@MinnesotaDave17 yet you don't mention how Joe Walsh (R-IL) owes over 100,000 in child support payments, after railing about fiscal responsibilities Nice hypocrisy. eh ? :D
Al Franken is a classless bouffon! Regardless of their party affiliation, they are all Americans first and a senator should be above pettinnes like that. Minnesotans, you should be ashamed too...
The most important thing to remember is that Franken didn't block his statements, he just let him know the time he was allowed to talk about them had expired. If you listen Leiberman asks that all his comments be included in the record and Franken agrees, but he stays firm with the time allotment.
Joe Lieberman is one crazy bozo. I mean, he doesn't even know what he is representing when he speaks. He may be a liberal, but he is the most conservative liberal i've seen. He tries to switch sides every other day, and has some real head scratch moments/comments. Just today he said the US should supply the Libyan opposition movement weapons! Now I am all for the opposition to topple that deranged man known as Qaddafi, but Lieb, suggested it so they could kill each other off! Really Joe!?!
I'll bet all of the folks here bashing Franken based on his experience as a comedian fucking worship the conservative poster-boy Ronald Reagan. He was an actor long before his tenure as Governor of California.
Typical conservatives though with their double standards.
@Vaishino Sonny Bono, Ronald Reagan, Fred Thompson, Arnold Schwarzenegger, all actors, all Republican politicians!! Other than Al Franken, how many liberal actors turned politicians??
@woofielove1970 Good one! HA! Actually, Franken DID do a good thing. He stated he wanted the troops pulled out of Afghan rughaus faster! So he ain't all bad!
I am not a fan of Al Franken, but I agree with him here. We demand our Foreign Service officers to go through rigorous testing which includes seeing if they can handle time limits for presentations. I imagine DoS employees have similar testing. Why should we put up with rambling politicians? Aren't they supposed to be smarter than the average Joe?
How many dickheads posting here just hate McCain and are so fucking stupid they make remarks or take sides just from emotion? I would assume most from the intellectually lacking comments.
Congress does alot of dicked up stuff but an extra "moment" to finish a speech is not going to hurt anything.
Maybe America would'nt have the jacked up government we have today if jackasses thought before they spoke/voted.
This is one of the most overrated "controversies" of the last two years. Franken was just enforcing procedural rules and his instructions. It wasn't personal, and Lieberman took no offense. Also, Franken did not get the gavel through privilege or a power move. In fact, it's a job that is regularly handed out to low ranking Senators. The only outrageous event is McCain's illogical overreaction.
If he would have only shortened down his boring ass speech...10 minutes was plenty to prove a point... F-OFF McCain... Franken is there to do a job... NOT blow smoke up peoples asses!!!
The times they are a changin' - and it's about GD time! I kinda' like McCain - Viet vet and all - Liebermann I got no use for - he's just so much a part of the problem - but if McCain has such a significant problem with doing something different after 20-some odd years being in the Senate - well, that's exactly the problem - it's been the same bullshit from the same elected officials that leads to nothing ever changing for the better - their old LOBBIED asses can't make a change!!!
There may a blue law somewhere that states you can't buy butter in Pawtucket, Rhode Island on Thursdays, but if you, your parents, your grandparents, etc. have been doing it for generations, you would be surprised if you are suddenly denied the right in 2010 and told the denial was due to some forgotten law.
At such a point, someone like McCain would question the resurrected ban.
Nobody here has said that the occupant of the chair (whatever his capacity) "can not do" as Franken did.
@blacksamcooke This is just more smoke and mirrors. We're not talking about some ancient and discreet outdated law. We're talking about the same power invoked by McCain when someone wished for THIRTY SECONDS to extend remarks objecting to the war, in 2002.
McCain was the chair at that time, and didn't want to begrudge 30 seconds...get this...to the Senator from Minnesota.
Either way you look at REALITY, McCain is just posturing.
@blacksamcooke To an extent, I see your point, artificially inflated as it is. I'm glad for C-Span, because it saves me the TONS of mail-time and reading I did before it was available, but raising a unanimous consent objection from the chair isn't some ancient resurrected arcane parliamentary procedure, despite McCain's posturing.
"Not done often"? Fair enough. But done over the course of the last ten years, it averages out to about 2 or 3 times a month. McCain, in fact, has done it himself.
McCain only said that the occupant of the chair (whatever his capacity) does not do what Franken did. In McCain's experience, the right to an additional minute from the chair is as certain as the option of buying butter on Thursdays in Pawtucket, Rhode Island.
What laws exist regarding the two aforementioned practices have no relevance in this matter.
@blacksamcooke No, he did not -say- that. You inferred it. McCain himself KNOWS that the chair does it, as he did in in the chair himself in 2002.
Let's face it, this is really a 'sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander' situation.
Or, more directly, "Don't dish it out if you can't take it".
Note that I am not a Franken apologist on all matters, but in this instance, which IS the one in which you chose to make an inflammatory statement, may have been a poor representation of your point.
@terotoIo I may have said 'he', and I admit presumption that she was male.
Quantity versus quality on insults? Are we keeping score? However politely stated, saying that people who don't see Franken's hypocrisy (in the context of this video's responses) are legally incompetent (IQs below 70) was inflammatory.
I reiterate my certainty that facts don't penetrate, because I've stated them, and they didn't.
What inflammatory statement have I made? What have I dished out?
You are the one who has been combative.
And what haven't I been able to take? Nothing has offended me here, and I was correcting terotolo when I specified my gender. I wasn't even making a big deal about that. It was just a correction, which most people appreciate.
@blacksamcooke If I ascribed the IQ remark to you erroneously, I'll apologize. I'm answering in real time here, but I'll look back.
However, you took my quotes out of context, in that the "you" who could not take it remark was not directed at you. It was directed at McCain's remark, not yours.
I'm as chill as a pill, friend. I'm not taking potshots at you.
@blacksamcooke "As anyone with an IQ over 70 knows, Al Franken is a small-minded hypocrite."
I was correct in attributing that statement to you, and I take some exception to it.
Al Franken may be a poster-boy for caustic at times, no doubt.
He is also however, in my opinion, not small-minded, but I'd be happy to qualify SOME of my reasons for thinking so, and didn't appreciate the blanket assertion that I must somehow be mentally inferior for that opinion.
blacksamcooke is correct. While Franken says he is acting as the Senator from MN, he is in fact acting as chair of the committee. Franken is being coy with his word choice. If he were acting as the Senator from MN, then anyone would feel free to shout him down or interrupt him as they would other floor members.
Franken knew that he (Franken) was playing a game.
This is why there was the incredulous response from Liebermann (and reportedly a few others) to Franken's objection.
@MrDenniskucinichoh20 You're simply making that up. The chair is a dual role, and if you don't know that, then you don't understand why not a single senator in the room raised a point-of-order objection.
Why didn't Mccain?? Why didn't Lieberman?? Are you serious?
I'm sorry for the people who really feel the need to distort the truth out of all proportion to make OTHERS look like they're being dishonest.
@OneVoiceMore McCain and Lieberman are both just posing, period. Despite self-proclaim 'C-Span junkies' and their cheerleaders, words mean things. NOT ONE raised the point that THE CHAIR CANNOT DO THAT, they just didn't like not getting more TIME. Period. They're whining because their stalling tactic on this bill isn't working, and they're misrepresenting their own participation is exactly the same behavior.
And then immediately after, McCain asks UC for up to 30 more minutes of rebuttal.
Pre-emptive argument: Senator Lieberman's KEY WORDS...pay attention...were 'unanimous consent', despite any other smoke and mirrors. He did not achieve unanimous consent of all senators present. The fact that Franken was sitting in the chair has nothing to do with the fact that the chairman as Senator is also one of whom 'unanimous consent' is being sought.
Unless we want to rewrite centuries of parliamentary procedure, rules of order and senatorial protocol, nothing improper happened here.
@OneVoiceMore ...cont...and let's keep it real here. MCCAIN KNOWS THESE PROCEDURES, and he KNOWS HE'S JUST POSTURING, feigning some sort of confusion about how the game is played. Odd, since he's also citing his decades of experience in the senate to make some sort of 'Me no likey' argument, instead of raising, for instance, a point-of-order objection.
We hear some blather about the 'comity' of this body (which cracks me up, because I always hear 'comedy'), but have no illusions. It's blather.
McCain's a poser. If there was any meat to his rant, instead of just 'I don't like it', he could have objected. He's TRYING to act as if Franken is playing catcher and umpire, knowing full well that's not the case, as Franken clearly stated 'IN MY CAPACITY AS SENATOR OF MINNESOTA', a status that is not nullified, nor prevented from senatorial voice, by sitting in the chair.
The chair does nothing but preside over the session, but as MEANT TO BE, it is a room of SENATORS with a voice.
I can't stand Al Franken but he was being fair. Remember although Lieberman caucuses with the democrats as does Bernie Sanders (I) Vermont. He objected to additional time earlier to a Repulican from I think Alaska. Reid and his couple of high ranking dems made it clear that all Presidents Pro Temp would object to any additional time regardless the party so they could shove the bill through quickly. Al Franken should have said fuck off and resigned as a presiding officer. Douche.
@blacksamcooke Anyone who can view YouTube can PROVE John McCain is a liar and a hypocrite PARTICULARLY on this point, where he PERSONALLY denied time to the Senator from Minnesota extra time.
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WHOOPS. I guess those of us with an IQ of 69 or less can spot a hypocrite, too.
@blacksamcooke So, now that I've PROVED McCain did -exactly- the same thing, and yet claimed 'I've never seen it before myself', we're left with a few conclusions to draw:
1. He's a pontificating liar.
2. His memory is bad.
3. He's a pontificating liar AND his memory is bad.
4. He does remember, but hopes everyone ELSE forgets he's a lying hypocrite, which ALSO means he's a big fucking crybaby, and America is lucky he's not our president.
Either Chris Matthews understands this distinction, or he is lazy in doing his job.
I neither dispute nor sponsor any of the four conclusions conclusions you have offered here regarding John McCain. I only write that you have proven nothing.
Thanks for the video of John McCain. I'm not sure why you've sent it to me, as it doesn't address anything I've written, but I'm always happy to have information.
McCain's words were as follows:
"I've never seen a member denied an extra minute or so, as the chair just did."
The word "chair" is key here, and that was the context under which McCain was speaking. I'm a CSPAN junkie, and I can say that objections from the floor, like McCain's here, are not unprecedented.
@blacksamcooke Horsecrap. The fact that Franken was occupying the chair, as any junkie of Robert's Rules of Order would know, is irrelevant, as he clearly stated that he was acting in ...catch the REAL key words....his capacity as the Senator of Minnesota, and not the acting chairman. His position as chair does not vacate his capacity as Senator, and he made that clear.
Trivianistas can try revisionist history elsewhere.
@OneVoiceMore The 'he' in my last sentence referring to the >cough< honorable Senator McCain, who also rather was lucky not to witness the ...earlier that day... identical scenario, which I must confess, certainly did allow him to act as though his shock and outrage act wasn't just some semantic bullshit while he tried to score political points.
@terotoIo Technically, it's a berry, and that argument has just as much merit, or lack of it, that Sen. Franken would have no right to raise an objection to a motion on the floor as a senator, simply because he's sitting in the chair.
That's not even the objection McCain is raising. The body of his objection is that a senator is being denied a few extra minutes, period, not that the CHAIR is raising the objection.
Anyway, I'm sure my opponents in this trivial debate won't be swayed by facts.
Oddly, you addressed someone with a topic (McCain) on which blacksamcooke hadn't commented. I'm sure he was taken aback by it. I was satirizing your behavior by doing the same to you.
And McCain specifically states here that he hadn't seen such objections from the chair. Also, given typical interaction of the members of the floor, he couldn't have meant anything else.
@blacksamcooke Perhaps you should not make blanket ad hominem attacks against people who may not be inclined to agree with you, and then play victim if called to town on it.
I apologize for the gender mistake, and make no issue of it. Sam Cooke was male, and I jumped to an irrelevant conclusion.
The argument is trivial, but you should learn what straw man means. You seem to think it's utterly unheard of for the chair to deny time based on ...what, then?
@terotoIo Actually, if you read the comment to which I was responding, you'd see that the samcooke remark was about intelligence, and hypocrites. I responded directly to the hypocrisy of the senator who had a problem with Franken. If that's NOT what sam meant, I'm sure he can speak to that.
And whether McCain had seen objections FROM THE CHAIR is all your take on it, period. McCain is clear in what he meant.
So, he hadn't seen it? It's a lie. If it's not, it's a memory failure.
@terotoIo That's not what McCain SAID, so you may ascribe other meanings to it.
"As the chair just did" were his exact words, placing, to my understanding, nothing except titular value, rather than improprietal indictment, to the word 'chair'.
And if McCain is, as you claim, saying he's never seen it....he's technically correct, since I don't believe he can actually see his own lips. He did not SEE it when he did it in 2002, when the situation was exactly reversed.
@DarkLordCallMeDickC Lieberman has dual citizenship between the US and Israel. Israel may be an ally of the US, but it's not a state. I don't think anyone with citizenship in another country should be allowed to serve in the US Congress.
@pigurine You sir, scare the S*** out of me. Nazi much? Why don't you read some Jefferson, educate yourself on the separation of church and state, get back to me. Real citizens elect based on political views not race or religion.
@thkaal1, the reason real conservatives are being ignored within the Republican party is because of the crazy extremeist tea party frenzy being promoted and pushed forward by the Republican party. Be a Democrat or an Independent is better.
Lieberman and McCain are both sellouts...deny them both...better yet, kick both of their war mongering, internet/free speech killing, New World Order minions out of there!
you suck Lieberman, go to Israel and lead them to their doom,
stop killing America.you wont get away with your traitorous actions here in America forever...you are not a true American, you only care for the nwo , what? kill;l the net>?
Yeah, way to step up and be a lying hypocrite John.
McCain: I've never seen a member denied an extra minute or so...(except when I denied a senator an extra minute or so who was ironically from Minnesota)
you would think that john and joe having been in the senate for 40+ years would have a understanding of what 10 minutes actually means and would be able to prepare their speach for the alloted time. remember elections have consequences. mccain you could have been in the whitehouse if you didn't pick palin.
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He is such a moron. I love how people said that Sara Palin was not qualified to be Vice President. But Al Franken who is a moron comedian is qualified to be a senator... Which if you know a senator has more power then the vice president. but yet Sara Palin wasn't qualified... Give me a break stupid Dems.
franken graduated from harvard with a ba in poly sci while palin graduated from university of idaho with a ba in journalism. franken's more qualified than palin in any political position
One of the curious elements of conservative ideology is their notion of the right to opt out of community & civic repsonsibility / involvement whenever the it suits their cause de jour. In their view there will always be parts of the "community" that will not deserve favorable civic programs designed for those who are fortunate enough to get a "return" on their taxes in a higher bracket...
duval, you use the word "right" but don't seem to understand its meaning.
Rights are what you're born with. They're free. They're yours given to you by God. Govt does not bestow them. They are your life, liberty, and right to pursue happiness. They're your right not to have to do what others want you to. You don't have to work to provide anything for anyone else unless you choose to. No one can justly force that upon you.
But liberals would have it differently... Libs would have all non productive members of society be cared for and provided for, by those who do produce. They'd have the earners shackled by their own efforts, and forced to provide for those who refuse to provide for themselves.
Any time govt tries to provide needs to some, it breaks its Constitutional limits and engages in tyranny. It seeks to force some to work to pay for the needs of others.
Frankly sir it sounds to me like you need to go off in the mountains and live like Jeremiah Johnson....NO TAXES THERE, no government...be conservative and leave the rest of us alone!!!
skyman, if we all adhered to your philosophy and leave each other alone to live as we wish, we would indeed all be Conservative. Thanks for proving our point.
Liberalism hinges on the idea of NOT leaving others to live their own lives. Liberalism can not survive unless there is tyranny and servitude in FORCING some to work to provide for the needs of the non-productive.
Liberalism is against the Founding of this country and is of the most heartless forms of tyranny one can choose.
Does anyone have a clue as too what Franken used to be? He was a comedian that done cocaine on a regular basis, but he claims he no longer uses the drug. Seems very identical to Bush, except sans comedian career. Another thing, when I see Franken, I see Stuart Smalley. And another thing, what is wrong with Minnesota? First you get Jesse Ventura as governor, now this twink for a Senator.
what the hell was reagan? he wasn't always a govenor or president...was he wesorion? can you guess what he did for a living for most of his life? do you have a clue you ignorant "christian"republican!
tell me why youtube allows ignorant fools like you to comment here? why?
cannabis a plant not a drug see tobacco is a drug you can get addicted to it but it is extremely hard to get addicted to weed but when ur addicted it is really easy to quit unlike tobacco it is verry hard to quit and same with alcohol and if cannabis not legal then tobacco shouldnt be legal but cannabis helps with lots of medical needs also such as minor pain depression trouble sleeping stress and more but what does tobacco and alcohol nothing they dont help at all. copy and paste if you agree
your comments go to show just how backward you are brizzle. since you know NOTHING about franken other than he is a liberal (a bastard like you couldn't tell anyone anything about him), you demonstrate your level of ignorance, btw bet you think now senator scott brown is a brain. HE IS NOT, he's in the same i.q. level as your masturbation fantasy ...sarah palin!
I see sailcats77 is your typical right winger. He throws rocks from the bushes, then crawls back under some slime covered rock.
What's the matter, you looked in the mirror I held up and didn't like what you saw?
You see the truth be known, conservatives aren't for anything, rather they endlessly whine what they're against, never offering any solutions other than bitching stop taking my tax dollars and using them for what they don't like.
lol willie, na I've just been busy ... you know... working. lol
What mirror you held up? You mean the one where you said you could come up with a list of fundamental problems with Conservatism, and I challenged you just to come up with 3... hell come up with just 1! And you couldn't?
Is that the mirror you're talking about? lol
Ahhh willie, all libs essentially turn out the same... either misled or blinded. You are blinded. Either way you advocate evil. You advocate tyranny.
Conservatives have told you time and again willie what exactly we're for.
Here I'll do it again: We're for the govt doing what the Declaration and the Constitution say it's to do, and nothing more. We're against redistribution of wealth because that's not a just function of govt.
Is that clear enough?
It's a faulty premise to complain Conservatives are always against everything... when "everything" libs talk about is outside of govt's Constitutional bounds.
You mean like redistribution of wealth from the poor to the rich, right...like when moronic psycho boy bush taxed the poor and gave tax cuts to the filthy rich....the average household was taxed an additional $8000.00 annually during his reign of terror.
What constitution are you talking about...the nazi constitution is the only one you know.
Then back up your claim skyman. This is the first I've ever heard anyone actually try to say G. W. Bush RAISED taxes on the poor.
Good for you not shopping at Walmart. Again, your choice. I think you're missing the point. You're failing to acknowledge xfer of your own wealth by choice is ok, while forcing someone else's wealth from them is servitude.
I fully support raising taxes on anyone not paying their fair share, including those you might call "poor". Even though most of the "poor" in the US have multiple cable tv's, multiple cars, homes bigger than the average European, cell phones, etc.
Those who can physically provide for themselves, need to.
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LOL I love how I get voted down profusely, but no one actually refutes what I say with a credible response (ie, fact based). They just don't like that what I say is true. lol!
Keep on voting down libs. In the mean time consider if you can't refute what's said, maybe your philosophy leaves something to be desired. Like being based in reality.
Nope, the USSR constitution is the one you're talking about if you're for redistribution of wealth.
The US Constitution is the one I'm interested in, which doesn't have one word about redistributing wealth, or "rights" of any kind that rely on forcing someone else to provide it for you.
...but when govt TAKES 45% or so, of your earnings, that you literally gave up part of your life, time away from your family, etc, to earn... and gives it to people who didn't give up any part of their own lives to earn a comparable amount... that's tyranny plain and simple.
It's easy to see the tyranny in liberalism when you look past the flowery feeling rhetoric. When you remove "caring", "generous", "everyone deserves", etc from what is actually servitude... it's easy to recognize the truth
Obviously you're not smart enough to give up. Since you insist, I'll hold up the mirror, just promise me you'll look.
The main thing wrong with conservatism is It's based on greed and selfishness. It boils down to I got mine, fuck everybody else. That in a few words is your belief system.
It is the conservative theme song you can hear Rush Limbaugh squeeching three hours a day on hate radio.
You aluded to the same view with your bitching about your claimed redistribution of wealth.
I turn the mirror around to your face. The main thing wrong with you and your ilk is it's based on greed and selfishness. It boils down to you are incompetent and cannot forge a living for yourself so you want what I worked hard for without having to do the leg work to get it. More simply put- "You got yours and I want it and fuck you." That, in a few words, is your belief system. Go hang out with Billy Ayers comma pause ASSHOLE!
squitzy, actually you're missing the point. First of all Conservatives are significantly more generous in their giving than liberals. So direct the "selfish" accusations where they belong, not at Conservatives.
2nd, the point is choice. Forcing taxation of some to pay for the needs of others removes choice from the discussion, and is therefore tyranny.
Interesting that libs accuse Conservatives of being selfish when libs want to FORCE earnings from some to be given to others.
Only name one thing you said that isn't true? Why the limit? I could go on and on.
Scroll down and read some of your own babbling. Servitude? Taking your earnnings? Giving to non earners?
You're acting like a pissy little hot head. I told you before if you can't get even votes to elect people that think as you, tough cookies. Congress voted to spend as it is spending. Live with it. Trying thatrical stunds screaming you've been robbed and other untruths only makes you look more crazy.
Yes willie, just name one thing fundamentally wrong with Conservatism. Just one thing. Again I'll remind you that you came up with this idea and you said you could name a list of things wrong with Conservatism. I've been challenging you now for weeks to follow through... put your money where your mouth is.
Are you all talk or can you actually perform what you say you can?
So I'll cut you a big break. I don't ask for 10 things, 5 or 3. I'm just going to be impressed if you can think of 1.
My main issue with conservatisim or even libertarianism for that matter is that it tends to deny that we are social creatures and that civilization and cooperation is good for mankind. They always complain about taxes yet how would any of these "self-made" business men be able to move their goods without the taxes that pay for roads or protect their stores from robbers without police all paid for by taxes. In our modern world no one can truly be self-sufficient.
shamrock, infrastructure and defense are exactly what govt is supposed to be doing. That's the purpose of govt. Those things benefit all and without regard to favoritism.
You say cooperation is good for mankind... but cooperation requires choice. When govt forces earnings from some to give to others who haven't earned it, that's servitude, not cooperation.
I doubt ppl would complain if everyone had to pay their fair share. As it is, the top 50% of earners pay ~97% of all income tax.
Careful not to confuse the purpose of govt... as the Declaration says, to secure our inalienable rights, govts are instituted among men, drawing its power from the *consent of the governed*.
The Declaration and Constitution do not allow govt to take from some to give to others. That's literally servitude, and infringement of rights. Not protection of them.
We need a nationwide education on the difference b/w rights & needs. Govt protecting rights=good. Govt providing needs=tyranny.
My issue is that we need a balance of power between the corporate sector and government both have the potential to oppress people. When the private sector is the sole source of providing needs to people they can wield an enoromous amount of power and in a sense become a shadow government.
not true at all. a pure free market system has NEVER been tried. If the government stays out of things, the people have power over the government, and the consumer has power over the corporation. It's government pandering to corporations and giving them monopolies protected by law that takes the power away from the consumer. They both need our money to function.
Yes but corporations are perfectly capable of forming monopolies without government assistance. Once the element of competion is gone from an industry the consumer suffers. Which is one of hte problems with health care the different insurance companies are allowed to set there prices across the board. Anti-trust laws are vital to protecting the consumer.
This might come as a shock, I don't read everyone's comments. I tend to read those that I've had exchanges with. Others I might read, time permitting, so I have no idea what you're saying.
True, I'm hard on conservatives because they let the looney right wing extremists take over their party. Much of the unrest, unwillingess to compromise even talk to "the other side" is directly traceable to those hot head nut jobs. Since main steam conservative allowed that, you're part of the problem..
Look Joe (and John), we won and you lost so shut up, sit down and let us make your mess even bigger and help continue to flush the good name and pride of the United States of America down the drain even more...
Oh geez... will right wingers ever learn when to simply shut-up? Sailcat77, I read everyone of your posts you made in the last week. Not a single one had a single rational thought. You simply spew hate and parrot your hero's, babbling starting the the lying sack of shit aka Rush Limbaugh, the de facto leader of the Republican pig pen. Have you no shame? Obviously not.
Willie you're a hypocrit. You obviously see irishpoet's slum excuses for posts, yet you say nothing about them. You try your best to see insult in my posts when in point of fact they're based on truth. You don't attempt to refute any of what I've said with logic and reason, but with attempts at labeling me what in fact you and your kind are:
Empty. All you have are insults. You have nothing at all in this philosophy you've chosen to live your lives by. Nothing except deceit.
In fact willie, name one thing that I've said that isn't true.
PS - I'm still waiting for that list of fundamental problems or things wrong with Conservatism, which you yourself came up with the idea for. Then the numerous times I've called on you to walk the talk, you've come up with nothing.
Which is exactly what I've come to expect of most liberals. lol
Willie, since you've accused me of posting zero rational thought, and hate, then please point out one thing that I said, in a quote, that is hate-filled.
I'm intrigued.
Also please at some point fulfill your obligation that you said you could deliver on last December, when you said you could point out fundementally what's wrong with Conservatism.
I've pointed out what's wrong with Liberalism... it doesn't just advocate tyranny, it *relies* on it, to exist.
Just walk the talk willie. Tell me what you said you could tell me:
Tell what's fundamentally wrong with Conservatism.
Tell me how I'm wrong when I tell you Liberalism requires forcing some to work to pay for the needs of those who choose not to work.
Tell us all, I'm sure Conservatives everywhere, who know how this country became the wealthiest, most advanced, most generous nation ever on earth, through free market and liberty... I'm sure we're all waiting to hear how wrong we are.
I love it...fuck John McCain...too bad Gramps didn't just retire in embarassment after his massive FAIL campaign for President...really, fuck all of the Repig assholes, including LIEberman the corporate whore!
oip is all the f this, f that, your way of saying you can't find one intelligent meaningful way to substantiate your liberal views?
Eh you don't have to answer. We both know you can't substantiate them. There is no justification for servitude.
Libs just don't like the inherent fact of nature that you have to perform valuable labor if you expect to survive. That includes healthcare as well as any other need.
Libs don't like it, so you just say F this and that in frustration. lol
@sailcats77 hate to repeat myself but don't like to argue with Repigs, it just frustrates me and irritates you stupid little Repigies....sweet jeebus you folks are retarded! :)
Oh oip, it doesn't irritate me to argue with libs. Not even incoherent ones who only have insults to rely on instead of rationale.
You see I love tests of my conservative philosophy. I arrived at it after long years of being very liberal. It's by far the strongest, most rational philosophy I've ever encountered, which is why I chose to be Conservative.
Tests I love are anything libs can throw at it. Which are usually just insults. Like yours.
@sailcats77 hey little gunnut Repiggy...if you 'arrived' at being a 'conservative' after years of being a 'liberal'' then I'm sorry to hear about whatever brain damage you've suffered to cause you to begin getting your 'rational' thought & advice from complete morons and imbeciles like Beck, Limbaugh, Haniiity, O'LIElly, Coulter, etc. your on Hate Squad leaders...Repigs are the most fearful folks around..who else would need to carry guns around all the time except frightened little boys?
hey oip, that's right. Rationale led me to Conservatism. The rationale is this. We all have the basic right to life. Therefore the part of our own lives we willingly trade in order to work, in order to earn money, which we use to pursue happiness and needs... the fruit of that labor obviously belongs to us just as much as the part of our lives we traded for it.
Therefore any govt that uses force to take the earnings of some in order to give to others is corrupt. It forces servitude on us.
And that oip, is exactly the idea that liberalism/ progressivism / etc rests on... it seeks to redefine "liberty" to mean guaranteed fulfillment by govt. But that "fulfillment" can only come about by taking from earners and giving to non-earners. Liberalism is therefore *based* on a lie.
Doesn't everyone just wish that fat ass shoot em in the face dickless I got better things to do then get drafted so I avoided the Vietnam war draft dodging Cheney would shut the fuck up? That pile of shit can't stop taking pot shots from the bushes. If that idiot thought he could have done better, why didn't Dickey boy run? Well maybe something to do with his laughable 6% approval rating. LOL!
hooray for Al and thanks for telling the Repuke and corporate whore LIEberman to STFU...looks like someone lost their JOEmentum! and got his ass handed to him by the most excellent senator from Minnesota...BTW, who woke Gramps McCain up from his nap? He seems a little grumpy and I'm surprised he didn't thro a few F-bombs around like the ignorant, angry asshole he's known to be...
Oh I see. Pardon me for not having the wisdom of someone like Scorpion who of course is right to make baseless attacks on the current administration while sweeping the shit storm of eight eights of endless failures and neglect from Bush under the rug.
Talk about historic knowledge: Ok, lets...on 9/11/01 George Bush on stage with a bunch of little kids just sat there doing absolutely nothing with a blank stare after told country was under attack.
willie, you'll get little defense of Bush from Conservatives. His admin kept us safe but with far too much govt power...
the US has been attacked by Muslims since before our founding. The Muslim Barbary pirates are the reason the USA commissioned the Navy in the late 1700's. And it will continue until the peaceful muslims *force* reform in their religion. We can only defend ourselves til then.
Doesn't excuse Obama's huge mistakes in growing govt power, overspending, killing the econ, etc.
You need a education buddy! Your personal attacks are very childish. Your debate lacks any historic knowledge. You think the country is heading in a better direction know with this administration? You are a sheep if you voted for this criminal corruption going on in Washington today!
Should have said Objection, at the end of the video, No, you only get 8 minutes you just used 2 up and the other 2 distinguished gentlemen we can only afford 7 and half minutes for each. Please be seated. !@\/@!
the lamest thing of all about this is that they don't even listen to each other... they have their prepared speeches, and it doesn't amount to jack squat! These 'debates' & "discussions" don't convince anybody to do anything; only Dear Leader promising special benefits gets a changed vote. Have you seen when cspan does a wide angle shot? The only people in the room are the ones that didn't speak yet, and are about too....
I agree with you. This is the most criminal and corrupt Whitehouse/Congress in American history! All said based on facts not opinions like these liberals have on here!
It isn't just Bush, rather all the people he surrounded himself with. One of the biggest collection of goof-offs, hanger-ons, crackpots and out right smucks ever in the history of the country. Surely you don't want me to list the many lowlights, or do you?
Get intouch with reality...the most criminal and corrupt whitehouse in history is in power rightnow! Taking money from taxpayers in one state to give to others in different states for healthcare votes is BREAKING THE LAW!!! Get a education please before you vote next election!! All liberals that goes for!!! You represent less then 17% of voters! Check the facts Jack!
Joe Lieberman is a Zionist douche.
davd1986 2 months ago
al franken sucked at his day job! how the fuck did this loon get elected?
mandy26lez 3 months ago
McCain is a whiny little bitch.
monokhem 3 months ago
McCain is a whiny little bitch.
monokhem 3 months ago
@TrueUSAPatriots A username
Greggotronic 4 months ago
Franken is a clown who during his campaign owed back taxes in several states. Joke...YES HE IS!
MinnesotaDave17 6 months ago
@MinnesotaDave17 yet you don't mention how Joe Walsh (R-IL) owes over 100,000 in child support payments, after railing about fiscal responsibilities Nice hypocrisy. eh ? :D
lloydmauler 5 months ago in playlist new
Al Franken is a classless bouffon! Regardless of their party affiliation, they are all Americans first and a senator should be above pettinnes like that. Minnesotans, you should be ashamed too...
sfowatcher 6 months ago
boo hoo
kakashi76767 6 months ago
Franken needs to get the stick out of his vagina.
gombis666 8 months ago
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PatienceLan1 9 months ago 96
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The most important thing to remember is that Franken didn't block his statements, he just let him know the time he was allowed to talk about them had expired. If you listen Leiberman asks that all his comments be included in the record and Franken agrees, but he stays firm with the time allotment.
erikp1999 11 months ago
Joe Lieberman is one crazy bozo. I mean, he doesn't even know what he is representing when he speaks. He may be a liberal, but he is the most conservative liberal i've seen. He tries to switch sides every other day, and has some real head scratch moments/comments. Just today he said the US should supply the Libyan opposition movement weapons! Now I am all for the opposition to topple that deranged man known as Qaddafi, but Lieb, suggested it so they could kill each other off! Really Joe!?!
davd1986 11 months ago
I'll bet all of the folks here bashing Franken based on his experience as a comedian fucking worship the conservative poster-boy Ronald Reagan. He was an actor long before his tenure as Governor of California.
Typical conservatives though with their double standards.
Vaishino 11 months ago 2
@Vaishino Sonny Bono, Ronald Reagan, Fred Thompson, Arnold Schwarzenegger, all actors, all Republican politicians!! Other than Al Franken, how many liberal actors turned politicians??
lebaneseameer 8 months ago
You MORONS from Minnesota deserve this clown .....
woofielove1970 11 months ago
@woofielove1970 Good one! HA! Actually, Franken DID do a good thing. He stated he wanted the troops pulled out of Afghan rughaus faster! So he ain't all bad!
Glinkaism1 7 months ago
Stuart Smalley is a United States Senator... yikes
sammysos21 1 year ago
I am not a fan of Al Franken, but I agree with him here. We demand our Foreign Service officers to go through rigorous testing which includes seeing if they can handle time limits for presentations. I imagine DoS employees have similar testing. Why should we put up with rambling politicians? Aren't they supposed to be smarter than the average Joe?
stefpratt 1 year ago
he's not good enough, he's not smart enough, and doggone it I hate his fucking ass.
plantguy666 1 year ago
How many dickheads posting here just hate McCain and are so fucking stupid they make remarks or take sides just from emotion? I would assume most from the intellectually lacking comments.
Congress does alot of dicked up stuff but an extra "moment" to finish a speech is not going to hurt anything.
Maybe America would'nt have the jacked up government we have today if jackasses thought before they spoke/voted.
Shargrailar 1 year ago
This is one of the most overrated "controversies" of the last two years. Franken was just enforcing procedural rules and his instructions. It wasn't personal, and Lieberman took no offense. Also, Franken did not get the gavel through privilege or a power move. In fact, it's a job that is regularly handed out to low ranking Senators. The only outrageous event is McCain's illogical overreaction.
Extratexture4 1 year ago
"Senator Franken"
Shit, how about Senator Bozo the Clown or Senator Howdy Fucking Doodie?
This country has gone to hell in a handbasket.
razumfrackle 1 year ago
I am no Al Franken fan, but as the chair he had the duty of stopping Lieberman from putting the entire Senate to sleep.
Sulla2300 1 year ago 4
If he would have only shortened down his boring ass speech...10 minutes was plenty to prove a point... F-OFF McCain... Franken is there to do a job... NOT blow smoke up peoples asses!!!
tinoDUB 1 year ago 3
shut the fuck up john....your a dork
bakersfieldmusicnow 1 year ago
John Mcain: "Change scares me."
zenzetra 1 year ago 2
The times they are a changin' - and it's about GD time! I kinda' like McCain - Viet vet and all - Liebermann I got no use for - he's just so much a part of the problem - but if McCain has such a significant problem with doing something different after 20-some odd years being in the Senate - well, that's exactly the problem - it's been the same bullshit from the same elected officials that leads to nothing ever changing for the better - their old LOBBIED asses can't make a change!!!
1GaryH1 1 year ago 2
stfu mccain... franken's trying something new
timpedersen 1 year ago
There may a blue law somewhere that states you can't buy butter in Pawtucket, Rhode Island on Thursdays, but if you, your parents, your grandparents, etc. have been doing it for generations, you would be surprised if you are suddenly denied the right in 2010 and told the denial was due to some forgotten law.
At such a point, someone like McCain would question the resurrected ban.
Nobody here has said that the occupant of the chair (whatever his capacity) "can not do" as Franken did.
blacksamcooke 1 year ago
@blacksamcooke This is just more smoke and mirrors. We're not talking about some ancient and discreet outdated law. We're talking about the same power invoked by McCain when someone wished for THIRTY SECONDS to extend remarks objecting to the war, in 2002.
McCain was the chair at that time, and didn't want to begrudge 30 seconds...get this...to the Senator from Minnesota.
Either way you look at REALITY, McCain is just posturing.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@blacksamcooke To an extent, I see your point, artificially inflated as it is. I'm glad for C-Span, because it saves me the TONS of mail-time and reading I did before it was available, but raising a unanimous consent objection from the chair isn't some ancient resurrected arcane parliamentary procedure, despite McCain's posturing.
"Not done often"? Fair enough. But done over the course of the last ten years, it averages out to about 2 or 3 times a month. McCain, in fact, has done it himself.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
McCain only said that the occupant of the chair (whatever his capacity) does not do what Franken did. In McCain's experience, the right to an additional minute from the chair is as certain as the option of buying butter on Thursdays in Pawtucket, Rhode Island.
What laws exist regarding the two aforementioned practices have no relevance in this matter.
Context folks!
blacksamcooke 1 year ago
@blacksamcooke No, he did not -say- that. You inferred it. McCain himself KNOWS that the chair does it, as he did in in the chair himself in 2002.
Let's face it, this is really a 'sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander' situation.
Or, more directly, "Don't dish it out if you can't take it".
Note that I am not a Franken apologist on all matters, but in this instance, which IS the one in which you chose to make an inflammatory statement, may have been a poor representation of your point.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore
I said "he," rather than "she." Did you do the same? I thought blacksamcooke was talking to me.
In following the reading, I think you should identify her "blanket ad hominem" attack. I've read more insults by you here than by the rest of us.
"I'm sure my opponents will not be swayed by facts."
David Gergen and many others were correct when they said Franken had gone beyond the traditions of the Senate in denying Lieberman the extra minute.
terotoIo 1 year ago
@terotoIo I may have said 'he', and I admit presumption that she was male.
Quantity versus quality on insults? Are we keeping score? However politely stated, saying that people who don't see Franken's hypocrisy (in the context of this video's responses) are legally incompetent (IQs below 70) was inflammatory.
I reiterate my certainty that facts don't penetrate, because I've stated them, and they didn't.
Broke a tradition of the senate? Not precisely.
But my response still would be..SO?
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore
???
What are you talking about?
What inflammatory statement have I made? What have I dished out?
You are the one who has been combative.
And what haven't I been able to take? Nothing has offended me here, and I was correcting terotolo when I specified my gender. I wasn't even making a big deal about that. It was just a correction, which most people appreciate.
Chill out.
blacksamcooke 1 year ago
@blacksamcooke If I ascribed the IQ remark to you erroneously, I'll apologize. I'm answering in real time here, but I'll look back.
However, you took my quotes out of context, in that the "you" who could not take it remark was not directed at you. It was directed at McCain's remark, not yours.
I'm as chill as a pill, friend. I'm not taking potshots at you.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago 2
@OneVoiceMore
Fair enough!
I'm glad you're chill.
Thanks for your remarks; they've been helpful.
blacksamcooke 1 year ago
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@blacksamcooke "As anyone with an IQ over 70 knows, Al Franken is a small-minded hypocrite."
I was correct in attributing that statement to you, and I take some exception to it.
Al Franken may be a poster-boy for caustic at times, no doubt.
He is also however, in my opinion, not small-minded, but I'd be happy to qualify SOME of my reasons for thinking so, and didn't appreciate the blanket assertion that I must somehow be mentally inferior for that opinion.
Combative? You mean I disagreed?
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
blacksamcooke is correct. While Franken says he is acting as the Senator from MN, he is in fact acting as chair of the committee. Franken is being coy with his word choice. If he were acting as the Senator from MN, then anyone would feel free to shout him down or interrupt him as they would other floor members.
Franken knew that he (Franken) was playing a game.
This is why there was the incredulous response from Liebermann (and reportedly a few others) to Franken's objection.
MrDenniskucinichoh20 1 year ago
@MrDenniskucinichoh20
Don't be so hard on Franken, Mr. Kucinich. At least he knows how to put idiot 9/11 truthers in their place.
terotoIo 1 year ago
@MrDenniskucinichoh20 You're simply making that up. The chair is a dual role, and if you don't know that, then you don't understand why not a single senator in the room raised a point-of-order objection.
Why didn't Mccain?? Why didn't Lieberman?? Are you serious?
I'm sorry for the people who really feel the need to distort the truth out of all proportion to make OTHERS look like they're being dishonest.
The liars here are obvious.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore McCain and Lieberman are both just posing, period. Despite self-proclaim 'C-Span junkies' and their cheerleaders, words mean things. NOT ONE raised the point that THE CHAIR CANNOT DO THAT, they just didn't like not getting more TIME. Period. They're whining because their stalling tactic on this bill isn't working, and they're misrepresenting their own participation is exactly the same behavior.
And then immediately after, McCain asks UC for up to 30 more minutes of rebuttal.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore Gah, I hate typos. 'participation is exactly' in my previous post should read 'IN" instead of is.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
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@OneVoiceMore
Don't worry about the typos. Anyone reading your comments can see you're an intelligent person.
blacksamcooke 1 year ago
Pre-emptive argument: Senator Lieberman's KEY WORDS...pay attention...were 'unanimous consent', despite any other smoke and mirrors. He did not achieve unanimous consent of all senators present. The fact that Franken was sitting in the chair has nothing to do with the fact that the chairman as Senator is also one of whom 'unanimous consent' is being sought.
Unless we want to rewrite centuries of parliamentary procedure, rules of order and senatorial protocol, nothing improper happened here.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore ...cont...and let's keep it real here. MCCAIN KNOWS THESE PROCEDURES, and he KNOWS HE'S JUST POSTURING, feigning some sort of confusion about how the game is played. Odd, since he's also citing his decades of experience in the senate to make some sort of 'Me no likey' argument, instead of raising, for instance, a point-of-order objection.
We hear some blather about the 'comity' of this body (which cracks me up, because I always hear 'comedy'), but have no illusions. It's blather.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
McCain's a poser. If there was any meat to his rant, instead of just 'I don't like it', he could have objected. He's TRYING to act as if Franken is playing catcher and umpire, knowing full well that's not the case, as Franken clearly stated 'IN MY CAPACITY AS SENATOR OF MINNESOTA', a status that is not nullified, nor prevented from senatorial voice, by sitting in the chair.
The chair does nothing but preside over the session, but as MEANT TO BE, it is a room of SENATORS with a voice.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
An objection to someone going over their time had never before occurred, except earlier that afternoon.
riparianlife97701 1 year ago
I can't stand Al Franken but he was being fair. Remember although Lieberman caucuses with the democrats as does Bernie Sanders (I) Vermont. He objected to additional time earlier to a Repulican from I think Alaska. Reid and his couple of high ranking dems made it clear that all Presidents Pro Temp would object to any additional time regardless the party so they could shove the bill through quickly. Al Franken should have said fuck off and resigned as a presiding officer. Douche.
beecee151 1 year ago
As anyone with an IQ over 70 knows, Al Franken is a small-minded hypocrite.
blacksamcooke 1 year ago
@blacksamcooke Anyone who can view YouTube can PROVE John McCain is a liar and a hypocrite PARTICULARLY on this point, where he PERSONALLY denied time to the Senator from Minnesota extra time.
rdH1pDI9oa4
WHOOPS. I guess those of us with an IQ of 69 or less can spot a hypocrite, too.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@blacksamcooke So, now that I've PROVED McCain did -exactly- the same thing, and yet claimed 'I've never seen it before myself', we're left with a few conclusions to draw:
1. He's a pontificating liar.
2. His memory is bad.
3. He's a pontificating liar AND his memory is bad.
4. He does remember, but hopes everyone ELSE forgets he's a lying hypocrite, which ALSO means he's a big fucking crybaby, and America is lucky he's not our president.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore
Either Chris Matthews understands this distinction, or he is lazy in doing his job.
I neither dispute nor sponsor any of the four conclusions conclusions you have offered here regarding John McCain. I only write that you have proven nothing.
blacksamcooke 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore
Thanks for the video of John McCain. I'm not sure why you've sent it to me, as it doesn't address anything I've written, but I'm always happy to have information.
McCain's words were as follows:
"I've never seen a member denied an extra minute or so, as the chair just did."
The word "chair" is key here, and that was the context under which McCain was speaking. I'm a CSPAN junkie, and I can say that objections from the floor, like McCain's here, are not unprecedented.
blacksamcooke 1 year ago
@blacksamcooke Horsecrap. The fact that Franken was occupying the chair, as any junkie of Robert's Rules of Order would know, is irrelevant, as he clearly stated that he was acting in ...catch the REAL key words....his capacity as the Senator of Minnesota, and not the acting chairman. His position as chair does not vacate his capacity as Senator, and he made that clear.
Trivianistas can try revisionist history elsewhere.
What he said was bullshit in all milieu.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore The 'he' in my last sentence referring to the >cough< honorable Senator McCain, who also rather was lucky not to witness the ...earlier that day... identical scenario, which I must confess, certainly did allow him to act as though his shock and outrage act wasn't just some semantic bullshit while he tried to score political points.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore
I can prove that a tomato is a fruit rather than a vegetable.
terotoIo 1 year ago
@terotoIo Technically, it's a berry, and that argument has just as much merit, or lack of it, that Sen. Franken would have no right to raise an objection to a motion on the floor as a senator, simply because he's sitting in the chair.
That's not even the objection McCain is raising. The body of his objection is that a senator is being denied a few extra minutes, period, not that the CHAIR is raising the objection.
Anyway, I'm sure my opponents in this trivial debate won't be swayed by facts.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
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terotoIo 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore
There was a point to my "tomato" comment.
Oddly, you addressed someone with a topic (McCain) on which blacksamcooke hadn't commented. I'm sure he was taken aback by it. I was satirizing your behavior by doing the same to you.
And McCain specifically states here that he hadn't seen such objections from the chair. Also, given typical interaction of the members of the floor, he couldn't have meant anything else.
terotoIo 1 year ago
@terotoIo
For what it's worth, I am a "she," not a "he."
Moreover, my original point had more to do with what we've always known about Franken, and less to do with his behavior in this video.
And yes, this is a trivial debate, and I regret being drawn into it by some straw man argument.
And yes Kucinich, Al Franken pawns 9/11 truthers.
blacksamcooke 1 year ago
@blacksamcooke Perhaps you should not make blanket ad hominem attacks against people who may not be inclined to agree with you, and then play victim if called to town on it.
I apologize for the gender mistake, and make no issue of it. Sam Cooke was male, and I jumped to an irrelevant conclusion.
The argument is trivial, but you should learn what straw man means. You seem to think it's utterly unheard of for the chair to deny time based on ...what, then?
Explain please how I misunderstood you.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@OneVoiceMore
There is a difference between making an objection from the chair, which Franken did, and making an objection for the floor, which McCain did.
The straw man argument is clear. You had responded to "sam" as if she had been discussing McCain, when in fact she had been discussing Franken.
terotoIo 1 year ago
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terotoIo 1 year ago
@terotoIo Actually, if you read the comment to which I was responding, you'd see that the samcooke remark was about intelligence, and hypocrites. I responded directly to the hypocrisy of the senator who had a problem with Franken. If that's NOT what sam meant, I'm sure he can speak to that.
And whether McCain had seen objections FROM THE CHAIR is all your take on it, period. McCain is clear in what he meant.
So, he hadn't seen it? It's a lie. If it's not, it's a memory failure.
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
@terotoIo That's not what McCain SAID, so you may ascribe other meanings to it.
"As the chair just did" were his exact words, placing, to my understanding, nothing except titular value, rather than improprietal indictment, to the word 'chair'.
And if McCain is, as you claim, saying he's never seen it....he's technically correct, since I don't believe he can actually see his own lips. He did not SEE it when he did it in 2002, when the situation was exactly reversed.
Is that your point?
OneVoiceMore 1 year ago
Joe Lieberman is a piece of shit, I wouldn't allow him to talk anymore than I had to either.
DarkLordCallMeDickC 1 year ago
@DarkLordCallMeDickC Lieberman has dual citizenship between the US and Israel. Israel may be an ally of the US, but it's not a state. I don't think anyone with citizenship in another country should be allowed to serve in the US Congress.
riparianlife97701 1 year ago
Less than0.001 % of Minnesotas population yet we are represented by
two jews figure it out.
pigurine 1 year ago
@pigurine You sir, scare the S*** out of me. Nazi much? Why don't you read some Jefferson, educate yourself on the separation of church and state, get back to me. Real citizens elect based on political views not race or religion.
vanillaBunny007 1 year ago
@vanillaBunny007 Do your homework look at the facts the bastards own everything
run it all watch o bama the deception No I am not a nazi
I am sick of being fucked by these people they are evil
pigurine 1 year ago
ole man McCain doesn't remember when he did the same thing to Sen. Mark Dayton (D-MN) in 2002..more hypocrisy from McCain and the republicans
xadam2dudex 1 year ago 2
Mccain don't know what's going on here. We know, Coz he's two days older then dirt
independent684 1 year ago
@thkaal1, the reason real conservatives are being ignored within the Republican party is because of the crazy extremeist tea party frenzy being promoted and pushed forward by the Republican party. Be a Democrat or an Independent is better.
Eric8542010 1 year ago
@Eric8542010 I'd love it if a real Republican ran. Clinton looked more like a real Republican than anyone I've seen in government in my 42 years.
riparianlife97701 1 year ago
I support Al Franken over Joe Lieberman any day.
Eric8542010 1 year ago 20
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Al Franken is a big fat idiot.
becertain 1 year ago
Lieberman and McCain are both sellouts...deny them both...better yet, kick both of their war mongering, internet/free speech killing, New World Order minions out of there!
KingsorPawn 1 year ago
you suck Lieberman, go to Israel and lead them to their doom,
stop killing America.you wont get away with your traitorous actions here in America forever...you are not a true American, you only care for the nwo , what? kill;l the net>?
you showed your true colors with this one...
witecracker2 1 year ago
Did John McCain refer to the "comity" of the Senate, or the "comedy" of the Senate? I could see either meaning being correct.
thexalon 1 year ago 2
good job mccain way to step up
shawnkelly90 1 year ago
@shawnkelly90
Yeah, way to step up and be a lying hypocrite John.
McCain: I've never seen a member denied an extra minute or so...(except when I denied a senator an extra minute or so who was ironically from Minnesota)
bmcmanus28 1 year ago 3
John McCain is a dumb ass. He just is. And a sore loser, emphasis on the "loser" part.
monstermash9 1 year ago 3
@monstermash9
You John McCain - an American Hero a "loser" .......a man who spent 5 years being tortured in a Vietnamese Prison camp a "loser"
MetalDetroit 1 year ago
jahat einer bock bissl zu quatschn ihr werdets warscheinlich nicht bereuen ^^
NicolePRussellt 1 year ago
you would think that john and joe having been in the senate for 40+ years would have a understanding of what 10 minutes actually means and would be able to prepare their speach for the alloted time. remember elections have consequences. mccain you could have been in the whitehouse if you didn't pick palin.
jackrabitcafe 1 year ago
So I majored in poli sci at the u of m does that mean I am Just as qualified as him..
parr0098 1 year ago
@parr0098 More qualified than Palin, for sure. :)
archon099 1 year ago
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He is such a moron. I love how people said that Sara Palin was not qualified to be Vice President. But Al Franken who is a moron comedian is qualified to be a senator... Which if you know a senator has more power then the vice president. but yet Sara Palin wasn't qualified... Give me a break stupid Dems.
parr0098 1 year ago
franken graduated from harvard with a ba in poly sci while palin graduated from university of idaho with a ba in journalism. franken's more qualified than palin in any political position
spaghettiman2000 1 year ago 12
@spaghettiman2000
And George Bush was the first President in U.S. history to have a Harvard MBA.
MetalDetroit 1 year ago
@spaghettiman2000 degrees are not the only qualification, you retarded moronic loser.
meccaturbo 1 year ago
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Joe should have walk over to that Liberal maggot and hit it with one of those metal police flashlights.
lol
JSMcCainRocks 1 year ago
booo hooo mccain, what a sore loser. and im not sure mccain has an extra 10 minutes of life left in him
sicsoma 1 year ago
Well, I don't like you McCain. Stop wasting damn time.
metaregina 2 years ago
One of the curious elements of conservative ideology is their notion of the right to opt out of community & civic repsonsibility / involvement whenever the it suits their cause de jour. In their view there will always be parts of the "community" that will not deserve favorable civic programs designed for those who are fortunate enough to get a "return" on their taxes in a higher bracket...
DuvalDem 2 years ago
duval, you use the word "right" but don't seem to understand its meaning.
Rights are what you're born with. They're free. They're yours given to you by God. Govt does not bestow them. They are your life, liberty, and right to pursue happiness. They're your right not to have to do what others want you to. You don't have to work to provide anything for anyone else unless you choose to. No one can justly force that upon you.
But liberals would have it differently...
sailcats77 1 year ago
But liberals would have it differently... Libs would have all non productive members of society be cared for and provided for, by those who do produce. They'd have the earners shackled by their own efforts, and forced to provide for those who refuse to provide for themselves.
Any time govt tries to provide needs to some, it breaks its Constitutional limits and engages in tyranny. It seeks to force some to work to pay for the needs of others.
Liberalism is no different than slavery.
sailcats77 1 year ago
I bet you didn't utter a peep during the eight years Bush was president.
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
Frankly sir it sounds to me like you need to go off in the mountains and live like Jeremiah Johnson....NO TAXES THERE, no government...be conservative and leave the rest of us alone!!!
Skyman46 2 years ago
skyman, if we all adhered to your philosophy and leave each other alone to live as we wish, we would indeed all be Conservative. Thanks for proving our point.
Liberalism hinges on the idea of NOT leaving others to live their own lives. Liberalism can not survive unless there is tyranny and servitude in FORCING some to work to provide for the needs of the non-productive.
Liberalism is against the Founding of this country and is of the most heartless forms of tyranny one can choose.
sailcats77 1 year ago
" I object...Because I'm good enough, I'm smart enough, and doggone it...people like me"
werevilsdare 2 years ago 12
lieberman talks in slowmo he deserves what he got
MillaHead 2 years ago 4
Does anyone have a clue as too what Franken used to be? He was a comedian that done cocaine on a regular basis, but he claims he no longer uses the drug. Seems very identical to Bush, except sans comedian career. Another thing, when I see Franken, I see Stuart Smalley. And another thing, what is wrong with Minnesota? First you get Jesse Ventura as governor, now this twink for a Senator.
WesOrion 2 years ago
what the hell was reagan? he wasn't always a govenor or president...was he wesorion? can you guess what he did for a living for most of his life? do you have a clue you ignorant "christian"republican!
tell me why youtube allows ignorant fools like you to comment here? why?
wntoply6 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
cannabis a plant not a drug see tobacco is a drug you can get addicted to it but it is extremely hard to get addicted to weed but when ur addicted it is really easy to quit unlike tobacco it is verry hard to quit and same with alcohol and if cannabis not legal then tobacco shouldnt be legal but cannabis helps with lots of medical needs also such as minor pain depression trouble sleeping stress and more but what does tobacco and alcohol nothing they dont help at all. copy and paste if you agree
mrmastermoviex2 2 years ago
Frankens an idiot. Who in the hell voted for this dumb ass anyway?
bRizzle2009100 2 years ago
your comments go to show just how backward you are brizzle. since you know NOTHING about franken other than he is a liberal (a bastard like you couldn't tell anyone anything about him), you demonstrate your level of ignorance, btw bet you think now senator scott brown is a brain. HE IS NOT, he's in the same i.q. level as your masturbation fantasy ...sarah palin!
wntoply6 2 years ago
I see sailcats77 is your typical right winger. He throws rocks from the bushes, then crawls back under some slime covered rock.
What's the matter, you looked in the mirror I held up and didn't like what you saw?
You see the truth be known, conservatives aren't for anything, rather they endlessly whine what they're against, never offering any solutions other than bitching stop taking my tax dollars and using them for what they don't like.
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
lol willie, na I've just been busy ... you know... working. lol
What mirror you held up? You mean the one where you said you could come up with a list of fundamental problems with Conservatism, and I challenged you just to come up with 3... hell come up with just 1! And you couldn't?
Is that the mirror you're talking about? lol
Ahhh willie, all libs essentially turn out the same... either misled or blinded. You are blinded. Either way you advocate evil. You advocate tyranny.
sailcats77 1 year ago
Conservatives have told you time and again willie what exactly we're for.
Here I'll do it again: We're for the govt doing what the Declaration and the Constitution say it's to do, and nothing more. We're against redistribution of wealth because that's not a just function of govt.
Is that clear enough?
It's a faulty premise to complain Conservatives are always against everything... when "everything" libs talk about is outside of govt's Constitutional bounds.
Of course we're against it! lol
sailcats77 1 year ago
You mean like redistribution of wealth from the poor to the rich, right...like when moronic psycho boy bush taxed the poor and gave tax cuts to the filthy rich....the average household was taxed an additional $8000.00 annually during his reign of terror.
What constitution are you talking about...the nazi constitution is the only one you know.
Skyman46 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
skyman, why do you believe Bush taxed the poor more? That's factually incorrect. Bush cut taxes for all.
Not that I'm taking up for Bush ... he is not Conservative, but cutting taxes is the right thing to do.
Redistribution of wealth from the poor to the rich ... hmmm well be careful to distinguish between redistribution by choice vs. by force.
When you go to Walmart and buy a dvd, you CHOOSE to transfer a little of your wealth to someone more wealthy than you.
Nothing wrong with that.
sailcats77 1 year ago
Because it's a fact that's why...I don't shop at walmart it's a nazi owned subsidiary.
Skyman46 1 year ago
Then back up your claim skyman. This is the first I've ever heard anyone actually try to say G. W. Bush RAISED taxes on the poor.
Good for you not shopping at Walmart. Again, your choice. I think you're missing the point. You're failing to acknowledge xfer of your own wealth by choice is ok, while forcing someone else's wealth from them is servitude.
sailcats77 1 year ago
Although skyman, don't get me wrong...
I fully support raising taxes on anyone not paying their fair share, including those you might call "poor". Even though most of the "poor" in the US have multiple cable tv's, multiple cars, homes bigger than the average European, cell phones, etc.
Those who can physically provide for themselves, need to.
sailcats77 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
LOL I love how I get voted down profusely, but no one actually refutes what I say with a credible response (ie, fact based). They just don't like that what I say is true. lol!
Keep on voting down libs. In the mean time consider if you can't refute what's said, maybe your philosophy leaves something to be desired. Like being based in reality.
sailcats77 1 year ago
Nope, the USSR constitution is the one you're talking about if you're for redistribution of wealth.
The US Constitution is the one I'm interested in, which doesn't have one word about redistributing wealth, or "rights" of any kind that rely on forcing someone else to provide it for you.
sailcats77 1 year ago
...but when govt TAKES 45% or so, of your earnings, that you literally gave up part of your life, time away from your family, etc, to earn... and gives it to people who didn't give up any part of their own lives to earn a comparable amount... that's tyranny plain and simple.
It's easy to see the tyranny in liberalism when you look past the flowery feeling rhetoric. When you remove "caring", "generous", "everyone deserves", etc from what is actually servitude... it's easy to recognize the truth
sailcats77 1 year ago
Cont 1
All conservatives endlessly whine they pay too much taxes, CUT THEM.
All conservatives bitch the government takes their money and wastes it on the needly.
You really want me to continue? I doubt you'll like what you see in the mirror.
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
Obviously you're not smart enough to give up. Since you insist, I'll hold up the mirror, just promise me you'll look.
The main thing wrong with conservatism is It's based on greed and selfishness. It boils down to I got mine, fuck everybody else. That in a few words is your belief system.
It is the conservative theme song you can hear Rush Limbaugh squeeching three hours a day on hate radio.
You aluded to the same view with your bitching about your claimed redistribution of wealth.
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
I turn the mirror around to your face. The main thing wrong with you and your ilk is it's based on greed and selfishness. It boils down to you are incompetent and cannot forge a living for yourself so you want what I worked hard for without having to do the leg work to get it. More simply put- "You got yours and I want it and fuck you." That, in a few words, is your belief system. Go hang out with Billy Ayers comma pause ASSHOLE!
squitzy 2 years ago
squitzy, actually you're missing the point. First of all Conservatives are significantly more generous in their giving than liberals. So direct the "selfish" accusations where they belong, not at Conservatives.
2nd, the point is choice. Forcing taxation of some to pay for the needs of others removes choice from the discussion, and is therefore tyranny.
Interesting that libs accuse Conservatives of being selfish when libs want to FORCE earnings from some to be given to others.
Evil.
sailcats77 1 year ago
haha im so stupid when im horny its true!
mariamakenzie287 2 years ago
stuart smalley the best
zamboangaVillain 2 years ago
Only name one thing you said that isn't true? Why the limit? I could go on and on.
Scroll down and read some of your own babbling. Servitude? Taking your earnnings? Giving to non earners?
You're acting like a pissy little hot head. I told you before if you can't get even votes to elect people that think as you, tough cookies. Congress voted to spend as it is spending. Live with it. Trying thatrical stunds screaming you've been robbed and other untruths only makes you look more crazy.
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
Yes willie, just name one thing fundamentally wrong with Conservatism. Just one thing. Again I'll remind you that you came up with this idea and you said you could name a list of things wrong with Conservatism. I've been challenging you now for weeks to follow through... put your money where your mouth is.
Are you all talk or can you actually perform what you say you can?
So I'll cut you a big break. I don't ask for 10 things, 5 or 3. I'm just going to be impressed if you can think of 1.
sailcats77 2 years ago
@sailcats77
My main issue with conservatisim or even libertarianism for that matter is that it tends to deny that we are social creatures and that civilization and cooperation is good for mankind. They always complain about taxes yet how would any of these "self-made" business men be able to move their goods without the taxes that pay for roads or protect their stores from robbers without police all paid for by taxes. In our modern world no one can truly be self-sufficient.
shamrockfan227 1 year ago
shamrock, infrastructure and defense are exactly what govt is supposed to be doing. That's the purpose of govt. Those things benefit all and without regard to favoritism.
You say cooperation is good for mankind... but cooperation requires choice. When govt forces earnings from some to give to others who haven't earned it, that's servitude, not cooperation.
I doubt ppl would complain if everyone had to pay their fair share. As it is, the top 50% of earners pay ~97% of all income tax.
sailcats77 1 year ago
Careful not to confuse the purpose of govt... as the Declaration says, to secure our inalienable rights, govts are instituted among men, drawing its power from the *consent of the governed*.
The Declaration and Constitution do not allow govt to take from some to give to others. That's literally servitude, and infringement of rights. Not protection of them.
We need a nationwide education on the difference b/w rights & needs. Govt protecting rights=good. Govt providing needs=tyranny.
sailcats77 1 year ago
My issue is that we need a balance of power between the corporate sector and government both have the potential to oppress people. When the private sector is the sole source of providing needs to people they can wield an enoromous amount of power and in a sense become a shadow government.
shamrockfan227 1 year ago 2
I agree shamrock, a balance is needed. I don't think anyone except anarchists are saying we don't need any govt at all.
Because power corrupts, the correct balance as stated in the Declaration and Constitution is for govt to have enough power to only protect rights.
Stopping any corruption in the free market is summed up in... protect our rights.
But anything more than that oversteps the govt's constitutional limits.
They're never intended to provide needs/ redistribute wealth.
sailcats77 1 year ago
not true at all. a pure free market system has NEVER been tried. If the government stays out of things, the people have power over the government, and the consumer has power over the corporation. It's government pandering to corporations and giving them monopolies protected by law that takes the power away from the consumer. They both need our money to function.
jcbruce2900 1 year ago
Yes but corporations are perfectly capable of forming monopolies without government assistance. Once the element of competion is gone from an industry the consumer suffers. Which is one of hte problems with health care the different insurance companies are allowed to set there prices across the board. Anti-trust laws are vital to protecting the consumer.
shamrockfan227 1 year ago
This might come as a shock, I don't read everyone's comments. I tend to read those that I've had exchanges with. Others I might read, time permitting, so I have no idea what you're saying.
True, I'm hard on conservatives because they let the looney right wing extremists take over their party. Much of the unrest, unwillingess to compromise even talk to "the other side" is directly traceable to those hot head nut jobs. Since main steam conservative allowed that, you're part of the problem..
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
Lieberman is the man. Who the fuck does Franken think he is? What a douche bag
SupportDemocracyNow 2 years ago
Look Joe (and John), we won and you lost so shut up, sit down and let us make your mess even bigger and help continue to flush the good name and pride of the United States of America down the drain even more...
chuckinindy 2 years ago
Oh geez... will right wingers ever learn when to simply shut-up? Sailcat77, I read everyone of your posts you made in the last week. Not a single one had a single rational thought. You simply spew hate and parrot your hero's, babbling starting the the lying sack of shit aka Rush Limbaugh, the de facto leader of the Republican pig pen. Have you no shame? Obviously not.
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
Willie you're a hypocrit. You obviously see irishpoet's slum excuses for posts, yet you say nothing about them. You try your best to see insult in my posts when in point of fact they're based on truth. You don't attempt to refute any of what I've said with logic and reason, but with attempts at labeling me what in fact you and your kind are:
Empty. All you have are insults. You have nothing at all in this philosophy you've chosen to live your lives by. Nothing except deceit.
sailcats77 2 years ago
In fact willie, name one thing that I've said that isn't true.
PS - I'm still waiting for that list of fundamental problems or things wrong with Conservatism, which you yourself came up with the idea for. Then the numerous times I've called on you to walk the talk, you've come up with nothing.
Which is exactly what I've come to expect of most liberals. lol
sailcats77 2 years ago
Willie, since you've accused me of posting zero rational thought, and hate, then please point out one thing that I said, in a quote, that is hate-filled.
I'm intrigued.
Also please at some point fulfill your obligation that you said you could deliver on last December, when you said you could point out fundementally what's wrong with Conservatism.
I've pointed out what's wrong with Liberalism... it doesn't just advocate tyranny, it *relies* on it, to exist.
Still waiting. Still. lol
sailcats77 1 year ago
Just walk the talk willie. Tell me what you said you could tell me:
Tell what's fundamentally wrong with Conservatism.
Tell me how I'm wrong when I tell you Liberalism requires forcing some to work to pay for the needs of those who choose not to work.
Tell us all, I'm sure Conservatives everywhere, who know how this country became the wealthiest, most advanced, most generous nation ever on earth, through free market and liberty... I'm sure we're all waiting to hear how wrong we are.
:-)
sailcats77 1 year ago
i love amateur porn, and one day i want to make a movie of my own with my bf
susanlarissa3228 2 years ago
Blah, work is dull! I cant wait to get home and get on my webcam lol, maybe i can get a job doing it some day...
susanlarissa3228 2 years ago
Funny, I can't imagine anything going up the ass of McCain or Lieberman except the business end of a enema bottle.
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
I love it...fuck John McCain...too bad Gramps didn't just retire in embarassment after his massive FAIL campaign for President...really, fuck all of the Repig assholes, including LIEberman the corporate whore!
oneirishpoet 2 years ago
oip is all the f this, f that, your way of saying you can't find one intelligent meaningful way to substantiate your liberal views?
Eh you don't have to answer. We both know you can't substantiate them. There is no justification for servitude.
Libs just don't like the inherent fact of nature that you have to perform valuable labor if you expect to survive. That includes healthcare as well as any other need.
Libs don't like it, so you just say F this and that in frustration. lol
sailcats77 2 years ago
@sailcats77 hate to repeat myself but don't like to argue with Repigs, it just frustrates me and irritates you stupid little Repigies....sweet jeebus you folks are retarded! :)
oneirishpoet 2 years ago
Oh oip, it doesn't irritate me to argue with libs. Not even incoherent ones who only have insults to rely on instead of rationale.
You see I love tests of my conservative philosophy. I arrived at it after long years of being very liberal. It's by far the strongest, most rational philosophy I've ever encountered, which is why I chose to be Conservative.
Tests I love are anything libs can throw at it. Which are usually just insults. Like yours.
Confirms my right choice & your mistake. lol
sailcats77 2 years ago
@sailcats77 hey little gunnut Repiggy...if you 'arrived' at being a 'conservative' after years of being a 'liberal'' then I'm sorry to hear about whatever brain damage you've suffered to cause you to begin getting your 'rational' thought & advice from complete morons and imbeciles like Beck, Limbaugh, Haniiity, O'LIElly, Coulter, etc. your on Hate Squad leaders...Repigs are the most fearful folks around..who else would need to carry guns around all the time except frightened little boys?
oneirishpoet 2 years ago
hey oip, that's right. Rationale led me to Conservatism. The rationale is this. We all have the basic right to life. Therefore the part of our own lives we willingly trade in order to work, in order to earn money, which we use to pursue happiness and needs... the fruit of that labor obviously belongs to us just as much as the part of our lives we traded for it.
Therefore any govt that uses force to take the earnings of some in order to give to others is corrupt. It forces servitude on us.
sailcats77 2 years ago
And that oip, is exactly the idea that liberalism/ progressivism / etc rests on... it seeks to redefine "liberty" to mean guaranteed fulfillment by govt. But that "fulfillment" can only come about by taking from earners and giving to non-earners. Liberalism is therefore *based* on a lie.
And I challenge you or anyone else to justify it.
Or can you only insult?
sailcats77 2 years ago
Doesn't everyone just wish that fat ass shoot em in the face dickless I got better things to do then get drafted so I avoided the Vietnam war draft dodging Cheney would shut the fuck up? That pile of shit can't stop taking pot shots from the bushes. If that idiot thought he could have done better, why didn't Dickey boy run? Well maybe something to do with his laughable 6% approval rating. LOL!
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
AUTOTUNE THOSE JEWS
AutotuneTheJews 2 years ago
Wow John McCain is seriously losing his mental capacities!
Thank you for stopping droopy dog from his mindless dribble to prevent intelligent discussion in our senate.
AAErikCO 2 years ago
hooray for Al and thanks for telling the Repuke and corporate whore LIEberman to STFU...looks like someone lost their JOEmentum! and got his ass handed to him by the most excellent senator from Minnesota...BTW, who woke Gramps McCain up from his nap? He seems a little grumpy and I'm surprised he didn't thro a few F-bombs around like the ignorant, angry asshole he's known to be...
oneirishpoet 2 years ago
Seriously, how can anyone suggest Bush kept us safe? Afterall he was the sitting president when we were attacked on 9/11.
The economy was in the tank in the last months of the Bush administration. It was Bush that gave the first huge handout to AIG and the banks.
Funny how conservatives attempt to not only distort history but deny Bush was one of their own.
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
@willieofroanoke
Ya that's amazing isn't it? Bush did nothing to protect our safety; he simply invaded several countries, and took away our privacy freedoms.
AAErikCO 2 years ago
Oh I see. Pardon me for not having the wisdom of someone like Scorpion who of course is right to make baseless attacks on the current administration while sweeping the shit storm of eight eights of endless failures and neglect from Bush under the rug.
Talk about historic knowledge: Ok, lets...on 9/11/01 George Bush on stage with a bunch of little kids just sat there doing absolutely nothing with a blank stare after told country was under attack.
How's that for some history?
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
willie, you'll get little defense of Bush from Conservatives. His admin kept us safe but with far too much govt power...
the US has been attacked by Muslims since before our founding. The Muslim Barbary pirates are the reason the USA commissioned the Navy in the late 1700's. And it will continue until the peaceful muslims *force* reform in their religion. We can only defend ourselves til then.
Doesn't excuse Obama's huge mistakes in growing govt power, overspending, killing the econ, etc.
sailcats77 2 years ago
You need a education buddy! Your personal attacks are very childish. Your debate lacks any historic knowledge. You think the country is heading in a better direction know with this administration? You are a sheep if you voted for this criminal corruption going on in Washington today!
ScorpionWRL595 2 years ago
McCain is a hypocrite. He's done it before and is a liar and a fraud. He did it 2002 to a senator from Minnisota. Liar, Liar, Liar!
DamnyankPaPa 2 years ago
Should have said Objection, at the end of the video, No, you only get 8 minutes you just used 2 up and the other 2 distinguished gentlemen we can only afford 7 and half minutes for each. Please be seated. !@\/@!
TheHellpa 2 years ago
the lamest thing of all about this is that they don't even listen to each other... they have their prepared speeches, and it doesn't amount to jack squat! These 'debates' & "discussions" don't convince anybody to do anything; only Dear Leader promising special benefits gets a changed vote. Have you seen when cspan does a wide angle shot? The only people in the room are the ones that didn't speak yet, and are about too....
joejohnson043 2 years ago
I agree with you. This is the most criminal and corrupt Whitehouse/Congress in American history! All said based on facts not opinions like these liberals have on here!
ScorpionWRL595 2 years ago
It isn't just Bush, rather all the people he surrounded himself with. One of the biggest collection of goof-offs, hanger-ons, crackpots and out right smucks ever in the history of the country. Surely you don't want me to list the many lowlights, or do you?
willieofroanoke 2 years ago
Get intouch with reality...the most criminal and corrupt whitehouse in history is in power rightnow! Taking money from taxpayers in one state to give to others in different states for healthcare votes is BREAKING THE LAW!!! Get a education please before you vote next election!! All liberals that goes for!!! You represent less then 17% of voters! Check the facts Jack!
ScorpionWRL595 2 years ago