Fuck this guy. If he is going to do things like end the war on drugs and bring all troops home then this country would have plenty of money to make a better fema. A governments main responsibility should be to protect and care for its citizens. You dont leave them in the fucking streets to rot and rely on crooked insurance policies that most cannot even afford. Fuck the gulf coast. Disasters can happen anytime, anywhere. I dont care how safe you think your home is, you cannot beat nature.
@airic554 Is what why? Like i said, if the US saves trillions on dollars by ending wars and the drug scam war, we can make a better fema. I have no problem paying to help my fellow Americans through fema, and neither should anyone else. In the end, without fema, the katrina victims would be much worse off. Governments DO NOT leave their citizens to rot in the streets over a natural disaster. Not unless you are North Korea or Iraq. Is that our goal?
@THExHOUND Mitt Romeny say's he would have signed Obama's indefinite detention law......and their both backed by Goldman Sachs......Yet this is who the american people choose to be their leader..... retards is the right word
And in the general hardening of outlook that set in round about 1930, practices which had been long abandoned, in some cases for hundreds of years -- imprisonment without trial, the use of war prisoners as slaves, public executions, torture to extract confessions, the use of hostages, and the deportation of whole populations-not only became common again, but were tolerated and even defended by people who considered themselves enlightened and progressive. ~George Orwell's book, 1984.
FEMA is suppose to help in times of disaster..Where was FEMA when Heraldo Rivera was begging the Gov to release the people stranded on that bridge during hurricane Katrina?
ron paul rejects reality. He doesn't accept evolution and he has labeled climate change a "hoax". Sorry ron but both are well established in the scientific communities. Rather than deny reality why doesn't he come up with support for his positions? It's because there is no reasonable support for those positions. His libertarian philosophy can't handle the truth so he sticks he head in the sand and says "It just can't be true!". Get real rp!
Are you sad because you don't have credible support for your opinion? What do you think I got wrong? Global warming... It's well established science that we humans are warming the planet. Libertarians like ron paul and his son rand want the "free" market to run almost everything. The free market doesn't account for the negative environmental externalities of dumping our waste into the atmosphere as if it were an endless open sewer. Need a link for more info?
@ReduceGHGs There is no such thing as evolution, nor is there such a thing as global warming and or climate change..There is however an awful lot of brainwashed people doing their utmost to destroy this nation..
@PiercedEar Have a look in the mirror for someone that's brainwashed.
Sorry but we have over 150 years of science supporting the fact of evolution. We have over 30 years of climate science confirming the fact that humans now affectg climate. All opinions should be well rooted in critical thinking. Beliefs alone should not be sufficient.
@ReduceGHGs Evolution and global warming are nothing but theory and the opinions or deceptions of mere man!! Facts can change but the truth never changes..We have the word and power of the creator,The Almighty, omnipotent, eternal, God! This world shall pass away but the word of God shall never pass away.
@ReduceGHGs I believe in true science. God is the creator of what we can determine as science and mathematics, fossils, and the moon..The holocaust really happened and seems to be coming again to the USA. Thanks for the suggestion but I am a living soul and there is no need to look into the mirror, I am not the image that i see reflected there..
Beliefs without credible, verifiable, supportive evidence usually come via brainwashing. You've probably been told what to believe for many years and now that is what you believe. But, if you're happy with it, good. Enjoy.
You know I just thought about it- Ron Paul is RIGHT! If you don't want to pay high insurance or pay for damage then you should not build your house in a Hurricane Area! I'm sorry, but 99.999 percent of the country should not be paying for .001 percent of an area's damage.
Time to put insurance and judgement into the people's hands! FEMA gets in the way with the typical "spend money now, ask questions later" policy the Fed is notorious for.
GOD you people are fucking retarded. Claiming someone whose life was wiped out by a catastrophy is a disaster is "lazy". You probably think someone dying of cancel is lazy as well. What a bunch of unAmerican, ignorant, selfish, jackasses we have in this country. Maybe you should get some balls, enlist and serve your country. See if your attitude changes when you are up to your eyeballs in shit trying to rescue someone or just stay alive. Then maybe you will understand what human suffering is.
@6thMessenger I personally do not believe people who are hit by disasters are lazy, they are afflicted and need our help. I am just one that believes I could help a whole lot more if the Gov. was taking from me. Look at how much money has been raised each time a disaster comes along....People are compassionate, they just want the ability to be compassionate without force. When I give, I feel so much more for my fellow brothers and sisters because I participated.
Seriously, have you lost your house, car or anything because your taxes have been SO outrageous? I haven't. This argument you are trying to make is irrelevent. FEMA - is an organization of trained and equiped people. No matter how much you donate or feel bad for someone means jack when you are stranded on a roof in a flood. You want someone in a boat or a helicopter to come save you and your family. Good intention doesn't cut it.
@6thMessenger Actually yes, in the past 3 years since this financial crisis we have lost our house, our car and our businesses, that is another story. First of all, what does FEMA have to do with saving you from a roof top? That is the job of the Coast Guard, police and fire departments. Are you telling me that your neighboring counties that were not hit by the disasters would not be there to aide you? Come on, FEMA the way it currently works is NOT the answer. ....to be continued......
In my State, we had huge forest fires that evacuated a ton of people. Individuals and State Depts from all over our state ran to the rescue of our fellow citizens. Tents, food, clothing and numerous other things were provided by groups from all over our State until they could go back home. So, my point is very relevant...
@6thMessenger I think you need a lesson in economics if you dont think this downturn in the economy has been influenced by taxes.
Also, I think that you have lost hope and faith in the American people to come to the aide of their neighbors. In large scale disasters, the State Gov should have emergency plans and encouraging their citizens to be prepared at a family level. In my church we have you may call a phone tree type system. Last week a mircroburst storm ripped through my neighborhood.
Within 30 minutes neighbors were out checking on each other and helping to remove torn down trees etc. We all had people we were to call and check on to make sure everyone was okay. Within the hour to two hours we were all accounted for and damages assesed and we did not need the Gov. to lead the effort.
@6thMessenger I agree that its hard to put food on the table, especially in todays economy, but my DIL is from DR where they are very poor and those who prepare take a handful of rice from what they buy and they put it aside for emergencies. Buying an extra bag of rice or canned milk or bottle water each time we go to the store adds up. I didn't get those supplies overnight, it took years of sacrifice and planning. The root of this "crap" is unchecked spending and excessive taxation.
@libertybelle2008 continued: My supplies may burn up in a house fire, but it is still my responsibility to do what I can for my family first. Then we go to our extended families and then to our Churches if they can help. The blessing is that when one is down, another can pick up. There have been plenty of times that I have helped when my resources were greater. No one is exempt from the possibility of needing help sometimes.
Exactly. And FEMA is there to help people that can't help themselves and that the city and state can't help.
imagine you lived in one of the suburbs of New Orleans. The levies that were designed to hold back storm surges break and the house that has been in your family for years is now flooded up to the roof. Your moms house near by is too. So is your church. So is the police, fire and hostpital. You are going to pray that help is going to come.
@6thMessenger Yes, the help does come and it did come from all the generous donations that came immediately after it happened. Again, my Church was one of the first on the scene helping and housing people. In Haiti, my DIL family took in people from there....so yes, help does come. Why can't the State help? If they had been preparing for emergencies (especially because they knew about this issue) those poor people would never had to spend days in a football stadium.
The catastrophy was too big for the state to handle. Too many people were displaced, not enough medical, or police, or boats. Communications was recked form the storm. The state didn't have the resources for a disaster of that size. They had been safe from other storm surges due to the levies, but Katrina was so powerful it broke the levies and flooded the whole city.
@6thMessenger I live right by New Orleans and FEMA did more harm then help during the disaster by not only wasting money on a ton of useless crap that was gone in less than a few weeks EX: a bunch of tents, gave us no food (we mostly got food from national guard volunteers), and actually threatened volunteer groups while spending most of the time in the area AROUND New Orleans instead of actually in it, offering food and water to people who loss their homes I'd have to agree with Ron Paul here.
@libertybelle2008 Fantastic about your state. So what was that, about 100 people that were affected?
What about a BIG city like New York with 8 MILLION people? Imagine them being under 20 ft of water. No power. No shelter. No food. Now what? You have a few million tents you can donate?
You think that the next county over can supply food for 8 million? Nope. FEMA isn't for small scale issues. So you are comparing crab apples to water mellons.
Imagine if you will: New York city gets hit with a catagory 4 hurricane. The streets are flooded for miles inland. Power, water, food, medicine... all cut off to the 8 MILLION people that live there. You think your church or your good will is going to help? You think Red Cross alone has the amount of supplies and equipment it would take to shelter and feed 8 million people? No.
If we all lived in small towns, we wouldn't need FEMA, but we don't.
@6thMessenger Now imagine if you will, each State taking the responsibility of emergency preparations for their people. Such as having safe zones from hurricanes where people/families could go in times like hurricanes. The States would be using their tax dollars wisely and storing food supplies and shelters that would be temporary until they could go back home. States cannot organize themselves and prepare for emergencies, is the problem. You should be demanding that your State "Be prepared"
@libertybelle2008 Part Two: Now imagine 8 million people/families who actually take responsibility for themselves and purchase tents, food and first aid supplies for just such emergencies. The problem lies with first the people who expect to be taken care of instead of relying upon themselves to be prepared.
@libertybelle2008 Part 3. I have in my home (even though I have never had to use it) supplies for my family. We have tents, emergency food, sleeping bags, first aid supplies and other things in case of such an emergency. I am not waiting for FEMA to provide those things for me.
Let me approach this from another direction...You say you lost your home and car. According to you, your family should have been prepared for whatever it was the caused that to happen. So what happened? As a result of your carelessness, the bank lost money, your neighbors lost money, my interest rates go up, etc. Who do you blame for your mistake? Did you get help when you lost your house or did you live in your tent?
@6thMessenger I dont need to re-read FEMA..thanks. As a personal story, no I was not careless, typical accusation, In fact we waited 20 years to buy a home. in 2006, 3 months after we bought my husband was forced to start his own first aid business due to his companies unethical practice. Our first aid Business takes care of mostly the construction industry, you figure it out from there. I sold my home because the banks would not talk to me. I moved in with my mom until we could be on our own.
What you went through could have been avoided had you prepared. But instead you lost everything and had to leach off your community and mother. Why did you buy a house that you couldn't afford? Why would your husband jeopardize his family's well being by leaving his regular paycheck and starting a new business in such tough times? What would have happened if all these people that helped your said, "Oh, she is just lazy." "She should have prepared." and didn't help you?
@6thMessenger Really, what I went through could have been avoided? LOL ya I had control over the economy that directly impacted our business at the END of 2006 and beginning of 2007...We did prepare, we had no debt until we bought a house,which we could afford and had to start a business. We had prepared that is why we had food to support ourselves. Second, we should turn to our families first in times of need. Third, I never once said anyone was lazy who needed help.
@libertybelle2008 continued: What I did say, is that FEMA is not the best solution to Emergency Preparedness. Lastly, you have no idea what my family has done. Do I look back and say, wow I wish I had waited to buy a house, yep I sure do, but after 20 years it seemed like the right time because all the forecasts were saying that the housing market was going to go up...Had I listened to RP from the beginning I certainly would not be where I am.
I am sure there is someone out there that would honestly accuse you of that. I am not that person, like I said, I was just making a point, being devil's advocate. I wanted to show you that sometimes you are a victim of circumstance and no amount of prep is going to avoid a large scale catastrophe. You were lucky to have people to help you. What I am saying is that the victims of Katrina are lucky to have the help from FEMA, because the the city and state couldn't handle it.
@6thMessenger I agree, victims of circumstances for sure, no doubt. The thing is that Katrina was actually what turned me against FEMA. I have heard countless stories of families who were hurt by FEMA and their "help" I know a personal account of a man from here who left to go get his mom and what FEMA did to stop him from protecting his supplies and mothers home. So, if their only job was to get shelter, food and supplies from generous donations, but they dont, they take police action as well
Police, national guard, army, marines, etc were ordered to evacuate people for safety. I know some people didn't understand that and were mad. But when your house is floating, you need to leave. So while he is mad, he is still alive, and he may not have been if he stayed.
@6thMessenger actually, his mother's house was in a safer zone and he was trying to get to her so he could get her out. I do not have any issue with those entities doing their job of saving lives by rescuing people, its when they disarmed people whose homes were safe and they had no way to protect themselves, is just one area that I dont believe they had a right to do
Its not my place to question you liberty. Honetly I don't care HOW you got into your bad situation, just making a point. I would help you, even though you are a stranger. If you were in a disaster and even lost your tent, I'd keep you & your family safe because it is the right thing to do. Just as I don't mind contributing a small amount of my money from my paychecks to prepare for potential disasters, whether I need it or YOU need it, it doesnt matter. It's right to do.
@6thMessenger Messenger, the problem is that you assume that you know what was the cause of my circumstances and how I prepared for them and how I handled them. You actually made my point, that Americans are generous! I would also help you at any time. I donate all the time through my church, to humanitarian funds. I know that money is going directly to helping victims rather than to something else. You did not answer the question about States taking responsibility, what do you think of that?
But you aren't being generous by taking away funding or a program that helps people. You are only generous to those who are directly linked to you. FEMA only takes over when the State can't handle the disaster. If you would have read FEMA in Wiki you would have already answered your own question. :p
@6thMessenger Not true. my donations have gone throughout the whole world where ever there has been tragedies. My own sons did Eagle Scout Projects that directly helped the children of Benin Africa and the other made emergency kits that went to stricken areas. These projects were not small in any way. It is my experience that Charities and Foundations can do a much better job at providing help than can a Gov agency filled with bureaucracy. Personally FEMA should be a Charity where you can donat
Oh, as for your situation, I would never really question you. YOu were saying that it's an individual responsibility to prepare... which I do agree. But there are some unforeseen situations that may arise. Like your husbands employment. Like the levies breaking in New Orleans. Like earth quakes, tornados and other natural disasters. Sometimes you have to lean on someone else for help and thats ok.
FEMA is the place for states and cities to lean when they need.
@6thMessenger Agreed, Messenger. Maybe where we split hairs is that I think the States should do a better job of being prepared for emergencies. If they would stop spending money on things that have no value and put it towards their people's safety, I believe the people would be better off.
Amen to that. States and Fed both need to check their spending. I am sure they are spending money in places THEY don't even know about. SO much red tape in gov. It's ridiculous.
The Fed has revamped and restructured FEMA and has been helping state better prepare.
But I don't want to eliminate organizations to help Americans. They need to be structured, streamlined and watched to avoid abuse.
@6thMessenger Maybe that is where we need to turn our focus. Turn to our individual States and find out what they are doing to prepare. How are they spending tax. Maybe those are the questions that should be asked in this upcoming election for our local reps? We live in very turbulent times and we need responsible leaders. I believe that is Ron Paul stance on this issue. If the States/citizens take more responsibility at a local level, there would be very little need for big agencies like FEMA
@6thMessenger Perhaps a better solution would be for government to fix the flaws and corruption in FEMAS system with more organized plans for individual cases so they don't interfere with local rescue efforts
Obviously you have some good ideas...There has been many revised plans already. So in the future, once FEMA is called in I believe they are going to cooridinate all efforts. Which is best really, you can't have a bunch of unorganization during a rescue effort, it just ends up bad.
They have also changed leadership and policy and engaged some checks in the system to curb flaws and corruption.
Respond to this video... continued: The banks did not lose money, another one of your misconceptions. I do have my tent and if I ever need to live in it, then I will. I had a one years supply of food that we lived on until it ran out, then my church helped me until we could be back on our feet. It still is very tight and we are doing the best we can. I just dont happen to believe that FEMA is the best help, sorry if we dont see eye to eye
@6thMessenger actually, yes I know my church and the members themselves would and has helped. I dont think that anyone group can do it alone...even FEMA depends on organizations like my church and Red Cross. That is my point, our states should be responsible for emergency plans and we should as a people be updated frequently on those plans. Remember the Emergency Broadcast System..it should be implemented again
Less class warfare = 2012 presidential candidate, Ron Paul, says he doesn't believe cutting entitlements to the poor is the way to balance the budget. He has GREATER ideas. Check him out! I love how Ron Paul doesn't pit groups against one another. VOTE RON PAUL 2012! I almost fainted last night when Bill OReilly said that Paul's idea of ending FEMA had merit (since FOX tends to ignore Paul).
FEMA has more going on than what meets the eyes. Look at the facts... some AMERICANS have become lazy, Ron Paul isn't being greedy, he actually makes sense on this one. The states would have the resources if the government would allow the state to make some of their own decisions. Do you ever think of what our tax dollars really go to? They go to many of the things that some of us don't even believe in or believe is right. Our government has been failing us because it's morally corrupt.
Yeah sure. Tell the folks from Cape Hatteras and Nags Head that the State has to pay for it. People love to complain about how Lousiana and New Orleans failed to provide disaster relief, and while they should have coordinated with FEMA to get those ppl out, States do not have the resources to handle these situations. Ron Paul is just another greedy asshole who believes in money over helping people.
@shocktrauma85 FEMA actually slows the recovery process because states can't do anything without their OK. FEMA encourages people to live in places prone to natural disasters because they offer insurance to people that could never get private insurance-people expect FEMA to be their ATM in a natural disaster to rebuild in the same place and then we all pay for their risk taking over and over again. FEMA was never intended to help people in natural disasters, it was for defense. Paul is right.
I responded to Katrina as a national guardsman. FEMA were wasting taxpayer dollars. We ate crappy food like soldiers always do, and FEMA were grilling steaks drinking beer in beautiful RV's that were paid for by the taxpayer. We slept in tents and got all the crappy jobs while FEMA made a camping trip of the situation! Ron Paul 2012!!!
@hectorsalinasisback Speaking of which, FEMA's NOLA/Katrina trailers' shoddy construction, molds, & VOC toxins probably hold the record for highest number of RV-related injury & soft-KILLS in history.
FEMA = PURE corporatist nonsense!
The incessant statist delusion of IF Fed.agency__ were eliminated its supposed function would NEVER be provided by ANY entity, is preposterous. What, no hurricanes before FEMA was established in 1979?
Most Americans live in historical amnesia la la land anyway.
I guess if the country is destroyed by natural disasters, Then we're fucked. No where to live, no money to go anywhere if you lose everything, no medic treatment if you get injured, I guess you're left to die. Look at Haiti. NO RACIST RON PAUL 2012!!!
@merkabaradio And there is a thing called not having enough money to afford insurance. Most people don't own a home, and even if they do, half of them don't have insurance. Not everyone is the same, you know.
@RepublicansAreEvilXX If you have a loan out on the house, the loan company usually requires you to have insurance out on the property. If you can't afford it, you probably shouldn't be in the house. If you flat out own the house, you're betting against the idea you'll ever have a natural disaster type situation by not having insurance.
@merkabaradio And as I stated, if you CANNOT AFFORD IT, then you can't. Like I said, Not everybody is the same as you. Everyone is different. I never said myself, so stop referring it to me. I own my home, I pay insurance, I have never taken a loan out for anything. The repairs and upkeep has been out of my pocket. But other people are not so fortunate. Because it is expensive, given to where the location is and how it reflects the value on your property.
@RepublicansAreEvilXX It was a generic 'you' and not specific to you, so don't be so defensive. Most people pay for basic repairs out of pocket, but if a tree falls on the house, there's extensive water damage, or god forbid a tornado destroys the entire structure, its why you're required to have insurance with the loan. If you own your house out right, which most people probably don't, you either pay insurance or are sol. For anywhere around 500-1000 someone can be covered.
@merkabaradio And I'll keep repeating myself on what i said. IF YOU CANNOT AFFORD IT, YOU CANNOT AFFORD IT! NOT EVERYONE IS THE FUCKING SAME, DO YOU UNDERSTAND?!
@RepublicansAreEvilXX If a person can't afford $80 a month for insurance, how are they going to pay for gas, electricity, property taxes and so forth. $20,000 or more in damages out of pocket is a lot harder to cope with than $80 a month. That's why when most people who take a mortgage out to buy a house are required to have insurance, people who opt out of insurance and buy outright are taking a risk/responsibility for damages to their property.
@merkabaradio People can only pay so much. You only included a portion of bills that people pay. Not all, not even counting family expenses, vehicles (I.E. car payments, insurance) You can only pay so much and have so little in a budget. Therefore, IT YOU CANNOT AFFORD HOME INSURANCE, YOU SIMPLY JUST CANNOT AFFORD IT ON A TIGHT BUDGET!
but again, a shelter and food is worth more than any $. Just the $ donated for a tragedy can go to the right place and we will all work together, why not?
He is saying that since the catastrophe doesnt involve him directly, he doesn't want his taxes to be used towards the preperation for disasters.
America is like a big house and we are all brothers and sisters living in the house. We all need to do our part to ensure we have a safe and healthy place to live.
Ron Paul is essentially turning his back on his fellow americans because some tragedy didn't directly affect him...
They aren't being coerced into helping through tax.
Anyone that lives in this country has to put some money into it to reap it's rewards.
For example... I don't happen to need the military right now. Why should my tax dollars support the military? Well, DUH at some point I may need the military to protect my country.
Same with FEMA. You could be directly affected by a earth quake that destroys your town.
@6thMessenger If it's truly in our interest to have these services set up, why not privatize them? Why do we need the government to threaten us with imprisonment if we don't pay up (a condition of both taxation and coercion)?
@6thMessenger Were the people a few miles away to lose their home, I would offer a bed and couch and some food till they could save a few dollars to start over. I'm sure many people would help our own along with red cross. just let the real help ($) go to actually needs it
@casperorchids I commend you for even being willing to do that.
That would totally work on a small scale. But to cover a million people we would need large scale money and resources to be able to save people. No one should be getting their houses rebuilt with FEMA monies, and i dont believe they are, but FEMA should be there to provide aid to anyone during a disaster. Doing away would only make this country unprepared.
@6thMessenger Privatizing something does not mean you start making money from it. Nonprofit corporations and charities are private but they make no profit by definition. The role of FEMA can be done more effectively and with more accountability by private philanthropy. There's a reason that people don't write out checks to the Treasury Department. Private charities operate much more efficiently and effectively. FEMA's budget has tripled last 15 years but it operates worse than ever (ie Katrina)
@Trimbler00 Even operating FEMA as a not for profit private company seems pretty unrealistic just given the resistance to some people paying a small tax. Why would they contribute to a private company?
There has been many changes to FEMA since Katrina. Most if not all of the staffing and leadership, and it's accountability have changed drastically. Whether it will work better or not next time remains to be seen.
@6thMessenger People resist federal taxes because they know about half of every dollar is going to pointless wars all over the world and even the part that ends up in FEMA will be lost to fraud thanks to the unaccountability of every public agency so FEMA would go to the Fed to make up for the shortfall and create inflation. And nonetheless we are forced to either pay the tax or face imprisonment.
Generally people don't know where any of their taxes go.
The reason we the people don't have a choice on paying taxes is that no one would pay taxes, and the country would collapse. Personally I like having a safe and free country and dont mind paying a few taxes to support it.
Just feel lucky you don't live in Canada or France or England. They take a huge amount of taxes out of your paycheck.
@6thMessenger You know, I'm not a Paul supporter, not by a long shot, but privatizing disaster relief could be a good idea. What the solution might be is to have the government contract out private companies to do the job.
@6thMessenger The government, of course. I think the black budget wouldn't apply to this though. They would have to contract out multiple companies in order to accomplish something. Privatizing may or may not reduce what is spent on FEMA. I think health is about 5% of the budget. It could save money if they hire good companies.And yes, they can act fiscally irresponsible, both the government and the private company, because guess what, they are run by PEOPLE. The fatal flaw in anything lol
The answer is the Fed would still be paying out money to the lowest bidder. Do you think privatizing would reduce what is spent on FEMA? It's not like a private company would act fiscally irresponsible, right?
LOL
I think if the Fed needs to spend our money I want some tight reigns on it so we can see where the money goes.
Listen to Ron a bit more - I bet you could find yourself as a supporter if you give him a chance :)FEMA's a scam - we had a torndao here recently . I persoanlly know 5 people I work with who were impacted . They had people lining up in droves pretending to be victims ,getting vouchers , food stamps , hotel lodging , cars , tons of stuff . A ton of fraud -a few made the news and prosecuted . They were not checking a thing - just handing stuff out like candy. what a joke
@doogleandalix I know Ive changed my point of view... I used to work for FEMA. Great people, but the system is not efficient. What we need to do is privatize disaster relief.
Not quite right - why should a person making mim.wage foot the bill for some fat cat having a house on the ocean ? That is why the ins rates are so high . your idea of us all being brothers and sisters sounds good , but is not reality . There will always be people who volunteer but not everyone should foot the bill for others . That is why people are mandated to buy flood ins. should they CHOOSE to buy a house in a flood district . Their choice , their money .
1. Many of the houses that were destroyed were in low income neighborhoods. Houses of families that have been there for generations. Many of them can barely take care of themselves, let alone buy additional insurance, there would be no way financially they could move. They weren't rich folk living in million $ sea side mansions.
2. FEMA's role is not to rebuild homes, Ron Paul would have you think they are, but
I see your point but I also see Ron Paul's point . As I said below, we had a tornado here recently and FEMA was pretty lax in handing out vouchers, food stamps, hotel lodging chits, etc. Anyone in line who said they lived in that neighborhood pretty much got assistance without any proof . Also , my state and possibly all have their own state emergency aid so these people collected twice . Two were 4 mos.late on mortgage and now have new houses ,made $ on the deal.
FEMA needs some tweeking. But, lax or not, they were still there to help those who needed it.
Collecting aid after you lose your house in a natural disaster is hardly making $.
Ron Pauls point is... Why should he have to contribute to the greater good if the tragedy doesn't affect him? He is selfish, therefore would make a horrible leader for the USA.
I'll have to check, but I am pretty sure Renters and Home owners insurance doesn't provide food, water and shelter after your entire city has been wiped off the map. But FEMA will.
@6thMessenger The point is if you are going to live on an island, on the shore, on the banks of a river or stream, you're going to get flooded. They reap the benefits of living by the water, but why are all taxpayers required to pay for the risks? And FEMA doesn't work-there's inefficiency and fraud on a massive scale, nothing but red tape and mounds of paperwork. If you're waiting on the Fed govt to save you-you'll be waiting a long, long time.
Its easy to judge them sitting in your chair watching the news from 1600 miles away. This wasn't a rich person that lost a mansion. These were 100,000's of poor people living in and around a city whose house and entire city were literally washed away by 20 ft of flood water. Whose lives depended on shipping, fishing, wareshousing, tourism as it had for generations. People that had been told that the levies would hold back tidal surges. But the levies failed and their lives washed away
@6thMessenger Actually, it is more like Church Organizations, Red Cross etc that come in and help with that. If Americans were allowed to keep more of their money through less taxation, Americans would be in a better position to give more. How did Americans get along before FEMA? The people gave generously to help their fellow Americans.
Where do you think a local church is going to stick 100,000 plus people that need food, water and shelter? They aren't. The local church and parishners are going to be suffering as well. The Red Cross and FEMA work together in cases of mass care and emergency support. Bottom line, there are just some disasters that are so big they can't be handled by volunteers.
The national response plan needed to change as the population has grown. We need FEMA.
@6thMessenger Well, I actually belong to a Church that is world wide, that does send a lot of food and supplies for that many people. We do it quietly because we are not doing it to be recognized, we do it because we love our brothers and sisters. I have personally participated many times in preparing emergency kits, etc. if you want to know more about this humanitarian effort you can visit. LDS.org and look under humanitarian.
Great. Do they have a fleet of helicopters they can fly supplies in with? Because you know, the airport and post offices are closed when they are under 20 ft of water.
@6thMessenger who do you think subsidizes the national flood insurance program? The tooth fairy? FEMA does not work-he's not saying that people shouldn't be helped-he's just saying that the Fed govt does a very bad job of it-like most things the Fed govt does.
@tmh2939 NO. THE POINT IS, no matter where you live there can be a massive catastophic disaster. If we are unprepared to handle such a disaster hundreds of thousands of people could die. Tax payers all over the country pay into the FEMA "insurance plan" because it CAN happen to you. IF it does, a federally funded and trained person is going to come rescue your terrified, hungry, crying, selfish ass from the catastrophe.
As far as management, agreed. Gov as a whole needs to improve.
@6thMessenger You are not listening to what he is saying-FEMA didn't even exist until the late 1970s, and even then only played a very minor role in natural disasters. then it became politicized with Clinton, Bush & Katrina. People managed before then. It amazes me how quickly a Fed agency or program can become something we "just can't do without" once it takes hold.Our country is bankrupt, FEMA is broke and it's just another inept, expensive Fed. govt agency that doesn't work that people hate.
@6thMessenger Knowing now that FEMA will provide money to someone who lives on the coast when a hurricane happens doesn't encourage more people to live in danger zones? Are you crazy??
You are mental. Do you have any desire to live in New Orleans after seeing the destruction there? I sure as hell don't. I have been there before and no amount of federal, state or divine aid would make me want to live any where near the gulf coast on a good day.
You'd have to be a seriously mentally sick and ignorant individual to be encouraged to move to the gulf *because* of FEMA. Many of the people that did and do live there have been there for generations.
You know why people live in New Orleans right? You act like living there is a privilege and you don't want to pay for people's privilege. It's not because everyone gets ocean from mansions.
There is a lot of work to be found there in oil, shipping, fishing, etc. It's not like living on the coast in Cali. It is crowded, hot, dirty, and dangerous. But it has been a hub of commerce for centuries.
Believe me - these people made $. A house assessed at $70,000 , you are 4 mos in arrears and you are insured for $150,000 plus another $100,000 for contents -via private homeowners ins. They ALSO got FEMA aid , and the state version of Fema, MEMA .They pocketed a TON of $ - Ron Paul's point is that it should be up to the states to have such agencies in place - not duplication and Federal bloat.I don't want to give my tax dollars so lazy people don't have to work,do you
Just recently FEMA was asking for money to be returned by Katrina Victims..(they are evil) evil like Dick Cheney and the rest of the Shadow Government.
@ryanshaunkelly Would you truthers please stop using RP as a spokesman. You're gonna KILL his chances on the national stage with all this shit. Please quit until we see how far this guy can go in a world of corporate media.
Hey Ron Paul is right! Why pay any taxes at all? How about we all just take care of ourselves? Screw everyone else.
My election predicition for Ron Paul = FAIL
When there is a catastrophic emergency rule of law changes. If we didn't have FEMA how many more dead peope would we have had from Katrina? Hundreds? Thousands? how many without homes or shelter of any kind? How many without food? To take an isolationist stance in an emergency is selfish and wrong.
@6thMessenger He said nothing about stopping taxation. He never said anything about "just taking care of ourselves." You're putting your own words in his mouth.
Strawman argument with absolutely no base in reality. The private charities and churches would have done a much better job with Katrina - namely in that they wouldn't have turned away help from Red Cross and Wal-Mart, and they wouldn't have pushed an agenda to disarm families trying to defend their homes and property.
According to Ron Paul's statements, his attitude is essentially, it's not his problem since it doesn't affect him, so why bother? If he's never had a car accident, why pay car insurance? Because the one time you need it, you will have it. Thats why.
Private churches and charities could in no way respond to helping 1 million people. They don't have the staffing, resources, leadership, etc. It's a wonderful fairytale land you live in, but it's not reality.
@6thMessenger Man, you're arguments are so weak it's not even worth my time. If this is the best you can come up with, it only serves as further evidence why democracy has failed and aristocracy has taken its place.
@6thMessenger Riiiiight.... and forcing every citizen to pay for such an agency through taxation is NOT selfish, and NOT wrong? Do you even understand how a volunteer group not on the federal payroll would most likely be larger in size, less costly, and far more efficient at saving lives than anything a government can offer? Do you really think that when FEMA is eliminated, there will be no private / charity groups who pop up all across the country and take their place, funded through donations?
@mit26chell The average overhead of a private charity organization is between 15-20%. The average overhead for a government welfare program is 70-85% overhead.
And please, folks, don't bring up Medicare/Medicaid. I'll blow that nonsense argument to shreds.
@6thMessenger Dn't use Katrina as an example FEMA fail was EPIC....and just for the record more people are helped every year by volunteer groups than by FEMA, Fact!
FEMA wasn't perfect for Kratina but that was their largest catastrophe that they have had to respond to yet.
Volunteers help more people than FEMA each year?? That is an irrelevent "fact". Volunteer groups are active daily. FEMA is active only for catastrophic events.
Who would lead enough volunteers to help 1 million people? Where would you get enough resources to house and feed 1 million people? It would be anarchy.
@6thMessenger What most people fail to realize is that when our country goes bankrupt, No FEMA, No Welfare, No Social Security, Nada... we have to change things, Ron Paul is the man, it will not be easy, there will be suffering, but it wont last forever... but you will be free RON PAUL 2012
@6thMessenger Talking to ideologues is pointless. They don't care about practical realities. If people suffer, they call it 'freedom'. With rightwing libertarianism, you are free to be poor & homeless, you are free to be sick & starve to death, you are free to be powerless & disenfranchised. As an ideology of privileged white males, right-libertarianism only cares about freedom from & not freedom toward.
@mrmailmandudebro Yes, they are ideologies. Every fucking thing is an ideology, you moron. However, rightwing libertarianism and voluntarism are ideologies that are based in unproven utopian ideals.
Fuck this guy. If he is going to do things like end the war on drugs and bring all troops home then this country would have plenty of money to make a better fema. A governments main responsibility should be to protect and care for its citizens. You dont leave them in the fucking streets to rot and rely on crooked insurance policies that most cannot even afford. Fuck the gulf coast. Disasters can happen anytime, anywhere. I dont care how safe you think your home is, you cannot beat nature.
JabberCT 1 month ago
@JabberCT LOL yeah. is that why thousands of katrina victims got sick in trailers given by fema, and THEN asked to REPAY them back? fuck off haha
airic554 1 month ago
@airic554 Is what why? Like i said, if the US saves trillions on dollars by ending wars and the drug scam war, we can make a better fema. I have no problem paying to help my fellow Americans through fema, and neither should anyone else. In the end, without fema, the katrina victims would be much worse off. Governments DO NOT leave their citizens to rot in the streets over a natural disaster. Not unless you are North Korea or Iraq. Is that our goal?
JabberCT 4 weeks ago
ron paul is the fucking man. too bad those retards are already voting for popularity and for mit romneys bitch ass.
THExHOUND 1 month ago
@THExHOUND Mitt Romeny say's he would have signed Obama's indefinite detention law......and their both backed by Goldman Sachs......Yet this is who the american people choose to be their leader..... retards is the right word
VictoryReef2012 3 weeks ago
And in the general hardening of outlook that set in round about 1930, practices which had been long abandoned, in some cases for hundreds of years -- imprisonment without trial, the use of war prisoners as slaves, public executions, torture to extract confessions, the use of hostages, and the deportation of whole populations-not only became common again, but were tolerated and even defended by people who considered themselves enlightened and progressive. ~George Orwell's book, 1984.
OmnusRubenn 1 month ago
"WAR is PEACE
FREEDOM is SLAVERY
IGNORANCE is STRENGTH" ~1984, George Orwell
How can we have PEACE from terrorists in our country when we start undeclared WARs in the middle-east, promoting hate?
How can we have FREEDOM when we must defer to the government in SLAVERY and reduction of our rights for our peace and safety?
How can we be STRONG as a people, when we are kept in divisive IGNORANCE by propaganda?
Vote Ron Paul 2012
*Feel free to copy and paste this comment in its entirety*
OmnusRubenn 1 month ago
FEMA is suppose to help in times of disaster..Where was FEMA when Heraldo Rivera was begging the Gov to release the people stranded on that bridge during hurricane Katrina?
PiercedEar 1 month ago
FEMA CAMPS is scary shit
if NDAA!! passes we could be sent to them.. gulp
Ron Paul voted against this bill.. but he was in the minority
DarkprinX2500 2 months ago
@DarkprinX2500 He didn't vote on the bill at all.
misterdirtyharry 1 month ago
@misterdirtyharry that counts as a no
DarkprinX2500 1 month ago
FEMA is taking away our liberty. Anyone who doesn't know what FEMA is really about should look it up. Wake up people!
aprairiemorning 2 months ago
ron paul rejects reality. He doesn't accept evolution and he has labeled climate change a "hoax". Sorry ron but both are well established in the scientific communities. Rather than deny reality why doesn't he come up with support for his positions? It's because there is no reasonable support for those positions. His libertarian philosophy can't handle the truth so he sticks he head in the sand and says "It just can't be true!". Get real rp!
ReduceGHGs 5 months ago
@ReduceGHGs Your misconception of "Global warming", libertarian philosophy and Ron Paul are saddening.
MrFireballbren 4 months ago
@MrFireballbren .
Are you sad because you don't have credible support for your opinion? What do you think I got wrong? Global warming... It's well established science that we humans are warming the planet. Libertarians like ron paul and his son rand want the "free" market to run almost everything. The free market doesn't account for the negative environmental externalities of dumping our waste into the atmosphere as if it were an endless open sewer. Need a link for more info?
ReduceGHGs 4 months ago
@ReduceGHGs There is no such thing as evolution, nor is there such a thing as global warming and or climate change..There is however an awful lot of brainwashed people doing their utmost to destroy this nation..
PiercedEar 1 month ago
@PiercedEar Have a look in the mirror for someone that's brainwashed.
Sorry but we have over 150 years of science supporting the fact of evolution. We have over 30 years of climate science confirming the fact that humans now affectg climate. All opinions should be well rooted in critical thinking. Beliefs alone should not be sufficient.
ReduceGHGs 1 month ago
Comment removed
PiercedEar 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@ReduceGHGs Evolution and global warming are nothing but theory and the opinions or deceptions of mere man!! Facts can change but the truth never changes..We have the word and power of the creator,The Almighty, omnipotent, eternal, God! This world shall pass away but the word of God shall never pass away.
PiercedEar 1 month ago
@PiercedEar .
What else isn't part of your reality? Moon landings? The Holocaust? Fossils? Mathematics?
Get real. Have a look at one of those brainwashed people in your mirror.
ReduceGHGs 1 month ago
@ReduceGHGs I believe in true science. God is the creator of what we can determine as science and mathematics, fossils, and the moon..The holocaust really happened and seems to be coming again to the USA. Thanks for the suggestion but I am a living soul and there is no need to look into the mirror, I am not the image that i see reflected there..
PiercedEar 1 month ago
@PiercedEar .
Beliefs without credible, verifiable, supportive evidence usually come via brainwashing. You've probably been told what to believe for many years and now that is what you believe. But, if you're happy with it, good. Enjoy.
ReduceGHGs 1 month ago
@ReduceGHGs Back at ya!
PiercedEar 1 month ago
You know I just thought about it- Ron Paul is RIGHT! If you don't want to pay high insurance or pay for damage then you should not build your house in a Hurricane Area! I'm sorry, but 99.999 percent of the country should not be paying for .001 percent of an area's damage.
Time to put insurance and judgement into the people's hands! FEMA gets in the way with the typical "spend money now, ask questions later" policy the Fed is notorious for.
nbarile18 5 months ago
GOD you people are fucking retarded. Claiming someone whose life was wiped out by a catastrophy is a disaster is "lazy". You probably think someone dying of cancel is lazy as well. What a bunch of unAmerican, ignorant, selfish, jackasses we have in this country. Maybe you should get some balls, enlist and serve your country. See if your attitude changes when you are up to your eyeballs in shit trying to rescue someone or just stay alive. Then maybe you will understand what human suffering is.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger I personally do not believe people who are hit by disasters are lazy, they are afflicted and need our help. I am just one that believes I could help a whole lot more if the Gov. was taking from me. Look at how much money has been raised each time a disaster comes along....People are compassionate, they just want the ability to be compassionate without force. When I give, I feel so much more for my fellow brothers and sisters because I participated.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
Seriously, have you lost your house, car or anything because your taxes have been SO outrageous? I haven't. This argument you are trying to make is irrelevent. FEMA - is an organization of trained and equiped people. No matter how much you donate or feel bad for someone means jack when you are stranded on a roof in a flood. You want someone in a boat or a helicopter to come save you and your family. Good intention doesn't cut it.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Actually yes, in the past 3 years since this financial crisis we have lost our house, our car and our businesses, that is another story. First of all, what does FEMA have to do with saving you from a roof top? That is the job of the Coast Guard, police and fire departments. Are you telling me that your neighboring counties that were not hit by the disasters would not be there to aide you? Come on, FEMA the way it currently works is NOT the answer. ....to be continued......
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008 part two.
In my State, we had huge forest fires that evacuated a ton of people. Individuals and State Depts from all over our state ran to the rescue of our fellow citizens. Tents, food, clothing and numerous other things were provided by groups from all over our State until they could go back home. So, my point is very relevant...
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
Come on... that wasnt' due to taxes.
FEMA has the equipment, personel and training to be able to help people during and after a catastrophy.
Why don't you Wikipedia FEMA?
In a large scale disaster someone has to be in charge to coordinate the rescue and repair efforts.
The coast guard isnt' staffed or funded or equiped or trained to handle large scale disaster either.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger I think you need a lesson in economics if you dont think this downturn in the economy has been influenced by taxes.
Also, I think that you have lost hope and faith in the American people to come to the aide of their neighbors. In large scale disasters, the State Gov should have emergency plans and encouraging their citizens to be prepared at a family level. In my church we have you may call a phone tree type system. Last week a mircroburst storm ripped through my neighborhood.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008 part two...
Within 30 minutes neighbors were out checking on each other and helping to remove torn down trees etc. We all had people we were to call and check on to make sure everyone was okay. Within the hour to two hours we were all accounted for and damages assesed and we did not need the Gov. to lead the effort.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
First: Not everyone can put food on the table everyday, let alone buy extra supplies.
Second: your supplies are no good if they are burnt to a crisp or under water or you have no land to pitch a tent.
Third: The root of this crap economy was unchecked spending and tax cuts.
4th: You are all about prep...FEMA is prep for large scale disaster.
5th: People don't sit back and wait for FEMA to help. Watch this: watch?v=Duz-2v1Omvc
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger I agree that its hard to put food on the table, especially in todays economy, but my DIL is from DR where they are very poor and those who prepare take a handful of rice from what they buy and they put it aside for emergencies. Buying an extra bag of rice or canned milk or bottle water each time we go to the store adds up. I didn't get those supplies overnight, it took years of sacrifice and planning. The root of this "crap" is unchecked spending and excessive taxation.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008 continued: My supplies may burn up in a house fire, but it is still my responsibility to do what I can for my family first. Then we go to our extended families and then to our Churches if they can help. The blessing is that when one is down, another can pick up. There have been plenty of times that I have helped when my resources were greater. No one is exempt from the possibility of needing help sometimes.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
Exactly. And FEMA is there to help people that can't help themselves and that the city and state can't help.
imagine you lived in one of the suburbs of New Orleans. The levies that were designed to hold back storm surges break and the house that has been in your family for years is now flooded up to the roof. Your moms house near by is too. So is your church. So is the police, fire and hostpital. You are going to pray that help is going to come.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Yes, the help does come and it did come from all the generous donations that came immediately after it happened. Again, my Church was one of the first on the scene helping and housing people. In Haiti, my DIL family took in people from there....so yes, help does come. Why can't the State help? If they had been preparing for emergencies (especially because they knew about this issue) those poor people would never had to spend days in a football stadium.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
The catastrophy was too big for the state to handle. Too many people were displaced, not enough medical, or police, or boats. Communications was recked form the storm. The state didn't have the resources for a disaster of that size. They had been safe from other storm surges due to the levies, but Katrina was so powerful it broke the levies and flooded the whole city.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Yes, it truly brings me to tears thinking of it. Didn't you say you were in Katrina? How did you survive?
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@6thMessenger I live right by New Orleans and FEMA did more harm then help during the disaster by not only wasting money on a ton of useless crap that was gone in less than a few weeks EX: a bunch of tents, gave us no food (we mostly got food from national guard volunteers), and actually threatened volunteer groups while spending most of the time in the area AROUND New Orleans instead of actually in it, offering food and water to people who loss their homes I'd have to agree with Ron Paul here.
limbylooms 4 months ago
@libertybelle2008 Fantastic about your state. So what was that, about 100 people that were affected?
What about a BIG city like New York with 8 MILLION people? Imagine them being under 20 ft of water. No power. No shelter. No food. Now what? You have a few million tents you can donate?
You think that the next county over can supply food for 8 million? Nope. FEMA isn't for small scale issues. So you are comparing crab apples to water mellons.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
Imagine if you will: New York city gets hit with a catagory 4 hurricane. The streets are flooded for miles inland. Power, water, food, medicine... all cut off to the 8 MILLION people that live there. You think your church or your good will is going to help? You think Red Cross alone has the amount of supplies and equipment it would take to shelter and feed 8 million people? No.
If we all lived in small towns, we wouldn't need FEMA, but we don't.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Now imagine if you will, each State taking the responsibility of emergency preparations for their people. Such as having safe zones from hurricanes where people/families could go in times like hurricanes. The States would be using their tax dollars wisely and storing food supplies and shelters that would be temporary until they could go back home. States cannot organize themselves and prepare for emergencies, is the problem. You should be demanding that your State "Be prepared"
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008 Part Two: Now imagine 8 million people/families who actually take responsibility for themselves and purchase tents, food and first aid supplies for just such emergencies. The problem lies with first the people who expect to be taken care of instead of relying upon themselves to be prepared.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008 Part 3. I have in my home (even though I have never had to use it) supplies for my family. We have tents, emergency food, sleeping bags, first aid supplies and other things in case of such an emergency. I am not waiting for FEMA to provide those things for me.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
You didn't wiki FEMA did you? tsk tsk.
Let me approach this from another direction...You say you lost your home and car. According to you, your family should have been prepared for whatever it was the caused that to happen. So what happened? As a result of your carelessness, the bank lost money, your neighbors lost money, my interest rates go up, etc. Who do you blame for your mistake? Did you get help when you lost your house or did you live in your tent?
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger I dont need to re-read FEMA..thanks. As a personal story, no I was not careless, typical accusation, In fact we waited 20 years to buy a home. in 2006, 3 months after we bought my husband was forced to start his own first aid business due to his companies unethical practice. Our first aid Business takes care of mostly the construction industry, you figure it out from there. I sold my home because the banks would not talk to me. I moved in with my mom until we could be on our own.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
What you went through could have been avoided had you prepared. But instead you lost everything and had to leach off your community and mother. Why did you buy a house that you couldn't afford? Why would your husband jeopardize his family's well being by leaving his regular paycheck and starting a new business in such tough times? What would have happened if all these people that helped your said, "Oh, she is just lazy." "She should have prepared." and didn't help you?
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Really, what I went through could have been avoided? LOL ya I had control over the economy that directly impacted our business at the END of 2006 and beginning of 2007...We did prepare, we had no debt until we bought a house,which we could afford and had to start a business. We had prepared that is why we had food to support ourselves. Second, we should turn to our families first in times of need. Third, I never once said anyone was lazy who needed help.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008 continued: What I did say, is that FEMA is not the best solution to Emergency Preparedness. Lastly, you have no idea what my family has done. Do I look back and say, wow I wish I had waited to buy a house, yep I sure do, but after 20 years it seemed like the right time because all the forecasts were saying that the housing market was going to go up...Had I listened to RP from the beginning I certainly would not be where I am.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
I am sure there is someone out there that would honestly accuse you of that. I am not that person, like I said, I was just making a point, being devil's advocate. I wanted to show you that sometimes you are a victim of circumstance and no amount of prep is going to avoid a large scale catastrophe. You were lucky to have people to help you. What I am saying is that the victims of Katrina are lucky to have the help from FEMA, because the the city and state couldn't handle it.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger I agree, victims of circumstances for sure, no doubt. The thing is that Katrina was actually what turned me against FEMA. I have heard countless stories of families who were hurt by FEMA and their "help" I know a personal account of a man from here who left to go get his mom and what FEMA did to stop him from protecting his supplies and mothers home. So, if their only job was to get shelter, food and supplies from generous donations, but they dont, they take police action as well
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
Police, national guard, army, marines, etc were ordered to evacuate people for safety. I know some people didn't understand that and were mad. But when your house is floating, you need to leave. So while he is mad, he is still alive, and he may not have been if he stayed.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger actually, his mother's house was in a safer zone and he was trying to get to her so he could get her out. I do not have any issue with those entities doing their job of saving lives by rescuing people, its when they disarmed people whose homes were safe and they had no way to protect themselves, is just one area that I dont believe they had a right to do
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
Its not my place to question you liberty. Honetly I don't care HOW you got into your bad situation, just making a point. I would help you, even though you are a stranger. If you were in a disaster and even lost your tent, I'd keep you & your family safe because it is the right thing to do. Just as I don't mind contributing a small amount of my money from my paychecks to prepare for potential disasters, whether I need it or YOU need it, it doesnt matter. It's right to do.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Messenger, the problem is that you assume that you know what was the cause of my circumstances and how I prepared for them and how I handled them. You actually made my point, that Americans are generous! I would also help you at any time. I donate all the time through my church, to humanitarian funds. I know that money is going directly to helping victims rather than to something else. You did not answer the question about States taking responsibility, what do you think of that?
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
But you aren't being generous by taking away funding or a program that helps people. You are only generous to those who are directly linked to you. FEMA only takes over when the State can't handle the disaster. If you would have read FEMA in Wiki you would have already answered your own question. :p
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Not true. my donations have gone throughout the whole world where ever there has been tragedies. My own sons did Eagle Scout Projects that directly helped the children of Benin Africa and the other made emergency kits that went to stricken areas. These projects were not small in any way. It is my experience that Charities and Foundations can do a much better job at providing help than can a Gov agency filled with bureaucracy. Personally FEMA should be a Charity where you can donat
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
Oh, as for your situation, I would never really question you. YOu were saying that it's an individual responsibility to prepare... which I do agree. But there are some unforeseen situations that may arise. Like your husbands employment. Like the levies breaking in New Orleans. Like earth quakes, tornados and other natural disasters. Sometimes you have to lean on someone else for help and thats ok.
FEMA is the place for states and cities to lean when they need.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Agreed, Messenger. Maybe where we split hairs is that I think the States should do a better job of being prepared for emergencies. If they would stop spending money on things that have no value and put it towards their people's safety, I believe the people would be better off.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
Amen to that. States and Fed both need to check their spending. I am sure they are spending money in places THEY don't even know about. SO much red tape in gov. It's ridiculous.
The Fed has revamped and restructured FEMA and has been helping state better prepare.
But I don't want to eliminate organizations to help Americans. They need to be structured, streamlined and watched to avoid abuse.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Maybe that is where we need to turn our focus. Turn to our individual States and find out what they are doing to prepare. How are they spending tax. Maybe those are the questions that should be asked in this upcoming election for our local reps? We live in very turbulent times and we need responsible leaders. I believe that is Ron Paul stance on this issue. If the States/citizens take more responsibility at a local level, there would be very little need for big agencies like FEMA
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Perhaps a better solution would be for government to fix the flaws and corruption in FEMAS system with more organized plans for individual cases so they don't interfere with local rescue efforts
limbylooms 4 months ago
@limbylooms
Obviously you have some good ideas...There has been many revised plans already. So in the future, once FEMA is called in I believe they are going to cooridinate all efforts. Which is best really, you can't have a bunch of unorganization during a rescue effort, it just ends up bad.
They have also changed leadership and policy and engaged some checks in the system to curb flaws and corruption.
6thMessenger 4 months ago
Respond to this video... continued: The banks did not lose money, another one of your misconceptions. I do have my tent and if I ever need to live in it, then I will. I had a one years supply of food that we lived on until it ran out, then my church helped me until we could be back on our feet. It still is very tight and we are doing the best we can. I just dont happen to believe that FEMA is the best help, sorry if we dont see eye to eye
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@6thMessenger actually, yes I know my church and the members themselves would and has helped. I dont think that anyone group can do it alone...even FEMA depends on organizations like my church and Red Cross. That is my point, our states should be responsible for emergency plans and we should as a people be updated frequently on those plans. Remember the Emergency Broadcast System..it should be implemented again
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
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Less class warfare = 2012 presidential candidate, Ron Paul, says he doesn't believe cutting entitlements to the poor is the way to balance the budget. He has GREATER ideas. Check him out! I love how Ron Paul doesn't pit groups against one another. VOTE RON PAUL 2012! I almost fainted last night when Bill OReilly said that Paul's idea of ending FEMA had merit (since FOX tends to ignore Paul).
vechorik 5 months ago
FEMA has more going on than what meets the eyes. Look at the facts... some AMERICANS have become lazy, Ron Paul isn't being greedy, he actually makes sense on this one. The states would have the resources if the government would allow the state to make some of their own decisions. Do you ever think of what our tax dollars really go to? They go to many of the things that some of us don't even believe in or believe is right. Our government has been failing us because it's morally corrupt.
wac070486 5 months ago
Yeah sure. Tell the folks from Cape Hatteras and Nags Head that the State has to pay for it. People love to complain about how Lousiana and New Orleans failed to provide disaster relief, and while they should have coordinated with FEMA to get those ppl out, States do not have the resources to handle these situations. Ron Paul is just another greedy asshole who believes in money over helping people.
shocktrauma85 6 months ago
@shocktrauma85 FEMA actually slows the recovery process because states can't do anything without their OK. FEMA encourages people to live in places prone to natural disasters because they offer insurance to people that could never get private insurance-people expect FEMA to be their ATM in a natural disaster to rebuild in the same place and then we all pay for their risk taking over and over again. FEMA was never intended to help people in natural disasters, it was for defense. Paul is right.
tmh2939 5 months ago
hector- do you have any proof that FEMA did the things that you allege?
bruhnrw 6 months ago
I responded to Katrina as a national guardsman. FEMA were wasting taxpayer dollars. We ate crappy food like soldiers always do, and FEMA were grilling steaks drinking beer in beautiful RV's that were paid for by the taxpayer. We slept in tents and got all the crappy jobs while FEMA made a camping trip of the situation! Ron Paul 2012!!!
hectorsalinasisback 6 months ago 6
@hectorsalinasisback Speaking of which, FEMA's NOLA/Katrina trailers' shoddy construction, molds, & VOC toxins probably hold the record for highest number of RV-related injury & soft-KILLS in history.
FEMA = PURE corporatist nonsense!
The incessant statist delusion of IF Fed.agency__ were eliminated its supposed function would NEVER be provided by ANY entity, is preposterous. What, no hurricanes before FEMA was established in 1979?
Most Americans live in historical amnesia la la land anyway.
RosenKrantz666 6 months ago
@hectorsalinasisback lies
RyanNHoang 2 months ago
At first I was shocked. Why abolish FEMA? But , after listened to Ron Paul's explanation, I turn to support his idea.
getyourhappy 6 months ago
I guess if the country is destroyed by natural disasters, Then we're fucked. No where to live, no money to go anywhere if you lose everything, no medic treatment if you get injured, I guess you're left to die. Look at Haiti. NO RACIST RON PAUL 2012!!!
OBAMA 2012!!!
RepublicansAreEvilXX 8 months ago
@RepublicansAreEvilXX Disagree with obama and you are a racist... you sir are an ignorant tool.
jsu401 8 months ago
@jsu401 will be a homeless bum when his/her house is destroyed, please do not pity this retard. for they are ignorant and dumb-fucked.
RepublicansAreEvilXX 8 months ago
@RepublicansAreEvilXX There's this thing called homeowners insurance, and you're obligated to have it if you own your own home in most states.
merkabaradio 8 months ago
@merkabaradio And there is a thing called not having enough money to afford insurance. Most people don't own a home, and even if they do, half of them don't have insurance. Not everyone is the same, you know.
RepublicansAreEvilXX 8 months ago
@RepublicansAreEvilXX If you have a loan out on the house, the loan company usually requires you to have insurance out on the property. If you can't afford it, you probably shouldn't be in the house. If you flat out own the house, you're betting against the idea you'll ever have a natural disaster type situation by not having insurance.
merkabaradio 8 months ago
@merkabaradio And as I stated, if you CANNOT AFFORD IT, then you can't. Like I said, Not everybody is the same as you. Everyone is different. I never said myself, so stop referring it to me. I own my home, I pay insurance, I have never taken a loan out for anything. The repairs and upkeep has been out of my pocket. But other people are not so fortunate. Because it is expensive, given to where the location is and how it reflects the value on your property.
RepublicansAreEvilXX 8 months ago
@RepublicansAreEvilXX It was a generic 'you' and not specific to you, so don't be so defensive. Most people pay for basic repairs out of pocket, but if a tree falls on the house, there's extensive water damage, or god forbid a tornado destroys the entire structure, its why you're required to have insurance with the loan. If you own your house out right, which most people probably don't, you either pay insurance or are sol. For anywhere around 500-1000 someone can be covered.
merkabaradio 8 months ago
@merkabaradio And I'll keep repeating myself on what i said. IF YOU CANNOT AFFORD IT, YOU CANNOT AFFORD IT! NOT EVERYONE IS THE FUCKING SAME, DO YOU UNDERSTAND?!
RepublicansAreEvilXX 8 months ago
@RepublicansAreEvilXX If a person can't afford $80 a month for insurance, how are they going to pay for gas, electricity, property taxes and so forth. $20,000 or more in damages out of pocket is a lot harder to cope with than $80 a month. That's why when most people who take a mortgage out to buy a house are required to have insurance, people who opt out of insurance and buy outright are taking a risk/responsibility for damages to their property.
merkabaradio 8 months ago
@merkabaradio People can only pay so much. You only included a portion of bills that people pay. Not all, not even counting family expenses, vehicles (I.E. car payments, insurance) You can only pay so much and have so little in a budget. Therefore, IT YOU CANNOT AFFORD HOME INSURANCE, YOU SIMPLY JUST CANNOT AFFORD IT ON A TIGHT BUDGET!
RepublicansAreEvilXX 8 months ago
but again, a shelter and food is worth more than any $. Just the $ donated for a tragedy can go to the right place and we will all work together, why not?
casperorchids 9 months ago
Why do we even need FEMA when we have the American Red Cross that not only is able to handle a situation like this but can handle it better?
airondee 9 months ago
He makes a fucking valid point.
IAmMichaelMyers 9 months ago
@IAmMichaelMyers No he doesn't!
He is saying that since the catastrophe doesnt involve him directly, he doesn't want his taxes to be used towards the preperation for disasters.
America is like a big house and we are all brothers and sisters living in the house. We all need to do our part to ensure we have a safe and healthy place to live.
Ron Paul is essentially turning his back on his fellow americans because some tragedy didn't directly affect him...
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger People have a personal responsibility to help out, but they shouldn't be coerced into helping out through taxation.
Trimbler00 9 months ago
@Trimbler00
They aren't being coerced into helping through tax.
Anyone that lives in this country has to put some money into it to reap it's rewards.
For example... I don't happen to need the military right now. Why should my tax dollars support the military? Well, DUH at some point I may need the military to protect my country.
Same with FEMA. You could be directly affected by a earth quake that destroys your town.
Who would get you food, water and shelter? FEMA
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger If it's truly in our interest to have these services set up, why not privatize them? Why do we need the government to threaten us with imprisonment if we don't pay up (a condition of both taxation and coercion)?
Trimbler00 9 months ago
@Trimbler00
How would you go about privatizing FEMA?
To make something private a company has to be able to make money from it. Right?
So would it be a pay to get emergency services kind of thing? So only the rich can get food and shelter?
Brilliant idea... I am sure Ron Paul could afford to get help. Could you? Could the elderly and disabled?
or should we just let them die?
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger Were the people a few miles away to lose their home, I would offer a bed and couch and some food till they could save a few dollars to start over. I'm sure many people would help our own along with red cross. just let the real help ($) go to actually needs it
casperorchids 9 months ago
@casperorchids I commend you for even being willing to do that.
That would totally work on a small scale. But to cover a million people we would need large scale money and resources to be able to save people. No one should be getting their houses rebuilt with FEMA monies, and i dont believe they are, but FEMA should be there to provide aid to anyone during a disaster. Doing away would only make this country unprepared.
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger Privatizing something does not mean you start making money from it. Nonprofit corporations and charities are private but they make no profit by definition. The role of FEMA can be done more effectively and with more accountability by private philanthropy. There's a reason that people don't write out checks to the Treasury Department. Private charities operate much more efficiently and effectively. FEMA's budget has tripled last 15 years but it operates worse than ever (ie Katrina)
Trimbler00 9 months ago
@Trimbler00 Even operating FEMA as a not for profit private company seems pretty unrealistic just given the resistance to some people paying a small tax. Why would they contribute to a private company?
There has been many changes to FEMA since Katrina. Most if not all of the staffing and leadership, and it's accountability have changed drastically. Whether it will work better or not next time remains to be seen.
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger People resist federal taxes because they know about half of every dollar is going to pointless wars all over the world and even the part that ends up in FEMA will be lost to fraud thanks to the unaccountability of every public agency so FEMA would go to the Fed to make up for the shortfall and create inflation. And nonetheless we are forced to either pay the tax or face imprisonment.
Trimbler00 9 months ago
@Trimbler00
Generally people don't know where any of their taxes go.
The reason we the people don't have a choice on paying taxes is that no one would pay taxes, and the country would collapse. Personally I like having a safe and free country and dont mind paying a few taxes to support it.
Just feel lucky you don't live in Canada or France or England. They take a huge amount of taxes out of your paycheck.
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@Trimbler00 Why not have the government contract out private companies?
86THECRITIC 8 months ago
@6thMessenger You know, I'm not a Paul supporter, not by a long shot, but privatizing disaster relief could be a good idea. What the solution might be is to have the government contract out private companies to do the job.
86THECRITIC 8 months ago
@86THECRITIC
So who would pay the private companies to do the job?
6thMessenger 8 months ago
@6thMessenger The government, of course. I think the black budget wouldn't apply to this though. They would have to contract out multiple companies in order to accomplish something. Privatizing may or may not reduce what is spent on FEMA. I think health is about 5% of the budget. It could save money if they hire good companies.And yes, they can act fiscally irresponsible, both the government and the private company, because guess what, they are run by PEOPLE. The fatal flaw in anything lol
86THECRITIC 8 months ago
@86THECRITIC
The answer is the Fed would still be paying out money to the lowest bidder. Do you think privatizing would reduce what is spent on FEMA? It's not like a private company would act fiscally irresponsible, right?
LOL
I think if the Fed needs to spend our money I want some tight reigns on it so we can see where the money goes.
6thMessenger 8 months ago
@6thMessenger At least if FEMA remains a government agency we can keep spending in check a little better.
6thMessenger 8 months ago
@86THECRITIC
Listen to Ron a bit more - I bet you could find yourself as a supporter if you give him a chance :)FEMA's a scam - we had a torndao here recently . I persoanlly know 5 people I work with who were impacted . They had people lining up in droves pretending to be victims ,getting vouchers , food stamps , hotel lodging , cars , tons of stuff . A ton of fraud -a few made the news and prosecuted . They were not checking a thing - just handing stuff out like candy. what a joke
doogleandalix 7 months ago
@doogleandalix I know Ive changed my point of view... I used to work for FEMA. Great people, but the system is not efficient. What we need to do is privatize disaster relief.
86THECRITIC 7 months ago
@6thMessenger
Not quite right - why should a person making mim.wage foot the bill for some fat cat having a house on the ocean ? That is why the ins rates are so high . your idea of us all being brothers and sisters sounds good , but is not reality . There will always be people who volunteer but not everyone should foot the bill for others . That is why people are mandated to buy flood ins. should they CHOOSE to buy a house in a flood district . Their choice , their money .
doogleandalix 7 months ago
@doogleandalix
1. Many of the houses that were destroyed were in low income neighborhoods. Houses of families that have been there for generations. Many of them can barely take care of themselves, let alone buy additional insurance, there would be no way financially they could move. They weren't rich folk living in million $ sea side mansions.
2. FEMA's role is not to rebuild homes, Ron Paul would have you think they are, but
it provides emergency response to disaster only.
6thMessenger 7 months ago
@6thMessenger
I see your point but I also see Ron Paul's point . As I said below, we had a tornado here recently and FEMA was pretty lax in handing out vouchers, food stamps, hotel lodging chits, etc. Anyone in line who said they lived in that neighborhood pretty much got assistance without any proof . Also , my state and possibly all have their own state emergency aid so these people collected twice . Two were 4 mos.late on mortgage and now have new houses ,made $ on the deal.
doogleandalix 7 months ago
@doogleandalix
FEMA needs some tweeking. But, lax or not, they were still there to help those who needed it.
Collecting aid after you lose your house in a natural disaster is hardly making $.
Ron Pauls point is... Why should he have to contribute to the greater good if the tragedy doesn't affect him? He is selfish, therefore would make a horrible leader for the USA.
6thMessenger 7 months ago
@6thMessenger that's what homeowner's or renter's insurance is for.
tmh2939 5 months ago
@tmh2939
I'll have to check, but I am pretty sure Renters and Home owners insurance doesn't provide food, water and shelter after your entire city has been wiped off the map. But FEMA will.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger The point is if you are going to live on an island, on the shore, on the banks of a river or stream, you're going to get flooded. They reap the benefits of living by the water, but why are all taxpayers required to pay for the risks? And FEMA doesn't work-there's inefficiency and fraud on a massive scale, nothing but red tape and mounds of paperwork. If you're waiting on the Fed govt to save you-you'll be waiting a long, long time.
tmh2939 5 months ago
@tmh2939
Its easy to judge them sitting in your chair watching the news from 1600 miles away. This wasn't a rich person that lost a mansion. These were 100,000's of poor people living in and around a city whose house and entire city were literally washed away by 20 ft of flood water. Whose lives depended on shipping, fishing, wareshousing, tourism as it had for generations. People that had been told that the levies would hold back tidal surges. But the levies failed and their lives washed away
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Actually, it is more like Church Organizations, Red Cross etc that come in and help with that. If Americans were allowed to keep more of their money through less taxation, Americans would be in a better position to give more. How did Americans get along before FEMA? The people gave generously to help their fellow Americans.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
Where do you think a local church is going to stick 100,000 plus people that need food, water and shelter? They aren't. The local church and parishners are going to be suffering as well. The Red Cross and FEMA work together in cases of mass care and emergency support. Bottom line, there are just some disasters that are so big they can't be handled by volunteers.
The national response plan needed to change as the population has grown. We need FEMA.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Well, I actually belong to a Church that is world wide, that does send a lot of food and supplies for that many people. We do it quietly because we are not doing it to be recognized, we do it because we love our brothers and sisters. I have personally participated many times in preparing emergency kits, etc. if you want to know more about this humanitarian effort you can visit. LDS.org and look under humanitarian.
libertybelle2008 5 months ago
@libertybelle2008
Great. Do they have a fleet of helicopters they can fly supplies in with? Because you know, the airport and post offices are closed when they are under 20 ft of water.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger who do you think subsidizes the national flood insurance program? The tooth fairy? FEMA does not work-he's not saying that people shouldn't be helped-he's just saying that the Fed govt does a very bad job of it-like most things the Fed govt does.
tmh2939 5 months ago
@tmh2939 NO. THE POINT IS, no matter where you live there can be a massive catastophic disaster. If we are unprepared to handle such a disaster hundreds of thousands of people could die. Tax payers all over the country pay into the FEMA "insurance plan" because it CAN happen to you. IF it does, a federally funded and trained person is going to come rescue your terrified, hungry, crying, selfish ass from the catastrophe.
As far as management, agreed. Gov as a whole needs to improve.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger You are not listening to what he is saying-FEMA didn't even exist until the late 1970s, and even then only played a very minor role in natural disasters. then it became politicized with Clinton, Bush & Katrina. People managed before then. It amazes me how quickly a Fed agency or program can become something we "just can't do without" once it takes hold.Our country is bankrupt, FEMA is broke and it's just another inept, expensive Fed. govt agency that doesn't work that people hate.
tmh2939 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Do you not understand the concept of moral hazard?
tmh2939 5 months ago
@tmh2939
Moral hazard does not apply when there is a massive natural disaster that FEMA would cover.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@6thMessenger Knowing now that FEMA will provide money to someone who lives on the coast when a hurricane happens doesn't encourage more people to live in danger zones? Are you crazy??
tmh2939 5 months ago
@tmh2939
You are mental. Do you have any desire to live in New Orleans after seeing the destruction there? I sure as hell don't. I have been there before and no amount of federal, state or divine aid would make me want to live any where near the gulf coast on a good day.
You'd have to be a seriously mentally sick and ignorant individual to be encouraged to move to the gulf *because* of FEMA. Many of the people that did and do live there have been there for generations.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@tmh2939
You know why people live in New Orleans right? You act like living there is a privilege and you don't want to pay for people's privilege. It's not because everyone gets ocean from mansions.
There is a lot of work to be found there in oil, shipping, fishing, etc. It's not like living on the coast in Cali. It is crowded, hot, dirty, and dangerous. But it has been a hub of commerce for centuries.
6thMessenger 5 months ago
@doogleandalix
Believe me - these people made $. A house assessed at $70,000 , you are 4 mos in arrears and you are insured for $150,000 plus another $100,000 for contents -via private homeowners ins. They ALSO got FEMA aid , and the state version of Fema, MEMA .They pocketed a TON of $ - Ron Paul's point is that it should be up to the states to have such agencies in place - not duplication and Federal bloat.I don't want to give my tax dollars so lazy people don't have to work,do you
doogleandalix 7 months ago
fuck CNN
intellectualgiant911 9 months ago
Just recently FEMA was asking for money to be returned by Katrina Victims..(they are evil) evil like Dick Cheney and the rest of the Shadow Government.
and you get my vote DR Paul.
jacobosmak 9 months ago
FEMA always has and always will do a terrible job. I think we all remember Katrina!! Abolish Katrina
generalJEANpaul 9 months ago
FEMA is to intern American citizens who exercise their freedom of speech,
turbomango 9 months ago
damn... a lot of people have a really distorted view of our country and our government. They need to attend a high school civics class.
6thMessenger 9 months ago
Ron Paul is the coolest
kommon12Cents 9 months ago
@xWren
He's in congress. They are all paid by special interests.
6thMessenger 9 months ago
Neocons only want 4 more years of Obama's protection
84% Reject Official 9 11 Story
ryanshaunkelly 9 months ago 2
@ryanshaunkelly 9/11 wasn't an inside job, man. I'm sorry, but government just isn't smart enough.
mrmailmandudebro 9 months ago
@mrmailmandudebro it wasn't the government...and it just wasn't the tan guys w/boxcutters either....question is who? Smoking gun Building 7
2ruthfox82 9 months ago
@2ruthfox82 I agree to a point, but I'm not jumping down that rabbit hole. There are more important issues today.
mrmailmandudebro 9 months ago
@ryanshaunkelly Would you truthers please stop using RP as a spokesman. You're gonna KILL his chances on the national stage with all this shit. Please quit until we see how far this guy can go in a world of corporate media.
Lukeor 9 months ago
@Lukeor Agreed. Thumbs up.
mrmailmandudebro 9 months ago
@ryanshaunkelly
96% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
1 in 5 people believe the sun revolves around the earth.
Only morons would elect Ron Paul or Sarah Palin, or Donald Trump or Newt Gingrich.
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger
Remember the '07 - '08 campaign.
Remember what they did, remember who did it.
nader paul kucinich gravel mckinney baldwin ventura sheehan
This time an entire citizen army of every stripe stands beside Dr Ron.
ryanshaunkelly 9 months ago
@6thMessenger Or Obama.
mrmailmandudebro 9 months ago
Hey Ron Paul is right! Why pay any taxes at all? How about we all just take care of ourselves? Screw everyone else.
My election predicition for Ron Paul = FAIL
When there is a catastrophic emergency rule of law changes. If we didn't have FEMA how many more dead peope would we have had from Katrina? Hundreds? Thousands? how many without homes or shelter of any kind? How many without food? To take an isolationist stance in an emergency is selfish and wrong.
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger He said nothing about stopping taxation. He never said anything about "just taking care of ourselves." You're putting your own words in his mouth.
Strawman argument with absolutely no base in reality. The private charities and churches would have done a much better job with Katrina - namely in that they wouldn't have turned away help from Red Cross and Wal-Mart, and they wouldn't have pushed an agenda to disarm families trying to defend their homes and property.
mrmailmandudebro 9 months ago
@mrmailmandudebro
According to Ron Paul's statements, his attitude is essentially, it's not his problem since it doesn't affect him, so why bother? If he's never had a car accident, why pay car insurance? Because the one time you need it, you will have it. Thats why.
Private churches and charities could in no way respond to helping 1 million people. They don't have the staffing, resources, leadership, etc. It's a wonderful fairytale land you live in, but it's not reality.
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger Man, you're arguments are so weak it's not even worth my time. If this is the best you can come up with, it only serves as further evidence why democracy has failed and aristocracy has taken its place.
mrmailmandudebro 9 months ago
@6thMessenger Riiiiight.... and forcing every citizen to pay for such an agency through taxation is NOT selfish, and NOT wrong? Do you even understand how a volunteer group not on the federal payroll would most likely be larger in size, less costly, and far more efficient at saving lives than anything a government can offer? Do you really think that when FEMA is eliminated, there will be no private / charity groups who pop up all across the country and take their place, funded through donations?
mit26chell 9 months ago
@mit26chell The average overhead of a private charity organization is between 15-20%. The average overhead for a government welfare program is 70-85% overhead.
And please, folks, don't bring up Medicare/Medicaid. I'll blow that nonsense argument to shreds.
mrmailmandudebro 9 months ago
@mit26chell ...and where is a volunteer group going to get the thousands of shelters? tons of food?
You think your local church can support that many people? hell no.
You can't get a volunteer group large enough or with nearly enough resources to be able to take care of all the people from Katrina, as an example.
No using part of our taxes towards keeping this country safe and helping our own countrymen in a time of need is not selfish or wrong.
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger Dn't use Katrina as an example FEMA fail was EPIC....and just for the record more people are helped every year by volunteer groups than by FEMA, Fact!
2ruthfox82 9 months ago
@2ruthfox82
FEMA wasn't perfect for Kratina but that was their largest catastrophe that they have had to respond to yet.
Volunteers help more people than FEMA each year?? That is an irrelevent "fact". Volunteer groups are active daily. FEMA is active only for catastrophic events.
Who would lead enough volunteers to help 1 million people? Where would you get enough resources to house and feed 1 million people? It would be anarchy.
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger What most people fail to realize is that when our country goes bankrupt, No FEMA, No Welfare, No Social Security, Nada... we have to change things, Ron Paul is the man, it will not be easy, there will be suffering, but it wont last forever... but you will be free RON PAUL 2012
2ruthfox82 9 months ago
@6thMessenger Talking to ideologues is pointless. They don't care about practical realities. If people suffer, they call it 'freedom'. With rightwing libertarianism, you are free to be poor & homeless, you are free to be sick & starve to death, you are free to be powerless & disenfranchised. As an ideology of privileged white males, right-libertarianism only cares about freedom from & not freedom toward.
benjamindavidsteele.wordpress. com/2010/09/07/libertarians-privilege-partisanship/
MarmaladeINFP 9 months ago
@MarmaladeINFP So we agree this guy is full of shit then?
/hi5
6thMessenger 9 months ago
@6thMessenger Yes, agreed. :)
MarmaladeINFP 9 months ago
@MarmaladeINFP Statism and Coercionism are ideologies. Get off of your high horse.
mrmailmandudebro 9 months ago
@mrmailmandudebro Yes, they are ideologies. Every fucking thing is an ideology, you moron. However, rightwing libertarianism and voluntarism are ideologies that are based in unproven utopian ideals.
MarmaladeINFP 9 months ago