I used the word "corrupt" to describe the various "contrivances of a certain kind of adult mind", the duality you are assuming is between those minds and everyone else, whom you have labled pure and innocent. Nations and war are not just stories, they are structures which people participate in. If you want to question the reality of shared experience feel free, but useful discussion stops exactly there.
What a great idea for the classroom. It embraces what's called inquiry based learning which is shared on a community resource blog at inquirylearning.ca
I watched the TEDtalk John Hunter on the World Peace Game after which I read the comments. While I was reading I began to be aware that I was mistified(spelling intended) befuddled by the concept/game. Slowly, quietly, innocently, a question began to form in my mind 'am I really the only one who is questioning the use of military/armament game pieces in a "World Peace Game" with fourth graders?!?' I decided to type the comment to see if anyone would respond
so I decided to watch it ...I found it a bit more enlightening but I'm still quite confused as to the games design ...I'm seeing ...actually I'm hearing an explanation that the military technology/focus is more than included it is emphsized on every level... yet the name of the game is World Peace
please understand that my purpose in commenting is to understand ...when a well respected educator, a highly intelligent enlightened human being presents an education tool I expect to feel confident
..confident that I could use the same tool or a reasonable facsimile with the understanding that the tool will enhance the concept that I'm introducing/presenting Peace is a pretty fundamental concept that I understand very well how to achieve moreover I find that most children have an astounding understanding of peace and what it means to be peaceful. I have yet to hear from a child that achieving peace has anything to do with military much less war. ...so I question please help me understand
@gaiagale Alright I'll show you how I see it, I think I can help you to understand.
Peace is a direct contrary to war. And the military is the weapon that is wielded to wage a war. So I can see how you say, why is there so much military in a game called world peace? I have 2 answers: First, how could the game be any challenge at all if the game had just, as one kid says in the documentary "butterflies and solar panels"? Without a path of failure (large schale war), there can be no path of succes
@Dunam thank-you for seeing my comment ...I really appreciate that you've made time to respond intelligently but I'm confused by this portion of your reply ...my curiosity is about opinion "am I really the only one who is questioning" I am clear about the widespread opinion that many people support the concept that 'we must fight for peace' My opinion is fundamentally different. I believe...think...know with every fibre of my being that the only way to achieve Peace is to be peaceful
@gaiagale I agree with you that the only way to be peaceful is to be peaceful; yet I wonder whether your answer would hold true in all situations... could you honestly say you wouldn't give someone a small push off a cliff if you saw the chance? How about if he was also a known serial killer? What if he just asked you to put your son in his car? Would remaining peaceful help your longterm peacefulness more or less? What would weigh heavier: losing your son or having to kill a killer?
@Dunam so the 'challenge' is to BE the thing we wish TO ACHIEVE ...the 'challenge' is to think peacefully
as to your reference to '' one kid " and "butterflies and solar panels" at least with butterflies the children could witness examples of ...demonstrations of ...peaceful living moreover if the children were presented the 'solar panel' challenge...the use of carbonbased fuels would be eliminated therefore the strategies to control and profit from them are rendered useless war is obsolete
@gaiagale Secondly: I think that most people agree that war is a bad thing. Killing is also a bad thing. However, without some of the tensions and situations that would or could naturally lead to a war or small scale conflict, in other words, without tempting the children to use these tools to achieve their goals in solving the financial, energy and water crisis of their nations, they can not make the mistake and truly understand how a war develops.
@Dunam I would like to believe "that people agree that war is a bad thing. Killing is also a bad thing" but your very next sentence is proof that people think otherwise on many levels. Peace is peace ...outside of the duality thinking 'good or bad' 'right or wrong' ...beyond requiring tools. Peace is naturally a state of being especially in children. Children are beyond 'financial, energy and water crisis ...nations. mistake, war. All of these are contrivances of a certain kind of adult mind.
@Dunam I appreciate that you are still somewhat engaged in our virtual conversation yet often questions are a tool for controlling discussion to avoid sharing opinion/insight.
I can answer your question regarding 'books' in general. BOOKS ARE STORIES ...a kind of hard copy medium for sharing opinions of virtual worlds ... fantasies ...stories that have been created to divert people from being present in their real world/our collective real world.
@Dunam as to "lord of the flies" well here's my story/opinion I remember it as compulory reading. I hated the title but I thought 'there must be a reason' so I read it. I hated the story. I was criticized for defending 'childlike innocence'. I was given low marks (chastized/bullied) for not buying the idea that children naturally bullies. I questioned why it was even part of the curriculum. I was absolutely spot on, as a child, in my opinion that children are naturally peace loving, in reality.
One of the girls suddenly and unexpectedly sends a military force to seize control of another nations fuel supply without having to fire a shot. Most other students and the teacher were aghast at this sudden open hostility. Turns out that nation was planning a world domination and without fuel, she was preventing large scale battles and fighting. Is this right? that's what they explore.
@Dunam I did see the TEDtalk it was my point of initial questioning ...I heard the scenario that described the whole thing as a story that is being accepted and validated ...as to what she prevented and what they explore well that is conjecture too!
The world peace game teaches that one can make a game of world peace and make is seem more real ... more justified than real peace.
@gaiagale Well I agree that the video is mostly conjecture and what John got out of it: ( @arthrella hi John!), but I think this very communication between me and you illustrates how a game like this can be a fantastic learning tool in thinking and learning about war and peace.
@Dunam how interesting ...how did you create the '@arthrella' as a link to say " hi John!"
clever twisting strategy ...certainly you are entitled to your opinion of "fantastic learning tool" even if it is very different from mine ...I still hope that I can find others that... in fact there is another TEDtalk speaker that has shared his concept of fun toys and educational strategies that encourage children to rethink and relearn what it is to truly live at peace. I wish you that peace
@gaiagale Definitely enjoyed our short conversation. I didn't do anything to make that arthrella a link, simply added an @ and made sure there was a space before and after it. Also: I wondered which assumptions you and I made about each other while watching this video: tedtalk 'kathryn_schulz_on_being_wrong' (referring to exactly the 10 minute mark)
@Dunam when I read "Definitely enjoyed our short conversation" I thought 'what?!?' reading further "I didn't do anything to make that arthrella a link, simply added an @ and made sure there was a space before and after it." I thought 'did Dunam really mean to explain what had been done and deny doing anything in the same sentence ...if so which part do I believe?!?
as to 'assumtions' as you put it~I was done with that modus operandi a long time ago~long before our virtual conversation
@Dunam I did watch "this video... exactly the 10 minute mark)" and this quote "think for a moment about what it means to feel right" is what I heard at the 10 minute mark ...so if I was into duality thinking ...right/wrong thinking I might have done as she suggested ...if I thought she really meant for me to think as she said instead of listen to her i might have done as she suggested ...I chose to remain fully engaged in listening to her
interesting that some folks are really into dualities
@gaiagale Speaking of dualities : "Children are beyond 'financial, energy and water crisis ...nations. mistake, war. All of these are contrivances of a certain kind of adult mind." That is a duality. Also, how would you go about explaining the existence of phenomena such as nations and war. If humans are born "pure" in some sense, how were they "corrupted"? That is, i think, part of what "the lord of the flies" is exploring.
as to "existence of phenomena such as..." they are just stories ...histories of how SOME people chose to live
beings are born 'pure' 'innocent' and (dare I type this) remain so forever... until they choose otherwise ...people have known this for a long time maybe they've always known even our law says the people are presumed innocent until proven guilty ...as to your question after "pure" ...who says they were? it is just a word that SOME people use...
John -- I just read about this in the DP and have bought tickets to the film at the Paramount next weekend. My school would LOVE this game. This is what we do--teach problem-solving. I would love to work with you to bring it to our school, if possible. I couldn't find another way to reach you, other than your home phone, and didn't want to intrude. Hope this reaches you. Thank you for what you do. -Katrien, teacher at North Branch School in Afton (PreK - 8th)
Hi lynz22, I invented the game in 1978, as I needed to engage some gifted high school students in a global social studies unit. Strange, it was my first actual teaching job under contract after graduating from university. Thanks for you compliments. There has been a film made about the game, by the Rosalia Film company, and it is hoped that it will be out on PBS this year. I am still teaching and so have not replicated the game for play elsewhere...yet! :-)
I used the word "corrupt" to describe the various "contrivances of a certain kind of adult mind", the duality you are assuming is between those minds and everyone else, whom you have labled pure and innocent. Nations and war are not just stories, they are structures which people participate in. If you want to question the reality of shared experience feel free, but useful discussion stops exactly there.
dappercad 7 months ago
michael graves
angle9871 8 months ago
What a great idea for the classroom. It embraces what's called inquiry based learning which is shared on a community resource blog at inquirylearning.ca
chuckstoffle 10 months ago
I watched the TEDtalk John Hunter on the World Peace Game after which I read the comments. While I was reading I began to be aware that I was mistified(spelling intended) befuddled by the concept/game. Slowly, quietly, innocently, a question began to form in my mind 'am I really the only one who is questioning the use of military/armament game pieces in a "World Peace Game" with fourth graders?!?' I decided to type the comment to see if anyone would respond
just now I saw this video explanation
gaiagale 10 months ago
so I decided to watch it ...I found it a bit more enlightening but I'm still quite confused as to the games design ...I'm seeing ...actually I'm hearing an explanation that the military technology/focus is more than included it is emphsized on every level... yet the name of the game is World Peace
please understand that my purpose in commenting is to understand ...when a well respected educator, a highly intelligent enlightened human being presents an education tool I expect to feel confident
gaiagale 10 months ago
..confident that I could use the same tool or a reasonable facsimile with the understanding that the tool will enhance the concept that I'm introducing/presenting Peace is a pretty fundamental concept that I understand very well how to achieve moreover I find that most children have an astounding understanding of peace and what it means to be peaceful. I have yet to hear from a child that achieving peace has anything to do with military much less war. ...so I question please help me understand
gaiagale 10 months ago
@gaiagale Alright I'll show you how I see it, I think I can help you to understand.
Peace is a direct contrary to war. And the military is the weapon that is wielded to wage a war. So I can see how you say, why is there so much military in a game called world peace? I have 2 answers: First, how could the game be any challenge at all if the game had just, as one kid says in the documentary "butterflies and solar panels"? Without a path of failure (large schale war), there can be no path of succes
Dunam 10 months ago
@Dunam thank-you for seeing my comment ...I really appreciate that you've made time to respond intelligently but I'm confused by this portion of your reply ...my curiosity is about opinion "am I really the only one who is questioning" I am clear about the widespread opinion that many people support the concept that 'we must fight for peace' My opinion is fundamentally different. I believe...think...know with every fibre of my being that the only way to achieve Peace is to be peaceful
gaiagale 10 months ago
@gaiagale I agree with you that the only way to be peaceful is to be peaceful; yet I wonder whether your answer would hold true in all situations... could you honestly say you wouldn't give someone a small push off a cliff if you saw the chance? How about if he was also a known serial killer? What if he just asked you to put your son in his car? Would remaining peaceful help your longterm peacefulness more or less? What would weigh heavier: losing your son or having to kill a killer?
Dunam 9 months ago
@Dunam so the 'challenge' is to BE the thing we wish TO ACHIEVE ...the 'challenge' is to think peacefully
as to your reference to '' one kid " and "butterflies and solar panels" at least with butterflies the children could witness examples of ...demonstrations of ...peaceful living moreover if the children were presented the 'solar panel' challenge...the use of carbonbased fuels would be eliminated therefore the strategies to control and profit from them are rendered useless war is obsolete
gaiagale 10 months ago
@gaiagale Secondly: I think that most people agree that war is a bad thing. Killing is also a bad thing. However, without some of the tensions and situations that would or could naturally lead to a war or small scale conflict, in other words, without tempting the children to use these tools to achieve their goals in solving the financial, energy and water crisis of their nations, they can not make the mistake and truly understand how a war develops.
Dunam 10 months ago
@Dunam I would like to believe "that people agree that war is a bad thing. Killing is also a bad thing" but your very next sentence is proof that people think otherwise on many levels. Peace is peace ...outside of the duality thinking 'good or bad' 'right or wrong' ...beyond requiring tools. Peace is naturally a state of being especially in children. Children are beyond 'financial, energy and water crisis ...nations. mistake, war. All of these are contrivances of a certain kind of adult mind.
gaiagale 10 months ago
@gaiagale What is your opinion about the books "lord of the flies" and "ender's game"?
Dunam 9 months ago
@Dunam I appreciate that you are still somewhat engaged in our virtual conversation yet often questions are a tool for controlling discussion to avoid sharing opinion/insight.
I can answer your question regarding 'books' in general. BOOKS ARE STORIES ...a kind of hard copy medium for sharing opinions of virtual worlds ... fantasies ...stories that have been created to divert people from being present in their real world/our collective real world.
Sometimes the intention is to share freely
gaiagale 9 months ago
@Dunam as to "lord of the flies" well here's my story/opinion I remember it as compulory reading. I hated the title but I thought 'there must be a reason' so I read it. I hated the story. I was criticized for defending 'childlike innocence'. I was given low marks (chastized/bullied) for not buying the idea that children naturally bullies. I questioned why it was even part of the curriculum. I was absolutely spot on, as a child, in my opinion that children are naturally peace loving, in reality.
gaiagale 9 months ago
@gaiagale
On the tedtalks website you can see the example.
One of the girls suddenly and unexpectedly sends a military force to seize control of another nations fuel supply without having to fire a shot. Most other students and the teacher were aghast at this sudden open hostility. Turns out that nation was planning a world domination and without fuel, she was preventing large scale battles and fighting. Is this right? that's what they explore.
Dunam 10 months ago
@Dunam I did see the TEDtalk it was my point of initial questioning ...I heard the scenario that described the whole thing as a story that is being accepted and validated ...as to what she prevented and what they explore well that is conjecture too!
The world peace game teaches that one can make a game of world peace and make is seem more real ... more justified than real peace.
and I feel like I'm the only one who sees it
that aside
I still understand and wish all ...each one peace
gaiagale 10 months ago
@gaiagale Well I agree that the video is mostly conjecture and what John got out of it: ( @arthrella hi John!), but I think this very communication between me and you illustrates how a game like this can be a fantastic learning tool in thinking and learning about war and peace.
Dunam 9 months ago
@Dunam how interesting ...how did you create the '@arthrella' as a link to say " hi John!"
clever twisting strategy ...certainly you are entitled to your opinion of "fantastic learning tool" even if it is very different from mine ...I still hope that I can find others that... in fact there is another TEDtalk speaker that has shared his concept of fun toys and educational strategies that encourage children to rethink and relearn what it is to truly live at peace. I wish you that peace
gaiagale 9 months ago
@gaiagale Definitely enjoyed our short conversation. I didn't do anything to make that arthrella a link, simply added an @ and made sure there was a space before and after it. Also: I wondered which assumptions you and I made about each other while watching this video: tedtalk 'kathryn_schulz_on_being_wrong' (referring to exactly the 10 minute mark)
Dunam 9 months ago
@Dunam when I read "Definitely enjoyed our short conversation" I thought 'what?!?' reading further "I didn't do anything to make that arthrella a link, simply added an @ and made sure there was a space before and after it." I thought 'did Dunam really mean to explain what had been done and deny doing anything in the same sentence ...if so which part do I believe?!?
as to 'assumtions' as you put it~I was done with that modus operandi a long time ago~long before our virtual conversation
gaiagale 9 months ago
@Dunam I did watch "this video... exactly the 10 minute mark)" and this quote "think for a moment about what it means to feel right" is what I heard at the 10 minute mark ...so if I was into duality thinking ...right/wrong thinking I might have done as she suggested ...if I thought she really meant for me to think as she said instead of listen to her i might have done as she suggested ...I chose to remain fully engaged in listening to her
interesting that some folks are really into dualities
gaiagale 9 months ago
@gaiagale Speaking of dualities : "Children are beyond 'financial, energy and water crisis ...nations. mistake, war. All of these are contrivances of a certain kind of adult mind." That is a duality. Also, how would you go about explaining the existence of phenomena such as nations and war. If humans are born "pure" in some sense, how were they "corrupted"? That is, i think, part of what "the lord of the flies" is exploring.
dappercad 7 months ago
@dappercad how do you see duality?
as to "existence of phenomena such as..." they are just stories ...histories of how SOME people chose to live
beings are born 'pure' 'innocent' and (dare I type this) remain so forever... until they choose otherwise ...people have known this for a long time maybe they've always known even our law says the people are presumed innocent until proven guilty ...as to your question after "pure" ...who says they were? it is just a word that SOME people use...
gaiagale 7 months ago
John -- I just read about this in the DP and have bought tickets to the film at the Paramount next weekend. My school would LOVE this game. This is what we do--teach problem-solving. I would love to work with you to bring it to our school, if possible. I couldn't find another way to reach you, other than your home phone, and didn't want to intrude. Hope this reaches you. Thank you for what you do. -Katrien, teacher at North Branch School in Afton (PreK - 8th)
Katrieneliz 2 years ago
This looks hella fun!
phongbong 2 years ago
Hi lynz22, I invented the game in 1978, as I needed to engage some gifted high school students in a global social studies unit. Strange, it was my first actual teaching job under contract after graduating from university. Thanks for you compliments. There has been a film made about the game, by the Rosalia Film company, and it is hoped that it will be out on PBS this year. I am still teaching and so have not replicated the game for play elsewhere...yet! :-)
athrella 3 years ago
This is fantastic. I read the article in Christian Science Monitor last week. How do you get this game? I'd like to use it with adults. Great work!
lynnz22 3 years ago
What age group is this targeted for?
Keli1952 3 years ago
Watching and spreading the word here in California. - RR
drumqueen8 4 years ago
John is making a big difference in this world- even from Charlottesville, VA. Keep up the good work.
drumqueen8 4 years ago