her man says she can choose what to believe well if she chooses to believe that jesus was just a man then according to john 3:36 she has no everlasting life so thats very irresponsible of a parent to let a 5 year old choose what to believe
It was so sad to hear about those young boys doing that.They were going to the Kingdom Hall so they would not be destroyed, as we are taught from the bible. God saves those who are righteous and follow his teachings. Someone could have told them that they would die because their mother wasn't going, or their mother told them that they were her religion, and not their dads'.Regardless they were confused.I have never heard of any other case like this. In Noah's day 8 souls survived-ungodly didn't.
All the crazy satanic stuff the show on tv...are you kidding...thats mild compared to harry potter...i mean really this was something going on inside of the home not at the Kingdom Hall..the truth never killed anybody..if any thing the truth saves...Jehovah and Jesus Christ have already said that Jehovah's people will be objects of hatred..Its important that people get Acurrate knowledge of the truth..it will surely set you free.
@momhalsmok you are out of your mind if you think teaching children that everyone dying at the end of this system who is not a Jehovah's Wittness is less damaging then Harry Potter! Have you ever even read Harry Potter? Or do you just believe everything you are told from the WT? Harry Potter is a work of FANTASY and children are very aware of that. Children are taught from THE KINGDOM HALL that anyone not preaching "THE TRUTH" will die as a REALITY. These children killed themselves for freedom
@SixElacatloverr Please do more bible research because JW dont teach that...In Reve 7:9 reveals that there will be a GREAT CROWD that no man will be able to number. So you do agree that the Bible is A Reality...vs Harry being Fantasy...There are 7 million JW..so that clearly shows Jehovah will have mercy on those you dont know him and give them a chance to learn and live by his Righteous Standards
@momhalsmok This is twisting my words. Your religion teaches that everyone, present day who does not convert and become a Jehovah's Wittness will die at the end of this system, which is rapidly approaching. Its great to send children off with that message and isolate them from their peers and leave them in constant fear of Satan. There are many religions in the world teaching a very similar message to your religion, it is not the only religion. Maybe you should do some research
Apparantly, this guy maybe just an associate. None the less, I feel very sorry for the mom's loss and how these boys were tricked...I hope the mother actually pulls her daughter out of there before its too late.
WTH??!! That's just wrong..first of all, why would this father continue going to the KH after this crock happened and taking his daughter?!! I got news for this guy-I am a bit surprised they actually held a memorial for the boys since they committed suicide. JW's do not believe in it and therefore shun it (of course everyone does but JW philosphy is if you commit suicide, you do not get to be resurrected into paradise, taking your own life=murder) and anyone that does do no receive a memorial.
you poor woman. please take your children and get out. if not for yourself, for them!! You can start over, people will help. All you need to do is ask. Please, it's not your fault what happened to your boys, but for your other child's lives, please do something!
why don't you post videos of the lives that 95% of TRUE jehovahs witnesses live.....they are so knowledgeable, not cowards in any way, and they live SO normally.
Well done 21crosscheck. Is there any wonder why 63% of Jehovah's Witness children leave the religion when they are adults? Too bad most of them were pushed into being baptized (using the fear of destruction at Armageddon as the tool to push them) prior to their leaving the Watchtower, resulting in the loss of their families for the rest of their lives.
@jwpublisher1 Yea Satan is pretty powerful and does attack the children. I was raised a JW. left the truth for 20 years. Saw what was out there. learned what other faiths taught. and believe me. it is a sad, sad world. so i truly know the JW's have the truth, Yet as imperfect humans, mistakes are made.JW's are the closest ones ahering to the bible.
@shihtzufizzers I don't think you understood my comment. The main reason 2/3 of children leave the JWs is because they don't buy into all of the fabricated doctrines, endless rules, and doctrinal flip-flops and inconsitencies that prove that this cannot be the "Only True Religion".
@jwpublisher1 No, I think they leave, because society pushes so much on them that is against what God wants. such as premarital sex. Satan has made sure that this is put in young ones faces all the time. It is very hard for a kids yes to stay in the truth, but many come back after they see that the so called rules are really a protection. There is nothing this world has to offer.
This is a subject that has too long been overlooked. The children of JWs suffer from tremendous psychological stress, especially at school, where they are forced to stand out for their religion and not pledge to the flag, and do sports, etc. This subjects them to incredible ridicule, and they are made to look like fools to the rest of the kids. They become the targets of ridicule. This coupled with no birthdays, no Christmas, no nothing makes them feel inferior and worthless.
@jwpublisher1 cont from my other comment...some have left,they become addicted to drugs, Get STD's ect. Gods rules are a protection, even kids who are not JW don't always obey the rules and look at their consequences. I don't think you have looked at the numbers of children who return when they realize they made an error. some don't but many do.
@shihtzufizzers If any return, it's because they can't stand the loss of their family, but they still have their doubts. They just have to keep their doubts inside from now on.
@jwpublisher1 We.. this is an answer that shows anger. I for one am one that returned and it was not for these weak reasons. Every one I know that has returned is because they KNOW it is the truth. If one returns for the reason you say, it is not from the heart therefore it wouldn't last. I have no doubts as do many others I know who left and came back. I think this is the best answer you could come up with. Loss of their family? My family was still there for me.
@jwpublisher1 i am a jehovahs witness. and im 14 years old. i go to a public school, i have friends, and i greatly enjoy my life. i play soccer and basketball and love it. i have never been "ridiculed" for my religion. if your saying JW are the only people that get made fun of, your point is invalid. not every child fits, in regardless of their religion. you are not a JW child so how can you say they feel inferior & worthless if you've never been in their position?
@3love0laugh0music3 I'm glad to hear that you are doing good in school. Sounds like your parents are giving you some freedom in your religion. My remarks were from what I have seen with my own eyes from the children of JWs I know. I'm glad you are doing good. Please keep your eyes open and study the scriptures for yourself and not let the Watchtower tell you what to believe. I'm glad you are checking things out for yourself on the internet. JESUS is the key!
@Blair0687 The JW do not use fear. they use the bible and teach what it says. there is nothing to fear. however, many other religions teach of a torment place you go when you die if you were bad in life. well everyone sins. But JW try to adhere to bible teachings and are repentant. They do not use God as a magic wand. So remember, there are three sides to every story. yours, thiers and the TRUTH. This guy is bitter and very one sided . take care
I cant believe there are people actually defending this point of view. Just look at what our children are exposed outside of God's organization: drugs, violence, sex, not to mention what the catholics believe about a hell of eternal suffering. They teach no such thing exist and that Jehovah is a God of love... you should really inform themselves before spreading false teachings about something you dont even bother to research
@nihonlova Maybe you should do some research on your own religion from an outside source. Oh wait, your not supposed to do that...did you ever think that the fact that you are constantly defending the point of view of something without any outside knowledge shows that you are under a great deal of mind control? You are completely ignorant if you know nothing of the suffering children have been victim to under the hand of Jehovah's Wittnesses who preach Jehovah's love
This is disgusting. Children are exempt from these things because they are innocent. I don't think that god would punish the children of this world for sin until they know it is in fact sin. Ive also been reading about what you guys are recently commenting on. I wish you would cite actual course instead of using a smart usurpers writings in place of the text of god. Alot of your JW text is adulterated compared to the original text. You should be ashamed instead of defending or comparing..
I dont understand, I happen to follow the Jehovahs witness religion an when I was young and learned about armageddon I didn't get scared.....??? The poor kids though.
Wow that sounds like a great Idea. However DY remains very anonymous and I doubt that he would make such a public appearance or answer questions in "real time." But who knows, I will be interested in his answer.
@21crosscheck21 SUICIDE?? Really, what was the cause of death? Whatever you thin caused this, what ever you think these kids were exposed to? Were they the ONLY two exposed to it? They were the ONLY two who diedm correct? And, if it was because of what they were exposed to, did anyone else that was exposed to it? also die, commit suicide? Amazing that a "christian" would use these tactics and lies, as you do. Death is tragic but you are horrible.
You went through all the trouble of cut and paste, collating, syncronizing and chronologically laying out this spam on Crosscheck.
For Jake25?
You are grasping at strawmen again and again, over and over. Jake is now one. How do you find the time? Are you in your teens or something?
Are you trying to test Brian into blocking you next? Because if I were him I would have blocked this rhetoric a long time ago and given others a chance to hold a meaningful dialogue here.
pbar1000 Then I guess 21CC21 should block you because your comments are a bunch of "rhetoric" and YOU never "hold a meaningful dialogue" you just agree with peoples comments that you favor, and when put to the test YOU FAIL. You just agree just to agree but really dont know what you are agreeing about. One example is with the dialogue with me and epidome, you agreed with his false statement, then when you were put to the test you failed and just ran off.
Interesting question. I wonder why you ask..... I am a Presbyterian. I belong to a theologically mainstream, socially progressive congregation. My church does a lot of ecumenical work and encourages much interfaith discussion. How about you?
Jakev25 writes:
I am a Jehovah Witness....Someone put one of your investigative reports on youtube about two kids that were in a JW family and committed suicide. They put it on youtube to discredit our faith.
I guess kids in mainstream Christian sects aren't ever spooked about going to a Torturous Hell ....or get so engulfed in their religion that they bomb abortion offices... It really wasn't a fair investigative report......I was born and raised a JW and I never had any fear about dying at Armageddon. Trish VanPilsum: Interesting. I did that story sooo long ago. I cant believe its still floating around out there.
As I recall the boys suicides had as much to do with family dynamics and the rigid way the family practiced their faith and with the religion itself.
But your note is a reminder of the lasting impact of my work and the importance of context and choosing my words carefully. Thanks for letting me know.
Correct me if I'm wrong but don't all JWs in good standing pretty much practice their faith in the same manner? She sounds like a nice woman and very diplomatic too. I'm not sure her comment helps your position though.
Without exception, I like every JW that I know personally. Some of the JWs here seem to really believe the WT teaches the truth. Maybe that is why it bugs me that I can't get a straight answer that makes any sense out of any JW to simple direct questions about what JWs believe.
@DefendingYHWH well i was also born and raised a JW and was constantly afraid dying at Armageddon. I was discouraged to attend collage or strive for any goals in life which eventually led me to manic depression, hyper anxiety and two suicide attempts. JWs destroyed my childhood by isolating me from other children my age and bombarding me with shame and guilt about feeling what most all people feel growing up. Anyone raising their kids in this cult ought to have there kids taken from them.
Jakev25 asked me to post a conversation through e-mail that he had with the reporter of this video. He said 21cc21 blocked him. I was just posting what he requested.
Right, so not a single man responsible for translating the NWT was qualified? If confirmed by the WT, I'm sure that would give JWs pause to rethink the accuracy of their Bible. Of course, that won't happen because the watchtower will not officially confirm those names.
Jake,,,, lol.... don't you read a bible and magazines every week without knowing the credentials of those who actually wrote it? Suddenly your interested in credentials?
Tell me, what credentials do you need to conduct an interview?
21...What I read comes from the WBTS of PA....But i assumed you knew that.....Please just let me know who produced this video. You did check before posting didn't you?
Jake what you read is written by anonymous people with credentials that cannot be verified. You base you entire faith on a bible and literature were the ultimate source is hidden in secrecy.
Your question exposes you double standard and is very hypocritical for obvious reasons. If you really want to know who conducted the interview it says so right in the clip.
21 Everything is edited by the Governing body before it is published. Now I don't care who the reporter of the story is....I want to know who produced it.
I don't think that is an outrageous request. The WBTS produces all of our literature.
So the names and credentials of the men who wrote the NWT are not important but the names of the producer(s) of this little youtube video clip, you just have to know?
My question is who translated the NWT? I believe there were five men rumored to have had a part in the translation. I have heard unofficial reports but, to my knowledge, the names of the translators has never been officially released. I would like to check out their credentials.
Not nice ......I happened to research the reporter she is well respected...In fact we are emailing back and forth...By the way...she isn't Born Again...
21...who are you arguing with?...Did I say it did?...It was just a fact....I already said she had excellent credentials...what else do you want from me? You just like to argue.
Yeah, I don't understand why the WT couldn't just tell us who 'translated' the NWT. As you know, there are distinct differences between the NWT and other translations. Since most of us do not understand Greek, it would be of great benefit if the credentials of the NWT translators could be verified to help remove doubt that they were just wrong. Other well known experts, whose credentials I can check, are on record as saying that the NWT is a very poor translation.
Not sure..Why don't you contact the Brooklyn office and ask them...
Also in his book..."Truth in Translation" Jason BeDuhn states that that the NWT is superior in accuracy than most bibles used today...I will send you his credentials..
"""I know we do not agree on much 21...But I have never lied to you...nor been deceitful.""" Jake you have posted lies about me on other videos saying that I follow Benny Hinn....
Au Contraire Pierre...I stated that your and Bennie Hinn's doctrine is the same. I then asked you to name several doctrines that his ministry differs from yours.....the best you can do is tell me that his ministry makes a lot more money..but has the same doctrine.
So it's your religion explain the difference between your Born Again Church and Bennie Hinn..We JW don't know what word faith teacher is......
More importantly ...give us the beef...What are the major doctrinal differences?...Does he teach eternal torment?....Trinity?....Eternal Soul?....The Rapture?....Bornagainism?
Jake I have no interest in spending time pointing out to you Benny Hinns theological problems....
Go watch a few of his sermons or some videos if you are interested in him....
Also... as a false prophet and false teacher and thief he is a wolf in sheep's clothing... his statement of faith is meaningless to me, if you want to know what he REALLY teaches go watch him.
21..Come on...Help us out here to understand better. Do people speak in tongues in your church..Are they healed? Is a collection plate passed around? I mean you call Bennie a false prophet but you also call the WBTS a false prophet. We really need to know exactly the things that differentiate your church from all the false ones.
Do you guys teach Eternal Torment?...Eternal Soul? Hellfire Dogma? What do YOU guys teach that is different from Bennie Hinn?
I have a radical thought. Why doesn't each man just speak for himself? Personally, I have never even heard of Hinn. I certainly wouldn't allow myself to pushed into trying to explain what that guy believes. If you want to know, then go listen and learn if you are curious. I don't speak for anyone else and I don't expect anyone else to either. So if you can bait Crosscheck into allowing you to redirect the conversation then so be it. In the meanwhile, I'm still waiting for answers
#1 We on the outside of the Born again Movement lump you all together. we thought that you all had the same basic false doctrines of Trinity, Eternal Soul, Hellfire, General Rapture, etc etc.
So let's make some headway...What are the doctrinal differences that separate TBN Preachers from your church....
Also...Are those followers of Bennie Hinn Saved even though you claim he is a false prophet.
#2 You spend so much time persecuting the JW but when I turn the tables you claim I'm a liar and refuse to answer.
Honestly how many JW kids have committed suicide because they were taught about Armageddon. You make it sound like a daily occurance. That we are traumatizing our young members.
Then you accuse me of impropriety because I want to know who produced such nonsense.
"""We on the outside of the Born again Movement lump you all together."""
Jake your willful and purposeful ignorance is not is not my problem... If you want to be deceitful and lump all your fictional "bornagainers" together that is your business... however my videos will not be the forum for you will spread these myths and if I see deceitful comments they will be deleted.
So again..Give me doctrines that are different.....Don't give me different METHODS of the same doctrine. Are there healings in your church? Do people speak in tongues? Are your young members encouraged to enlist in the military? Do you celebrate pagan holidays? Does your church get into politics? Do people get "drunk with the Holy Spirit" and convulse at your church?
Include differences in the teachings of the trinity, eternal soul, Hellfire and the General rapture of the church.
Deleted that comment Jake..... once again more lies and gross exaggerations.... if you have an intelligent point you are free to post.... otherwise you are not.
The "organization" usually refers to the leadership of the WT... at other times all JWS would be included but most, (including the organization) don't use the word that way very often.
U understand the Watchtower Societies of NY and PA are legal entities.
These don't represent Jehovah's Witnesses individually, but are controlled by the Governing Body (The Boys from Brooklyn) for printing & legal purposes.
When the literature or the Societies representatives, or individuals say "the org.", they mean God's Theocratic government in heaven, represented on earth by the "faithful steward" as Jesus' representatives, "ambassadors for Christ."
I didn't think that U r anyone else outside of JWs understood what "the organization" really is to individual Jehovah's Witnesses. We are never taught & neither are our children that they should revere(respect, yes)an earthly organization. If a child is learning Christianity & about God's Theocratic org. it will be imperative that they learn all the lessons of that org. on an "age appropriate basis". That describes Jehovah's Witnesses. Unless U have privileged info I'm not aware of.
That's interesting TRUTHINTHEBIBLE. Thank you for bringing that up here. It just so happens that is yet another thing about which I would like to have a clear understanding. Can you expand on that a little more. I want to understand the organizational structure better. Jehovah is the head of the org. I assume Jesus/Michael is directly under him followed by the lower angels?Sound right? If they are all in heaven, how then can men accurately represent them?
At one point the speaker in the video spoke of the boys feeling isolated. Would anyone like to speak to that? Can JW kids have friendships with their classmates who are not JWs ("worldly people")? Many of the things that make JW kids seem different to their peers seem made up to me. Things like not celebrating birthdays, not saluting the flag, ...etc. However, putting that aside I want to know whether friendships with non JWs in and of themselves are discouraged? If so, why?
I'll say that. Yes, they are. Until they put on the "new personality". You don't get a dirty car clean by rubbing your new white suit all over it. Your suit gets dirty.
Wow, how boring your conversations must be! Some of the conversations that I enjoy the most are with people who don't agree with me and challenge me in some way. You seem to be saying that you really only want to know and talk to people who think like you do. It almost sounds like you don't ever have a real conversation about anything non WT related with non JWs. It's almost as if you are saying that you shut off part of your mind when talking to them. Sounds kind of small.
You probably know that is not at all what I am talking about. Jesus and Paul both made it clear that we must live in the world, but not be a part of it. We preach in it but do not submit to it. We love those to whom we preach, but do not embrace their ways.
What I find boring are the veiled predictable YouTube attacks I receive.
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE wrote: "We love those to whom we preach,..."
Of that I have no doubt.
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE wrote: "What I find boring are the veiled predictable YouTube attacks I receive."
I didn't realize you were sensitive. In that case, I'll just say that there are many of your beliefs which do not make any sense to me. I'll try to refrain from making any further observations and just stick to questions which I would like to have answered.
So associations with 'worldly' people are bad but I am wrong in suggesting that you are uncomfortable with talking to non JWs about things not related to your preaching work because that is "not at all what you are talking about"? You tell me then, what is it about associating with non JWs that is objectionable if it is not the conversations? Is it that you think all 'worldly' people run around doing things like getting drunk and you just don't want to be in their presence?
concerned for what? ... that I will end up frying in flames for eternity. NO worries my friend, I went to the local fire station and got me the latest state of the art fire proof suit. Bring it on!!!!
I agree with you. It's usually things siad that are wrong about Jehovah's Witnesses. OUr children know what the bible teaches. It is not frightening at all, It gives children a future and a hope
So the JW's are what? Supposed to tell us all that if you are evil and do not have fear for God you will be ok? That if you are a murderer, a thief, a corrupt politician who enslaves the world you still go to heaven? Then abolish the death penalty! Abolish imprisonment! BEsides, who are we as humans to judge?? what i see is the JW's are preaching the Bible the way its written and if you think the Bible is a fairy tale book full of chocolates and rainbows youre wrong. It speaks of destruction
21 your videos are getting more and more desperate. And I will be here to refute each one. This is my testimony: I grew up as a JW and I never had any problems. I came from a very loving home and I was not worried about being destroyed at Armegeddon. I didn't go to "Sunday School" and paint pictures ...we sat with the adults and learned the truth about Jehovah and the future. I guess the Parents in Noah's day should have been more like the JW today..perhaps many more would have survived...
Funny how 21 never remarks on the Born Again Christians that have been so brainwashed by their ministries that they go out and bomb abortion sites....
I hate to defend JW's, and that isn't my intention here, but mainstream Christians aren't any better. They fill their kids' heads up with stories and images of how they will burn for an eternity in Hell if they don't believe, so who are they to accuse JWs of filling their kids' heads up with images of destruction if THEY don't believe? I'd rather be destroyed forever than spend eternity in Hell. There are people who go into years of therapy due to their fear of a nonexistent torture chamber.
Yeah utukkuxul, that is very true. I was talking to a friend earlier who made a similar point. I guess people's experience can vary but I can tell you that as a child I was taught about hell. However, I will say that as a child I don't recall seeing any images... other than the ones I created in my mind. In my opinion, I doubt most kids see either Armageddon or hell (depending on what they are taught) as a particularly imminent threat. Idk, when I was young I thought I would live forever anyway.
One of the things that gets me about this video is how the mother of the two boys was treated. She said they treated her as if it was somehow her fault because she left the organization. That doesn't sound like a very loving, compassionate attitude to me.
Yeah, I am judgmental of an organization that I've watched consistently lie, judge and hate others, contradict itself, and ruin lives. What's your point?
utukkuxul How about an organization that refuses to kill their neighbors, you never see racism among their communities, always helping out their brothers and sisters when in need, help peoples lives to better themselves. This sounds like the Jehovahs Witnesses. What other organization has this?
The fact that your organization is pacifistic and non-racist doesn't change the fact that you are liars. As for helping our your brothers and sisters... LOL. Yeah right.
I don't know. The JWs pound into their kids' heads that Armageddon is going to happen tomorrow. I know I always expected the fireworks to start at any moment. I can't say how scared most kids are of Hell since I wasn't taught it was real, but from what I've heard from people who were taught of it, they seemed to indicate they were pretty terrified.
Both sides here are basically accusing the other of scaring their kids and asking each for peer-reviewed reports and obituaries. Both are crazy.
I will say, though, most believers in Hell, including children, do not think they are going there. They "know" they are saved and Heaven-bound. The JWs, on the other hand, go their whole life not knowing if they've been saved, and being scared that they haven't "done enough" to warrant salvation. So in that way, their Armageddon is more frightening than Hell.
I can't speak for most kids,but I for one was TRAUMATIZED by hell!I thought I was going there because I didn't understand it and couldn't honestly love a God who made it.I prayed a LOT for understanding and he gave it to me.The wicked shall perish.God is just.
..Why don't you enlighten us...but first....tell us if your a Christian and your denomination ....If you are an atheist or agnostic or non-christian....please do not even waste my time.....
Yes I am an atheist. If that means I cannot know what your books say, so be it. I made several videos showing from your own books that you are allowed to lie, and you call it "theocratic war strategy." Sorry that my disbelief in your fairy tales nullifies your feigned ignorance of your own beliefs.
Exactly. Your books say you can lie, but that doesn't count because I don't believe in your fairy tales. Any excuse to not admit that you are allowed to lie.
Utukkuxul If one of your love ones were wanted for being an Atheists and the authorities found that out and tried to in prison them for that, I bet you would hide them out. Just to give you a better understanding what "theocratic war strategy" is. This was done during the Nazi concentration camp
And it still applies today to anything that the org feels would hurt its preaching work. The very definition of "lie" your org uses is "telling something that isn't true to someone that deserves to know the truth." By your definition, if you decide I am not "worthy" of the truth, you do not have to tell me the truth.
Your example is hypothetical that might not even really happened, I gave you a real life situation that has happened to JWs. Why wouldnt we tell you the truth about something? The only way that would occur is if a similar situation was to occur what I just described.
Actually Christian children wouldn't know they are saved until they were saved. Typically children are older kids before that happens... speaking from my experience only. I guess it could vary from church to church. I might have just been projecting my lack of fear onto others when I said I doubt most kids are afraid of hell. As a child I wasn't afraid. I don't know why.
I think I misspoke myself about Armageddon somewhat. Of course, you're right utukkuxul. JWs do live with the belief that Armageddon could be tomorrow.. It's a Jack in the Box theology that is always one note away from springing. However, from what I gather from talking to other ex JWs, the thing that causes the most stress is the isolation that JW kids feel. But I don't doubt that fear of Armageddon is real.
You're saved. Then Matthew 24:13 Philippians 2:12 and all the other scriptures having the same thought are meaningless to you. "Once saved, always saved." Wrong.
Very sad and so true, the depression rate of JW kids is so overwhelming. Mat God rest those souls of the children who have been emotionally damaged by this cult.
I use to like you 21cc21, I THOUGHT YOU WERE A FAIR-MINDED person. I can see that I was wrong.
Tell me 21cc21, how many incidents do you think we could find where children of Baptists, lutheran, pentecostal, Catholic, or any of the other hundreds of sects and denominations that make up your HELL-FIRE... "FLY or FRY" Satanic Christendom religions have killed themselves over the past 50 years???
Suicide is an epidemic among young people... But you choose to sensationalize!!!! Jerk!!!
I have heard of reports that suggests that JWs suffer from depression at a disproportionately high rate compared to non Witnesses. You could look into if you were so inclined. My personal experience is that JWs are afraid. However, I don't think it is so much the fear of Armageddon as it is the fear of having their friends and family turn their backs on you. Basically, they could have their whole world ripped from them. In a child's mind that is a very real fear. It's true for many adults too.
HaHa. Actually, I saw a video right here on youtube where someone interviewed a psychologist who made that claim. In fact, I've seen a number of videos making a similar claim. You don't have to take my word. Go listen to them yourself if you want. Either way, this is youtube not a court of law so I don't feel particularly constrained by the hear say law.
IT'S TIME THE GOV DO SOMETHING AGAINST THEM-AS THEY DID DURING WW2
Ni1234ckA 6 months ago
her man says she can choose what to believe well if she chooses to believe that jesus was just a man then according to john 3:36 she has no everlasting life so thats very irresponsible of a parent to let a 5 year old choose what to believe
JUMONGI2011 7 months ago
It was so sad to hear about those young boys doing that.They were going to the Kingdom Hall so they would not be destroyed, as we are taught from the bible. God saves those who are righteous and follow his teachings. Someone could have told them that they would die because their mother wasn't going, or their mother told them that they were her religion, and not their dads'.Regardless they were confused.I have never heard of any other case like this. In Noah's day 8 souls survived-ungodly didn't.
eternityandforever 8 months ago
So Sad!!!!
roxychabo 9 months ago
Put it this way....Would you let a kindergartener take a college course?
teddet87 9 months ago
I LIKE TURTLES
keroberos333 9 months ago
All the crazy satanic stuff the show on tv...are you kidding...thats mild compared to harry potter...i mean really this was something going on inside of the home not at the Kingdom Hall..the truth never killed anybody..if any thing the truth saves...Jehovah and Jesus Christ have already said that Jehovah's people will be objects of hatred..Its important that people get Acurrate knowledge of the truth..it will surely set you free.
momhalsmok 9 months ago
@momhalsmok you are out of your mind if you think teaching children that everyone dying at the end of this system who is not a Jehovah's Wittness is less damaging then Harry Potter! Have you ever even read Harry Potter? Or do you just believe everything you are told from the WT? Harry Potter is a work of FANTASY and children are very aware of that. Children are taught from THE KINGDOM HALL that anyone not preaching "THE TRUTH" will die as a REALITY. These children killed themselves for freedom
SixElacatloverr 8 months ago
@SixElacatloverr Please do more bible research because JW dont teach that...In Reve 7:9 reveals that there will be a GREAT CROWD that no man will be able to number. So you do agree that the Bible is A Reality...vs Harry being Fantasy...There are 7 million JW..so that clearly shows Jehovah will have mercy on those you dont know him and give them a chance to learn and live by his Righteous Standards
momhalsmok 8 months ago
@momhalsmok This is twisting my words. Your religion teaches that everyone, present day who does not convert and become a Jehovah's Wittness will die at the end of this system, which is rapidly approaching. Its great to send children off with that message and isolate them from their peers and leave them in constant fear of Satan. There are many religions in the world teaching a very similar message to your religion, it is not the only religion. Maybe you should do some research
SixElacatloverr 8 months ago
@spankMAbooTAY thank you for the kind words.
Punkninja12 1 year ago
This is simply another example of how The organization destoys lives & families.
October31st1517 1 year ago
so its Jehovah's fault. I feel sorry for them but we can't blame Jehovah..God is not the author of confusion.
peetyq314 1 year ago
Apparantly, this guy maybe just an associate. None the less, I feel very sorry for the mom's loss and how these boys were tricked...I hope the mother actually pulls her daughter out of there before its too late.
oliviaswarden 1 year ago
WTH??!! That's just wrong..first of all, why would this father continue going to the KH after this crock happened and taking his daughter?!! I got news for this guy-I am a bit surprised they actually held a memorial for the boys since they committed suicide. JW's do not believe in it and therefore shun it (of course everyone does but JW philosphy is if you commit suicide, you do not get to be resurrected into paradise, taking your own life=murder) and anyone that does do no receive a memorial.
oliviaswarden 1 year ago
There had to be more going on with those boys then that,
Obasiliasfilosofos 1 year ago
you poor woman. please take your children and get out. if not for yourself, for them!! You can start over, people will help. All you need to do is ask. Please, it's not your fault what happened to your boys, but for your other child's lives, please do something!
Hopefully yours-
onimah 1 year ago
why don't you post videos of the lives that 95% of TRUE jehovahs witnesses live.....they are so knowledgeable, not cowards in any way, and they live SO normally.
McNelly92 1 year ago
@McNelly92 I known many JW´s and they are fucking happy and have great lifes and amazing husbands...
DzVinci 1 year ago
that so fucked up.....and i dont mean those jws....
McNelly92 1 year ago
@ JW Publisher1..I concur.
phenique29 1 year ago
Next time you see information like this directed at your children, take a look at the Documentary "JESUS CAMP (2006)"
This is the eye opener as to what a true cult can do to your children.
Robin
nibornagrom 1 year ago
Well done 21crosscheck. Is there any wonder why 63% of Jehovah's Witness children leave the religion when they are adults? Too bad most of them were pushed into being baptized (using the fear of destruction at Armageddon as the tool to push them) prior to their leaving the Watchtower, resulting in the loss of their families for the rest of their lives.
jwpublisher1 1 year ago
I think this vid is a bit OTT...I mean if had a mother who looked like that i'd probably kill myself too.
VerySimplePerson 1 year ago
Comment removed
jwpublisher1 2 years ago
@jwpublisher1 Yea Satan is pretty powerful and does attack the children. I was raised a JW. left the truth for 20 years. Saw what was out there. learned what other faiths taught. and believe me. it is a sad, sad world. so i truly know the JW's have the truth, Yet as imperfect humans, mistakes are made.JW's are the closest ones ahering to the bible.
shihtzufizzers 1 year ago
@shihtzufizzers I don't think you understood my comment. The main reason 2/3 of children leave the JWs is because they don't buy into all of the fabricated doctrines, endless rules, and doctrinal flip-flops and inconsitencies that prove that this cannot be the "Only True Religion".
jwpublisher1 1 year ago
@jwpublisher1 No, I think they leave, because society pushes so much on them that is against what God wants. such as premarital sex. Satan has made sure that this is put in young ones faces all the time. It is very hard for a kids yes to stay in the truth, but many come back after they see that the so called rules are really a protection. There is nothing this world has to offer.
shihtzufizzers 1 year ago
This is a subject that has too long been overlooked. The children of JWs suffer from tremendous psychological stress, especially at school, where they are forced to stand out for their religion and not pledge to the flag, and do sports, etc. This subjects them to incredible ridicule, and they are made to look like fools to the rest of the kids. They become the targets of ridicule. This coupled with no birthdays, no Christmas, no nothing makes them feel inferior and worthless.
jwpublisher1 2 years ago
@jwpublisher1 cont from my other comment...some have left,they become addicted to drugs, Get STD's ect. Gods rules are a protection, even kids who are not JW don't always obey the rules and look at their consequences. I don't think you have looked at the numbers of children who return when they realize they made an error. some don't but many do.
shihtzufizzers 1 year ago
@shihtzufizzers If any return, it's because they can't stand the loss of their family, but they still have their doubts. They just have to keep their doubts inside from now on.
jwpublisher1 1 year ago
@jwpublisher1 We.. this is an answer that shows anger. I for one am one that returned and it was not for these weak reasons. Every one I know that has returned is because they KNOW it is the truth. If one returns for the reason you say, it is not from the heart therefore it wouldn't last. I have no doubts as do many others I know who left and came back. I think this is the best answer you could come up with. Loss of their family? My family was still there for me.
shihtzufizzers 1 year ago
@jwpublisher1 i am a jehovahs witness. and im 14 years old. i go to a public school, i have friends, and i greatly enjoy my life. i play soccer and basketball and love it. i have never been "ridiculed" for my religion. if your saying JW are the only people that get made fun of, your point is invalid. not every child fits, in regardless of their religion. you are not a JW child so how can you say they feel inferior & worthless if you've never been in their position?
3love0laugh0music3 1 month ago
@3love0laugh0music3 I'm glad to hear that you are doing good in school. Sounds like your parents are giving you some freedom in your religion. My remarks were from what I have seen with my own eyes from the children of JWs I know. I'm glad you are doing good. Please keep your eyes open and study the scriptures for yourself and not let the Watchtower tell you what to believe. I'm glad you are checking things out for yourself on the internet. JESUS is the key!
jwpublisher1 1 month ago
Sick fucking shit. Any religion that uses fear as a mind control technique is a cult. I hated how they never supported and free thinking.
Blair0687 2 years ago
@Blair0687 The JW do not use fear. they use the bible and teach what it says. there is nothing to fear. however, many other religions teach of a torment place you go when you die if you were bad in life. well everyone sins. But JW try to adhere to bible teachings and are repentant. They do not use God as a magic wand. So remember, there are three sides to every story. yours, thiers and the TRUTH. This guy is bitter and very one sided . take care
shihtzufizzers 1 year ago
I cant believe there are people actually defending this point of view. Just look at what our children are exposed outside of God's organization: drugs, violence, sex, not to mention what the catholics believe about a hell of eternal suffering. They teach no such thing exist and that Jehovah is a God of love... you should really inform themselves before spreading false teachings about something you dont even bother to research
nihonlova 2 years ago
@nihonlova Maybe you should do some research on your own religion from an outside source. Oh wait, your not supposed to do that...did you ever think that the fact that you are constantly defending the point of view of something without any outside knowledge shows that you are under a great deal of mind control? You are completely ignorant if you know nothing of the suffering children have been victim to under the hand of Jehovah's Wittnesses who preach Jehovah's love
SixElacatloverr 8 months ago
This is disgusting. Children are exempt from these things because they are innocent. I don't think that god would punish the children of this world for sin until they know it is in fact sin. Ive also been reading about what you guys are recently commenting on. I wish you would cite actual course instead of using a smart usurpers writings in place of the text of god. Alot of your JW text is adulterated compared to the original text. You should be ashamed instead of defending or comparing..
sethy1 2 years ago
I dont understand, I happen to follow the Jehovahs witness religion an when I was young and learned about armageddon I didn't get scared.....??? The poor kids though.
MissAdora10 2 years ago 5
*cricket sounds*
I have never seen this DY guy so quiet.....
Help4uNow 2 years ago
DY,
I would like to invite you to a discussion on my internet WorldWideChristians radio show.
I would send you a list of our questions and you can do the same. I will draft a layout for the show and schedule it. What do you say?
pbar1000 2 years ago
Wow that sounds like a great Idea. However DY remains very anonymous and I doubt that he would make such a public appearance or answer questions in "real time." But who knows, I will be interested in his answer.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
@21crosscheck21 SUICIDE?? Really, what was the cause of death? Whatever you thin caused this, what ever you think these kids were exposed to? Were they the ONLY two exposed to it? They were the ONLY two who diedm correct? And, if it was because of what they were exposed to, did anyone else that was exposed to it? also die, commit suicide? Amazing that a "christian" would use these tactics and lies, as you do. Death is tragic but you are horrible.
HolyRollerSpirit1 4 months ago
DY,
You went through all the trouble of cut and paste, collating, syncronizing and chronologically laying out this spam on Crosscheck.
For Jake25?
You are grasping at strawmen again and again, over and over. Jake is now one. How do you find the time? Are you in your teens or something?
Are you trying to test Brian into blocking you next? Because if I were him I would have blocked this rhetoric a long time ago and given others a chance to hold a meaningful dialogue here.
:))
pbar1000 2 years ago
pbar1000 Then I guess 21CC21 should block you because your comments are a bunch of "rhetoric" and YOU never "hold a meaningful dialogue" you just agree with peoples comments that you favor, and when put to the test YOU FAIL. You just agree just to agree but really dont know what you are agreeing about. One example is with the dialogue with me and epidome, you agreed with his false statement, then when you were put to the test you failed and just ran off.
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago
Hold off on your comments and think before you post another one. This time make it have meaning.
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago
DY should I alert your little buddy firehawk so he can make a video about your comments here.... they sound a bit like personal insults.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
21CC21, Jakev25 asked me to post the following conversation that he had with the Trish VanPilsum the reporter of this video since you blocked him:
Jakev25: Trish can you tell me what religion do you belong?
In a message dated 9/25/2009 3:16:43 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago 9
Interesting question. I wonder why you ask..... I am a Presbyterian. I belong to a theologically mainstream, socially progressive congregation. My church does a lot of ecumenical work and encourages much interfaith discussion. How about you?
Jakev25 writes:
I am a Jehovah Witness....Someone put one of your investigative reports on youtube about two kids that were in a JW family and committed suicide. They put it on youtube to discredit our faith.
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago 9
I guess kids in mainstream Christian sects aren't ever spooked about going to a Torturous Hell ....or get so engulfed in their religion that they bomb abortion offices... It really wasn't a fair investigative report......I was born and raised a JW and I never had any fear about dying at Armageddon. Trish VanPilsum: Interesting. I did that story sooo long ago. I cant believe its still floating around out there.
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago 9
As I recall the boys suicides had as much to do with family dynamics and the rigid way the family practiced their faith and with the religion itself.
But your note is a reminder of the lasting impact of my work and the importance of context and choosing my words carefully. Thanks for letting me know.
Trish
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago 10
Correct me if I'm wrong but don't all JWs in good standing pretty much practice their faith in the same manner? She sounds like a nice woman and very diplomatic too. I'm not sure her comment helps your position though.
Without exception, I like every JW that I know personally. Some of the JWs here seem to really believe the WT teaches the truth. Maybe that is why it bugs me that I can't get a straight answer that makes any sense out of any JW to simple direct questions about what JWs believe.
Catch22here 2 years ago
@DefendingYHWH No, they aren't. They are not bombarded with any graphic immages of hell, either.
jwpublisher1 1 year ago
@DefendingYHWH well i was also born and raised a JW and was constantly afraid dying at Armageddon. I was discouraged to attend collage or strive for any goals in life which eventually led me to manic depression, hyper anxiety and two suicide attempts. JWs destroyed my childhood by isolating me from other children my age and bombarding me with shame and guilt about feeling what most all people feel growing up. Anyone raising their kids in this cult ought to have there kids taken from them.
Punkninja12 1 year ago
What exactly are you posting here, if you don't mind my asking.
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE 2 years ago 2
Jakev25 asked me to post a conversation through e-mail that he had with the reporter of this video. He said 21cc21 blocked him. I was just posting what he requested.
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago
Incorrect.
JWinCT 2 years ago
Right, so not a single man responsible for translating the NWT was qualified? If confirmed by the WT, I'm sure that would give JWs pause to rethink the accuracy of their Bible. Of course, that won't happen because the watchtower will not officially confirm those names.
Catch22here 2 years ago
again deleted....
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
Does anyone know who produced this video?...I think she says "For Dementia I'm so and so"
I hope 21 just didn't post this video without checking out who produced it.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Jake,,,, lol.... don't you read a bible and magazines every week without knowing the credentials of those who actually wrote it? Suddenly your interested in credentials?
Tell me, what credentials do you need to conduct an interview?
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
21...What I read comes from the WBTS of PA....But i assumed you knew that.....Please just let me know who produced this video. You did check before posting didn't you?
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Jake what you read is written by anonymous people with credentials that cannot be verified. You base you entire faith on a bible and literature were the ultimate source is hidden in secrecy.
Your question exposes you double standard and is very hypocritical for obvious reasons. If you really want to know who conducted the interview it says so right in the clip.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
21 Everything is edited by the Governing body before it is published. Now I don't care who the reporter of the story is....I want to know who produced it.
I don't think that is an outrageous request. The WBTS produces all of our literature.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Please tell me there is nothing to hide 21.
Surely there were credentials at the begining or end of that video that you chopped off.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Jake... the translators... oops... I mean producers are very humble and have asked to stay anonymous because of their extreme humility.
Tell me Jake... what does the WT have to hide... why can't we know who actually writes the literature?
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
It doesn't matter who writes it 21. Jesus disciples were mere fisherman...not college educated theologians.
I know we do not agree on much 21...But I have never lied to you...nor been deceitful.
Are you going to stand by your video or are you going to be deceitful?
JAKEV25 2 years ago 2
So the names and credentials of the men who wrote the NWT are not important but the names of the producer(s) of this little youtube video clip, you just have to know?
Catch22here 2 years ago
Catch...the publisher of the NWT is the WBTS of Penn. Who translated it is unimportant to me...accuracy is. They did a fantastic job of translation.
In any event...I found out for myself and we are now in contact via email.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
JAKEV25,
My question is who translated the NWT? I believe there were five men rumored to have had a part in the translation. I have heard unofficial reports but, to my knowledge, the names of the translators has never been officially released. I would like to check out their credentials.
Catch22here 2 years ago
Hey Catch... Jake will do what all jws seem to do. He will dig for dirt on the producers and they say they should not be believed because of X or Y.
But..
He will continue to read and trust the WT no matter who their sources are.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
Not nice ......I happened to research the reporter she is well respected...In fact we are emailing back and forth...By the way...she isn't Born Again...
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Jake whether her report was well done or not has nothing to do whether or not she is born again.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
21...who are you arguing with?...Did I say it did?...It was just a fact....I already said she had excellent credentials...what else do you want from me? You just like to argue.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
also this is very hypocritical of you 21...none of you have a good word for Jason BeDuhn
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Yeah, I don't understand why the WT couldn't just tell us who 'translated' the NWT. As you know, there are distinct differences between the NWT and other translations. Since most of us do not understand Greek, it would be of great benefit if the credentials of the NWT translators could be verified to help remove doubt that they were just wrong. Other well known experts, whose credentials I can check, are on record as saying that the NWT is a very poor translation.
Catch22here 2 years ago
Not sure..Why don't you contact the Brooklyn office and ask them...
Also in his book..."Truth in Translation" Jason BeDuhn states that that the NWT is superior in accuracy than most bibles used today...I will send you his credentials..
JAKEV25 2 years ago 5
Still awaiting an apology for this comment 21......
JAKEV25 2 years ago
"""I know we do not agree on much 21...But I have never lied to you...nor been deceitful.""" Jake you have posted lies about me on other videos saying that I follow Benny Hinn....
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
21..not true..I say you are in the same movement...Bornagainism..
Remember you are to separate yourself from the world...
JAKEV25 2 years ago
"""Bornagainism""" is neither a religion or a movement Jake.... it's not even a word... but I have been through that with you...
You tried to spread a knowingly false rumor an brought reproach to you faith in doing so.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
hhmmm...Maybe not to those inside the movement....but to us outside it is.....
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Au Contraire Pierre...I stated that your and Bennie Hinn's doctrine is the same. I then asked you to name several doctrines that his ministry differs from yours.....the best you can do is tell me that his ministry makes a lot more money..but has the same doctrine.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Jake you continue to lie... You asked and I said he was a word faith teacher.... VERY different Doctrine and God.
However you already know all that because I have already told you.... and you continue to lie about it. Very sad my friend....
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
So it's your religion explain the difference between your Born Again Church and Bennie Hinn..We JW don't know what word faith teacher is......
More importantly ...give us the beef...What are the major doctrinal differences?...Does he teach eternal torment?....Trinity?....Eternal Soul?....The Rapture?....Bornagainism?
JAKEV25 2 years ago 2
Jake if you don't Know what word faith is why would you say we share the same faith?
Shouldn't you have researched that FIRST! Is you defense that you lied in ignorance?
And you said "I follow Benny Hinn." an outright lie.... you even said that after I called him a heretic.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
Sorry 21 I usually put all Born Againers in the same class...So go ahead what's the difference?
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Jake I have no interest in spending time pointing out to you Benny Hinns theological problems....
Go watch a few of his sermons or some videos if you are interested in him....
Also... as a false prophet and false teacher and thief he is a wolf in sheep's clothing... his statement of faith is meaningless to me, if you want to know what he REALLY teaches go watch him.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
21..Come on...Help us out here to understand better. Do people speak in tongues in your church..Are they healed? Is a collection plate passed around? I mean you call Bennie a false prophet but you also call the WBTS a false prophet. We really need to know exactly the things that differentiate your church from all the false ones.
Do you guys teach Eternal Torment?...Eternal Soul? Hellfire Dogma? What do YOU guys teach that is different from Bennie Hinn?
JAKEV25 2 years ago 4
JAKEV25,
I have a radical thought. Why doesn't each man just speak for himself? Personally, I have never even heard of Hinn. I certainly wouldn't allow myself to pushed into trying to explain what that guy believes. If you want to know, then go listen and learn if you are curious. I don't speak for anyone else and I don't expect anyone else to either. So if you can bait Crosscheck into allowing you to redirect the conversation then so be it. In the meanwhile, I'm still waiting for answers
Catch22here 2 years ago
Jake if you can give me a reason that any of this is relevant I will tell you what separates me from Hinn,
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
about 10,000 miles?
That would be it!
JWinCT 2 years ago
#1 We on the outside of the Born again Movement lump you all together. we thought that you all had the same basic false doctrines of Trinity, Eternal Soul, Hellfire, General Rapture, etc etc.
So let's make some headway...What are the doctrinal differences that separate TBN Preachers from your church....
Also...Are those followers of Bennie Hinn Saved even though you claim he is a false prophet.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
#2 You spend so much time persecuting the JW but when I turn the tables you claim I'm a liar and refuse to answer.
Honestly how many JW kids have committed suicide because they were taught about Armageddon. You make it sound like a daily occurance. That we are traumatizing our young members.
Then you accuse me of impropriety because I want to know who produced such nonsense.
JAKEV25 2 years ago 6
"""Honestly how many JW kids have committed suicide because they were taught about Armageddon. You make it sound like a daily occurance""""
Again... another gross exaggeration.... please provide evidence that I have done this.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
Come on 21...that's exactly your ploy....You don't think JW's should teach their childern bible truths because they might consider suicide....
You know that is the truth...Stop lying.
JAKEV25 2 years ago 2
No Jake.... what I suggested is that they be taught age appropriate material....
You want to call me a liar.... fine... present some evidence.... otherwise take it elsewhere.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
You are nothing but a two bit liar 21...Your entire ministry is centered on destroying the JW faith...This is just a small slice of the pie...
JAKEV25 2 years ago 9
Jake... I gave you a number of chances to back your claims up or stop making these comments.... I am tired of dealing with you... your blocked
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
"""We on the outside of the Born again Movement lump you all together."""
Jake your willful and purposeful ignorance is not is not my problem... If you want to be deceitful and lump all your fictional "bornagainers" together that is your business... however my videos will not be the forum for you will spread these myths and if I see deceitful comments they will be deleted.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
So again..Give me doctrines that are different.....Don't give me different METHODS of the same doctrine. Are there healings in your church? Do people speak in tongues? Are your young members encouraged to enlist in the military? Do you celebrate pagan holidays? Does your church get into politics? Do people get "drunk with the Holy Spirit" and convulse at your church?
Include differences in the teachings of the trinity, eternal soul, Hellfire and the General rapture of the church.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Jake I think you already know the answer to all those questions....
Does Benny Hinn believe in a few of the same things I believe in.... of course.... so does the WT. Satan always uses a bit of truth to deceive.
The problem you have is you view Christians only by what you have been taught by the WT.... mostly lies and exaggerations..... very demonic.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
Deleted that comment Jake..... once again more lies and gross exaggerations.... if you have an intelligent point you are free to post.... otherwise you are not.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
I have asked one of Bennie's church members to join the converstion. I hope he will.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Let me ask you this 21.....Are Bennie's church members saved?
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Let me ask you Jake... the 144000 claim to be born again.... so the must be bornagainers too....
Your fake movement Just grew>>>
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
Brian,
what do people, R yourself mean by "organization" when talking about Jehovah's Witnesses? I need to sort that out.
Robin
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE 2 years ago
Hi Robin,
The "organization" usually refers to the leadership of the WT... at other times all JWS would be included but most, (including the organization) don't use the word that way very often.
I
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
Hey, Ok.
Let 's put it this way.
U understand the Watchtower Societies of NY and PA are legal entities.
These don't represent Jehovah's Witnesses individually, but are controlled by the Governing Body (The Boys from Brooklyn) for printing & legal purposes.
When the literature or the Societies representatives, or individuals say "the org.", they mean God's Theocratic government in heaven, represented on earth by the "faithful steward" as Jesus' representatives, "ambassadors for Christ."
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE 2 years ago
So,
I didn't think that U r anyone else outside of JWs understood what "the organization" really is to individual Jehovah's Witnesses. We are never taught & neither are our children that they should revere(respect, yes)an earthly organization. If a child is learning Christianity & about God's Theocratic org. it will be imperative that they learn all the lessons of that org. on an "age appropriate basis". That describes Jehovah's Witnesses. Unless U have privileged info I'm not aware of.
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE 2 years ago
That's interesting TRUTHINTHEBIBLE. Thank you for bringing that up here. It just so happens that is yet another thing about which I would like to have a clear understanding. Can you expand on that a little more. I want to understand the organizational structure better. Jehovah is the head of the org. I assume Jesus/Michael is directly under him followed by the lower angels?Sound right? If they are all in heaven, how then can men accurately represent them?
Catch22here 2 years ago
I'm just trying to understand what you believe. I am not saying I agree with it.
Catch22here 2 years ago
At one point the speaker in the video spoke of the boys feeling isolated. Would anyone like to speak to that? Can JW kids have friendships with their classmates who are not JWs ("worldly people")? Many of the things that make JW kids seem different to their peers seem made up to me. Things like not celebrating birthdays, not saluting the flag, ...etc. However, putting that aside I want to know whether friendships with non JWs in and of themselves are discouraged? If so, why?
Catch22here 2 years ago
1 Corinthians 15:33, my man.
JWinCT 2 years ago
"Do not be misled. Bad associations spoil useful habits."
JWinCT 2 years ago
Right, so you are saying that all 'worldly people' are bad associations then?
Catch22here 2 years ago
I'll say that. Yes, they are. Until they put on the "new personality". You don't get a dirty car clean by rubbing your new white suit all over it. Your suit gets dirty.
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE 2 years ago
Wow, how boring your conversations must be! Some of the conversations that I enjoy the most are with people who don't agree with me and challenge me in some way. You seem to be saying that you really only want to know and talk to people who think like you do. It almost sounds like you don't ever have a real conversation about anything non WT related with non JWs. It's almost as if you are saying that you shut off part of your mind when talking to them. Sounds kind of small.
Catch22here 2 years ago
You probably know that is not at all what I am talking about. Jesus and Paul both made it clear that we must live in the world, but not be a part of it. We preach in it but do not submit to it. We love those to whom we preach, but do not embrace their ways.
What I find boring are the veiled predictable YouTube attacks I receive.
I've learned you can't do much good here.
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE 2 years ago
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE wrote: "We love those to whom we preach,..."
Of that I have no doubt.
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE wrote: "What I find boring are the veiled predictable YouTube attacks I receive."
I didn't realize you were sensitive. In that case, I'll just say that there are many of your beliefs which do not make any sense to me. I'll try to refrain from making any further observations and just stick to questions which I would like to have answered.
Catch22here 2 years ago
So associations with 'worldly' people are bad but I am wrong in suggesting that you are uncomfortable with talking to non JWs about things not related to your preaching work because that is "not at all what you are talking about"? You tell me then, what is it about associating with non JWs that is objectionable if it is not the conversations? Is it that you think all 'worldly' people run around doing things like getting drunk and you just don't want to be in their presence?
Catch22here 2 years ago
concerned for what? ... that I will end up frying in flames for eternity. NO worries my friend, I went to the local fire station and got me the latest state of the art fire proof suit. Bring it on!!!!
littleamigos 2 years ago
Concerned that you are following a false prophet and have accepted a false, works based gospel that cannot save you.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
If I had the money, I would ship you a lifetime supply of Pepto Bismol, just to sooth your chronic case of "JW IBS".
Seriously... you are OBSESSED! It's painfully obvious that your jealousy and envy is consuming you.
Now... go ahead and attack my Christian character, because you can't look in the mirror and admit to what you have become.
littleamigos 2 years ago 2
I agree with you. It's usually things siad that are wrong about Jehovah's Witnesses. OUr children know what the bible teaches. It is not frightening at all, It gives children a future and a hope
unlimiteduse1 2 years ago
Watch the video again my friend... I have done nothing of the kind.
21crosscheck21 2 years ago
Who produced this video 21...I think they say at the very end but I did not catch it....
JAKEV25 2 years ago
and if you do not heed the word of God, then you must be ready to tackle the consequences. I see nothing wrong in what the Witnesses do.
GUEROMEXICANO831 2 years ago
So the JW's are what? Supposed to tell us all that if you are evil and do not have fear for God you will be ok? That if you are a murderer, a thief, a corrupt politician who enslaves the world you still go to heaven? Then abolish the death penalty! Abolish imprisonment! BEsides, who are we as humans to judge?? what i see is the JW's are preaching the Bible the way its written and if you think the Bible is a fairy tale book full of chocolates and rainbows youre wrong. It speaks of destruction
GUEROMEXICANO831 2 years ago
21 your videos are getting more and more desperate. And I will be here to refute each one. This is my testimony: I grew up as a JW and I never had any problems. I came from a very loving home and I was not worried about being destroyed at Armegeddon. I didn't go to "Sunday School" and paint pictures ...we sat with the adults and learned the truth about Jehovah and the future. I guess the Parents in Noah's day should have been more like the JW today..perhaps many more would have survived...
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Funny how 21 never remarks on the Born Again Christians that have been so brainwashed by their ministries that they go out and bomb abortion sites....
JAKEV25 2 years ago 2
Until you stop preaching hellfire,to lambast ANYONE for preaching armageddon is unjustified and absurd.
howdytheresir 2 years ago
It's beside the point if this would hurt kids or not if someone criricizing it actually preaches hell.Examine yourself.Extract he rafter first.
howdytheresir 2 years ago
2.You preach HELLFIRE for heaven's sake.Talk about traumatic!
So if you've ever mentioned hell to your kids,I've no idea why you have the guts to post something like this.
howdytheresir 2 years ago
I wouldn't have posted this for 2 reasons
1.You have NO idea what killed these boys so it isn't justified for you to speculate so assuredly as if this is fact
howdytheresir 2 years ago
I hate to defend JW's, and that isn't my intention here, but mainstream Christians aren't any better. They fill their kids' heads up with stories and images of how they will burn for an eternity in Hell if they don't believe, so who are they to accuse JWs of filling their kids' heads up with images of destruction if THEY don't believe? I'd rather be destroyed forever than spend eternity in Hell. There are people who go into years of therapy due to their fear of a nonexistent torture chamber.
utukkuxul 2 years ago
Yeah utukkuxul, that is very true. I was talking to a friend earlier who made a similar point. I guess people's experience can vary but I can tell you that as a child I was taught about hell. However, I will say that as a child I don't recall seeing any images... other than the ones I created in my mind. In my opinion, I doubt most kids see either Armageddon or hell (depending on what they are taught) as a particularly imminent threat. Idk, when I was young I thought I would live forever anyway.
Catch22here 2 years ago
One of the things that gets me about this video is how the mother of the two boys was treated. She said they treated her as if it was somehow her fault because she left the organization. That doesn't sound like a very loving, compassionate attitude to me.
Catch22here 2 years ago
I agree about the treatment of the mother. I know the JWs to be extremely judgmental and quick to blame.
utukkuxul 2 years ago 2
Sounds more like you are judgmental...
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Yeah, I am judgmental of an organization that I've watched consistently lie, judge and hate others, contradict itself, and ruin lives. What's your point?
utukkuxul 2 years ago 3
utukkuxul How about an organization that refuses to kill their neighbors, you never see racism among their communities, always helping out their brothers and sisters when in need, help peoples lives to better themselves. This sounds like the Jehovahs Witnesses. What other organization has this?
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago
The fact that your organization is pacifistic and non-racist doesn't change the fact that you are liars. As for helping our your brothers and sisters... LOL. Yeah right.
utukkuxul 2 years ago
utukkuxul A bunch of talk with no proof. Come on you can do better than that. What else do you have?
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago
I don't know. The JWs pound into their kids' heads that Armageddon is going to happen tomorrow. I know I always expected the fireworks to start at any moment. I can't say how scared most kids are of Hell since I wasn't taught it was real, but from what I've heard from people who were taught of it, they seemed to indicate they were pretty terrified.
Both sides here are basically accusing the other of scaring their kids and asking each for peer-reviewed reports and obituaries. Both are crazy.
utukkuxul 2 years ago
I will say, though, most believers in Hell, including children, do not think they are going there. They "know" they are saved and Heaven-bound. The JWs, on the other hand, go their whole life not knowing if they've been saved, and being scared that they haven't "done enough" to warrant salvation. So in that way, their Armageddon is more frightening than Hell.
utukkuxul 2 years ago
I can't speak for most kids,but I for one was TRAUMATIZED by hell!I thought I was going there because I didn't understand it and couldn't honestly love a God who made it.I prayed a LOT for understanding and he gave it to me.The wicked shall perish.God is just.
howdytheresir 2 years ago
The JW do not believe that you can do works for salvation...Your comments are mute.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
How's that Theocratic War Strategy working for you?
utukkuxul 2 years ago 2
Have no idea of what you speak...
JAKEV25 2 years ago
lol, of course you don't.
utukkuxul 2 years ago
..Why don't you enlighten us...but first....tell us if your a Christian and your denomination ....If you are an atheist or agnostic or non-christian....please do not even waste my time.....
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Yes I am an atheist. If that means I cannot know what your books say, so be it. I made several videos showing from your own books that you are allowed to lie, and you call it "theocratic war strategy." Sorry that my disbelief in your fairy tales nullifies your feigned ignorance of your own beliefs.
utukkuxul 2 years ago
Sorry I must have missed those were they up for an academy award or something?....
I will not debate or engage aetheist...If God has given up on you....who am I to think I can help? Romans chapter 1.
Look Try to find it in your heart to forgive the WBTS for insisting that you be an upright and moral person.
Time to move on.....
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Exactly. Your books say you can lie, but that doesn't count because I don't believe in your fairy tales. Any excuse to not admit that you are allowed to lie.
utukkuxul 2 years ago
UTU......LISTEN..I don't debate atheist....NO EXCEPTIONS. I don't believe in your religion.
JAKEV25 2 years ago
It's not a religion you idiot.
Keep lying for Jehovah just like your Watchtower Babble and Crap publications tell you to :)
utukkuxul 2 years ago
It is a religion and it requires far more faith than most religions. ..And by the way it is not a new religion..Romans chapter 1
JAKEV25 2 years ago
Utukkuxul If one of your love ones were wanted for being an Atheists and the authorities found that out and tried to in prison them for that, I bet you would hide them out. Just to give you a better understanding what "theocratic war strategy" is. This was done during the Nazi concentration camp
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago
And it still applies today to anything that the org feels would hurt its preaching work. The very definition of "lie" your org uses is "telling something that isn't true to someone that deserves to know the truth." By your definition, if you decide I am not "worthy" of the truth, you do not have to tell me the truth.
utukkuxul 2 years ago
Your example is hypothetical that might not even really happened, I gave you a real life situation that has happened to JWs. Why wouldnt we tell you the truth about something? The only way that would occur is if a similar situation was to occur what I just described.
DefendingYHWH 2 years ago
Actually Christian children wouldn't know they are saved until they were saved. Typically children are older kids before that happens... speaking from my experience only. I guess it could vary from church to church. I might have just been projecting my lack of fear onto others when I said I doubt most kids are afraid of hell. As a child I wasn't afraid. I don't know why.
Catch22here 2 years ago
I think I misspoke myself about Armageddon somewhat. Of course, you're right utukkuxul. JWs do live with the belief that Armageddon could be tomorrow.. It's a Jack in the Box theology that is always one note away from springing. However, from what I gather from talking to other ex JWs, the thing that causes the most stress is the isolation that JW kids feel. But I don't doubt that fear of Armageddon is real.
Catch22here 2 years ago
This video depicts the tip of the iceburg of the darkness of the WT.
It is the largest of the devestating cults and thousands of souls are eternally lost as a result.
But some get saved. Tha is a good thing.
Let's pray that the family in the video brings Christ into the home, and shows the door to the spirit of the anti-Christ.
Help4uNow 2 years ago
You're saved. Then Matthew 24:13 Philippians 2:12 and all the other scriptures having the same thought are meaningless to you. "Once saved, always saved." Wrong.
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE 2 years ago
Very sad and so true, the depression rate of JW kids is so overwhelming. Mat God rest those souls of the children who have been emotionally damaged by this cult.
PwrOfChristInMe 2 years ago
Some lawyer needs to get in touch with this woman> She should sue the Church for damages, get a divorce and get full custody.
Lodger72 2 years ago
I use to like you 21cc21, I THOUGHT YOU WERE A FAIR-MINDED person. I can see that I was wrong.
Tell me 21cc21, how many incidents do you think we could find where children of Baptists, lutheran, pentecostal, Catholic, or any of the other hundreds of sects and denominations that make up your HELL-FIRE... "FLY or FRY" Satanic Christendom religions have killed themselves over the past 50 years???
Suicide is an epidemic among young people... But you choose to sensationalize!!!! Jerk!!!
BloodySunday1905 2 years ago
I have heard of reports that suggests that JWs suffer from depression at a disproportionately high rate compared to non Witnesses. You could look into if you were so inclined. My personal experience is that JWs are afraid. However, I don't think it is so much the fear of Armageddon as it is the fear of having their friends and family turn their backs on you. Basically, they could have their whole world ripped from them. In a child's mind that is a very real fear. It's true for many adults too.
Catch22here 2 years ago
Hear-say. I'm glad you bring the concrete of most arguments about Jehovah's Witnesses into focus.
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE 2 years ago
HaHa. Actually, I saw a video right here on youtube where someone interviewed a psychologist who made that claim. In fact, I've seen a number of videos making a similar claim. You don't have to take my word. Go listen to them yourself if you want. Either way, this is youtube not a court of law so I don't feel particularly constrained by the hear say law.
Catch22here 2 years ago
Conveniently making broad statements with evidence from YouTube to back it up. You are in a catch22here.
TRUTHINTHEBIBLE 2 years ago