Critical Thinking for Children - 2. Three Kinds of Thinkers

[Sneaklemming]

Is it not a little ironic that I find Fairminded Fran to be Naive?!

[finalfantasy8911]

@Sneaklemming

Why is that?

[Sneaklemming]

@finalfantasy8911

"I want to be fair to others because I expect everyone to be fair to me."

[finalfantasy8911]

@Sneaklemming

What, she expects too much of others?

[Sneaklemming]

@finalfantasy8911 an attitude like that can get you hurt

[finalfantasy8911]

@Sneaklemming

A-hahaha. Yes it can.

[robincb30]

THis sounds like Adora Svitak's voice!!! I love her!

[finalfantasy8911]

And "Fran" had better find out soon that, truth be told: she will NEVER be able to make the world a better place for everyone. Humanity is just WAY too diverse.

[MartialArtsMaster]

@finalfantasy8911

It sounds like you haven't learned intellectual humility, the art of not asserting something to be true you do not in fact KNOW to be true.

In fact, the world is already a better place than it was a thousand years ago because of (for example) revolutionaries, thinkers such as Galen who perfected the art of brain and eye surgery, and Human Rights Watch.

Your goal might be to rationalize selfish behavior that hurts others. Is that accurate?

[finalfantasy8911]

@MartialArtsMaster

Well stranger, what do you think I am asserting to know that you think I don't know? What makes others more than tools for achieving a desired goal? Especially the ones who are obnoxious, bigoted, racist, stupid, arrogant, demanding, insane, and other undesirables? Nothing but hairless apes are all people are. Selfish behavior, along with a lack of sympathy and acute intellect, tends to reap benefits. And on what ground does the history lesson have in this?

[finalfantasy8911]

@MartialArtsMaster

Prove me illogical, and I will consider the sentimental argument you have to offer effectual and reshape my moral system because of it.

[MartialArtsMaster]

@finalfantasy8911

The problem with your argument isn't one of logic, it's one of "accuracy" and "breadth." It is simply not true that the only way to get what you want is to step all over other people; ask anyone's married parents, or read about loving relationships throughout history since ancient Greece, there is your demonstration.

Also, humans are bad at figuring out who is "undesirable" and who is not, and end up hurting innocent people because of bad definitions.

[finalfantasy8911]

@MartialArtsMaster

It looks like you haven't learned to read thoroughly. I didn't say steping over people was the ONLY way one can get what they want. Kindness, good-will, and sympathy are pathyways as well, but why not pretend those emotions? Why accept that "roller coster of emotions" that comes with emotionally attaching to others? Also, I don't know what you mean by "accuracy" & "breadith", so please clarify that.

[finalfantasy8911]

@MartialArtsMaster

I agree with the last sentance, many, many humans are inadequate thinkers and end up hurting, killing, and/or tormenting others because of it. There are many reasons why: religion, insanity, discontent, bad parents, abandonment by loved ones, government screw-ups, many reasons exist. Most of the reasons, however, are rooted in the flaws of human nature. What do you propose, as a "moral" human being (which you perhaps are), is the solution to all of this?

[finalfantasy8911]

I most definately agree that Nancy is an inadequate critical thinker. Sam and Fran, however, are both ADEQUATE critical thinkers (although I don't know why Sam would want to consider tricking himself). The main difference between Sam and Fran is that Fran includes sympathetic emotions in her train of thought, which is in fact COMPLETELY unnecessary (up to you if you want to include it). Sam is selfish, but not illogical or stupid; and thats the point. Confused? Disagree? Then talk to me.

[mtng0ddess]

I am so using this in my classroom! I have a ton of Nancys and Sams in my classroom.

[liloboy911808]

I'm an adult and I found this to be very helpful. Even as adults you should still learn from what the 3rd person has said.



[Jarrod5300]

@XinBiDe It does seem that there is a general sexism, not just here, but in other places as well, that treats men as less considerate, more selfish members of society. I can't think of any specific examples right now, but when I was a child I did feel like there are a lot of books, TV shows, and other things aimed at children that are a little biased towards females.

[MartialArtsMaster]

@n1gardenfan

Nitpicking. You haven't responded to any of the actual ideas in this video. Instead, you simply wish to discredit the authors. That is unreasonable.

[jmegawarne]

Ironically, this video conflates critical thinking with ethical action.

[MartialArtsMaster]

@jmegawarne

Of course it does. That's because ethical action is an essential part of critical thinking. That's why Socrates vehemently disagreed with Thrasymachus' belief that justice is in the interests of the strong. It isn't.

[jmegawarne]

@MartialArtsMaster Now you are conflating justice with critical thinking.

[MartialArtsMaster]

@jmegawarne

Justice is a necessary part of critical thinking, because critical thinking always respects the rights and needs of others, like a civilized human being.

Would it KILL all of you commenting on this video to actually do the reading the authors suggest rather than coming up with endless excuses for your selfishness and utter refusal to actually hear what the authors are saying?

Why you're all flying off the handle over the idea of being good to other people, I will never know.

[jmegawarne]

@MartialArtsMaster Now you are suggesting that a simple criticism is a symptom of my flying off the handle and of my being selfish. What a pity that your critical thinking skills are so poor.

If justice in critical thinking is a given, can you explain how critical thinking can be used to examine and possibly re-evaluate what is just? If ethical action is a part of critical thinking, can you explain how critical thinking can be used to examine and possible re-evaluate what is ethical?

[tima9992003]

I'm all three o_O

[Nine00]

"You can't believe all you see ON TV", yep because it's just TV. Can't believe everything in books, on the internet and especially IN SCHOOL either.

[MartialArtsMaster]

@Nine00

Reading books, as explained in 25 Days To Better Living, is an absolutely essential component of education oneself and enriching one's mind, mostly by reading all the greatest thinkers of the world.

[Nine00]

I never said that it wasn't. All I did say was that it's not just TV you can't believe. They are books that are full of lies, too. You can't believe it simply because it's a book and not TV.

[molewizard]

I'm going to be honest, Fran seems autistic to me.

[TheTigerReturns]

I always used to think that I thought too much, I always used to think over my thoughts and I thought I was going crazy! Now I know it's not a bad thing, but a great thing! :)

[TGGeko]

Sam will grow up to be a supervillian.

[highpitchike]

I am selfish sam...thats alright i am boplar...o wait there i go again coming up with excuses to make things right when there not, i am 23 aand why didnt i have this when i was younger, could have saved me much hassel. lol

[Automation2BFree]

@highpitchike Why didn't you learn critical thinking when you were younger? Could it be that we live in a world of inequality? That the rich and powerful want to make people demoralized and unable to figure out that we are being flooded with propaganda to continue playing the role of ignorant consumers and unable to resist the Big Brother government that is comming? We are "human resources" for them to do whatever they want with. Crisis is comming, millions or even billions will die soon.

[KanatsizKelebekk]

@Automation2BFree I agree with you! Thinking matters so much...

[DrRonPaul]

I think I'll use my critical thinking skills and call out the politically correct bullshit in this video.

How exactly can you be a politically correct absolutest and be open minded?

[MartialArtsMaster]

@DrRonPaul

You are labeling any non-selfish form of thinking as politically correct.

Don't blame Richard Paul for your own lack of fair-mindedness. If your peer group has taught you that selfishness is a good thing and compassion is "politically correct," then maybe you need to stop classifying yourself as already having critical thinking skills and recognize when you're just egocentrically attacking ideas instead of rationally critiquing them.

For example, refrain from using "bullshit."

[DrRonPaul]

@MartialArtsMaster If your peer group has taught you that altruism is a good thing and individualism is "politically incorrect" then maybe you stop classifying yourself as already having critical thinking skills and recognize that this video is egocentrically attacking ideas instead rationally critiquing them.

Have a nice day.

[MartialArtsMaster]

@DrRonPaul

That is IMMATURE of you, just parroting my argument back to me in reverse instead of meeting it.

Every great thinker since Socrates has warned against Thrasymachus' selfish living. That is not "politically correct," that is a fact.

This author is not egocentrically attacking you, YOU are the one egocentrically attacking this video.

You're demonstrating what this author is talking about, preferring thinking that confirms your beliefs instead of thinking that is fair to others.

[MartialArtsMaster]

@DrRonPaul

One more thing. I wasn't attacking individualism, I was attacking selfishness. You got my argument wrong because you confused the two concepts, ironically proving Richard Paul right by failing to live up to the intellectual standard of "precision," the ability to make subtle distinctions and recognize nuances and fine points.

Read these people's published works before you judge them. Stop jumping to conclusions about what they think based on your own feelings of being attacked.

[DrRonPaul]

@MartialArtsMaster You are attacking individualism and so is this video. The video presents a good vs evil, right vs wrong paradigm. Thats about as far from critical thinking as you can get.

You can call me selfish or I can call you a marxist. Neither is any more "nuanced" than the other.

[MartialArtsMaster]

@DrRonPaul

Like I said, try to actually research and read their published works before you jump to conclusions about Richard Paul and Linda Elder. Never say you know something if you haven't confirmed it for yourself. In fact, that could be applied to any opinion you happen to hold. You should not try to criticize something you only falsely think you understand. Black and white is about the furthest thing away from everything their published works try to stress.

[Elesparto]

Sam sounds like American foreign policy...

[Cueil]

@Elesparto that's everyone's foreign policy... perhaps you are naive nancy?

[Elesparto]

@Cueil

No...it definitely sounds like Sam has learned from his uncle--Uncle Sam, and with his selfishness and lack of critical thinking skills he too will plunge the country into endless wars--good old Sam...just like uncle...but it's too bad he never goes to fight his wars himself. Imagine if Sam and his elite friends fought the wars they created themselves-that small group would annihilate itself in no time and leave the rest of us alone...make a wish...

[EpistemicFusion]

@n1gardenfan maybe you should take some lessons...

[MomoTheBellyDancer]

Well, Sam has a point. Often it's best to just tell people what they want to hear. People will often turn against you if you simply tell them what you think.

[Shavarnarak]

I like how Selfish Sam sounds like a Rush Limbaugh Jr.

That's very appropriate indeed!

[ScrewAttackChina]

its important in society to have Naive Nancy's, Selfish Sams and FM Fran's. Each play a role in the ladder of society.. I can't tell you how many Naive Nancy's I've slept with in college. I'm a Selfish Sam.

[Korkzor]

to "except everyone to be fair to you" is probably asking too much. Being fair to others bring it´s own rewards, and I think that should have been emphasised as well.

[samthehaloguy]

fuck fran

ftw sam

[wiseye61]

selfish sam is the most interesting, how do i learn to be like him?

[ShinobiBoiX]

Selfish Sam is alpha as f*ck  lols

[RandomSydee]

LOL I'm Selfish Sam

[MartialArtsMaster]

I would argue there are a lot of Selfish Sams in the population too. Not just among kids, either: now we have people like Glenn Beck who argue that empathy for others isn't even a good idea to begin with!

Selfish Sam's philosophy is beginning to be taught in graduate business schools. Forget graduate schools, now teachers are starting to encourage bullies and punish the bullies' victims for "whining!"

We are a country that equates "diplomacy" with "wimpiness." That's Sam's idea, not Nancy's.

[ensittare]

This video seems to be more about Morals than critical Thinking...to be honest, or at least it is the morals that kids are going to pick up when they watch it not the key ideas.

[666or999]

Why does critical thinking seem to equal alturism in this video? I find it strange that a video on critical thinking would be pushing forward ideas like selfishness is intrinsicly wrong.

[MartialArtsMaster]

@666or999

Because selfishness entails hurting people in ways you would not want others to hurt you.

If you decide for example to get your jollies from hurting little kids because that's what gives you pleasure in life, you're being selfish.

If you're a corporate boss and you gain your wealth by stealing it from 70-year-old people who just wanted their pensions for four decades of hard work, you're making their lives miserable and therefore being selfish.

Do you see how it works now?

[Mandoon]

@666or999 Me too, but I think that the whole thing makes you think. Which is probably what its for, remmeber that it is there to both help you question yourself and others, but not to judge. Makes me feel foolish and stupid lol but I realize that I can only get better. And this is a kids thing lol!

[Rustyshackleford08]

OMG this is awesome, everyone can learn from this:) I want to show my friend and my brother this (they have kids obviously.)

[clevo891]

a lost art...

[walliworld]

Nice video. This should be for adults as well.

[albert1498]

i totally agree with you

[ruinyourdaywithpiss]

@walliworld

Would put both kids and adults to sleep.

[Mandoon]

@ruinyourdaywithpiss You ruined your day with piss!

[bowlerdude]

fair minded fran, watching tv? tsk tsk tsk

[nbakram]

i think im a fair minded fran

[XinBiDe]

Why are the men always the villains? Why can't it be Selfish Samantha and Fair-minded Fred?

[CriticalThinkingOrg]

My question would be; Why do you perceive men as "always being the villains"? and; why do you feel it was a sexist decision to assign any or the characters, Nancy, Sam or Fran the genders they were?

It is the positive and negative traits of the mind, not the gender that matters.

[Katy1985]

I like your video, even though they are critical thinking skill for children, I found that helpful too. I am currently struggling bad in universtiy, I guess building some more critical skill and being able to cope with my own procrastination will help. Thanks

[XinBiDe]

Did I use the word sexist? I just felt it was a bit cliche to make the guy out to be the dick, but not quite as honest. The examples given by Selfish Sam... telling parents what they want to hear, manipulation, etc. These are behaviors that young girls are perfectly likely to exhibit, as most parents will report.

Consider this: your portrayal of women encompasses naive attitudes and mature, responsible attitudes, but males in the world you've created here are entirely one dimensional: selfish.

[rkyeun]

@CriticalThinkingOrg

Unless you flipped coins for the gender of your characters, you had some basis for choosing which would be which. What reasoning did you use?

[ushadrons]

@CriticalThinkingOrg,

I am certain that gender is not a determinate factor when it comes to selfish or complacent behavior in human beings. Fairminded Fred is a friend of mine. LOL!

America needs an adult version of this message for the consumers of cable news and talk radio.

[Maximustard]

@CriticalThinkingOrg Critically thinking about XinBiDe's comment I believe he was having some fun !!!

My question is why would you question XinBiDe re his comment and assume that he was serious ?

Have you got a Jump To Conclusions board game?

Good uploads keep up the good work.

[kid29a]

"Why are the men always the villains?"

statistics xD

[XinBiDe]

@kid29a Are statistics an accurate presentation of reality, though, or could we find that there are a lot of cultural variables that would include the reinforcement of these negative stereotypes to the point where men just slip into the roles? And are we going to deny that there is a great amount of female violent crime that goes unreported? I'd say most domestic abuse committed by women goes unreported, for example.

[kid29a]

@XinBiDe Sure but there is no better way to know it. You think it's true. Somebody else may think the opposite. You have to find some way of assessing who is right. Statistics are better than individual's opinion. You just have to make better statistics.

[cddavids]

I like the way that you are using your critical thinking skills in evaluating this video. Are you sure that you are being fair-minded?

[babaluboo123]

@XinBiDe

I guess you forgot about all those Super-Hero's....oops...they are almost all men ;-)

[XinBiDe]

@babaluboo123 And, aside from superman, aren't most male superheroes dramatically flawed in someway? Batman is overly aggressive and borderline insane, Punisher is a mass murder, Green Arrow was a womanizer and a greedy jerk, Tony Stark was a womanizer and alcoholic, etc... In general, male heroes are portrayed as eccentric, obsessed, and having major psychological issues, while female heroes, such as Wonder Woman, Power Girl, Super Girl, Spider Woman, etc. tend to have less glaring flaws.

[babaluboo123]

@XinBiDe Well, I guess I'd be out of my depth to go any further.

Now, I'll have to be more observant when I come across super-heros, again.

[l337pwnage]

@XinBiDe Well, you want the vid to be realistic, don't ya? :)

[lezvarthok]

@XinBiDe you could also say that nancy is dumb. at least he has brains ;) I'd say in some comedyseries it seems like making sexual roles of the stupid man has have been popular for a while, but when I thought so, I had much trouble with an ignorant woman. maybe its just an impression of your circumstance. maybe people would be angry if fairminded fran would be a twit ? maybe some gays would be outraged if its a boy and a girl ? its hard to satisfy emotional responses and maybe its not necessary.

[ElizabethIsabelle]

@XinBiDe I wonder why you only noticed that the male character was the "villain" and did not notice that "Naive Nancy" was a female. Is it really important to you that all of the negative characteristics be assigned to female characters, and the good guy has to be a guy?

It sounds like the narrator is female, so it seems reasonable to assign her own gender to the character embodying her ideas. Men's rights do need to be protected, but if you go overboard you will get as silly as feminism got.

[MultiJacob17]

@XinBiDe because all men are pigs!!!!!

[MultiJacob17]

@XinBiDe I don't think it was intentional.Plus,all men are pigs!!!

[XinBiDe]

@MultiJacob17 Hey, let's not base this on "reality" though, be politically correct ;) hjahahaha

[BeatlesFan51620]

lol Naive Nancy