Atheism isn't really supposed to offer anything special or give something positive to humanity as a whole (other than a possible explanation of life and so on). It's just one of many ways to see and understand the world.
What I don't get is why it's apparently not easily accepted that people have different perspectives, understanding, and opinions. Why do people have to bitch about it?
So what if some people choose to base their beliefs on scientific research instead of the idea of a purpose...?
I don't think anyone would agree with your definition of atheism. It doesn't really matter though, whether atheism offers anything or not. What matters is being intellectually honest with yourself, pursuing the truth, it doesn't matter if becoming atheism doesn't make you into ghandi. In fact not becoming atheist because you don't believe it'll make you a better person sounds more like an emotional bias at the expense of your intellectual honesty. Sorry if I don't clap for that.
I'm an agnostic atheist and yep there's a lot of arrogant atheists on YouTube, but there's plenty of arrogant Christians, Muslims, etc. as well. Also about Gandhi, Martin Luther King Jr., and others...I can't accurately judge how logical they were, but even if they were incredibly logical, them believing in a god doesn't prove theism. Even if 95% of all the brilliant people who lived believed in theism, that doesn't mean it can't be wrong. Evidence has to hold it's own.
I was raised in a Christian family. No gods showed up by age five or so and I stopped believing. If asked, I'd call myself a Christian, as if it was a nationality. As I grew up I never said I don't believe in god, but made lame excuses like I think the universe is god, etc. Only after realizing I am an atheist did I understand how negative society has made the word.
It made me want to say I am an atheist, my reasons are valid and I don't deserve such discrimination. That's my point.
@robtbo i feel sad that u had to come to an understanding through such a heavy perspective. it seems like you cared, and then saw what has came out of society and favored compliance over possibilities. to live like that is hard. society is fucked up in so many ways that i can name but the people are products of that. but if u feel you need to declare your self an atheist to pronounce your disagreement with society then there is no room for improvement out side of those who improve. and thats sad
@AJAXxxTheHumanist I can only speak about what I have an understanding of and to hear you say those who identify themselves as atheists are douchebags makes me think atheists haven't been loud enough.
@robtbo yeah its pretty simple understanding if i walk around and say im none asian and use that to describe my self to the world id be a douche bag. just like the atheists who think its the most important fight out there.... their douche bags
@AJAXxxTheHumanist And how are atheists supposed to identify themselves to bring light to social and religious bigotry? If the your culture was Asian and considered non-Asians the least trusted group in society, you'd call self-identified non-Asians douchebags?
I understand what you're trying to say. If the majority of the world's religions didn't have so much influence and discrimination, I wouldn't call myself anything but me.
@robtbo and really what the fuck is atheism gonna do to help the world? how bout to get loud about feeding hungry children, instead getting loud about declaring your disbelief.
check out WHO those atheists you are complaining about are talking to..
the arrogance is in many cases just to make an example, to put something on the edge to make the listener will stop and realy think what they actually believe.
are they talking to mindless sheep that is the masses. are they talking to christians, theists or just deists?
when it comes to arrogance, what i find arrogant about theists is claiming to have faith, but speaking as if it was truth (hypocrisy).
@sethecx theism is a concept that just has a brourder view point on philosophy then atheism(true faith is a part of belief but out of respect for my self and others im not going to try and explain it). and in the same terms as you just put i feel the same way, about atheists speaking about god not existing and them using only faith to support it.
most atheists dont claim that gods dont exist, but one can dare dismiss gods that are illogical, for example a sqare circled one dont exist.. an evil all-good one doesnt exist.
Beyond that it's easy to agree that atheism is empty of content, but it's not pointless in a world that is as poisoned with ignorance as this one. Merely being visible and declaring that one doesn't believe all the old men with strange costumes that go around pretending to be experts on the unobserved and non-demonstrable helps end that nonsense.
As far as trying to construe atheists as hypocrites and "just as bad as religious people" when they hold up the virtues of the scientific method as the best way we currently have to relate to reality is completely idiotic in a world where it happens to be the case that this is demonstrably true. What on earth is controversial or hypocritical about rejecting other people's claims if they can't back them up? Or pushing hard for everyone to start caring about evidence and justification?
"atheism doesnt seem helpful to humanity as a whole"
atheists cant be religious? atheists cant follow say; jesus?
"hard to imagine god" god is just a subjective word that can be just about anything.. might as well say its nature.. in which case everyone is objectively theists.
@sethecx if everyone is a so called objectively theist then we should have the ability to take away difference between(god believing)religious people and none religious people and just help each other for the sake of helping.still there will be many who have differences that are more potent then that but for the majority of the population it would increase general understanding its not that i think atheists dont help people its that calling your self an atheist puts you in a very small minority.
minority? billions are Nonreligious/agnostic/atheist. its ranked the 3rd most common thing, under islam and christianity. if you concider that buddism doens have gods, that another 500 mill people that are atheists de facto.
i live in europe, and all though many subsribe to christianity, thats most because of old tradition. (marriage, funeral or other church ceremonies) rarely do i meet someone who actually believe in gods and any of the supernatural
@sethecx when was i talking about religious beliefs? or people who practice religion? and your grouping a lot of people into that, that might not be atheists. but if you just talking about people who have questions about stuff, go ahead... and p.s. Buddhism is about spirituality and if atheists pick that up ill laugh for a week straight(not really)
@sethecx atheists account for like 11% of the world. and what i did talk about is how stupid declaring your self an atheists first and for most is stupid... so your grouping means nothing to me
It also turns out to be the case that if you have already "explained" lightning with Thor or Zeus, you have no motivation to look for real answers. Once you admit supernatural explanations into your worldview you can make up pseudo-understanding of any state of affairs and you will kill critical inquiry to the extent you employ it.
Such things are actually serious problems with practical consequences for the people who are trapped in religious dogma.
FYI, what people are saying when they're claiming that reason is incompatible with faith is not that religious people can't make a single valid logical argument. It's that any logical argument that depends on a premise that looks like this:
"I believe X is true for no reason what so ever"
Will never have the power to convince anyone of anything. Nor will it improve if you add the premise:
"People who don't believe X are evil and will burn in Hell forever"
Atheism isn't really supposed to offer anything special or give something positive to humanity as a whole (other than a possible explanation of life and so on). It's just one of many ways to see and understand the world.
What I don't get is why it's apparently not easily accepted that people have different perspectives, understanding, and opinions. Why do people have to bitch about it?
So what if some people choose to base their beliefs on scientific research instead of the idea of a purpose...?
nicciweasley 3 weeks ago
@nicciweasley thats fine but people dont need to be douche bags about it their beliefs systems
AJAXxxTheHumanist 3 weeks ago
I don't think anyone would agree with your definition of atheism. It doesn't really matter though, whether atheism offers anything or not. What matters is being intellectually honest with yourself, pursuing the truth, it doesn't matter if becoming atheism doesn't make you into ghandi. In fact not becoming atheist because you don't believe it'll make you a better person sounds more like an emotional bias at the expense of your intellectual honesty. Sorry if I don't clap for that.
MrKommienezuspadt 1 month ago
I'm an agnostic atheist and yep there's a lot of arrogant atheists on YouTube, but there's plenty of arrogant Christians, Muslims, etc. as well. Also about Gandhi, Martin Luther King Jr., and others...I can't accurately judge how logical they were, but even if they were incredibly logical, them believing in a god doesn't prove theism. Even if 95% of all the brilliant people who lived believed in theism, that doesn't mean it can't be wrong. Evidence has to hold it's own.
willquestion 1 month ago
I was raised in a Christian family. No gods showed up by age five or so and I stopped believing. If asked, I'd call myself a Christian, as if it was a nationality. As I grew up I never said I don't believe in god, but made lame excuses like I think the universe is god, etc. Only after realizing I am an atheist did I understand how negative society has made the word.
It made me want to say I am an atheist, my reasons are valid and I don't deserve such discrimination. That's my point.
reflect
robtbo 2 months ago
@robtbo i feel sad that u had to come to an understanding through such a heavy perspective. it seems like you cared, and then saw what has came out of society and favored compliance over possibilities. to live like that is hard. society is fucked up in so many ways that i can name but the people are products of that. but if u feel you need to declare your self an atheist to pronounce your disagreement with society then there is no room for improvement out side of those who improve. and thats sad
AJAXxxTheHumanist 2 months ago
@AJAXxxTheHumanist I can only speak about what I have an understanding of and to hear you say those who identify themselves as atheists are douchebags makes me think atheists haven't been loud enough.
robtbo 1 month ago
@robtbo yeah its pretty simple understanding if i walk around and say im none asian and use that to describe my self to the world id be a douche bag. just like the atheists who think its the most important fight out there.... their douche bags
AJAXxxTheHumanist 1 month ago
@AJAXxxTheHumanist And how are atheists supposed to identify themselves to bring light to social and religious bigotry? If the your culture was Asian and considered non-Asians the least trusted group in society, you'd call self-identified non-Asians douchebags?
I understand what you're trying to say. If the majority of the world's religions didn't have so much influence and discrimination, I wouldn't call myself anything but me.
That's not the way this world is, man.
robtbo 1 month ago
@robtbo non-asian*
AJAXxxTheHumanist 1 month ago
@robtbo and really what the fuck is atheism gonna do to help the world? how bout to get loud about feeding hungry children, instead getting loud about declaring your disbelief.
AJAXxxTheHumanist 1 month ago
check out WHO those atheists you are complaining about are talking to..
the arrogance is in many cases just to make an example, to put something on the edge to make the listener will stop and realy think what they actually believe.
are they talking to mindless sheep that is the masses. are they talking to christians, theists or just deists?
when it comes to arrogance, what i find arrogant about theists is claiming to have faith, but speaking as if it was truth (hypocrisy).
sethecx 2 months ago
@sethecx theism is a concept that just has a brourder view point on philosophy then atheism(true faith is a part of belief but out of respect for my self and others im not going to try and explain it). and in the same terms as you just put i feel the same way, about atheists speaking about god not existing and them using only faith to support it.
AJAXxxTheHumanist 2 months ago
@AJAXxxTheHumanist
most atheists dont claim that gods dont exist, but one can dare dismiss gods that are illogical, for example a sqare circled one dont exist.. an evil all-good one doesnt exist.
sethecx 2 months ago
Beyond that it's easy to agree that atheism is empty of content, but it's not pointless in a world that is as poisoned with ignorance as this one. Merely being visible and declaring that one doesn't believe all the old men with strange costumes that go around pretending to be experts on the unobserved and non-demonstrable helps end that nonsense.
Gnomefro 2 months ago
@Gnomefro really? people knew about gravity before they knew what to call it, same could be with god.
AJAXxxTheHumanist 2 months ago
As far as trying to construe atheists as hypocrites and "just as bad as religious people" when they hold up the virtues of the scientific method as the best way we currently have to relate to reality is completely idiotic in a world where it happens to be the case that this is demonstrably true. What on earth is controversial or hypocritical about rejecting other people's claims if they can't back them up? Or pushing hard for everyone to start caring about evidence and justification?
Gnomefro 2 months ago
"atheism doesnt seem helpful to humanity as a whole"
atheists cant be religious? atheists cant follow say; jesus?
"hard to imagine god" god is just a subjective word that can be just about anything.. might as well say its nature.. in which case everyone is objectively theists.
sethecx 2 months ago
@sethecx if everyone is a so called objectively theist then we should have the ability to take away difference between(god believing)religious people and none religious people and just help each other for the sake of helping.still there will be many who have differences that are more potent then that but for the majority of the population it would increase general understanding its not that i think atheists dont help people its that calling your self an atheist puts you in a very small minority.
AJAXxxTheHumanist 2 months ago
@AJAXxxTheHumanist
minority? billions are Nonreligious/agnostic/atheist. its ranked the 3rd most common thing, under islam and christianity. if you concider that buddism doens have gods, that another 500 mill people that are atheists de facto.
i live in europe, and all though many subsribe to christianity, thats most because of old tradition. (marriage, funeral or other church ceremonies) rarely do i meet someone who actually believe in gods and any of the supernatural
sethecx 2 months ago
@sethecx when was i talking about religious beliefs? or people who practice religion? and your grouping a lot of people into that, that might not be atheists. but if you just talking about people who have questions about stuff, go ahead... and p.s. Buddhism is about spirituality and if atheists pick that up ill laugh for a week straight(not really)
AJAXxxTheHumanist 2 months ago
@AJAXxxTheHumanist
you said atheists are a very small minority, when atheism cowers everyone who's not a theist.
"ill laugh for a week straight" Atheists can be spiritual, they just cant believe in gods.
sethecx 1 month ago
@sethecx atheists account for like 11% of the world. and what i did talk about is how stupid declaring your self an atheists first and for most is stupid... so your grouping means nothing to me
AJAXxxTheHumanist 1 month ago
@AJAXxxTheHumanist
now i dont know what we're talking about.
thank you or your time.
sethecx 1 month ago
@sethecx lol your welcome
AJAXxxTheHumanist 1 month ago
It also turns out to be the case that if you have already "explained" lightning with Thor or Zeus, you have no motivation to look for real answers. Once you admit supernatural explanations into your worldview you can make up pseudo-understanding of any state of affairs and you will kill critical inquiry to the extent you employ it.
Such things are actually serious problems with practical consequences for the people who are trapped in religious dogma.
Gnomefro 2 months ago
FYI, what people are saying when they're claiming that reason is incompatible with faith is not that religious people can't make a single valid logical argument. It's that any logical argument that depends on a premise that looks like this:
"I believe X is true for no reason what so ever"
Will never have the power to convince anyone of anything. Nor will it improve if you add the premise:
"People who don't believe X are evil and will burn in Hell forever"
Gnomefro 2 months ago
your personal definitionof atheism is the best I ever heard
zragisha 2 months ago