As someone who workes in the Dutch health care system I am interested what delusional idiot thinks that the current US health care system is anything like the Dutch health care system.. Can anyone tell me where I can find that comment????
no that is not what I mean.. I am talking about the guy who told you that the current, pre-reform US health care system is like the dutch system.. I know.. All politics is messed up.. But american politics is really is number one at that.. I can see why so many americans distrusted their goverment...
no socisty is totally capitalistic or comunistic and the ntherlands today is a mix of pro market policy and a rather genrous welfare state..the index of econmic freedom ranks the netherlands the 12 th freest economy in the world
the problkem here is both parties are weak. The right is filled with people who believe in the lies of the insurance comapnies. The left is full of people filled with people like obama who are happy to take pay offs from the insurance comanies and big pharma. Obama is weak. He could just say hey we are voting on it right now and all dems vote on the bill.Who carees about the republicans. The problem is he caves to the insurance lobbiest. Obama is comprimising on everything he is as weak as bush
Another fallacy is our founding fathers mandated unfettered capitalism, and that democracy is exclusive of socialism. Actually they are complimentary and many of our European friends do operate democratic socialist governments. During the soviet era the USSR never really practiced socialism/communism they were really just fascist dictatorships using socialism as camouflage. And at the same time there are many popular/successful socialistic programs in the US. Public schools is a good example!
the founding fathers on many instances.Spoke on the need for a freemarket econmy based on capitalism. China is now adapting capitalism look at them and look at us. Thomas jefferson said "The policy of the American government is to leave their citizens free, neither restraining nor aiding them in their pursuits. "
Our capitalism is what won both ww2 and the cold war. If ussr had adaped capitalism they would have been a far greater threat. China knows this this is why they are growing.
We need roads, schools, a justice system, military, civil infrastructure that is the foundation for society that rewards innovation and entrepreneurism, a society that protect liberty and freedom. The problem is that some of the rhetoric conveniently overlooks the cost of these things. In this vain Reagan also said that government is not the solution, it is the problem, but in the end we still need government... You get what you pay for. The US has the lowest tax base of industrialized countrys
The rhetoric of small government is lunacy, as government is essential to a free, prosperous society. So what is wrong with expecting the richest people, who benefit the most from society to pay a bigger share? During the Clinton years the tax rate on the rich was raised and that was the most prosperous time in the last 28 years. W comes in and cuts the tax on the rich and another thing we need government to do is protect the citizens from the misdeeds of big business.
An argument against government is the federal gov exerts undo control at the state/local level... there are some places that want to put prayer in school, violating the separation of church and state, but are blocked by federal oversight. Funny these same folks scream when a locality passes gay marriage; they want to pass a constitutional amendment to ban it. People loose sight of the fact that our government is a modified republic. That means that we are vote, but majority doesnt always rule.
This government is organized so that a majority cant pass legislation, like school prayer, that violates other peoples rights. You see the founding fathers actually anticipated that there could be instances where some religions would try to impose themselves upon a populace via government intervention how smart these guys were.
We do not need a big national goverment. The government should only have the objective of protecting the country. The rest of these projects you speak of belong to the state and local governments. The reason our governments were setup the way it is to keep the government from ruling its people. both bush and obama are abusing their power.
I would also point out the reason why we prospered during the 90s is the tech boom.Business make alot of money they create alot of jobs.
Repubs try to deregulate so that the rich can get richer, but do you really trust a businessman to do what is best for society, for the citizens? Do the rich really spend their money to enrich society?
If we systematically kill everyone now we won't have to worry about health care reform.
Then we can fill those libatard FEMA coffins like they like to claim.
Let's fill those quotas from the secret pinkos behind closed door somewhere planning to summit with the 12 galaxies with Frank Chu and HowtheworldDOESNTwork with Libatards who lead them first.
Could we just set the tax rate be our age and thus guarantee that everyone would be depressed to death before they got old enough to need any substantial health care?
That might be the next conspiracy. As for the present day old, they only need to look at the young to be depressed enough to want to die. Some die younger because they want to.
setting a tax rate is wrong giving a tax break on their health care premiums is better. So they can choose for themselves what medical care they want or need supported by their own taxes they get back.
I cannot afford to have a hernia or get cancer or require heart bypass surgery or any number of other serious conditions that actually happen to people.
My suggestion is to tax the black market in order to retire our debt, to create a universal transactor to enable the field of medicine to shift its focus to prevention and allow us to fund it fairly, and to use the business revenue and carbon tax to fund an income stream for every American that replaces the present entitlement programs. I explain it all in a dozen or so blogs posts. But the organizing principle behind those interconnected suggestions is to give us the info we need to be wiser.
I wouldn't take anything Reagan said about spending too seriously because I believe a persons actions are a better indicator of what they actually do believe.
No one want to be a thief, Warren Buffet wrote an essay in the WSJ to complain about the injustice of the Bush tax cuts. It would be a lot easier to enjoy ones wealth if you knew it did not come at anyone else's expense. I disagree it's a hatred for wealth--it's a hatred for theft: the heads-we-win tails-you-lose philosophy we live by.
i dont nessicarily agree with reagan but it doesnt mean the words are no less untrue.
The problem here is the left has created this idea the rich got that way by stealing it. Warren buffet is a perfect examplehe is rich because he worked for it not because he stole it from someone. There is also an inherent problem when we want to make everyone rich or everyone poor. If everyone has the same income level. Then there is no innovation or entrepreneurship. To creat advances in business.
Everyone should share an equal part of what our nation earns from the businesses it operates--like selling the right to pollute. Not because it helps the poor, because it is the only way to create a fair marketplace--to implement actual capitalism as you suggest. The income such an approach generated would be less than $1000/yr. The point is that it really does belong to each of us. Without such a mechanism a baby is paying $1000/yr just for existing.
i like your premise of more suggestions to be wiser. The key here is options. Just like now the democrats are arguing there is only one option is directly dishonest. It would be better to have a debate on all the options then we all can agree togethor what is the best to go with.
I disagree on one point about entitlements. i will give you a quote
"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. " Thomas Jefferson
Exactly what my suggestions are designed to do--end them by replacing them with what is presently being taken away from people now without redress--the integrity of their environment, the income generated by their lands, airwaves, and resources. Turning those revenue sources into an income stream we each own a share of is stopping a transfer of wealth, not creating one. As things are now, they are hidden taxes on the very poorest of us to fund the activities of the very wealthiest.
i like your general idea. There is a problem the democrats and republicans have created. When we as a culture villify the wealthy because of their wealth. The same way it is wrong to penalize people for being poor. It is inherently wrong to penalize people who succeed. In the end generally wealthy people own business which create jobs. If you take out the wealthy then you also loose the businesses and the jobs. Alaska already has a profit sharing policy in place in their oil reserves.
All of the proposed health care solutions look doomed to fail for precisely the same reason: not one of them makes any attempt to connect the price we pay for the choices we make in life to the true cost those choices impose on everyone. This situation creates a selective pressure that favors behavior that best exploits the inequities of our system rather than compel us to act wisely. Preventative medicine cannot grow in an environment that selects against it. I see a very different fix for it.
how can you say the 3 fixes i proposed would impose choices on everyone it is built on the fact it would give you more options not less because someone is not forcing you to have them like a government.
I was talking about the proposals being considered by congress. Sorry if I accidently replied to you instead of using the correct button.
A tax break won't help the folks who just can't afford it at any price. For most people HC rates below entertainment in importance until they need it. You don't address that problem. A private insurance model takes money out of HC by using a HC dollar to buy things that cannot render HC, like insurance executives, brokers, etc. 3: easy to say, hard to do.
i disagree with you here people who cant afford healthcare can afford it through taxes. Think about it take a part of the taxes they pay anyway on their paychecks whatever their health are costs you deduct the total on your tax return. The only reason you wont get it back on your taxes is if you dont pay taxes. If you dont pay taxes then you really shouldnt be asking the government to help you with your health care
i was saying that take the money your sending to the government anyway in taxes why not use that money to buy health care? Why is it you thus are now responsible to use the money you would beable to keep for youw own rather then send it to the government to give me health care.
I think we both agree that a free enterprise system is the best technology we have for evolving ingenious solutions to the problems we face. But it's a difficult technology to deploy when you're trying to build an industry intended to put itself out of business. Yet that is exactly what an effective HC industry would tend to do; create less opportunities to deliver HC by effectively preventing the need of it.. We are, after all, designed to maintain ourselves. A different approach is needed.
in a free enterprise system competition is a wonderful thing. The market can and will fix itseelf when you allow more compitition. People buy the products people believe are both good quality and servicce. If you dont provide these you tend to loose business as any other business would. Now changing away from the free market system to a system with no competition only hurts the system. Im in the healthcare industry I have not meet a single doctor that in anyway aproves of a public option.
"The policy of the American government is to leave their citizens free, neither restraining nor aiding them in their pursuits. " Thomas Jefferson
"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. " Thomas Jefferson
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them. " Thomas Jefferson
We must not allow a precedent to be set where being critical of the president is automatically racist. Being critical of our government even if they are wrong is the basis of our democracy. if this is to change it will be a disaster regardless if obama turns out to be the a great american president or the terrible.
This issue of racism needs to be stop being brought up on both sides.
I agree. I also agree with Obama' plan with healthcare. Many of the things I hear regarding Canadian health is complete bullshit. How fast you get things such as an MRI depends on how serious it is. You can get one same day. I got an MRI, 2 EEGs and saw a neurologist in a span of 3 weeks. I have a Family doctor that I can see same day if it's serious or with a few days if it's a check up. Medicine does not cost me an arm and a leg.
and about 2 year ago I accidentally gashed my hand open when I moved. it was about 3" long and to the bone. I went to the ER. got it stitched bandaged and got a tetanus shot with 30mins. I have no idea were some Americans are getting this idea of many hours in the waiting room and month for an MRI.
democrats have this idea ok our healthcare system needs reform lets just scrap the whole thing in favor of a government system. Address its problems. I myself could totally reform health care on 3 points.
1 Give everyone paying taxes a break on their health care premiums.
2 Allow insurance companies to insurace across state lines.
3 fix medical malpractice law.
these 3 things i guarantee will do exactly what the system needs presently. None of these are even discussed.
It really is funny the way Americans see the rest of the world. I'm from the UK and I have family that live in the Netherlands. The Netherlands is a much more socialist country in both politics and public behavior than the UK is. But according to some of the American commentators I've heard the UK is apparently a communist utopia :-P, while the Netherlands it seems is the way to go.
well said boxant i consider myself an atheist libertarian it simply amazes my how everyone wants more government involvement even though im pretty sure no government anywhere has done anything anywhere except oppress people
i didnt say i was oppressed but it is the typical nature of the world. Government is driven by those who want power. Corruption and greed is its product.
of course i believe their is corruption in the current healthcare system. Do you realize the level of corruption and greed in our current goverment? There are ways to reform healthcare with out government control. These arnt even posed as an option. Do you really believe the same people who run the department of motor vehicles and the post office to also run healthcare?
You have to agree the government is only effcient in taking your money.
Personally, I think we should take it back to wild west and Gangster days when you could shoot a man with no government intervention...but thats just me.:)
There is right now, more regulation of our healthcare system from the AMA than from the government.
And that, to a large extent, is why cost is skyrocketing. They and the drug companies are willing to pay our politicians to keep it that way.
The problem is that there is regulation im equally against the AMA. I think obama could have done a far better job presenting his health care. Im not a republican but why is a large group of americans being called rasict becuse of a differing politcal view? Do i inherently agree with them no. The insurance companies are also a problem but having government involvement is a worse option. There are other options and their not even discussed at all.
the government is a problem but so s the regulations. What about malpractice insurance or allowing insurance across state lines? I would agree to a bill that is agreed on on a bipartisan basis. If thats what the American people want i would support it. I didnt agree with the republicans in the war but i dont agree with the democrats way of doing this either. you know as well as i do that obama could sit down with the repuublicans and hash out a comprimise both parties could agree on.
then why hasnt he sat down with the republicans since april.Especially when you have thousand of people marching on the capital. Should we then ignore their concerns whether they are valid or not? Obama could go out there and say look right on page whatever there is proof against death panals, illegal coverage, government having your health records. He could dismiss all of that and he doesnt. Im in the medical industry i havnt heard one doctor i know agree with the proposed plan not one.
you see either he isnt doing a good job presently the medical bill or hes doing a bad job countering the republicans on the bill. one of the 2 is correct. Obama says alot of things but i want him to start doing things. How about that war thats still going on? Have you realized the republicans dont have the votes to turn down any bill? why doesnt he put it up for a vote and just tell the dems to vote on it. They have the majority vote in both the house and the senate. He just blames the right
just last week barely anyone at all knew that the house voted on complete government take over of student loans by next year. He wont pass the health care bill because he doesnt intend to. Even if he passed it today it wouldnt go into effect for years. But you could also use it to distract people from what your really doing.
since your obviously a big obama supporter let me ask you this. When is government too big. The government has ownership in the american auto industry. They have control over the banks. They now have total control over student loans. They control 90% of the mortgage market. Now they want 20% of our economy as well in the new health care.
autocompanies if i remember correctly the goverment is still the majority shareholder in gm and chrysler.
The problem is the government shouldnt be lending money to financial institutions that are poorly run to the point they will go bankrupt with out financial assistance.
Your going to honestly tell me the government is the magic answer here? Individuality is best when the government gets out of the way and lets people be themselves
The the Government didn't regulate lenders so shady ones came in offering 1% ARM's to home owners who didn't understand that a 1% rise in the interest rate would cripple them financially.
Then those shady lenders sold their shady deals to legitimate banks who didn't know they were shady and there were no regulations to protect from.
And when that interest rate did rise, homeowners couldn't pay to the banks who's only error was trust.
if i remember correctly there is a video. where the company regulating freddie mac and fanny mae. brought up the problems that he was seeing as a regulator and then being attacked in congress for doing his job.we know there are people in the government that benefited direcly from these comapnies. Again the government made a problem worse by its involvment
I agree. the government should never be involved in any private company in any way unless it's tax related. These should be no hand outs, no pushing of a private companies agenda. It should be very strict. I have no problem with a government setting up companies as long as all profits from the companies are put towards offsetting the cost of taxes. However if a company is going to go bankrupt because of poor business practice then that's their problem.
there are just oo many things the democrats are doing that i have to agree with the republicans on. Why are they trying to force bills through they have not read or reached a bipartisan agreement. Why add pages to a bill at 3 in morning before a vote? Why is the media not covering serious problems with the current government van jones, acorn. Why does obama keep taking over parts of the private sector first it was the banks.then it was the car companies, next is health care?
I have help peopel medicaly with out pay because i swore to do so..... sadly most doctors forget about there oath....... So yeah you can pay me with what you can afford
Why would anyone think that a government monolopy would change any of this? The acceptance of statism is the intellectual equivalence of the biblical flood story.
The problem with Obama's plan is simple: It's Obama's plan. The plan BELONGS to OBAMA. I'm a believer that the loudest people in this debate are the stupidest. I've talked to people in my family who I'd put in that category. Don't know the issues. Don't wanna know solutions. So blinded by Democrat/Republican that the people and issues don't matter so much. Can't have good ideas FROM THE OTHER SIDE! FROM THE ENEMY!
In the same manner that the ancient mystics burned down The Library of Alexandra todays progressive occultist are attempting to cast out capitalism because it isn't in keeping with their utopian socialist vision. I am amazed at how liberal atheist can be skeptical of the bible creation story while being all too accepting of top down government planning, it seems an opiate of the desire to control others rather than a well rationed critical understanding.
the thing I found funny when I was watching some of the teabagger videos... these people were saying they wanted some form of nationalized medicine, but not what was being offered. I think it has less to do with not wanting a socialized program and more to do with which party is doing it. This is why I have a huge problem with both parties... or left and right. They won't do anything that the "other side" proposes so we never get anywhere.
exactly - this entire debate has become a "you say this, I do that" argument that has created few viable solutions. each side spends all their resources shooting down the other side's ideas as opposed to coming up with their own. I wish people would just sit down and work out a solution that works...
....but I fear that that is not going to be the case and we will get (at best) a watered down version of what could have been....
I'm from the Netherlands myself, and my experience with our health care system has been good so far (the few times I needed to make use of it).
While you are right that we are not a socialist country, one of the larger parties that is currently in the government was originally - and probably still is to some extent - a socialist party. However, I don't see the problem with this. The word 'socialism' has been thoroughly demonized in the US, and no longer reflects the actual meaning of the word.
I always laugh when i hear Americans use words like socialist (or marxist) as some replacement for pure evil stupidity.
They don't seem to realise that Europian right is left or social in america. Europian left migh even be concidered communist in america.
The abuse of the word marxist annoys me. Like he's some sort of evil-prime. They should try and read some of his works. And soon any sane human would realise he's one of the greatist thinkers in the history of the modern world.
Not having decent health care is something for 3rd world countries. America should have improved this about 50 years ago. I know its a big country but if you can plan big wars, planning some healthcare changes can't be that hard right......
Just one problem, the Netherlands doesn't have 50 different states with there own regulations on health care. The Obama plan does not confront this deadly flaw. Otherwise I be glad to support it.
As someone who workes in the Dutch health care system I am interested what delusional idiot thinks that the current US health care system is anything like the Dutch health care system.. Can anyone tell me where I can find that comment????
BlueDoc1984 2 years ago
It isn't, but what Obama had originally proposed at the beginning of his term was very similar.
Its too bad the conservatives killed it.
corthew 2 years ago
no that is not what I mean.. I am talking about the guy who told you that the current, pre-reform US health care system is like the dutch system.. I know.. All politics is messed up.. But american politics is really is number one at that.. I can see why so many americans distrusted their goverment...
BlueDoc1984 2 years ago
my fathers family is from the netherlands
no socisty is totally capitalistic or comunistic and the ntherlands today is a mix of pro market policy and a rather genrous welfare state..the index of econmic freedom ranks the netherlands the 12 th freest economy in the world
but notes it high level of welfare spending
TheWilliamcale 2 years ago
:) and this is yet another reasons why you are one of my Favorite people that i have subscribed to.
RateBuddha 2 years ago
the problkem here is both parties are weak. The right is filled with people who believe in the lies of the insurance comapnies. The left is full of people filled with people like obama who are happy to take pay offs from the insurance comanies and big pharma. Obama is weak. He could just say hey we are voting on it right now and all dems vote on the bill.Who carees about the republicans. The problem is he caves to the insurance lobbiest. Obama is comprimising on everything he is as weak as bush
necrotic43 2 years ago
The answer to your question is NOTHING.
How the world works is just a moron and a lair not to mention a manipulative little shit head
BTW great video
theracemixer 2 years ago
BOOYAH!!! nice:-)
cristoballs 2 years ago
I am from the Netherlands (amsterdam) ii]:o]-~
I won't spoil your argument i hope...we are partly Socialist (Democrat).....
But I think that show its not all Bad
Care4alot 2 years ago
Another fallacy is our founding fathers mandated unfettered capitalism, and that democracy is exclusive of socialism. Actually they are complimentary and many of our European friends do operate democratic socialist governments. During the soviet era the USSR never really practiced socialism/communism they were really just fascist dictatorships using socialism as camouflage. And at the same time there are many popular/successful socialistic programs in the US. Public schools is a good example!
mpfield1966 2 years ago
the founding fathers on many instances.Spoke on the need for a freemarket econmy based on capitalism. China is now adapting capitalism look at them and look at us. Thomas jefferson said "The policy of the American government is to leave their citizens free, neither restraining nor aiding them in their pursuits. "
Our capitalism is what won both ww2 and the cold war. If ussr had adaped capitalism they would have been a far greater threat. China knows this this is why they are growing.
necrotic43 2 years ago
We need roads, schools, a justice system, military, civil infrastructure that is the foundation for society that rewards innovation and entrepreneurism, a society that protect liberty and freedom. The problem is that some of the rhetoric conveniently overlooks the cost of these things. In this vain Reagan also said that government is not the solution, it is the problem, but in the end we still need government... You get what you pay for. The US has the lowest tax base of industrialized countrys
mpfield1966 2 years ago
The rhetoric of small government is lunacy, as government is essential to a free, prosperous society. So what is wrong with expecting the richest people, who benefit the most from society to pay a bigger share? During the Clinton years the tax rate on the rich was raised and that was the most prosperous time in the last 28 years. W comes in and cuts the tax on the rich and another thing we need government to do is protect the citizens from the misdeeds of big business.
mpfield1966 2 years ago
An argument against government is the federal gov exerts undo control at the state/local level... there are some places that want to put prayer in school, violating the separation of church and state, but are blocked by federal oversight. Funny these same folks scream when a locality passes gay marriage; they want to pass a constitutional amendment to ban it. People loose sight of the fact that our government is a modified republic. That means that we are vote, but majority doesnt always rule.
mpfield1966 2 years ago
This government is organized so that a majority cant pass legislation, like school prayer, that violates other peoples rights. You see the founding fathers actually anticipated that there could be instances where some religions would try to impose themselves upon a populace via government intervention how smart these guys were.
mpfield1966 2 years ago
We do not need a big national goverment. The government should only have the objective of protecting the country. The rest of these projects you speak of belong to the state and local governments. The reason our governments were setup the way it is to keep the government from ruling its people. both bush and obama are abusing their power.
I would also point out the reason why we prospered during the 90s is the tech boom.Business make alot of money they create alot of jobs.
necrotic43 2 years ago
Repubs try to deregulate so that the rich can get richer, but do you really trust a businessman to do what is best for society, for the citizens? Do the rich really spend their money to enrich society?
mpfield1966 2 years ago
Good video Mr. corthew.
anonymityismyname 2 years ago
If we systematically kill everyone now we won't have to worry about health care reform.
Then we can fill those libatard FEMA coffins like they like to claim.
Let's fill those quotas from the secret pinkos behind closed door somewhere planning to summit with the 12 galaxies with Frank Chu and HowtheworldDOESNTwork with Libatards who lead them first.
isegoria1 2 years ago
Could we just set the tax rate be our age and thus guarantee that everyone would be depressed to death before they got old enough to need any substantial health care?
ananiasacts 2 years ago
That might be the next conspiracy. As for the present day old, they only need to look at the young to be depressed enough to want to die. Some die younger because they want to.
isegoria1 2 years ago
setting a tax rate is wrong giving a tax break on their health care premiums is better. So they can choose for themselves what medical care they want or need supported by their own taxes they get back.
necrotic43 2 years ago
I cannot afford to have a hernia or get cancer or require heart bypass surgery or any number of other serious conditions that actually happen to people.
Your proposal does not address my concerns.
corthew 2 years ago
My suggestion is to tax the black market in order to retire our debt, to create a universal transactor to enable the field of medicine to shift its focus to prevention and allow us to fund it fairly, and to use the business revenue and carbon tax to fund an income stream for every American that replaces the present entitlement programs. I explain it all in a dozen or so blogs posts. But the organizing principle behind those interconnected suggestions is to give us the info we need to be wiser.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
BTW--by "business revenue" I mean the non-tax income of the federal government (leasing lands, airwaves, minerals, and lots of other misc stuff.)
ananiasacts 2 years ago
that is why we need to reduce taxes alltogethor.
"Governments should not tax for the money they need but find a need for the money they have" Ronald Reagan
"The problem is not that people are taxed too little, the problem is that government spends too much."
Ronald Reagan
necrotic43 2 years ago
I wouldn't take anything Reagan said about spending too seriously because I believe a persons actions are a better indicator of what they actually do believe.
No one want to be a thief, Warren Buffet wrote an essay in the WSJ to complain about the injustice of the Bush tax cuts. It would be a lot easier to enjoy ones wealth if you knew it did not come at anyone else's expense. I disagree it's a hatred for wealth--it's a hatred for theft: the heads-we-win tails-you-lose philosophy we live by.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
i dont nessicarily agree with reagan but it doesnt mean the words are no less untrue.
The problem here is the left has created this idea the rich got that way by stealing it. Warren buffet is a perfect examplehe is rich because he worked for it not because he stole it from someone. There is also an inherent problem when we want to make everyone rich or everyone poor. If everyone has the same income level. Then there is no innovation or entrepreneurship. To creat advances in business.
necrotic43 2 years ago
Everyone should share an equal part of what our nation earns from the businesses it operates--like selling the right to pollute. Not because it helps the poor, because it is the only way to create a fair marketplace--to implement actual capitalism as you suggest. The income such an approach generated would be less than $1000/yr. The point is that it really does belong to each of us. Without such a mechanism a baby is paying $1000/yr just for existing.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
i like your premise of more suggestions to be wiser. The key here is options. Just like now the democrats are arguing there is only one option is directly dishonest. It would be better to have a debate on all the options then we all can agree togethor what is the best to go with.
I disagree on one point about entitlements. i will give you a quote
"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. " Thomas Jefferson
necrotic43 2 years ago
Exactly what my suggestions are designed to do--end them by replacing them with what is presently being taken away from people now without redress--the integrity of their environment, the income generated by their lands, airwaves, and resources. Turning those revenue sources into an income stream we each own a share of is stopping a transfer of wealth, not creating one. As things are now, they are hidden taxes on the very poorest of us to fund the activities of the very wealthiest.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
i like your general idea. There is a problem the democrats and republicans have created. When we as a culture villify the wealthy because of their wealth. The same way it is wrong to penalize people for being poor. It is inherently wrong to penalize people who succeed. In the end generally wealthy people own business which create jobs. If you take out the wealthy then you also loose the businesses and the jobs. Alaska already has a profit sharing policy in place in their oil reserves.
necrotic43 2 years ago
All of the proposed health care solutions look doomed to fail for precisely the same reason: not one of them makes any attempt to connect the price we pay for the choices we make in life to the true cost those choices impose on everyone. This situation creates a selective pressure that favors behavior that best exploits the inequities of our system rather than compel us to act wisely. Preventative medicine cannot grow in an environment that selects against it. I see a very different fix for it.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
how can you say the 3 fixes i proposed would impose choices on everyone it is built on the fact it would give you more options not less because someone is not forcing you to have them like a government.
necrotic43 2 years ago
I was talking about the proposals being considered by congress. Sorry if I accidently replied to you instead of using the correct button.
A tax break won't help the folks who just can't afford it at any price. For most people HC rates below entertainment in importance until they need it. You don't address that problem. A private insurance model takes money out of HC by using a HC dollar to buy things that cannot render HC, like insurance executives, brokers, etc. 3: easy to say, hard to do.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
i disagree with you here people who cant afford healthcare can afford it through taxes. Think about it take a part of the taxes they pay anyway on their paychecks whatever their health are costs you deduct the total on your tax return. The only reason you wont get it back on your taxes is if you dont pay taxes. If you dont pay taxes then you really shouldnt be asking the government to help you with your health care
necrotic43 2 years ago
Why not keep my taxes and give me the healthcare?
I would prefer the safety net to the money.
corthew 2 years ago
i was saying that take the money your sending to the government anyway in taxes why not use that money to buy health care? Why is it you thus are now responsible to use the money you would beable to keep for youw own rather then send it to the government to give me health care.
necrotic43 2 years ago
I think we both agree that a free enterprise system is the best technology we have for evolving ingenious solutions to the problems we face. But it's a difficult technology to deploy when you're trying to build an industry intended to put itself out of business. Yet that is exactly what an effective HC industry would tend to do; create less opportunities to deliver HC by effectively preventing the need of it.. We are, after all, designed to maintain ourselves. A different approach is needed.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
in a free enterprise system competition is a wonderful thing. The market can and will fix itseelf when you allow more compitition. People buy the products people believe are both good quality and servicce. If you dont provide these you tend to loose business as any other business would. Now changing away from the free market system to a system with no competition only hurts the system. Im in the healthcare industry I have not meet a single doctor that in anyway aproves of a public option.
necrotic43 2 years ago
"The policy of the American government is to leave their citizens free, neither restraining nor aiding them in their pursuits. " Thomas Jefferson
"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. " Thomas Jefferson
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them. " Thomas Jefferson
necrotic43 2 years ago
We must not allow a precedent to be set where being critical of the president is automatically racist. Being critical of our government even if they are wrong is the basis of our democracy. if this is to change it will be a disaster regardless if obama turns out to be the a great american president or the terrible.
This issue of racism needs to be stop being brought up on both sides.
necrotic43 2 years ago
I agree. I also agree with Obama' plan with healthcare. Many of the things I hear regarding Canadian health is complete bullshit. How fast you get things such as an MRI depends on how serious it is. You can get one same day. I got an MRI, 2 EEGs and saw a neurologist in a span of 3 weeks. I have a Family doctor that I can see same day if it's serious or with a few days if it's a check up. Medicine does not cost me an arm and a leg.
systematic101 2 years ago
and about 2 year ago I accidentally gashed my hand open when I moved. it was about 3" long and to the bone. I went to the ER. got it stitched bandaged and got a tetanus shot with 30mins. I have no idea were some Americans are getting this idea of many hours in the waiting room and month for an MRI.
systematic101 2 years ago
democrats have this idea ok our healthcare system needs reform lets just scrap the whole thing in favor of a government system. Address its problems. I myself could totally reform health care on 3 points.
1 Give everyone paying taxes a break on their health care premiums.
2 Allow insurance companies to insurace across state lines.
3 fix medical malpractice law.
these 3 things i guarantee will do exactly what the system needs presently. None of these are even discussed.
necrotic43 2 years ago
PWNED
isegoria1 2 years ago
It really is funny the way Americans see the rest of the world. I'm from the UK and I have family that live in the Netherlands. The Netherlands is a much more socialist country in both politics and public behavior than the UK is. But according to some of the American commentators I've heard the UK is apparently a communist utopia :-P, while the Netherlands it seems is the way to go.
WhichDoctor1 2 years ago
Lol, way to go HTWW fans to point to the healthcare system of a EU country.
Ah well... great video, Cort. :)
Gnug215 2 years ago
Corthew, the more videos i watch from you, the more i love you. No homo, not that theres anything wrong with that.
crackerkiller89 2 years ago
Ugh.
Need more Atheist Libertarians on youtube :\
The role of government is not to be your provider, the role of government is to maintain the peace and stay the hell out of the private sector.
The only tool of the government is violence.
boxant 2 years ago
well said boxant i consider myself an atheist libertarian it simply amazes my how everyone wants more government involvement even though im pretty sure no government anywhere has done anything anywhere except oppress people
necrotic43 2 years ago
If you live in this country and you feel oppressed, you've probably done something you shouldn't.
corthew 2 years ago
i didnt say i was oppressed but it is the typical nature of the world. Government is driven by those who want power. Corruption and greed is its product.
necrotic43 2 years ago
So you've seen alot of corruption and greed from the desire for universal healthcare?
Have you noticed the level of corruption and greed that exists in the current healthcare system?
Look at all of the lobbyists trying to KEEP the healthcare system from changing.
Do you think they are doing this out of the goodness of their hearts?
They're doing it because the groups they represents stands to loose money they've pretty much been stealing from you and me.
corthew 2 years ago
of course i believe their is corruption in the current healthcare system. Do you realize the level of corruption and greed in our current goverment? There are ways to reform healthcare with out government control. These arnt even posed as an option. Do you really believe the same people who run the department of motor vehicles and the post office to also run healthcare?
You have to agree the government is only effcient in taking your money.
necrotic43 2 years ago
Personally, I think we should take it back to wild west and Gangster days when you could shoot a man with no government intervention...but thats just me.:)
There is right now, more regulation of our healthcare system from the AMA than from the government.
And that, to a large extent, is why cost is skyrocketing. They and the drug companies are willing to pay our politicians to keep it that way.
Break the chain dude.
That's what Obama's trying to do.
To break that chain for us.
corthew 2 years ago
lol i like your analogy
The problem is that there is regulation im equally against the AMA. I think obama could have done a far better job presenting his health care. Im not a republican but why is a large group of americans being called rasict becuse of a differing politcal view? Do i inherently agree with them no. The insurance companies are also a problem but having government involvement is a worse option. There are other options and their not even discussed at all.
necrotic43 2 years ago
These other options...How do you propose to enforce them without government involvement.
That's why we have regulations.
People want to do right but one bad apple who doesn't and the whole system is screwed unless there are regulations to deal with him.
corthew 2 years ago
the government is a problem but so s the regulations. What about malpractice insurance or allowing insurance across state lines? I would agree to a bill that is agreed on on a bipartisan basis. If thats what the American people want i would support it. I didnt agree with the republicans in the war but i dont agree with the democrats way of doing this either. you know as well as i do that obama could sit down with the repuublicans and hash out a comprimise both parties could agree on.
necrotic43 2 years ago
The healthcare bill that is currently on the table is a result of Republicans and Democrats hashing it out.
Obama has made concessions.
He's is incorporating McCain's ideas from the debates into the plan.
He insisted that it must be bipartisan from before he entered office.
corthew 2 years ago
then why hasnt he sat down with the republicans since april.Especially when you have thousand of people marching on the capital. Should we then ignore their concerns whether they are valid or not? Obama could go out there and say look right on page whatever there is proof against death panals, illegal coverage, government having your health records. He could dismiss all of that and he doesnt. Im in the medical industry i havnt heard one doctor i know agree with the proposed plan not one.
necrotic43 2 years ago
I'm betting they no your position and don't want an argument.
Intelligent people people who aren't looking for an argument will usually mirror your attitude, even though they don't agree with it.
But you asked why Obama doesn't give the page that "doesn't" mention death panels.
That would be the entire bill, dude.
The question is, "If the bill mentions death panels, what page is that on?"
corthew 2 years ago
you see either he isnt doing a good job presently the medical bill or hes doing a bad job countering the republicans on the bill. one of the 2 is correct. Obama says alot of things but i want him to start doing things. How about that war thats still going on? Have you realized the republicans dont have the votes to turn down any bill? why doesnt he put it up for a vote and just tell the dems to vote on it. They have the majority vote in both the house and the senate. He just blames the right
necrotic43 2 years ago
Think about that.
The Democrats are capable of doing this without Republican support and the Republicans have been giving them hell over it.
Why would they not already have just pushed it through?
Is it possible Obama is truly serious about wanting this to be a bipartisan plan?
That he DOESN'T want to exercise Absolute power?
corthew 2 years ago
I believe the healthcare debate is a distraction.
just last week barely anyone at all knew that the house voted on complete government take over of student loans by next year. He wont pass the health care bill because he doesnt intend to. Even if he passed it today it wouldnt go into effect for years. But you could also use it to distract people from what your really doing.
necrotic43 2 years ago
since your obviously a big obama supporter let me ask you this. When is government too big. The government has ownership in the american auto industry. They have control over the banks. They now have total control over student loans. They control 90% of the mortgage market. Now they want 20% of our economy as well in the new health care.
continued
necrotic43 2 years ago
Bush also forced government to be bigger and gave himself more power. When i see obama doing the same thing it is a problem.
no where does it say i have to accept what im givin because the government says so
necrotic43 2 years ago
Again I'll ask, what banks are government owned?
What autocompanies?
Lending money to companies who employ a large portion of Americans and lending money to the banks who hold alot of American's money is a good idea.
That the money is being paid back is a good thing.
The problem you have is that you think that means big brother.
We've had big brother since the McCarthy era and before.
Fear is what creates the need for that.
Paranoia of both each other and of government.
corthew 2 years ago
banks dont you remember the tarp program?
autocompanies if i remember correctly the goverment is still the majority shareholder in gm and chrysler.
The problem is the government shouldnt be lending money to financial institutions that are poorly run to the point they will go bankrupt with out financial assistance.
Your going to honestly tell me the government is the magic answer here? Individuality is best when the government gets out of the way and lets people be themselves
necrotic43 2 years ago
Its a vicious cycle isn't it.
The the Government didn't regulate lenders so shady ones came in offering 1% ARM's to home owners who didn't understand that a 1% rise in the interest rate would cripple them financially.
Then those shady lenders sold their shady deals to legitimate banks who didn't know they were shady and there were no regulations to protect from.
And when that interest rate did rise, homeowners couldn't pay to the banks who's only error was trust.
corthew 2 years ago
if i remember correctly there is a video. where the company regulating freddie mac and fanny mae. brought up the problems that he was seeing as a regulator and then being attacked in congress for doing his job.we know there are people in the government that benefited direcly from these comapnies. Again the government made a problem worse by its involvment
necrotic43 2 years ago
Again I'll say it:
Vicious cycle.
Knowing where to draw the line is the problem.
If there were no regulations that guy wouldn't have been there to be attacked by congress.
Its not a black and white issue.
There are problems no matter how much or how little you regulate it.
But no regulation has already proven to be a bad move repeatedly down through history.
corthew 2 years ago
that we can agree on.
necrotic43 2 years ago
I agree. the government should never be involved in any private company in any way unless it's tax related. These should be no hand outs, no pushing of a private companies agenda. It should be very strict. I have no problem with a government setting up companies as long as all profits from the companies are put towards offsetting the cost of taxes. However if a company is going to go bankrupt because of poor business practice then that's their problem.
systematic101 2 years ago
exactly
necrotic43 2 years ago
there are just oo many things the democrats are doing that i have to agree with the republicans on. Why are they trying to force bills through they have not read or reached a bipartisan agreement. Why add pages to a bill at 3 in morning before a vote? Why is the media not covering serious problems with the current government van jones, acorn. Why does obama keep taking over parts of the private sector first it was the banks.then it was the car companies, next is health care?
necrotic43 2 years ago
Why are you paying so much attention to Fox news?
Why don't you ask your local bank if they are run by the government?
Why would the news be talking about things that only seem to be news worthy to people against Obama.
Is it because he's black?
I'm really starting to think it is because when Bush was doing his stupid stuff, the republican community ignored it.
Its because Obama's black, isn't it.
corthew 2 years ago
i dont watch fox news for the same reason i dont watch msnbc. Neither one will report accuratly on the news.
The banks are run by the federqal reserve which the president has no power over. Im totally against the federal reserve.
im going to continue on an additional response
necrotic43 2 years ago
Sorry Corthew to dissapoint you......
I am 100% pro Healthcare like Holland but it won`t chaing alot the cost still skyroket.......
The cost increase is because our health care can cure more and more disesses and help even the sickest....
Phama Comapanys make pills really really expencive....... and the problem is we can not stop them doing this
FratisNox 2 years ago
What ever happened to the days when doctors were healing the sick for chickens and eggs?
I can afford to pay with those.:)
corthew 2 years ago
I have help peopel medicaly with out pay because i swore to do so..... sadly most doctors forget about there oath....... So yeah you can pay me with what you can afford
FratisNox 2 years ago
Why would anyone think that a government monolopy would change any of this? The acceptance of statism is the intellectual equivalence of the biblical flood story.
ALittleBitPregnant 2 years ago
You sound like a believer who shames the atheist for not accepting their theistic view. I think liberalism is just as oppressive as theism.
ALittleBitPregnant 2 years ago
Could you explain why? What part of 'society should seek to maximize personal freedom' appears oppressive to you?
ananiasacts 2 years ago
The problem with Obama's plan is simple: It's Obama's plan. The plan BELONGS to OBAMA. I'm a believer that the loudest people in this debate are the stupidest. I've talked to people in my family who I'd put in that category. Don't know the issues. Don't wanna know solutions. So blinded by Democrat/Republican that the people and issues don't matter so much. Can't have good ideas FROM THE OTHER SIDE! FROM THE ENEMY!
happysplodie 2 years ago
I agree with you, Corthew!
joel1923 2 years ago
In the same manner that the ancient mystics burned down The Library of Alexandra todays progressive occultist are attempting to cast out capitalism because it isn't in keeping with their utopian socialist vision. I am amazed at how liberal atheist can be skeptical of the bible creation story while being all too accepting of top down government planning, it seems an opiate of the desire to control others rather than a well rationed critical understanding.
ALittleBitPregnant 2 years ago
the thing I found funny when I was watching some of the teabagger videos... these people were saying they wanted some form of nationalized medicine, but not what was being offered. I think it has less to do with not wanting a socialized program and more to do with which party is doing it. This is why I have a huge problem with both parties... or left and right. They won't do anything that the "other side" proposes so we never get anywhere.
tattooskin72 2 years ago
exactly - this entire debate has become a "you say this, I do that" argument that has created few viable solutions. each side spends all their resources shooting down the other side's ideas as opposed to coming up with their own. I wish people would just sit down and work out a solution that works...
....but I fear that that is not going to be the case and we will get (at best) a watered down version of what could have been....
...our own private bridge to nowhere!
1n354a 2 years ago
I'm from the Netherlands myself, and my experience with our health care system has been good so far (the few times I needed to make use of it).
While you are right that we are not a socialist country, one of the larger parties that is currently in the government was originally - and probably still is to some extent - a socialist party. However, I don't see the problem with this. The word 'socialism' has been thoroughly demonized in the US, and no longer reflects the actual meaning of the word.
wrongwayup 2 years ago
I always laugh when i hear Americans use words like socialist (or marxist) as some replacement for pure evil stupidity.
They don't seem to realise that Europian right is left or social in america. Europian left migh even be concidered communist in america.
The abuse of the word marxist annoys me. Like he's some sort of evil-prime. They should try and read some of his works. And soon any sane human would realise he's one of the greatist thinkers in the history of the modern world.
jankuiper3422 2 years ago 4
Not having decent health care is something for 3rd world countries. America should have improved this about 50 years ago. I know its a big country but if you can plan big wars, planning some healthcare changes can't be that hard right......
jankuiper3422 2 years ago
thanx corthew, this is a topic i have become quite concerned about and interested in. yay for reform
SkeptikSnarf 2 years ago
Just one problem, the Netherlands doesn't have 50 different states with there own regulations on health care. The Obama plan does not confront this deadly flaw. Otherwise I be glad to support it.
TheAtheistPaladin 2 years ago
Did you respond back telling him that?
1tofallen 2 years ago
I did and its been several days now with no reply.
corthew 2 years ago
I have a feeling he doesnt know what Obamas plan is, just that he has to be against it because he is a republican
Brianswers 2 years ago
Good video!
TheSupremeSkeptic 2 years ago
Seems to be a great "gotcha" video, corthew. It'll be interesting to see how Lee's HTWW followers will respond, IF they respond.
1140Cecile 2 years ago