naa the rapture is real god SAID HE WILL COME FOR HIS PEOPLE. First, "as a thief in the night" . . . for those who waited in faith 2nd Second, "every eye shall see" . . . with those who waited in faith
I studied this about 6 years ago when the Lord started showing me all the delusion and false doctrines in the churches, and this is absolutely the truth--people are being martyred for Christ all over the world....it is worth it in the end--those who die for Him rule and reign with Him on the earth during millenium. Read your uncorrupted KJV Bible to see the truth. Wake up you believers, the great falling away is happening even now!
@kckimberdog Yeah, but you forgot the background check this ''prophet Stan'' of yours... Go to and read this page: A GLP Alert on False Prophets - Dumitru Duduman and The Prophecy Club Stan and his mony-machine is not that great after all?
I STRONGLY RECOMMEND EVERYONE TO SEE THOSE SITES IT WILL CLEAR YOUR UNDERSTANDING WHEN THE RAPTURE TAKE PLACE AND RESURRECTION OF THE SAINTS AND OTHER FINAL EVENTS OF THE BIBLE PROPHECY
Revelation - is for the Jews, the Israel of Old. Not all of Revelation of course.....but the 144,000 witnesses will be raised from the Jewish people. There would be NO protection if we stayed on the earth! a third of the earth will be burnt up.....poison, storms, beheadiings......not much of a Bride left for Christ at the end. He isn't COMING for his church with the rapture...we are TAKEN AWAY.
when is that 1000 years of reign with christ and how will people reproduce people and who are the left over people at the 1000 years of reign with christ? i need your info thanks.
It's funny. People believe what they want to believe...
Do you, pre-trib-rap believers think that we, who don't believe in such a nice idea, love suffering? No, we don't, i hate thinking about it. I can't comprehend why did God allowed His best people to suffer martyrdom? Are we better than them? Or we just more lucky than they were? Or we are smarter?
The idea that Jesus will lift us up before the tribulation is sweet, yet it doesn't have Scriptural support...
Very good and sound teaching. Many People can quote: "But of that DAY of that HOUR no man knows (when the Lord returns) to justify the Rapture, but Jesus says in Matt. 24;29 AND in Mark 13;24 the LORD says: Immediately AFTER the Tribulation of those days THEN shall He send His angels to gather together His elect. In Matt. 25 Jesus talks about the 10 virgins, 5 were WISE and got prepared to endure the darkness 5 were Foolish and took no oil. You might get shot by other Christians if not prepared!
Enoch; before the flood GENESIS. walked with God 365 years. his name translated is teacher and has always bn a symbol of the church. he also has a prophecy from God about the second coming of JC in the book of jude. which is in the new testament right before revelation Jude-14. oh yea and he was raptured befor the flood. 'AS I WAS IN THE DAYS OF NOAH"
the reason there is a 2000 year gap is bcause the clock stopped after the crucifixion of Jesus, why because Israel would not accept Him as the Christ.(who were originally Gods chosen people) remember this whole Daniel 70th week thing is about the restoration of Israel. We are the church, this doesnt include us. 70AD Israel doesnt even exist at all; until 1948 comes along ISRAEL BECOMES A NATION AGAIN. look it up. history, thts why there is a gap.
I did watch the whole lecture..I have been learning about lots of different viewpoints. I was raised pre-trib and have put it to the test for 2 months when yesterday morning I decided the bible was pre-trib suddenly I was slammed by a friends comment that it is made up and these videos. I view it as God is trying to tell me something..the timing is God for sure...I just need to figure it out. too many stories don't add up and others do.. hagd :)
There are going to be at least two raptures. How many rapture types in old testament? Perhaps, more than one school of thought is correct? Either way, prepare yourself, live in holiness and righteousness. Seek Him while He may be found. Repent! Come out of her!!
@BornofGodtoOverCome You mention "come out of her" as a reference to Sardis and the Daughters of the Whore. The Whore says she will escape pain. Who does that sound like? The whore sits on 7 hills. Rome sits on 7 hills. What daughters came from Roman Catholicism? The Denominations. When you come out from the Whore and flee from the other daughters.. what is a major doctrine of the modern American denominations? ...... the "pre-trib" fable. Comfort and escape = Laodicea
I am really disappointed with this man. How can he seriiously teach post trib rapture. The Bible clearly points to two comings. God ALWAYS takes his people OUT before the trouble really hits. Noahs Ark, Lot. Yes, the coming time is the time of JACOBS trouble, the Jewish people will go through terrible times...but the BRIDE of Christ...the true christians will be taken away, for 7 years tucked away...then returning with him. This man is wrong.
@JMMCL16 What bible are you reading bro you just contradicted yourself like you said Noah was still on earth but god protected him while judgement passed so shall it be in the end...yes some of us will die during ''TRIBULATION'' that why revelation speaks of the persecution of the saints and the two chosen witnesses..but when his plagues are unleashed those still living will not be affected...thats the bible
@mr44doom Agreed. We will go through the entire thing. Most of us will be slain. Our tribulation comes by the hand of our family, friends, government and world systerm. ..............Worst of all......... fellow Christians will fall away and turn us in. However, we will not be affected by the angelic plagues (except that of famine and strife...... but only indirectly). But as Paul said in Romans 8... i consider these hardships nothing in comparison to the glory to come!
@JMMCL16 Sorry friend........ Noah and Lot both suffered great Tribulation. God...delivered righteous Lot, who was oppressed by the filthy conduct of the wicked (for that righteous man, dwelling among them, TORMENTED his righteous soul from day to day by seeing and hearing their lawless deeds” (2 Peter 2:7-8) Like you, I was taught "escapism" timing of the Harpazo, but study showed different, praise God! We will escape WRATH... not tribulation. Shalom.
@JMMCL16 He is quite right. Despite the many great things that we (Americans) have been allowed to bless Israel with ............. we now perpetuate this great Pre-Trib lie. I was a firm believer in this lie... and thought that I was a great student as well. God showed me otherwise. Without any guide, or prompt, God showed me that we will be his evangelicals throughout this dark period. The "left behind" nonsense is both unbiblical and damaging. Shalom.
@KeyboardPacifist Sorry, I know the arguments for pre trib and post trib and mid trib. I still firmly believe in the PRE Trib. The bible speaks about two different comings. One - unexpected the other at the battle of Armageddon (which would be expected!) The Lord had the ARK to protect and keep his children....and the rapture ties in with the Jewish Wedding image.....the Bridegroom coming UNEXPECTEDLY - taking his bride, staying shut away for 7 years. (Trib last 7 years)
@JMMCL16 Tell me. What do you feel that you know about "the Jewish wedding" and where in scripture can you prove this ? I was taught and studied pre-trib for over 20 years... and I know that the Talmudic Grecian wedding is the lie that pre-tribbers swallow. This is a parable of apostacy and love for God's Word. It's not about the pre-trib rapture. Tell me the lies about 7 days and feastings, etc... Christ taught the simple Mohar and Ketubah - not the Talmud.
@KeyboardPacifist Haven't you ever heard about this then? You need to look it up, also look up the different FEASTS....how they all tie in with the Gospel of Christ. For instance....Feast of Atonement.....Jesus died on the cross. Feast of First Fruits.....Jesus raised from the dead. And so on. Do some more research.
@JMMCL16 We have heard the same thing. I am more than aware of what pre-trib teachers about the Feasts. I've done my research. Did you do yours... or did you simply find yourself "wowed" and impressed by what you were being told... Research of the Feasts brought me to another conclusion. Guess what....... the Feast of Atonement has not been fully established. Pre-tribber swallow what Missler and others tell them. Christ fullfilled the Feast of Passover on the Cross
@JMMCL16 The church of Rome has shed more innocent blood than any other institution that has ever existed among mankind. Satan has been ruling the earth since day one. God's kingdom is in heaven, Satan's is on earth. The earth will perish eventually, but God's word never will. Jesus' second coming will be to judge the world. That book LEFT BEHIND is a fiction book. There are 2 comings. His first, and his second. No rapture in between.
@YouMadButISwag I agree with you about Rome and this earth being satans kingdom. Jesus is coming again, but he came first at Bethlehem....and the second time he will come back WILL be at the end of the age and every eye will see him. But, the Christians who truly belong to him, will be TAKEN and snatched away from this earth. You need to study Bible prophecy and also look at Jewish History and how the Passover of the Old Testament reflect Christ as OUR passover lamb. Feast of Trumpets etc
@JMMCL16 There is no rapture of believers and then nonbelievers are left for 7 years on earth. It is not a biblical teaching. Jesus will come again, yes. God will protect us THROUGH tribulations just like he did with Noah, Daniel, ect. The idea, "rapture before tribulation" is sweet but not biblical at all. That would mean all of Revelation doesn't matter because believers would not be on earth. You want to be left on earth with Jesus' kingdom, because like the flood, scoffers were swept away.
I had a dream about climbing a cliff away from a village, I begged the people to come with me and escape....but no one listened. So eventually i left with my children and cllimbed the rock face...higher and higher...I looked around and saw a great wave cover the village, I heard the screams...I told my kids to keep climbing....the wave lapped just under our feet. Thing is, My sister had the same dream, so did my brother. I believe in a PRE Trib. A catching away. a Noahs Ark.I am disappointed
@JMMCL16 Friend............ Noah went through a GREAT tribulation and so will you and I. Christ tells us that the end-time cultural climate will be "as it was in the days of Noah" It will be (and already is) a nightmare. The last time, angels tried a rudimentary method to poison the genome of the future messiah. It failed. This time.. they are attacking the very core of stem cell and genomic modifications. We will see hell on earth.... and God will be with us to the end.
@KeyboardPacifist yeah the time is comingwatched this guy on prophecy club named dimtri and he said five years ago that there wil be an explosion of oil just in the gulf and that during the government and citizen bickering however long that last we would get nuked i brushed it off till the oil spill which was diliberate. he;s right so far
@mr44doom That freaked me out too! I saw the Dimitri video about 2 years ago and it has stayed in the back of my head. When I heard about the spill, my mind immediately began to question the "accident" and the circumstances that would arise. Profit margins, increased international tensions, pressure on countries hostile to the world bank and to the Arab league of Nations, etc... We run on oil & our leaders have sidestepped every chance in the past 130 years to diversify
@KeyboardPacifist Bro they say its the worst in history of man and that was five days ago. its the perfect distraction. the devils are meeting for there final blueprint, bet on it
@mr44doom At the fringes of European, Central Russia, and American economic theory... experts (on the fringe, i must note) are all saying that the 2008 collapse is nothing compared to what is on the horizon. I've scambled to think of a way out - but ONLY our Master can keep us safe. I'm trying to start a career and family soon.. but only Christ can determine my next move. While I do have my wants.. i know that He is no respecter of secular ambitions and His will is superior in scope
@KeyboardPacifist yea i feel you plan your life like he is not coming live your life like he will be here tomorrow. obama is speaking tonight at 8 listen carefully for signal word like sustain,new,supreme.golden,age,one,externalize,grand,order,design,globalize,peace,
@mr44doom When they say "peace" and "safety" sudden destruction. But first..... the Christians will be led to slaughter, daily. Preparation (ie, the 5 wise virgins) will be to keep our eye on the Word, to guard our heart and to NOT love our life to the death. Preparation is NOT to keep your eye on the sky. That's anti-Christian, unbiblical, unsound non-study of the word. It's the hope of escaping persecution. Obama is a tool. The Maitreya/Mahdi will be ushered in with diaster
@mr44doom@mr44doom I live this life as though God is with me at all times. and the Malakim (rebel, hybrid and obediant) are witness to what I do. I plan ahead - and I keep my eye on His Enduring Word. (Rev.3:10) I do believe in imminency, but not the way the pre-tribbers do. I keep Daniel 12:1-3 in mind. We all ought to.
@mr44doom Also, this preacher says, we will have the trib to clean us up....don't agree. Most of the earth will be obliterated by nukes. And we are overcomers and made clean by the blood of Jesus. I have had a dream - signialling a pre trib rapture, turned out it was the same dream, 2 other people had had! I am going in the Pre trib raptrue....at the trumpet...he is coming ofr his bride and we will be with him for 7 years and return with him at the battle of Armageddon.
@JMMCL16 what you believe just isnt biblical its tradition jesuit tradition at that. NOWHERE in the good book does it say were going to spend seven yrs with Jesus come on brother that is just ridiculous we spend a 1,000 yrs. it does not say seven and then a thousand. but whatever as long as your prepared for it not to happen because it wont. be biblical not traditional. you prolly believe that you go to heaven or hell when you die. cant blame you youve been spoon fed by a pastor
@mr44doom Yeah....... I was pretty bitter once I saw the real evidence in the bible. But then..... the Truth did set me free. It's so much better. "For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which will be revealed in us. ... Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril or sword? ...Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us." - Romans 8:18-37
@JMMCL16 Dreams in this day, are not a reliable witness for the entire Church. Let 2 or 3 witnesses (scripture) speak it clearly. I used to have dozens of horrible and fearful dreams as a child, fearing the pre-trib rapture fable... with its many popular books and movies.
But when I became a man...... i went through the discomfort of facing popular doctrine ........ that I might be a workman, unashamed and rightly dividing the word of truth.
I had a dream about climbing a cliff away from a village, I begged the people to come with me and escape....but no one listened. So eventually i left with my children and cllimbed the rock face...higher and higher...I looked around and saw a great wave cover the village, I heard the screams...I told my kids to keep climbing....the wave lapped just under our feet. Thing is, My sister had the same dream, so did my brother. I believe in a PRE Trib. A catching away. a Noahs Ark.
@JMMCL16 what makes you think that this generation wont be tested like others? indeed we are the greatest generation but like all greats their labeled thru great testing....stop going to church for a while and jus read on your own front to back
@mr44doom Paul tells us not abstain from the gathering of the saints.
On the other hand, he is not referring to what is we now call "church." This large, public , politically-correct religious community gathering is NOT what he is talking about. There are certain things to accomplish and to do while gathering. In general, time spent "raising building funds" and doing "community bake sales" are resources wasted in vain. Know your bible intimately and get ready !
yea im very dissapointed, i liked mike hoggard, hope he is not preaching against rapture too. the rapture is what the bible says, it will happen, many scriptures prove it, i cant believe this , its not clear, its just a lot of talk,
@rick00770 well if you are right then show us, we are depending on your understanding since you know, brother show us that dont know scriptures. please
I agree. I'm from Europe and I cant remember my grandpas tell me that many Christians were raptured during WW 1&2. They suffered. Many were killed with the Jews for refusing to fight the war. I even give you Americans the credit, I do believe God loves this nation for having been kind of a gigantic church. Now its vile though. He might give the loved nation special judgement before the 70th week.
Why do Americans think they are above Tribulation ? Look at the the the Voice of the Martyrs website to see followers of Christ that suffer today and still give HIM the glory The 1st Century Church suffered and spread the Gospel around the known world .
@Hijinx59 Because of this prophecy: Rev.18:7 "7`As much as she did glorify herself and did revel, so much torment and sorrow give to her, because in her heart she saith, I sit a queen, and a widow I am not, and sorrow I shall not see;" The Roman Church was the first to receive a bit of Leaven. It has become the whore drunk on the blood of saints. Yet YHWH has called many out of her. These ekklesia will be refined by fire to join Our Master.
1 Timothy 6:20-21 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called: Which some professing have erred concerning the faith. Grace be with thee. Amen.
@Senteami and yet the popularity of the Pre-trib fable grows in our comfortable english-speaking nations..... we will have it more drastic than many others.... Praise YHWH that Christ will never forsake us !
To explain why the great tribulation is coming would be much easier if you would let scripture explain it, wouldn't it?
Jude.14. Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are "ungodly" among them of all their "ungodly" deeds which they have "ungodly" committed, and of all their hard speeches which "ungodly" sinners have spoken against him.
Or you could blast those that "look" for His glorious pre trib return.
@rick00770 The issue that bothers me. and should bother others... is that the spirit (figuratively speaking) the spirit of escapism and non-persecution is associated with Pre-trib story-telling... and with the Whore of Bablyon.
The motivation of this fable is to escape pain while Israel and the world goes through it ! They even condemn mid/post tribbers to a world without the in-dwelling of the Holy Spirit.
That's the heart of the matter. It's mostly a comfortable American doctrine
@Gr8eskape Pre-tribbers believe that the second coming is at the very end of the tribulation. Yet you explain this judgment as "the why" of the Tribulation. Which is the tribulation... the execution... or the earthly sufferings? try this:
1) Look up the usage of the greek word "orge" when applied to the english word "wrath" in the english translation of the N.T. 2) Look up the usage of the greek word "thylipsis" when applied to the english translation of the N.T.
@Gr8eskape eskape... is the very heart of the pre-trib story. It is NOT the story of the Bible. The Heroes of the faith... went through tribulation and when great Judgement came - ..... only at the last moment.... Lot and Noah were preserved.
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naa the rapture is real god SAID HE WILL COME FOR HIS PEOPLE. First, "as a thief in the night" . . . for those who waited in faith 2nd Second, "every eye shall see" . . . with those who waited in faith
15heartz 4 days ago
Go to this page and check out Stan's background!!!
A GLP Alert on False Prophets - Dumitru Duduman and The Prophecy Club
Don't let anyone decive you. The socalled ufo's and alien's are evil spirits, demons
HowardTheServant 1 week ago
I studied this about 6 years ago when the Lord started showing me all the delusion and false doctrines in the churches, and this is absolutely the truth--people are being martyred for Christ all over the world....it is worth it in the end--those who die for Him rule and reign with Him on the earth during millenium. Read your uncorrupted KJV Bible to see the truth. Wake up you believers, the great falling away is happening even now!
kckimberdog 3 months ago
@kckimberdog Yeah, but you forgot the background check this ''prophet Stan'' of yours... Go to and read this page: A GLP Alert on False Prophets - Dumitru Duduman and The Prophecy Club Stan and his mony-machine is not that great after all?
HowardTheServant 1 week ago
that's what being tried in the fire means...
BCRIBB4real 8 months ago
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I STRONGLY RECOMMEND EVERYONE TO SEE THOSE SITES IT WILL CLEAR YOUR UNDERSTANDING WHEN THE RAPTURE TAKE PLACE AND RESURRECTION OF THE SAINTS AND OTHER FINAL EVENTS OF THE BIBLE PROPHECY
bibleprophecytruth com
666truth org
amazingfacts org
MrAndrVa 10 months ago
Regardless of when, prepare to endure to the end.
Biblehastheanswer 10 months ago
Revelation - is for the Jews, the Israel of Old. Not all of Revelation of course.....but the 144,000 witnesses will be raised from the Jewish people. There would be NO protection if we stayed on the earth! a third of the earth will be burnt up.....poison, storms, beheadiings......not much of a Bride left for Christ at the end. He isn't COMING for his church with the rapture...we are TAKEN AWAY.
JMMCL16 10 months ago
@JMMCL16 WRONG SORRY
JASONANDTRACI 7 months ago
when is that 1000 years of reign with christ and how will people reproduce people and who are the left over people at the 1000 years of reign with christ? i need your info thanks.
maxbird2003 10 months ago
It's funny. People believe what they want to believe...
Do you, pre-trib-rap believers think that we, who don't believe in such a nice idea, love suffering? No, we don't, i hate thinking about it. I can't comprehend why did God allowed His best people to suffer martyrdom? Are we better than them? Or we just more lucky than they were? Or we are smarter?
The idea that Jesus will lift us up before the tribulation is sweet, yet it doesn't have Scriptural support...
SerJahPhoto 11 months ago
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micahwrite 1 year ago
Very good and sound teaching. Many People can quote: "But of that DAY of that HOUR no man knows (when the Lord returns) to justify the Rapture, but Jesus says in Matt. 24;29 AND in Mark 13;24 the LORD says: Immediately AFTER the Tribulation of those days THEN shall He send His angels to gather together His elect. In Matt. 25 Jesus talks about the 10 virgins, 5 were WISE and got prepared to endure the darkness 5 were Foolish and took no oil. You might get shot by other Christians if not prepared!
WillSee11 1 year ago
AS IT* WAS IN THE DAY OF NOAH my bad
bangedalltheonesuluv 1 year ago
pre trib 4 life
bangedalltheonesuluv 1 year ago
I CAN GO ON FOREVER
bangedalltheonesuluv 1 year ago
Enoch; before the flood GENESIS. walked with God 365 years. his name translated is teacher and has always bn a symbol of the church. he also has a prophecy from God about the second coming of JC in the book of jude. which is in the new testament right before revelation Jude-14. oh yea and he was raptured befor the flood. 'AS I WAS IN THE DAYS OF NOAH"
bangedalltheonesuluv 1 year ago
the end-times is all about the restoration of Israel not the church. if u wana stick to scripture tht is
bangedalltheonesuluv 1 year ago
the reason there is a 2000 year gap is bcause the clock stopped after the crucifixion of Jesus, why because Israel would not accept Him as the Christ.(who were originally Gods chosen people) remember this whole Daniel 70th week thing is about the restoration of Israel. We are the church, this doesnt include us. 70AD Israel doesnt even exist at all; until 1948 comes along ISRAEL BECOMES A NATION AGAIN. look it up. history, thts why there is a gap.
bangedalltheonesuluv 1 year ago
Comment removed
selviskk 1 year ago
@selviskk
you are very polite..thanks
I did watch the whole lecture..I have been learning about lots of different viewpoints. I was raised pre-trib and have put it to the test for 2 months when yesterday morning I decided the bible was pre-trib suddenly I was slammed by a friends comment that it is made up and these videos. I view it as God is trying to tell me something..the timing is God for sure...I just need to figure it out. too many stories don't add up and others do.. hagd :)
TheRoseville5 1 year ago
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MANY will say to me in that day, LORD, LORD, have we not
PROPHESIED IN THY NAME?
AND IN THY NAME HAVE CAST OUT DEVILS?
AND IN THY NAME DONE MANY WONDERFUL WORKS?
and THEN will I profess unto them,
I NEVER KNEW YOU:
DEPART FROM ME, YE THAT WORK INIQUITY.”
(Matthew 7:21-23)
jpaul7292 1 year ago
7 years of Satan ruling the Earth? Hasnt Satan ruled the Earth since day one? It's a lie to teach that Satan isn't the god of this world.
AndrewKH85 1 year ago
If you are truly saved and doing the will of the Heavenly Father, to die is gain.
th3w4tchm4n 1 year ago
There are going to be at least two raptures. How many rapture types in old testament? Perhaps, more than one school of thought is correct? Either way, prepare yourself, live in holiness and righteousness. Seek Him while He may be found. Repent! Come out of her!!
BornofGodtoOverCome 1 year ago
@BornofGodtoOverCome There is only one Harpazo for the Living.
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@BornofGodtoOverCome You mention "come out of her" as a reference to Sardis and the Daughters of the Whore. The Whore says she will escape pain. Who does that sound like? The whore sits on 7 hills. Rome sits on 7 hills. What daughters came from Roman Catholicism? The Denominations. When you come out from the Whore and flee from the other daughters.. what is a major doctrine of the modern American denominations? ...... the "pre-trib" fable. Comfort and escape = Laodicea
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
I am really disappointed with this man. How can he seriiously teach post trib rapture. The Bible clearly points to two comings. God ALWAYS takes his people OUT before the trouble really hits. Noahs Ark, Lot. Yes, the coming time is the time of JACOBS trouble, the Jewish people will go through terrible times...but the BRIDE of Christ...the true christians will be taken away, for 7 years tucked away...then returning with him. This man is wrong.
JMMCL16 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 What bible are you reading bro you just contradicted yourself like you said Noah was still on earth but god protected him while judgement passed so shall it be in the end...yes some of us will die during ''TRIBULATION'' that why revelation speaks of the persecution of the saints and the two chosen witnesses..but when his plagues are unleashed those still living will not be affected...thats the bible
mr44doom 1 year ago
@mr44doom Agreed. We will go through the entire thing. Most of us will be slain. Our tribulation comes by the hand of our family, friends, government and world systerm. ..............Worst of all......... fellow Christians will fall away and turn us in. However, we will not be affected by the angelic plagues (except that of famine and strife...... but only indirectly). But as Paul said in Romans 8... i consider these hardships nothing in comparison to the glory to come!
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 Sorry friend........ Noah and Lot both suffered great Tribulation. God...delivered righteous Lot, who was oppressed by the filthy conduct of the wicked (for that righteous man, dwelling among them, TORMENTED his righteous soul from day to day by seeing and hearing their lawless deeds” (2 Peter 2:7-8) Like you, I was taught "escapism" timing of the Harpazo, but study showed different, praise God! We will escape WRATH... not tribulation. Shalom.
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 He is quite right. Despite the many great things that we (Americans) have been allowed to bless Israel with ............. we now perpetuate this great Pre-Trib lie. I was a firm believer in this lie... and thought that I was a great student as well. God showed me otherwise. Without any guide, or prompt, God showed me that we will be his evangelicals throughout this dark period. The "left behind" nonsense is both unbiblical and damaging. Shalom.
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@KeyboardPacifist Sorry, I know the arguments for pre trib and post trib and mid trib. I still firmly believe in the PRE Trib. The bible speaks about two different comings. One - unexpected the other at the battle of Armageddon (which would be expected!) The Lord had the ARK to protect and keep his children....and the rapture ties in with the Jewish Wedding image.....the Bridegroom coming UNEXPECTEDLY - taking his bride, staying shut away for 7 years. (Trib last 7 years)
JMMCL16 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 exactly noah was protected from the God's wrath he wasnt beamed up then brought back you make no sense brother
mr44doom 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 Tell me. What do you feel that you know about "the Jewish wedding" and where in scripture can you prove this ? I was taught and studied pre-trib for over 20 years... and I know that the Talmudic Grecian wedding is the lie that pre-tribbers swallow. This is a parable of apostacy and love for God's Word. It's not about the pre-trib rapture. Tell me the lies about 7 days and feastings, etc... Christ taught the simple Mohar and Ketubah - not the Talmud.
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@KeyboardPacifist Haven't you ever heard about this then? You need to look it up, also look up the different FEASTS....how they all tie in with the Gospel of Christ. For instance....Feast of Atonement.....Jesus died on the cross. Feast of First Fruits.....Jesus raised from the dead. And so on. Do some more research.
JMMCL16 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 We have heard the same thing. I am more than aware of what pre-trib teachers about the Feasts. I've done my research. Did you do yours... or did you simply find yourself "wowed" and impressed by what you were being told... Research of the Feasts brought me to another conclusion. Guess what....... the Feast of Atonement has not been fully established. Pre-tribber swallow what Missler and others tell them. Christ fullfilled the Feast of Passover on the Cross
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 The bible disagrees. Noah and Lot went through much persecution and tribulation.
They only escaped Judgement. True Christians will be refined in the Tribulation. Those who remain will be gathered.
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 The church of Rome has shed more innocent blood than any other institution that has ever existed among mankind. Satan has been ruling the earth since day one. God's kingdom is in heaven, Satan's is on earth. The earth will perish eventually, but God's word never will. Jesus' second coming will be to judge the world. That book LEFT BEHIND is a fiction book. There are 2 comings. His first, and his second. No rapture in between.
YouMadButISwag 10 months ago
@YouMadButISwag I agree with you about Rome and this earth being satans kingdom. Jesus is coming again, but he came first at Bethlehem....and the second time he will come back WILL be at the end of the age and every eye will see him. But, the Christians who truly belong to him, will be TAKEN and snatched away from this earth. You need to study Bible prophecy and also look at Jewish History and how the Passover of the Old Testament reflect Christ as OUR passover lamb. Feast of Trumpets etc
JMMCL16 10 months ago
@JMMCL16 There is no rapture of believers and then nonbelievers are left for 7 years on earth. It is not a biblical teaching. Jesus will come again, yes. God will protect us THROUGH tribulations just like he did with Noah, Daniel, ect. The idea, "rapture before tribulation" is sweet but not biblical at all. That would mean all of Revelation doesn't matter because believers would not be on earth. You want to be left on earth with Jesus' kingdom, because like the flood, scoffers were swept away.
YouMadButISwag 10 months ago
I had a dream about climbing a cliff away from a village, I begged the people to come with me and escape....but no one listened. So eventually i left with my children and cllimbed the rock face...higher and higher...I looked around and saw a great wave cover the village, I heard the screams...I told my kids to keep climbing....the wave lapped just under our feet. Thing is, My sister had the same dream, so did my brother. I believe in a PRE Trib. A catching away. a Noahs Ark.I am disappointed
JMMCL16 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 Friend............ Noah went through a GREAT tribulation and so will you and I. Christ tells us that the end-time cultural climate will be "as it was in the days of Noah" It will be (and already is) a nightmare. The last time, angels tried a rudimentary method to poison the genome of the future messiah. It failed. This time.. they are attacking the very core of stem cell and genomic modifications. We will see hell on earth.... and God will be with us to the end.
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@KeyboardPacifist yeah the time is comingwatched this guy on prophecy club named dimtri and he said five years ago that there wil be an explosion of oil just in the gulf and that during the government and citizen bickering however long that last we would get nuked i brushed it off till the oil spill which was diliberate. he;s right so far
mr44doom 1 year ago
@mr44doom That freaked me out too! I saw the Dimitri video about 2 years ago and it has stayed in the back of my head. When I heard about the spill, my mind immediately began to question the "accident" and the circumstances that would arise. Profit margins, increased international tensions, pressure on countries hostile to the world bank and to the Arab league of Nations, etc... We run on oil & our leaders have sidestepped every chance in the past 130 years to diversify
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@KeyboardPacifist Bro they say its the worst in history of man and that was five days ago. its the perfect distraction. the devils are meeting for there final blueprint, bet on it
mr44doom 1 year ago
@mr44doom At the fringes of European, Central Russia, and American economic theory... experts (on the fringe, i must note) are all saying that the 2008 collapse is nothing compared to what is on the horizon. I've scambled to think of a way out - but ONLY our Master can keep us safe. I'm trying to start a career and family soon.. but only Christ can determine my next move. While I do have my wants.. i know that He is no respecter of secular ambitions and His will is superior in scope
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@KeyboardPacifist yea i feel you plan your life like he is not coming live your life like he will be here tomorrow. obama is speaking tonight at 8 listen carefully for signal word like sustain,new,supreme.golden,age,one,externalize,grand,order,design,globalize,peace,
mr44doom 1 year ago
@mr44doom When they say "peace" and "safety" sudden destruction. But first..... the Christians will be led to slaughter, daily. Preparation (ie, the 5 wise virgins) will be to keep our eye on the Word, to guard our heart and to NOT love our life to the death. Preparation is NOT to keep your eye on the sky. That's anti-Christian, unbiblical, unsound non-study of the word. It's the hope of escaping persecution. Obama is a tool. The Maitreya/Mahdi will be ushered in with diaster
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@mr44doom @mr44doom I live this life as though God is with me at all times. and the Malakim (rebel, hybrid and obediant) are witness to what I do. I plan ahead - and I keep my eye on His Enduring Word. (Rev.3:10) I do believe in imminency, but not the way the pre-tribbers do. I keep Daniel 12:1-3 in mind. We all ought to.
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@mr44doom Also, this preacher says, we will have the trib to clean us up....don't agree. Most of the earth will be obliterated by nukes. And we are overcomers and made clean by the blood of Jesus. I have had a dream - signialling a pre trib rapture, turned out it was the same dream, 2 other people had had! I am going in the Pre trib raptrue....at the trumpet...he is coming ofr his bride and we will be with him for 7 years and return with him at the battle of Armageddon.
JMMCL16 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 what you believe just isnt biblical its tradition jesuit tradition at that. NOWHERE in the good book does it say were going to spend seven yrs with Jesus come on brother that is just ridiculous we spend a 1,000 yrs. it does not say seven and then a thousand. but whatever as long as your prepared for it not to happen because it wont. be biblical not traditional. you prolly believe that you go to heaven or hell when you die. cant blame you youve been spoon fed by a pastor
mr44doom 1 year ago
@mr44doom Yeah....... I was pretty bitter once I saw the real evidence in the bible. But then..... the Truth did set me free. It's so much better. "For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which will be revealed in us. ... Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril or sword? ...Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us." - Romans 8:18-37
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 Dreams in this day, are not a reliable witness for the entire Church. Let 2 or 3 witnesses (scripture) speak it clearly. I used to have dozens of horrible and fearful dreams as a child, fearing the pre-trib rapture fable... with its many popular books and movies.
But when I became a man...... i went through the discomfort of facing popular doctrine ........ that I might be a workman, unashamed and rightly dividing the word of truth.
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
I had a dream about climbing a cliff away from a village, I begged the people to come with me and escape....but no one listened. So eventually i left with my children and cllimbed the rock face...higher and higher...I looked around and saw a great wave cover the village, I heard the screams...I told my kids to keep climbing....the wave lapped just under our feet. Thing is, My sister had the same dream, so did my brother. I believe in a PRE Trib. A catching away. a Noahs Ark.
JMMCL16 1 year ago
@JMMCL16 what makes you think that this generation wont be tested like others? indeed we are the greatest generation but like all greats their labeled thru great testing....stop going to church for a while and jus read on your own front to back
mr44doom 1 year ago
@mr44doom Paul tells us not abstain from the gathering of the saints.
On the other hand, he is not referring to what is we now call "church." This large, public , politically-correct religious community gathering is NOT what he is talking about. There are certain things to accomplish and to do while gathering. In general, time spent "raising building funds" and doing "community bake sales" are resources wasted in vain. Know your bible intimately and get ready !
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
yea im very dissapointed, i liked mike hoggard, hope he is not preaching against rapture too. the rapture is what the bible says, it will happen, many scriptures prove it, i cant believe this , its not clear, its just a lot of talk,
rick00770 2 years ago
@rick00770 well if you are right then show us, we are depending on your understanding since you know, brother show us that dont know scriptures. please
hector771000 2 years ago
I agree. I'm from Europe and I cant remember my grandpas tell me that many Christians were raptured during WW 1&2. They suffered. Many were killed with the Jews for refusing to fight the war. I even give you Americans the credit, I do believe God loves this nation for having been kind of a gigantic church. Now its vile though. He might give the loved nation special judgement before the 70th week.
JesusCoup 2 years ago
Why do Americans think they are above Tribulation ? Look at the the the Voice of the Martyrs website to see followers of Christ that suffer today and still give HIM the glory The 1st Century Church suffered and spread the Gospel around the known world .
Hijinx59 2 years ago
@Hijinx59 Because of this prophecy: Rev.18:7 "7`As much as she did glorify herself and did revel, so much torment and sorrow give to her, because in her heart she saith, I sit a queen, and a widow I am not, and sorrow I shall not see;" The Roman Church was the first to receive a bit of Leaven. It has become the whore drunk on the blood of saints. Yet YHWH has called many out of her. These ekklesia will be refined by fire to join Our Master.
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
1 Timothy 6:20-21 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called: Which some professing have erred concerning the faith. Grace be with thee. Amen.
Senteami 2 years ago
@Senteami and yet the popularity of the Pre-trib fable grows in our comfortable english-speaking nations..... we will have it more drastic than many others.... Praise YHWH that Christ will never forsake us !
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
To explain why the great tribulation is coming would be much easier if you would let scripture explain it, wouldn't it?
Jude.14. Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are "ungodly" among them of all their "ungodly" deeds which they have "ungodly" committed, and of all their hard speeches which "ungodly" sinners have spoken against him.
Or you could blast those that "look" for His glorious pre trib return.
Gr8eskape 2 years ago
your right brother, so sad people will not believe the bible, they twist it to prove their point, it goes on and on,
rick00770 2 years ago
@rick00770 The issue that bothers me. and should bother others... is that the spirit (figuratively speaking) the spirit of escapism and non-persecution is associated with Pre-trib story-telling... and with the Whore of Bablyon.
The motivation of this fable is to escape pain while Israel and the world goes through it ! They even condemn mid/post tribbers to a world without the in-dwelling of the Holy Spirit.
That's the heart of the matter. It's mostly a comfortable American doctrine
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@Gr8eskape Pre-tribbers believe that the second coming is at the very end of the tribulation. Yet you explain this judgment as "the why" of the Tribulation. Which is the tribulation... the execution... or the earthly sufferings? try this:
1) Look up the usage of the greek word "orge" when applied to the english word "wrath" in the english translation of the N.T. 2) Look up the usage of the greek word "thylipsis" when applied to the english translation of the N.T.
shalom
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago
@Gr8eskape eskape... is the very heart of the pre-trib story. It is NOT the story of the Bible. The Heroes of the faith... went through tribulation and when great Judgement came - ..... only at the last moment.... Lot and Noah were preserved.
KeyboardPacifist 1 year ago