Bill, now that you bashed Bush (I hate him as well) and I've been a fan of you for years I have to ask you where you stand politically. Are you a libertarian? Do you support Ron Paul? Do you even live in the US or have you been repatriated to Argentinia?
I used to be a fanatic communist... and I mean fanatic. I abandoned politics some time ago and then got back into the show with the issue of extinction. It is more an 'Economics' than a 'Politics' issue, but I think I finally got to where I had to reach. I am essentially apolitical because I think that our species is on its way out (Vids 14-18). Politics per se doesn't interest me any more, certainly not half as much as in my youth.
2. My interest in 9/11 is not political, but Physics. I don't swallow the nonsense that what happened that day was done by Arabs, not because of politics, but because I don't like to eat shit. The politics of WHY the US Military had to do it doesn't affect me at all. That's an internal American problem.
3. It's barely a curiosity from my perspective, no different actually than why Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld Gonzalez, et al, decided to torture people with waterboarding and then got away with convincing the masses that it was an 'enhanced interrogation technique'. These things don't affect me these days. 30 years earlier it would have created an instantaneous ulcer from the adrenaline rush alone.
Again, I'm not into politics at all. I can vote in the four countries of which I am a citizen, but I do my best to stay away from the ballotage lines if I can help it. I'd rather use the time to enjoy a good beer and read a book. I haven't voted in years. In Argie, I am required to vote, so the last time I did I stuffed the envelope with all the candidates. It barely fit thru the slit of the box. Big Bro can force me to vote, but will not compel my allegiance.
5. Paul will not prevent extinction. Neither will Romney, Perry or whoever. The global econ WILL collapse no matter what anyone does. The only Q is when.
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"have you been repatriated to Argentinia?"
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I was sent back to Argie, then went to Colombia, where I have strong ties, and now I'm in Germany. The beer is not as good and the women are not as attractive as in Brazil or Argie, but it's a livin'!
I agree that there will be an economic collapse no matter what. But with a free market approach we might turn it to the better. If we keep our socialist policies with massive redistribution of wealth, barriers to entry and phony money that isn't backed by anything it will be truly horrific.
And as I already said, I don't agree with your expectation that humanity will go completely extinct. I am sure there will be alot of people that will starve to death or die during the riots that will go on
But why should they ALL die? Humans are animals, but they are adapt to a vast variety of environments and situations. I'm sure there will be enough humans for mankind or even civilisation to survive.
3. There is little time to plant seeds and grow crops when you are being hunted, and you will be bait only in the best of cases if you managed to store food for a lengthy period of time. Since no one agrees with what i'm saying, very few are taking precautions NOW. It will be too late to run to the supermarket to stock up at the last moment. You'll be elbowing everybody in town.
4. They, you have to have seeds and other resources to do post-collapse subsistence farming if you survive the killing/cannibalism phase. There will be no hunting because it is unrealistic to expect any small to large mammal, bird, fish or reptile to survive the hunger of 7B monkeys armed with technology.
5. But assuming you managed to get thru all that, you will have an enormous psychological problem. You are suddenly in a new planet, an alien, an extraterrestrial in his own land. So how many people are you? Is it just your wife? Does your group include your sons and daughters? Are your neighbors or friends and their children included? Are you 5, 10, 50, 100?
6. These things have to be planned. You don't improvise them on the last day. The bigger the group, the more resources you need to store and the more likely it will be for bands to find you and/or your cache of food.
7. Assuming you survive all that, there won't be a human for hundreds of miles around and you surely won't go looking for trouble. The worst enemy of a human in the wild is another human -- certainly not a rabbit. Will the children find mates? Will they mate if they find a mate? Will they have 20 children again like the grandmas of old? City girls??? Who don't want to have a kid despite medicines, docs and hospitals? They'll have a kid in the bushes w/o docs?
9. So, no! There will NOT be reproduction assuming a family survives because it took the extreme trouble to prepare in advance. People like you are betting that the collapse won't happen, that it's business as usual, that this is a cycle. That's why you aren't preparing for anything. If you truly realized that the collapse WILL happen, no matter what, then you would react differently.
"The dinosaurs were for the most part giant beings that needed a lot of food to sustain themselves."
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Irrelevant! It's not a Q of whether Man needs so many calories per day. It's a yes or no type of Q. If you don't feed a man for a year, he will invariably die way before New Dear's Day. This is NOT a prediction! I add this comment from now on because people have yet to figure out what a prediction is.
I've posted a large series of comments on one of your videos where I explain in detail why your extinction-theory is pretty bad when analyzed from an austrian-economic's standpoint
@77GSlinger oh and it was cute getting me banned on that channel, seens that faggot does that to anyone who doesnt subscribe to his ideas or calls him out on all his bullshit
@Xero555000 You have some serious mental problems and a blatant hatred for Gays, which is actually against youtube policy, so you may be banned from youtube permanently even for this one foul comment. Its your problem not mine and you have nothing to contribute of any value in any discussion, just your self hate and personal ugliness! Sorry to hear your life sucks so bad. I wish you the best and that you can get yourself the psychological help you so desperately need. Many Blessings to you!
@77GSlinger only faggots think people who call them a faggot are calling them out for being gay, look up lewis CK, he'll explain it to you because you're a fucking idiot
@Xero555000 that is two violations against the conduct code on youtube against Gays and you look real ugly with your mindless drivel and insults. Poor sad sack and scrub of a loser what a pathetic dark soul you are. Now go hang yourself and do the world a big favor!
@Aegis5461 I don't watch the idiot box Mr. aegis troll with a fake shill channel where you hide and attack people who are infinitely smarter than you! Bill has destroyed your mind controlled world, now crawl back under your rock you creepy thang! You are not witty you are an idiot! Nothing has changed since last election fool! TPTB are still TPTB!
Only the first few minutes of the call were recorded. There were almost 20 additional minutes after the recording we don't hear. Was the plane really nosediving at impossible speed a full 20 minutes before Betty was even disconnected?
Again, this would have been an idiotic "shoot yourself in the foot" type thing to plan out and build into a conspiracy. Whether Ted lied to add some drama or draw some sympathy or what, or Barbara managed to make an improbable (but possible) call on her cell phone, conspirators wouldn't have created such a dumb lie that served so little purpose.
9) It sucks ass that these guys got promoted even when they failed to prevent this atrocity. I think think the US gov't IS dysfunctional. I WISH they were capable of grand united efforts that could unite and galvanize the nation. I am not pro war or pro conspiracy, though. And anyway, there's no way they could pull off a conspiracy, there isn't enough unity, there isn't enough competence.
It would have been a spectacle, a real theatrical event with F-15 fighter jets shooting down empty planes the Arabs thought would be full. SEALs would swim, in full gear, and board vessels "taken" by Al Queda operatives. Snipers would be picking off evildoers. The whole country would be an orgy of nationalistic pride and fury!
Not a discombobulated mess of fear, hopelessness, conspiracy, and skepticism.
I would have tricked some Al Queda operatives into thinking mid/high level soldiers had flipped to their side. They would have leaked a "hole" in our defenses. Al Queda "penetrates" our defenses, maybe takes out an empty cruise liner sitting in harbor or a FedEx plane full of people's mail. Then big bad US special ops swoop in and save the day! Go us! Let's get those Muslim towel-heads! Bomb bomb bomb Iran! I mean Iraq! Whatever, which has oil again?
Have I mentioned that our government is ludicrously dysfunctional and politicians are corrupt?
Corrupt, yes. Ready to order the murder of hundreds and the effective murder of thousands, all just for an excuse to invade Iraq??? To cause untold carnage and destruction, then plant/create damning evidence like "reporter scripts" and improbable docs?
I could think of a better conspiracy over breakfast, and handle it better while drunk!
Who gives a shit about a bandana? It's consistent with one of the passenger's stories, but ffs it's trifling compared to the other allegedly fabricated evidence. The DL and bandana make no sense at all. May as well show a vid of your wife with another man and then say hey, I recovered a used condom from the scene, and it's the same brand you and your wife use! Except the DL/band are even worse, they weigh more against the perps b/c they're so improbable.
While it does strain one's belief that this could survive, I can't imagine what the conspirators have to gain by planting a simple DL. There are countless calls from UA93 with screaming in the background and other havoc. The cockpit recorder has the terrorists speaking in Arabic and talking about a bomb. If anything, planting this DL hurts their case. Same with the bandana. Planting these objects is shooting themselves in the foot!
In the vid onlookers report observations from indeterminate vantage points and distances in the immediate aftermath. I find it very unconvincing that a few people testified using similes, metaphors, and analogies. It didn't look like a plane crashed, blah blah.
In many pictures of the crash site the 1st floor is obscured by water vapor, smoke, and debris. This hole is about 90 feet across. I've said before, also, that I wouldn't be suprised if part(s) of the fragile wings didn't quite penetrate the steel reinforced concrete wall. Check:
Impossible that it flew out of his pocket on the way down?
I admit this point is a little suspicious and convenient. Perhaps the passport was planted just to implicate someone believable so the American people could point their rage somewhere specific. If none were positively identified, there would have been a lot of emotion with no direction, extremely dangerous.
A believable smaller conspiracy, or it fortuitously flew out a broken window before impact.
Impossible that it flew out of his pocket on the way down?
I admit this point is a little suspicious and convenient. Perhaps the passport was planted just to implicate someone believable so the American people could point their rage somewhere specific. If none were positively identified, there would have been a lot of emotion with no direction, extremely dangerous.
A believable smaller conspiracy, or it fortuitously flew out a broken window before impact.
4) Silverstein said the fire chief said to "pull" the building.
Well, fire chiefs are not CD, and so we should be hesitant to assign meanings to their words that come from CD-parlance. Especially when those meanings don't even make sense.
Pull means with cables. It's also CD jargon, and this was a firefighter speaking.
More believable: Fire chief was "pulling" the rescue operation around WTC7 because he didn't want to lose the rescue workers.
There are no problems with forewarning. The building had internal fires, was hit with tons of debris from the north tower, and had a massive gaping hole 20 stories high. It was leaning toward the south. Anyone with a brain cell would be concerned about a collapse and get the hell outta there.
Furthermore, there were 1st responders telling people to get out of the area for hours that day. Even in the absence of explosions as immediate forewarning, they probably told people the building was going to collapse 5 minutes ago. Probably 10 minutes ago too. And 15, and 30... and 45... Eventually they warn people and then it happens.
Here, I'll predict your death. I'll keep predicting it every day until you die. Do I have a pact with the Reaper?
2) Fireman and policeman warned bystanders that WTC7 was going to collapse before it did.
The building was already collapsing before it could be seen visually. In fact, in vids you can see one corner collapsing and settling before the building, as a whole, comes crashing down. The fireman and policeman heard floors collapsing on one another and/or compressed air blowing out of windows.
In a CD there should have been a distinctive series of explosions STARTING at the bottom and proceeding up.
They probably got news that WTC7 was expected to collapse. News outlets have made bigger errors than simply converting "about to collapse" to "collapsed".
Reporters told the families' of trapped mine workers that they all suvived but one, when it was the reverse case! I hardly need to list out reporter gaffes here.
Instead I'm to believe conspiracists fed reporters a script? For what, to leave behind a little extra evidence of conspiracy???
I'll just address each point on the IQ test in order.
1) BBC knew (or at least reported) that WTC7 was going to collapse 20 minutes before it did.
It was well known the building was going to collapse hours before it did. Silverstein was "pulling" firefighters out of the area to avoid losing them. First responders said it was only a matter of time. They pointed out the leaning, there was a 20 story high hole. Raging infernos are apparent on the vid:
"CERN released info today that a neutrino traveled faster then light"
Yeah, I read it and made comments elsewhere. the important part is the quote of the day...
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"If it is true, then we truly haven't understood anything about anything."
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ALVARO DE RUJULA, a theorist at CERN, the European Center for Nuclear Research, on a report that physicists plan to report that they have detected subatomic particles moving faster than the speed of light.
Cell phone calls have been succesful on such flights before. See a pilot-confirmed testimony of a 1989 flight. Also, Shanksville was a town with a population of a couple hundred, i.e. there would be much less interferene in such an area.
4. FBI told NTSB Anna Cushman to shut up about the flight recorders, especially the one she had ALREADY transcribed, later declared ‘unrecoverable’ by the FBI at the Moussaoui Trial.
3 Pentagon folks TOLD April Gallup that she had seen a plane.
FBI told Susan McElwain that she had confused a 757 with a Piper!
4. FBI told NTSB Anna Cushman to shut up about the flight recorders, especially the one she had ALREADY transcribed, later declared ‘unrecoverable’ by the FBI at the Moussaoui Trial.
Three Pentagon brass TOLD April Gallup that she had seen a plane.
FBI told Susan McElwain that she had confused a 757 with a Piper!
Bombs are heard: listen again... youtube com/watch?v=z9CXQY-bZn4
The firemen/policemen TELL you that the building is about to come down BECAUSE it is going to be BLOWN UP! What part of BLOWN UP did you miss? What part of the explosions did you not hear? What part of Jenning’s ‘explosions’ testimony did you gloss over... youtube com/watch?v=_DuSeuxjiJQ
8. “the President of Controlled Demolition Inc...”
...is the guy who did the job! ANYTHING he says can and will be used against him in a court of law. Loizeaux should be executed for murdering 3000 people in NY. He is a mass murderer.
Any idea at what speed? Or how Hani controlled the plane? Maybe remote control? Or perhaps NORAD provided guidance since Hani contacted them by mistake. Right? The good generals probably did this to avoid injuring the pax.
11. “Betty Ong... She was probably afraid... keeping her cool”
You missed the crucial argument. The plane is NOSEDIVING at impossible speeds! Watch the vid again. This time please do it while sober... youtube com/watch?v=jRp4lULPAIc
It was a miracle that she was able to talk, let alone to do her nails while on the air phoney!
Erm... Alton? TWO passports, FA Lyles’ Florida DL, a terrorist bandana (in mint condition... good e-bay item!)... all the stuff George needed to make HIS case... but no BBs! No OBJECTIVE evidence to show that any of the commercial planes went down that day!
I mean, if you believe that 4 BB disintegrated and 2 passports survived, well...
15. In fact, Brian didn’t need to testify. We can all see it from the outside. There was no PHYSICAL reason for the ST to collapse like it did unless NORAD melted the steel frame, which would indeed be 'very, very, very hot' as testified by Melissa and produce smoke instead of fire, which is also what we see. We also see melted steel DRIPPING down the side of the building like in a foundary. I guess its all that unleaded stuff, huh?
Mark Bingham's mom was not particularly suprised that her son used his full name. It may be uncommon, but it is believable if he was trying to insert some strength of formality and level-headedness into a frightening situation. He wanted to sound strong, like he had things in control, possibly more for his own sake than his mother's. In any event, he'd introduced himself this way before on the phone, as he was a businessman who like to maintain a professional and businesslike manner.
Many people do not become frantic in dangerous situations, especially when they are experiencing it more second-hand. If she had witnessed stabbings and had an inkling that the plane was going to be slammed into a building, I would expect more panic in her voice.
We don't hear panic in the background because coach didn't know what was happening.At 8:41 Sweeney tells Woodward that the coach passengers are under the impression there is a routine medical emergency in 1st class.
Regarding Betty Ong's phone call to the Reservation Center. Only the first 4 minutes were recorded because of a time limit on the recently installed system. (Chapter 1, footnote 29).
When interpreting her tone, it's important to remember she was assigned to coach, near the back of the plane, and it is unlikely she witnessed any stabbing or other activity. Rather, she is probably reporting secondhand. She was probably afraid, but keeping her cool to best deal with the situation.
Demasi's report of finding 3 black boxes in his 2003 book is questionable. Why didn't he report this to every news outlet? Instead he puts it in a self-published book and fails to ever confirm it?
Other than this single, unconfirmed, self-published book, there's no evidence that additional black boxes were recovered.
No catastrophe obliterates absolutely everything. Some things are fortuitously insulated or placed and avoid damage, it's inevitable. The survival of a passport is unlikely, but so is the survival of 500 bones, which are certainly not as resilient as black boxes or steel:
Flight 93 also was not shot down. The Flight Data Recorder shows no signs in cabin pressure, vibrations, or other abnormalities that would be consistent with an aircraft being shot out of the sky:
Have you listened to the phone recording with Kevin Cosgrove (R.I.P)? 9-1-1 was on the phone with him until the collapse broke the connection. He was on the 105th floor. There are no audible bangs shortly before the collapse on the tape. Cosgrove, very vocal the entire time, repeatedly describing his location and the scenario, says nothing about flashes or a series of bangs, which would be consistent with a CD.
The only "squibs" we see in WTC7 occur after the collapse has already begun, which is not the way a CD happens. What we are seeing is compressed air blowing out of the windows as floors collapse upon each other. In a CD the squibs begin at the bottom of the building and proceed upward, all BEFORE the building collapses. WTC7 may look superficially like a CD, and many at Grnd 0 may have understandably have had that initial impression, but upon real scrutiny WTC7 does not compare to CD.
The Lamont-Doherty Seismic Center is not happy with conspiracists' twisting their work:
"There is no scientific basis for the conclusion that explosions brought down the towers. That representation of our work is categorically incorrect and not in context."
It is unsurprising that the tower hit second came down first. It wasn't hit dead-on, so the forces acting on it were asymmetric, causing greater strain.
The second plane to hit was traveling faster.
The second tower was hit lower, so there was greater weight bearing down on the damaged area, which again was bearing down on it more asymmetrically.
President of Controlled Demolition Inc. Says:
"It's coming down. And the second tower will fall first, because it was hit lower"
The Empire State Building incident wasn't even comparable. The bomber, in comparison to the 767, was probably 1/10 the weight and held 1/10 the fuel. It had something like 1/2 or 1/3 the wingspan and was traveling 1/3 the speed.
In 1967 the McCormick Place exhibition hall, a heavy steel-constructed building in Chicago, collapsed merely 30 minutes after the start of a small electrical fire.
Continuing the discussion of WTC7. The top corner of the building collapse well before the building as a whole collapses. How is that a controlled demolition? It fits better with a crumbling internal infrastructure. You wouldn't cause some random section to collapse if you were planning to implode the whole thing anyway.
The building also did not fall "straight" down. There was a definite southward tilt.
15. I watched the video. The old man seems confused and I don't know if the interviewer has doctored some of the photos or if the old man is hiding something.
The most powerful summation of the point seems to be the image at 8:42 which asserts that all the eyewitnesses that day describe a flight path that doesn't intersect the poles, while the NSTB flight path is significantly to the side, where the poles actually are.
11. Larry can smile all he wants. The numbers indicate he took a net loss in this arrangement, a relatively large net loss. Insuring against terrorist attacks was not out of the ordinary.
If anything, Larry underinsured the building! He should have taken out the biggest insurance policy possible if he knew it was going down in a matter of weeks. You don't take out a 50k life insurance policy on your spouse before you torch them! You take a 1, 2, 3.. million dollar policy!
9. As far as I know, drills and scenarios run before did not involve a hijacking of a commercial plane followed by ramming said plane into a public building.
14. I contest the analogy. The skinny little nerd is in a little league field, and the pitcher is a spoiled overconfident rich kid who thinks he can toss a few heaters down the middle of the strike zone and get this batter out. Lo and behold the nerd has done some practice and gets a piece of one of those juicy pitches.
The nerd's brother pulls the same stunt on the spoiled kid's brother, over at the intramural field.
13. The 767 may have been operated outside its technical specifications. You probably know that engineers report operating specs conservatively on consumer use equipment. They want commercial equipment, especially something like a big commercial plane full of passengeres, operating well within a narrow, safe range to eliminate risk. Simulators probably run on conservative specs.
The 767 could very well have fallen apart in the sky. It managed to hold up.
13. I don't have the knowledge of aircraft or piloting to know how reasonable it is to accelerate a 767 close to the sound barrier and point it at a building. I know instruments/radar have vastly enhanced pilots' abilities beyond their ordinary senses and reaction time. On the one hand Marcel finds the feat unsurprising, on the other 9/11 conspiracists argue the other way.
12. "pull it" means something specific in demolition circles which involves pulling a building's frame onto its side by attaching hooks from various machines. They could not have meant to invoke this definition as they were not remotely prepared to perform this operation. Most likely they were referring to to "pulling" the firemen and other rescue workers out of the area. "Pull it" = "Cancel rescue mission".
7) Many tapes cannot be released due to the law of evidence in releasing private property into the public domain. Many of these recordings simply are not permitted to be released under the rules and law of evidence and property. It goes pretty deep, the Constitution protects these rights specifically (5th amendment).
1. “In watching the WTC7 clip, I cannot imagine a controlled demolition”
Absolute nonsense. Theonly thing that comes to mind is a controlled demolition.
Now, if it was done in an unconventional way specifically to mislead serious researchers, that’s another matter. But there is no way you can say that what you observe in EVERY demolition – a building disintegrating on its own foot print – is different than what happened to Building 7.
4. What is weak about the stag vs simult attacks argument? You don’t need to be a professional terrorist to figure this out. You simply will not prepare an attack of this nature for over a year, train several individuals at flight schools (that could have just as well been trained in Arab countries without any paper trail – but then what would George introduce as subjective evidence, right?) and then come up with a stag plan!
5. And as to this professional vs amateur issue, it is the US Gov which stealthily portrays the camel jockeys as extremely skillful in flying a 767 for the first time in their lives, yet they don’t know how to turn the phone system off and, ‘by a very convenient error’, talk to ground control when they think they are talking to the pax. All the terrorists made this ‘mistake’. You’ve got to be a very gullible individual to accept this nonsense.
6. What is weak is your argument, Alt. YOU are suggesting that these hillbilly camel jockeys had the means to penetrate the US for over a year with ‘sleepers’, ‘terrorists’ who ‘slept’ at CIA headquarters such as Huffman Aviation, individuals such as Atta who smoked coke and did vodka and had sex with unveiled women... and now suddenly become fanatic Muslims???
7. YOUR argument is weak because you are putting words in my mouth and making them bigger than the vid shows. The argument is NOT that professional terrorists would do a much better job launching synchronized attacks. The argument is that NOBODY, even a gang of loonies suffering from Down’s, would launch staggered attacks. You don’t have to be a genius to figure out that you WILL be shot down if you do so! Y or N?
Perhaps you are referring to the incompetence of the population. Certainly, George and NORAD and the 9/11 Commission are not incompetent if they managed to pull the wool over your eyes. Whose incompetence are you referring to? They did get away with murder, so who is truly incompetent is an interesting Q.
9. “I don't think they anticipated a commercial airliner used as a missile.”
This argument has already been debunked and George and Condy already backed away from this part of the cover up. George and Condy stated on TV that they didn’t imagine that... but then researchers showed that NORAD had been practicing for that evetuality for over a year and that on 9/11 was ‘coincidentally’ simulating just such a scenario.
10. There are several documents that show that George, the FBI, etc, were already aware of the idea of hijacking commercial planes to be used as missiles. You can find them on the Internet. That’s why Larry took extra care... (Wink, wink, nudge, nudge!) That argument has now been long forgotten and swept under the rug. Condy had to back away from it in public at the 9/11 Commission hearing.
11. "Lucky" Larry... did not benefit from this arrangement”
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I wonder why he’s smiling so much? I wonder where he got the money to rebuild his buildings? I wonder why Marv Bush was the guy who controlled the cameras in Larry’s buildings and later the guy who insured the buildings? I wonder why Jeb Bush rushed to Huffman in his private plane to expropriate the records of the hijackers at 2.00 a.m. on Sept 12th?
12. But most of all, I wonder what Larry ‘really’ meant by...
“I remember getting a call from the Fire Department Commander telling that they were not sure they’re going to be able to control the fire... the smartest thing to do is ‘PULL IT’ (which in demolition language means...) aaaaahhhh... They made that decision to ‘PULL’, and we watched the building collapse.”
What a mystery... What could Larry possibly have meant by ‘pull it’... Hmmm?
13. “Hanjour, had over 600 hours… wasn't great at landing, but ramming a plane”
You’re getting ahead of my next vid (Fl 175), but I wonder how he managed to get the 767 to fly faster than the speed of sound (while FA Fangman crooned over the phone to ground control), control the aircraft (w/o it breaking apart), and pinpoint the towers from miles away. No pilot can do that! youtube com/watch?v=GEQtxTnDusk
14. But here you propose that a skinny, little nerd with glasses who steps up to the plate for the first time in his life hits a grand slam out of Yankee Stadium from the starting pitcher... and, just in case, his skinnier little brother does the same thing on the next at bat. My, my... You do have quite an imagination!
16. Of course, you are welcome to show us the films from the 86 cameras located on the roof of the Pentagon. They would certainly show us from what direction the plane arrived and how it swung around, right? I mean, how much time did the Pentagon folks have to figure out that a hijacked plane full of suicidal terrorists was headed their way... I mean... after they evacuated Mrs. Bush from the White House?
17. “Many tapes cannot be released due to the law of evidence in releasing private property into the public domain.”
Just release the 86 tapes from the Pentagon cameras. And if you want to be a pal and go the extra mile, please release the FOUR black boxes the FBI recovered at the WTC as well. Thx. Let me know why the DC National Guard failed to shoot FL77 out of the skies from the ground. Lack of radars?
Yes, the US Constitution is so marvelous when it comes to issues involving national security... I know because the prosecutors threw the book at me when I requested measly ole Rule 16 material. And all I was asking for was a transcript of my declarations to a CIA agent at the Hyatt H in BA on Oct 12, 1994. They told me that it was ‘Nat Sec’ and that I should ... fuck off!
19. I wonder where the US Constitution is when torturers like George, Rummy and Dick ‘reinterpret’ waterboarding as ‘enhanced interrogation’ and soldier as ‘combatant’. To believe that a group of thugs such as these who lose no sleep over such trivial matters are meek little lambs incapable of murdering 3000 ANONYMOUS Yanks and justify their deaths to themselves (shucks) as inevitable ‘casualties of war’ is what is truly unbelievable.
Notice all the charges going off with their associated flashes and smoke billowing from the windows, all before the building collapses. I don't see this in the WTC7 clip.
3. You argue that professional terrorists, bent on succeeding, would never stagger their attacks. On the other hand, you argue that the US military could never be thwarted by "barefoot camelback hillbillies". I think it's reasonable to think the terrorists are not all that competent and failed to coordinate their assault. Additionally, US security was outdated and failed to defend against an unforeseen threat.
7) Many tapes cannot be released due to the law of evidence in releasing private property into the public domain. Many of these recordings simply are not permitted to be released under the rules and law of evidence and property.
6) I'm unsurprised that a 100 ton object, moving at 550 mph, would have the momentum to atomize most of the plane. Especially taking into account a large reservoir of jet fuel on board.
5) I'm unconvinced that a missile struck the Pentagon. A series of light poles, not arranged in a straight line path toward the Pentagon, were torn out of the ground. Such a missile would have had to make zany zigzag maneuvers to insure it hit each light pole along the way.
I highly doubt the thin, fragile wings would create an indelible mark on the thick concrete walls of the Pentagon. And I would not be surprised that the fuel and momentum of this impact would atomize most of the plane.
4) Says Ken Hertz, a pilot rated on 757/767, "The hijackers required only the shallow understanding of the aircraft. In much the same way a person can perform CPR or set a broken bone without being an experienced physician."
4) The pilot, Hanjour, had over 600 hours of logged flight time. He had a pilot license. He wasn't great at landing, but ramming a plane into a building has nothing to do with landing.
Marcel Bernard, the flight instructor with experience with Hanjour's flying, stated that Hanjour failed because he had problems landing the plane, and that Hanjour's problems "were nothing unusual"
3) "Lucky" Larry does not convince me either. He did not benefit from this arrangement. The $4.7B he received was nothing compared to the $120M in rent he had to continue to pay every month in order to preserve the right to spend over $6B to rebuild the building. He took a net loss!
It was also normal to insure against terrorist attacks in light of more "ordinary" attempted terrorist bombings in the past. This asset was of incalculable value, Larry could not have let it go uninsured.
2) I think they were likely not that sophisticated and am not surprised at US incompetence, honestly. The US may have a large, trained military, but I don't think they anticipated a commercial airliner used as a missile.
2) I find your "staggered attack" argument weak. On the one hand you argue that serious, professional terrorists would do a much better job launching a synchronized attack. On the other hand you express incredulity that the US military was penetrated by "barefoot camelback hillbillies".
Either they are sophisticated, trained, professional terrorists with a cunning, razor-sharp, coordinated plan or they're a bunch of hlilbillies. Not both! You depict them as both as it suits you.
Now you've done it. I've opened Pandora's Box and started researching this issue.
1) In watching the WTC7 clip, I cannot imagine a controlled demolition via pre-set explosives. We see no flashes or explosions on the various floors. The clip is consistent with a weakened internal structure due to high levels of heat and collateral impact from the collapse of a nearby building. If we compare the FULL clip of WTC7 to FULL clips of controlled demolition, there are many dissimilarities.
5. If the gov't could pull off such a conspiracy, couldn't they do a better job making the building collapse in a way that would look more like a catastrophic accident? Detonate it in pieces, blow it sideways, etc.?
2. I mean, April Gallup was a survivor of the bombs the Bush team planted at the Pentagon, sued Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and George’s cousin, Judge Walker, not only dismissed her case, but held her in contempt of court for filing a frivolous lawsuit.
Willie Rodriguez also sued Bush. The Court dismissed the case claiming lack of jurisdiction.
3. The FBI recovered the black boxes at the WTC, made them disappear, and told Mike Malone and friend to shut up about it. They, didn’t. Who believes them? In fact, I think they wrote a book about it. If they did, they certainly didn’t become millionaires. Nobody cares about justice. They’ve got more important things to think about than 9/11.
4. But let’s say you saw George Bush himself plant the bombs inside WTC 7? Please tell us about it? I’m sure everyone will go out there and be desperate to buy your book!
.
Or let’s make it better. Let’s say you saw Mohammed Atta walking down the street and invited him to a talk show tomorrow morning. Would there be an investigation of 9/11? Would they retract and say that the airplane strikes and the 19 Arabs stuff was all bullshit?
5. No! They would tell the gullible idiots who believe the Gov’s version that Mohammed jumped with his parachute thru a side window at the last moment. And people who believe the idiocy that WTC 7 was brought down by fires would believe that, too!
6. The last guy to leave WTC 7, Barry Jennings, testified on camera that he heard bombs (like so many other people did that day) and stepped over bodies, later attempted to recant as the Bush death squads applied pressure on him, and was probably murdered before this potentially dangerous witness could reach the stand.
9. “Why don't we see windows shattering from shockwaves”
This is a myth spread by Loizeaux, the guy who did the WTC. Show me where the famous windows are shattered here. In Fact, the entire upper left hand region of windows collapses practically in one piece!
11. What you’ve got to answer is how does a building like WTC 7 which is NOT hit by significant debris (compare external structural damage vs 3, 4, 5+6) disintegrates on its footprint exactly like any building that is demolished (whereas those same 4 buildings didn’t)!
12. But when all else fails, you simply have to see the demolition truck in the middle of NY City while the Towers are burning to believe! (Actually, quite funny. Worth seeing!).
14. AND Larry Silverstein telling the folks on camera that the fire chief decided to ‘pull’ the building that morning,
youtube com/watch?v=7WYdAJQV100
then you really have to be quite gullible to swallow the nonsense that WTC 7 was brought down by Arabs or fires. There is no mystery as to what brought WTC 7 down!
15. “If the gov't...making the building collapse in a way that would look more like a catastrophic accident?”
What for? You seem to believe despite the overwhelming evidence that 9/11 was done by Bush and Co. And other people don’t know half as much as you or care to know. George knows his people well and factored that into his plan. The risk was minimal. And with the US legal system, actually there was no risk at all.
17. I have to believe that you probably don’t know much about what happened that day. I have a difficult time believing that a smart guy like you, after doing an unbiased research of the irregularities that day, would continue to hold that some barefooted camel jockeys from Afghanistan did the Towers.
But if you do, then I strongly recommend that you take the IQ Test, Alt (or join our discussion group). Glad to hear from you again, buddy!
No, I have not conducted my own independent investigation. My only explanation for this is a fear that I will actually become "convinced" and I'm not sure how I'd handle that as a U.S. citizen trying to lead a "regular" life. I'm in law school ffs. I worked for a year at NIST. What the hell would I do if I truly believed the gov't was engaged in conspiracy at this level?
"The great masses of people will more likely fall victim to a big lie than to a small one" - Hitler
"fear that I will actually become "convinced" and I'm not sure how I'd handle that as a U.S. citizen"
That was a very honest statement. I think that's the dilemma of many Americans, especially of those in Congress. The consequences of this realization (if on a massive scale) are incalculable.
No, I have not conducted my own independent investigation. My only explanation for this is a fear that I will actually become "convinced" and I'm not sure how I'd handle that as a U.S. citizen trying to lead a "regular" life. I'm in law school ffs. I worked for a year at NIST. What the hell would I do if I truly believed the gov't was engaged in conspiracy at this level?
"The great masses of people will more likely fall victim to a big lie than to a small one" - Hitler
You put your faith too heavily on the legal system, birth. It ain't what it's been cracked up to be. There will never be an investigation, let alone a trial. If there is a trial by some act of God, it will be hijacked by Congress, much like the Assassination Committee that 'reviewed' JFK. Total BS!
2. And even though this committee decided that there was probably a conspiracy, the Wiki, the high school textbooks, etc. all say that Oswald was the lone killer. That's what most people out there who are not familiar with the incident believe. Pretty much like the fact that most people believe in warped space, Big Bang and black holes, and that the dinos died because of an asteroid.
3. So, 9/11 is over. It is already dead and buried. It's only purpose on the 10th Ann was to prop up Obama's sagging polls. George was there beside him, both with their hands in their hearts. What a circus! The further we get away from 2001, the more people will forget... just like no one remembers what happened or who died in WWI. The 3000 who died in NY simply were casualties of war... numbers, unfortunate souls who simply were at the wrong place at the wrong time.
My entry at the Pilots for 9/11 reads: "Let's get it straight, folks: first we hang George Bush, then we try him, finally we investigate what happened."
.
That's the sequence, birth. George Bush and his team did 9/11. Any proposal other than that means the individual:
a. hasn't done a minimum of research on the subject.
2. So, we should hang George today and then ask Qs. There will be no discussion if this ground rule is not adhered to. W's guilt is NON-NEGOTIABLE. If the gallows are too barbaric for you, we can waterboard him to death.
3. After all, the US Gov maintains that waterboarding is not torture, and if it changes its mind, it should bring George, Dick and Donald to your proposed trial when it does so. That's the way the US would show that it is serious. Otherwise, these mass murderers got away with murder!
inside inside insidious iside job , lol INTEL INSIDE !!
BeavisNacho 5 days ago in playlist Relativity Blues Vol I
This is the worst song i've ever heard. Why did it have to be 9 minutes long. Why do you have to be wrong about everything?
Aegis5461 2 months ago
Bill, now that you bashed Bush (I hate him as well) and I've been a fan of you for years I have to ask you where you stand politically. Are you a libertarian? Do you support Ron Paul? Do you even live in the US or have you been repatriated to Argentinia?
Breaker242 4 months ago
1. "where you stand politically"
.
I used to be a fanatic communist... and I mean fanatic. I abandoned politics some time ago and then got back into the show with the issue of extinction. It is more an 'Economics' than a 'Politics' issue, but I think I finally got to where I had to reach. I am essentially apolitical because I think that our species is on its way out (Vids 14-18). Politics per se doesn't interest me any more, certainly not half as much as in my youth.
bgaede 4 months ago
2. My interest in 9/11 is not political, but Physics. I don't swallow the nonsense that what happened that day was done by Arabs, not because of politics, but because I don't like to eat shit. The politics of WHY the US Military had to do it doesn't affect me at all. That's an internal American problem.
bgaede 4 months ago
3. It's barely a curiosity from my perspective, no different actually than why Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld Gonzalez, et al, decided to torture people with waterboarding and then got away with convincing the masses that it was an 'enhanced interrogation technique'. These things don't affect me these days. 30 years earlier it would have created an instantaneous ulcer from the adrenaline rush alone.
bgaede 4 months ago
4. "Do you support Ron Paul?"
.
Again, I'm not into politics at all. I can vote in the four countries of which I am a citizen, but I do my best to stay away from the ballotage lines if I can help it. I'd rather use the time to enjoy a good beer and read a book. I haven't voted in years. In Argie, I am required to vote, so the last time I did I stuffed the envelope with all the candidates. It barely fit thru the slit of the box. Big Bro can force me to vote, but will not compel my allegiance.
bgaede 4 months ago
5. Paul will not prevent extinction. Neither will Romney, Perry or whoever. The global econ WILL collapse no matter what anyone does. The only Q is when.
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"have you been repatriated to Argentinia?"
.
I was sent back to Argie, then went to Colombia, where I have strong ties, and now I'm in Germany. The beer is not as good and the women are not as attractive as in Brazil or Argie, but it's a livin'!
bgaede 4 months ago
@bgaede
You are in Germany? Sprichst du deutsch? :3
Breaker242 4 months ago
I agree that there will be an economic collapse no matter what. But with a free market approach we might turn it to the better. If we keep our socialist policies with massive redistribution of wealth, barriers to entry and phony money that isn't backed by anything it will be truly horrific.
And as I already said, I don't agree with your expectation that humanity will go completely extinct. I am sure there will be alot of people that will starve to death or die during the riots that will go on
Breaker242 4 months ago
@Breaker242
But why should they ALL die? Humans are animals, but they are adapt to a vast variety of environments and situations. I'm sure there will be enough humans for mankind or even civilisation to survive.
Breaker242 4 months ago
1. "I don't agree with your expectation that humanity will go completely extinct"
.
I know. The great majority of people don't agree. I guess I have special eyes or something.
bgaede 4 months ago
2. "why should they ALL die? ...there will be enough humans for mankind or even civilisation to survive"
.
There will be an exponential decline of the population once the economy breaks. The causes will be:
a. starvation
b. cannibalism
c. good old fashioned killing (either for robbing, settling old scores, outright meanness, pleasure, or to engage in cannibalism)
bgaede 4 months ago
3. There is little time to plant seeds and grow crops when you are being hunted, and you will be bait only in the best of cases if you managed to store food for a lengthy period of time. Since no one agrees with what i'm saying, very few are taking precautions NOW. It will be too late to run to the supermarket to stock up at the last moment. You'll be elbowing everybody in town.
bgaede 4 months ago
4. They, you have to have seeds and other resources to do post-collapse subsistence farming if you survive the killing/cannibalism phase. There will be no hunting because it is unrealistic to expect any small to large mammal, bird, fish or reptile to survive the hunger of 7B monkeys armed with technology.
bgaede 4 months ago
5. But assuming you managed to get thru all that, you will have an enormous psychological problem. You are suddenly in a new planet, an alien, an extraterrestrial in his own land. So how many people are you? Is it just your wife? Does your group include your sons and daughters? Are your neighbors or friends and their children included? Are you 5, 10, 50, 100?
bgaede 4 months ago
6. These things have to be planned. You don't improvise them on the last day. The bigger the group, the more resources you need to store and the more likely it will be for bands to find you and/or your cache of food.
bgaede 4 months ago
7. Assuming you survive all that, there won't be a human for hundreds of miles around and you surely won't go looking for trouble. The worst enemy of a human in the wild is another human -- certainly not a rabbit. Will the children find mates? Will they mate if they find a mate? Will they have 20 children again like the grandmas of old? City girls??? Who don't want to have a kid despite medicines, docs and hospitals? They'll have a kid in the bushes w/o docs?
bgaede 4 months ago
8. And finally you have racial senility. Our species is at a dead end genetically speaking. We've interbred too much now and conquered diseases.
.
But now, there are ten humans left to restart the race. Yet one study shows that it takes 10,000 for MVP!
bgaede 4 months ago
9. So, no! There will NOT be reproduction assuming a family survives because it took the extreme trouble to prepare in advance. People like you are betting that the collapse won't happen, that it's business as usual, that this is a cycle. That's why you aren't preparing for anything. If you truly realized that the collapse WILL happen, no matter what, then you would react differently.
bgaede 4 months ago
10. "Humans are animals, but they are adapt to a vast variety of environments and situations"
.
Tell that to the dinosaurs, Break. Some have told me that the dinos converted into birds to avoid extinction...
bgaede 4 months ago
@bgaede
The dinosaurs were for the most part giant beings that needed a lot of food to sustain themselves. They weren't nearly as multifaceted as humans.
Breaker242 4 months ago
"The dinosaurs were for the most part giant beings that needed a lot of food to sustain themselves."
.
Irrelevant! It's not a Q of whether Man needs so many calories per day. It's a yes or no type of Q. If you don't feed a man for a year, he will invariably die way before New Dear's Day. This is NOT a prediction! I add this comment from now on because people have yet to figure out what a prediction is.
bgaede 4 months ago
@bgaede
Let's discuss that one on your video #14. I've posted there why humans won't go extinct just because of the agriculture/manufacturing/service-ratio.
Breaker242 4 months ago
@bgaede
I've posted a large series of comments on one of your videos where I explain in detail why your extinction-theory is pretty bad when analyzed from an austrian-economic's standpoint
Breaker242 4 months ago
May bush cheney rumsfeld, rice, asscraft and the rest of the subhuman filth running this hell hole racket burn in hell for all eternity.
77GSlinger 5 months ago 8
@77GSlinger you are such a shameless fanboy you queer, why dont you just bend over and take it from gayde over here?
Xero555000 4 months ago
@77GSlinger oh and it was cute getting me banned on that channel, seens that faggot does that to anyone who doesnt subscribe to his ideas or calls him out on all his bullshit
Xero555000 4 months ago
@Xero555000 You have some serious mental problems and a blatant hatred for Gays, which is actually against youtube policy, so you may be banned from youtube permanently even for this one foul comment. Its your problem not mine and you have nothing to contribute of any value in any discussion, just your self hate and personal ugliness! Sorry to hear your life sucks so bad. I wish you the best and that you can get yourself the psychological help you so desperately need. Many Blessings to you!
77GSlinger 4 months ago
@77GSlinger only faggots think people who call them a faggot are calling them out for being gay, look up lewis CK, he'll explain it to you because you're a fucking idiot
Xero555000 4 months ago
@Xero555000 that is two violations against the conduct code on youtube against Gays and you look real ugly with your mindless drivel and insults. Poor sad sack and scrub of a loser what a pathetic dark soul you are. Now go hang yourself and do the world a big favor!
77GSlinger 4 months ago
@77GSlinger if you believe in anything bill gaede says, then you are immediately stupid
Xero555000 4 months ago
@77GSlinger umm... have you stepped outside or turned on a TV since the last election?
Aegis5461 2 months ago
@Aegis5461 I don't watch the idiot box Mr. aegis troll with a fake shill channel where you hide and attack people who are infinitely smarter than you! Bill has destroyed your mind controlled world, now crawl back under your rock you creepy thang! You are not witty you are an idiot! Nothing has changed since last election fool! TPTB are still TPTB!
77GSlinger 2 months ago
Betty Ong
Only the first few minutes of the call were recorded. There were almost 20 additional minutes after the recording we don't hear. Was the plane really nosediving at impossible speed a full 20 minutes before Betty was even disconnected?
altonhare 5 months ago
American Airlines 757's do, indeed, have seat-back phones. So we needn't believe the calls were improbably made from a cell phone:
airliners net/photo/0020665/L
news cnet com/2100-1033-831093
altonhare 5 months ago
10) Ted Olson's false claim.
Again, this would have been an idiotic "shoot yourself in the foot" type thing to plan out and build into a conspiracy. Whether Ted lied to add some drama or draw some sympathy or what, or Barbara managed to make an improbable (but possible) call on her cell phone, conspirators wouldn't have created such a dumb lie that served so little purpose.
altonhare 5 months ago
9) It sucks ass that these guys got promoted even when they failed to prevent this atrocity. I think think the US gov't IS dysfunctional. I WISH they were capable of grand united efforts that could unite and galvanize the nation. I am not pro war or pro conspiracy, though. And anyway, there's no way they could pull off a conspiracy, there isn't enough unity, there isn't enough competence.
altonhare 5 months ago
It would have been a spectacle, a real theatrical event with F-15 fighter jets shooting down empty planes the Arabs thought would be full. SEALs would swim, in full gear, and board vessels "taken" by Al Queda operatives. Snipers would be picking off evildoers. The whole country would be an orgy of nationalistic pride and fury!
Not a discombobulated mess of fear, hopelessness, conspiracy, and skepticism.
altonhare 5 months ago
9) Gov't failure to prevent, promotions.
I would have tricked some Al Queda operatives into thinking mid/high level soldiers had flipped to their side. They would have leaked a "hole" in our defenses. Al Queda "penetrates" our defenses, maybe takes out an empty cruise liner sitting in harbor or a FedEx plane full of people's mail. Then big bad US special ops swoop in and save the day! Go us! Let's get those Muslim towel-heads! Bomb bomb bomb Iran! I mean Iraq! Whatever, which has oil again?
altonhare 5 months ago
9) Gov't failure, nevertheless promotions.
Have I mentioned that our government is ludicrously dysfunctional and politicians are corrupt?
Corrupt, yes. Ready to order the murder of hundreds and the effective murder of thousands, all just for an excuse to invade Iraq??? To cause untold carnage and destruction, then plant/create damning evidence like "reporter scripts" and improbable docs?
I could think of a better conspiracy over breakfast, and handle it better while drunk!
altonhare 5 months ago
8) No bodies.
Obliterated. However, after a great deal of cleanup and searching, many tiny fragments were eventually found.
550 mph, 100 tons, including some of the most energy-dense and combustible fuel available. I just don't find it very unbelievable.
altonhare 5 months ago
7) DL and bandana.
Who gives a shit about a bandana? It's consistent with one of the passenger's stories, but ffs it's trifling compared to the other allegedly fabricated evidence. The DL and bandana make no sense at all. May as well show a vid of your wife with another man and then say hey, I recovered a used condom from the scene, and it's the same brand you and your wife use! Except the DL/band are even worse, they weigh more against the perps b/c they're so improbable.
altonhare 5 months ago
7) Driver's license.
While it does strain one's belief that this could survive, I can't imagine what the conspirators have to gain by planting a simple DL. There are countless calls from UA93 with screaming in the background and other havoc. The cockpit recorder has the terrorists speaking in Arabic and talking about a bomb. If anything, planting this DL hurts their case. Same with the bandana. Planting these objects is shooting themselves in the foot!
altonhare 5 months ago
7) No debris/bodies at UA 93.
In the vid onlookers report observations from indeterminate vantage points and distances in the immediate aftermath. I find it very unconvincing that a few people testified using similes, metaphors, and analogies. It didn't look like a plane crashed, blah blah.
transcripts cnn com/TRANSCRIPTS/0109/13/bn 01
popularmechanics com/technology/military/news/1227842?page=8
A 100 ton craft going 550 mph. Shit was obliterated & scattered for miles. Shit was found.
altonhare 5 months ago
6) The size of the hole in the pentagon.
In many pictures of the crash site the 1st floor is obscured by water vapor, smoke, and debris. This hole is about 90 feet across. I've said before, also, that I wouldn't be suprised if part(s) of the fragile wings didn't quite penetrate the steel reinforced concrete wall. Check:
oilempire us/pentagon-hole
altonhare 5 months ago
5) The passport.
Impossible that it flew out of his pocket on the way down?
I admit this point is a little suspicious and convenient. Perhaps the passport was planted just to implicate someone believable so the American people could point their rage somewhere specific. If none were positively identified, there would have been a lot of emotion with no direction, extremely dangerous.
A believable smaller conspiracy, or it fortuitously flew out a broken window before impact.
altonhare 5 months ago
5) The passport.
Impossible that it flew out of his pocket on the way down?
I admit this point is a little suspicious and convenient. Perhaps the passport was planted just to implicate someone believable so the American people could point their rage somewhere specific. If none were positively identified, there would have been a lot of emotion with no direction, extremely dangerous.
A believable smaller conspiracy, or it fortuitously flew out a broken window before impact.
altonhare 5 months ago
4) Silverstein said the fire chief said to "pull" the building.
Well, fire chiefs are not CD, and so we should be hesitant to assign meanings to their words that come from CD-parlance. Especially when those meanings don't even make sense.
Pull means with cables. It's also CD jargon, and this was a firefighter speaking.
More believable: Fire chief was "pulling" the rescue operation around WTC7 because he didn't want to lose the rescue workers.
altonhare 5 months ago
3) The whole FEMA presence thing and moving to the pier.
Circumstantial evidence. On an otherwise rock-solid case, you might toss this on for good measure, but you can't make a case out of this.
Believing the conspiracists fed reporters a script ahead of time to no purpose other than leaving behind extra evidence, that strains credulity.
altonhare 5 months ago
3) Jerry Hauer... warned the Mayor.
There are no problems with forewarning. The building had internal fires, was hit with tons of debris from the north tower, and had a massive gaping hole 20 stories high. It was leaning toward the south. Anyone with a brain cell would be concerned about a collapse and get the hell outta there.
altonhare 5 months ago
2) Fireman and policeman prewarning.
Furthermore, there were 1st responders telling people to get out of the area for hours that day. Even in the absence of explosions as immediate forewarning, they probably told people the building was going to collapse 5 minutes ago. Probably 10 minutes ago too. And 15, and 30... and 45... Eventually they warn people and then it happens.
Here, I'll predict your death. I'll keep predicting it every day until you die. Do I have a pact with the Reaper?
altonhare 5 months ago
2) Fireman and policeman warned bystanders that WTC7 was going to collapse before it did.
The building was already collapsing before it could be seen visually. In fact, in vids you can see one corner collapsing and settling before the building, as a whole, comes crashing down. The fireman and policeman heard floors collapsing on one another and/or compressed air blowing out of windows.
In a CD there should have been a distinctive series of explosions STARTING at the bottom and proceeding up.
altonhare 5 months ago
1) BBC's premature reporting of WTC7 collapse.
They probably got news that WTC7 was expected to collapse. News outlets have made bigger errors than simply converting "about to collapse" to "collapsed".
Reporters told the families' of trapped mine workers that they all suvived but one, when it was the reverse case! I hardly need to list out reporter gaffes here.
Instead I'm to believe conspiracists fed reporters a script? For what, to leave behind a little extra evidence of conspiracy???
altonhare 5 months ago
Bill,
I'll just address each point on the IQ test in order.
1) BBC knew (or at least reported) that WTC7 was going to collapse 20 minutes before it did.
It was well known the building was going to collapse hours before it did. Silverstein was "pulling" firefighters out of the area to avoid losing them. First responders said it was only a matter of time. They pointed out the leaning, there was a 20 story high hole. Raging infernos are apparent on the vid:
youtube com/watch?v=Afb7eUHr64U
altonhare 5 months ago
"CERN released info today that a neutrino traveled faster then light"
Yeah, I read it and made comments elsewhere. the important part is the quote of the day...
.
"If it is true, then we truly haven't understood anything about anything."
.
ALVARO DE RUJULA, a theorist at CERN, the European Center for Nuclear Research, on a report that physicists plan to report that they have detected subatomic particles moving faster than the speed of light.
bgaede 5 months ago
Voice of an angel Bgaede, if that dunt charm the truth outa the Washington establishment i dont know what will.
stiffex 5 months ago
16. And the firemen testified that they saw the same... youtube com/watch?v=3SLIzSCt_cg
So I don’t know what your problem is, Alt. Quite a surprise! Really!
I can only recommend that you take the IQ Test again... youtube com/watch?v=sycO5b4jwcY
You said it correct earlier. The real fear is that you might actually believe what actually happened that day.
bgaede 5 months ago
Cell phone calls have been succesful on such flights before. See a pilot-confirmed testimony of a 1989 flight. Also, Shanksville was a town with a population of a couple hundred, i.e. there would be much less interferene in such an area.
tinyurl com/8jb5g
altonhare 5 months ago
1. Alton, I am completely without words. I’ll address a couple of your arguments...
“Flight 93... Large amounts of wreckage and personal effects were recovered”
No parts (@ 5:14 – 7:07) No bodies (@ 7:10 - 7:47) youtube com/watch?v=sycO5b4jwcY
End of story! What they recovered 'years' later is of no consequence!
bgaede 5 months ago
1. Alton, I am completely without words. I’ll address a couple of your arguments...
“Flight 93... Large amounts of wreckage and personal effects were recovered”
No parts (5:14 – 7:07) No bodies (7:10 - 7:47) youtube com/watch?v=sycO5b4jwcY
End of story! What they recovered 'years' later is of no consequence!
bgaede 5 months ago
2. “Investigations of the rubble and scrap leftover were not blocked”
(1:30 – 2:23) youtube com/watch?v=2Mj6POZ-XxY
NIST’s John Gross denied molten metal: youtube com/watch?v=3SLIzSCt_cg
They shipped all the molten metal abroad as quickly as they could to prevent an investigation.
In fact, there was NEVER an investigation of 9/11! There was only a FOREGONE conclusion!
bgaede 5 months ago
3. FBI told Mike Malone, et al., to shut up about recovered black boxes.
Anonymous people told Barry Jenning to shut up about WTC7 or he’d be fired.
Anonymous people told cab driver Lloyde England to stand on the bridge at the Pent and give false testimony.
bgaede 5 months ago
4. FBI told NTSB Anna Cushman to shut up about the flight recorders, especially the one she had ALREADY transcribed, later declared ‘unrecoverable’ by the FBI at the Moussaoui Trial.
3 Pentagon folks TOLD April Gallup that she had seen a plane.
FBI told Susan McElwain that she had confused a 757 with a Piper!
bgaede 5 months ago
4. FBI told NTSB Anna Cushman to shut up about the flight recorders, especially the one she had ALREADY transcribed, later declared ‘unrecoverable’ by the FBI at the Moussaoui Trial.
Three Pentagon brass TOLD April Gallup that she had seen a plane.
FBI told Susan McElwain that she had confused a 757 with a Piper!
bgaede 5 months ago
5. “The Landmark Tower... took 4 months to set up for demolition”
So? What's your argument?
“no explosive-sniffing dogs or anyone had an inkling?”
On an inside job??? When security was handled by Kroll and electronic surveilance by Marv Bush??? Are you for real?
bgaede 5 months ago
6. WTC7...
Bombs are heard: listen again... youtube com/watch?v=z9CXQY-bZn4
The firemen/policemen TELL you that the building is about to come down BECAUSE it is going to be BLOWN UP! What part of BLOWN UP did you miss? What part of the explosions did you not hear? What part of Jenning’s ‘explosions’ testimony did you gloss over... youtube com/watch?v=_DuSeuxjiJQ
bgaede 5 months ago
7. What part of Larry’s claim that the fire chief decided to PULL IT (the building) that same day did you not understand?
youtube com/watch?v=7WYdAJQV100
Of course, if it takes more than 4 months to ‘PULL’ WTC7, then Larry has a lot to tell us during the waterboarding session.
bgaede 5 months ago
8. “the President of Controlled Demolition Inc...”
...is the guy who did the job! ANYTHING he says can and will be used against him in a court of law. Loizeaux should be executed for murdering 3000 people in NY. He is a mass murderer.
bgaede 5 months ago
9. “The second plane to hit was traveling faster”
Any idea at what speed? Or how Hani controlled the plane? Maybe remote control? Or perhaps NORAD provided guidance since Hani contacted them by mistake. Right? The good generals probably did this to avoid injuring the pax.
bgaede 5 months ago
10. “Mark Bingham...used his full name”
And it only gets worse. It’s coming in Vid FL175, but you get the scoop here, okay? You gotta give me the credit.
Hanson calls his father and just before the crash says: “Oh my God, Oh my God, Oh my God” just before the plane hits the ST.
The sergeant who impersonated Hanson didn’t realize that he was sitting at 30E!
Homework: look it up!
bgaede 5 months ago
11. “Betty Ong... She was probably afraid... keeping her cool”
You missed the crucial argument. The plane is NOSEDIVING at impossible speeds! Watch the vid again. This time please do it while sober... youtube com/watch?v=jRp4lULPAIc
It was a miracle that she was able to talk, let alone to do her nails while on the air phoney!
bgaede 5 months ago
12. “Demasi's report of finding 3 black boxes”
I am entirely perplexed. Are you really Alton Hare or another NORAD impersonator? This isn’t the Alton I know. This sounds more like Alt on drugs.
I don’t give a shit about Demasi or Malone’s TESTIMONY!!! IRRELEVANT!
Where the fuck are the 4 BBs????? Until the US Gov comes up with the BBs, 9/11 was done by George, okay? Is that a deal?
bgaede 5 months ago
13. “The survival of a passport is unlikely”
Erm... Alton? TWO passports, FA Lyles’ Florida DL, a terrorist bandana (in mint condition... good e-bay item!)... all the stuff George needed to make HIS case... but no BBs! No OBJECTIVE evidence to show that any of the commercial planes went down that day!
I mean, if you believe that 4 BB disintegrated and 2 passports survived, well...
bgaede 5 months ago
14. “Have you listened to the phone recording with Kevin Cosgrove”
Actually, I enjoyed Melissa Doi’s call a lot more, especially where she says that “it’s very, very, very hot”... and there’s no fire. Just smoke!
And then Brian Clark, who comes down below the strike zone and survives, testifies that EVERYWHERE below the strike zone the building was normal.
bgaede 5 months ago
15. In fact, Brian didn’t need to testify. We can all see it from the outside. There was no PHYSICAL reason for the ST to collapse like it did unless NORAD melted the steel frame, which would indeed be 'very, very, very hot' as testified by Melissa and produce smoke instead of fire, which is also what we see. We also see melted steel DRIPPING down the side of the building like in a foundary. I guess its all that unleaded stuff, huh?
bgaede 5 months ago
Mark Bingham's mom was not particularly suprised that her son used his full name. It may be uncommon, but it is believable if he was trying to insert some strength of formality and level-headedness into a frightening situation. He wanted to sound strong, like he had things in control, possibly more for his own sake than his mother's. In any event, he'd introduced himself this way before on the phone, as he was a businessman who like to maintain a professional and businesslike manner.
altonhare 5 months ago
Many people do not become frantic in dangerous situations, especially when they are experiencing it more second-hand. If she had witnessed stabbings and had an inkling that the plane was going to be slammed into a building, I would expect more panic in her voice.
We don't hear panic in the background because coach didn't know what was happening.At 8:41 Sweeney tells Woodward that the coach passengers are under the impression there is a routine medical emergency in 1st class.
tinyurl com/s7kkx
altonhare 5 months ago
Regarding Betty Ong's phone call to the Reservation Center. Only the first 4 minutes were recorded because of a time limit on the recently installed system. (Chapter 1, footnote 29).
When interpreting her tone, it's important to remember she was assigned to coach, near the back of the plane, and it is unlikely she witnessed any stabbing or other activity. Rather, she is probably reporting secondhand. She was probably afraid, but keeping her cool to best deal with the situation.
altonhare 5 months ago
Demasi's report of finding 3 black boxes in his 2003 book is questionable. Why didn't he report this to every news outlet? Instead he puts it in a self-published book and fails to ever confirm it?
Other than this single, unconfirmed, self-published book, there's no evidence that additional black boxes were recovered.
altonhare 5 months ago
No catastrophe obliterates absolutely everything. Some things are fortuitously insulated or placed and avoid damage, it's inevitable. The survival of a passport is unlikely, but so is the survival of 500 bones, which are certainly not as resilient as black boxes or steel:
tinyurl com/pqsm6
tinyurl com/mk37n
altonhare 5 months ago
Flight 93 also was not shot down. The Flight Data Recorder shows no signs in cabin pressure, vibrations, or other abnormalities that would be consistent with an aircraft being shot out of the sky:
tinyurl com/rfbz4
altonhare 5 months ago
There are other examples of airplanes nearly disintegrating on impact:
tinyurl com/n88nd
tinyurl com/rzgom
tinyurl com/my4oo
altonhare 5 months ago
About 1,500 samples of human tissue, weighing around 600 pounds, were recovered from the site:
tinyurl com/4hpaq
altonhare 5 months ago
Flight 93 did crash in Shanksville. Large amounts of wreckage and personal effects were recovered.
tinyurl com/q84jz
altonhare 5 months ago
Have you listened to the phone recording with Kevin Cosgrove (R.I.P)? 9-1-1 was on the phone with him until the collapse broke the connection. He was on the 105th floor. There are no audible bangs shortly before the collapse on the tape. Cosgrove, very vocal the entire time, repeatedly describing his location and the scenario, says nothing about flashes or a series of bangs, which would be consistent with a CD.
altonhare 5 months ago
Investigations of the rubble and scrap leftover were not blocked:
tinyurl com/lo39z
altonhare 5 months ago
The Landmark Tower, only 30 stories, took 4 months to set up for demolition. The two towers were EACH around 110 stories.
tinyurl com/oezsn
And no explosive-sniffing dogs or anyone had an inkling?
altonhare 5 months ago
The only "squibs" we see in WTC7 occur after the collapse has already begun, which is not the way a CD happens. What we are seeing is compressed air blowing out of the windows as floors collapse upon each other. In a CD the squibs begin at the bottom of the building and proceed upward, all BEFORE the building collapses. WTC7 may look superficially like a CD, and many at Grnd 0 may have understandably have had that initial impression, but upon real scrutiny WTC7 does not compare to CD.
altonhare 5 months ago
The Lamont-Doherty Seismic Center is not happy with conspiracists' twisting their work:
"There is no scientific basis for the conclusion that explosions brought down the towers. That representation of our work is categorically incorrect and not in context."
- Arthur Lerner-Lam
altonhare 5 months ago
It is unsurprising that the tower hit second came down first. It wasn't hit dead-on, so the forces acting on it were asymmetric, causing greater strain.
The second plane to hit was traveling faster.
The second tower was hit lower, so there was greater weight bearing down on the damaged area, which again was bearing down on it more asymmetrically.
President of Controlled Demolition Inc. Says:
"It's coming down. And the second tower will fall first, because it was hit lower"
tinyurl com/9x5e9
altonhare 5 months ago
The Empire State Building incident wasn't even comparable. The bomber, in comparison to the 767, was probably 1/10 the weight and held 1/10 the fuel. It had something like 1/2 or 1/3 the wingspan and was traveling 1/3 the speed.
altonhare 5 months ago
1967 McCormick collapse vs. 9/11:
tinyurl com/ nmjdu
altonhare 5 months ago
In 1967 the McCormick Place exhibition hall, a heavy steel-constructed building in Chicago, collapsed merely 30 minutes after the start of a small electrical fire.
altonhare 5 months ago
Continuing the discussion of WTC7. The top corner of the building collapse well before the building as a whole collapses. How is that a controlled demolition? It fits better with a crumbling internal infrastructure. You wouldn't cause some random section to collapse if you were planning to implode the whole thing anyway.
The building also did not fall "straight" down. There was a definite southward tilt.
altonhare 5 months ago
15. I watched the video. The old man seems confused and I don't know if the interviewer has doctored some of the photos or if the old man is hiding something.
The most powerful summation of the point seems to be the image at 8:42 which asserts that all the eyewitnesses that day describe a flight path that doesn't intersect the poles, while the NSTB flight path is significantly to the side, where the poles actually are.
Do I understand correctly?
altonhare 5 months ago
11. Larry can smile all he wants. The numbers indicate he took a net loss in this arrangement, a relatively large net loss. Insuring against terrorist attacks was not out of the ordinary.
If anything, Larry underinsured the building! He should have taken out the biggest insurance policy possible if he knew it was going down in a matter of weeks. You don't take out a 50k life insurance policy on your spouse before you torch them! You take a 1, 2, 3.. million dollar policy!
altonhare 5 months ago
9. As far as I know, drills and scenarios run before did not involve a hijacking of a commercial plane followed by ramming said plane into a public building.
altonhare 5 months ago
14. I contest the analogy. The skinny little nerd is in a little league field, and the pitcher is a spoiled overconfident rich kid who thinks he can toss a few heaters down the middle of the strike zone and get this batter out. Lo and behold the nerd has done some practice and gets a piece of one of those juicy pitches.
The nerd's brother pulls the same stunt on the spoiled kid's brother, over at the intramural field.
altonhare 5 months ago
13. The 767 may have been operated outside its technical specifications. You probably know that engineers report operating specs conservatively on consumer use equipment. They want commercial equipment, especially something like a big commercial plane full of passengeres, operating well within a narrow, safe range to eliminate risk. Simulators probably run on conservative specs.
The 767 could very well have fallen apart in the sky. It managed to hold up.
altonhare 5 months ago
13. I don't have the knowledge of aircraft or piloting to know how reasonable it is to accelerate a 767 close to the sound barrier and point it at a building. I know instruments/radar have vastly enhanced pilots' abilities beyond their ordinary senses and reaction time. On the one hand Marcel finds the feat unsurprising, on the other 9/11 conspiracists argue the other way.
altonhare 5 months ago
12. "pull it" means something specific in demolition circles which involves pulling a building's frame onto its side by attaching hooks from various machines. They could not have meant to invoke this definition as they were not remotely prepared to perform this operation. Most likely they were referring to to "pulling" the firemen and other rescue workers out of the area. "Pull it" = "Cancel rescue mission".
altonhare 5 months ago
7) Many tapes cannot be released due to the law of evidence in releasing private property into the public domain. Many of these recordings simply are not permitted to be released under the rules and law of evidence and property. It goes pretty deep, the Constitution protects these rights specifically (5th amendment).
altonhare 5 months ago
1. “In watching the WTC7 clip, I cannot imagine a controlled demolition”
Absolute nonsense. Theonly thing that comes to mind is a controlled demolition.
Now, if it was done in an unconventional way specifically to mislead serious researchers, that’s another matter. But there is no way you can say that what you observe in EVERY demolition – a building disintegrating on its own foot print – is different than what happened to Building 7.
bgaede 5 months ago
2. “If we compare the FULL clip of WTC7 to FULL clips of controlled demolition, there are many dissimilarities.”
.
For instance...?
bgaede 5 months ago
3. “I find your "staggered attack" argument weak.”
You didn’t explain why. You just mentioned something irrelevant about whether these terrorists were professionals or amateurs.
bgaede 5 months ago
4. What is weak about the stag vs simult attacks argument? You don’t need to be a professional terrorist to figure this out. You simply will not prepare an attack of this nature for over a year, train several individuals at flight schools (that could have just as well been trained in Arab countries without any paper trail – but then what would George introduce as subjective evidence, right?) and then come up with a stag plan!
bgaede 5 months ago
5. And as to this professional vs amateur issue, it is the US Gov which stealthily portrays the camel jockeys as extremely skillful in flying a 767 for the first time in their lives, yet they don’t know how to turn the phone system off and, ‘by a very convenient error’, talk to ground control when they think they are talking to the pax. All the terrorists made this ‘mistake’. You’ve got to be a very gullible individual to accept this nonsense.
bgaede 5 months ago
6. What is weak is your argument, Alt. YOU are suggesting that these hillbilly camel jockeys had the means to penetrate the US for over a year with ‘sleepers’, ‘terrorists’ who ‘slept’ at CIA headquarters such as Huffman Aviation, individuals such as Atta who smoked coke and did vodka and had sex with unveiled women... and now suddenly become fanatic Muslims???
bgaede 5 months ago
7. YOUR argument is weak because you are putting words in my mouth and making them bigger than the vid shows. The argument is NOT that professional terrorists would do a much better job launching synchronized attacks. The argument is that NOBODY, even a gang of loonies suffering from Down’s, would launch staggered attacks. You don’t have to be a genius to figure out that you WILL be shot down if you do so! Y or N?
bgaede 5 months ago
8. “I... am not surprised at US incompetence“
Perhaps you are referring to the incompetence of the population. Certainly, George and NORAD and the 9/11 Commission are not incompetent if they managed to pull the wool over your eyes. Whose incompetence are you referring to? They did get away with murder, so who is truly incompetent is an interesting Q.
bgaede 5 months ago
9. “I don't think they anticipated a commercial airliner used as a missile.”
This argument has already been debunked and George and Condy already backed away from this part of the cover up. George and Condy stated on TV that they didn’t imagine that... but then researchers showed that NORAD had been practicing for that evetuality for over a year and that on 9/11 was ‘coincidentally’ simulating just such a scenario.
bgaede 5 months ago
10. There are several documents that show that George, the FBI, etc, were already aware of the idea of hijacking commercial planes to be used as missiles. You can find them on the Internet. That’s why Larry took extra care... (Wink, wink, nudge, nudge!) That argument has now been long forgotten and swept under the rug. Condy had to back away from it in public at the 9/11 Commission hearing.
bgaede 5 months ago
11. "Lucky" Larry... did not benefit from this arrangement”
.
I wonder why he’s smiling so much? I wonder where he got the money to rebuild his buildings? I wonder why Marv Bush was the guy who controlled the cameras in Larry’s buildings and later the guy who insured the buildings? I wonder why Jeb Bush rushed to Huffman in his private plane to expropriate the records of the hijackers at 2.00 a.m. on Sept 12th?
bgaede 5 months ago
12. But most of all, I wonder what Larry ‘really’ meant by...
“I remember getting a call from the Fire Department Commander telling that they were not sure they’re going to be able to control the fire... the smartest thing to do is ‘PULL IT’ (which in demolition language means...) aaaaahhhh... They made that decision to ‘PULL’, and we watched the building collapse.”
What a mystery... What could Larry possibly have meant by ‘pull it’... Hmmm?
bgaede 5 months ago
13. “Hanjour, had over 600 hours… wasn't great at landing, but ramming a plane”
You’re getting ahead of my next vid (Fl 175), but I wonder how he managed to get the 767 to fly faster than the speed of sound (while FA Fangman crooned over the phone to ground control), control the aircraft (w/o it breaking apart), and pinpoint the towers from miles away. No pilot can do that! youtube com/watch?v=GEQtxTnDusk
bgaede 5 months ago
14. But here you propose that a skinny, little nerd with glasses who steps up to the plate for the first time in his life hits a grand slam out of Yankee Stadium from the starting pitcher... and, just in case, his skinnier little brother does the same thing on the next at bat. My, my... You do have quite an imagination!
bgaede 5 months ago
15. “A series of light poles, not arranged in a straight line path toward the Pentagon, were torn out of the ground...”
... later by the US Gov.
.
Unfortunately, the plane didn’t come thru that route, Alt...
youtube com/watch?v=3GHM5f9lVho
bgaede 5 months ago
16. Of course, you are welcome to show us the films from the 86 cameras located on the roof of the Pentagon. They would certainly show us from what direction the plane arrived and how it swung around, right? I mean, how much time did the Pentagon folks have to figure out that a hijacked plane full of suicidal terrorists was headed their way... I mean... after they evacuated Mrs. Bush from the White House?
bgaede 5 months ago
17. “Many tapes cannot be released due to the law of evidence in releasing private property into the public domain.”
Just release the 86 tapes from the Pentagon cameras. And if you want to be a pal and go the extra mile, please release the FOUR black boxes the FBI recovered at the WTC as well. Thx. Let me know why the DC National Guard failed to shoot FL77 out of the skies from the ground. Lack of radars?
bgaede 5 months ago
18. “the Constitution protects these rights...”
...of terrorists and hijackers.
Yes, the US Constitution is so marvelous when it comes to issues involving national security... I know because the prosecutors threw the book at me when I requested measly ole Rule 16 material. And all I was asking for was a transcript of my declarations to a CIA agent at the Hyatt H in BA on Oct 12, 1994. They told me that it was ‘Nat Sec’ and that I should ... fuck off!
bgaede 5 months ago
19. I wonder where the US Constitution is when torturers like George, Rummy and Dick ‘reinterpret’ waterboarding as ‘enhanced interrogation’ and soldier as ‘combatant’. To believe that a group of thugs such as these who lose no sleep over such trivial matters are meek little lambs incapable of murdering 3000 ANONYMOUS Yanks and justify their deaths to themselves (shucks) as inevitable ‘casualties of war’ is what is truly unbelievable.
bgaede 5 months ago
@bgaede
1+2:
youtube com/ watch?v=oiftDBtCFt8
youtube com/ watch?v=SaBQ3AkRetI
Notice all the charges going off with their associated flashes and smoke billowing from the windows, all before the building collapses. I don't see this in the WTC7 clip.
altonhare 5 months ago
@bgaede
3. You argue that professional terrorists, bent on succeeding, would never stagger their attacks. On the other hand, you argue that the US military could never be thwarted by "barefoot camelback hillbillies". I think it's reasonable to think the terrorists are not all that competent and failed to coordinate their assault. Additionally, US security was outdated and failed to defend against an unforeseen threat.
altonhare 5 months ago
7) Many tapes cannot be released due to the law of evidence in releasing private property into the public domain. Many of these recordings simply are not permitted to be released under the rules and law of evidence and property.
altonhare 5 months ago
6) I'm unsurprised that a 100 ton object, moving at 550 mph, would have the momentum to atomize most of the plane. Especially taking into account a large reservoir of jet fuel on board.
altonhare 5 months ago
5) I'm unconvinced that a missile struck the Pentagon. A series of light poles, not arranged in a straight line path toward the Pentagon, were torn out of the ground. Such a missile would have had to make zany zigzag maneuvers to insure it hit each light pole along the way.
I highly doubt the thin, fragile wings would create an indelible mark on the thick concrete walls of the Pentagon. And I would not be surprised that the fuel and momentum of this impact would atomize most of the plane.
altonhare 5 months ago
4) Says Ken Hertz, a pilot rated on 757/767, "The hijackers required only the shallow understanding of the aircraft. In much the same way a person can perform CPR or set a broken bone without being an experienced physician."
altonhare 5 months ago
4) Marcel Bernard also stated explicitly:
"There's no doubt in my mind that once (Flight 77) got going, he could have pointed that plane at a building and hit it."
altonhare 5 months ago
4) The pilot, Hanjour, had over 600 hours of logged flight time. He had a pilot license. He wasn't great at landing, but ramming a plane into a building has nothing to do with landing.
Marcel Bernard, the flight instructor with experience with Hanjour's flying, stated that Hanjour failed because he had problems landing the plane, and that Hanjour's problems "were nothing unusual"
altonhare 5 months ago
3) "Lucky" Larry does not convince me either. He did not benefit from this arrangement. The $4.7B he received was nothing compared to the $120M in rent he had to continue to pay every month in order to preserve the right to spend over $6B to rebuild the building. He took a net loss!
It was also normal to insure against terrorist attacks in light of more "ordinary" attempted terrorist bombings in the past. This asset was of incalculable value, Larry could not have let it go uninsured.
altonhare 5 months ago
2) I think they were likely not that sophisticated and am not surprised at US incompetence, honestly. The US may have a large, trained military, but I don't think they anticipated a commercial airliner used as a missile.
I favor the view of incompetence on both sides.
altonhare 5 months ago
2) I find your "staggered attack" argument weak. On the one hand you argue that serious, professional terrorists would do a much better job launching a synchronized attack. On the other hand you express incredulity that the US military was penetrated by "barefoot camelback hillbillies".
Either they are sophisticated, trained, professional terrorists with a cunning, razor-sharp, coordinated plan or they're a bunch of hlilbillies. Not both! You depict them as both as it suits you.
altonhare 5 months ago
Mr. Gaede,
Now you've done it. I've opened Pandora's Box and started researching this issue.
1) In watching the WTC7 clip, I cannot imagine a controlled demolition via pre-set explosives. We see no flashes or explosions on the various floors. The clip is consistent with a weakened internal structure due to high levels of heat and collateral impact from the collapse of a nearby building. If we compare the FULL clip of WTC7 to FULL clips of controlled demolition, there are many dissimilarities.
altonhare 5 months ago
5. If the gov't could pull off such a conspiracy, couldn't they do a better job making the building collapse in a way that would look more like a catastrophic accident? Detonate it in pieces, blow it sideways, etc.?
altonhare 5 months ago
1. “Why wouldn't a single person on the "inside" blow the whistle and thereby gain millions of dollars in revenue from a book, fame, etc.?”
.
Are you kidding? Are you for real, Alton?
bgaede 5 months ago
2. I mean, April Gallup was a survivor of the bombs the Bush team planted at the Pentagon, sued Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and George’s cousin, Judge Walker, not only dismissed her case, but held her in contempt of court for filing a frivolous lawsuit.
Willie Rodriguez also sued Bush. The Court dismissed the case claiming lack of jurisdiction.
bgaede 5 months ago
3. The FBI recovered the black boxes at the WTC, made them disappear, and told Mike Malone and friend to shut up about it. They, didn’t. Who believes them? In fact, I think they wrote a book about it. If they did, they certainly didn’t become millionaires. Nobody cares about justice. They’ve got more important things to think about than 9/11.
bgaede 5 months ago
4. But let’s say you saw George Bush himself plant the bombs inside WTC 7? Please tell us about it? I’m sure everyone will go out there and be desperate to buy your book!
.
Or let’s make it better. Let’s say you saw Mohammed Atta walking down the street and invited him to a talk show tomorrow morning. Would there be an investigation of 9/11? Would they retract and say that the airplane strikes and the 19 Arabs stuff was all bullshit?
bgaede 5 months ago
5. No! They would tell the gullible idiots who believe the Gov’s version that Mohammed jumped with his parachute thru a side window at the last moment. And people who believe the idiocy that WTC 7 was brought down by fires would believe that, too!
bgaede 5 months ago
6. The last guy to leave WTC 7, Barry Jennings, testified on camera that he heard bombs (like so many other people did that day) and stepped over bodies, later attempted to recant as the Bush death squads applied pressure on him, and was probably murdered before this potentially dangerous witness could reach the stand.
bgaede 5 months ago
7. “Why is there no flash/detonation in any of the videos?”
There are diff ways to bring down a building. Even bulldozers are used in demolitions.
No flash here...
youtube com/watch?v=o1Vu15D_0oI
bgaede 5 months ago
8. Everyone heard detonations, explosions. Everybody testified as to bombs.
youtube com/watch?v=8n-nT-luFIw
In fact, you SEE the explosions shooting out for about 75 or so meters thru several windows/walls as both the South and North Tower collapse.
bgaede 5 months ago
9. “Why don't we see windows shattering from shockwaves”
This is a myth spread by Loizeaux, the guy who did the WTC. Show me where the famous windows are shattered here. In Fact, the entire upper left hand region of windows collapses practically in one piece!
.
youtube com/watch?v=cRaNwPGcQcM
bgaede 5 months ago
10. “If a controlled demolition, why was a property across the street severely damaged?”
Hopefully, you don’t expect two monsters like the Twins to be demolished and for there not to be collateral damage.
bgaede 5 months ago
11. What you’ve got to answer is how does a building like WTC 7 which is NOT hit by significant debris (compare external structural damage vs 3, 4, 5+6) disintegrates on its footprint exactly like any building that is demolished (whereas those same 4 buildings didn’t)!
.
youtube com/watch?v=2Mj6POZ-XxY
bgaede 5 months ago
12. But when all else fails, you simply have to see the demolition truck in the middle of NY City while the Towers are burning to believe! (Actually, quite funny. Worth seeing!).
.
youtube com/watch?v=qnsgVMVcklQ
bgaede 5 months ago
13. If we add that the demolition guys told everyone 10 SECONDS before WTC7 came down that...
Fireman: “Did you HEAR that?”
Demolition worker: “Keep your eye on that building. That thing’s coming down”
Policeman: “Move it back... The building’s about to blow up.”
And you can HEAR the typical sequence of demolition explosions...
.
Youtube com/watch?v=z9CXQY-bZn4
bgaede 5 months ago
14. AND Larry Silverstein telling the folks on camera that the fire chief decided to ‘pull’ the building that morning,
youtube com/watch?v=7WYdAJQV100
then you really have to be quite gullible to swallow the nonsense that WTC 7 was brought down by Arabs or fires. There is no mystery as to what brought WTC 7 down!
And if WTC 7 came down by way of demolition...
bgaede 5 months ago
15. “If the gov't...making the building collapse in a way that would look more like a catastrophic accident?”
What for? You seem to believe despite the overwhelming evidence that 9/11 was done by Bush and Co. And other people don’t know half as much as you or care to know. George knows his people well and factored that into his plan. The risk was minimal. And with the US legal system, actually there was no risk at all.
bgaede 5 months ago
16. What did George present so far?
.
Phone (y) calls! Subjective evidence that was manufatcured by NORAD and friends!
youtube com/watch?v=jRp4lULPAIc
Where’s the OBJECTIVE evidence? Where are the WTC black boxes? ALL 4 of them disappeared and you don’t even ask the Q???
bgaede 5 months ago
17. I have to believe that you probably don’t know much about what happened that day. I have a difficult time believing that a smart guy like you, after doing an unbiased research of the irregularities that day, would continue to hold that some barefooted camel jockeys from Afghanistan did the Towers.
But if you do, then I strongly recommend that you take the IQ Test, Alt (or join our discussion group). Glad to hear from you again, buddy!
.
youtube com/watch?v=sycO5b4jwcY
bgaede 5 months ago
@bgaede
No, I have not conducted my own independent investigation. My only explanation for this is a fear that I will actually become "convinced" and I'm not sure how I'd handle that as a U.S. citizen trying to lead a "regular" life. I'm in law school ffs. I worked for a year at NIST. What the hell would I do if I truly believed the gov't was engaged in conspiracy at this level?
"The great masses of people will more likely fall victim to a big lie than to a small one" - Hitler
altonhare 5 months ago
"fear that I will actually become "convinced" and I'm not sure how I'd handle that as a U.S. citizen"
That was a very honest statement. I think that's the dilemma of many Americans, especially of those in Congress. The consequences of this realization (if on a massive scale) are incalculable.
bgaede 5 months ago
@bgaede
No, I have not conducted my own independent investigation. My only explanation for this is a fear that I will actually become "convinced" and I'm not sure how I'd handle that as a U.S. citizen trying to lead a "regular" life. I'm in law school ffs. I worked for a year at NIST. What the hell would I do if I truly believed the gov't was engaged in conspiracy at this level?
"The great masses of people will more likely fall victim to a big lie than to a small one" - Hitler
altonhare 5 months ago
1. Why wouldn't a single person on the "inside" blow the whistle and thereby gain millions of dollars in revenue from a book, fame, etc.?
2. Why is there no flash/detonation in any of the videos?
3. Why don't we see windows shattering from shockwaves that would result from detonations.
4. If a controlled demolition, why was a property across the street severely damaged?
altonhare 5 months ago
1. "Civil law suit against the (ex) government"
You put your faith too heavily on the legal system, birth. It ain't what it's been cracked up to be. There will never be an investigation, let alone a trial. If there is a trial by some act of God, it will be hijacked by Congress, much like the Assassination Committee that 'reviewed' JFK. Total BS!
bgaede 5 months ago
2. And even though this committee decided that there was probably a conspiracy, the Wiki, the high school textbooks, etc. all say that Oswald was the lone killer. That's what most people out there who are not familiar with the incident believe. Pretty much like the fact that most people believe in warped space, Big Bang and black holes, and that the dinos died because of an asteroid.
bgaede 5 months ago
3. So, 9/11 is over. It is already dead and buried. It's only purpose on the 10th Ann was to prop up Obama's sagging polls. George was there beside him, both with their hands in their hearts. What a circus! The further we get away from 2001, the more people will forget... just like no one remembers what happened or who died in WWI. The 3000 who died in NY simply were casualties of war... numbers, unfortunate souls who simply were at the wrong place at the wrong time.
bgaede 5 months ago
1. "Gallows are medieval. Try a court of law."
.
My entry at the Pilots for 9/11 reads: "Let's get it straight, folks: first we hang George Bush, then we try him, finally we investigate what happened."
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That's the sequence, birth. George Bush and his team did 9/11. Any proposal other than that means the individual:
a. hasn't done a minimum of research on the subject.
b. is mentally handicapped -- bordering on Downs
c. believes in 'right or wrong, my country'
d. is an infiltrator
bgaede 5 months ago
2. So, we should hang George today and then ask Qs. There will be no discussion if this ground rule is not adhered to. W's guilt is NON-NEGOTIABLE. If the gallows are too barbaric for you, we can waterboard him to death.
bgaede 5 months ago
3. After all, the US Gov maintains that waterboarding is not torture, and if it changes its mind, it should bring George, Dick and Donald to your proposed trial when it does so. That's the way the US would show that it is serious. Otherwise, these mass murderers got away with murder!
bgaede 5 months ago