The Magic Show #121 - Elves & The 2008 States Metagame

[bobudess]

argh, thorn of amethyst DOESN'T WORK,

FAE laughs in the face of thorn of amethyst,

like this,

non fae player:"i play thorn of amethyst"

faerie player:"muahahahaha, i can function with non creature spells a turn slow, can you?"

[blithium]

Non fae player: I play four Thorn of Amethyst.

Faerie player: o.o

[carthwolf]

sure

[DirectorBirraj]

ouijiomhiumhiuhiyguyguyggiyg i%^%R&$Hgjihgbijgfibhih*^%&64

[markgdl]

another great show ... thanks

[vmknut4]

if i chose to evoke it

(look at the bottom to see why i'm saying it)

(at the bottom of comment)

[vmknut4]

it runs like a revilark deck,

but i added a few cards (like nettle seintenel to make it faster) and took out cards like revilark, which i felt were too slow with all of the pancake flippers, Qasali Ambushers, and sigied palidin.

(plus with thorn of amytheist that might break play, i thought it would be too late once i put of revilark)

[idunnocuzimawesome]

don't know why nobody counts wheel of sun and moon for rev hate, we're kinda past relevance after states, but that was my sideboard tech

[vmknut4]

isn't louis scott vargas on partick chapin's team?

[kpmuad]

I only played reveillark once...the 8th round. Both were 6-1 and couldn't draw into top 8. I got HOUSED.

[vmknut4]

i don't like a revilark

so i'm coming up with a "white weenie on steroids" deck. it focuses on bant. but i use some elves, and cats.

[SaitiOfTheSouth]

Thanks so much for doing these shows. Im a long time kitchen-table player and I'm trying to break into the competitive field. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated :)

[identikit]

explosions in the sky. siick

[IlGreven]

Mono-G OverCrux FTW!

[Caladors]

Thats the best show i have seen from you in quite a few weeks.

Not trying to insult for sure.

Just saying that I really enjoyed that show and it what I have always loved from your show the breakdowns all the random crud thats out there as well for JustInCase

[HobbyGameSupport]

This show has become quite addictive :)

[yourmadbunz138]

Graymatter conventions, NY NJ TO, says the free entry is only for constructed events and not limited ones for the State Champs. Is this true for all other TOs?

[doomtomb3]

Lol, why are you guys arguing over the Ultimatums? I use 2 Cruel Ultimatum in my Grixis control deck and they rock. Chapin obviously changed his mind about Cruel Ultimatum in his latest StarCity article. He now runs 3 and talks about how he uses cards just to dig closer to Cruel Ultimatum.

[theRAGNAR321]

Fuck you, cruel ultimatum is shit and you know it, chapin said it aswell

[HarryPitfall]

As soon you use these dirty words, you lose the argument... the ultimatuns aren't 'godly' cards, they are regular-to-crap ones, the overall effect is nice, the cost makes then too hard to cast...

[QuadmanSwe]

thank god for the magic show so I can keep track of what day it is, FNM day :D

[bobudess]

Thanks soo much for the anti control tech,

mr orange i will always love you,

if it works... if not...

[rogerbanango]

Explosions in the Sky! Woo!

[abaddon1919]

I think he's right in banning 'something' from the elves deck, turn 2 wins are abit dull...Then again Tezzerator handled elves very nicely...so maybe if they don't ban anything, everyone will side in extreme anti-elves-tech and round out that odd odd thing you guys keep calling 'a metagame' :P

[tinfold]

eileen. a k a, fireball ninja lava sword.

[Darklordbrink]

i agree, the elves deck is no faster than the old dredge deck. both of the decks have a bunch of hate and elves is less consistent. there is no way they will ban anything

[onlainari]

I love the magic show but please try to avoid making noob errors such as getting the wrong card to ban.

If you ban glimpse, the deck dies. Sure if you ban nettle sentinel the deck dies, but banning glimpse doesn't hurt any other deck.

[walkertrull]

Siding out your Spectral Processions? Please.

[PetrichorAllegory]

Once again, godly episdoe.

[mtgfeftw]

why ban? People realize that the elf deck has its weaknesses, now that it's been played and been exposed, they can be exploited, I dont see a ban coming, but thats up to WOTC.

[cxeazn]

Evan, have you actually played against the Quillspike deck? As a Quillspike player, I know its weakness and it's not Devoted Druid... it's Quillspike. Without the Druid, Quillspike still feeds off Kitchen Finks, Murderous Redcap and Puppeteer Clique from the board. It can't combo, but it still has lots of tricks. Without Quillspike, the Druid is just a mana elf, and the deck turns into a bad Rock deck. You should only kill the Druid if a Quillspike is on the stack and it resolving means you die.

[BurningLotuz]

No creature has ever or will ever be banned in a real format. If anything was to be banned it would be Glimpse, but the deck is fine and not hard to beat and I forsee no changes comming.

[ViolentJesus]

Hermit Druid, Arcbound Ravager, Disciple of the Vault, Goblin Recruiter, Metalworker, etc. All banned in real formats.

[jairomy]

Rofl ever heard of Disciple of the Vault and Lin Sivvi?

[GenericKen000]

Why ban Sentinel when Heritage Druid is the engine core?

Sia in the bumper is great music. Good taste.

[kylepwndyou]

that entry fee prize is amazing. thank you wizards

[Phil2171]

continued from below...

They should reprint Engineered Plaque in Conflux or some instant along the lines of

1B

Instant

All creatures of your chosen type get -2 -2

And that should deal with it and make it so 6 of the top 8 and 4 of the top 4 arent ELVES.

Generally combo doesnt get banned. It get "hosed" by cards. Aether vial was banned and skullclamp was banned because well... you know. Minds desire wasnt banned, Nor was any other combo in Extended.

Hope you see this Evan.

[mercenarybdu]

Will it be like 1998 again where the USA swept all the PT and World Titles? I wonder?

[Phil2171]

Honestly i dont think elves should be banned, its a combo deck. Combo is easy to beat when people figure it out. People at PTQ Berlin knew about it, they just werent ready. Its not some boring control combo like countertop is, or was, and even though the mirrors with wirewood hivemaster and essence warden made matches in the top 8 go to around 300 life, the deck is still beatable. The length of mirror matches is the major concern for me. I personally think if worse comes to worst,

[doomtomb3]

This combo is especially resilient to hate. Since the banning of top, this deck just went crazy. The only cards that beat this is Chalice of the Void and a couple others.

[agdstardust]

trinishpere, engineered plague, a red(ish) deck ...

[kgesme21]

does anyone have a deck list for "Planeswalkers"? WOuld love to just putts around with that.

[TDAWizard]

U S A

[Amanisawesome]

the elves defck is so sweet

but gift should get banned

[FreshmanThesis]

Glimpse of Nature deserves the banhammer so hardcore.

[sixcopies]

i'd give it the banhammer so hard, if you know what i mean.

[DaiJekLow]

great show, can't wait to see those rogue decks go.

[virble]

I disagree with your claim on Nettle Sentinel. I've seen the deck in action and think that even with his inclusion in a broken deck, Conflux will probably bring us some goods to beat it. Either that, or another cryptic combo will arise and kick it's ass.

[animekevin]

Holy crap, Evan Erwin likes explosions in the sky! That band is amazing!

[xanthophobia22]

Elves is totally broken. I have been testing against it and even when you basically make a deck just to beat it it still wins 40 percent of the time. Havent seem numbers like that since affinity. However I disagree with you on the ban. Dont you think glimpse of nature does more to kill the deck? I like leaving the 2/2 legal for aggro decks. I think when banning a combo piece you should always ban the spells, not creatures.

[manudosde]

Extended is a degenerate format, we all know that, but the banhammer can't be the permanent solution wizards. You have a future future league for a reason.

[jvdthwip]

You can't catch everything. Elves takes a decent amount of practice to get down right. It's not obvious like mindless aggro decks. Also, if the loss of Top really did contribute to Elves' power, then maybe they *did* test Nettle Sentinel, etc., in Extended in FFL... with Top unbanned. Then they print Shadowmoor, then they ban Top, then hell breaks loose.

[anday3456]

manudosde: Aaron Forsythe has said in several different places that the future future league does not test extended or eternal; only standard, sealed deck, and booster draft. This is the reason that things get banned in extended and eternal so often.

[manudosde]

I wasn't aware of that, and I find it quite shocking tbh: if wizards wants extended to be a pro tour format they should try to avoid these situations. The constant banning is deeply disruptive for the game, it creates uncertainty and has an economic impact on players too.

[anday3456]

the problem though is that there are just too many archetypal permutations in extended and the format is just too big to get a feel for. Standard is composed of 6 sets right now, and that's all they have to test, plus one for each additional set. T2 is more played too Extended, on the other hand, has currently 24 sets to work with, including Shards. That is just way too many cards to try and fit testing in for, along with Standard, Draft, and sealed. R&D are masters, but still only mere mortals.

[SasukeJR]

Great show. is it just me or did the video quality seem better? BTW im playing green now lol.

[Jak2574]

Green is soooo broken

[St1llF1y]

Yea!!! First Comment. Oh good show btw.