Keynsians say "We didn't spend enough money and we don't have enough control over the economy."
Austrians: "The other two people are too stupid to grasp the complexities of the economy. The markets are more productive, fair and stable than academics sticking their fingers in everything."
Austrian Economics makes too much sense. I can't make heads or tails of what the other two jokers on stage are saying but Peter Schiff speaks commen sense.
Schiff predicted the collapse to a tee using the Austrian model. So how exactly does the collapse prove his model is outdated? Statist/Keynesian economics is sheer wish-thinking.
it's a shame people in the audience toward the end got so hostile towards peter's response the effects of unemployment benefits. they take it to heart as if it's some kind of attack against lazy and poor people. he's just stating the obvious of human nature without placing blame. most "reasonable" people who don't think in terms of long term consequences of wrong-headed monetary policy will of course not work until the benefits end. hell, i probably would too.
Soo... Farmer is arguing that FED should control both the supply of money (and interest rates, so basicaly how much money you have) AND price levels (what you can afford), while still being independent from democratic government and that this was supposed to be right? REALLY?
That's like, the essence of total control on economics. Good God, if that guy is actually a consultant of FED (in Atlanta), no wonder they screwed up so badly.
Gotta love how the left is now against the bail outs. Not to mention anyone by name but the big conservatives on the right were against the bailouts from day 1. Of course no one beats the libertarians on getting the economy right for decades.
The other two economists seem utterly oblivious to the phrase, "No pain, no gain." They appear to be thinking, "Oh! We can never, ever allow people to bear hardship! That would be like Armageddon!"
But ironically, free-market capitalism works so much better than regulated crony capitalism. In spite of occasional hardships in a free market (such as stock crashes, bank runs, high unemployment, or new inventions rendering entire industries obsolete overnight), living standards rise dramatically.
Not even a contest, this is a fantastic debate! This makes the Republican debates look like a Third Grade Play....Peter you need to be Ron Pauls running mate! Or top advisor!
"People will die if unemployment benefits are not extended." Do we really live in a society that is willing to keep poor people alive as long as someone else is paying for it? Or would it be more logical that a society willing to force people to keep others from starving would have a population large enough and wealthy enough, with good intentions enough to voluntarily keep people from starving on the streets?
I propose an idea for a kind of bank that adjust principals of loans with CPI. So when inflation is 1% if I borrow 100 I should return 101, but if deflation was 1% I only have to return 99. Same apply to deposits, if you save money in a bank you get no interest but if you invest money in a bank you get interest but your money should be able to be returned in alignment with CPI as well. So people get 2 types of bank accounts, 1. No Interest Savings account, 2. The investment account that earns.
Peter is 100% right about student loans. The only way to get a decent job now is to get a masters degree and go deeper into debt and not start working till you turn 28!
Big government is destroying western civilization. Make it stop!
I work for a commercial Real Estate company. We leased out an office-warehouse to a firearm assembly company. It was amazing to me that when the government beaurocrat with the ATF was going over taxes and fees and extra 10% here and there, the owner said "well, we will just pass this cost onto the customers", and the government agent just said "thats fine". LOL Amazing. Oh the agent was also making about $150K/Year. Guess he is okay with driving up prices as long as he gets his federal pension.
Keynesian snake oil salesmen think it is possible to solve all our woes by increasing the electronic money supply - straight from the comfort of your own keyboard.
Unfortunately the real economy needs to take some real pain to right the wrongs of the last 20 years.
Depression and lazyness are big enemy's but also greedy business man who miss treated them in work force. They hire illegals to do their jobs and the illegal collect food stamps and controled rent etc. My research shows that most mexican that plug in for 10 years are making 40 60 thousands a year because their un wed wifes collect 35,000 in benifits while the men work illegally collecting 12 to 15 hour.
Peter you a hero in my mind because you say it like it is. I have many friends getting unemployement and their milking it for two years. They ve been offered jobs, 5 dallors an hour more then on unemployment however they would not take them. They would rather site home and be lazy collect a check. Many of them manuipulate SS to get permit disability checks. Now some them have net worth 200,000 or 5,000 but working has become a peria to them.
Man, how was that Brit wanker supposedly in the "center"?! All three of those cats couldn't get far enough left, including the flippin' moderator. At least there was one person there who spoke lucidly. Thank you Mr Schiff.
They all have their heads in the sand except the few moments that they take it out just to laugh at Schiff and then stuck it back in. I thought that his past predictions proved his point in the past and gave him some credibility.
I think that the faux-classy guy won this debate. People here trolling are like creationists that close their ears from the counter-arguments.
Peter didn't answer many questions that he was proposed, for example in the unemployment benefit case. Some of the Peter's arguments are false.
For example let's take the trade deficit thing. America hasn't deficit because of the government, taxes or regulations but simply because the Chinese currency isn't fluctuating in the free market.
that's nonsense.. we have a deficit because we dont produce anything and because the rest of world is willing take paper for real goods because our paper is so valuable because it's the reserve currency.. You need to study Peter real carefully.
@exitiummagnum 'America hasn't deficit because of the government, taxes or regulations but simply because the Chinese currency isn't fluctuating in the free market.' If it did the USD would be completely worthless since China is keeping the dollar alive. I guess you don't mind the federal reserve manipulating bonds' prices. The US is borrowing money it can't afford to repay to buy goods they don't produce; under a free market economy nobody would continuously lend them so much money.
I think Peter dominated the debate. What im wondering is why do we let these kind of debates turn into policy/sentiment driven instead of adressing it technically.. I think majority of the facts stated by these financiers could be easily tested by a simulation in a mediocre supercomputer that many of the universities have. Some might argue the human input in the market movements not being included, but we could still compare the results to 100yr market flux and see whos full of crap-Farmer imo.
I almost punched my computer listening to that fat guy with the beard scream and whine... holy shit that guy reminds me of those nerds with bad tempers. I always want to fight nerds with bad tempers...
I don't like socialism but we must admit that Rosnick has a point. When the government takes a part of the profits of productive businesses through taxation and then gives the money for ordinary and not-that-rich people, they will almost necessarily spend the money and give it back to the productive businesses by buying goods from them.
This kind of system is in practice in countries like Norway, Sweden and Finland. They have very small deficits and businesses are doing OK.
@exitiummagnum Norway just had a food shortage similar to food shortages in the Soviet Union. Some were busted for smuggling butter because prices there are so high.
They export huge amounts of oil and natural resources and that helps support their tiny population. Without that, their welfare state would not exist. Even now, it is still faltering like in the example I provided.
@itachi705 You referred only to Norway but excluded Finland and Sweden that are both almost on the same level with Norway in the living standard statistics.
I though people would understand the effects of the system I described. Well, let me tell you then. An example: a doctor earning 180K a year vs. a McDonald's guy earning just 20K a year. If you give them both a 10K bonus, which of them would likely to spend it and by that keep the wheels of the economy rolling? I think you know the answer.
@BarrySlisk I haven't said that but saving's not the solution to everything. There are two essential parts for the well being of the economy: firstly there must be spending (demand) and secondly investments (supply).
America doesn't produce not because of the acts of the government like Schiff says, but because of a huge gap between the wages in Asia and the western world. And China's totalitaristic monetary policy makes these gaps even worse by not giving renminbi to fluctuate freely.
So spending money americans don't have, which goes to China, getting flatscreen TV's in return is the answer? How does this help in the long run? Would it not be better to actually produce something and sell it to the world.
@itachi705 Norway had the shortages just as any other country that doesn't have natural resources or a large amount of intellectual capital.
Getting back to Finland and Sweden. Finland has an industrialized economy. 30% of the GDP consists of the industrial output. The reason why is because Finland has managed to increase the total intellectual capital for the industry.
@dubified89 The real (not nominal) profits (aka trade surplus) of the economy in general come from 1) exports 2) the effectiveness in using the natural resources the economy has and 3) positive capital flows (aka the yields from the foreign investments).
Schiff-pricks that just come here and accuse people by their Wolverine and British-dissing bullshit without having any clue about the economy are freaky people.
"I want to live in a free market economy that has a conscience." How the hell is stealing money from person A to give to person B a "free market with a conscience?" How the hell did we get to the point where government theft is a moral ideal?
@caniacstanleycup Because they are humanist with a guillotine. You see, they are trying to do the right thing(and maybe in another contex it would be good), but they are not really trying to convince you, they want to use the state to force their will, their convictions, their opinions upon you, you see, they trying to do you good and make you moral and if they can´t they will smash your face if they have to.
I've read why Economies Grow and Why They Fail, and am starting on Crash Proof 2.0, Peter has accurately described and predicted this problem almost a decade ago. Get out of debt. Do what ever it takes, but quit spending, pay off your personnel debt. That is the least anyone can do. Do it now.
It seemed like everybody against Schiff, Grizzly Adams over there sounded like he wanted to cry at some points. The cool thing about Schiff is you don't need an economics degree to understand what the fuck he is saying. All these "intellectuals" throw out a smokescreen with their jargon to mask their true objectives. Grizzy kept whining about doctors making more money, and the problem is? Why didn't tubby go to medical school then and put in the hard work?that's right,he just wants a free ride.
Keynesians appeal to emotion and authority so much that before I even understood both sides of the argument I STRONGLY suspected that they were wrong. Peter Schiff confirms that suspicion every time he debates one of these individuals.
How does an employee saving his money for future capital investment and being productive (key word there) not create jobs? And how does buying an iPhone (or other consumer goods) assembled in China help the US create jobs??
@PazGuerro first of all you are wrong, an employee saving his money isnt going to create jobs, it is just going to sit there; if he spent it he would be reinvesting it into the economy therefore creating jobs
second when I said you create jobs by spending I was talking about GOVERNMENT spending, how do you think we got out of the Depression? Because the government started spending shitloads on the war effort for WWII, but that was when we still made everything in America
Also, an employee constantly spending his money is a long-term detriment to the economy. What about savings? What happens when this person retires with no wealth and a bunch of useless consumer goods? I suppose you are going to say that social security and welfare are good for the economy too?
@PazGuerro you are not explaining how saving money spurs an economy, money sitting in a mattress or a bank account wont help the economy at all, it will do nothing, if it is spent that money goes to the retailer who pays the wholesaler, the retailer's profit goes back into the economy spent on supplies, more goods, and employees, the wholesaler spends on trucks and truck drivers for shipping, etc.
I'm surprised I have to explain this elementary stuff to you, just admit you are wrong
Ever heard of a capital investment? How can a potential small business owner invest if he spends his paychecks on clothes, cars, eating out, and useless consumer goods? Get a loan, right?
I'm surprised you have to explain that stuff, too, because it shows how misled your education has made you. A consumer economy that has to borrow the money it spends and runs huge trade deficits will inevitably collapse. We need to produce and export, and that means savings.
@PazGuerro you never mentioned investment, you said savings and you don't need to save to invest, you can invest small amounts of money too, and when did I ever say people were borrowing obviously you cant have a conversation without putting words in my mouth, why don't you actually use your eyes and read my comments before commenting asshole
@benjak21 You know what? You're right. I see the flaws in my argument, spending can only hold our economy together for so long it is just a band-aid on the wound, the only way to sustain our economy long term is to save, invest, and most importantly produce and I'm sorry I didn't see that.
You have the overweight Wolverine-looking guy busting a nut trying to make sense of what he's talking about, and this faux-classy British schmuck throwing out bullshit analogies that I'm not sure he himself even understands, and Peter sending both of them to school.
@Kant419 Best comment here. BTW do you think these "top academics" are aware of the Epistemological differences between Kantian Rationalism and Logical Positivism ?
If you have no money then you're and idiot that needs to get a job. You're consuming resources faster than you can produce more so YOU have to stop comsuming. Its only fair.
@UncommonThinker apply what you just wrote to the discussion in the video about government policy, and I think you'll find yourself agreeing with GeoFry.
Here is a crazy idea, if I have NO MONEY then I can not spend it to make the economy "grow". So either the companies need to make things so I can afford it, or they need to fail and free up the marketplace so some one else can have a go at it.
I love listening to the left and the middle and how both seem to have a hard time actually describing their theories, much like anyone else making it up as they go along.
I just got back from shopping and it is Christmas time in China, virtually everything in the store has a "Made in China" sticker, the things that don't have one mostly came from Vietman. The United States is an empty shell, there is very little left of our manufacturing sector, it is an airplane flying on autopilot, kept aloft by a continuous stream of money printing.
"The world" stopped buying our debt a long time ago. Our bond market is propped up by the the low interest rates generated by the federal reserve which are much lower than anyone who doesn't have access to those interest rates would afford. The bond market interest rates are unsustainable at the current rate which is less than even the CPI which is an extremely conservative inflation estimate.
46:30 Farmer typifies liberals inability to apply argument logically, seeing more=better, rather than accepting diminishing/negative returns. He(rightly)says that education is a social good. This is true-to a point. Education does not only benefit the individual, but society as a whole. We need doctors, engineers, chemists, etc. Yet, at one extreme we have no people spending no time at college, At the other, we would have all people spending all time at college. Both are highly undesirable.
@ElJefer Yes. Farmer's 'I believe in Capitalism with a conscience' was a particularly Nauseating soundbite moment designed to suggest Schiff doesn't. He doesnt qualify his position at all. As they say, the road the hell is paved with good intentions. Farmers type will lead us to Hell.
53:00 Lol Farmer said the recession was not connected to government intervention. Fannie and Freddie didn't contribute? the Fed changing interest rates didn't contribute? FDIC didn't contribute? I expected him to be more informed
So Rosnkick wants the government to take more of our money and decide which projects to invest in and Farmer wants the Fed to have more "tools" and the ability to buy stocks. And then they call free-market proponents crazy...
It's so sad that Schiff's opponents represent the prevailing economic attitudes of those in power (Bernanke, Geithner, and most politicians). Watching this makes me feel like I'm living in a nightmare. Peter Schiff's argument is simple and elegant: freedom is what creates prosperity and is how our country built so much wealth from the time we were founded.
@6678 I recommend you call schiffradiodotcom on open Friday and debate with Peter Schiff. Bring up your main points. If you believe in your philosophy so much, you should test it against Peter.
@Nuby29 It's not a philosophy, it's basic economics. You've shown a complete disregard for it, choosing dogma over evidence. Sorry, but you're simply not trained in it to make any intelligent contribution. This is noticeable because you've done nothing other than regurgitate dumbed down talking points from popular austrian/libertarian books. Even reputable economists who completely disregards gov. intervention don't sound as bad as you do, and are able to make articulate points.
@6678 "@Nuby29 Agreed, Green Energy wasn't a good investment. Yet, how do you think things such as the Internet came about? It was part of a government project. Roads, sewers, medical care, and military are all things that the government provide that are necessary but the market isn't willing to provide. This is basic Adam Smith. There are downfalls to government funding, just like there are downfalls to a free-market.
@6678 I'm not going to argue who get's credit for the internet. I'm not even going to argue if green energy, or roads, sewers, medical care, and military are good investment. But I will argue, you can't go into massive debt under the idea that "your" investment is so GREAT and the growth from it will more than make up for the excessive debt. Gov needs to stay in its limit. Just like any company, the balance sheet can not be in the red for an extended period of time w/o going into bankru
@Nuby29 Yes, actually, you can argue exactly that. Heavy investment in capital and human capital will create positive externalities, 'spillovers' if you want, that allow people to be more productive and produce more output.
And again, as I've said before, but maybe you'll understand it this time, going into debt is not per say a bad thing and balancing the budget is a priority in a booming economy, not an anemic one. This is because trying to balance the books does more harm than good.
@6678 This will be my last point. I've examined all your points, and found each one to be inaccurate, but I will not follow up anymore b/c we can debate forever and get nowhere. I understand your logic & will not gain anything further. I can say that what you suggest might work if we do follow it. But finally, when have we ever reduce the deficit? Even during the Clinton years of surplus we have already ran a deficit. That is my final point. The debt is too big they will never address it.
Also what is your profession? I'm assuming you are an academic? I'll make a note to follow up in a few yrs. You will see there will be no growth. If it were to happen, it would've happened by now. 2012 at the latest, but it's obvious we're sliding again. Will you say wait for 2013,14,15. When will we ever address the debt. Til the whole system collapse? Like I said, result trump theory every time. That is why FREE market is the only system that work. Free M profit only those who are right
@6678 "The free market is currently experiencing a MARKET FAILURE! Unemployment is still high, and consumer confidence is barely picking up and growth is still anemic. It's amazing that even in the face of all evidence you still cheerlead a free-market that clearly isn't working optimally currently. It doesn't correct itself, that's a myth. Furthermore, you just take it for granted that it will self-correct without actually giving me a mechanism for how this occurs.*Waits for invisible hand ref"
@6678 All you have to do is look at areas where there is FREE market. Like Technology, It expands naturally, engineers improves upon old ideas, new ideas come about. iphone, ipad, fla tscreens. Then look at the medical & drugs industries where there are tons of regulations and compliance. There hasn't been a cure to anything solid. Hardly any progress. The FDA destroys so many potential drugs and ideas. As far as self correcting. It's going to be a lot of pain b/c we destroyed the free marke
@Nuby29 Technology DOES NOT EXPAND NATURALLY! There has been heavy government intervention that has allowed for companies to produce offshore at cheaper costs (Tariff Item 806 & 807), subsidies, and deregulation (particularly in the financial industry). Drug industries are bloated because government has offered protectionism in the name of 'safety measures' (which is a load of bull, I know.)
That's your mechanism for how the market is self correcting? It doesn't explain anything!
@6678 so now I see your mentally. You don't believe in the FREE market at all. You believe in a control market (fiscal & monetary). That is so scary. It's one thing to say "control" or "intervention" market is better than free market (which I disagree), but it's another thing to say free market is a complete failure. You don't understand why we are cheer-leading it. Maybe b/c we see the debt growing, gov growing, corrupt politicians and their lobbyists. The free market would never allow this.
@Nuby29 I believe in free-market, but I believe in government intervention to prevent fraud and market failures. So does everyone who believes and studies the free-market, they know it's not without its shortfalls as well. Government has short-falls too, but abolishing it or minimizing it excessively is stupid and got us into the mess we're in.
Roger Farmer and David Rosnick are 2 total trolls. Why do these idiot economist believe that their will always be someone out there that will buy US bonds. WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WOULD BUY OUR DEBT?
They should have escorted the two establishmenf whores from the building after their first minute of chatter, so Peter Schiff can school the audience without interruption.
Rosnick is a stumblingl, bumbling, fumbling idiot and Farmer thinks he is so smart that all he needs to do as President is give more "tools" to the idiots that created this mess. This arrogant ass thinks that HE is so smart that HE can micromanage the economy and adjust a few knobs so to speak. As usual Schiff completely schools these two fools.
Wow! Peter Schiff was the only one that had a clue how economies work and why they prosper/collapse. The other two were just regurgitating the same ol' Keynesian "aggregate demand", low interest rates, free money, money printing & govt spending BS that got is into this mess. SUPPLY is king. You can't have consumption without first producing goods to sell or export. Companies aren't investing because govt rules/regs/mandates/taxes & high labor/energy costs have made it unprofitable to do so.
@hiten369 Oh so you don't buy stuff when its on sale. Come one buy low sell high is what everyone is trying to do. Peter just does it better than everyone else.
@xpressurs Peter Schiff didn't do shit. He lost money for his clients in 2008 and he has admitted this. He was wrong about hyperinflation and he was wrong about the rest of the world would be immune to a US slowdown. Perhaps if you got up off your knees and stopped sucking his dick you would realize Peter Schiff is all hype.
@hiten369 that just shows you haven't done any homework, he hasn't been wrong about hyperinflation, i listen to his show and he believes within the next 2-5 years it could get bad. you can't time this stuff perfectly dude, but the fact is that he did predict the housing bubble collapse with military precision and you're going to write him off as stupid? you sound like mainstream media when it comes to Ron Paul. These people are not only intelligent, but pretty damn courageous.
@MrMattieRich Actually, I did do my homework. But people like you are so stuck in Peter Schiff's ass that you can see how much he was wrong. It's not like he was the only one to predict the economic collapse. Liberal have been warning us for decades but dumbasses like you wrote them off. All you have to do is Google "Peter Schiff was Wrong" and you'll find detail examples of how he was wrong.
@hiten369 why don't you Google "peter schiff predictions 2002-2007 and you'll see he was laughed at for eventually being right about everything. I'm sure other people predicted these issues but he was more vocal then most, but yeah I'm sure he's an idiot b/c he bought gold 15 years when it was 200/oz.... hahaha man wake up and stop calling people names, it just shows your childish when it comes to having a spirited debate about real issues. he didn't just fall into his wealth....
@MrMattieRich the real issue is why does PS makes his money from shorting which is making money when others fail. How can you say he's good at predictions when his clients lost a ton of money. Yet he knew when the collapse was going to happen. That doesn't inspire confidence. It's childish of you to bend over backwards for this guy. And no he wasn't that vocal at all. So being wrong for five years makes Peter Schiff right now? Give me a break.
@hiten369 first of all you need short sellers in the market, that's markets 101 and second, many many people lost money during that time, hell i did! And yeah some of PS lost some money but many of his customers were invested in gold and even though they took a hit for a while, they doing fine now, this isn't about losing money short term, it's about making money long term. stop living in the moment. you have to look at the investment horizon of his customers.
@hiten369 his company Euro Pac Metals seems to be doing just fine, he has many customers and continues to grow, so what exactly are you talking about when you say his customers lost money, EVERYONE did on certain investments, but if took his general advice about foreign currencies, dividend stocks and precious metals, you may of lost money in the short term, but right now you're looking pretty good. the markets are turbulent b/c the FED is keep interest rates too low.
@hiten369 it seems as though you just don't understand his message, listen to his show and try to understand his principle and philosophy behind his economic ideas, you don't just understand this stuff overnight, get over the normalcy bias that nothing bad could happen here, were in worse shape than every country in Europe, we owe more money to more people than any other country in history... doesn't that bother you? we have to stop borrowing money, it's our only hope
@hiten369 you think he should be a day trader and not a commodities broker, he sees long run trends and has made a mint off of those trends, one data point where he still outperformed most even if he took a loss does not make him an idiot. losing less in a crashing market still makes you look good, and over the past few years he has been going gangbusters. or maybe i should just make shit up like you have. not being able to pinpoint a crash but calling the trend still makes him right
@surrealnumber 2002-2007 dumbass!. Here's PS in 2007, watch?v=2I0QN-FYkpw&. Sounds good right, wrong. If you listened to Peter between 2002-2007, you lost your shirt. If you had listened to Peter and "short" stock "A" at 25, your loss has no limit. If it goes to $100, you lose $75. In shorting, you are only limited in your upside. If "A" goes to zero, "Schiffers" profit $25. Yes, Peter S. is so honorable, he so great!
@hiten369 and to think i was going to debate something, there is no need to debate an emotional child that cannot do anything but personal attacks, and his firm and investments performed well during that time overall, there was one year in that period where his investments took a loss, but he did not sell and it turns out to have been a great decision on his part. i am done with out and your personal attacks.
@surrealnumber What debate? All you did was praise Peter Schiff and constantly tell me how great he is. All you did was pander. It's OK, I know Peter Schiff fans don't have a leg to stand on so it's been entertaining for me. Make sure to tell Peter that your ass is nice and loose.
@hiten369 i did what now? you must like making things up because you have done it with every post you have attacked me with. saying i did an action does not make it true, youre going to need to troll better if you want to get a rise out of me. lies simply wont work.
@surrealnumber So when you can't defend your position you call me and others a lier. The difference between you and me is, I was showing the truth of what peter was saying. You and others just pander and try to defend your lover boy. Debate is useless because it's just 2 people arguing instead of seeking what is true. That's why you lost and you try to run away from people that might burst your little bubble.
@hiten369 defend my position that he did get hit one year but did not sell and because of that his investments pulled through ina big way onthe long run.i have no vested interest in schiff, i dont make money from his actions but i dont tryto caracter assassinate him or others. i have lost nothing but the time i have spent typing responses to you,nothing i have said has been wrong you sit there and attack people for no reason. as i said you need to troll harder if you want to get a rise out of me
@hiten369 Well, I don't know about you, but i'll throw in with the guy who bases investment strategy on savings and production, not spending and consumption.
@hiten369 oh and please don't comment on grammar and spelling..... it's youtube, i only say that because someone else already did and it's a bit annoying when were talking about real issues and they bring up that i misspelled something...
@xpressurs If you want to find someone who knew this ecomonic collapse was coming try Brooksly Borne who was the chairperson of the CFTC in the late 90's. She saw the dangers of the derivatives market and tried to stop it but was blocked by Greenspan. She was also criticized by punk asses like you for even trying. I know you won't understand a word I'm saying so just go back down on your knees and start sucking. The rich need people like you so make sure you open that mouth real wide.
Don't try and bother debating with these youtube users. I've been trying to also explain to them why Peter Schiff is full of shit, but it's gone nowhere. Many people here don't understand basic economics, but instead get all their information from Schiff or popular austrian economics books (which are manifestos, not real books on economics).
Our universities are infested with keynesian fools polluting the minds of our children with misinformed economics. Peter is one of the few people left who understands real economics, more people like him hopefully will take back the country.
Peter Schiff is extremely smart. PETER SCHIFF 2012!
PCGamer1224 5 days ago
Keynsians say "We didn't spend enough money and we don't have enough control over the economy."
Austrians: "The other two people are too stupid to grasp the complexities of the economy. The markets are more productive, fair and stable than academics sticking their fingers in everything."
TheDerpable 1 week ago
Austrian Economics makes too much sense. I can't make heads or tails of what the other two jokers on stage are saying but Peter Schiff speaks commen sense.
TheDerpable 1 week ago
Schiff predicted the collapse to a tee using the Austrian model. So how exactly does the collapse prove his model is outdated? Statist/Keynesian economics is sheer wish-thinking.
lordabacu 2 weeks ago
keynesian's economic is developping than neoclassical economy
creditequityophshoa 2 weeks ago
If I was getting paid $8 an hour on unemployment I wouldn't go look for a job.
Aahlookoutbehindyou 2 weeks ago
it's a shame people in the audience toward the end got so hostile towards peter's response the effects of unemployment benefits. they take it to heart as if it's some kind of attack against lazy and poor people. he's just stating the obvious of human nature without placing blame. most "reasonable" people who don't think in terms of long term consequences of wrong-headed monetary policy will of course not work until the benefits end. hell, i probably would too.
wunderbeast 2 weeks ago
Schiff won this debate before it even started.
Mattertea 2 weeks ago
wiki.mises.org/wiki/Long_Depression
Coteincdr 2 weeks ago
Rosnick is damn crybaby
killersack1 2 weeks ago in playlist More videos from SchiffReport
Schiff: no notes.
Other guys: phony statistics, prepared speeches, and stuttered sentence fragments when they can't find the answer on a sheet of paper.
PazGuerro 2 weeks ago 4
Wish i could see Peter's face when the Brit is 1st talking
1TheBusyBody94 3 weeks ago
Soo... Farmer is arguing that FED should control both the supply of money (and interest rates, so basicaly how much money you have) AND price levels (what you can afford), while still being independent from democratic government and that this was supposed to be right? REALLY?
That's like, the essence of total control on economics. Good God, if that guy is actually a consultant of FED (in Atlanta), no wonder they screwed up so badly.
hagunadari 1 month ago
Gotta love how the left is now against the bail outs. Not to mention anyone by name but the big conservatives on the right were against the bailouts from day 1. Of course no one beats the libertarians on getting the economy right for decades.
thebackbencher666 1 month ago
@thebackbencher666
There were plenty of conservatives that supported the baliouts... but you're definitely right about the libertarians. :-)
KyleSkullz 3 weeks ago
haha ucla boners.
halflifeproductionz 1 month ago
Schiff knows his shit!
17jjskater 1 month ago
aks25aks : funny you should say that...at one time Peter was indeed Ron Paul's financial advisor
joemoby89 1 month ago in playlist More videos from SchiffReport
The other two economists seem utterly oblivious to the phrase, "No pain, no gain." They appear to be thinking, "Oh! We can never, ever allow people to bear hardship! That would be like Armageddon!"
But ironically, free-market capitalism works so much better than regulated crony capitalism. In spite of occasional hardships in a free market (such as stock crashes, bank runs, high unemployment, or new inventions rendering entire industries obsolete overnight), living standards rise dramatically.
DiscoProJoe 1 month ago
Not even a contest, this is a fantastic debate! This makes the Republican debates look like a Third Grade Play....Peter you need to be Ron Pauls running mate! Or top advisor!
aks25aks 1 month ago
Roger Farmer - personality matches the name really. Amazing that people pay thousands of dollars for this guy to "teach" them.
dbmcmillan 1 month ago
Goodness Peter demolishes these fools. Not even close.
dustinseth1 1 month ago
This Farmer makes me go a big rubbery one.
PrivateAckbar 1 month ago in playlist More videos from SchiffReport
"The rules of the game" and the way it should be played is always to do what is most consistent with freedom.
PrivateAckbar 1 month ago in playlist More videos from SchiffReport
"People will die if unemployment benefits are not extended." Do we really live in a society that is willing to keep poor people alive as long as someone else is paying for it? Or would it be more logical that a society willing to force people to keep others from starving would have a population large enough and wealthy enough, with good intentions enough to voluntarily keep people from starving on the streets?
Thatmakessense356 1 month ago
I propose an idea for a kind of bank that adjust principals of loans with CPI. So when inflation is 1% if I borrow 100 I should return 101, but if deflation was 1% I only have to return 99. Same apply to deposits, if you save money in a bank you get no interest but if you invest money in a bank you get interest but your money should be able to be returned in alignment with CPI as well. So people get 2 types of bank accounts, 1. No Interest Savings account, 2. The investment account that earns.
Melki 1 month ago
Hey Peter, you should give a speech here in Washington D.C. I would like to see you live.
TheMEK3 1 month ago in playlist More videos from SchiffReport
keynesian is a failure since 1913.
rushersftw 1 month ago
@rushersftw Not to diminish your point, but I think 1936 would be a better date given that was the year Keynes' General Theory was published.
ohai2yew 1 month ago
@ohai2yew I stand corrected for the incorrect date.
I still think Keynesian is a failure though :)
rushersftw 1 month ago
46:00 - 48:30
Peter is 100% right about student loans. The only way to get a decent job now is to get a masters degree and go deeper into debt and not start working till you turn 28!
Big government is destroying western civilization. Make it stop!
TimeWarp66 1 month ago
Hey Rosnick...TA TA TA TA TODAY JUNIOR!!
fiyahdave 1 month ago
Schiff did best on School Loans.
cooljj82 1 month ago 2
I work for a commercial Real Estate company. We leased out an office-warehouse to a firearm assembly company. It was amazing to me that when the government beaurocrat with the ATF was going over taxes and fees and extra 10% here and there, the owner said "well, we will just pass this cost onto the customers", and the government agent just said "thats fine". LOL Amazing. Oh the agent was also making about $150K/Year. Guess he is okay with driving up prices as long as he gets his federal pension.
cooljj82 1 month ago
Keynesian snake oil salesmen think it is possible to solve all our woes by increasing the electronic money supply - straight from the comfort of your own keyboard.
Unfortunately the real economy needs to take some real pain to right the wrongs of the last 20 years.
evilzzzability 1 month ago
Schliff-Well, corportations don't actual pay income tax...they shift it to their customers
Audience- GASP
squarecracker 1 month ago 2
Their our so many components envolved that the only solution is Jesus.
silverton7777 1 month ago
@silverton7777 Well tell him to wake up will ya
prasooncpascal 1 month ago
Depression and lazyness are big enemy's but also greedy business man who miss treated them in work force. They hire illegals to do their jobs and the illegal collect food stamps and controled rent etc. My research shows that most mexican that plug in for 10 years are making 40 60 thousands a year because their un wed wifes collect 35,000 in benifits while the men work illegally collecting 12 to 15 hour.
silverton7777 1 month ago
Peter you a hero in my mind because you say it like it is. I have many friends getting unemployement and their milking it for two years. They ve been offered jobs, 5 dallors an hour more then on unemployment however they would not take them. They would rather site home and be lazy collect a check. Many of them manuipulate SS to get permit disability checks. Now some them have net worth 200,000 or 5,000 but working has become a peria to them.
silverton7777 1 month ago
Wow, David Rosnick is an emotional fool. Schiff definitely made the most sense here.
ImhoffInstruments 1 month ago
@ImhoffInstruments Schiff made no sense in most of the areas that were discussed with his unacademic and foolish views.
exitiummagnum 1 month ago
Man, how was that Brit wanker supposedly in the "center"?! All three of those cats couldn't get far enough left, including the flippin' moderator. At least there was one person there who spoke lucidly. Thank you Mr Schiff.
thumpybones 1 month ago
Schiff is a bulldog, I love it!
JaguarSoundBlaster 1 month ago in playlist More videos from SchiffReport
IF YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE A GOVT DECIDING WHAT THE STOCK MARKET IS WORTH WHAT IS THE POINT OF HAVING A MARKET????
mason72518 2 months ago 2
listening to a brit talking economics is like listening to a gangster rapper teach you engineering maths.
xpressurs 2 months ago 13
@xpressurs Bare in mind there actually are a few rapping mathemetitions.
XpEAnUTBuTtERsUckSX 1 day ago
Two lame Keynesian's and one smart Austrian school economist
jibbi4one 2 months ago 25
They all have their heads in the sand except the few moments that they take it out just to laugh at Schiff and then stuck it back in. I thought that his past predictions proved his point in the past and gave him some credibility.
jimlap777 2 months ago in playlist More videos from SchiffReport
I've asked Peter to take me to his show because he just doesn't have the guts to answer my arguments. Yeah, happy trading day everybody.
exitiummagnum 2 months ago
I think that the faux-classy guy won this debate. People here trolling are like creationists that close their ears from the counter-arguments.
Peter didn't answer many questions that he was proposed, for example in the unemployment benefit case. Some of the Peter's arguments are false.
For example let's take the trade deficit thing. America hasn't deficit because of the government, taxes or regulations but simply because the Chinese currency isn't fluctuating in the free market.
exitiummagnum 2 months ago
@exitiummagnum
that's nonsense.. we have a deficit because we dont produce anything and because the rest of world is willing take paper for real goods because our paper is so valuable because it's the reserve currency.. You need to study Peter real carefully.
xMaXiMuSx 2 months ago
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@exitiummagnum 'America hasn't deficit because of the government, taxes or regulations but simply because the Chinese currency isn't fluctuating in the free market.' If it did the USD would be completely worthless since China is keeping the dollar alive. I guess you don't mind the federal reserve manipulating bonds' prices. The US is borrowing money it can't afford to repay to buy goods they don't produce; under a free market economy nobody would continuously lend them so much money.
zhongguohua88 2 months ago
OMG - it's painful to see that this is the low quality of economic education being fed to student in universities. For christ's sake.
KristenLumbato 2 months ago
I think Peter dominated the debate. What im wondering is why do we let these kind of debates turn into policy/sentiment driven instead of adressing it technically.. I think majority of the facts stated by these financiers could be easily tested by a simulation in a mediocre supercomputer that many of the universities have. Some might argue the human input in the market movements not being included, but we could still compare the results to 100yr market flux and see whos full of crap-Farmer imo.
kanalija 2 months ago
Schiff dominated.
100SCN 2 months ago
I almost punched my computer listening to that fat guy with the beard scream and whine... holy shit that guy reminds me of those nerds with bad tempers. I always want to fight nerds with bad tempers...
BronsonKatz 2 months ago
I don't like socialism but we must admit that Rosnick has a point. When the government takes a part of the profits of productive businesses through taxation and then gives the money for ordinary and not-that-rich people, they will almost necessarily spend the money and give it back to the productive businesses by buying goods from them.
This kind of system is in practice in countries like Norway, Sweden and Finland. They have very small deficits and businesses are doing OK.
exitiummagnum 2 months ago
@exitiummagnum Norway just had a food shortage similar to food shortages in the Soviet Union. Some were busted for smuggling butter because prices there are so high.
They export huge amounts of oil and natural resources and that helps support their tiny population. Without that, their welfare state would not exist. Even now, it is still faltering like in the example I provided.
itachi705 2 months ago
@itachi705 You referred only to Norway but excluded Finland and Sweden that are both almost on the same level with Norway in the living standard statistics.
I though people would understand the effects of the system I described. Well, let me tell you then. An example: a doctor earning 180K a year vs. a McDonald's guy earning just 20K a year. If you give them both a 10K bonus, which of them would likely to spend it and by that keep the wheels of the economy rolling? I think you know the answer.
exitiummagnum 2 months ago
@exitiummagnum
So saving and investments have no function in "your" economy?
BarrySlisk 2 months ago
@BarrySlisk I haven't said that but saving's not the solution to everything. There are two essential parts for the well being of the economy: firstly there must be spending (demand) and secondly investments (supply).
America doesn't produce not because of the acts of the government like Schiff says, but because of a huge gap between the wages in Asia and the western world. And China's totalitaristic monetary policy makes these gaps even worse by not giving renminbi to fluctuate freely.
exitiummagnum 2 months ago
@exitiummagnum
So spending money americans don't have, which goes to China, getting flatscreen TV's in return is the answer? How does this help in the long run? Would it not be better to actually produce something and sell it to the world.
BarrySlisk 2 months ago
@itachi705 Norway had the shortages just as any other country that doesn't have natural resources or a large amount of intellectual capital.
Getting back to Finland and Sweden. Finland has an industrialized economy. 30% of the GDP consists of the industrial output. The reason why is because Finland has managed to increase the total intellectual capital for the industry.
exitiummagnum 2 months ago
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@exitiummagnum "spend the money and give it back to the productive businesses"
*rolls eyes* This is the economic equivalent of the perpetual energy machine.
"practice in countries like Norway, Sweden and Finland ..."
correlation != causality
jeffiek 2 months ago
@exitiummagnum Where do the profits of productive businesses come from?
dubified89 2 months ago
@dubified89 The real (not nominal) profits (aka trade surplus) of the economy in general come from 1) exports 2) the effectiveness in using the natural resources the economy has and 3) positive capital flows (aka the yields from the foreign investments).
Schiff-pricks that just come here and accuse people by their Wolverine and British-dissing bullshit without having any clue about the economy are freaky people.
exitiummagnum 2 months ago
"I want to live in a free market economy that has a conscience." How the hell is stealing money from person A to give to person B a "free market with a conscience?" How the hell did we get to the point where government theft is a moral ideal?
caniacstanleycup 2 months ago 2
@caniacstanleycup Because they are humanist with a guillotine. You see, they are trying to do the right thing(and maybe in another contex it would be good), but they are not really trying to convince you, they want to use the state to force their will, their convictions, their opinions upon you, you see, they trying to do you good and make you moral and if they can´t they will smash your face if they have to.
megatherium100 2 months ago
I've read why Economies Grow and Why They Fail, and am starting on Crash Proof 2.0, Peter has accurately described and predicted this problem almost a decade ago. Get out of debt. Do what ever it takes, but quit spending, pay off your personnel debt. That is the least anyone can do. Do it now.
calexander230 2 months ago
Roger Farmer is trying to say some great things but there's no explanation. It sounds like empty rhetoric.
David Rosnik gets emotionally attached to his arguments. It clouds his better judgment.
Peter Schiff gives very clear explanations and analogies. He understands the problems and solutions--crystal clear.
purplefetus3 2 months ago 2
This country is going belly up!
BeantownJim 2 months ago
It seemed like everybody against Schiff, Grizzly Adams over there sounded like he wanted to cry at some points. The cool thing about Schiff is you don't need an economics degree to understand what the fuck he is saying. All these "intellectuals" throw out a smokescreen with their jargon to mask their true objectives. Grizzy kept whining about doctors making more money, and the problem is? Why didn't tubby go to medical school then and put in the hard work?that's right,he just wants a free ride.
fairman308 2 months ago
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Keynesians appeal to emotion and authority so much that before I even understood both sides of the argument I STRONGLY suspected that they were wrong. Peter Schiff confirms that suspicion every time he debates one of these individuals.
riyyc1 2 months ago
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riyyc1 2 months ago
Keynesians... LOL...
Rosnick and Farmer are morons. Why do Keynesians lack common sense?
xExekut3x 2 months ago
this schiff guy is incredibly wrong! you dont make jobs by NOT spending
WarThug13 2 months ago
@WarThug13 For every public sector job created you have to tax out two private sector jobs.
cooljj82 1 month ago
@WarThug13
How does an employee saving his money for future capital investment and being productive (key word there) not create jobs? And how does buying an iPhone (or other consumer goods) assembled in China help the US create jobs??
PazGuerro 2 weeks ago
@PazGuerro first of all you are wrong, an employee saving his money isnt going to create jobs, it is just going to sit there; if he spent it he would be reinvesting it into the economy therefore creating jobs
second when I said you create jobs by spending I was talking about GOVERNMENT spending, how do you think we got out of the Depression? Because the government started spending shitloads on the war effort for WWII, but that was when we still made everything in America
WarThug13 2 weeks ago
@WarThug13
watch?v=7QLoeehMw0w
Also, an employee constantly spending his money is a long-term detriment to the economy. What about savings? What happens when this person retires with no wealth and a bunch of useless consumer goods? I suppose you are going to say that social security and welfare are good for the economy too?
PazGuerro 2 weeks ago
@PazGuerro you are not explaining how saving money spurs an economy, money sitting in a mattress or a bank account wont help the economy at all, it will do nothing, if it is spent that money goes to the retailer who pays the wholesaler, the retailer's profit goes back into the economy spent on supplies, more goods, and employees, the wholesaler spends on trucks and truck drivers for shipping, etc.
I'm surprised I have to explain this elementary stuff to you, just admit you are wrong
WarThug13 2 weeks ago
@WarThug13
Ever heard of a capital investment? How can a potential small business owner invest if he spends his paychecks on clothes, cars, eating out, and useless consumer goods? Get a loan, right?
I'm surprised you have to explain that stuff, too, because it shows how misled your education has made you. A consumer economy that has to borrow the money it spends and runs huge trade deficits will inevitably collapse. We need to produce and export, and that means savings.
PazGuerro 2 weeks ago
@PazGuerro you never mentioned investment, you said savings and you don't need to save to invest, you can invest small amounts of money too, and when did I ever say people were borrowing obviously you cant have a conversation without putting words in my mouth, why don't you actually use your eyes and read my comments before commenting asshole
WarThug13 2 weeks ago
@WarThug13 How can you possibly invest without first producing and saving part of that production? Your comments make little sense.
benjak21 1 week ago
@benjak21 You know what? You're right. I see the flaws in my argument, spending can only hold our economy together for so long it is just a band-aid on the wound, the only way to sustain our economy long term is to save, invest, and most importantly produce and I'm sorry I didn't see that.
WarThug13 1 week ago
I hate when the guy in the middle realises he hasn't contributed enough and decides to "step in" and start talking bullshit.
Jinmane 2 months ago
You have the overweight Wolverine-looking guy busting a nut trying to make sense of what he's talking about, and this faux-classy British schmuck throwing out bullshit analogies that I'm not sure he himself even understands, and Peter sending both of them to school.
Kant419 2 months ago 37
@Kant419 Best comment here. BTW do you think these "top academics" are aware of the Epistemological differences between Kantian Rationalism and Logical Positivism ?
needtoalwayslearn 1 month ago
Peter Schiff is the man ... those other guys are retards
hmt741 2 months ago
Peter Schiff is the only one that makes sense.
Pexterable 2 months ago
Keynesianism = Economic Witchcraft!!!
jiggie2g 2 months ago 25
@jiggie2g This is only obvious to those of us whom have taken the time to look at heterodox Economics, and considered the Epistemological issues.
The illusive trick is:How do we get the message across.
needtoalwayslearn 1 month ago
If you have no money then you're and idiot that needs to get a job. You're consuming resources faster than you can produce more so YOU have to stop comsuming. Its only fair.
UncommonThinker 2 months ago
@UncommonThinker apply what you just wrote to the discussion in the video about government policy, and I think you'll find yourself agreeing with GeoFry.
teganyavo 2 months ago
yeah let's just steal money from those who have them to retain our conscience
Communism is a mental disorder
Armando7654 2 months ago
Here is a crazy idea, if I have NO MONEY then I can not spend it to make the economy "grow". So either the companies need to make things so I can afford it, or they need to fail and free up the marketplace so some one else can have a go at it.
GeoFry3 2 months ago
I love listening to the left and the middle and how both seem to have a hard time actually describing their theories, much like anyone else making it up as they go along.
GeoFry3 2 months ago
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idricool 2 months ago
I just got back from shopping and it is Christmas time in China, virtually everything in the store has a "Made in China" sticker, the things that don't have one mostly came from Vietman. The United States is an empty shell, there is very little left of our manufacturing sector, it is an airplane flying on autopilot, kept aloft by a continuous stream of money printing.
MX3516 2 months ago
"The world" stopped buying our debt a long time ago. Our bond market is propped up by the the low interest rates generated by the federal reserve which are much lower than anyone who doesn't have access to those interest rates would afford. The bond market interest rates are unsustainable at the current rate which is less than even the CPI which is an extremely conservative inflation estimate.
hodoprime 2 months ago
turning on the snowflakes made this video hilarious
nochtis 2 months ago
there is a reason why peter schiff is a ceo adn these two toolbags are number crunching nerds with no grasp of reality.
look at how schiff just rips them apart
nochtis 2 months ago
It's hard to listen to anyone but Schiff, I find myself just fast forwarding through the other people to get to Schiff.
TheBlitz1 2 months ago
For Keynseyans, the stimulus is never enough. Not even when the debt is 100 trillion. MORE PRINTING!!! idiots
hudi42 2 months ago
46:30 Farmer typifies liberals inability to apply argument logically, seeing more=better, rather than accepting diminishing/negative returns. He(rightly)says that education is a social good. This is true-to a point. Education does not only benefit the individual, but society as a whole. We need doctors, engineers, chemists, etc. Yet, at one extreme we have no people spending no time at college, At the other, we would have all people spending all time at college. Both are highly undesirable.
MrIOTOPIA 2 months ago
Farmer end on an appeal to emotion. In case he doesn't know, that's a logical fallacy...
ElJefer 2 months ago
@ElJefer Yes. Farmer's 'I believe in Capitalism with a conscience' was a particularly Nauseating soundbite moment designed to suggest Schiff doesn't. He doesnt qualify his position at all. As they say, the road the hell is paved with good intentions. Farmers type will lead us to Hell.
MrIOTOPIA 2 months ago
The moderator was not unbiased at all. He is a Keynesian and censored Schiff when he didn't agree
ElJefer 2 months ago
53:00 Lol Farmer said the recession was not connected to government intervention. Fannie and Freddie didn't contribute? the Fed changing interest rates didn't contribute? FDIC didn't contribute? I expected him to be more informed
ElJefer 2 months ago
So Rosnkick wants the government to take more of our money and decide which projects to invest in and Farmer wants the Fed to have more "tools" and the ability to buy stocks. And then they call free-market proponents crazy...
ElJefer 2 months ago
Two of these three guys make my eyes and ears bleed. Can you guess which ones?
wreagfe 2 months ago
Rosnik is a joke.
ctb3386 2 months ago
It's so sad that Schiff's opponents represent the prevailing economic attitudes of those in power (Bernanke, Geithner, and most politicians). Watching this makes me feel like I'm living in a nightmare. Peter Schiff's argument is simple and elegant: freedom is what creates prosperity and is how our country built so much wealth from the time we were founded.
electroplate 2 months ago
52:30 someone should ask Farmer if he's heard of Iceland...
Their experience of simply letting the bubble pop doesnt quite match his hellish propaganda.
MrIOTOPIA 2 months ago
@6678 I recommend you call schiffradiodotcom on open Friday and debate with Peter Schiff. Bring up your main points. If you believe in your philosophy so much, you should test it against Peter.
Nuby29 2 months ago
@Nuby29 It's not a philosophy, it's basic economics. You've shown a complete disregard for it, choosing dogma over evidence. Sorry, but you're simply not trained in it to make any intelligent contribution. This is noticeable because you've done nothing other than regurgitate dumbed down talking points from popular austrian/libertarian books. Even reputable economists who completely disregards gov. intervention don't sound as bad as you do, and are able to make articulate points.
6678 2 months ago
@6678 "@Nuby29 Agreed, Green Energy wasn't a good investment. Yet, how do you think things such as the Internet came about? It was part of a government project. Roads, sewers, medical care, and military are all things that the government provide that are necessary but the market isn't willing to provide. This is basic Adam Smith. There are downfalls to government funding, just like there are downfalls to a free-market.
Nuby29 2 months ago
@6678 I'm not going to argue who get's credit for the internet. I'm not even going to argue if green energy, or roads, sewers, medical care, and military are good investment. But I will argue, you can't go into massive debt under the idea that "your" investment is so GREAT and the growth from it will more than make up for the excessive debt. Gov needs to stay in its limit. Just like any company, the balance sheet can not be in the red for an extended period of time w/o going into bankru
Nuby29 2 months ago
@Nuby29 Yes, actually, you can argue exactly that. Heavy investment in capital and human capital will create positive externalities, 'spillovers' if you want, that allow people to be more productive and produce more output.
And again, as I've said before, but maybe you'll understand it this time, going into debt is not per say a bad thing and balancing the budget is a priority in a booming economy, not an anemic one. This is because trying to balance the books does more harm than good.
6678 2 months ago
@6678 This will be my last point. I've examined all your points, and found each one to be inaccurate, but I will not follow up anymore b/c we can debate forever and get nowhere. I understand your logic & will not gain anything further. I can say that what you suggest might work if we do follow it. But finally, when have we ever reduce the deficit? Even during the Clinton years of surplus we have already ran a deficit. That is my final point. The debt is too big they will never address it.
Nuby29 2 months ago
@Nuby29 I meant "always" Even during the Clinton years of surplus we ran a deficit every year.
Nuby29 2 months ago
Also what is your profession? I'm assuming you are an academic? I'll make a note to follow up in a few yrs. You will see there will be no growth. If it were to happen, it would've happened by now. 2012 at the latest, but it's obvious we're sliding again. Will you say wait for 2013,14,15. When will we ever address the debt. Til the whole system collapse? Like I said, result trump theory every time. That is why FREE market is the only system that work. Free M profit only those who are right
Nuby29 2 months ago
@6678 "The free market is currently experiencing a MARKET FAILURE! Unemployment is still high, and consumer confidence is barely picking up and growth is still anemic. It's amazing that even in the face of all evidence you still cheerlead a free-market that clearly isn't working optimally currently. It doesn't correct itself, that's a myth. Furthermore, you just take it for granted that it will self-correct without actually giving me a mechanism for how this occurs.*Waits for invisible hand ref"
Nuby29 2 months ago
@6678 All you have to do is look at areas where there is FREE market. Like Technology, It expands naturally, engineers improves upon old ideas, new ideas come about. iphone, ipad, fla tscreens. Then look at the medical & drugs industries where there are tons of regulations and compliance. There hasn't been a cure to anything solid. Hardly any progress. The FDA destroys so many potential drugs and ideas. As far as self correcting. It's going to be a lot of pain b/c we destroyed the free marke
Nuby29 2 months ago
@Nuby29 Technology DOES NOT EXPAND NATURALLY! There has been heavy government intervention that has allowed for companies to produce offshore at cheaper costs (Tariff Item 806 & 807), subsidies, and deregulation (particularly in the financial industry). Drug industries are bloated because government has offered protectionism in the name of 'safety measures' (which is a load of bull, I know.)
That's your mechanism for how the market is self correcting? It doesn't explain anything!
6678 2 months ago
@6678 so now I see your mentally. You don't believe in the FREE market at all. You believe in a control market (fiscal & monetary). That is so scary. It's one thing to say "control" or "intervention" market is better than free market (which I disagree), but it's another thing to say free market is a complete failure. You don't understand why we are cheer-leading it. Maybe b/c we see the debt growing, gov growing, corrupt politicians and their lobbyists. The free market would never allow this.
Nuby29 2 months ago
@Nuby29 I believe in free-market, but I believe in government intervention to prevent fraud and market failures. So does everyone who believes and studies the free-market, they know it's not without its shortfalls as well. Government has short-falls too, but abolishing it or minimizing it excessively is stupid and got us into the mess we're in.
6678 2 months ago
Listen to the UCLA trolls at the end boo Peter for saying the obvious. No one is going off benefits as long as the benefits are there.
beallendall08 2 months ago
Roger Farmer and David Rosnick are 2 total trolls. Why do these idiot economist believe that their will always be someone out there that will buy US bonds. WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WOULD BUY OUR DEBT?
beallendall08 2 months ago
They should have escorted the two establishmenf whores from the building after their first minute of chatter, so Peter Schiff can school the audience without interruption.
EriPages 2 months ago
They bore the bejesus out of you with jargon and gibberish, then people think they are so smart that they must be right.
bizwiz21 2 months ago
Man.....I feel really smart watching these two clowns stutter through their ridiculous ideas.
fosterchild4523 2 months ago
Rosnick is a stumblingl, bumbling, fumbling idiot and Farmer thinks he is so smart that all he needs to do as President is give more "tools" to the idiots that created this mess. This arrogant ass thinks that HE is so smart that HE can micromanage the economy and adjust a few knobs so to speak. As usual Schiff completely schools these two fools.
fosterchild4523 2 months ago 12
as soon as i heard the guy in the middle was from a university i had a feeling he was a tool
MrGiggity890 2 months ago
Wow! Peter Schiff was the only one that had a clue how economies work and why they prosper/collapse. The other two were just regurgitating the same ol' Keynesian "aggregate demand", low interest rates, free money, money printing & govt spending BS that got is into this mess. SUPPLY is king. You can't have consumption without first producing goods to sell or export. Companies aren't investing because govt rules/regs/mandates/taxes & high labor/energy costs have made it unprofitable to do so.
samuraiconservative 2 months ago
Why is everyone concerned about Kenyans. They don't exactly have a booming economy. Duh!
MaHaRushie 2 months ago
Peter Schiff is a cheating MFer who makes money when our economy fails. People like him enjoy it when the poor and middle class lose their money.
hiten369 2 months ago
@hiten369 Oh so you don't buy stuff when its on sale. Come one buy low sell high is what everyone is trying to do. Peter just does it better than everyone else.
MaHaRushie 2 months ago
@hiten369 He also make money when the economy thrives. Unfortunately, those economies are not here in the states.
Nuby29 2 months ago
@hiten369 peter schiff has been sounding the alarm before the crisis.
if the government listened we wouldnt have hasd the financial crisis.
so how is he trying to profit from it.?
if that was he's intention he wouldn't have tried to warn people dumbass.
xpressurs 2 months ago
@xpressurs Peter Schiff didn't do shit. He lost money for his clients in 2008 and he has admitted this. He was wrong about hyperinflation and he was wrong about the rest of the world would be immune to a US slowdown. Perhaps if you got up off your knees and stopped sucking his dick you would realize Peter Schiff is all hype.
hiten369 2 months ago
@hiten369 that just shows you haven't done any homework, he hasn't been wrong about hyperinflation, i listen to his show and he believes within the next 2-5 years it could get bad. you can't time this stuff perfectly dude, but the fact is that he did predict the housing bubble collapse with military precision and you're going to write him off as stupid? you sound like mainstream media when it comes to Ron Paul. These people are not only intelligent, but pretty damn courageous.
MrMattieRich 2 months ago
@MrMattieRich Actually, I did do my homework. But people like you are so stuck in Peter Schiff's ass that you can see how much he was wrong. It's not like he was the only one to predict the economic collapse. Liberal have been warning us for decades but dumbasses like you wrote them off. All you have to do is Google "Peter Schiff was Wrong" and you'll find detail examples of how he was wrong.
hiten369 2 months ago
@hiten369 why don't you Google "peter schiff predictions 2002-2007 and you'll see he was laughed at for eventually being right about everything. I'm sure other people predicted these issues but he was more vocal then most, but yeah I'm sure he's an idiot b/c he bought gold 15 years when it was 200/oz.... hahaha man wake up and stop calling people names, it just shows your childish when it comes to having a spirited debate about real issues. he didn't just fall into his wealth....
MrMattieRich 2 months ago
@MrMattieRich the real issue is why does PS makes his money from shorting which is making money when others fail. How can you say he's good at predictions when his clients lost a ton of money. Yet he knew when the collapse was going to happen. That doesn't inspire confidence. It's childish of you to bend over backwards for this guy. And no he wasn't that vocal at all. So being wrong for five years makes Peter Schiff right now? Give me a break.
hiten369 2 months ago
@hiten369 first of all you need short sellers in the market, that's markets 101 and second, many many people lost money during that time, hell i did! And yeah some of PS lost some money but many of his customers were invested in gold and even though they took a hit for a while, they doing fine now, this isn't about losing money short term, it's about making money long term. stop living in the moment. you have to look at the investment horizon of his customers.
MrMattieRich 2 months ago
@hiten369 his company Euro Pac Metals seems to be doing just fine, he has many customers and continues to grow, so what exactly are you talking about when you say his customers lost money, EVERYONE did on certain investments, but if took his general advice about foreign currencies, dividend stocks and precious metals, you may of lost money in the short term, but right now you're looking pretty good. the markets are turbulent b/c the FED is keep interest rates too low.
MrMattieRich 2 months ago
@hiten369 it seems as though you just don't understand his message, listen to his show and try to understand his principle and philosophy behind his economic ideas, you don't just understand this stuff overnight, get over the normalcy bias that nothing bad could happen here, were in worse shape than every country in Europe, we owe more money to more people than any other country in history... doesn't that bother you? we have to stop borrowing money, it's our only hope
MrMattieRich 2 months ago
@hiten369 you think he should be a day trader and not a commodities broker, he sees long run trends and has made a mint off of those trends, one data point where he still outperformed most even if he took a loss does not make him an idiot. losing less in a crashing market still makes you look good, and over the past few years he has been going gangbusters. or maybe i should just make shit up like you have. not being able to pinpoint a crash but calling the trend still makes him right
surrealnumber 2 months ago
@surrealnumber So being wrong for five years makes Peter Schiff right now?
hiten369 2 months ago
@hiten369 you are going to need to tell me what FIVE years youre talking about, because it seems like youre pulling shit right out of your ass
surrealnumber 2 months ago
@surrealnumber 2002-2007 dumbass!. Here's PS in 2007, watch?v=2I0QN-FYkpw&. Sounds good right, wrong. If you listened to Peter between 2002-2007, you lost your shirt. If you had listened to Peter and "short" stock "A" at 25, your loss has no limit. If it goes to $100, you lose $75. In shorting, you are only limited in your upside. If "A" goes to zero, "Schiffers" profit $25. Yes, Peter S. is so honorable, he so great!
So get back on your knees and start sucking.
hiten369 2 months ago
@hiten369 and to think i was going to debate something, there is no need to debate an emotional child that cannot do anything but personal attacks, and his firm and investments performed well during that time overall, there was one year in that period where his investments took a loss, but he did not sell and it turns out to have been a great decision on his part. i am done with out and your personal attacks.
surrealnumber 2 months ago
@surrealnumber What debate? All you did was praise Peter Schiff and constantly tell me how great he is. All you did was pander. It's OK, I know Peter Schiff fans don't have a leg to stand on so it's been entertaining for me. Make sure to tell Peter that your ass is nice and loose.
hiten369 2 months ago
@hiten369 i did what now? you must like making things up because you have done it with every post you have attacked me with. saying i did an action does not make it true, youre going to need to troll better if you want to get a rise out of me. lies simply wont work.
surrealnumber 2 months ago
@surrealnumber So when you can't defend your position you call me and others a lier. The difference between you and me is, I was showing the truth of what peter was saying. You and others just pander and try to defend your lover boy. Debate is useless because it's just 2 people arguing instead of seeking what is true. That's why you lost and you try to run away from people that might burst your little bubble.
hiten369 2 months ago
@hiten369 defend my position that he did get hit one year but did not sell and because of that his investments pulled through ina big way onthe long run.i have no vested interest in schiff, i dont make money from his actions but i dont tryto caracter assassinate him or others. i have lost nothing but the time i have spent typing responses to you,nothing i have said has been wrong you sit there and attack people for no reason. as i said you need to troll harder if you want to get a rise out of me
surrealnumber 2 months ago
@hiten369 Well, I don't know about you, but i'll throw in with the guy who bases investment strategy on savings and production, not spending and consumption.
TheBlitz1 2 months ago
@hiten369 Schiff has been right for 14 years.
cooljj82 1 month ago
@hiten369 oh and please don't comment on grammar and spelling..... it's youtube, i only say that because someone else already did and it's a bit annoying when were talking about real issues and they bring up that i misspelled something...
MrMattieRich 2 months ago
@MrMattieRich When did I make a comment on your grammar?
hiten369 2 months ago
@xpressurs If you want to find someone who knew this ecomonic collapse was coming try Brooksly Borne who was the chairperson of the CFTC in the late 90's. She saw the dangers of the derivatives market and tried to stop it but was blocked by Greenspan. She was also criticized by punk asses like you for even trying. I know you won't understand a word I'm saying so just go back down on your knees and start sucking. The rich need people like you so make sure you open that mouth real wide.
hiten369 2 months ago
@hiten369 ^LOL, finally!
Don't try and bother debating with these youtube users. I've been trying to also explain to them why Peter Schiff is full of shit, but it's gone nowhere. Many people here don't understand basic economics, but instead get all their information from Schiff or popular austrian economics books (which are manifestos, not real books on economics).
6678 2 months ago
Our universities are infested with keynesian fools polluting the minds of our children with misinformed economics. Peter is one of the few people left who understands real economics, more people like him hopefully will take back the country.
TWSceptic 2 months ago