mashaalah for al Andalusi and dr Ed Buckner is realy a good man i realy want him to convert to islam if he learn about it i am sur he will convert i don't want to see him disapointed in the day of gdgment
Keep posting this stuff its hilarious. I felt a bit sorry for Abdulla it must have taken a hell of a lot of training and he still needed a list of books he's pretended to read.
This guy sounds really reasonable but a few years ago he was spouting semi scientific nonsense in his videos. He hasn't read many if not all of the books he is quoting but Adnan may well have. A lie is being told here.
We've seen how Christian theocracies treated Muslims and Jews as second class citizens & I've seen how my own relatives have been treated in Islamic theocracies. I'm also concerned about the fact that laws requiring the death of those who leave Islam still exist in 2011. For those arguing for theocracy- see how Muslims & Christians lke vedhic law, etc. There are extremes on the other end- anti-religious laws, but as far as I'm concerned, govt should be neutral regarding matters of religion.
You first have to become Muslim! Islam is the fastest growing religion on earth, and these reverts know the rules and regulations of it perfectly. Islam is also the state, and treason in any state even in US is punishable by death. No one is killed for choosing a religion by choice, but anyone who goes on to fight the state or conspire against it, well that person is guilty of 'Treason' - do not equate Christianity and Islam - Judaism also has similar rules to that of Islam, see old-testament!
The Islamic golden age fell, once fanatical Muslims gained control. They did whatever they could to stamp out freethought, critical inquiry, they mocked and even made heretics of natrualists/rationalists. The time where Muslims, Christians, atheists, etc could sit at the table and debate about religions, gods in the middle east without getting their head cuts off ended hundreds of years ago. The Muslims of today are not the Muslims of the golden era who may have been open minded and tolerant.
No form of human government will every succeed because we humans are incapable of governing ourselves in a fair, just matter. Whether you are a Muslim or an atheist, whatever, it's just not gonna happen. Whatever the perfect government is, we could not implement it.
Hi I debates Sammi Zaatari and Adam Deen and I've made some videos debunking discussing pre big bang cosmology , exposing creationist mis quotes and other pseudo science etc. Just click on my name to check them out,Many thanks. Phil
Great debates can only happen in secular countries with a lesser degree of threat to the Atheist (by that I mean death threats). Ever Arab show I have watched about secularism ends up screaming match after 10 min. It's usually the psycho Muslim who does the shouting. Has Mr Abdullah lived in a country run by religious law? If not, it wouldn't surprise me. Keep dreaming off utopia Muslims. The golden age is over and will never be repeated, just like ancient Mayan and Egyptian cultures.
@apostatesspeak Muslims have lost their sense of tolerance im afraid and there is also a difference between "freedom of speech" and hurting someones feelings. Both sides have their problems.
@apostatesspeak - Islam in Spain, Turkey, Morocco, Egypt, Baghdad, Demasque is what has shown you this multi-culturalism, debate, progress, critique, discussion, of which the dark-ages church suppressed and as a result your thinkers like Martin luther protested against and developed the 'separation of church and state' NOT Islam and state!' - do not think big where you're only a speck! at least read the Quran and compare with anyother book - you'd see something amazing!
@apostatesspeak dont dream...muslims are the fathers of debates, they debated people of every faith 1250 years before europeans, americans were allowed to open their mouths...
mayan and egyptian civilization disapeared along with their culture but islam still exists, 1.5 billion muslims exist and adopt islam...
secular states (all states) force their views over us, they force us to submit to secular laws so thats not really freedom since we dont want secular values (no values)...
@spanptotacs well guess what. u dopnt have to feel sad for me, u can mind ur own problems since u dont even know me.
im happy enough for myself and ur sadness/happiness wont benefit nor will it harm me.
u have ur way i have mine. im glad u have understanding in abundance. so much understanding that ur body doesnt have enough room for it anymore so its coming out from ur nostrils. bye bye
@mujtahid2006 always good to know, so i can understand who is speaking, actually i still have doubt about shia, i don´t know if i should consider them Muslim or not, i am totally confused,
Dr Buckner presented the case of secularism brilliantly, and didn't dwell on Atheism, even though he is a declared Atheist. I wasn't so impressed by Abdullah's presentation though.... While he criticises secularism (i.e. separation of religious leadership and government), what exactly is he proposing as an alternative? Dr Buckner's approach is far more realistic and practical.
@WulfrunaSufi What is so brilliant about someone who can present a case from his point of view only. He is clueless about Islam, doesn't know anything about the Qur'an or its history and accomplishments.
@WulfrunaSufi Did we watch the same thing? Dr. Buckner provided no case for why secularism is rational at all, in fact he admitted its irrationality. Abdullah didn't propose an alternative because that was NOT the debate. This debate was about secularism, not Shariah or something else.
@NinjaKiyo and the fact that Abdullah didn't yet tried to weasel a comment about the Golden Age of Islam in there is a showcase of cowardice. Its a trend of many Muslims to debate Atheists on topics which put the Atheist on the defensive and avoid Islam itself or Muslims becoming open criticized.
Anybody can find faults with Secularism. It's not a perfect system and the forms it takes aren't all equal, but what it is today isn't what it will be tomorrow as it grows and changes with humanity.
As Bruckener said "its not a perfect but its the best we got" and that hasn't been refuted because nothing was really presented or argued to prove otherwise.
This whole debate was a simply stepdown from Abdullah's earlier debate of "Secularism Vs Political Theism" inwhich he lost.
By that definition, Nazism was Rational, because it was the best system for the poor, inflation ridden germans - who used Nazism to rebuild their economy, and become a world superpower in the space of 5 years!!
Secularism does not address Human problems, it creates brand new ones and cannot be justified philosophically, hence it is irrational - regardless of it being the best of the worst (!)
@mujtahid2006 yes If we only look at "best" in a narrow fashion like that then Nazism was best along with slavery. When we talk about Secularism we don't merely say it's the best because it creates a great standard of living for one group but because it creates the best standard of living for all groups in society. Sure there is discrimination however the fact remains minorities here have a better life than minorities (religious aswell as ethnic) in non-secular states.
@mujtahid2006 Secularism is evergrowing and changing. What problems it faces one day will be gone and different from the next. It's problems that drive us to create and grow, I don't expect us to ever be without problems and if we were what would be the point of living then?
The way I see it is that you claim as an individual Muslim to have the perfect design for society but as a group you all can't agree upon it. You have no idea how to set it up or how to even get others (both non-Muslim and Muslim with their own version) to accept that what you have is perfect. It's easy enough to convince someone Islam is the truth but harder to convince them that the way you see Islam is correct.
So the question becomes "what good is a house if it can't be built"?
@WrongWorldBuddy lol I live in Pakistan and most muslims are just mulisms by name not really muslims. I dont know what you think we are some burka clad society which is run by mullahs. As far as i know about my country it cannot be run by Islamic law because people dont want it actually they dont even know about it so you cant say as a group we dont agree upon it. Practicing muslims do however agree upon it and this is for my country not all muslim countires i dont know about them so i cant say
masha'Allah ,MDI put in alot of work. have you thought of arranging these debates with deviiant sects? would be good because deviiant sects hurt me more than non believers and athiest.keep up the good works inaha'Allah
Religions have one goal to convert the world there will never be separation they will always try to dictate.
wachnathan 3 months ago
mashaalah for al Andalusi and dr Ed Buckner is realy a good man i realy want him to convert to islam if he learn about it i am sur he will convert i don't want to see him disapointed in the day of gdgment
Klazyo 5 months ago
Keep posting this stuff its hilarious. I felt a bit sorry for Abdulla it must have taken a hell of a lot of training and he still needed a list of books he's pretended to read.
strangetranceoffaith 8 months ago
This guy sounds really reasonable but a few years ago he was spouting semi scientific nonsense in his videos. He hasn't read many if not all of the books he is quoting but Adnan may well have. A lie is being told here.
strangetranceoffaith 8 months ago
We've seen how Christian theocracies treated Muslims and Jews as second class citizens & I've seen how my own relatives have been treated in Islamic theocracies. I'm also concerned about the fact that laws requiring the death of those who leave Islam still exist in 2011. For those arguing for theocracy- see how Muslims & Christians lke vedhic law, etc. There are extremes on the other end- anti-religious laws, but as far as I'm concerned, govt should be neutral regarding matters of religion.
TurboDally 11 months ago
You first have to become Muslim! Islam is the fastest growing religion on earth, and these reverts know the rules and regulations of it perfectly. Islam is also the state, and treason in any state even in US is punishable by death. No one is killed for choosing a religion by choice, but anyone who goes on to fight the state or conspire against it, well that person is guilty of 'Treason' - do not equate Christianity and Islam - Judaism also has similar rules to that of Islam, see old-testament!
robin4good 11 months ago
The Islamic golden age fell, once fanatical Muslims gained control. They did whatever they could to stamp out freethought, critical inquiry, they mocked and even made heretics of natrualists/rationalists. The time where Muslims, Christians, atheists, etc could sit at the table and debate about religions, gods in the middle east without getting their head cuts off ended hundreds of years ago. The Muslims of today are not the Muslims of the golden era who may have been open minded and tolerant.
TurboDally 11 months ago
No form of human government will every succeed because we humans are incapable of governing ourselves in a fair, just matter. Whether you are a Muslim or an atheist, whatever, it's just not gonna happen. Whatever the perfect government is, we could not implement it.
mayawarriorprincess 1 year ago
Abdullah is really good.thnx 2 ALLAH that we have men of such calibor
HIMAZZZ1991 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Hi I debates Sammi Zaatari and Adam Deen and I've made some videos debunking discussing pre big bang cosmology , exposing creationist mis quotes and other pseudo science etc. Just click on my name to check them out,Many thanks. Phil
skydivephil 1 year ago
Great debates can only happen in secular countries with a lesser degree of threat to the Atheist (by that I mean death threats). Ever Arab show I have watched about secularism ends up screaming match after 10 min. It's usually the psycho Muslim who does the shouting. Has Mr Abdullah lived in a country run by religious law? If not, it wouldn't surprise me. Keep dreaming off utopia Muslims. The golden age is over and will never be repeated, just like ancient Mayan and Egyptian cultures.
apostatesspeak 1 year ago
@apostatesspeak Muslims have lost their sense of tolerance im afraid and there is also a difference between "freedom of speech" and hurting someones feelings. Both sides have their problems.
gmgnautics313 1 year ago
@apostatesspeak - Islam in Spain, Turkey, Morocco, Egypt, Baghdad, Demasque is what has shown you this multi-culturalism, debate, progress, critique, discussion, of which the dark-ages church suppressed and as a result your thinkers like Martin luther protested against and developed the 'separation of church and state' NOT Islam and state!' - do not think big where you're only a speck! at least read the Quran and compare with anyother book - you'd see something amazing!
robin4good 11 months ago
@apostatesspeak dont dream...muslims are the fathers of debates, they debated people of every faith 1250 years before europeans, americans were allowed to open their mouths...
mayan and egyptian civilization disapeared along with their culture but islam still exists, 1.5 billion muslims exist and adopt islam...
secular states (all states) force their views over us, they force us to submit to secular laws so thats not really freedom since we dont want secular values (no values)...
khalilrabee 11 months ago 13
@khalilrabee lack of understanding usually makes me angry but yours makes me feel sad for you
spanptotacs 3 months ago
@spanptotacs well guess what. u dopnt have to feel sad for me, u can mind ur own problems since u dont even know me.
im happy enough for myself and ur sadness/happiness wont benefit nor will it harm me.
u have ur way i have mine. im glad u have understanding in abundance. so much understanding that ur body doesnt have enough room for it anymore so its coming out from ur nostrils. bye bye
khalilrabee 3 months ago
fitrah
nazifdaniel 1 year ago
brother abdullah is sunni or shia?
raju53 1 year ago
@raju53
He is Sunni. Why do you ask?
mujtahid2006 1 year ago
@mujtahid2006 always good to know, so i can understand who is speaking, actually i still have doubt about shia, i don´t know if i should consider them Muslim or not, i am totally confused,
raju53 1 year ago
@raju53
Shias are part of the Muslim Ummah - you don't have to agree with them, to call them Muslim.
mujtahid2006 1 year ago
Dr Buckner presented the case of secularism brilliantly, and didn't dwell on Atheism, even though he is a declared Atheist. I wasn't so impressed by Abdullah's presentation though.... While he criticises secularism (i.e. separation of religious leadership and government), what exactly is he proposing as an alternative? Dr Buckner's approach is far more realistic and practical.
WulfrunaSufi 1 year ago 4
@WulfrunaSufi What is so brilliant about someone who can present a case from his point of view only. He is clueless about Islam, doesn't know anything about the Qur'an or its history and accomplishments.
indimaya 1 year ago
@WulfrunaSufi Did we watch the same thing? Dr. Buckner provided no case for why secularism is rational at all, in fact he admitted its irrationality. Abdullah didn't propose an alternative because that was NOT the debate. This debate was about secularism, not Shariah or something else.
NinjaKiyo 1 year ago
@NinjaKiyo and the fact that Abdullah didn't yet tried to weasel a comment about the Golden Age of Islam in there is a showcase of cowardice. Its a trend of many Muslims to debate Atheists on topics which put the Atheist on the defensive and avoid Islam itself or Muslims becoming open criticized.
WrongWorldBuddy 1 year ago
Anybody can find faults with Secularism. It's not a perfect system and the forms it takes aren't all equal, but what it is today isn't what it will be tomorrow as it grows and changes with humanity.
As Bruckener said "its not a perfect but its the best we got" and that hasn't been refuted because nothing was really presented or argued to prove otherwise.
This whole debate was a simply stepdown from Abdullah's earlier debate of "Secularism Vs Political Theism" inwhich he lost.
WrongWorldBuddy 1 year ago
@WrongWorldBuddy
The debate was 'Is Secularism rational?' - whether it is the best system humans have at the moment is irrelevant.
mujtahid2006 1 year ago
@mujtahid2006 it is relevant because Secularism being rational is the result of it being the best system today.
WrongWorldBuddy 1 year ago
@WrongWorldBuddy
By that definition, Nazism was Rational, because it was the best system for the poor, inflation ridden germans - who used Nazism to rebuild their economy, and become a world superpower in the space of 5 years!!
Secularism does not address Human problems, it creates brand new ones and cannot be justified philosophically, hence it is irrational - regardless of it being the best of the worst (!)
mujtahid2006 1 year ago
@mujtahid2006 yes If we only look at "best" in a narrow fashion like that then Nazism was best along with slavery. When we talk about Secularism we don't merely say it's the best because it creates a great standard of living for one group but because it creates the best standard of living for all groups in society. Sure there is discrimination however the fact remains minorities here have a better life than minorities (religious aswell as ethnic) in non-secular states.
WrongWorldBuddy 1 year ago
@mujtahid2006 Secularism is evergrowing and changing. What problems it faces one day will be gone and different from the next. It's problems that drive us to create and grow, I don't expect us to ever be without problems and if we were what would be the point of living then?
WrongWorldBuddy 1 year ago
The way I see it is that you claim as an individual Muslim to have the perfect design for society but as a group you all can't agree upon it. You have no idea how to set it up or how to even get others (both non-Muslim and Muslim with their own version) to accept that what you have is perfect. It's easy enough to convince someone Islam is the truth but harder to convince them that the way you see Islam is correct.
So the question becomes "what good is a house if it can't be built"?
WrongWorldBuddy 1 year ago
@WrongWorldBuddy lol I live in Pakistan and most muslims are just mulisms by name not really muslims. I dont know what you think we are some burka clad society which is run by mullahs. As far as i know about my country it cannot be run by Islamic law because people dont want it actually they dont even know about it so you cant say as a group we dont agree upon it. Practicing muslims do however agree upon it and this is for my country not all muslim countires i dont know about them so i cant say
gmgnautics313 1 year ago
@mujtahid2006 One doesn't need religion to address Human problems. GUTTED!!!
SaerdnaOoOoo 1 year ago
@SaerdnaOoOoo Tell that to the Palestinians, their problems haven't been addressed properly or fairly for over 60 years.
A2Neji 1 year ago
@WulfrunaSufi The topic wasn't about Islam after all. Its was about secularism as we have right now.
MatrixOfDynamism 1 year ago
That was mad..conclusion LOVED IT :)
pamuk7 1 year ago
......Very good points by Brother Abdullah.May God give him more strength and perseverance on truth..
humanion 1 year ago
Allahu Akbar! MashAllah Souljah on yaa Ummah ul Muhammad SAW <3
sheikhtheworld 1 year ago
masha'Allah ,MDI put in alot of work. have you thought of arranging these debates with deviiant sects? would be good because deviiant sects hurt me more than non believers and athiest.keep up the good works inaha'Allah
pillgrimz 1 year ago