@teenprepper96 You're part of a growing population that puts more faith in the creation than in the creator. You have ignored Gods moral law and replaced it with not littering so you can be as immoral as you want and believe there is no consequences for your actions. Unfortunately God will judge you by His law not your man made law. Recycling and using special light bulbs will not get you into heaven.
@ArboriusOwns Im not questioning your religion so please dont question mine, all faiths have unanswered questions, and I respect your beliefs so please respect mine
@teenprepper96 Seems you have a problem with a blunt description of your worship of the creation. My only question was "What created energy?" The most intelligent species you know of can't create the smallest spec of matter yet you believe it was created by accident by energy so my question is were did energy come from?
@teenprepper96 God created time "Gen 1:1 In the beginning" Before time & still today God existed outside of time & space in a place called eternity. He is not a created being which means His origins are not at question. Energy is fueled by something created, oil gas sun petroleum etc. How can energy which needs fuel create everything if it needs creation to fuel its self? Energy does not think. How can a non thinking creator create laws like gravity inertia etc?
@ChristianArmorOfGod Sorry but I have to remove this comment try to remember this is an adult conversation for mature adults no blasphemy please. It's so easy to drop that kind of language from your vocabulary especially when you have that extra time between typing something that shows your ignorance and clicking post.
39 You study[a] the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, 40 yet you refuse to come to me to have life.
Psalms 86:10: For thou art great, and doest wondrous things: thou art God alone.
Isaiah 37:16: O LORD of hosts, God of Israel, that dwellest between the cherubims, thou art the God, even thou alone, of all the kingdoms of the earth: thou hast made heaven and earth.
Matthew 4:4: But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.
O mighty one... you still do not understand because you know not the whole bible story. Perhaps if you would learn exactly Why Jesus was REQUIRED to come and die it will open up to you. Sitting at the right hand of Omnipotence, it's an Idiom, means in Power of God. Worker of Miracle / power / force, alluding to the commander-in-chief of his force and his triumphant return. God girds man with His power like in Psa 18.32 & Psa 21.all specially weight the last verse out and see if it makes sense.
Isa 41.14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I will help thee, saith the LORD, and thy redeemer, the Holy One of Israel. 43.14 Thus saith the LORD, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel
Isaiah 44:6: Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.
@ChristianArmorOfGod I'm done arguing with you this conversation is way off topic. The point of this video is not to say believe what I believe or go to hell. It is a plea for JW's to examine the bible without the watchtower organization telling them what it means. The watchtower is lying to them. You don't have to understand every word of the bible to go to heaven you only have to repent and believe and believing means you believe Jesus is God.
We Must Obey. Belief alone is not enough. The devil/satan if you will, he believes... many people believe or else Jesus would not tell them to DEPART From Me! The point and problem is that the "hell doctrine" and the belief of an 'everliving soul" works to destroy Gods message. Problem is that the JW's got part of the puzzle RIGHT, it's just convoluted with a lot of filthy POLLUTION which is not likely to be addressed because of what they are taught and agreed neglect to look up scripture 4 self
Jer 3.14 Turn, O backsliding children, saith the LORD; for I am married unto you: and I will take you one of a city, and two of a family, and I will bring you to Zion:
Rev 19.7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.
@ArboriusOwns Do you want to keep going there? You should read the whole thing and think... read past 20
Go therefore to teach all nations about NT/baptizing ie the circumcision Colossians 2.11-12 the person being baptized is putting off something old (OT) and being initiated into something new (NT) - covenants. You got to THINK. The willingness to let God/Jesus be their Director/Master/Head/King. This does not annul the adoption or the law. Jn 1.1-14 Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us.
Why did the man in this story only want a Tiny Drop of Water?
Why did he not ask for a Bucket? A river? an Ocean full of water?
Rv 19.12,2.8,1.14 Hb 1.7, 2thes1.8,Acts 7.30 and only here in the NT have this same word here but with another word added to show fire. Here in the parable does not. The other word is strong's 4442, the word here in question flame is 5395.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Why did the man in this story only want a Tiny Drop of Water? Why did he not ask for a Bucket? A river? an Ocean full of water? He was begging for any amount of mercy even just a drop of water.
Do you know how to use a Strongs? never even heard of a strongs
Ezekiel 33.11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?
If there is a Second death, and that is reserved for the wicked, their executed judgment, why would they live for tens, hundreds, thousands and perhaps tens of thousands of years in hell, before the judgment -- are you selling purgatory like the catholics?
@ChristianArmorOfGod Job 3:17-22 "There the wicked cease from raging, And there the weary are at rest. "The prisoners are at ease together; They do not hear the voice of the taskmaster. "The small and the great are there, And the slave is free from his master. "Why is light given to him who suffers, And life to the bitter of soul; Who long for death, but there is none, And dig for it more than for hidden treasures; Who rejoice greatly, They exult when they find the grave?
Once again, you are pitting scripture against itself based upon a subjective wish that aligns with your views. Let the bible tell from itself what it is saying. First off Job is a very complicated book, it is easy to get lost and one has to be very careful with whom is speaking and really read whole chapters and even several chapters in groups/like verses. If you are convinced this is proof of your position, are you willing to wager all your claim to this stake?
@ArboriusOwns That's not what is meant by using scripture against scripture. Go look it up it's called "PITTING scripture against Scripture".
No that's not what I'm saying, but the reality is that it could lead there, for one, because this everlasting bbq pit does lead many in the wrong direction.
If you even understood the basic reason why Jesus actually had to come, then you would be better light to see the rest, an example of the hell doctrines we are discussing.
Read 16-19 in a tiny group of reflection and read 20-22 together read them in respect to the whole of scripture here in Job 3.
The bible is not necessarily Linear dialogue and neither can you justify your position from the whole chapter here, however if that is your intent I suggest you refrain from posting to this message and make a video reply so I can tear into your flimsy proposition.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Got some questions for you. Well you're definitely Arian but are you a JW? Do you believe Jesus is God? Do you believe in the Godhead/trinity? What Bible are you using?
@ArboriusOwns No JW but have had colleagues that were.
No trinity here, only one God. Father came in the form of the Son as the Father in the flesh who dwelt among us because of his Law it was required, and set-up if you will - premeditated. They both send the helper ie the holy Spirit, there are more than one holy spirit by the way (side note). Godhead - Kinda like a company CEO/President/Operating partner --- relationship in my mind.
I use several. KJV, Septuagint, Geneva, YLT, Weymouth, etc
@ChristianArmorOfGod The Bible is very clear that the Father and Son have 2 distinct personalities When Jesus was baptized the Father spoke from heaven about the Son. We are told to baptize in the name of the Father Son and Holy Spirit when Jesus was on the cross he said my God why have you forsaken me. The 3 are mention together as separate individuals countless times in the bible.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Yes I'm sure someone has counted please forgive me for overstating I forget sometimes that your superior to me the Father Son and Holy Spirit are mentioned together many times indicating a triunion. anyway I'm going to work I'm sure you have more to say but you'll have to wait until tomorrow for my response.
@ArboriusOwns Jesus was the Father clothed in the flesh. God declared in the OT he would be the one to save. And By His own Very Law - It required Him to Die because of His Word to his People that he married. God had to come himself in the Flesh to free her from the law... No one else could satisfy the law, God is a law doer. Hope this simpleton description can sink home through your mental blockade. If Jesus was anyone but the Father, then there is NO redemption. Just the facts Jack.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Jesus was not an avatar you watch too many cartoons. God was the one who saved Jesus is God but only 1 member of the trinity. You seem to think that just because God spoke in the OT that it was the Father speaking. People may not have understood that there were 3 persons in 1 God during OT times but that doesn't mean the trinity didn't exist then.gen 1:26“Let us make mankind" gen 3:22“become like one of us" gen 11:7 gen 19:24 has 2 lords destroying Sodom & Gomorrah
@ArboriusOwns Genesis 19:24 (Young's Literal Translation) 24and Jehovah hath rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from Jehovah, from the heavens;
Look Jehovah rained upon from Jehovah 2 persons 2 individuals
I Cor 8.6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him. Eze18.4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die. Isa 54.5 For thy Maker is thine husband; the LORD of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called.
Isaiah 44.8:...... ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.
Isaiah 45.5 I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me 6That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.
Isaiah 45:21: Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.
Hosea 13:4: Yet I am the LORD thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: for there is no saviour beside me.
@ChristianArmorOfGod We've been having this conversation all morning and I still have no idea what you believe you posting scripture that have nothing to do with this video or the after life. I've asked what Bible you use no answer I asked you o email me to better explain your point you haven't so perhaps you're right we should end this conversation
@ChristianArmorOfGod I'd like to know who indoctrinated me. I was an atheist until about 10 years ago then only became a Christian after studying the bible over the last 4-5 years.
Nothing but love for you but you'll have to answer my questions 1st. If you reply again without answering my questions I'll assume you're a troll and block you.
Sounds like you still are an a-Thiest. I've dealt with for years, and tens of thousands of hours. I asked the questions below which you refuse to answer to get us on the same page. Block me if you will... anyone with a brain can tell I am no troll. I have been blocked and closed down on hundreds of postings and channels, it would be nothing but confirmation of your true nature if you did.
What reasons did you have to "become a Christian" and HOW does that process work? did you follow the bible?
@ChristianArmorOfGod You remind me of Saul who was full of pride. He could trace his line back to David memorized books of the Bible even persecuted & killed Christians but after meeting Jesus he compared his past accomplishments to filthy menstrual rages. Or the pharisees who tried many times to humiliate Jesus. Pride is very dangerous & your love of yourself is clear in how you talk down to me. Your arrogant prideful tone is why you are rejected by so many.
@ArboriusOwns You should show love for others when you evangelize not love for yourself. You point out their sin convict them of being a sinner explain the punishment in store for them and explain that Jesus to their punishment if they repent and believe. Your overbearing pride will not only turn people away from you but it will turn them away from Christ
@ArboriusOwns I can trace many of my lines to Adam. But is that alone worth life - No, never claimed so. I don't have anything in Godly with any such pride that you allude to. Sounds like you need to look in the mirror.
I cn assure you I have not been talking down to you, but the truth is that you are showing to me that you need some help in your understandings because you trust too much what YOU think opposed to what the Word declares
@ChristianArmorOfGod What reasons did you have to "become a Christian" and HOW does that process work? did you follow the bible?
My kids showed me the way. I looked through their eye's and saw the world in a new light. After that I bought a bible and started reading and examining what others believed and how that stacked up to the bible. Jesus said to be like a child so I guess I did follow the bible even before I read it.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Is it your contention that there is a punishing hell? Yes there is a punishing hell
That this hell is different from the hell we go to when we die? not sure I think the punishment side of sheol/hades might be hell and the lake of fire final death.
The hades/hell is for a time for duration before the return of Jesus and his Judgment with punishing hell? see above
@ChristianArmorOfGod The punishing hell last a bit then over? answer to both questions below
That the spirit of man has eternal existence in one of two places?
I believe eternity is a place or dimension outside ours not a time frame. God created time in Gen 1:1In the beginning God created. I believe God can flip through time the way you or I would flip through the pages of a history book.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Does Man have a spirit that is eternal or limited unless extended by God through Jesus?
Again I don't believe eternity is an amount of time it is a place. If you insist on eternity being an amount of time then only God is eternal only God is alpha and omega.
1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.
Jn 5.28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. James1.15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death John 3.6For God...gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
@ArboriusOwns Yes they will. He will call your name and say wake or come to me. You are making an assumption that they are awake and have full knowledge the whole time. The dead know not. Daniel 12.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. RichMan and Lazarus.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Lk 20:37 But in the account of the burning bush, even Moses showed that the dead rise, for he calls the Lord ‘the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’[a] 38 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living, for to him all are alive.”
You are leaving intentionally or un intentionally KEY elements out, you are cutting and pasting to fit your doctrine, you are PITTING scripture against itself even when the context shows the correct pretext. You should go and think on how and why you respond like pavlovs dog.
33 Therefore in the resurrection.... 34The children of this world.... 35they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead...
36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.
37 Now that the dead are raised, even Moses shewed at the bush, when he calleth the Lord the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.
@ChristianArmorOfGod 26Now about the dead rising—have you not read in the Book of Moses, in the account of the burning bush, how God said to him, ‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’[d]?27 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living. You are badly mistaken!”
@ChristianArmorOfGod 37 But in the account of the burning bush, even Moses showed that the dead rise, for he calls the Lord ‘the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’ 38 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living, for to him all are alive.”
@ChristianArmorOfGod Lk 20:37 But in the account of the burning bush, even Moses showed that the dead rise, for he calls the Lord ‘the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’[a] 38 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living, for to him all are alive.”
Moses: 1500 BC & Elijah: 730 BC in Mt 17:1-5 they both appear in front of the disciples.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Lazarus and the rich man is not a vision it is a parable. Which version of the bible are you using because your bible is way differrent than the ones I am using
@ArboriusOwns Again you need to read all of Rev 6, and take it all in instead of picking which verses you choose to ignore to suit your agenda. The BLOOD cries from the ground does it not? If you want to argue 1 point and one point only and REST all your arguments on your one point, then lets move forward but if you want to throw up dust in the air and play what abouts then you are wasting my time.
@ChristianArmorOfGod exactly, and the fact there is a second death, means what it sounds. No second hell visit, an eternal vacation, but the consequences last eternally, just like the Revelation story of the smoke eternally... this event will be forever removed and vanished away when the wicked are removed - from our minds, nature that leads us to destruction et al.
II Peter 2.9 The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished. Jn12.48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. Mt13.41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that ...which do iniquity42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire...
One more thing, Read isa 1.all Very carefully, and focus on two verses in light of this discussion V 6, and V 28. Think on this: they that forsake the LORD shall be consumed. v29 For they shall be ashamed...Mt8.10-12many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob....cast out into outer darkness. Lk13.28-29 & Mt13.37-38.
One is the SEED of the promise and the other has no part. One blesses the world the other CURSES.
Isa66.15-16,24 the world is already ruled by “the antichrist” and todays preachers/churches for the most part are his little henchmen singing his doctrine.The story of Lazarus is a VISION and just exactly what Jesus did here and often, tell a PARABLE. It is not the literal analysis of heaven and hell. Heaven is for God, Not Man. Ps115.16 The heaven, even the heavens, are the LORD'S: but the earth hath he given to the children of men. This is very much liken to the PARABLE of the TARES
@ChristianArmorOfGod no it isn't a literal description of heaven and hell. It's Jesus describing Hades(not Heaven or hell) in a way the human mind can better understand. Hades is divided into a paradise and a place of torment. After Jesus died on the cross he led those unjustly imprisoned from paradise in Hades up to Heaven. That's why Jesus told the criminal on the cross today you will be with me in paradise. The criminal on his other side didn't repent he went to the torment side of Hades.
@ArboriusOwns Hades/Sheol means place of the dead. It isn't Heaven or hell. Well the torment side might be hell but I always felt that hell is during judgment when Hades is cast into the lake of fire.
I also don't believe eternity is a length of time I think it is a place. God exists for all eternity even before he created time in gen1 "In the beginning" God exists in eternity and created man and subjected us to time. I don't really have anything scriptural to back that up it's just what I feel.
The hell people think about does exist and is RESERVED unto judgment but lasts for a brief time.
Job 21.30 That the wicked is reserved to the day of destruction? they shall be brought forth to the day of wrath. psa37.9 For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth.
10 For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be.
Key is that you refuse to look into the words and think, shame on you. You are liken to the rich man here. The rich man is the then jewish/even now jewish/Babylonian system that opposes God - today it's many Church-ians who believe preachers over Biblical believers. Just by using the word Hades, the people would know the story was in metaphors (the word from GREEK mythology). Why would the lost be able to dialogue with the "Saved"? Why do you refuse to walk in anyones counsel rather than Gods?
@ChristianArmorOfGod Sheol means place of the dead when the old testament was translated to Greek Sheol was translated to Hades same meaning in some translations to english Hades was translated to hell which doesn't mean place of the dead. The NT was written in greek so what you are saying is that because revolations uses the word Hades it is metaphor?
7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
Concerning Sodom Gen 19.17 ....escape to the mountain, lest thou be consumed.
You can't read whatever you want into a text.
Suffering the vengeance is to be consumed, to be consumed is to have nothing left... most people are reserved UNTO judgment...
2 Peter 1:13 I think it is right to refresh your memory as long as I live in the tent of this body, 14 because I know that I will soon put it aside, as our Lord Jesus Christ has made clear to me. 15 And I will make every effort to see that after my departure you will always be able to remember these things.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Lk 8:52 Meanwhile, all the people were wailing and mourning for her. “Stop wailing,” Jesus said. “She is not dead but asleep.” 53 They laughed at him, knowing that she was dead. 54 But he took her by the hand and said, “My child, get up!” 55 Her spirit returned, and at once she stood up. Then Jesus told them to give her something to eat. 56 Her parents were astonished, but he ordered them not to tell anyone what had happened.
@ArboriusOwns True Sheol and Hades are words related to death . Some Bible translations render them as “grave,” “hell,” or “pit.” However, Gehenna is the word Jesus used which many take to heart when thinking of some place of torture. Gehenna was a place for dumping refuse, outside the walls of Jerusalem. Its fires were kept burning to prevent pestilence. Sulphur or brimstone was added to help the burning. The “lake of fire” is also a symbolic term for everlasting destruction none the less.
@illwillcpt83 I don't think I ever called Hades hell. Hades is divided into 2 sections a section of suffering and a section of paradise. For example Catholics believe Jesus died and descended into hell to battle Satan or defeat sin or continue suffering for mans sins whatever it's different every time. Now on the cross Jesus said to the thief next to him today you will be with me in paradise not hell. After Jesus died he went to the paradise side of Hades to lead the wrongfully accused to Heaven
Romans 6.23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Do you honestly believe God would ALLOW those that HATE and CURSE him who lived a BRIEF flicker in "time" to LIVE eternally through his DIRECT POWER AND WILL and allow them to CURSE him?
Consider what happened in Genesis 3, read ALL of it and actually THINK and Reflect.
If the penalty for sin is an Everlasting BBQ, how did Jesus Death Pay for us all.
V9, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.
It was a vision. And you have to take into account the arguments of the people at the time... Long and the short of it, there are plenty of supporting scriptures against a conscious "soul" after death. There in fact is No Everliving spirit of a man unless granted from Jesus. You don't have judgment to the end, and we have not reached the end... not biblical sound reasoning. Good Fiction
@ChristianArmorOfGod V9 of what book? The Rich Man and Lazarus is Luke 16:19-31 every scriptures against a conscious "soul" after death that I've read was from the perspective of man but God always spoke of the afterlife at least from my studies.
Mt17. Don't try to pit scripture against scripture.
Use all of scripture: Lk16.31 If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. Jesus went to hell. David and other patriarchs too. {CAREFULLY consider vs. 25, 26} Jg8.26 who wears purple? Mk15.16-18 clothed Jesus in Purple -soldiers put a purple robe on Him to represent Christ the RULER. Also:Ex28.1-5,Lv 6, 16,Eze9,Dn10, 12, Rv 19.8 -priest of God. Rev 17 Babylon, ut the pieces together.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Luke 16:31“He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.’” Who is speaking and who is he speaking to if Abraham and the rich man are uncontentious?
"Jesus went to hell" Jesus went to the paradise side of Hades were Abraham & Lazarus were.
Eccl 9.3 there is one event unto all:... they live, and after that they go to the dead.
You are READING into scripture what you want, that's not using the whole counsel of God, you can't pick and choose you must read in harmony for the whole. 2Tm 3.16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine.
If Jesus did not actually die then there is NO forgiveness of sins. Death was the only way to release Israel from the terms of the law. So she then could remarry.
Luke16.22,23.Get a Strongs Concordance - study on the word torment.Acts20.37,38 use Strongs. Consider Hb1.7of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire. Acts7And when forty years were expired, there appeared to him in the wilderness of mount Sina an angel of the Lord in a flame of fire in a bush.Rv2the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire. 2Thess.ALL Jb18.5light of the ungodly shall be quenched, and their flame shall not go up.
@ArboriusOwns go ahead and play your silly reasonings and wash away simple truth. This is why I stopped teaching people. Because they will argue with fruitless points and even dismiss it when they admit you are right. I can count on one had of over 70000 people I talked to that actually repented. If you didn't get what I was referring to in ALL that little bit of scripture I posted, then this message is probably not for you, tat is unless you want to work out your salvation with it. REFLECT/READ
@ChristianArmorOfGod Hey I am always willing to discuss scripture. You aren't very clear in the point you're trying to make maybe these little comment sections aren't large enough for you to express yourself clearly. I know I run out of space to say what I want all the time and have to cut back and abbreviate. Feel free to email me if you think that will get your point across better.
@ChristianArmorOfGod Matthew 17:9As they were coming down the mountain, Jesus instructed them, “Don’t tell anyone what you have seen, until the Son of Man has been raised from the dead.”
It's not a vision Jesus was transfigured in front of them
Matthew 17:2 There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light.
Jesus commanded them, saying, Tell the vision to no man
Jesus commanded them, "Tell no one the vision
Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man
Subject matter is not about Jesus it's about the Vision.
Eccl 9.5the dead know not any thing
Acts 2: 29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
God made mans spirit, and it is not eternal.... unless covered under blood of Jesus
@ChristianArmorOfGod Matthew 17:9 (New Living Translation)“Don’t tell anyone what you have seen until
Matthew 17:9 (New International Version“Don’t tell anyone what you have seen,
Matthew 17:9 (Contemporary English Version)not to tell anyone what they had seen until
I think what you are missing is that Moses and Elijah were there talking with Jesus and Peter didn't make 3 shelters for a vision also "There in front of the disciples, Jesus was completely changed."
@ArboriusOwns True, parables are a simple story illustrating a moral lesson. In the case of "The rich man and Lazarus", if it were taken literally, it would mean that those enjoying divine favor could all fit at the bosom of one man, Abraham; that the water on one’s fingertip would not be evaporated by the fire of Hades; that a mere drop of water would bring relief to one suffering there. ? If it were literal, it would conflict with other parts of the Bible (Eccl 9:5, 10; Rom 6:7; Rom 6:23)
@willhedoright I don't see why Jesus would comeup with an illustration that uses heaven and hell and an immortal soul if those weren't true. Why would he confuse people with his story if it didn't agree with the things he was teaching. If he was teaching we don't have a soul and there is no hell, then he uses a story with those issues, that would create alot of confusion. Since he did teach we have a soul and there is a hell, that story made sense to those that were listening to him that day.
@JAT002 The beginning of creation regarding man states "and the man came to be a living soul." (Genesis 2:7) Many bible translations render it that way, that man became "a living soul", (not "given a soul") meaning not a part of man, but the whole man. The apostle Paul shows that the Christian teaching did not differ from the earlier Hebrew teaching, for he quotes Genesis 2:7 @ 1Co 15:45-47, saying "‘The first man Adam became a living soul...The first man is out of the earth and made of dust"
@ArboriusOwns “when they heard of a resurrection of the dead, some began to mock.” (Acts 17:29-34)
Understand Arborious, that there is a first resurrection and a second. The first ressurection (1 Thess 4:16) are of those who have a heavenly calling (Rev 14:1) .Reread or finish reading, ch 15... "And there are heavenly bodies, and earthly bodies; but the glory of the heavenly bodies is one sort, and that of the earthly bodies is a different sort" 1 Cor 15:40
@willhedoright John wrote revelations while in exile he wrote in codes because Christians were persecuted the 12000 from each tribe and the 144000 were his way of saying a great multitude.
Revelation 19:1 After this I heard what sounded like the roar of a great multitude in heaven shouting: “Hallelujah!
most religious leaders hold that God made this fiery hell to torment ppl forever, except those "predestined" for salvation righ? The hellfire teaching is based on a fallacy that allure men to believing the God is cruel and unjust. C'mon, A God that would use his power to create human beings, who he foreknew and predestined to be eternally tormented, could neither be wise, just, nor loving. His standard would be lower than that of many men. Fortunately, Jehovah, the true God of Israel, does not..
(cont2) act in such a manner... Greek philosophy (philosophers such as Plato, Socrates) often taught that the soul is immortal when the bible says that man became a "living soul" and that "the soul that is sinning will die" (Gen 2:7; Ezek 18:4) ... Also, immortality is a gift that the True God bestows upon the faithful, not a gift he bestows upon the wicked.. so how can the wicked have an immortal soul?
@willhedoright Just thought I'd mention, I looked up my copy of "Reasoning from the Scriptures. That answer of yours is right there on pages 174 and 175.
@willhedoright Parables teach in a way that is understandable to humans. Eccl 9:5,10 describes the dead in relation to the world. The dead know nothing of their past life they get no further rewards from their labor during life and they will be forgotten in time. Rom 6:7 those who are dead can no longer sin because there is no sin in hades Rom 6:10 flat out says there is eternal life
there is neither working nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom.
@ArboriusOwns Rom 6:7 "For he that has died is justified from sin." -Darby ... "because there is no sin in hades"??? well, what if you were set for Gehenna, or Sheol? No, let me stop that was actually rhetorical. Um, Ecclesiastes 9:5,10 is not a parable .. it is the condition that mankind experience. Once again, when Solomon lived, Christ had not yet come as a ransom so how could his shed blood yet apply to them?
@willhedoright There was an after life since the beginning I never said the after life began because Jesus shed his blood. The gates of Heaven were opened because Jesus opened them when he led those unjustly imprisoned up to heaven.
@ArboriusOwns Death was and still is being unconscious of anything at all. From the Adam, to Solomon, to even our modern day living...We will be resting in peace (R.I.P.) until (Dan 12:2; Acts 24:15, Rev 20:12)
"Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will hear his voice and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life, those who practiced vile things to a resurrection of judgment" - John 5:28,29
@willhedoright Isa. 14:19 the king is cast out of his grave (kever) in order to be thrown into Sheol where the departed spirits can rebuke him
Phil. 1:22 If I am to go on living in the body, this will mean fruitful labor for me. Yet what shall I choose? I do not know! 23 I am torn between the two: I desire to depart and be with Christ, which is better by far; 24 but it is more necessary for you that I remain in the body.
@willhedoright 2 Peter 1:13 I think it is right to refresh your memory as long as I live in the tent of this body, 14 because I know that I will soon put it aside, as our Lord Jesus Christ has made clear to me. 15 And I will make every effort to see that after my departure you will always be able to remember these things.
@ArboriusOwns Brother, think of this logically. Christ had not yet ransomed himself for all mankind, yet here was Elijah and Moses standing before him. How could anyone who, inherited sin (Rom 5:12), be rescued from sin, before Jesus offered himself as a ransom. Jesus' death had not yet taken place. Do you understand why Jesus had died for all mankind??? But this is just my reasoning... Not that of anyone else.
@willhedoright 1 Sam 28:1-20 Samuel appeared he was disturbed from from his rest in Hades/Sheol which Hades/Sheol is described in The Rich man and Lazarus as a place divided into 2. A place of torture and a place of paradise the paradise Jesus mentions on the cross when he told the thief hanging with him that today you will be with me in paradise. Because Saul broke the law & command of God he was punished by losing his kingdom and being delivered into the hands of the Philistines.
@ArboriusOwns in the Mosaic Law, it is written that "There should not be found in you anyone......consults a spirit medium or a professional foreteller of events or anyone who inquires of the dead." Deut 18:10-12 ...Yet n 1 Sam Chapter 28, King Saul decides to break God's law @ Deut 18. True, the witch of Endor claimed to get in touch with the dead, but yo she could not have, for the dead are unconscious, asleep in the grave. (Ps. 146:3, 4; Eccl. 9:5, 10) .... WHen reading 1 Sam have you.....
@ArboriusOwns ....actually took that into reasoning? Why do you suppose God would actually say in Deut 18:10-12, to avoid spiritism ... and wha bro??? the Scriptures say regarding sauL “Saul died for his unfaithfulness . . . and also for asking of a spirit medium to make inquiry.” (1 Chronicles 10:13) Saul wasnt speaking to "Samuel" ... he was talking to demons.
@illwillcpt83 Yes and JW's don't believe your spirit goes on after you're death. They believe you are sleeping in the grave so how could a spirit appear to anyone?
there are two things that man must have in order to be and stay alive: spirit and breath.
“If he [God] sets his heart upon anyone, if that one’s spirit and breath he gathers to himself, all flesh will expire together, and earthling man himself will return to the very dust." -Job 34:14, 15
@willhedoright Thanks for your useless scriptures to help me to inherit Gods kingdom. I just love how ALL of you JWS bypass Jesus. Funny how you JWS always pass or overlook Jn.3:1-16. Jn.3:3-" truly truly I say to you. unless one is BORN AGAIN he cannot see Gods kingdom. You see that buddy-you will not see Gods kingdom, and by the way, for those who are born again, are alrerady aprt of Gods kingdom, its here alrerady, it just gets better in the future. Sorry you will not see or experience.
@mosherincexjw ? Scriptures are now useless? When have any scripture been useless? (2 tim 3:16) Furthermore, how do i bypass Jesus when the very first scripture i referenced, is what Jesus said... it is written "This means everlasting life, their taking in knowledge of you, the only true God, and of the one whom you sent forth, Jesus Christ." -John 17:3 Moreover, when has any human become judge to tell another that he will not experience/see God's kingdom, based on not mentioning a scripture ?
Amen Amen! The sad thing is, the WTS/jws have an answer for this. Of course its very twisted, but nonetheless thet have an answer. Notice that everything that they have an answer for is the things pertaining to HOPE. The only thing they look foward to is Armageddon. That should be a dead give-a-away why we should walk the other way. I guess Satan is looking foward to Armageddon as well so shall his followers- alot of people are going to die and this includes the jws who unknowingly follow Satan
@mosherincexjw "the only thing" very untrue. While it is true that we look forward to armaggedon, we also look forward to the day where loved ones will return from the grave. Where we would not suffer from the imperfections that we inherited from Adam (Rev 21:3,4) Satan knows that he has a short time left, and he doesnt look forward to Armageddon.
@JAT002 We are admonished to "keep on the watch" (Matt 24:42) Therefore look forward to Jehovah's day, not in a sense of rejoicing, but understanding that Jehovah will be vindicating his name and sovereignty. Those will be times of destructive judgment against the nations who despise Jah. But knowing whats to take place after Armageddon; resurrected love ones, healing of the nations etc, gives hope..
"awaiting and keeping close in mind the presence of the day of Jehovah" (2 Peter 3:11,12)
@willhedoright the New World Translation adds "Jehovah" into the New Testament 237 times, where there is absolutely no ancient manuscript evidence of any kind to support it.
@willhedoright The Tetragrammaton YHWH the New World Translation adds "Jehovah" into the New Testament 237 times, where there is absolutely no ancient manuscript evidence of any kind to support it. You're referring to the JW belief that the name of God was removed by the Church which if it was true would make the entire NT regardless of who's version you read illegitimate.
Obviously the other comments are of reasoning beyond "Reasoning from the scriptures", but that of my own, maybe thats why you are alluding my previous question ...
@willhedoright Sorry to tell you this. Hallelujah is Hebrew. They did not call him Jah. They called him Lord and he is referred to in the old testament as YHWH. Do you think God likes to be called by an informal nick name like pete, joe, bill? Isn't that disrespectful to the God of all creation?
@JAT002 In fact no it isnt disrespectful to call Jehovah, Jehovah. If you call on a friend, yet you do not know his name, how could he view as such when his name is not remembered by you. Many times throughout the bible, God's name has been a key issue. Take the Pharaoh of Moses' day. Jehovah told Pharaoh "I have kept you in existence, for the sake of showing you my power and in order to have my name declared in all the earth" -Ex 9:16 ... Jah (see tetragrammaton) could have easily dismantled..
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teenprepper96 7 months ago
I dont belieave in any god so I think this is useless, but ArboriusOwns I like your rabbit vids
teenprepper96 8 months ago
@teenprepper96 I'm glad you like my rabbit videos and I hope your unscientific belief that nothing created everything works out for you.
ArboriusOwns 7 months ago
@teenprepper96 Im not athiest or anything Im a branch of pegan thats believes in mothernature, not as a god but still a creater, through energy
teenprepper96 7 months ago
@teenprepper96 You're part of a growing population that puts more faith in the creation than in the creator. You have ignored Gods moral law and replaced it with not littering so you can be as immoral as you want and believe there is no consequences for your actions. Unfortunately God will judge you by His law not your man made law. Recycling and using special light bulbs will not get you into heaven.
What created energy?
ArboriusOwns 7 months ago
@ArboriusOwns Im not questioning your religion so please dont question mine, all faiths have unanswered questions, and I respect your beliefs so please respect mine
teenprepper96 7 months ago
@teenprepper96 Seems you have a problem with a blunt description of your worship of the creation. My only question was "What created energy?" The most intelligent species you know of can't create the smallest spec of matter yet you believe it was created by accident by energy so my question is were did energy come from?
ArboriusOwns 7 months ago
@ArboriusOwns Where did your god come from, what created it
teenprepper96 7 months ago
@teenprepper96 God created time "Gen 1:1 In the beginning" Before time & still today God existed outside of time & space in a place called eternity. He is not a created being which means His origins are not at question. Energy is fueled by something created, oil gas sun petroleum etc. How can energy which needs fuel create everything if it needs creation to fuel its self? Energy does not think. How can a non thinking creator create laws like gravity inertia etc?
ArboriusOwns 7 months ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Sorry but I have to remove this comment try to remember this is an adult conversation for mature adults no blasphemy please. It's so easy to drop that kind of language from your vocabulary especially when you have that extra time between typing something that shows your ignorance and clicking post.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns John 5:39-40 (New International Version, ©2010)
39 You study[a] the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, 40 yet you refuse to come to me to have life.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns You really should get away from the NIV there are copious problems with that one.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns That was not blasphemy you just can't read and do not understand the Godly message I wrote. Kinda like a few 7th day adventist I know.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Psalms 86:10: For thou art great, and doest wondrous things: thou art God alone.
Isaiah 37:16: O LORD of hosts, God of Israel, that dwellest between the cherubims, thou art the God, even thou alone, of all the kingdoms of the earth: thou hast made heaven and earth.
Matthew 4:4: But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Matthew 26:64 (New International Version, ©2010) 64 “You have said so,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: From now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”
Jesus is the Son of Man the Father is the Mighty One
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
O mighty one... you still do not understand because you know not the whole bible story. Perhaps if you would learn exactly Why Jesus was REQUIRED to come and die it will open up to you. Sitting at the right hand of Omnipotence, it's an Idiom, means in Power of God. Worker of Miracle / power / force, alluding to the commander-in-chief of his force and his triumphant return. God girds man with His power like in Psa 18.32 & Psa 21.all specially weight the last verse out and see if it makes sense.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Isa 41.14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I will help thee, saith the LORD, and thy redeemer, the Holy One of Israel. 43.14 Thus saith the LORD, your redeemer, the Holy One of Israel
Isaiah 44:6: Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod I'm done arguing with you this conversation is way off topic. The point of this video is not to say believe what I believe or go to hell. It is a plea for JW's to examine the bible without the watchtower organization telling them what it means. The watchtower is lying to them. You don't have to understand every word of the bible to go to heaven you only have to repent and believe and believing means you believe Jesus is God.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
We Must Obey. Belief alone is not enough. The devil/satan if you will, he believes... many people believe or else Jesus would not tell them to DEPART From Me! The point and problem is that the "hell doctrine" and the belief of an 'everliving soul" works to destroy Gods message. Problem is that the JW's got part of the puzzle RIGHT, it's just convoluted with a lot of filthy POLLUTION which is not likely to be addressed because of what they are taught and agreed neglect to look up scripture 4 self
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Jer 3.14 Turn, O backsliding children, saith the LORD; for I am married unto you: and I will take you one of a city, and two of a family, and I will bring you to Zion:
Rev 19.7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod John 5:17 In his defense Jesus said to them, “My Father is always at his work to this very day, and I too am working.”
Matthew 28:18 (New International Version, ©2010)
18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.
If Jesus was the Father then who gave him authority who had authority before it was given to Jesus?
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Do you want to keep going there? You should read the whole thing and think... read past 20
Go therefore to teach all nations about NT/baptizing ie the circumcision Colossians 2.11-12 the person being baptized is putting off something old (OT) and being initiated into something new (NT) - covenants. You got to THINK. The willingness to let God/Jesus be their Director/Master/Head/King. This does not annul the adoption or the law. Jn 1.1-14 Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Are you going to answer the question about any of the questions I asked or are you going to continue your aThiest training.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod I answered each of your questions. If you can't find them check your email it should be easier for you there
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Why did the man in this story only want a Tiny Drop of Water?
Why did he not ask for a Bucket? A river? an Ocean full of water?
Rv 19.12,2.8,1.14 Hb 1.7, 2thes1.8,Acts 7.30 and only here in the NT have this same word here but with another word added to show fire. Here in the parable does not. The other word is strong's 4442, the word here in question flame is 5395.
Do you know how to use a Strongs?
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Why did the man in this story only want a Tiny Drop of Water? Why did he not ask for a Bucket? A river? an Ocean full of water? He was begging for any amount of mercy even just a drop of water.
Do you know how to use a Strongs? never even heard of a strongs
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Ezekiel 33.11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?
If there is a Second death, and that is reserved for the wicked, their executed judgment, why would they live for tens, hundreds, thousands and perhaps tens of thousands of years in hell, before the judgment -- are you selling purgatory like the catholics?
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Job 3:17-22 "There the wicked cease from raging, And there the weary are at rest. "The prisoners are at ease together; They do not hear the voice of the taskmaster. "The small and the great are there, And the slave is free from his master. "Why is light given to him who suffers, And life to the bitter of soul; Who long for death, but there is none, And dig for it more than for hidden treasures; Who rejoice greatly, They exult when they find the grave?
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Once again, you are pitting scripture against itself based upon a subjective wish that aligns with your views. Let the bible tell from itself what it is saying. First off Job is a very complicated book, it is easy to get lost and one has to be very careful with whom is speaking and really read whole chapters and even several chapters in groups/like verses. If you are convinced this is proof of your position, are you willing to wager all your claim to this stake?
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod "If you are convinced this is proof of your position, are you willing to wager all your claim to this stake?"
Ok are you saying that if I am wrong about the afterlife that I go to hell?
Also you are the one using scripture against scripture this is my video you came here I didn't come looking for you
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns That's not what is meant by using scripture against scripture. Go look it up it's called "PITTING scripture against Scripture".
No that's not what I'm saying, but the reality is that it could lead there, for one, because this everlasting bbq pit does lead many in the wrong direction.
If you even understood the basic reason why Jesus actually had to come, then you would be better light to see the rest, an example of the hell doctrines we are discussing.
WhyJesusDie if he was GOD?
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Read 16-19 in a tiny group of reflection and read 20-22 together read them in respect to the whole of scripture here in Job 3.
The bible is not necessarily Linear dialogue and neither can you justify your position from the whole chapter here, however if that is your intent I suggest you refrain from posting to this message and make a video reply so I can tear into your flimsy proposition.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Got some questions for you. Well you're definitely Arian but are you a JW? Do you believe Jesus is God? Do you believe in the Godhead/trinity? What Bible are you using?
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns No JW but have had colleagues that were.
No trinity here, only one God. Father came in the form of the Son as the Father in the flesh who dwelt among us because of his Law it was required, and set-up if you will - premeditated. They both send the helper ie the holy Spirit, there are more than one holy spirit by the way (side note). Godhead - Kinda like a company CEO/President/Operating partner --- relationship in my mind.
I use several. KJV, Septuagint, Geneva, YLT, Weymouth, etc
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod The Bible is very clear that the Father and Son have 2 distinct personalities When Jesus was baptized the Father spoke from heaven about the Son. We are told to baptize in the name of the Father Son and Holy Spirit when Jesus was on the cross he said my God why have you forsaken me. The 3 are mention together as separate individuals countless times in the bible.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Separate individuals? That's your doctrine.. interpretation... but you can't claim the bible state it countless times.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Yes I'm sure someone has counted please forgive me for overstating I forget sometimes that your superior to me the Father Son and Holy Spirit are mentioned together many times indicating a triunion. anyway I'm going to work I'm sure you have more to say but you'll have to wait until tomorrow for my response.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Jesus was the Father clothed in the flesh. God declared in the OT he would be the one to save. And By His own Very Law - It required Him to Die because of His Word to his People that he married. God had to come himself in the Flesh to free her from the law... No one else could satisfy the law, God is a law doer. Hope this simpleton description can sink home through your mental blockade. If Jesus was anyone but the Father, then there is NO redemption. Just the facts Jack.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Jesus was not an avatar you watch too many cartoons. God was the one who saved Jesus is God but only 1 member of the trinity. You seem to think that just because God spoke in the OT that it was the Father speaking. People may not have understood that there were 3 persons in 1 God during OT times but that doesn't mean the trinity didn't exist then.gen 1:26“Let us make mankind" gen 3:22“become like one of us" gen 11:7 gen 19:24 has 2 lords destroying Sodom & Gomorrah
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Genesis 19:24 (Young's Literal Translation) 24and Jehovah hath rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from Jehovah, from the heavens;
Look Jehovah rained upon from Jehovah 2 persons 2 individuals
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
You jest - don't tell me your this foolish.
I Cor 8.6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him. Eze18.4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die. Isa 54.5 For thy Maker is thine husband; the LORD of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Isaiah 43:11: I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Isaiah 44.8:...... ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.
Isaiah 45.5 I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me 6That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Isaiah 45:21: Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.
Hosea 13:4: Yet I am the LORD thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: for there is no saviour beside me.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Rev1.8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
Rev22.13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
Isa 41.4 Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he.
Isa 48.12 Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Isa. 14: 9 The realm of the dead below is all astir to meet you at your coming;
it rouses the spirits of the departed to greet you— all those who were leaders in the world;
it makes them rise from their thrones— all those who were kings over the nations.
10 They will all respond, they will say to you,
“You also have become weak, as we are; you have become like us.”
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns READ all of isa 14 instead of taking something out of context
I will not continue your charade much longer
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod We've been having this conversation all morning and I still have no idea what you believe you posting scripture that have nothing to do with this video or the after life. I've asked what Bible you use no answer I asked you o email me to better explain your point you haven't so perhaps you're right we should end this conversation
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns You can't see because of your doctrinal beliefs.Let's try this. One question at a time.
Is it your contention that there is a punishing hell?
That this hell is different from the hell we go to when we die?
The hades/hell is for a time for duration before the return of Jesus and his Judgment with punishing hell?
The punishing hell last a bit then over?
That the spirit of man has eternal existence in one of two places?
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod I'd like to know who indoctrinated me. I was an atheist until about 10 years ago then only became a Christian after studying the bible over the last 4-5 years.
Nothing but love for you but you'll have to answer my questions 1st. If you reply again without answering my questions I'll assume you're a troll and block you.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Sounds like you still are an a-Thiest. I've dealt with for years, and tens of thousands of hours. I asked the questions below which you refuse to answer to get us on the same page. Block me if you will... anyone with a brain can tell I am no troll. I have been blocked and closed down on hundreds of postings and channels, it would be nothing but confirmation of your true nature if you did.
What reasons did you have to "become a Christian" and HOW does that process work? did you follow the bible?
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod You remind me of Saul who was full of pride. He could trace his line back to David memorized books of the Bible even persecuted & killed Christians but after meeting Jesus he compared his past accomplishments to filthy menstrual rages. Or the pharisees who tried many times to humiliate Jesus. Pride is very dangerous & your love of yourself is clear in how you talk down to me. Your arrogant prideful tone is why you are rejected by so many.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns You should show love for others when you evangelize not love for yourself. You point out their sin convict them of being a sinner explain the punishment in store for them and explain that Jesus to their punishment if they repent and believe. Your overbearing pride will not only turn people away from you but it will turn them away from Christ
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns I can trace many of my lines to Adam. But is that alone worth life - No, never claimed so. I don't have anything in Godly with any such pride that you allude to. Sounds like you need to look in the mirror.
I cn assure you I have not been talking down to you, but the truth is that you are showing to me that you need some help in your understandings because you trust too much what YOU think opposed to what the Word declares
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Yep you definately need to work on your pride issues
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod What reasons did you have to "become a Christian" and HOW does that process work? did you follow the bible?
My kids showed me the way. I looked through their eye's and saw the world in a new light. After that I bought a bible and started reading and examining what others believed and how that stacked up to the bible. Jesus said to be like a child so I guess I did follow the bible even before I read it.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Is it your contention that there is a punishing hell? Yes there is a punishing hell
That this hell is different from the hell we go to when we die? not sure I think the punishment side of sheol/hades might be hell and the lake of fire final death.
The hades/hell is for a time for duration before the return of Jesus and his Judgment with punishing hell? see above
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod The punishing hell last a bit then over? answer to both questions below
That the spirit of man has eternal existence in one of two places?
I believe eternity is a place or dimension outside ours not a time frame. God created time in Gen 1:1In the beginning God created. I believe God can flip through time the way you or I would flip through the pages of a history book.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Not an answer. Does Man have a spirit that is eternal or limited unless extended by God through Jesus?
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Does Man have a spirit that is eternal or limited unless extended by God through Jesus?
Again I don't believe eternity is an amount of time it is a place. If you insist on eternity being an amount of time then only God is eternal only God is alpha and omega.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
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Malachi 4:
1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Psalms 37:
20 But the wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the LORD shall be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall they consume away.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Jn 5.28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. James1.15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death John 3.6For God...gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod "all that are in the graves shall hear his voice," Sheol/Hades means place of the dead or the grave
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Yes they will. He will call your name and say wake or come to me. You are making an assumption that they are awake and have full knowledge the whole time. The dead know not. Daniel 12.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. RichMan and Lazarus.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod I never said they have full knowledge the dead have no knowledge of the living or of what is happening in the world
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Revelation of John 21:
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Lk 20:37 But in the account of the burning bush, even Moses showed that the dead rise, for he calls the Lord ‘the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’[a] 38 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living, for to him all are alive.”
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
You are leaving intentionally or un intentionally KEY elements out, you are cutting and pasting to fit your doctrine, you are PITTING scripture against itself even when the context shows the correct pretext. You should go and think on how and why you respond like pavlovs dog.
Carefully read Luke 20 from34-38
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
33 Therefore in the resurrection.... 34The children of this world.... 35they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead...
36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.
37 Now that the dead are raised, even Moses shewed at the bush, when he calleth the Lord the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.
38 For he is not a God of the dead....
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod 26Now about the dead rising—have you not read in the Book of Moses, in the account of the burning bush, how God said to him, ‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’[d]?27 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living. You are badly mistaken!”
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod 37 But in the account of the burning bush, even Moses showed that the dead rise, for he calls the Lord ‘the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’ 38 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living, for to him all are alive.”
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Lk 20:37 But in the account of the burning bush, even Moses showed that the dead rise, for he calls the Lord ‘the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’[a] 38 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living, for to him all are alive.”
Moses: 1500 BC & Elijah: 730 BC in Mt 17:1-5 they both appear in front of the disciples.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Like the Holy Book says, it's a Vision.
Time of Christ advanced Movie or TV setting. Does not mean it was an actual event.
Matthew 10.
28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Who is able to destroy the BODY and SOUL?
What is Jesus Real Illustration?
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Lazarus and the rich man is not a vision it is a parable. Which version of the bible are you using because your bible is way differrent than the ones I am using
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns They are all parables look at the beginning of the stories... Moses Elias Vision.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod parables teach about real things or real meanings
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Stop playing semantics AO
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Why would Jesus use from Pagan false doctrine in the parable of the rich man and Lazarus? (Luke 16:19-31)
Rev 6:9-11I saw underneath the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God ... and they cried out with a loud voice,
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Again you need to read all of Rev 6, and take it all in instead of picking which verses you choose to ignore to suit your agenda. The BLOOD cries from the ground does it not? If you want to argue 1 point and one point only and REST all your arguments on your one point, then lets move forward but if you want to throw up dust in the air and play what abouts then you are wasting my time.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod exactly, and the fact there is a second death, means what it sounds. No second hell visit, an eternal vacation, but the consequences last eternally, just like the Revelation story of the smoke eternally... this event will be forever removed and vanished away when the wicked are removed - from our minds, nature that leads us to destruction et al.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
II Peter 2.9 The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished. Jn12.48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. Mt13.41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that ...which do iniquity42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire...
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
One more thing, Read isa 1.all Very carefully, and focus on two verses in light of this discussion V 6, and V 28. Think on this: they that forsake the LORD shall be consumed. v29 For they shall be ashamed...Mt8.10-12many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob....cast out into outer darkness. Lk13.28-29 & Mt13.37-38.
One is the SEED of the promise and the other has no part. One blesses the world the other CURSES.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Sorry Esau = RichMan
Also HEll probably includes with a special twist of divine justice here, those that FELL away from Jesus/faith in support of the world favors
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
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ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Isa66.15-16,24 the world is already ruled by “the antichrist” and todays preachers/churches for the most part are his little henchmen singing his doctrine.The story of Lazarus is a VISION and just exactly what Jesus did here and often, tell a PARABLE. It is not the literal analysis of heaven and hell. Heaven is for God, Not Man. Ps115.16 The heaven, even the heavens, are the LORD'S: but the earth hath he given to the children of men. This is very much liken to the PARABLE of the TARES
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod no it isn't a literal description of heaven and hell. It's Jesus describing Hades(not Heaven or hell) in a way the human mind can better understand. Hades is divided into a paradise and a place of torment. After Jesus died on the cross he led those unjustly imprisoned from paradise in Hades up to Heaven. That's why Jesus told the criminal on the cross today you will be with me in paradise. The criminal on his other side didn't repent he went to the torment side of Hades.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Hades/Sheol means place of the dead. It isn't Heaven or hell. Well the torment side might be hell but I always felt that hell is during judgment when Hades is cast into the lake of fire.
I also don't believe eternity is a length of time I think it is a place. God exists for all eternity even before he created time in gen1 "In the beginning" God exists in eternity and created man and subjected us to time. I don't really have anything scriptural to back that up it's just what I feel.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
The hell people think about does exist and is RESERVED unto judgment but lasts for a brief time.
Job 21.30 That the wicked is reserved to the day of destruction? they shall be brought forth to the day of wrath. psa37.9 For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth.
10 For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
Key is that you refuse to look into the words and think, shame on you. You are liken to the rich man here. The rich man is the then jewish/even now jewish/Babylonian system that opposes God - today it's many Church-ians who believe preachers over Biblical believers. Just by using the word Hades, the people would know the story was in metaphors (the word from GREEK mythology). Why would the lost be able to dialogue with the "Saved"? Why do you refuse to walk in anyones counsel rather than Gods?
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Sheol means place of the dead when the old testament was translated to Greek Sheol was translated to Hades same meaning in some translations to english Hades was translated to hell which doesn't mean place of the dead. The NT was written in greek so what you are saying is that because revolations uses the word Hades it is metaphor?
Revelation 20:14
Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Durning the interim from time of death to Resurrection the dead KNOW not.
Revelation of John 22:
12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Jude 1:
7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
Concerning Sodom Gen 19.17 ....escape to the mountain, lest thou be consumed.
You can't read whatever you want into a text.
Suffering the vengeance is to be consumed, to be consumed is to have nothing left... most people are reserved UNTO judgment...
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod 2 Cor. 12:2-4
2 Peter 1:13 I think it is right to refresh your memory as long as I live in the tent of this body, 14 because I know that I will soon put it aside, as our Lord Jesus Christ has made clear to me. 15 And I will make every effort to see that after my departure you will always be able to remember these things.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Lk 8:52 Meanwhile, all the people were wailing and mourning for her. “Stop wailing,” Jesus said. “She is not dead but asleep.” 53 They laughed at him, knowing that she was dead. 54 But he took her by the hand and said, “My child, get up!” 55 Her spirit returned, and at once she stood up. Then Jesus told them to give her something to eat. 56 Her parents were astonished, but he ordered them not to tell anyone what had happened.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Isa. 14: 9 The realm of the dead below is all astir to meet you at your coming;
it rouses the spirits of the departed to greet you—
all those who were leaders in the world;
it makes them rise from their thrones— all those who were kings over the nations.
10 They will all respond, they will say to you,
“You also have become weak, as we are; you have become like us.”
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns True Sheol and Hades are words related to death . Some Bible translations render them as “grave,” “hell,” or “pit.” However, Gehenna is the word Jesus used which many take to heart when thinking of some place of torture. Gehenna was a place for dumping refuse, outside the walls of Jerusalem. Its fires were kept burning to prevent pestilence. Sulphur or brimstone was added to help the burning. The “lake of fire” is also a symbolic term for everlasting destruction none the less.
illwillcpt83 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns If hell is the lake of fire, as many say, how can it be cast into itself?
illwillcpt83 1 year ago
@illwillcpt83 I don't think I ever called Hades hell. Hades is divided into 2 sections a section of suffering and a section of paradise. For example Catholics believe Jesus died and descended into hell to battle Satan or defeat sin or continue suffering for mans sins whatever it's different every time. Now on the cross Jesus said to the thief next to him today you will be with me in paradise not hell. After Jesus died he went to the paradise side of Hades to lead the wrongfully accused to Heaven
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Romans 6.23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Do you honestly believe God would ALLOW those that HATE and CURSE him who lived a BRIEF flicker in "time" to LIVE eternally through his DIRECT POWER AND WILL and allow them to CURSE him?
Consider what happened in Genesis 3, read ALL of it and actually THINK and Reflect.
If the penalty for sin is an Everlasting BBQ, how did Jesus Death Pay for us all.
You don't know the bible story.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
V9, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.
It was a vision. And you have to take into account the arguments of the people at the time... Long and the short of it, there are plenty of supporting scriptures against a conscious "soul" after death. There in fact is No Everliving spirit of a man unless granted from Jesus. You don't have judgment to the end, and we have not reached the end... not biblical sound reasoning. Good Fiction
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod V9 of what book? The Rich Man and Lazarus is Luke 16:19-31 every scriptures against a conscious "soul" after death that I've read was from the perspective of man but God always spoke of the afterlife at least from my studies.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Mt17. Don't try to pit scripture against scripture.
Use all of scripture: Lk16.31 If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. Jesus went to hell. David and other patriarchs too. {CAREFULLY consider vs. 25, 26} Jg8.26 who wears purple? Mk15.16-18 clothed Jesus in Purple -soldiers put a purple robe on Him to represent Christ the RULER. Also:Ex28.1-5,Lv 6, 16,Eze9,Dn10, 12, Rv 19.8 -priest of God. Rev 17 Babylon, ut the pieces together.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Luke 16:31“He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.’” Who is speaking and who is he speaking to if Abraham and the rich man are uncontentious?
"Jesus went to hell" Jesus went to the paradise side of Hades were Abraham & Lazarus were.
Luke 23:43
Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
I'm not sure what your point is with the rest of the scripture
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Eccl 9.3 there is one event unto all:... they live, and after that they go to the dead.
You are READING into scripture what you want, that's not using the whole counsel of God, you can't pick and choose you must read in harmony for the whole. 2Tm 3.16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine.
If Jesus did not actually die then there is NO forgiveness of sins. Death was the only way to release Israel from the terms of the law. So she then could remarry.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Hades is the place of the dead.
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,
Jesus did die who said he didn't?
Ecclesiastes 12:7 and the dust returns to the ground it came from, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Luke16.22,23.Get a Strongs Concordance - study on the word torment.Acts20.37,38 use Strongs. Consider Hb1.7of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire. Acts7And when forty years were expired, there appeared to him in the wilderness of mount Sina an angel of the Lord in a flame of fire in a bush.Rv2the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire. 2Thess.ALL Jb18.5light of the ungodly shall be quenched, and their flame shall not go up.
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns go ahead and play your silly reasonings and wash away simple truth. This is why I stopped teaching people. Because they will argue with fruitless points and even dismiss it when they admit you are right. I can count on one had of over 70000 people I talked to that actually repented. If you didn't get what I was referring to in ALL that little bit of scripture I posted, then this message is probably not for you, tat is unless you want to work out your salvation with it. REFLECT/READ
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Hey I am always willing to discuss scripture. You aren't very clear in the point you're trying to make maybe these little comment sections aren't large enough for you to express yourself clearly. I know I run out of space to say what I want all the time and have to cut back and abbreviate. Feel free to email me if you think that will get your point across better.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Matthew 17:9As they were coming down the mountain, Jesus instructed them, “Don’t tell anyone what you have seen, until the Son of Man has been raised from the dead.”
It's not a vision Jesus was transfigured in front of them
Matthew 17:2 There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Jesus commanded them, saying, Tell the vision to no man
Jesus commanded them, "Tell no one the vision
Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man
Subject matter is not about Jesus it's about the Vision.
Eccl 9.5the dead know not any thing
Acts 2: 29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
God made mans spirit, and it is not eternal.... unless covered under blood of Jesus
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
@ChristianArmorOfGod Matthew 17:9 (New Living Translation)“Don’t tell anyone what you have seen until
Matthew 17:9 (New International Version“Don’t tell anyone what you have seen,
Matthew 17:9 (Contemporary English Version)not to tell anyone what they had seen until
I think what you are missing is that Moses and Elijah were there talking with Jesus and Peter didn't make 3 shelters for a vision also "There in front of the disciples, Jesus was completely changed."
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Lazarus=Me/Israel - Bible Christians followers of the law
Esau=NWO/Commie Mystery whore Church Slut Babylon
Abrahams bosom=Rest when Clothed in Christ's Blood through repentance and Baptism
Hell/Torments=Me vs World Church and their FALL away from Love of truth into a judiazed Teaching
The GULF=VAST expanse (180% apart) in Biblical and Actual living; one is wicked the other repentant
Common theme in scripture is to OBEY, to follow Law, be a law keeper like Master King Jesus, you do or don't
ChristianArmorOfGod 1 year ago
My question to you ArboriusOwns, are we to take Jesus parables literally or symbolically?
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright Parables are how Jesus explained things in human terms so we could better understand.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns True, parables are a simple story illustrating a moral lesson. In the case of "The rich man and Lazarus", if it were taken literally, it would mean that those enjoying divine favor could all fit at the bosom of one man, Abraham; that the water on one’s fingertip would not be evaporated by the fire of Hades; that a mere drop of water would bring relief to one suffering there. ? If it were literal, it would conflict with other parts of the Bible (Eccl 9:5, 10; Rom 6:7; Rom 6:23)
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright I don't see why Jesus would comeup with an illustration that uses heaven and hell and an immortal soul if those weren't true. Why would he confuse people with his story if it didn't agree with the things he was teaching. If he was teaching we don't have a soul and there is no hell, then he uses a story with those issues, that would create alot of confusion. Since he did teach we have a soul and there is a hell, that story made sense to those that were listening to him that day.
JAT002 1 year ago
@JAT002 The beginning of creation regarding man states "and the man came to be a living soul." (Genesis 2:7) Many bible translations render it that way, that man became "a living soul", (not "given a soul") meaning not a part of man, but the whole man. The apostle Paul shows that the Christian teaching did not differ from the earlier Hebrew teaching, for he quotes Genesis 2:7 @ 1Co 15:45-47, saying "‘The first man Adam became a living soul...The first man is out of the earth and made of dust"
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright 1Co 15:45-47 became a living being
1Co 15:45 44it is sown a (BL)natural body, it is raised a (BM)spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.
"If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. "
Don't misuse incomplete scripture out of context trying to deceive people 1Co 15 clearly describes 2 bodies
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns “when they heard of a resurrection of the dead, some began to mock.” (Acts 17:29-34)
Understand Arborious, that there is a first resurrection and a second. The first ressurection (1 Thess 4:16) are of those who have a heavenly calling (Rev 14:1) .Reread or finish reading, ch 15... "And there are heavenly bodies, and earthly bodies; but the glory of the heavenly bodies is one sort, and that of the earthly bodies is a different sort" 1 Cor 15:40
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright John wrote revelations while in exile he wrote in codes because Christians were persecuted the 12000 from each tribe and the 144000 were his way of saying a great multitude.
Revelation 19:1 After this I heard what sounded like the roar of a great multitude in heaven shouting: “Hallelujah!
Salvation and glory and power belong to our God,
Oh by the way were is the great multitude?
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@willhedoright
Ah yes, Reasoning with the scriptures page 376. Do you do any of your own research like I do?
JAT002 1 year ago
most religious leaders hold that God made this fiery hell to torment ppl forever, except those "predestined" for salvation righ? The hellfire teaching is based on a fallacy that allure men to believing the God is cruel and unjust. C'mon, A God that would use his power to create human beings, who he foreknew and predestined to be eternally tormented, could neither be wise, just, nor loving. His standard would be lower than that of many men. Fortunately, Jehovah, the true God of Israel, does not..
willhedoright 1 year ago
(cont2) act in such a manner... Greek philosophy (philosophers such as Plato, Socrates) often taught that the soul is immortal when the bible says that man became a "living soul" and that "the soul that is sinning will die" (Gen 2:7; Ezek 18:4) ... Also, immortality is a gift that the True God bestows upon the faithful, not a gift he bestows upon the wicked.. so how can the wicked have an immortal soul?
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright Just thought I'd mention, I looked up my copy of "Reasoning from the Scriptures. That answer of yours is right there on pages 174 and 175.
JAT002 1 year ago
@JAT002 yes
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright Parables teach in a way that is understandable to humans. Eccl 9:5,10 describes the dead in relation to the world. The dead know nothing of their past life they get no further rewards from their labor during life and they will be forgotten in time. Rom 6:7 those who are dead can no longer sin because there is no sin in hades Rom 6:10 flat out says there is eternal life
there is neither working nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Rom 6:7 "For he that has died is justified from sin." -Darby ... "because there is no sin in hades"??? well, what if you were set for Gehenna, or Sheol? No, let me stop that was actually rhetorical. Um, Ecclesiastes 9:5,10 is not a parable .. it is the condition that mankind experience. Once again, when Solomon lived, Christ had not yet come as a ransom so how could his shed blood yet apply to them?
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright There was an after life since the beginning I never said the after life began because Jesus shed his blood. The gates of Heaven were opened because Jesus opened them when he led those unjustly imprisoned up to heaven.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Death was and still is being unconscious of anything at all. From the Adam, to Solomon, to even our modern day living...We will be resting in peace (R.I.P.) until (Dan 12:2; Acts 24:15, Rev 20:12)
"Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will hear his voice and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life, those who practiced vile things to a resurrection of judgment" - John 5:28,29
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright Isa. 14:19 the king is cast out of his grave (kever) in order to be thrown into Sheol where the departed spirits can rebuke him
Phil. 1:22 If I am to go on living in the body, this will mean fruitful labor for me. Yet what shall I choose? I do not know! 23 I am torn between the two: I desire to depart and be with Christ, which is better by far; 24 but it is more necessary for you that I remain in the body.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@willhedoright 2 Peter 1:13 I think it is right to refresh your memory as long as I live in the tent of this body, 14 because I know that I will soon put it aside, as our Lord Jesus Christ has made clear to me. 15 And I will make every effort to see that after my departure you will always be able to remember these things.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@willhedoright Moses: 1500 BC & Elijah: 730 BC in Mt 17:1-5 they both appear in front of the disciples.
1 Sam 28:1-20 Samuel died but appeared to Saul soon after
1 Sam 28:19 Saul and two sons died then joined the presence of Samuel
Isa. 14:9-11the spirits of the dead will all respond and say to you "Even you have been made weak as we, You have become like us."
Ps 90:10-12 our lives pass and we fly away
Rev 6:9-11Souls of dead Christians under altar talking to God
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Brother, think of this logically. Christ had not yet ransomed himself for all mankind, yet here was Elijah and Moses standing before him. How could anyone who, inherited sin (Rom 5:12), be rescued from sin, before Jesus offered himself as a ransom. Jesus' death had not yet taken place. Do you understand why Jesus had died for all mankind??? But this is just my reasoning... Not that of anyone else.
Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10 ...
Anyhow. compare Deut 18:10-12 to 1 Sam 28:1-20
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright 1 Sam 28:1-20 Samuel appeared he was disturbed from from his rest in Hades/Sheol which Hades/Sheol is described in The Rich man and Lazarus as a place divided into 2. A place of torture and a place of paradise the paradise Jesus mentions on the cross when he told the thief hanging with him that today you will be with me in paradise. Because Saul broke the law & command of God he was punished by losing his kingdom and being delivered into the hands of the Philistines.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns in the Mosaic Law, it is written that "There should not be found in you anyone......consults a spirit medium or a professional foreteller of events or anyone who inquires of the dead." Deut 18:10-12 ...Yet n 1 Sam Chapter 28, King Saul decides to break God's law @ Deut 18. True, the witch of Endor claimed to get in touch with the dead, but yo she could not have, for the dead are unconscious, asleep in the grave. (Ps. 146:3, 4; Eccl. 9:5, 10) .... WHen reading 1 Sam have you.....
willhedoright 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns ....actually took that into reasoning? Why do you suppose God would actually say in Deut 18:10-12, to avoid spiritism ... and wha bro??? the Scriptures say regarding sauL “Saul died for his unfaithfulness . . . and also for asking of a spirit medium to make inquiry.” (1 Chronicles 10:13) Saul wasnt speaking to "Samuel" ... he was talking to demons.
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright My Bible says Samuel and nothing about the demon you speak of you seem to be making up scripture.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Samuel appeared to Saul??? That account is about spirtism... even Satans people know that
youtube.com/watch?v=appcGkJv7z0&feature=watch_response
illwillcpt83 1 year ago
@illwillcpt83 Yes and JW's don't believe your spirit goes on after you're death. They believe you are sleeping in the grave so how could a spirit appear to anyone?
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
there are two things that man must have in order to be and stay alive: spirit and breath.
“If he [God] sets his heart upon anyone, if that one’s spirit and breath he gathers to himself, all flesh will expire together, and earthling man himself will return to the very dust." -Job 34:14, 15
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright So tell us, what must one do to see Gods kingdom?
mosherincexjw 1 year ago
@mosherincexjw (John 17:3, 1 Cor 6:9,10; Gal 5:19-21, Col 3:5-14 )
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright Thanks for your useless scriptures to help me to inherit Gods kingdom. I just love how ALL of you JWS bypass Jesus. Funny how you JWS always pass or overlook Jn.3:1-16. Jn.3:3-" truly truly I say to you. unless one is BORN AGAIN he cannot see Gods kingdom. You see that buddy-you will not see Gods kingdom, and by the way, for those who are born again, are alrerady aprt of Gods kingdom, its here alrerady, it just gets better in the future. Sorry you will not see or experience.
mosherincexjw 1 year ago
@mosherincexjw ? Scriptures are now useless? When have any scripture been useless? (2 tim 3:16) Furthermore, how do i bypass Jesus when the very first scripture i referenced, is what Jesus said... it is written "This means everlasting life, their taking in knowledge of you, the only true God, and of the one whom you sent forth, Jesus Christ." -John 17:3 Moreover, when has any human become judge to tell another that he will not experience/see God's kingdom, based on not mentioning a scripture ?
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright True.
Ecclesiastes 12:7
and the dust returns to the ground it came from, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
Amen Amen! The sad thing is, the WTS/jws have an answer for this. Of course its very twisted, but nonetheless thet have an answer. Notice that everything that they have an answer for is the things pertaining to HOPE. The only thing they look foward to is Armageddon. That should be a dead give-a-away why we should walk the other way. I guess Satan is looking foward to Armageddon as well so shall his followers- alot of people are going to die and this includes the jws who unknowingly follow Satan
mosherincexjw 1 year ago
@mosherincexjw "the only thing" very untrue. While it is true that we look forward to armaggedon, we also look forward to the day where loved ones will return from the grave. Where we would not suffer from the imperfections that we inherited from Adam (Rev 21:3,4) Satan knows that he has a short time left, and he doesnt look forward to Armageddon.
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright
Jehovah does not approve of looking forward to arnaggedon
Amos 5:18 Woe to you who long for of the Lord! Why do you long for the day of the Lord? That day will be darkness, not light.
JAT002 1 year ago
@JAT002 We are admonished to "keep on the watch" (Matt 24:42) Therefore look forward to Jehovah's day, not in a sense of rejoicing, but understanding that Jehovah will be vindicating his name and sovereignty. Those will be times of destructive judgment against the nations who despise Jah. But knowing whats to take place after Armageddon; resurrected love ones, healing of the nations etc, gives hope..
"awaiting and keeping close in mind the presence of the day of Jehovah" (2 Peter 3:11,12)
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright the New World Translation adds "Jehovah" into the New Testament 237 times, where there is absolutely no ancient manuscript evidence of any kind to support it.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@ArboriusOwns Correction, see " Tetragrammaton"
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright The Tetragrammaton YHWH the New World Translation adds "Jehovah" into the New Testament 237 times, where there is absolutely no ancient manuscript evidence of any kind to support it. You're referring to the JW belief that the name of God was removed by the Church which if it was true would make the entire NT regardless of who's version you read illegitimate.
ArboriusOwns 1 year ago
@willhedoright
I did a bible search. could not find the name "Jah"
The bible says NOT to look forward to Jehovah's day. Would a loving God tell you to look forward to his destruction? Not my God.
obviously all of your answers are copy and paste. Why don't you step away from that material and study independently.
JAT002 1 year ago
@JAT002 Hallelujah = Praise Jah = Praise Jehovah.. hence Hallelu"Jah"
Obviously the other comments are of reasoning beyond "Reasoning from the scriptures", but that of my own, maybe thats why you are alluding my previous question ...
willhedoright 1 year ago
@willhedoright Sorry to tell you this. Hallelujah is Hebrew. They did not call him Jah. They called him Lord and he is referred to in the old testament as YHWH. Do you think God likes to be called by an informal nick name like pete, joe, bill? Isn't that disrespectful to the God of all creation?
JAT002 1 year ago
@JAT002 wikipedia or google, Hallelujah
willhedoright 1 year ago
@JAT002 In fact no it isnt disrespectful to call Jehovah, Jehovah. If you call on a friend, yet you do not know his name, how could he view as such when his name is not remembered by you. Many times throughout the bible, God's name has been a key issue. Take the Pharaoh of Moses' day. Jehovah told Pharaoh "I have kept you in existence, for the sake of showing you my power and in order to have my name declared in all the earth" -Ex 9:16 ... Jah (see tetragrammaton) could have easily dismantled..
willhedoright 1 year ago