeno1999 No scientist can be closed minded, the default position of any scientist is "I don't know". What is close minded is ignoring glaring errors and parlour tricks in order to vindicate your belief in an iron age superstition. The universe is more wonderful and complex than any of us can possibly imagine we don't need to make shit up to make it more interesting.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@Dorfkanal You have to be retarded to use statistics to research astrology. If you try to take 15000 Leos and see if they are all creative, you will fail miserably because you do not understand how to interpret charts like authentic astrologers...there are too many variables for statistical analysis

[SatyajeetGaur]

@KellyLeePhipps If you don't want to use statistical analysis to research astrology, what do you want to use? .....Astrology!? Too many variables? Statistics was developed in order to take in account all these variables.There is no other way to account for experimental biases otherwise.Do you have any alternative suggestions?

[KellyLeePhipps]

@SatyajeetGaur Yes each chart is unique, but the techniques are easy to apply to one person at a time. The basic interpretation of an individual planet is that there is a planet symbolizing a psychological faculty expressing itself in on of the 12 signs of the zodiac along the archetypal spectrum, which is then expressed in one of the 12 Houses or zones of the sky, which symbolize a field of life experience (1st House is the body, outward behavior etc).

[KellyLeePhipps]

@KellyLeePhipps Then planets can have aspects like conjunctions, squares and oppositions to (geometrical angular relationships to the other planets in a chart) which serves to modify, change, add influence to the essential meaning of the interaction. For instance if Mars is conjunct any other planet, it adds heat, aggression, motivation, willpower, desire, forcefulness...etc.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@KellyLeePhipps The goal in astrology is not to isolate the parts and call them the person's parts..You can see how that approach would be very Western materialistic...our aim is to synthesize all these parts into a dynamic cohesive whole, where the Emergent properties that rise out of the communion of the parts, reveals the actual unique being. If you can design a statistical analysis involving 12 planets, in up to 12 signs, in up to 12 houses, including the relations between Signs and Houses

[KellyLeePhipps]

@KellyLeePhipps ...and then include the aspects as modifiers to the basic interpretation equation of PLANET-SIGN-HOUSE, I'd be fascinated to check it out. ANd that's just character analysis...when we get to forecasting, then you have to apply moving versions of all the same stuff mentioned above for the current time compared to the natal chart on at least the two primary different levels:

[KellyLeePhipps]

@KellyLeePhipps Transits (actual moving planets in the sky) and Progressions (the symbolic movements devised by the Babylonians that set each day of life equal to a year). Then realize that each unique person has all that going on inside plus the free will how to express it all including harmonious behavioral traits vs. shadow traits, like your basic Aries deciding each moment to be heroic and courageous and leadership oriented or impulsive, angry, and destructive.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@KellyLeePhipps The only way you can verify astrology is to learn it's techniques and apply them to one person at a time and see if it "works" As a former astrophysicist major turned astrologer, if it didn't "work" I would not be involved in this field for very long. Add to the fact that astrology is lumped in with Tarot, crystal balls, etc, then you can see why we are fighting an uphill battle. But it's okay, because we've seen real results and trust in them over societal pressures.

[SatyajeetGaur]

@KellyLeePhipps Maybe you would like to lump astrology with the string theory. As both of them have no falsifiable predictions as of now, are based on phenomenon that have no proof of existance (super-strings,planets' orbits affecting humans), but are mathematically consistent. But the only problem is, then you would have to rename it as "astrological theory", and stop treating it as an established framework to make predictions, and wait until and if it is proven to be correct based on evidence.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@SatyajeetGaur If someone with a Gemini Moon is not a great communicator, comedic, and versatile, then that is falsifiable...If that same Moon is in the 8th House of death and rebirth and they are not emotionally intense as well as being light hearted Peter Pan, and do not struggle with those extremes of emotion, then that is falsifiable...you have to talk with the person and compare what astrolgoy says to their experience, if it matches it "works".

[KellyLeePhipps]

@KellyLeePhipps Why would thousands of clients over the years keep coming back year after year, from business executives to professional creative performers, if they thought astrology gave them nothing of value in terms of self-understanding or conscious alignment? Astrology is not falsifiable in the way you want it to be...because you think it's about exact prediction of event x at time t, and it is not.

[KellyLeePhipps]

@KellyLeePhipps Astrology is about understanding the archetypal qualities of time that show up in character and events. I don't tell clients such and such is going to happen at time t, I simply describe the archetypal qualities of certain phases whether we're talking a month, a season a year or a day, and challenge them to take the ball and run with it and create their future with deep wisdom about the energetic patterns that govern life..

[KellyLeePhipps]

@KellyLeePhipps There's a fifth force in the universe that allowed us to even imagine and conceive the four forces of gravitation, electromagnetism and the weak and strong nuclear forces...and it's called CONSCIOUSNESS. Cultures are good examples of Consciousness fields in action...how does some baby just acquire a British accent by hanging out with parents..you should try including the force of consciousness in your equations, you might understand how Tebow can lead the Broncos in a come-back.

[KellyLeePhipps]

It's obvious they made up there minds about what they wanted to "discover" before they began. LOL You call this science. They didn't even do a comprehensive analysis of the seven traditional planets and their aspects. They looked at Sun moon by Element and when they found extraversion in fire and air signs and introversion in water and earth signs they dismissed it...I would be embarrassed to claim this paper as research!

[danielchakraborty]

the way that randi moron treated johnathan cainer on some dumb talk show was appalling... obviously these people choose to believe that it's purely superstition... there's a distinct pattern to astrology...

[thinkalittlemore]

yes, i have found astrology so accurate and complex that for people to attack its legitimacy is simply because they have not taken the energy to investigate it on an even rudimentary level.

astrology is fascinating.

[hmann09]

@thinkalittlemore I've investigated it, it's geocentric, egocentric, nonsense.

[Aquagoat]

This was a very helpful video for anyone who is interested in pursuing astrology as a career. Thank you for posting it. I've read some of Steven Forrest's books, but have never heard or seen him speak in public. So this was a good opportunity. Thanks.

[fomalhauto]

I appreciate you putting up this video,and I recommended it to people. I like that Steven Forrest talks about the need to tolerate diversity in Astrology.

[astrologer8]

wonderful! Thanks! Forrest is awesome.