Wesley Clark "swiftboats" John Mccain (2 of 2)

[dunskie]

General Clark is someone to be listened to.

In no way is he doind anything like "swiftboating" John McCain. Ridiculous.

[Kuumbaman]

Go ahead, Mr. Clark! You are correct.

[Jetkimchrea]

Let me just say this folks, he got shot down, if we chose every guy who gets shot down as president and NOT choose the guy who can AVOID getting shot and come home safely, wouldnt that be the dumbest fucken decision ever. How the did he get shot down in the first place? go look that up, and you'll know why he makes stupid a stupid ass president. O and If you dont listen to a fucken 4 star general, then......then youll get shot down. Gen. Clark, known to get through war without a single casualty.

[dietrijn9er]

It says something to the American people when a 4 star general speaks of John McCain's lack of National Security Policy experience. He said nothing about John McCains combat experience. That is not whats being questioned.

Gen Clark is an expert on National Security and would know more than any two bit news anchor who beats to the drum that because McCain was a POW, he MUST be an expert on all things foreign...Thats absurd and I'm outraged that more emphasis has not been put on his views!!!

[reformedcynic]

I'm really annoyed that the democrats let the republican's tactic of feigned shock and dismay work on them. General Clarke was being completely logical and respectful and has no reason to apologize for what he said. I'm glad the Obama camp has finally realized that they don't have to go running scared every time the McCain camp whines about being offended over a completely valid point.

[obeone21]

mccstain you suck!

[thearchives]

Doesn't being shot down mean he FAILED his mission?

[daWatchiir]

John McCain went on a Secret Mission and got SHOT DOWN?

Then shouldn't we been QUESTIONING HIS JUDGEMENT?

[Davidhebron123]

You can see why we call him Weasely Clark. He says McCain was "riding on a jet" like he was dozing in seat 23C. McCain was a fighter pilot in combat.

He says McCain did no leadership. Then in the next sentence admits that he commanded a squadron. Weasely, you earned the name.

[dietrijn9er]

Well, you certainly know nothing of General Clark. You are another superficial citizen who jumps on headlines and neglects to read the entire story. Try reading for a change, them making a rational comment.

Gen. Clark is an honorable man that you, nor I, could ever hope to aspire to!

[theyak47]

Did conservatives turn a blind eye to Net's philandering? Did they turn a blind eye to Bob Dole leaving his wife for Liddy? do they turn a blind eye to Rush running to the Dominican republic for a sex tour, not to mention illegal use of drugs? There is hypocracy on both sides of the coin. So let's try dealing with actual qualification for office.

[pgthinker007]

I just want to admit that this man dealt with terrorists. Maybe people would not beleive it because he speaks nicely.

I would suggest to see this:

thebrooklynconnection [DOT] net

navigate the site and you will find this guy there.

[enabuus]

Everybody can talk but this gay is telling nothing but the thruth.

[anomalysix]

Didn't John McCain cheat on his wife?

[THUD086]

He was following in John Kennedys footsteps.

[SAINTKUSH]

Mccain said the war will be quick and easy - clark just wants him to be accountable for his judgement or lack of.

[BrendanM4458]

"Swiftboats?" How so? Did he question McCain's service or call him a traitor who didn't deserve his medals? Did Gen. Clark lie about John McCain?

Of course not. He merely questioned McCain's qualifications and judgment to be president. The only one "swiftboating" is McCain's campaign, who actually brought in a Swift Boat Veteran for "Truth" to smear Clark and defend McCain.

[shaire99]

The Republican mindset is truly desperate and panicking as they distort and contrive with their hatefilled messages of derision and bigotry.

Republicans and their Faux News ilk are disgusting to watch and listen to as they continue to deceive their ignorant flock.

[THUD086]

I was wondering how long it would take for an intellectualy bankrupt Democrat to come here and divert attention from the topic to spout their usual drivel "wah wah, you wepublicans are a bunch of meanies, wah wah".

If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit.

If you can't contribute anything significant to the debate, go sit at the toddler table and leave this for the grown-ups.

[shaire99]

thud, No one is saying McCain's service wasn't significant and something to be proud of. See if you can follow this IT doesn't , in and of itself, qualify you for the Presidency. Get it?

Now sonny, head down the street to that community college and tell em you want in!

And quit trolling and stalking me

[THUD086]

shaire99, read the comments below. I already stated that it is not the single qualifier. Got a problem with researching things, I see.

And stop being paranoid. You added a point of view here, and I reacted to it. When you enter a debate, expect to have your talking points challenged. Discussing politics is not a pillow fight. If you can't handle it, then like I said, go sit at the toddler table. Nobody is stalking and trolling you. And please don't call me sonny, I'm a Vietnam vet.

[beornborg]

Thud086, I pegged you as a troll with all the personal attacks you make.

Do you honestly think that McCain is capable of standing up against the NeoCons and their backers? He has already conceded important positions that helped to create his reputation. It's gotten to the point that McCain can debate himself because he's taken opposing sides on the same issue. McCain does not exhibit the strong decisive leadership skills that I expect from a military man.

[THUD086]

Good morning beornborg, I'm on the east coast. First of all, I don't care what you peg me as. I came here to get my point across regarding the content of this video, and so far, you haven't even come close to disputing it. I like the way you throw out such things as "what were the ethics issues?" Diverting attention elsewhere , I see. Let me lay my cards out on the table. Personally, I commend both Clark and McCain for their military service, something dear to me. Politically, McCain SUCKS.

[THUD086]

He supports amnesty for illegal aliens, and he's no friend of the second ammendment, two things I despise about him. My first choices were either Thompson or Romney, but I will play the hand I was dealt with. No backing down from that. Too bad the Dems couldn't put up someone more on the conservative side, but I don't care for Obama. McCain comes with some heavy baggage, "the gang of 14" and "The Keating Five" come to mind. Mostly, he's just not conservative enough for me, but I'm stuck with him

[THUD086]

It's like the proverbial albatross around my neck. But I won't shy away from the fight. Now if you can address the comment I made earlier to you, then do so. If you can't, then that's how I will accept, and we'll move on to other issues. Sound okay to you? And like I said to the troll, this is not a pillow fight.

.

[beornborg]

Thud086 it sounds like you need a hug. That albatross must be a burden to carry around.

To be fair I'll have to reread your comments, but as far as I am concerned I addressed the video. I believe that Schieffer's point wasn't the same as yours. Kerry's experience was never brought up. I'll have to leave you with that for now. I need to get to work.

Have a Happy 4th.

[THUD086]

Thanks beornborg, and I wish a safe and happy fourth to you, and all, as well. At your convenience, if you wish to slug it out here in the YouTube "Thunderdome", I'll be lurking.

A hug sounds nice, but I'd rather have tonights lottery Number.

[yaat22055]

the host is an idiot, he's even suggesting that obama should have been a POW as well to have an argument...alright guys, for all of you who dream one day to be a president you should start learning to fly now and to get yourself shot and to fall on your ass to be qualified

[willofphilg]

Maybe Barak thinks William Ayers is more qualified than McCain to be commander in cheif. After all he did order the bombings. .... Obama does'nt have the the first clue about judging people...Rednecks will all be awaken come November and by that time Obama will be a joke anyway. MaCain is such a weak opponent Obama's basicly running against himself. It's funny to watch.

[498345]

fuck wesley clark

yellow coward son of a bitch

human excrement..a fucking pussy

too bad wasn't a casualty during vietnam

Blow me general

[beornborg]

Nice sock account.

[DAVIDSILVERCA]

Wes Clark asked a reasonable question. Wes Clark is another American hero and a retired 4 star General. Yet McCain's surrogates are now trashing him, being disrespectful to an Amercian hero and are trying to say this 4 star general should not ask a reasonable questions. Now the swiftboat guys are on McCain payroll...another dirty deed in the making, even though McCain renounced Swift Boat in 04. Guess McCain will do anything to win.

[beornborg]

This is exactly the problem that I have with McCain. He's willing to compromise his character to win this election. It's tough to watch him do this.

[brezz2285]

Clark was an extremely "political" (as in office politics) officer on active duty. He gained little, if any, respect from his peers or subordinates. His career ended with him being relieved of command and passed over for advancement after that. He could have served as the prototype for Courtney Massengale.

[EricFlatpick]

You can take the "swift-boat" characterization and ... flush it down the toilet. LOL.

[bryannforClark]

Just like Gen.Petraeus.

[bryannforClark]

Now tell me who amongst McCain's roster of potential V.P. can tout the same experience?

What I am trying to distinguish between a Captain and a full General are humongous. I am certain you are aware of this very fact. Executive experience, Clark have this in spades over McCain. No contest.

Just a caveat here, I am not a supporter of Obama, I will hold to myself what I think of Obama which is not much. I served under Gen.Clark and I found him to be one of our country's ablest generals...

[brezz2285]

You served under Clark and you're a Canadian? I call BS. I served under Clark In Europe, I know USMA classmates of Clarks. He is universally reviled as the sort of officer who was always looking up the chain of command to find an ass to kiss instead of taking care of troops. He was NOT the dirty-boots leader that the Army calls for. He was relieved of cammand over "matters of ethics".

[beornborg]

What were the ethics issues?

[brezz2285]

You'll have to ask the people who fired him. That would include Shelton and the SecDef.

[bryannforClark]

Academically, it's not even a contest. West Point Valedictorian,Graduated 1st at Command and General Staff College. Just like the conservatives fave, Gen.Petraeus.

Combat experience, I'll give them both a tie here, Command experience it's not even a contest commanding from every level of command the Army have, and being the J-5 on the Joints Chief of Staff, that means responsible for Worldwide Geo Political Military Strategy.

SOUTHCOM,EUROPEAN COMMAND, NATO SACEUR. Need I add more?

[brezz2285]

Yes, here's more, relieved of command by Bill Clinton.

[bryannforClark]

What makes Gen.Clark credible as Obama's running mate? well as you can tell the obvious Gen.Clark will tout his record of achievement in the Armed Forces like he did the last time. Does it come across hypocritical? Yes and no, depending on one's perspective and political leanings.

You will obviously feel that if Clark is chosen that he will come out and boost his credentials as a former military man.

Let's be realistic here okay, McCain does not have and can't equal what Gen.Clark achieved.

[THUD086]

I had to go out for a while. You're reversing yourself. You said earlier that it's not the sole qualifier, and I agree with you, but now you're drawing a comparison touting Clark over others. You can't have it both ways. And YES, it is hypocritical if Clark runs on his record. You're starting to sound like a whining, crying, little schoolgirl with your panties in a wad. It's either your way or none at all. And Clark isn't going anywhere. Obama will throw him under the bus when he's done.

[beornborg]

Clark already got thrown under the bus. His comments were denounced for no good reason. He may be out of the running now.

As for Clark's experience, he is more than qualified. His executive level experience as a general is comparable to any statesman. As NATO commander, he made agreements with thugs like Milosevic and Ratko Mladic that paved the way for peace in Bosnia. His unique insight would be valuable in policy and military decisions in Iraq. He is qualified to be VP.

[THUD086]

beornborg, let me elaborate more on a comment earlier. In 92, Bush senior, a veteran of WW2, running for re-election, faced Clinton whose claim to fame as a draft dodger. The Dems would cry "no fair, no fair", when military experience was brought into the race. Four years later, Dole, a WW2 veteran who fought in Italy and lost the use of his right hand, and again "no fair, no fair' from the Dems. Four years ago the Dems got a decorated veteran in Kerry, and did a complete 180.

[THUD086]

The Dems rammed his record down everyones throat. Now, four years later, we have McCain, a decorated war veteran, and Obama, no military service, and Clark, a Clinton boot licker trying to tell us that McCains military experience is meaningless against Obama. You do not see the irony in this? Is your head stuck so far up your ass that you can actually peek out through your belly button? If military experience counts in a candidate, then McCain has that edge over Obama, in spite of Clarks comment

[beornborg]

I don't see your point. I don't vote along party lines. Military service helps. There are qualities that I like such as decisiveness, attention to detail, the ability to think abstractly, and accountability. The old McCain had some of those qualities, but now he looks weak and desperate. He's waffled on every position that I care about and he has surrounded himself with the same old Bush gang that I loath. I voted for McCain years ago to stop Bush and now he plans to continue his legacy.

[bryannforClark]

I understood completely what you have written. The problem I have with it as I see it, is that you are charactezing Gen.Clark's comment as something of a red herring.

Gen.Clark clearly said that being a veteran and a P.O.W is certainly a very godd traits to have in a person running for the Presidency.

But not as being the "SOLE" qualifier to becoming the next President. Look I welcome any disagreements from you as you seems to be at the moment pragmatic and reasonable.

[THUD086]

I addressed the issue of it not being the sole qualifier below with jtartsy. You're right, it's not the sole qualifier, but regardless of whether McCains military record is stellar or not, it should not be a topic for discussion since Obama does not have one to begin with. This is a problem I see from the Dems. In 92, military experience meant nothing, since Clinton was running. Four years ago, the Dems got a war hero, and it became a different story. Do you see how pathetic this is getting?

[THUD086]

This also brings up another good issue,bryannforclark. Let's just suppose that Clark gets the VP nod, (I don't think he will). Without his military record to carry him, what makes him qualified then? Holding public office? He can't say that, can he? You know as I do, he'll be throwing his military record all over the place. Would you agree with me, that it would be hypocritical? Again, assuming he gets the VP nod.

[DLPresents]

John McCain, after graduating 894th of 899 at the Naval Academy, was still accepted to flight school because of who is father and grandfather were. At the academy he crashed 2 planes, he crashed another doing a fly-over at a football game, and he crashed planes 4 and 5 a week apart in Vietnam. I don't see how anyone can feel that someone who's crashed almost every plane he's ever been in should be leading the country. McCain is clearly better suited for a POW camp than the white house.

[bryannforClark]

The issue here is judgment and insight to see that what McCain is representing is simply the same as Bush. We can honor a person's service but not the politics of which they represent. By the way don't try to equate what Kerry experienced to what Gen.Clark is trying to convey here, you could not be more mistaken here.

Kerry was attacked as a fake, phony combat veteran. McCain is being assailed by Gen.Clark for his service and lauded for his great character and bravery. Swiftboating? HARDLY.

[THUD086]

After listening to this douche bag, I only wish I could eat as much as I would like to throw up. Four years ago, the dummycrats couldn't stop praising Kerrys military career over Bush's. Now we have a bona fide military hero and leader up against Barack "Hot Lips" Obama, who couldn't make pimple on a G.I.'s ass, and this Clinton ass kisser crawls out from a cesspool to spout this crap? Selling your soul to the devil for a possible VP spot only shows what you're made of, and it smells like shit.

[beornborg]

You wish you could eat as much as you would like to throw up? eww.

[THUD086]

Like I said, funny how the Dem's fawned over John "Reporting for Duty" Kerry's military record over Bush, but here we have Obama who never seen a day in the military, but what a difference four years makes to the Dem's, right? Saying that McCains' military experience doesn't qualify him to be president is the same as saying losing a PT boat also doesn't qualify one to be president. Would you like to walk down that road with me?

[beornborg]

In 2000, I supported McCain for his record, but today he's not the same man. I now question his ability to lead and tell us the truth about Iraq. When he declared Mosul safe, 3 suicide attacks occured. This showed me he is not informed on Iraq. His multiple attempts to link Al Queda with Iran further weakened the argument that he should be Commander in Chief. Iran and Al Queda are enemies. His reversal on torture and opposition to the GI Bill had me wondering what happened to the old McCain.

[pipemannow]

Pardon me, Swift Boat veterans.

[bryannforClark]

Shit typical of these bozos. Swift boating? Man don't be such a fucking sissy pls. Is this is it? I thought McCain is a lot tougher than this, man mcCain supporters are such drama queens. Talk about hyperbole

[pipemannow]

Clark dishonored Sen. McCain's record. McCain, by the way, defended Sen. Kerry against the Shift Boat vets in 2004. I guess the left really has no shame.

[beornborg]

Clark did not dishonor McCain's record. In the quote, he was referring to Obama not to McCain. My interpretation of Clarks quote is that Obama does not need to have military experience to become President.

[DAVIDSILVERCA]

Then why did McCain hire a swiftboater to demonize Clark? This is not the McCain of old...he is selling his soul to be president. And now he just put Karl Rove's hatchet man in charge of his campaign...that's the DOUBLE TALK EXPRESS.

[dogstar7]

I didn't realize earlier that Main Stream Media was using this "Swiftboat" trope to characterize Clark's comments across the board today, AC. You're excused for following suit for the sake of brevity.

One does wonder...since everyone on the air and in the blogosphere is using the "swiftboat" meme to smear Clark's comments...who, in the Ministry of Propaganda, sent the first email to whom at FOX to get THAT snowball rolling....???

Score one for the sons of Dr. Goebells today.

[PyroTibbs]

"Really!". I mean, duh. Fighter plane pilot =! president of the united states. One is technical, the other is political. They have nothing to do with each other. What's impressive is that Schieffer is somehow convinced that they are intimately connected.

[JamCamp06]

If being a war hero qualifies you for prez, how about Randy "Duke" Cunningham for veep? Then we'd have two war heos!

[jtartsy]

I have to say that I agree. Being shot down in a fighter plane and being a prisoner of war aren't qualifications for presidency they do highlight his patriotism, but I would think that being a POW for as long as McCain was would kinda fuck with his head a little bit. You don't walk away from that type of experience without some psychological baggage. If feel it dis a qualification then please clear that up for me. give me a little clarity..lol

[THUD086]

jtartsy, by itself, McCains military experience does not qualify him or anyone else, for that matter. But it is reflective of one's character, for all to see, if one's eyes are open. As far psychological baggage, as you put it, McCain has been in politics since the early eighties. Now if you have reason to believe his head is fucked up a bit, I for one would like to hear it. Otherwise, all your doing is throwing shit on the wall just to see if any of it will stick, and it's not.

[bryannforClark]

Look THUD086 show me a quote from Gen.Clark were he dissed or demeaned Sen.McCain's service?

Gen.Clark went out on his way to praise the man's great service to our nation, but as the General, it is not and should be not the overriding qualification to lead and be the leader of this nation of which Gen.Clark bled and fought for.

[THUD086]

Bryan, where in my comments did I say that? I never said he dissed or demeaned McCains service. It's Clark who claims McCains experiences in the Navy doesn't qualify him. Do you have a reading comprehension problem, or were you trying to bait me into something else? Don't waste your time doing that, okay?

[JimboTHC]

DITTO

Clark: "I don't think riding in a fighter plane and getting shot down is a qualification for President."

Schieffer: "Really?!(huff)"

Yes Bob; really! LOL!

Comment(s) marked as spam S

[Cindi3847]

I agree that just being a prisoner of war doesn't make you qualified to be president.

Gen. Clark however, ran for President after taking far more than he gave to this country. He spent almost 1/3 of his military career in College's including studying abroad. His education cost the taxpayers hundreds of thousands of dollars which he is cashing in on now.

Lastly, President Bill Clinton, during his second term, FORCED Gen. Clark to retire.

[beornborg]

Cindi3847, don't smear Clark. He's a war hero too with a Silver Star. Clark gave back to his country in many ways through is military service in Vietnam, teaching, and in various leadership positions at different commands. He is not an academic as you allege. He has real experience and was distinguished as a cadet and officer. He earned the advanced degrees and the Rhodes Scholarship. McCain's saber rattling and ill-informed comments shows the same poor judgement that got us into the Iraq war.

[DAVIDSILVERCA]

Cindi, General Clark was a Rhodes Scholar, probably, the highest honor an American student can have, so the money is well spent. BTW, Bill Clinton WAS CLARK'S PRIMARY BACKER FOR HIS PRESIDENTIAL RUN IN 2004.

[Cindi3847]

I believe both Pres. Clinton and Gen Clark were Rhodes Scholars. Being a Rhodes Scholar doesn't qualify you to be the President either. Character and moral values are also important and we know how how Bill Clinton failed on these issues.

It seems you equate formal higher education with qualifications to be a good President or General for that matter. One of our best Presidents, Harry S. Truman, never went to college and wasn't a womanizer.

[DAVIDSILVERCA]

Cindi, this is convoluted logic. Clark is not running for President...McCain is. You mentioned Clark went to college and I was referring to that. Frankly, our country was in 100% better shape with Clinton and his character and moral issues than we are with Bush, who's sense of righteousness has destroyed our economy, ruined our international standing and depressed our country. We can't afford 4 more years of Graham's failed economics (McCain's closest adviser) and Leiberman/Bush wars. OBAMA!

[Cindi3847]

Subject: Convoluted logic. Your logic is convoluted. I didn't mention Pres. Bush and your response is all about the failures of the Bush Administration which I DO NOT refute.

You failed to comment on the subject of my comment.

I stated that education was no more important than being a prisoner of war in regards to selecting a President, citing Pres. Truman, who didn't go to college.

I also stated that character and moral values are critical. Do you believe they are important?

[DAVIDSILVERCA]

Education IS more important than being a POW. Being President is a job that requires understanding of economics, history, leadership, et al. You cannot do that without knowledge and knowledge comes from education.

Character and moral values are broad and sweeping terms. I rather have Monica Lewinsky to worry about that Dick Cheney.

Obama has the right values AND the right stuff: intelligence, resourcefulness, incredible leadership charisma. I think we need him. Nuff said.

[THUD086]

You still don't get it, do you? Cindi brought up an excellent point about Harry Truman, and he did just fine. Ah dude, the president has a cabinet to assist him/her in areas where they may be weak. You can be a Mensa member and still have no common sense. YOU may think you need Obama, but that's your opinion. And you know that old cliche about everyone having a rectum.

[Cindi3847]

I'm sure YOU WOULD rather have Monica Lewinsky. NUFF Said!

[theyak47]

No, I'dd rather have Cindy McCain and her $100 million!!!

[Cindi3847]

theyak47: Please get your facts right. It's $300,000,000. LOL

[THUD086]

Cindi3847, it's a waste of time being logical to a liberal They don't understand such things. Facts, confuse them. It's like waving a silver cross in front of Dracula, they're frightened by it. The only thing they understand is their own revisionist history.

[DAVIDSILVERCA]

BTW, what is worse, a man who cheats on his wife, or one who calls her unmentionable names? Which is worse, a man who lies to his wife while cheating, or one who leaves his impaired wife for a rich, younger woman? Both are bad...Clinton and McCain. McCain apparently does not have the values you mention, while Obama has a successful marriage and family. If values are important to YOU, then you should choose Obama. My values are about selecting the best equipped candidate...that is Obama.

[THUD086]

Anybody who mistreats their spouse is a scumbag in my book, be they Dem or Repub. The problem was liberals all turned a blind eye during the time Clinton turned the White House in to a whore house, so cut your self righteous crap will you. I'm glad Obama projects that moral image, we need more of it. But you know as well as I do, if he didn't, that wouldn't make a difference to you. Lib's are as phony as a three dollar bill.

[Cindi3847]

David,

Your right in that abuse is very bad no matter who institutes it. Also I never questioned Obama's character or values. At least I'M HONEST and will admit when I agree.

I would much rather have my husband get mad and call me a name than to find out he is sleeping with an intern, young enough to be his daughter, and put in his trust by a parent like myself. I feel sorry for you that you don't see the difference.

[LaMouleQuiCoule]

wow, thats gonna hurt McCain.

The journalist perfectly represented how the media sucks up to McCain and buy into his "experience"

[dogstar7]

Schieffer: "I've gotta say, Barack Obama never had those kind of experiences either, nor has he ridden in a fighter plane and gotten shot down..."

Clark: "I don't think riding in a fighter plane and getting shot down is a qualification for President."

Schieffer: "Really?!(huff)"

Yes Bob; really! LOL!