Re: The Decline and Fall of Christian America (it's not nearly as fallen as it sounds)

[bresophil]

You look just like Shane Dawson... not as gay though...

[LIBERALTSUNAMI]

obama won because so many churchers in the south prayed for him to win hahahahahahah

[luvdomus]

Christianity's repuputation was hurt by the right wing Evangelicals at the end of the 20th century-- Fallwell, 700 Club, Bush et al. They were mendacious, greedy bullies. Morals and ethics can flourish without sects like that, and Christianity itself can exist without superstitious beliefs like the Resurrection, the Virgin Birth, or God as a Father/King. As people are exposed to more information, the formerly dominant religion loses influence. Take what's positive in all religions.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

@luvdomus Why don't we just look for what's positive ourselves instead of taking it from religions? Like, if two scientists were arguing on whose evidence was more sound, and one's evidence was grounded in scientific evidence and the other's was taken from an astrology book, whose do you think is better? if you think the astrologist's evidence is better, that's cool, but realize that your standard of evidence is as low as a cave dwelling primitive.

[lowerklass]

lol its funny how ya basing ya knowledge on what people are sayin, rather then actually sturdying the bible! but hay u aint got time for tht man! cos ya busy makin youtube video's aboot mislims and tht ahahahaha i take it your parents arn't christian??? or muslim? lol ye funny ye like! watch south park- go, god, go episode! obviously u like to investigate stuff, investigate tht! and it will show you how sad you are! hahahahahahaha

[lowerklass]

lol atheism arn't fun to watch! i suppose if you mean in sense of "to be laughed at". just think man ya gona be doin this ya whole life it jus seems a lil sad! am gona pray for you! oh but yer pray + 0= 0. read on...

[VILeonidasV]

Religion is falling at the rate, I don't know but I do know that now coming into the new aged world ALL religions are going to have to abandon there fight on teaching there methology as fact. For example: the 1st book of the bible 'Genisis' After reading it you discover that it sounds no differen't then norse/greek methology.

The churches/people who try to keep that will become the minority.

[ogirv101]

Christianity is nowhere near the end in America, mainly because of Latino populations and the increasin latino populations in the US, lets not forget the influence Latino populations give to the US. In Europe, Christianity is dying, slowly, but Atheism won't take its place, in fact Islam will. In 39 years France will become an Islamic Republic, in 2025, 1/3 of all Children will be born to Muslims families. You guys are sad if you think atheism is going to dominate.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

Well, I guess I'm a bit of a wishful thinker, but I would hope that rationality and sanity would dominate. Not necessarily atheism, but then again, it does tend to follow.

[ogirv101]

Atheism and rationality have nothing to do with each other. Rationality and Logic, come from branches of Philosophy, and philosophy was mainly influenced by religious minds, like those of Plato, Aristotle, Socrates, Aquinas, Descartes, Leibenz, etc. Atheism has barely contributed to logic, it hasn;t even provided a good culture to sustain it. Christian culture has sustained inquiry and Science, which leads to rationalism.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

I laugh at Socrates being on that list, since he was tried and found guilty of blasphemy and sentenced to death.

Also, I think you got what I said backwards. I didn't say atheism leads to rationality, I said rationality leads to atheism (often). It's simple: rational people don't often believe in things that are impossible/can't be proven to be true, like unicorns and genies. This often leads to people abandoning religion when they realize that unicorns and god have a lot in common.

[ogirv101]

Really? Socrates said himself near his death that he believed he was sent by God to critique greek society. Furthermore, your portrayal of Socrates got him killed, Socrates himself also admitted that it was a man who portrayed him as an Atheist that had to do with his death. He critiqued the greek Gods, and blasphemy towards greek gods isn't the same to the Christian God, the Christian God didn't even exist, what are you even talking about? He was also killed for his criticism.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

I never said he didn't believe in god, I just said he was tried and found guilty of blasphemy. Critical thinking of religion tends to get a lot of people killed, then and now. I suppose you don't believe that has anything to do with religion though, right?

[ogirv101]

So how is that laugheable? It's like claiming Jesus was a religious figure, though he was killed for his beliefs. No, it has nothing to do with religion. Jesus taught to love thy neighbor, enemy, and not to judge anyone. I don't see how that goes for killing anyone, especially if Jesus was considered a heretic in his day, he hung around with prostitutes and other immoral people. Jesus is the man...

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

Yeah, which is why the most horrible crimes in human history have been done for religious goals. And when I say religious, I mean the characteristics of religion, including zealotry, unquestioned loyalty and authoritarianism, so that means that Stalin, Mao and Hitler were all on this list too.

[izzatiizzatiizzati]

How can Stalin, Mao, Hitler be on the list of religious figures?

Hitler's goals were related to politics and world domination. He had more self interests in him and he was never concerned about pleasing a higher power. At least that's how I see him in history.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

Well, because their style of authority was very akin to the style of many religions. they was authoritarian, they demanded zealotry and absolute subservience and cooperation without question, they had people believe things that were ridiculous and unprovable (Hitler had his men believe that Jews drank the blood of christians), they had people believe that they were infallible and beyond question, so that even when they killed it was for the good, etc. A lot like religion.

[izzatiizzatiizzati]

Nazism is a religion?

[izzatiizzatiizzati]

I don't know, maybe nazism is a religion, I'm not too sure.

But I thought religion (well I don't know about other religions; there's satanism so i don't know what the hell is that) is more about sacrificing certain self interests and greed for the greater good/ pleasing a Higher power.

Dictatorships in history are more linked to human greed, that's how I see it but I don't know maybe you won't agree. Just a thought.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

Nazism isn't a religion, it's a political movement. That said, as I pointed out, they had all the characteristics of a religion except a god.

You're right, except that in this case the greater good was world domination, and the higher power was your country's ruler. Most nazis probably didn't want to kill jews, but the fuhrer said it was good, so they did it.

[ogirv101]

Nazism is somewhat of a religion, it's based off many occult practices, but mainly had nothing to do with religion. It was a political ideology, that used a skewed version of Christianity and a skewed version of evolution theory to make its movement, the thing is that it's based off false assumptions.

[ogirv101]

Religious? You make your own definition of religious to fit your viewpoint, you're an idiot. Einstein considered himself religious in his sense, just because you say something doesn't mean it's true. Furthermore, religions like protestantism is against authoritarian an unquestioned loyalty, look at its history.

[ogirv101]

Rationality never leads to Atheism. Atheism has nothign to do with logic, it's a belief that there is no God, which the denial is based off lack of evidence (negative proof fallacy). Unicorns and God have alot in common? Yeah, and apparently you're a rational person how? Appeal to ridicule fallacies is what landed you morons in the laughingstock of true intellectuals. Especially recalcitrant and arrogant dipshits like you, most rational Atheists would disapporve of what you said.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

Do you believe in unicorns? No? Well that's a negative proof fallacy.

Unicorns are unable to be perceived in any way, no logical or physical evidence can be provided for them that is remotely sound and they are the product of the human imagination.

God "" ""

they're pretty much identical.

But hey, I know you don't agree, so I'll give the floor to you. Explain to me what god has that unicorns don't.

[ogirv101]

You've asumed that i denied the existance of Unicorns, It's completely probable (just as almost everything is), btu through logical reasoning and deduction I have reason to doubt its existance, I'm not basing the denial of my belief in Unicrons off the lack of evidence, but through philosophical argumentation.

What God has? Well for one, he's the Creator of the Universe beyond the scope of Science, Unicrons are in the scope of Science, and disproven.

[izzatiizzatiizzati]

Whoaaaaaaaaaaaaa a Christian thinking/admitting that Islam will dominate Europe.. Nice. Sorry I haven't seen that in a while on youtube. So far, I've gotten,"Islam will die" or "Islam is from the devil" from some of them online, oh well.

[ogirv101]

I really don't have hostility to any religion, Islam is a very peaceful religion, and I've found this out through comparitive politics and the need to understand different cultures. Islam is going to take over Europe, it's not me 'thinking', it's me telling you through empirical evidence and statistics, something Atheists and other idiots (religious alike) have a problem doing.

[izzatiizzatiizzati]

Wow thanks, it's hard to find christians like you nowadays on youtube. I admit I have bashed christians for their faith :/ well as a way to stand up for how they have been making fun of my faith. Sorry, not going to pretend.Thanks for the information, how refreshing.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

"Atheists and other idiots"

I'd laugh if I didn't think you were serious.

[ogirv101]

It wasn't a joke, your belief system relies on a neative proof fallacy, it's based off a logical fallacy that deserves the branding of an idiot. Also of course I did mention religious people can be idiots, especially young earth Creationist, fundamentalists, literists, etc. I also may fear that what you said was an appeal to ridicule logical fallacy.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

The depth of your ignorance disturbs me, and no, I'm not ridiculing you, that's a fact.

Perhaps you're not aware of the definition of atheism. I go by the old one, that is:

Prefix, "a-", meaning "not" or "without".

Suffix "theism", a belief in a god/religion.

I am without religion because I am not convince through any empiriical or logical evidence that your or any other god exists. I don't KNOW he doesn't exist, he very well could. I just am not convinced of this.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

For it to be a negative proof fallacy, I would have to be saying "you can't prove that he exists, therefore he doesn't".

What I'm saying is "you can't prove he exists, therefore I'm not obliged to believe you".

Also, appeals to ridicule are funny things; you can only really call me on them if they aren't true, like if I say "you think the world is a sphere? That's crazy! Does that make the moon a cube?"

When I say "god is like unicorns", it doesn't really count as such because its true

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

You say "it's completely probable, just like everything is"

So like the thinking of a theist. Everything, no matter how much evidence we have for or against it, is PROBABLE to exist. Now, we clearly have an irreconcilable difference in preference here, so I don't intend to counter it. I prefer believing things with evidence than believing in everything, even if it doesn't have evidence, and you prefer the opposite. That's fine, whatever, but don't call me stupid because of it, for I am not.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

I don't deny the existence of god, or unicorns, or anything. I just am not convinced that they exist.

"god is beyond the scope of science". This is akin to me saying I have a dragon in my garage that's invisible, intangible and is beyond any means of detection. Would you believe me? I don't know your answer. I wouldn't believe you if you said that, because I have seen no reason to believe you.

Perhaps if you could furnish me with some kind of proof for god, I'd see your side.

[ogirv101]

So you just don't beleive in them? You either accept it or you deny it, there are only two options, if you don't accept it then you deny it, and you need reasons for denying it(negative proof fallacies don't count). You're basing all your beliefs off empricism, a truely logical mind is a combination of an empricist-rationalist based mind, you seem to lack the rationalist based mind. You're a materialist, far from a rationalist. Also, a dragon in our realm is nothing close to God....

[ogirv101]

So you're telling me that it's completely logical to base all your beliefs off empricism (because all knowledge is based off belief and justification)? Knowledge is subjective, we can even rarely define knowledge most of the times (not germane to our discussion though). Let me give an example, so if you saw a man, and then he hid behind a wall while you looked somehwere else, the fact that he isn't there means he doesn't exist, because you can't see him? No evidence that he does.

[ogirv101]

"it doesn't really count as such because its true"

How, explain how a mythiccal creature compares to the Creator of the cosmos, that is an appeal to ridicule fallacy, and anyone with a logical brain can see it, you're just too recalcitrant to accept it.

[ogirv101]

You're not ridiculing me (that would be an ad hominem), you're ridiculing my statement; it is you that stays in ignorance.

"I am without religion because I am not convince through any empiriical or logical evidence that your or any other god exists."

So you dismiss belief due to the lack of evidence? It's the same thing as me still believing ina flying spaghetti monster for the lack of evidence proving its inexistance, negative proof fallacy still applies.

[WHISTLEBOMB]

you make algebra fun

[RussiaGlory]

Fuck faggots.

[goldgoku3264]

you said you like things that make you think, i have a question for you that might do that.

here it is:

we all know that space is big, but... how far can you travel through space until you reach the end?  is it eternal? is there a brick wall at the end that stops you from going any further, can we even fathom as human beings that space has no end?

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

I do not know. It seems illogical that there would be a brick wall, but it's possible. I haven't been to the edge of space, but If I go I'll let you know.

However, I am of the supposition that matter is in a finite space, but space itself is infinite. I could be wrong though.

[dudits01]

according to the last developpement of the astrophysic, the universe (at a very large scale) seems to be in an accelerated inflation.

This means that even if you travel at the light-speed during an eternity... you'll never reach the edge of the universe 'cause if edge there is, it is getting away from you quicker the the speed limit (the speed of light)

[dudits01]

But it's all about relativity, the edge of universe (if it exists) doesn't travel at all... that's only you who is fleeing the edge quicker than speed-light, event if you're pointing toward it.

Fun! isn't it?

[bloodvamp089]

well if u know some science space is ever growing and expanding so yes it is infinite and it sounds like ignorant people still refer to the forece of creation as god which is wrong but w/e god is not aperson it is couscoisness in which in matter becomes vibrations and thus light and atoms are formed. as for evolution god as u say is evolution not just in genes but in spiritual and over all evolution

[goldgoku3264]

i believe prayer humbles a man.

no only does he pray about his concerns but he hears himself with his own lips confess them.

this i believe stirs a hardened heart, one that plague majority of american men by pride. i do believe however faith without works is dead, one that i suffer from. but i will simply say the beneifts of prayer is an experience of humility repentance ( and many people don't forgive themselfs) and that knowing God hears and anwsers.

[neverlookback75]

Sub'd, awesome vid.

[Mopster12345k]

dude BornInAsphodelMeadow have you even read the Bible its more elaborate than some long hair dude picking out your sins. And you can say sin is a more fun way of life but it is corrupt way of life if critically think and look at it. The Bible also says the life of a christian was going to be easy. Oh yea also the bible is a very ELABORATE book with lots of meanings so how can it be a waste of time? Its also the way to know God. You are very ignorant peace.

[neverlookback75]

Have you read the bible? No, you haven't. Because the one in your hands isn't the same as the one that was written long ago, that was lost. What you're reading is a bible that is riddled with errors, omissions and changes. You're no more following the bible, than the mormons, who you ridicule, who had their faith made up for them are.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

mopster, what is sin? Sin is what the bible says is wrong. You say it's corrupt to sin, and yeah, killing and stealing is wrong. but the bible is fine with rape, is that corrupt? it's also fine with genocide and infanticide, is that corrupt?

I'm ignorant? You're right. I'm completely unaware how anyone could buy that bullshit.

It's a waste of time because after reading the whole bible cover to cover I will have learned nothing and not improved myself in any way. peace.

[JRock005]

Jesus didn't come to condemn the world but to save it. Ultimately it's all love. The 10 commandments were written because God didn't want mankind living like a bunch of pigs with no morals. The whole idea of being "civilized" came from God. Like, Give to the poor, Control your anger, turn the other cheek, respect your parents, don't kill, don't steal, don't cheat on your spouse, don't be greedy, respect yourself, don't lie, stay humble...etc.

God is not trying to send people to hell.

[JRock005]

And prayer is used to ask God for favor or for help. But prayer alone is not enough, God helps those who help themselves. Faith without works is dead.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

I think faith with or without works is, as I said, worthless.

And regardless of how you interpret god's actions and rules, ultimately he's the one who throws the switch that sends you into a fiery pit forever and ever, and that makes him malicious. You can invent a rhetoric to justify this, but I challenge you to EXPLAIN it.

[JRock005]

LOL. What are you so angry about? It seems theres something that happened to you that caused animosity. Like an "ill will". God doesn't send people to hell, they send themselves. Man is not supposed to go to hell anyway. Do you think God made hell for humans?

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

Oh, I'm not angry at all, rest assured. I can see that by my text it looks that way, but it's not. I don't think god made hell for humans, I think neither god nor hell exist. What I'm trying to assert is that the answer to that question doesn't matter, because yes or no, there are fallacies and holes in it that cannot be rationalized away. Do you think god made hell for humans?

[neverlookback75]

God made the mechanism to send people to hell. He created the rules and set them in motion, so he very much is trying to send people to hell. If not, then he would get rid of hell entirely, since it's his creation.

[JRock005]

But you have free will. If God is trying to send people to hell then why is he so angry about people denying his son. Hell was made for the fallen angels. Not for man. You have to be a certain way to dwell in the kingdom. Would you allow people to do what ever they want in your house?

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

In my house, people have option of leaving, and going to their house without me threatening to force them into eternal fire and torment for the rest of eternity.

Slight difference there eh?

If he is god he is omniscient. if that is so, he knew when he sent jesus here that we would forsake him. If that is so than he could have not sent him and then not been mad at us for sinning. if that's so, he sent him here so that we would sin. if that's so then he's mad at us for something he did.

[neverlookback75]

okaaayyyy?!?

[JRock005]

Before christ came, there was no way into the kingdom at all.

We have freewill. God knew we were going to sin. That's why he set it up so we won't have to live in damnation. God forgives you of your sin before you commit it. Anybody can make it to heaven. The reason God hates sin, is because he hates to see you suffer the "earthly" consequences. Sin is anything that can destroy or corrupt man. Like greed. Which keeps the money out of poverty areas. Hell, is for fallen angels.

[neverlookback75]

Ah yes, free will to live in fear of him. That's kinda like all the freedoms given by dictators right?

[JRock005]

Fear God. "Fear" as in respect. There's nothing about God to be afraid of. You have people who run away from God because of this fake image of God that says he's angry all the time. You guys really think God is concentrating on how he's going to get you to hell. If that's the case, then everything would have ceased to exist already. God is patient and has faith in man. He gave man power and dominion over the earth. All the problems on earth is mans fault. Satan only does what man allows him to.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

ok so let me get this straight. god hates sin because of the earthly consequences. So, if I'm willing to deal with the earthly consequences, and the almighty righteous god has given me the free will to do so, i'm allowed to right? Why shouldn't I be? god doesn't want me to go to hell, but he doesn't like the consequences that happen to me because of my actions. So i'll go ahead and do as I please, and god doesn't have to worry about it because it's not his responsibility, and i'll go to heaven.

[JRock005]

You don't go to hell for just sinning. It's from not having a personal relationship with christ. Remember, sin really hurts you. God just hates to see it. it's like a mother watching her son smoke crack. Do you think she's going to okay it because it's his right? You don't turn christian so you can go to heaven. It's so you can get to know God, and your purpose in life. Sodom and Gomorra were destroyed because they abandoned their purpose. Not because they were gay, but because negligence.

[neverlookback75]

LOL, are you kidding? The whole tagline to Christianity is "Do it or burn in hell!" At the least, it's "Might as well do it, just in case you're right and you end up burning in hell". Do you really think that the idea of someplace where you burn for eternity isn't a threat? Perhaps if I hold a hot poker in your face and threaten to jab it into you, that isn't the least bit threatening.

The reason why I think God wants people to go to hell is because he created it and then used it as a tool

[neverlookback75]

to scare humans into submitting.

God has no faith in man. He has no need for faith. If he does exist, and he is all knowing, then he knows what's going to happen. I don't need faith if I know already.

Add to this that he has the power to get rid of hell for everyone, to let everyone live for all eternity in "heaven", then how is he not a sadistic fuck when he is fine with this allowing to happen. And by association, how are you not the same by being fine with some people burning for eternity?

[JRock005]

Dude. where do you live? I'm from Maryland and all this "your going to hell" stuff is not Gods idea of life. Living on earth is a threat too. Don't you think? If God foreskins the earth, the earth will automatically become hell. Hell is for fallen angels. if you separate yourself from God, you'll have to live somewhere separate.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

I've separated myself from god, and I still live at home. hell, I even go to free church plays every christmas because I'm cheap. I'm not planning on leaving my domicile, and if god doesn't like it, he can strike me dead. or, should he either be impotent or not exist, he can leave me as is, happier without being his slave.

[JRock005]

I think the reason your perception of God is so negative, is because you don't really know God personally. Only what other people have told you God is. You have to see for yourself. Wouldn't you hate if I thought you were a bad person just because everyone else says so, but never took the time out to find out for myself?

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

I would dislike that severely. Here's how I look at it though: if I killed a bunch of babies and allowed my child to be brutally tortured and may have caused some genocide and rape, I wouldn't expect people to think of me nicely without getting to know me. But if I wanted them to get to know me and realize what a good person I am, I'd introduce myself. If god reveals himself to me, answers a few of my questions about the universe to prove he's god and then convinces me he's a nice guy, we'll see

[herzogf22]

Lets face it the concept of her (gods) existence is a theoretical fallacy; I believe in the selfish gene, I believe that the purpose of genes and thus and thus animal traits is to be reproduced. There is heavy evolutionary selection. We only succeed, four our genes, by reproducing... if there is only one god he fails at this basic task. She fails by removing the only possible purpose of her life from her existence. Unless of course her purpose is insert Dawkins religion rant.

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

wait, you're saying that god can't reproduce, therefore god fails at existence? Pardon me if I misinterpreted, but if that's what you meant, I don't really think you've thought that one through.

[bloodvamp089]

selfish gene lol?? well thats so retarted in order to maintain a helath body all things including genes must bein harmony osmosis , balance w/e u want to call it if a gene is therfore sl;efish then of course there would be health issues and therfore ur therory is just stupid like christians defending that the earth is flat

[smpunditz]

haha "it's hard to ignore that hand".

[BornInAsphodelMeadow]

shit I didn't even realize, lol

[saqib09]

Ha ha.... your 'abouts'...

[thatdarnsugarbees]

Yay for use of algebra!

[rockerwere]

I am Jesus... I hang around with gay people... The reason I said it was a sin is because I wanted to hide my own sexual preferences.... You see I am actually bisexual... Just ask Mary and Adam.... They know ;-)