hmmm, so right off the bat. what's with the just "hey I'm gonna take your sword out of your hand." "ok" wtf? These western martial arts guys get a little carried away I think with some of their moves.
@HolzmannsKnogar Not really just a parry, it is a zornhau followed by an einwinden and thrust, that technique will sometimes go edge to edge if you're a little bit off timing, that is of less importance as long as you stop the opponent's blade in a way that gives you leisure to wind your blade inward and thrust whilst shielding yourself with the sword. Also, in the demo thy have lowered it so that the thrust isn't aimed at an unprotected face.
I think the more they research and practice these martial arts we are going to see distinct similarities in the style that are practiced. I remember seeing in a book called Martial Arts of Renaissance Europe by Angelo, the tricks called wrestling reminded me of Jujistu techniques.
The video is done in a professional manner, I like it. We also are doing the same thing in New Zealand in regards to the Liechtenauer tradition and a few others. Will definitely pay you guys a visit when I'm around USA again.
As a history enthusiast and fellow Historic European Martial Arts practitioner i sallute the people involved in the making of this video. We need to protect what little has survived from the Middle Ages and Renaissance to this day, both in terms of armoured or unarmoured fighting arts aswell as the codes of honour involved in such activities. It is our duty and responsability to revive these fighting systems so they don't become lost in history forever. Thank You.
Nice video Christian, it would be more effective if the HEMA techniques in the opening sequence were done a little faster. The monologue was well written.
@BigDummy23 Yea, this project was done a while ago as a video project for a college course on documentary production... I pretty much said "hey, Christian, what are you doing this weekend? I have something due next week..." Since then, I have directed the instructional DVD series with Tobler, which have much better choreography :-)
Good job guys. Awesome. Can you please post some links for the ones interested? Nice to see this old art preserved and revived. Continue your good work.
its sad that when you type german martial arts on youtube and you go here, there are some videos next to this one that show martial arts that only are done in germany but arent german.
@SweStuff94 if you are asking if there are any from the country of germany no germany was fromed after the midlle ages. but if you mean did the people in that area have them yes. the mace was used all over the world and wrhammers are common for knights to have no matter where they are
@lockbreak12 You seem to jump right to insulting while I was just informing you of historic fact. Sword arts from other countries may not always use edge parries but the historic European techniques do. Certain techniques from Liechtenauer's verse call for strikes to the flat of the blade (plays of the Krumphau for example) but most are just edge on edge.
Done with high quality blades, the edge is not damaged. The swords shown had been used for years training and are still fine.
@vash383 Actually, from my experience studying Liechtenauer, Meyer, Paulus Hector Mair, Fiore Dei Liberi, Ringeck, and Marozzo, (Mostly Liechtenauer and Meyer) The student is instructed specifically to always block with the flat and strike with the edge, unless otherwise called for, such as a flat strike to box an ear. Putting that much force on the cross-sectional area represented by one edge striking another is never a good idea with any steel if it can be avoided. Thus the use of the flat.
@MFWraith interesting, i have only some experience with the later German works, and very little of the Italian. Can you cite anything from the older works (Ringek, Kal, Talhoffer, etc) that calls out using the flat?
The ideal defensive move in the early material is using one of the master cuts and (for example) I cant imagine striking a zwerchhau to block with the flat while cutting with the short edge.
Are you on any forums? If this keeps going, it might be easier to shift to something better
@vash383 Actually its more drawn from the depictions, as Ox and Plow are almost always depicted with the flat presented to intercept in Talhoffer (also "point of wrath" pl 3,18), as well as in the Schielhau, where the opponents blade is initially struck with the knuckle side flat to displace, as in Ringeck. You are right however, in that it is considered much better to defeat a strike with another master strike rather than merely by displacing, but the guards would not exist if they were unused.
@MFWraith The illustrations are not always as clear as we think of them in the modern sense, though. A blade drawn horizontal to the ground would be a thin line, so many times the image is distorted while the text stays true to the technique.
In my experience working with steel, blocking directly with the flat is not a strong. In fact, meeting both edges straight on is not great either. The best is meeting so your blade is at an angle, like if you were cutting in with a zornhau
@vash383 I find that the pictures of the zwerchau often show the blade turned parallel to the ground, so why should the artist change for other positions if he meant it to be the same orientation? I do agree about not meeting completely flat on most of the time, but part of that may be based on whether or not you are using one of the more whip like training, sparring, and tournament swords, or a fuller bladed battle sword, as the thinner one bend a lot more that the full that I use.
@MFWraith Oh yes, training materials make a huge difference in blade alignment. I have had new students using wasters that can get away with things here and there. Put some Albion blunts in their hand and suddenly things change. The Hanwei federschwert trainers are not at all forgiving when it comes to blade alignment
@MFWraith also Dobringer discusses using the flat in the Krumphau in order to keep the blade lined up for the sceond strike at the face and, presumably, to get a bit more spring action out of the deflection and/or save your own blade - (page 26R of Dobringer)
@vash383 ...And yes, you would definately use the edge with the zwerchhau because that is a strike that is intended to kill as well as block, as the master strikes are meant to do. I merely was referring to the common blocks used from the guards, which set you up to thrust but are not themselves strikes, such as blocking with plow and ox. Since blocking with the flat works just as well with these, it is, IMHO, better to save your edge by using the flat to block here, and this is how its drawn.
@vash383 Actually, from my experience studying Liechtenauer, Meyer, Paulus Hector Mair, Fiore Dei Liberi, Ringeck, and Marozzo, (Mostly Liechtenauer and Meyer) The student is instructed specifically to always block with the flat and strike with the edge, unless otherwise called for, such as a flat strike to box an ear. Putting that much force on the cross-sectional area represented by one edge striking another is never a good idea with any steel if it can be avoided. Thus the use of the flat.
@vash383 Actually, from my experience studying Liechtenauer, Meyer, Paulus Hector Mair, Fiore Dei Liberi, Ringeck, and Marozzo, (Mostly Liechtenauer and Meyer), the student is instructed specifically to always block with the flat and strike with the edge, unless otherwise called for, such as a flat strike to box an ear. Putting that much force on the cross-sectional area represented by one edge striking another is never a good idea with any steel if it can be avoided. Thus the use of the flat.
@lockbreak12 the technique shown in the 4th shot is the zornhau, the first of the five German master strokes. When one person strikes down from above, the other cuts down into their attack to parry while simultaneously thrusting to the attacker's face.
The two swordsmen in the video are a highly respected martial arts instructor and one of his top students. Longswords meet edge to edge, that is how it is done.
Brilliantly presented. I suggest you might consider looking at some of the entertainment materials that are extant, which illustrate the ethos of these warriors who spent their lives preparing to do battle. For example there is Gawain and the Green Knight from the 14th century, the Ring of the Neibelung from the 13th century, and the romances of Chretien de Troyes from the 12th century.
hahaha, that is why nobody won vs germany except napoleon (and that whas with cannons), juajuajua. foolish europeans in their mind could only proccess sword x sword. huhahaha ▐▐▐▐
Where can I learn this in Germany?
TheBernhard100 1 month ago
@TheBernhard100 Look for "Zornhau" Offenbach/Main
ThePhale 1 month ago
@ThePhale
Hamburg, youtube.com/user/tossetoke?gl=IT&hl=it
or 3xw.hammaborg.de
Gieszkanne 1 month ago
@TheBernhard100
Hamburg, youtube.com/user/tossetoke?gl=IT&hl=it
or 3xw.hammaborg.de
Gieszkanne 1 month ago
hmmm, so right off the bat. what's with the just "hey I'm gonna take your sword out of your hand." "ok" wtf? These western martial arts guys get a little carried away I think with some of their moves.
CrimsonEmpire 1 month ago
Parrying-With-The-Edge-FAIL at 02:40 Sheesh!
OMG! Dont teach people crap like this!
Watch this instead: watch?v=TtNZQBc4RpE
And this: watch?v=zQHT-bYelCA
HolzmannsKnogar 1 month ago
@HolzmannsKnogar Not really just a parry, it is a zornhau followed by an einwinden and thrust, that technique will sometimes go edge to edge if you're a little bit off timing, that is of less importance as long as you stop the opponent's blade in a way that gives you leisure to wind your blade inward and thrust whilst shielding yourself with the sword. Also, in the demo thy have lowered it so that the thrust isn't aimed at an unprotected face.
Tehinke 1 month ago
lol @ 0:07
dave997 1 month ago
very cool!
MagicalSunrise1984 2 months ago
Comment removed
keganhouse 4 months ago
@ 0:07 that dude wasn't even trying to hold his sword
hsd6553 5 months ago
Edge on edge parry made me cringe.
TheKingdomofErnor 5 months ago
@TheKingdomofErnor is there another way?
dave997 1 month ago
Nice clothing too. Thanks
louishpjr 5 months ago in playlist More videos from vash383
Very good video. Perfectly said it really does "allow us to touch" some of that period. Really enjoyed this...Thank you.
louishpjr 5 months ago in playlist More videos from vash383
greetings from Germany ! Teutonic Order
Quetzalgoatl 6 months ago
Looks like the Grosse Messer on the wall :40
mm3mm3 8 months ago
Enjoyed this video!
combaton 9 months ago
I think the more they research and practice these martial arts we are going to see distinct similarities in the style that are practiced. I remember seeing in a book called Martial Arts of Renaissance Europe by Angelo, the tricks called wrestling reminded me of Jujistu techniques.
schizoidboy 10 months ago 2
The video is done in a professional manner, I like it. We also are doing the same thing in New Zealand in regards to the Liechtenauer tradition and a few others. Will definitely pay you guys a visit when I'm around USA again.
ruski69 11 months ago
fuck that i play runescape xD
DevatorGaming 1 year ago
the knife behind the dudes hed looks like one of the last dagger u buy in assassains creed 2
TheMattwasherein1992 1 year ago
@TheMattwasherein1992
It's called a cinqueda. The blade is named that because the blade is about as wide as five fingers
AsturiasGuitar 11 months ago
@AsturiasGuitar sick thanks man
TheMattwasherein1992 11 months ago
He butchers the pronunciation Leichtenaur's name, otherwise it's good.
qyark 1 year ago
We read the same books...
:)
Canis1969Lupus1 1 year ago
As a history enthusiast and fellow Historic European Martial Arts practitioner i sallute the people involved in the making of this video. We need to protect what little has survived from the Middle Ages and Renaissance to this day, both in terms of armoured or unarmoured fighting arts aswell as the codes of honour involved in such activities. It is our duty and responsability to revive these fighting systems so they don't become lost in history forever. Thank You.
FenrirTheDarkWolf 1 year ago
Nice video Christian, it would be more effective if the HEMA techniques in the opening sequence were done a little faster. The monologue was well written.
BigDummy23 1 year ago
@BigDummy23 Yea, this project was done a while ago as a video project for a college course on documentary production... I pretty much said "hey, Christian, what are you doing this weekend? I have something due next week..." Since then, I have directed the instructional DVD series with Tobler, which have much better choreography :-)
FreelanceAcademy 1 year ago
May one should ask german Fencing-Masters (not that wussy H.Schmidt of course) about german taditions.
11Kralle 1 year ago
Is there any sound to it?
ninjadawg84 1 year ago
@ninjadawg84 Yes, if you are not hearing anything, I would try refreshing the page or restarting your browser
vash383 1 year ago
Good job guys. Awesome. Can you please post some links for the ones interested? Nice to see this old art preserved and revived. Continue your good work.
CavalerVlah 1 year ago
damn, I cant wait to get 18 :D
justaguy08 1 year ago
its sad that when you type german martial arts on youtube and you go here, there are some videos next to this one that show martial arts that only are done in germany but arent german.
pochazet 1 year ago
do you know of any chools teaching the german longsword in MN? i cant find any that are clear
Kelvarra 1 year ago
Did the germans use Mace's and warhammers in the medieval adge?
SweStuff94 1 year ago
@SweStuff94 if you are asking if there are any from the country of germany no germany was fromed after the midlle ages. but if you mean did the people in that area have them yes. the mace was used all over the world and wrhammers are common for knights to have no matter where they are
kokofan50 1 year ago
@kokofan50 Ahha :) ty for the anser :)
SweStuff94 1 year ago
i would love to do this, i do judo, but would love to do something european, unfotunately all i have were i live are asian martial arts
ewbecht 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
you are a moron and I have no more to say other than enjoy your horribly damaged swords
lockbreak12 1 year ago
@lockbreak12 You seem to jump right to insulting while I was just informing you of historic fact. Sword arts from other countries may not always use edge parries but the historic European techniques do. Certain techniques from Liechtenauer's verse call for strikes to the flat of the blade (plays of the Krumphau for example) but most are just edge on edge.
Done with high quality blades, the edge is not damaged. The swords shown had been used for years training and are still fine.
vash383 1 year ago
@vash383 Actually, from my experience studying Liechtenauer, Meyer, Paulus Hector Mair, Fiore Dei Liberi, Ringeck, and Marozzo, (Mostly Liechtenauer and Meyer) The student is instructed specifically to always block with the flat and strike with the edge, unless otherwise called for, such as a flat strike to box an ear. Putting that much force on the cross-sectional area represented by one edge striking another is never a good idea with any steel if it can be avoided. Thus the use of the flat.
MFWraith 1 year ago
@MFWraith interesting, i have only some experience with the later German works, and very little of the Italian. Can you cite anything from the older works (Ringek, Kal, Talhoffer, etc) that calls out using the flat?
The ideal defensive move in the early material is using one of the master cuts and (for example) I cant imagine striking a zwerchhau to block with the flat while cutting with the short edge.
Are you on any forums? If this keeps going, it might be easier to shift to something better
vash383 1 year ago
@vash383 Actually its more drawn from the depictions, as Ox and Plow are almost always depicted with the flat presented to intercept in Talhoffer (also "point of wrath" pl 3,18), as well as in the Schielhau, where the opponents blade is initially struck with the knuckle side flat to displace, as in Ringeck. You are right however, in that it is considered much better to defeat a strike with another master strike rather than merely by displacing, but the guards would not exist if they were unused.
MFWraith 1 year ago
@MFWraith The illustrations are not always as clear as we think of them in the modern sense, though. A blade drawn horizontal to the ground would be a thin line, so many times the image is distorted while the text stays true to the technique.
In my experience working with steel, blocking directly with the flat is not a strong. In fact, meeting both edges straight on is not great either. The best is meeting so your blade is at an angle, like if you were cutting in with a zornhau
vash383 1 year ago
@vash383 I find that the pictures of the zwerchau often show the blade turned parallel to the ground, so why should the artist change for other positions if he meant it to be the same orientation? I do agree about not meeting completely flat on most of the time, but part of that may be based on whether or not you are using one of the more whip like training, sparring, and tournament swords, or a fuller bladed battle sword, as the thinner one bend a lot more that the full that I use.
MFWraith 1 year ago
@MFWraith Oh yes, training materials make a huge difference in blade alignment. I have had new students using wasters that can get away with things here and there. Put some Albion blunts in their hand and suddenly things change. The Hanwei federschwert trainers are not at all forgiving when it comes to blade alignment
vash383 1 year ago
@MFWraith also Dobringer discusses using the flat in the Krumphau in order to keep the blade lined up for the sceond strike at the face and, presumably, to get a bit more spring action out of the deflection and/or save your own blade - (page 26R of Dobringer)
MFWraith 1 year ago
@vash383 ...And yes, you would definately use the edge with the zwerchhau because that is a strike that is intended to kill as well as block, as the master strikes are meant to do. I merely was referring to the common blocks used from the guards, which set you up to thrust but are not themselves strikes, such as blocking with plow and ox. Since blocking with the flat works just as well with these, it is, IMHO, better to save your edge by using the flat to block here, and this is how its drawn.
MFWraith 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@vash383 Actually, from my experience studying Liechtenauer, Meyer, Paulus Hector Mair, Fiore Dei Liberi, Ringeck, and Marozzo, (Mostly Liechtenauer and Meyer) The student is instructed specifically to always block with the flat and strike with the edge, unless otherwise called for, such as a flat strike to box an ear. Putting that much force on the cross-sectional area represented by one edge striking another is never a good idea with any steel if it can be avoided. Thus the use of the flat.
MFWraith 1 year ago
@vash383 Actually, from my experience studying Liechtenauer, Meyer, Paulus Hector Mair, Fiore Dei Liberi, Ringeck, and Marozzo, (Mostly Liechtenauer and Meyer), the student is instructed specifically to always block with the flat and strike with the edge, unless otherwise called for, such as a flat strike to box an ear. Putting that much force on the cross-sectional area represented by one edge striking another is never a good idea with any steel if it can be avoided. Thus the use of the flat.
MFWraith 1 year ago
@lockbreak12 I would not suggest using the inexpensive swords you have for such a block though, those would be damaged.
vash383 1 year ago
ummmmmmm the fencing was taken from medevi sword fighting even longsword is seen in fencing just not as much as a stab
jettarulz 1 year ago
I would have loved this even better if you had not included that edge block in the video
lockbreak12 1 year ago
@lockbreak12 I'm not sure exactly what you mean, the techniques shown in the video are examples of historic plays with steel longswords
vash383 1 year ago
@vash383 yep and one of them screwed up not entirely your fault but it could have been edited around
lockbreak12 1 year ago
@lockbreak12 actually, other than done at a slower speed than normal, all of the techniques are correct.
vash383 1 year ago
@vash383 you know what fuck it if you want to believe that go right ahead btw I am referring to the 4th shot
lockbreak12 1 year ago
@lockbreak12 the technique shown in the 4th shot is the zornhau, the first of the five German master strokes. When one person strikes down from above, the other cuts down into their attack to parry while simultaneously thrusting to the attacker's face.
The two swordsmen in the video are a highly respected martial arts instructor and one of his top students. Longswords meet edge to edge, that is how it is done.
vash383 1 year ago
"to touch something very magical" he says....
i translate this to: "Langes Schwert freakin rocks!"
darkfiete 1 year ago
Brilliantly presented. I suggest you might consider looking at some of the entertainment materials that are extant, which illustrate the ethos of these warriors who spent their lives preparing to do battle. For example there is Gawain and the Green Knight from the 14th century, the Ring of the Neibelung from the 13th century, and the romances of Chretien de Troyes from the 12th century.
lebarosky 1 year ago
Sweet.
VegaEtereo 1 year ago
very good video! I too am a practitioner of Western Martial arts, and think that it's extremely important to revive this system of fighting.
VikingWannaBe51887 2 years ago 27
I agree !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
megasayajinsongoku99 2 years ago
I agree, also there is some practicality use in this arts that you can still do. I will say more about it some other time. I am sleepy.
255Knights 2 years ago
@VikingWannaBe51887 respecting all martial arts around the world, fuck that ufc mma bullshit!
paladindarknite 1 month ago
awesome, wish I could see a full version though.
maybe even a training video on some of the cool stuff you did in this one? :V
fadedproductionsVX 2 years ago
bravo christian and crew!
MarkHolgate 2 years ago
Nicely done.
Kunstdesfechtens 2 years ago
hahaha, that is why nobody won vs germany except napoleon (and that whas with cannons), juajuajua. foolish europeans in their mind could only proccess sword x sword. huhahaha ▐▐▐▐
Czaendermajer 2 years ago
Its good. I also have Toblers book :D
hjames1101 2 years ago 6