Weapon Masters- Atlatl vs. Steel Armor

[matthew22389]

"They made some severe dents" No, no they did not.

[AustralianKing19]

its naut appning mark, its naut appning

[01Jweaved]

1:30 he flipped me off!

[WitheringintheDark]

Were they regular stone points or the obsidian the Aztecs would have actually used? Obsidian sling stones could crack a metal sallet helm; it's one of the hardest materials available. An obsidian point would def. have a chance at piercing I think.

[Nydracommander]

@WitheringintheDark it's more about the force needed to penetrate the armor, and not the hardness of the material. remember: steeltipped arrows shot from most bows can't penetrate armor

[WitheringintheDark]

@Nydracommander

Hardness greatly increases the difficulty or ease with which you penetrate a target, as does the shape of the projectile. A hardened steel arrow or bullet, can penetrate more deeply then a wrought iron or lead one.

Likewise, you can pierce unhardened wrought iron far easier then tempered steel.

Those same steel tipped arrows that won't penetrate good armor, easily go through normal sheet steel. Why? Because sheet steel isn't hardened and worked like armor is.

[WitheringintheDark]

@Nydracommander

You are half right, it is about the force needed to penetrate but the force needed to penetrate the armor increases exponentially with both the thickness as well as the hardness of the material being struck. The projectiles shape also plays it's part, arrow tips needing far less force to pierce then musket balls.

This is covered in some depth in Alan Williams book The Knight and the Blast Furnace.

[WitheringintheDark]

@Nydracommander

It also examines gambesons, or padding worn underneath the armor, and discovered that it greatly increased the force needed to compromise the armor. Curvature hurts penetration of projectiles. Steel armors could easily withstand crossbows; wrought iron of similar thickness, not so much.

Essentially, you would need 3.1mm of wrought iron munitions armor to rival the protectiveness of 2mm of med-carbon hardened steel armor.

[Tehinke]

@WitheringintheDark Obsidian would have made little difference as the shaft would break long before the breast plate. Not even a tungsten carbide tip would, since the impact strength needed to penetrate the hardened steel armour of a conquistador far exceeds what the projectile will hold up to. That said, a hundred of these atlatl shafts and some of them will most likely hit an unprotected spot.

[WitheringintheDark]

@Tehinke

Point. A case of the projectile only being as strong as the weakest link, yes? In this case, the wooden shaft.

[LokitheCajun]

@Tehinke True, there's no need to penetrate the armor. I'm sure those throwers could easily land a shot at or just below the neck, which would easily be lethal.

[TheTraumaFactor]

atlatl sucks bitches

[133j0hn]

LOL @ the grenade. Farking hilarious.

[Paucce]

I got here from Kipkay's channel.

[MySecretWeapon77]

i want the one with the fricken grenade

[ALEXGILL88]

1:03 LOL thumbs up if you agree

[Byakuyasbrother]

xDDDD maximum impact , this old man has style 

[usukker]

what the fuck was this?

[xMrjamjam]

Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl Atl nuff said

[666tabarnak]

"This is for maximum impact." LMFAO

[TheSonsofThunder2010]

they would have launched darts in volleys that would have hit all over arms legs necks faces, it would have been lethal to many of the Spanish esp front line without shields.

[XxEntaroAdunxX]

@TheSonsofThunder2010 Hell, they had grenade spears! lol

[usbfuse]

a grenade attached to a stick... BEST IDEA EVER

[vampuricknight1]

@usbfuse milatary funding at its finest

[TheShaolinScholar]

THOSE ARE NOT THE RIGHT SPEAR HEADS OF COURSE ITS NOT GONNA MAKE IT THROUGH MOFFADYTES THE WEIGHT IS OFF THE THICKNESS OF LAUNCHER AN SPEAR BODY IS LAUGHABLE

[TheShaolinScholar]

@TheShaolinScholar we are talkign about another time here when the armor was waay better an the atalatal was also better so what is this bullshit?

[TheShaolinScholar]

hey nigga some real mormon shit IM A NEIPHYTE!!!!!!

[Exoskeleton99]

Dear Youtube...I DONT GIVE A SHIT ABOUT POLITICIANS!!!

[aramanx]

A Mexica weapon and no Mexican guys, well it seems is the Mexican do not care for their culture.

[Lukos0036]

@aramanx Wasn't just mexicans that used these. At one point everyone did. It was as ubiquitous as the bow and arrow, or the gun now.

[Dagsschiller]

@aramanx I must admit that in Mexico there is not a very good cultural concience, I have never heard of an Atlatl competition in Mexico, but I'm hoping it starts to spread since we have very good Atlatl makers

[INbredMonarchy]

Well we all know who won that war... now let's see the hand grenade atlatl! :)

[joec123able]

High pound medieval bow will do it

[fabioeoch]

Try with a javelin next time.

[bsapaka]

mike: "EUROPEAN ARMOR, BITCHESSS"

[GabrielTheViking]

i would say a heavy spear is better would have destroyed theat armour

[Brendonkchu2]

Wow. first of all i dont think the conqestadors (cant spell) had that strong armor, the one they used seemed factory made. Plus the guy just fricken broke the goddamn stone head off. those people put time and effort into stuff like that.

[cr76802]

Right in the eye ball sweetness

[TheFirstDandelione]

lol- i expected to see one fling from off camera into him at 2:46....

[TheFirstDandelione]

"World Atlatl Association?" for real? i mean... of course... but still. so great! ;D :D xD

[nephildevil]

that show host is an annoying sonovabitch

[sillypantsochasy]

killshot 3:05

[SpeedyCycles]

Thumbs up if you hate ads on a video with only 23k views.

[0hypnotoad0]

What the heck were they expecting. A stone tip is not going to penetrate a plate cuirass

The heavy slings on the other hand, I wouldn't put it past them to be able to shatter a few ribs through plate like this.

[flylow223]

@0hypnotoad0 agreed, i would use a steel broadhead. or today, a pistol.

[SilvaDreams]

@0hypnotoad0 Well you have to remember those plates were also ment to protect against swords and arrows, thus their design that naturally deflects a blow. (A crossbow would punch through but they were built just for that reason)

[TheSchnupfen]

grenade spear lol

[sarah53062]

what the fyck am I doing here

[taritonkens]

Dammit now i have to found darbal comment!

[Lukos0036]

I don't think the Aztec kills were attributed to penetrating the armor so much as going around it. The Spanish helms left the face wide open and the neck and arm pits were relatively undefended. If you are accurate enough, and they were, you could just strike there and ignore the hard spots entirely. Still I wonder how they would perform with heavy bodkin like points.

[MoRockHound]

@Lukos0036 i would imagine that bodkin type tips would improve the penetration. they would be just as heavy if not heavier than the stonepoints and stronger too. so your using a much stronger material that is imparting the same amount of energy. i think it would help it alot

[Lukos0036]

@MoRockHound Might be worth trying out some day. XD

[elgostine]

@Lukos0036 yeah... thats the first rule of dealing with armour... unless you have no other choice, dont bother going through, go around,

in the era of plate armour in europe, the period fight manuals essentially tell you to go for the armpits, or eyes, or any other gaps ilke the neck maybe.

[StringsCrusader]

it'd be completely different, in the hands of a trained aztec warrior lol. they'd be in such good shape compared to these guys and would have trained with the weapon since they were kids. cool experiment though.

[Magician12345]

i was like "we pon masters?"



[HaNsWiDjAjA]

I think it only takes logic to figure out that an obsidian tipped dart would never go through a steel breastplate. No matter how powerful is the force behind the dart, the lower structural strength of obsidian vs steel would mean that the obsidian would always shatter before it can pierce the steel.

[powereater]

poor aztecs, brave warriors but simply outmatched by strongr technology

[BloodofPatriots]

@powereater Poor Aztecs? They raped, murdered and oppressed millions. Why do you think so many native tribes volunteered to help Cortez destroy the Aztec Empire? They were pissed off at the hell the Aztecs put them through and wanted some payback.

[powereater]

@BloodofPatriots and im sure the spaniards had a wonderful history of loving and caring all those who they came in contact with.

[BloodofPatriots]

@powereater The Spaniards were bastards, too. This is not a story of Good vs. Evil, but the greedy and violence of the Spaniards was nothing compared to the bloodlust of the Aztecs.

[powereater]

@BloodofPatriots im sure the aztecs would love to hear that, shame they're not around much anymore.

i suppose you can always go to spain and tell how their greed and violence were much better than the civilization they wiped out.

[BloodofPatriots]

@powereater There are a lot more descendants of the Aztec's neighboring tribes alive today because the Spaniards wiped out the most violent, murderous, bloodthirsty culture in the New World. I have been to Spain and did thank them for wiping out the Aztecs. Made for good conversation during a siesta. Good thing Spain conquered the Aztecs 400 years ago, because, to be honest, they're just too damn lazy to pull it off today. But you have to give them props for kicking the vile Muslims out, too.

[xxTeutonicKnightxx]

@BloodofPatriots LOL Yea I agree good thing 400 years ago, most Modern Europeans are pussies.  The Spartans, Romans, Teutonic Knights and others are rolling in there graves of how most Modern Europeans are.

[changolini]

@BloodofPatriots true it wasnt the europeans who bought rape into the new world ,the aztecs raped ,murdered,and selling people for slavery ,or privite whore houses aswell so in other words tripe raping tribe thats all their was

[BloodofPatriots]

@changolini It's time we just accept the truth: Central and South America are shitholes because their run by the natives. Case in point: Mexico. It's fucked up because it's run by Mexicans.

[changolini]

@BloodofPatriots wat natives u idiot their corrupt because of the cartel rule and true in 1 thing about mexicans .and naitves over their fight for rights

[BloodofPatriots]

@changolini Learn to communicate coherently in English, beaner.

[changolini]

@BloodofPatriots beaner my ass bitch

[BloodofPatriots]

@changolini Well, yes, you are a beaner, so that means the majority of your body, including your brain, that constitutes your "ass" is also beaner.

[changolini]

@BloodofPatriots wat r u bitch talking like ur all perfect if ur american majority of all nations aim at u fukers

[BloodofPatriots]

@changolini Only cowards appeal to the faceless mob for support. The world hated the British Empire, the Mongolian Empire, the Roman Empire and the Persian Empire. Why? For the same reason you hate the US: Jealousy.

We're powerful and you're a diseased turd polluting civilization.

[Procrastinatron2000]

@BloodofPatriots I think all of those empires were hated mostly because they were total dicks.

[BloodofPatriots]

@Procrastinatron2000 Never heard of Pax Romana, Pax Mongolica, Pax Britannia or Pax America have you? During the reign of those empires, the world saw enough peace to build lasting, long-distance trade relations. During the Mongolian Empire, it was said that a virgin wearing gold could walk from one end of the empire to the other without being molested.

Empires are hated because they make the "dicks" peaceful by crushing them.

[Procrastinatron2000]

@BloodofPatriots The point is that these peaces were achieved after some fairly atrocious acts were committed. The only reasons these empires did what they did were resources and power. They conquered other lands for resources, and the peace that followed served them economically. Some of the losers were dicks, some weren't. But that didn't matter to the Mongols and Romans. If the people resisted, they got their shit slapped, and that's why empires are dicks.

[BloodofPatriots]

@Procrastinatron2000 The natural state of the animal world is chaos. In the human animal, we call this state "war." Rome's laws, including its civil code that treated every citizen as an equal, is the foundation of all Western jurisprudence. It's model of government emphasizing checks and balances, the Republic, lives on today in Europe and North America. While the founding of empires may be brutal, empires themselves unite different lands, different cultures in trade.

[mrjesse999]

@BloodofPatriots The Aztec empire sounds a lot like The United States. Minus the human sacrifice of course.

[BloodofPatriots]

@mrjesse999 Comparing the US to the Aztecs makes you an idiot. The Aztecs took everything from their neighbors, while the US runs a trade deficit with both of our neighbors. We also feed, house, educate and provide social services for 10 million illegal aliens from Mexico and allow Canadian law school graduates to practice in the US, while Canada prohibits our law school graduates from practicing in its courts. You're a moron.

[DJonX7]

@BloodofPatriots half of americans can't afford university, but they let canadians in? somehow that doesn't make sense.

[lurconis666]

Hordes of indians with atlatls and clubs rushing a mere 200 conquistadores with guns, epic fail.

[Railstarfish]

@lurconis666 Missing out the hordes of indians on the conquistadores side as well...

[kop4321]

If it had a steel tip, maybe.

But with stone, no not gonna happen.

[userdoubleoseven]

how many conquistadors of that era would have armor that shiny. fail. it would be rusted or made of lower grade metal. just barely able to hold a shine, because they are less consistent. and, none of those guys look like an aztek warrior. none of them are "ripped" and barely look healthy enough for a aztek war. maybe they could cook. not very strong in my opinion.

[sairoku]

@userdoubleoseven of course, you lived in that era and now you're telling people exactly what you saw.

[andrewCNC905]

@userdoubleoseven They most likely polished there armour, im sure they also took care or there weaponery

as would the most of us hear.

[VladiSSius]

1:19 for maximum impact? Lol Aztec warrior never invented that... XD lmao 

[Jesusisyhwh]

And yet the Spanish won. The Aztecs, from a technological standpoint, were a stone age people. The only advantage they had were numbers.

[Davmm96]

hurm.. 1:19...

[MegaCrispyChicken]

a grenade on a over-sized arrow xD

[seanetc]

i like it how the presenter guy just destroys the guys atlatl dart by ripping it out and you see all the sinew rapping falling off!

[p4h10oso]

OK, so the firsthand Spanish accounts said the Aztecs hurled darts with bronze tips cuz the Indians knew how to make bronze and it was those tips that pierced Spanish armor and killed folks.......discovery channel FAIL!!!!!!!!

[NICKarrowman]

@p4h10oso Do you really think some bronze-tipped atlatl can pierce conqistador armour when even the bodkin arrow of an english warbow can only irregularly penetrate such steel plate armour? Sorry, but I think you should thay a little more realistic on that ;D!

[SteDeRaver]

Oh Bob you crazy bastard, where did you get a handgrenade?

[dartbal]

first!!!!



[typemyusernamehere]

@dartbal congratulations, contact youtube to collect your prize

[Snipeouts]

@dartbal and only

[anthony21266]

@dartbal your an idiot lol

[SunfireGTX25]

@anthony21266 Before you insult others, make sure you learn how to spell!! It's "you're" not "your"!

You ARE an idiot = You're an idiot. Hence the "you're"!! :P

[08Talentboy80]

@SunfireGTX25

That guy who said first did deserve it though.

[anthony21266]

@SunfireGTX25 fine YOU'RE a jackass 

or would you rather have YOU ARE a jackass >:PPPPPPP

[SunfireGTX25]

@anthony21266 I prefer "you're" :P lol