What drives atheist crazy is christian always say Evolution is a theory, without really understanding what a scientific theory even is. It is a way to describe something that has already been observed. It is not a guess A hypothesis is a guess at how an observed event happens, it is then tested and retested by other sources until at some point it is Called a Theory, the model used changes or new fact are discovered, but those usually compliment the original theory not disprove it. Evolution=fact
@robtay1963 so it would be safe using simple logic to say that if something is designed like the universe and the earth in it and life upon it ,that since it shows design that we can deduct by simple common sense that since it shows design ,that it must have a super intelligent designer and since it had to be created then it must have a creator,after all if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck it must be a duck,creation the is created and there is creator,simple done!
have you not heard the tale of the ant and the grasshopper ,its was summer and the ant was piling away food and building a shelter and preparing for winter and the grasshopper well he just ate and played around and the ant told him to prepare for winter but the grasshopper didn't see the need because he didn't believe in winter so the wise ant made it and the grasshopper perished and the Bible says consider the ant how he prepares and works and plans for winter is coming to all!
@majorl31 Btw, atheists believe no gods exist, but you are missing the point. This is about how contradictory the so called "god's character" is, not about wether god exists or not. What you are doing there is simply acknowledging the argument Matt used against that christian guy, disregarding the fact that it clearly demonstrates this god character is a fucking jackass.
@hellhammerz666 you call God immoral because you don't like justice,its like you being a rebel and you think when you do what you want and it breaks laws then that the police busting you makes them immoral
Why do you care so much about all those chritians that belive a god? Dont you think that your a hypocrite because of what your doing.... (This question goes to Mat, if any one wants to answear for him go ahead)
@majorl31 So I should just trust that you have a special sense and choose to believe like you? Sorry I need evidence. Can you demonstrate this sixth sense?
@majorl31 I will ask you again. Can you demonstrate this sixth sense? Can you explain how one uses it? You claim we just don't want to. But as far as I'm concerned this so called sense does not exist. It's not a matter of not wanting to. In fact if I knew the sense was real I would very much want to use it.
@Khyrid here is clue if you want to be spiritual you must seek GOD to find God you must seek GOD f course you could seek the dark side of the spiritual but GOD is light and not darkness
@Khyrid you desire to find God in your life and if the desire is sincere and true and you pursue him you will find Him, i found god in a church were the church was very alive with the spirit of God myself
@majorl31 Well I was a christian and my desire to find god was sincere. But the more I tried to find him the more I realized he didn't exist. So I'm sorry but your advice doesn't work for me.
@Khyrid I do not know what the problem was except for if you read what the Bible says about the chosen,or the elect of God many are called but few are chosen.
@majorl31 Wait a minute... Are you suggesting now that only certain people are chosen to go to heaven? So now it's not just a matter of sincerely seeking salvation, but you also must be on the list? So I'm for whatever reason not on the list so I go to Hell? I must not be understanding you correctly.
@Khyrid You say you were Christian and the Bible says God knew you from the womb and knowing you from the womb and knowing what your desires are going to be yes I believe that God is all knowing and knows who will reject Him and who won't
@majorl31 Oh you did answer my previous question, I didn't see this response before.
Okay, well that's an interesting concept. So god knew I would reject him? But when I became an atheist, I rejected the idea that god exist. I did not reject god in the sense that I thought he was real but I didn't want to follow him. Also it was not my choice. I am intellectually honest, I came to the understanding that god probably doesn't exist so I had become an atheist unwillingly.
@majorl31 I wasn't talking about if God was immoral, that's leading us off topic.
Yes, he doesn't exist to me. Did you think I thought he exist but didn't want to follow him? Why would I forfeit my eternal soul and send myself to hell for all eternity just so I can live how I want in this short finite life? If I thought that, I would be insane and therefore exempt from punishment.
It doesn't make sense to me that I deserve to go to hell because from my perspective, no religion is correct.
@majorl31 I found your comment hard to understand. "a point in every direction"? What does that mean? I think you made a typo somewhere.
Anyway what I think you are trying to say is that the answers are in the bible. But I read the bible and that's a big part of why I became an atheist in the first place. Also no matter what the bible says the bible can't be proof of itself. That is circular logic.
If I felt there was a reasonable possibility that god exist I would pursue him.
@Khyrid A point in every direction is saying there are many truths ,when truth itself indicates that there cannot be many truths,Jesus declared He was the truth and I believe He is .
There s a very reasonable possibility that here is a creator God so pursue Him>
1.) Atheist say the character of god as depicted in the bible is immoral. No need to believe he is real to judge the character of the fictional character that real people worship.
2.) You still seem to be talking in riddles about this many truths thing. You claim that there is a real possibility but you have not demonstrated it. Also I have pursued god already as I told you. But I never found reasonable evidence for him. No special sense developed. I just don't buy it.
@majorl31 They said the god of the bible is immoral. By that they meant the character in the story. I can say Darth Vader is evil, it doesn't mean I believe he is real.
If you have to believe god exist before you can solve the riddle of the bible and the bible is the main evidence to believe god exist in the first place... that's circular logic. I'm sorry but that is not a good way to determine fact from fantasy.
@majorl31 I only mentioned one horror movie character and you state I watch to many horror films?!?! Is it not possible to know who Freddy Krueger is without watching any horror films at all?
First of all I don't follow anyone. I think for myself.
Secondly... I shouldn't even listen to a view opposing religion or god won't reveal himself to me? I should only listen to one point of view? If someone listens to only one view, how are they supposed to critically analyze that view to ensure it's true? What you are asking me to do is literally abandon reason.
Also you didn't answer my previous question about having to be chosen.
@cynisturbI mean that we have a soul and we need to take care of our spiritual side ,we are not just a mind and a body get in touch with God and have a sixth sense
@majorl31 There is NO EVIDENCE to support your claim. Noone has presented any testable and independently verifiable evidence to support that claim. Henceforth, I have no reason to believe any such god exists. Now, replace the word "god" with "unicorn", Bigfoot", or "leprechauns" and demonstrate how your claim is any less ridiculous.
@cynisturb No evidence except the the whole creation ,you should read Einsteins book as he states that a super intelligence had to be responsible for the universe being created,then there is DNA which is a code or language in each of us and we each have a separate DNA did you know that code comes from a mind?the mind of GOD the creator the God who I know exists and who cares for those who will acknowledge HIm
@majorl31 "No evidence except the the whole creation" How is that evidence that can be tested? "you should read Einsteins book" You should read Darwin's book. Either way, just because they say something in their books, doesn't mean they are right. "then there is DNA" So. DNA is evidence of evolution, not creation. "did you know that code comes from a mind?" Incorrect analogy. "the mind of GOD" Evidence? How do you explain chromosome 2?
@cynisturb Based on your insane reply,this is how you would view your car,your computer,your house,you would look at them and say wow they are nice but no design needed,no builder required,in fact even though life is more complex you believe that it didn't require any plan whatsoever,common sense you throw it right out the window ,you are absurd!
@majorl31 How was my reply insane? Your reply seemed to have been one long non-sequitor and you conclusions are totally baseless. If you want to have an adult conversation, I suggest you ask questions instead of making assertions. Speculations and conjectures are usually entertaining when it comes to gossip, but has no real value when determining truth and adds absolutely nothing to a conversation.
@cynisturb well I already won the debate because I already know that a super intelligence created everything and I'm no Einstein so you need to get out of the dark
@majorl31 "well I already won the debate because I already know that a super intelligence created everything"
No. That's how you just lost the debate. Basically, argumentum ad tantrum. "I'm a know it all, so there! I win!"
Go look at ironchariotsdotorg. Your cosicfingerprints/dna/code argument is ripped apart there. Study the other arguments there as well. When you come up with a new argument that hasn't been debunked or maybe some evidence, we can continue our dialog.
@cynisturbin nutshell and so easy a caveman could understand it, here is how you think things came about the creation has a mind of its own and it can create,so therefore the creation is the creator.
The Bible speaks of you worshiping the creation rather than the creator ,how absurd ,your atheism is your belief system and you have to listen to your preachers here on youtube
@majorl31 "here is how you think things came about..."
No, that is not what I think. I don't worship anything or anyone. "My atheism" is not a belief system. "My atheism" is a lack of belief in "your claims" or "Your belief system". "My atheism" doesn't even have anything to do with my opinions regarding the origin(s) of the universe.
@cynisturb sure it is you believe there is no God so therefore that is your belief system,your having a hard time keeping up with me ,don't worry it happens a lot with atheists!
@cynisturb yes that is a belief system the reason atheists are always behind is we believers already KNOW there is a God we are waiting for you to catch up with us
@UnderlordZ Well its ver yhard not to see Gods handiwork in everything Einstein said in his book a super intelligence beyond our imagination a spirit was responsible for the universe Einstein and I agree are you with me
@majorl31 My standing is: you have yet to support your position with facts, so I am entirely within reason to not believe you. That's it! That's all atheism is: not believing god claims, until sufficient demonstrable evidence is provided to support said claim.
@UnderlordZ ah ha you lack the ability to connect the dots,clearly complex design requires a complex designer so you can't do simple deduction and you make it much too complicated
@majorl31 There actually have to be dots before they can be connected.
How did you deduce that life was designed? Demonstrate the designer in a way that is applicable to everyone on the planet that could not possibly be misinterpreted.
@UnderlordZ here is a dot for you ,detectives use it its called DNA each of our DNAs are different ,DNA can now be used in court to identify a particular individual as the person responsible for the crime,therefore DNA is a code ,a code comes from a mind and therefore I will now say that that min is the mind of the creator,thanks for asking
@majorl31 DNA in and of itself is not a code; it's a complex combination of nucleic acids that define individuality on a cellular level. We only identify it as some sort of code, because humans are pattern-seeking creatures, and we can use analogies to compare things that we interpret as similar.
Where is this 'creator'? What does it look like? Don't give me something you say he did; show me the actual creator itself.
@UnderlordZ I have tried to show you the creator but somehow you are blinded to what I say and your whole mission in life is to miss GOD so what is the use of me trying to lead you to God ,there is an old saying you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink,its up to you to find God
@majorl31 You are completely, absolutely, monumentally WRONG. As the asserting party, it is on you to provide evidence to support your claim.
How tall is god? Is god male or female? How long is god's hair, and what color is it? Eye color? What kind of clothing does god like to wear? And perhaps most importantly, why is god not answering any prayers asking for a better, more fair and peaceful world? Why do people in third world countries have to live in their own filth until they die of AIDS?
@UnderlordZ no I'm not wrong first of all GOD is a spirit the Bible says God is a spirit and Einstein said so also,the American Indian even worshiped the great spirit,and you are kinda have a split personality you ask God for peace ,the God you don't believe exists?
God chosen people the Jewish people rejected God,and they paid the price,if the whole world turned to God and repented to God and followed God then He would take care of them.
@majorl31 Using Einstein is an argument from authority; not valid. It doesn't matter if 4 out 5 dermatologists like Nike shoes; that tells me nothing about the actual product.
Using Native Americas (who worshipped numerous spirits per tribe, not just one) is an appeal to popularity; also invalid. Just because a lot of people believe something, doesn't automatically make it true. It must be demonstrated.
@majorl31 I didn't ask any god for anything; I asked YOU why a god who supposedly loves EVERYBODY is constantly playing favorites, why those favorites can never agree on who among them IS the favorite, AND why they can't all agree on one god.
@UnderlordZ well very well Jesus Christ warned of this very situation when he said there would be false Christs, wolves in sheep's clothing,false prophets and on and on ,He said that he alone was the way to God and if you tried any other way then you were a robber and a thief,so try Jesus ,the Bible has the answers but if you wish to keep on keeping on with you endless quest then that is up to you
@majorl31 Matthew 1:23 says that the messiah will be called Immanuel; Jesus is never referred as such, not even by Mary and Jospeh.
Romans 1:3 and Acts 2:30 say that the messiah would be a descendent of David, but how could Jesus have been such if god was his father, not Joseph?
Deuteronomy 23:2 says bastards (born out of wedlock) and their families for 10 generations are not to be allowed in the church; bible says Jesus was born of Mary and god, but Mary was wed to Joseph. Jesus is a bastard.
@UnderlordZ you atheists really do believe don't you but you don't like Gods way so therefore you keep looking for a loophole,well there are no loophole either you do it Gods way or your lame excuses won't hold up on your judgment day,when you die !
God created everything from absolutely nothing, by speaking, then picked one out of quadrillions of stars, put some planets around it, then picked the third one for no discernable reason. On this chosen planet, he made a man (out of dirt, despite the fact that he previously created everything else from absolutely nothing). When the man said he was lonely (despite god always being with him), god made him sleep, tahn stole one of the man's ribs and (cont.)
used the rib to make a woman (again, he couldn't just make her appear from nothing?). God told the man and woman they could eat from any tree in Garden, except the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, and that if they did eat from that specific trees, they would instantly die. One day, on the advice of a talking snake, the woman ate a fruit from the Tree. She didn't die, she got the man to eat some of the same fruit, and it was then and only then that they understood the idea of good and evil.
But because they did what god told them not to do, god banned them and all their descendents from paradise, FOREVER.
Skip forward a couple thousand years.
Jesus is literally god made flesh. He's killed, spends 3 days in hell, resurrects on Earth, and physically ascends into heaven (paradise) for the rest of eternity.
Now, god came down, got stabbed, visited hell, then went back home to heaven, as the ONLY POSSIBLE LOOPHOLE to our banning from paradise, and if we choose not to accept it...
then we deserve to go to hell and be tortured FOR THE REST OF ETERNITY. It doesn't matter how good we were when we were alive; if we didn't accept jesus, we deserve to fry.
On top of all that, god knew, before he evewn started, exactly how every detail would pan out, from beginning to end.
Here's an analogy: I throw you in the deep end of the pool, knowing full-well that you can't swim. I offer to get you out, but you have to do everything I say, or I shoot you dead.
If you refuse my offer, I drag you out and chain you to the ceiling of a dark, cold chamber, by your testicles for the rest of your life, and at my own descretion, beat you within an inch of your life with searing hot metal rods, because you DESERVE it for turning down my offer.
@UnderlordZ From the Bible for God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that none should perish but that all should have eternal life now the offer of amnesty is there for you so if you refuse to reconcile with God then it is your own rebellion and not anything else
@UnderlordZ Well its a fair offer repent of your sins and GOD is willing to reconcile with you and amke things right after all he has said that He would rather have you repent then you send yourself to Hell,just remember the offer in case you find yourself at the 11th hour if you won't take it now
@majorl31 Ah, Pascal's Wager; telling me I should believe just in case I'm wrong.
First of all, don't you think god would know if I was just saying that I believe just to cover my ass? Don't bother answering; he's omniscient, so he absolutely would know.
Second, what if you're wrong, but the Muslims are right? Then YOU'RE fucked. So after you've pledged your life in service to Allah, I may consider thinking about being completely dishonest to your all-knowing non-existent god.
@majorl31 You know my first hint that it's a bullshit site? They can't even be bothered to do enough research to use the correct form of "you're", as in "you are".
But of course, this is getting off the main point: because I don't think like you, the book that you take as the perfect and infallible word of your god (a book full of hundreds of errors and contradictions, btw) says that I deserve by choice to be tortured forever, because that's just the way the all-powerful sky-daddy made me.
@UnderlordZ now you are nitpicking again actually they were aware of that your and you're problem and they address that,something to so with picking what was available for the name of the site.
anyway yourgoingtohelldotcom show you the problem called sin that we all have and how to repent of that sine and reconcile with GOD,since its only your soul that is at stake you may want to explore that site and quit nitpicking
@majorl31 Yeah, see the thing is, the idea of sin is something invented BY THE CHRISTIAN CHURCH INDUSTRY, as a way to control you. They giove you a list of things they say are wrong or evil or bad, and tell you that if you do anything on that list, it doesn't matter what good you do; if you aren't disgusted and don't feel bad about BEING HUMAN, then you DESERVE to be tortured FOREVER. Why would you want to listen to ANYONE who would tell you something like that? How stupid do you have to be?!
@UnderlordZ The thing is that you have not thought about what sin does to people,when you steal from someone you are violating that person and trespassing on them for instance,if you covet what someone else has you can conceive thoughts that may make you do something to take that and again you have trespassed on that person,when you do things you should not do you will feel guilt and when you are ridden with guilt you will be very unhappy,the Bible says the wages of sin is death
@majorl31 If you 'covet' what someone else has, you have 2 options:
1) Steal it, and likely get arrested NOW, not get TORTURED FOR ETERNITY after your dead, or
2) Go buy one of your own, and help the economy along, which eventually helps everyone.
The bible also says that disobedient children are to put to death; don't we arrest and imprison people for that? Yes, we do, because we don't go by the rules and laws of the bible in the REAL WORLD.
@UnderlordZ the torture for eternity thing you keep referring to there is another place to go and spend eternity and that is Heaven but you get into Heaven by god way and not everyone gets in because man is in a fallen state now god has made a way for you to get to Heaven but it is up to you to take the offer and reconcile with God
@majorl31 Stop. Just fucking stop. You keep rambliong on about how god is all-loving, all-knowing, and all-powerful; what you completely fail to realise (or more likely, what you're intentionally ignoring) is that all of these traits are not only completely contradictory to what the bible actually says, but also comletely SELF-contradictory, as well.
On top of ALL of that, YOU HAVE STILL YET TO DEMONSTRATE YOUR GOD'S EXISTENCE! You can make absolutely no. Other. Claims about it, until you do.
@UnderlordZ I'm going to throw it back on you prove to me that there is no GOD,you have evidence that there is a GOD because a super-intelligence HAD to have designed the universe so prove that that is not true,your problem is that I have by logic shown you that an intelligence is very well behind the existence of everything but you keep running away from that back into your denial then you accuse me of not demonstrating to you that there is a GOD ,you are silly
@majorl31 I'm not saying that god doesn;t exist, nor am I saying he didn't design the Universe. I'm saying that when you say that he DID, it is YOU and YOU ALONE who carries the burden of proof for your statement.
I tell you I have a dead body in the trunk of my car. It's not on you to prove me wrong, you FUCKING DUMBASS. If you truly and honestly think that it is, then you are in a position where you have to believe EVERYTHING that anyone tells you.
@majorl31 Oh, so god only likes people who thinks he exists, and everyone else deserves by choice to be tortured forever. Yeah, that makes me want to waste the rest of my life worshipping him...
@UnderlordZ you need to work this out all you have to do is block me of you don't like what I say,you want me to show you GOD and i do my best to logically show you GOD,then you say that all along you didn't deny God exists,after all the denying,you atheists cannot prove GOD does not exist but insist on telling us to show you God and we give you our best argument and you don't like logic,so I take it you are an agnostic not an atheist at all!
@majorl31 you can't show god to anybody because he only exists in your imagination. The burden of proof is on your side, because you are the one making a positive claim (god exists). Unbelievers don't have to provide evidence for not believing, that's an absurd thing to ask for,
Also, agnosticism refers to what you KNOW, atheism refers to what you BELIEVE. Don't try to mix them, because they aren't the same thing. Atheism simply rejects the unproven claim about any gods existing.
@majorl31 Once again, there's no burden of proof in disbelief. And don't bring up bible verses, they are absolutely worthless. You believe this bullshit blindly without even understanding this particular book had HUMAN EDITORS. There's not a single shred of evidence about this thing being "divinely" inspired. Heck, there's not even a single shred of evidence about this imaginary character called god existing.
Some kids have imaginary friends, but they get over them when they reach adulthood.
@hellhammerz666 well go your way and I'll go my way but you see i know God ,you can have a relationship with God and people do not spend their lives believing fantasies i feel sad for you that you won't know God
@majorl31 Condescending, aren't we? This is one of the reasons why i find religions extremely mind-rotting: They provide unknown certainties and a fictitious sense of superiority. You feel sorry about me not knowing your imaginary friend, i feel sorry about you being gullible and not being able to provide evidence about him.
@hellhammerz666 and your not condescending,here's the thing man design requires a designer ,things that are created require a creator,so things created are evidence of GOD,it is not all that hard and God made us and it was on accident mate
@majorl31 That's precisely the point. There's no evidence for ANYTHING in the natural world being designed. If we were, as you claim, we wouldn't have so many flaws. Don't bring up the complexity argument, complexity doesn't necessarily imply design. In fact, for certain cases it would denote quite the opposite. What you're claiming is that your imaginary friend made everything out of a brainfart. Not very convincing, tbh.
@hellhammerz666 Yes it makes perfect sense that complex design required a complex intelligence to design it ,its like detective work ,the evidence leads to solving the crime and finding who did it!
@majorl31 You still don't get it, do you? Design, by definition is practical and perfect, it shouldn't have extra stuff. Nothing in nature is perfect, and every species has it's own flaws. If your god had actually made everything, he would have been extremely sloppy with his design. You claim your god is perfect, but he's incapable of making a perfect creation? If your god actually existed, which you haven't proved at all, he would be mediocre, at best.
@hellhammerz666 God is amazing, if you look around you,the sun is just the right distance from the earth,everything we need to sustain us is here ,your and my body's are complex and amazing,all the specie s of the world are amazing and they all work in balance,but you only see the flaws,and without flaws we could not know perfection
@majorl31 So what? that doesn't prove your god exists. That's only proof that earth conditions were relatively favorable for life to develop. Our bodies may be complex, but they have a lot of flaws. It's not about me only seeing flaws, it's about you not wanting to acknowledge the evident contradiction in your argument about a perfect and designed universe, which is you want to be true, but is simply not true at all.
@majorl31 So your god's standard of perfection is lower than mine? Wtf?
You are assuming i automatically go and commit crimes only because i don't believe in your fantasy friend. That's not how it works. I behave properly because i have common sense. If you only do good deeds to be on your god's good side, then you're just a hypocrite.
@hellhammerz666 no I don't get in Gods face and tell Him he is immoral,i don't know why you keep arguing with me if there is no God then why do you keep bad mouthing HIM?
@majorl31 It's not about your imaginations. It's about you pretending he's a moral standpoint when you haven't even managed to prove he's real, or at least morally syperior in any way, and trying to bring to the table really dumb assumptions about me as arguments simply for not believing the same crap as you do. Tossing random red herrings isn't going to sustain your argument. At most, it will denote it's evident frailty.
@hellhammerz666 I'm ready to end this discussion as i have more productive things to do i don't have to prove god exists to you therefore any replies from you will go in my trash so that I can get one with the rest of my life.
@majorl31 You should read the story of The Emperors New Clothes. The bible claims anyone who does not believe in the bible a Fool is just like the Clothes makers in the above story. They convince the Emperor that only wise men can see the clothes they have made for him and only a fool would say they don't exist. The Emperor who can not see them does not want to be thought a fool so parades naked down the public street. Circular logic is silly, the bible is true because it says so???
@robtay1963 bad analogy man,the Bible has been around now since thousands of years,and millions of Christians have found peace living it,the Bible is about man's fall from grace and Jesus paying the debt He did not owe for the debt we could not pay,bringing us back into God's grace!
@majorl311 I used to be a christian, Until one day I thought, hmm would I let my son die to save millions, yes if I had no choice, but then I am not god. In other words if I had to defuse a bomb or save my son from drowning , i suppose I would save the millions and let my son drown, but if I was God I could do both. What a sick god to require human sacrifice for what he could just have done anyway. I looked for answers in OT and found it sick and repulsive, later found answers in Science.
@majorl311 I think part of it is you miss my point. I don't believe in any invisible, intangible magic man...I don't believe in an after life, and I trust in modern Science.....That being said, if The biblical God were a real undeniable presence in the world I would be in the rebellion because I Don't find him morale. kind or loving, Power does not make one worthy of worship. If you found your self ruler of the world would you commit genocide on a regular basis. and want human sacrifice, sick
@robtay1963 you already in denial and in rebellion,the truth is the god of this world is the head of lust ,greed,lies scams the God of Heaven well He had this huge rebellion that's been going on for a while now!
@majorl311 You do realize that the same story was told in many cultures long before anyone heard of the Hebrew god. The bible is full of stories just like The Brothers Grimm's book, stories that have been passed around from culture to culture. It is all fiction. I was a christian, Now that I know the truth I can't go back to the believing without proof.. Christians are stubborn because they refuse to see religion as a cultural thing, You would argue about Zeus if from that time and place.
@robtay1963 well apparently you know little about my battle not to let God into my life and it was an overpowering battle and you knew it was between God and this present world and as you know Satan is the God of this world and as you know in the Lords prayer we are praying Our Father which art in Heaven Hallowed be thy name,Thy Kingdom come thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven,so I went to a church at 20 years of age and the battle was going on in me,I fought and it took all I had ,cont
@robtay1963 all I had in me in that church in Ruidoso New Mexico ,as a friend in the Air Force knew the pastor of this small church and we would spend the weekends there at his home,but I resisted God with all that I had in meand then it would be many years before my wife began to attend church and I was mad about this but she talked me into going one Sunday and as soon as we walked through the doors,I could sense God strongly again and this time I wanted more and more of what I was sensing!
@majorl311 Then May your god be with you if that is what you need. I find myself a better person for knowing that there is no god. Because I know my morals are not out of fear, when I help a person or am kind it is because that is who I am. And I suppose being raised by parents who gave me good moral values I do not believe one needs a god or a religion to tell them right from wrong. Act toward others as we truly want to be treated and the world would be a great place with or without God.
@robtay1963 knowing there is no God is impossible there is no way you can say you know there is no God because first of all you would have to definitely prove that and I would venture to say since this creation shows design that there is a designer behind it all and a very powerful one at that,
@majorl311 Any design we see is descriptive in nature; it is subjective and only there because we are here to assign it the characteristics of design.
And even if the world were designed, so what? That in no way points to any particular God concept. We could just as easily be hooked up to the Matrix, or we are the fever dream of some sleeping alien, or perhaps our entire Universe is some kind of biological preserve created to study the growth of sentient life over time.
@TheGeneralCritic The first three verses of Genesis accurately express all known aspects of the Creation. Science expresses the Universe in terms of: Time, Space, Matter, and Energy. In Genesis chapter one we read, " In the beginning (time) God created the heavens (Space) and the Earth (Matter)...then God said, " Let there be light (Energy)."-- No other creation account agrees with the observable evidence-- (Genesis 1:1-3).
accountable to God we were no accident godandscience org
@majorl311 And I suppose there is still a Firmament protecting us from the waters above? That the Earth sits upon pillars? That Adam could have named all the species in any conceivable amount of time?
You're falling into a trap known as 'Confirmation Bias', whereby you already believe something so you see only what will reinforce that belief and downplay or ignore any contradictory evidence. That's why psuedo-scientific malarkey such as what you posted could ever be convincing to you.
@TheGeneralCritic Yes well ok lets go with your story ,there was nothing and out of nothing came everything and then everything came with it's own intelligence and evolved into something ?
@majorl311 No, I never made such a claim. I have no idea how the Universe came to be. We, as a species, have an idea of what happened moments AFTER the beginning- the expansion of the Universe, the coalescence of gas into stars, the formation of planets, etc. Where it all comes from, where matter comes from, are answers we do not yet have.
'I don't know' is a better answer than any other I have heard concerning the origin of the Universe, because it is intellectually honest and rational.
@TheGeneralCritic Godandscience org see what Einstein had to say about it and others,now leave me alone,your not an accident of nature we have a creator!
@TheGeneralCritic all the signs are here for the second coming of Christ,the Four Horseman of the Apocalypse are near ,nations are in distress ,natural disasters are on the rise ,here is the scenario,a solar conveyor on the sun and a huge solar flare hits the earth and all communications and technology are wiped out,foods stocks in stores runs out ,oil is not available ,people panic and a crises the likes the world has never seen will ensue,because we relied on those things totally The end!
@TheGeneralCritic The Earth free-floats in space, affected only by gravity. While other sources declared the Earth sat on the back of an elephant or turtle, or was held up by Atlas, the Bible alone states what we know true- "He hangs the earth on nothing"-(Job 26:7)-
God is the super intelligence responsible for everything we now see,if man was not in rebellion then we would have peace!
@TheGeneralCritic Our bodies are made from the dust of the ground (Genesis 2:7 & 3:19). Researchers at NASA's Ames Research Center confirmed that every element in Humans can be found in the soil. Scientist have discovered that the Human body is comprised of some 28 base and trace elements- ALL of which are found in the dust of the ground.- Genesis not an accident that we have this account,its like the owners manual!
@majorl311 I agree and disagree, I believe that it is okay to say something does not exist when there is no tangible definable, testable evidence of the said object. I don't mean your feelings or because someone got better who might have gotten better anyway. I mean a physical presence. or amputees regrowing limbs on record. If god were real no one would be arguing the case. But yes I can not present proof there is no god only that there is no need for the belief in god. watch these videos.
@robtay1963 God is the intelligent designer behind it all and atheists look around them and see complex design in the universe and upon the earth then they say were is the evidence of the creator when they are looking everyday at His creation !
@majorl311 Ok, well may your god bless you....Nothing will ever convince you unless you want it too. I know because once I said the same things you said. But consider this, most of the time when you ask a Christian "What proof would make you see that there is no god or at least that the Biblical is not real", they will answer "Nothing could make me lost my faith". But Ask an atheist what would make you believe and you will get a whole list of things. so whose is closed minded. my list follows.
Matt is like a chaingun, Hitchens brother...no christian can survive him.
calabarbean 1 week ago 2
God Bless you all!
angelinewinter84 2 months ago
@angelinewinter84
No thanks! :-)
papermermaid 1 month ago 4
What drives atheist crazy is christian always say Evolution is a theory, without really understanding what a scientific theory even is. It is a way to describe something that has already been observed. It is not a guess A hypothesis is a guess at how an observed event happens, it is then tested and retested by other sources until at some point it is Called a Theory, the model used changes or new fact are discovered, but those usually compliment the original theory not disprove it. Evolution=fact
robtay1963 3 months ago
@robtay1963 so it would be safe using simple logic to say that if something is designed like the universe and the earth in it and life upon it ,that since it shows design that we can deduct by simple common sense that since it shows design ,that it must have a super intelligent designer and since it had to be created then it must have a creator,after all if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck it must be a duck,creation the is created and there is creator,simple done!
majorl311 3 months ago
have you not heard the tale of the ant and the grasshopper ,its was summer and the ant was piling away food and building a shelter and preparing for winter and the grasshopper well he just ate and played around and the ant told him to prepare for winter but the grasshopper didn't see the need because he didn't believe in winter so the wise ant made it and the grasshopper perished and the Bible says consider the ant how he prepares and works and plans for winter is coming to all!
majorl311 3 months ago
matt is great, ahah!
bekacynthia 6 months ago
waa waa waa God is immoral ,wait a minute isn't this an atheist video ,don't atheists not believe there is a God ?
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Btw, atheists believe no gods exist, but you are missing the point. This is about how contradictory the so called "god's character" is, not about wether god exists or not. What you are doing there is simply acknowledging the argument Matt used against that christian guy, disregarding the fact that it clearly demonstrates this god character is a fucking jackass.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
@hellhammerz666 you call God immoral because you don't like justice,its like you being a rebel and you think when you do what you want and it breaks laws then that the police busting you makes them immoral
majorl31 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Psalms 14 The fool has said in his heart there is no GOD.
Professing themselves to be wise they became fools
majorl31 1 year ago
i thought john was going to hang up first!
xenomann442 1 year ago
ironchariots. org
talkorigins. org
wiki. ironchariots. org/index. php? title=Information_Theory_Argument
cynisturb 1 year ago
cosmicfingerprintsdotcom
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31
talkoriginsdotcom
ironchariotsdotorg
cynisturb 1 year ago
an atheist saying God is immoral is very strange because they believe there is no GOD
majorl31 1 year ago
Why do you care so much about all those chritians that belive a god? Dont you think that your a hypocrite because of what your doing.... (This question goes to Mat, if any one wants to answear for him go ahead)
IvanMaster13 1 year ago
The Bible says that we Christians would be considered foolish by the world so again the Bible was right like the Bible always is right
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 A lot of religions talk about how some will oppose you and ridicule you, it's an essential part of the brainwashing.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid yes well tell me if you die first what you find on the other side please
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 I don't have to die, most probably, you wont find anything.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid I can absolutely promise you you shall find life on the otherside
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 How do you know? If your answer is "look at the trees" spare me.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid some of us have a sixth sense which we use
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 So I should just trust that you have a special sense and choose to believe like you? Sorry I need evidence. Can you demonstrate this sixth sense?
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid that is why you atheists can't find god or anything else you don't use your sixth sense ,you only want to rationalize everything
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 I will ask you again. Can you demonstrate this sixth sense? Can you explain how one uses it? You claim we just don't want to. But as far as I'm concerned this so called sense does not exist. It's not a matter of not wanting to. In fact if I knew the sense was real I would very much want to use it.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid here is clue if you want to be spiritual you must seek GOD to find God you must seek GOD f course you could seek the dark side of the spiritual but GOD is light and not darkness
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Okay, how do I seek him?
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid you desire to find God in your life and if the desire is sincere and true and you pursue him you will find Him, i found god in a church were the church was very alive with the spirit of God myself
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Well I was a christian and my desire to find god was sincere. But the more I tried to find him the more I realized he didn't exist. So I'm sorry but your advice doesn't work for me.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid I do not know what the problem was except for if you read what the Bible says about the chosen,or the elect of God many are called but few are chosen.
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Wait a minute... Are you suggesting now that only certain people are chosen to go to heaven? So now it's not just a matter of sincerely seeking salvation, but you also must be on the list? So I'm for whatever reason not on the list so I go to Hell? I must not be understanding you correctly.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid You say you were Christian and the Bible says God knew you from the womb and knowing you from the womb and knowing what your desires are going to be yes I believe that God is all knowing and knows who will reject Him and who won't
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Oh you did answer my previous question, I didn't see this response before.
Okay, well that's an interesting concept. So god knew I would reject him? But when I became an atheist, I rejected the idea that god exist. I did not reject god in the sense that I thought he was real but I didn't want to follow him. Also it was not my choice. I am intellectually honest, I came to the understanding that god probably doesn't exist so I had become an atheist unwillingly.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid God know all about you atheists ,you all are so funny saying GOD is immoral how is God immoral, He doesn't even exist to you?
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 I wasn't talking about if God was immoral, that's leading us off topic.
Yes, he doesn't exist to me. Did you think I thought he exist but didn't want to follow him? Why would I forfeit my eternal soul and send myself to hell for all eternity just so I can live how I want in this short finite life? If I thought that, I would be insane and therefore exempt from punishment.
It doesn't make sense to me that I deserve to go to hell because from my perspective, no religion is correct.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid The Bible is the correct version of things, a point in every direction ,after all is no point at all.
From the Bible ,there is a way that seems right unto man but the end there of is death
God's ways are above our ways .
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 I found your comment hard to understand. "a point in every direction"? What does that mean? I think you made a typo somewhere.
Anyway what I think you are trying to say is that the answers are in the bible. But I read the bible and that's a big part of why I became an atheist in the first place. Also no matter what the bible says the bible can't be proof of itself. That is circular logic.
If I felt there was a reasonable possibility that god exist I would pursue him.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid A point in every direction is saying there are many truths ,when truth itself indicates that there cannot be many truths,Jesus declared He was the truth and I believe He is .
There s a very reasonable possibility that here is a creator God so pursue Him>
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31
1.) Atheist say the character of god as depicted in the bible is immoral. No need to believe he is real to judge the character of the fictional character that real people worship.
2.) You still seem to be talking in riddles about this many truths thing. You claim that there is a real possibility but you have not demonstrated it. Also I have pursued god already as I told you. But I never found reasonable evidence for him. No special sense developed. I just don't buy it.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid No they said GOD is immoral and if they believe that then they believe there is a GOD?
The whole Bible is a riddle waiting to be solved and if you understood the key to the Bible you also could solve the riddle!
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 They said the god of the bible is immoral. By that they meant the character in the story. I can say Darth Vader is evil, it doesn't mean I believe he is real.
If you have to believe god exist before you can solve the riddle of the bible and the bible is the main evidence to believe god exist in the first place... that's circular logic. I'm sorry but that is not a good way to determine fact from fantasy.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@Khyrid Perhaps we should part our ways since we can't find any common ground here good luck in the future
Without faith it is impossible to find GOD
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Very well, goodbye.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@majorl31 I am the truth. I am the light. I am the way. I am the cheese!
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturb yes you are kinda cheesy
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Freddy Krueger is immoral and just as fictional as your god.
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturb yea sure an that is a joke the creator who put us here is My God and I have no doubt about it,you watch too many horror movies
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 I only mentioned one horror movie character and you state I watch to many horror films?!?! Is it not possible to know who Freddy Krueger is without watching any horror films at all?
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturb cosmicfingerprintsdotcom go to this site and get updated on the latest evidence of a creator or God as we call Him
majorl31 1 year ago
@Khyrid Tell me sincerely how are you going to find God when you are following Matt here
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31
First of all I don't follow anyone. I think for myself.
Secondly... I shouldn't even listen to a view opposing religion or god won't reveal himself to me? I should only listen to one point of view? If someone listens to only one view, how are they supposed to critically analyze that view to ensure it's true? What you are asking me to do is literally abandon reason.
Also you didn't answer my previous question about having to be chosen.
Khyrid 1 year ago
@majorl31 What do you mean by "spiritual"?
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturbI mean that we have a soul and we need to take care of our spiritual side ,we are not just a mind and a body get in touch with God and have a sixth sense
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 THANK YOU! You just admitted that believing in a god is not rational!
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturb actually it is rational to believe in God because He made us and gave us everything to sustain us here on planet earth
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 There is NO EVIDENCE to support your claim. Noone has presented any testable and independently verifiable evidence to support that claim. Henceforth, I have no reason to believe any such god exists. Now, replace the word "god" with "unicorn", Bigfoot", or "leprechauns" and demonstrate how your claim is any less ridiculous.
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturb No evidence except the the whole creation ,you should read Einsteins book as he states that a super intelligence had to be responsible for the universe being created,then there is DNA which is a code or language in each of us and we each have a separate DNA did you know that code comes from a mind?the mind of GOD the creator the God who I know exists and who cares for those who will acknowledge HIm
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 "No evidence except the the whole creation" How is that evidence that can be tested? "you should read Einsteins book" You should read Darwin's book. Either way, just because they say something in their books, doesn't mean they are right. "then there is DNA" So. DNA is evidence of evolution, not creation. "did you know that code comes from a mind?" Incorrect analogy. "the mind of GOD" Evidence? How do you explain chromosome 2?
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturb Based on your insane reply,this is how you would view your car,your computer,your house,you would look at them and say wow they are nice but no design needed,no builder required,in fact even though life is more complex you believe that it didn't require any plan whatsoever,common sense you throw it right out the window ,you are absurd!
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 How was my reply insane? Your reply seemed to have been one long non-sequitor and you conclusions are totally baseless. If you want to have an adult conversation, I suggest you ask questions instead of making assertions. Speculations and conjectures are usually entertaining when it comes to gossip, but has no real value when determining truth and adds absolutely nothing to a conversation.
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturb simple common sense tells me that there is a creator God but you dance around common sense and avoid it like the plague
majorl31 1 year ago
Comment removed
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Still, you have yet to explain human chromosome 2. You also seem to have difficulty distinguishing abiogenesis from evolution.
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturb well I already won the debate because I already know that a super intelligence created everything and I'm no Einstein so you need to get out of the dark
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 "well I already won the debate because I already know that a super intelligence created everything"
No. That's how you just lost the debate. Basically, argumentum ad tantrum. "I'm a know it all, so there! I win!"
Go look at ironchariotsdotorg. Your cosicfingerprints/dna/code argument is ripped apart there. Study the other arguments there as well. When you come up with a new argument that hasn't been debunked or maybe some evidence, we can continue our dialog.
cynisturb 1 year ago
@majorl31 "and I'm no Einstein so you need to get out of the dark"
You're right. You are no Einstein. So stop pretending you are more intelligent and knowledgeable than Einstein was.
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturbin nutshell and so easy a caveman could understand it, here is how you think things came about the creation has a mind of its own and it can create,so therefore the creation is the creator.
The Bible speaks of you worshiping the creation rather than the creator ,how absurd ,your atheism is your belief system and you have to listen to your preachers here on youtube
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 "here is how you think things came about..."
No, that is not what I think. I don't worship anything or anyone. "My atheism" is not a belief system. "My atheism" is a lack of belief in "your claims" or "Your belief system". "My atheism" doesn't even have anything to do with my opinions regarding the origin(s) of the universe.
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturb sure it is you believe there is no God so therefore that is your belief system,your having a hard time keeping up with me ,don't worry it happens a lot with atheists!
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 When did I state there is no god? I believe bigfoot doesn't exist. Is that a belief system?
I can't keep up with all of your logical fallacies and circular arguments. All your arguments are debunked on ironchariots. org so have at it Hoss!
cynisturb 1 year ago
@cynisturb yes that is a belief system the reason atheists are always behind is we believers already KNOW there is a God we are waiting for you to catch up with us
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 How do you know? What was it that convinced you that some god not only exists, but created the entirety of existence as we know it?
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ Well its ver yhard not to see Gods handiwork in everything Einstein said in his book a super intelligence beyond our imagination a spirit was responsible for the universe Einstein and I agree are you with me
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 I've seen you pretending to be on par with Einstein, and you're clearly not; it's an insult to his intelligence.
Einstein was a deist, and only because he didn't know any better in that case because of the limited scientific knowledge of his time.
But that's not the point. I asked you why YOU think your god exists, and you give me 'it's really hard not to see it'.
BULL.
FUCKING.
SHIT.
Give me a real answer, or shut your damn mouth.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ So you think you can shut me up because you are a you tube bully .
Well here it is like 2+2 is 4 ,design requires a designer and creation requires a creator can you think logically at all?
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Asking for a real answer to a question does not a bully make.
All you've done is assert that existence was designed and created; you haven't demonstrated it, and thus still have no standing.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ you have no standing I ask you to use some logic and you are not capable of that apparently, like so many atheists
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 My standing is: you have yet to support your position with facts, so I am entirely within reason to not believe you. That's it! That's all atheism is: not believing god claims, until sufficient demonstrable evidence is provided to support said claim.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ ah ha you lack the ability to connect the dots,clearly complex design requires a complex designer so you can't do simple deduction and you make it much too complicated
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 There actually have to be dots before they can be connected.
How did you deduce that life was designed? Demonstrate the designer in a way that is applicable to everyone on the planet that could not possibly be misinterpreted.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ here is a dot for you ,detectives use it its called DNA each of our DNAs are different ,DNA can now be used in court to identify a particular individual as the person responsible for the crime,therefore DNA is a code ,a code comes from a mind and therefore I will now say that that min is the mind of the creator,thanks for asking
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 DNA in and of itself is not a code; it's a complex combination of nucleic acids that define individuality on a cellular level. We only identify it as some sort of code, because humans are pattern-seeking creatures, and we can use analogies to compare things that we interpret as similar.
Where is this 'creator'? What does it look like? Don't give me something you say he did; show me the actual creator itself.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ I have tried to show you the creator but somehow you are blinded to what I say and your whole mission in life is to miss GOD so what is the use of me trying to lead you to God ,there is an old saying you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink,its up to you to find God
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 You are completely, absolutely, monumentally WRONG. As the asserting party, it is on you to provide evidence to support your claim.
How tall is god? Is god male or female? How long is god's hair, and what color is it? Eye color? What kind of clothing does god like to wear? And perhaps most importantly, why is god not answering any prayers asking for a better, more fair and peaceful world? Why do people in third world countries have to live in their own filth until they die of AIDS?
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ no I'm not wrong first of all GOD is a spirit the Bible says God is a spirit and Einstein said so also,the American Indian even worshiped the great spirit,and you are kinda have a split personality you ask God for peace ,the God you don't believe exists?
God chosen people the Jewish people rejected God,and they paid the price,if the whole world turned to God and repented to God and followed God then He would take care of them.
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Using Einstein is an argument from authority; not valid. It doesn't matter if 4 out 5 dermatologists like Nike shoes; that tells me nothing about the actual product.
Using Native Americas (who worshipped numerous spirits per tribe, not just one) is an appeal to popularity; also invalid. Just because a lot of people believe something, doesn't automatically make it true. It must be demonstrated.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@majorl31 I didn't ask any god for anything; I asked YOU why a god who supposedly loves EVERYBODY is constantly playing favorites, why those favorites can never agree on who among them IS the favorite, AND why they can't all agree on one god.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ well very well Jesus Christ warned of this very situation when he said there would be false Christs, wolves in sheep's clothing,false prophets and on and on ,He said that he alone was the way to God and if you tried any other way then you were a robber and a thief,so try Jesus ,the Bible has the answers but if you wish to keep on keeping on with you endless quest then that is up to you
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Matthew 1:23 says that the messiah will be called Immanuel; Jesus is never referred as such, not even by Mary and Jospeh.
Romans 1:3 and Acts 2:30 say that the messiah would be a descendent of David, but how could Jesus have been such if god was his father, not Joseph?
Deuteronomy 23:2 says bastards (born out of wedlock) and their families for 10 generations are not to be allowed in the church; bible says Jesus was born of Mary and god, but Mary was wed to Joseph. Jesus is a bastard.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ you atheists really do believe don't you but you don't like Gods way so therefore you keep looking for a loophole,well there are no loophole either you do it Gods way or your lame excuses won't hold up on your judgment day,when you die !
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 So, let me see if I get this:
God created everything from absolutely nothing, by speaking, then picked one out of quadrillions of stars, put some planets around it, then picked the third one for no discernable reason. On this chosen planet, he made a man (out of dirt, despite the fact that he previously created everything else from absolutely nothing). When the man said he was lonely (despite god always being with him), god made him sleep, tahn stole one of the man's ribs and (cont.)
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
used the rib to make a woman (again, he couldn't just make her appear from nothing?). God told the man and woman they could eat from any tree in Garden, except the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, and that if they did eat from that specific trees, they would instantly die. One day, on the advice of a talking snake, the woman ate a fruit from the Tree. She didn't die, she got the man to eat some of the same fruit, and it was then and only then that they understood the idea of good and evil.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
But because they did what god told them not to do, god banned them and all their descendents from paradise, FOREVER.
Skip forward a couple thousand years.
Jesus is literally god made flesh. He's killed, spends 3 days in hell, resurrects on Earth, and physically ascends into heaven (paradise) for the rest of eternity.
Now, god came down, got stabbed, visited hell, then went back home to heaven, as the ONLY POSSIBLE LOOPHOLE to our banning from paradise, and if we choose not to accept it...
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
then we deserve to go to hell and be tortured FOR THE REST OF ETERNITY. It doesn't matter how good we were when we were alive; if we didn't accept jesus, we deserve to fry.
On top of all that, god knew, before he evewn started, exactly how every detail would pan out, from beginning to end.
Here's an analogy: I throw you in the deep end of the pool, knowing full-well that you can't swim. I offer to get you out, but you have to do everything I say, or I shoot you dead.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
If you refuse my offer, I drag you out and chain you to the ceiling of a dark, cold chamber, by your testicles for the rest of your life, and at my own descretion, beat you within an inch of your life with searing hot metal rods, because you DESERVE it for turning down my offer.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@UnderlordZ From the Bible for God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that none should perish but that all should have eternal life now the offer of amnesty is there for you so if you refuse to reconcile with God then it is your own rebellion and not anything else
majorl31 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ Well its a fair offer repent of your sins and GOD is willing to reconcile with you and amke things right after all he has said that He would rather have you repent then you send yourself to Hell,just remember the offer in case you find yourself at the 11th hour if you won't take it now
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Ah, Pascal's Wager; telling me I should believe just in case I'm wrong.
First of all, don't you think god would know if I was just saying that I believe just to cover my ass? Don't bother answering; he's omniscient, so he absolutely would know.
Second, what if you're wrong, but the Muslims are right? Then YOU'RE fucked. So after you've pledged your life in service to Allah, I may consider thinking about being completely dishonest to your all-knowing non-existent god.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@majorl31 But of course, none of that matters in the slightest until you demonstrate that your god exists.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ waaaaaaaaa waaaaaaaaaaaaa waaa,you know I'm right and you whine and cry well that isn't going to cut it so grow up
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Those who choose not to live in reality, don't get to demand that others do.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ I can't demand you do anything and you can't demand i do anything check this out this is a real website, yourgoingtohelldotcom
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 You know my first hint that it's a bullshit site? They can't even be bothered to do enough research to use the correct form of "you're", as in "you are".
But of course, this is getting off the main point: because I don't think like you, the book that you take as the perfect and infallible word of your god (a book full of hundreds of errors and contradictions, btw) says that I deserve by choice to be tortured forever, because that's just the way the all-powerful sky-daddy made me.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ now you are nitpicking again actually they were aware of that your and you're problem and they address that,something to so with picking what was available for the name of the site.
anyway yourgoingtohelldotcom show you the problem called sin that we all have and how to repent of that sine and reconcile with GOD,since its only your soul that is at stake you may want to explore that site and quit nitpicking
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Yeah, see the thing is, the idea of sin is something invented BY THE CHRISTIAN CHURCH INDUSTRY, as a way to control you. They giove you a list of things they say are wrong or evil or bad, and tell you that if you do anything on that list, it doesn't matter what good you do; if you aren't disgusted and don't feel bad about BEING HUMAN, then you DESERVE to be tortured FOREVER. Why would you want to listen to ANYONE who would tell you something like that? How stupid do you have to be?!
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ The thing is that you have not thought about what sin does to people,when you steal from someone you are violating that person and trespassing on them for instance,if you covet what someone else has you can conceive thoughts that may make you do something to take that and again you have trespassed on that person,when you do things you should not do you will feel guilt and when you are ridden with guilt you will be very unhappy,the Bible says the wages of sin is death
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 If you 'covet' what someone else has, you have 2 options:
1) Steal it, and likely get arrested NOW, not get TORTURED FOR ETERNITY after your dead, or
2) Go buy one of your own, and help the economy along, which eventually helps everyone.
The bible also says that disobedient children are to put to death; don't we arrest and imprison people for that? Yes, we do, because we don't go by the rules and laws of the bible in the REAL WORLD.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ the torture for eternity thing you keep referring to there is another place to go and spend eternity and that is Heaven but you get into Heaven by god way and not everyone gets in because man is in a fallen state now god has made a way for you to get to Heaven but it is up to you to take the offer and reconcile with God
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Stop. Just fucking stop. You keep rambliong on about how god is all-loving, all-knowing, and all-powerful; what you completely fail to realise (or more likely, what you're intentionally ignoring) is that all of these traits are not only completely contradictory to what the bible actually says, but also comletely SELF-contradictory, as well.
On top of ALL of that, YOU HAVE STILL YET TO DEMONSTRATE YOUR GOD'S EXISTENCE! You can make absolutely no. Other. Claims about it, until you do.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ I'm going to throw it back on you prove to me that there is no GOD,you have evidence that there is a GOD because a super-intelligence HAD to have designed the universe so prove that that is not true,your problem is that I have by logic shown you that an intelligence is very well behind the existence of everything but you keep running away from that back into your denial then you accuse me of not demonstrating to you that there is a GOD ,you are silly
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 I'm not saying that god doesn;t exist, nor am I saying he didn't design the Universe. I'm saying that when you say that he DID, it is YOU and YOU ALONE who carries the burden of proof for your statement.
I tell you I have a dead body in the trunk of my car. It's not on you to prove me wrong, you FUCKING DUMBASS. If you truly and honestly think that it is, then you are in a position where you have to believe EVERYTHING that anyone tells you.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ I didn't say that God was all loving He is to those who obey but God can be wrathful!
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Oh, so god only likes people who thinks he exists, and everyone else deserves by choice to be tortured forever. Yeah, that makes me want to waste the rest of my life worshipping him...
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ you need to work this out all you have to do is block me of you don't like what I say,you want me to show you GOD and i do my best to logically show you GOD,then you say that all along you didn't deny God exists,after all the denying,you atheists cannot prove GOD does not exist but insist on telling us to show you God and we give you our best argument and you don't like logic,so I take it you are an agnostic not an atheist at all!
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 This is the last time I'm tellig you this: it is NOT the atheists responsibility to prove you wrong.
Your knowledge of definitions is...I honestly can't find a word to express how monumentally retarded you've proven yourself to be.
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ Its a good thing that I know that you are wrong about me isn't it because all the hateful stuff you say rolls right off me :-)
majorl31 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ Matt is my master I shall not know GOD,He makes me lay down in Godless places,he leads me beside shrill
liars,he destroys my soul,He leads me in the path of wrongness,for his own
sake,yea though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death I will fear
no evil for he is with me , it's all a delusion he prepares a table for me
nothing is on it,he anoints my head with arrogance my cup is full surely
emptiness shall follow me all the days of my life a grave awaits me
majorl31 1 year ago
@UnderlordZ Tell me again please because its not my fault you can't use logic very well
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 you can't show god to anybody because he only exists in your imagination. The burden of proof is on your side, because you are the one making a positive claim (god exists). Unbelievers don't have to provide evidence for not believing, that's an absurd thing to ask for,
Also, agnosticism refers to what you KNOW, atheism refers to what you BELIEVE. Don't try to mix them, because they aren't the same thing. Atheism simply rejects the unproven claim about any gods existing.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
@hellhammerz666 Yea what can i expect from an unbeliever
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 You can expect someone who isn't gullible. If that's a bad thing for you, that's your problem.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
@hellhammerz666 yes well your gullible to believe this crap about there being no GOD
the fool has said in his heart there is NO GOD! that is from the Bible
also from the Bible it says professing themselves to be wise they became fools
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Once again, there's no burden of proof in disbelief. And don't bring up bible verses, they are absolutely worthless. You believe this bullshit blindly without even understanding this particular book had HUMAN EDITORS. There's not a single shred of evidence about this thing being "divinely" inspired. Heck, there's not even a single shred of evidence about this imaginary character called god existing.
Some kids have imaginary friends, but they get over them when they reach adulthood.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
@hellhammerz666 well go your way and I'll go my way but you see i know God ,you can have a relationship with God and people do not spend their lives believing fantasies i feel sad for you that you won't know God
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Condescending, aren't we? This is one of the reasons why i find religions extremely mind-rotting: They provide unknown certainties and a fictitious sense of superiority. You feel sorry about me not knowing your imaginary friend, i feel sorry about you being gullible and not being able to provide evidence about him.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
@hellhammerz666 and your not condescending,here's the thing man design requires a designer ,things that are created require a creator,so things created are evidence of GOD,it is not all that hard and God made us and it was on accident mate
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 That's precisely the point. There's no evidence for ANYTHING in the natural world being designed. If we were, as you claim, we wouldn't have so many flaws. Don't bring up the complexity argument, complexity doesn't necessarily imply design. In fact, for certain cases it would denote quite the opposite. What you're claiming is that your imaginary friend made everything out of a brainfart. Not very convincing, tbh.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
@hellhammerz666 Yes it makes perfect sense that complex design required a complex intelligence to design it ,its like detective work ,the evidence leads to solving the crime and finding who did it!
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 You still don't get it, do you? Design, by definition is practical and perfect, it shouldn't have extra stuff. Nothing in nature is perfect, and every species has it's own flaws. If your god had actually made everything, he would have been extremely sloppy with his design. You claim your god is perfect, but he's incapable of making a perfect creation? If your god actually existed, which you haven't proved at all, he would be mediocre, at best.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
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majorl31 1 year ago
@hellhammerz666 God is amazing, if you look around you,the sun is just the right distance from the earth,everything we need to sustain us is here ,your and my body's are complex and amazing,all the specie s of the world are amazing and they all work in balance,but you only see the flaws,and without flaws we could not know perfection
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 So what? that doesn't prove your god exists. That's only proof that earth conditions were relatively favorable for life to develop. Our bodies may be complex, but they have a lot of flaws. It's not about me only seeing flaws, it's about you not wanting to acknowledge the evident contradiction in your argument about a perfect and designed universe, which is you want to be true, but is simply not true at all.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
@hellhammerz666 It has flaws by the standards you say yes,but it is an amazing universe
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 So your god's standard of perfection is lower than mine? Wtf?
You are assuming i automatically go and commit crimes only because i don't believe in your fantasy friend. That's not how it works. I behave properly because i have common sense. If you only do good deeds to be on your god's good side, then you're just a hypocrite.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
@hellhammerz666 no I don't get in Gods face and tell Him he is immoral,i don't know why you keep arguing with me if there is no God then why do you keep bad mouthing HIM?
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 It's not about your imaginations. It's about you pretending he's a moral standpoint when you haven't even managed to prove he's real, or at least morally syperior in any way, and trying to bring to the table really dumb assumptions about me as arguments simply for not believing the same crap as you do. Tossing random red herrings isn't going to sustain your argument. At most, it will denote it's evident frailty.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
@hellhammerz666 I'm ready to end this discussion as i have more productive things to do i don't have to prove god exists to you therefore any replies from you will go in my trash so that I can get one with the rest of my life.
take caee mate
majorl31 1 year ago
@majorl31 Go ahead. I'm happy knowing you at least thought about it.
hellhammerz666 1 year ago
@majorl31 You should read the story of The Emperors New Clothes. The bible claims anyone who does not believe in the bible a Fool is just like the Clothes makers in the above story. They convince the Emperor that only wise men can see the clothes they have made for him and only a fool would say they don't exist. The Emperor who can not see them does not want to be thought a fool so parades naked down the public street. Circular logic is silly, the bible is true because it says so???
robtay1963 3 months ago
@robtay1963 bad analogy man,the Bible has been around now since thousands of years,and millions of Christians have found peace living it,the Bible is about man's fall from grace and Jesus paying the debt He did not owe for the debt we could not pay,bringing us back into God's grace!
majorl311 3 months ago
@majorl311 I used to be a christian, Until one day I thought, hmm would I let my son die to save millions, yes if I had no choice, but then I am not god. In other words if I had to defuse a bomb or save my son from drowning , i suppose I would save the millions and let my son drown, but if I was God I could do both. What a sick god to require human sacrifice for what he could just have done anyway. I looked for answers in OT and found it sick and repulsive, later found answers in Science.
robtay1963 3 months ago
@majorl311 I think part of it is you miss my point. I don't believe in any invisible, intangible magic man...I don't believe in an after life, and I trust in modern Science.....That being said, if The biblical God were a real undeniable presence in the world I would be in the rebellion because I Don't find him morale. kind or loving, Power does not make one worthy of worship. If you found your self ruler of the world would you commit genocide on a regular basis. and want human sacrifice, sick
robtay1963 3 months ago
@robtay1963 you already in denial and in rebellion,the truth is the god of this world is the head of lust ,greed,lies scams the God of Heaven well He had this huge rebellion that's been going on for a while now!
majorl311 3 months ago
@majorl311 You do realize that the same story was told in many cultures long before anyone heard of the Hebrew god. The bible is full of stories just like The Brothers Grimm's book, stories that have been passed around from culture to culture. It is all fiction. I was a christian, Now that I know the truth I can't go back to the believing without proof.. Christians are stubborn because they refuse to see religion as a cultural thing, You would argue about Zeus if from that time and place.
robtay1963 3 months ago
@robtay1963 well apparently you know little about my battle not to let God into my life and it was an overpowering battle and you knew it was between God and this present world and as you know Satan is the God of this world and as you know in the Lords prayer we are praying Our Father which art in Heaven Hallowed be thy name,Thy Kingdom come thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven,so I went to a church at 20 years of age and the battle was going on in me,I fought and it took all I had ,cont
majorl311 3 months ago
@robtay1963 all I had in me in that church in Ruidoso New Mexico ,as a friend in the Air Force knew the pastor of this small church and we would spend the weekends there at his home,but I resisted God with all that I had in meand then it would be many years before my wife began to attend church and I was mad about this but she talked me into going one Sunday and as soon as we walked through the doors,I could sense God strongly again and this time I wanted more and more of what I was sensing!
majorl311 3 months ago
@majorl311 Then May your god be with you if that is what you need. I find myself a better person for knowing that there is no god. Because I know my morals are not out of fear, when I help a person or am kind it is because that is who I am. And I suppose being raised by parents who gave me good moral values I do not believe one needs a god or a religion to tell them right from wrong. Act toward others as we truly want to be treated and the world would be a great place with or without God.
robtay1963 3 months ago
@robtay1963 knowing there is no God is impossible there is no way you can say you know there is no God because first of all you would have to definitely prove that and I would venture to say since this creation shows design that there is a designer behind it all and a very powerful one at that,
godandscience org
majorl311 3 months ago
@majorl311 Any design we see is descriptive in nature; it is subjective and only there because we are here to assign it the characteristics of design.
And even if the world were designed, so what? That in no way points to any particular God concept. We could just as easily be hooked up to the Matrix, or we are the fever dream of some sleeping alien, or perhaps our entire Universe is some kind of biological preserve created to study the growth of sentient life over time.
TheGeneralCritic 3 months ago
@TheGeneralCritic The first three verses of Genesis accurately express all known aspects of the Creation. Science expresses the Universe in terms of: Time, Space, Matter, and Energy. In Genesis chapter one we read, " In the beginning (time) God created the heavens (Space) and the Earth (Matter)...then God said, " Let there be light (Energy)."-- No other creation account agrees with the observable evidence-- (Genesis 1:1-3).
accountable to God we were no accident godandscience org
majorl311 3 months ago
@majorl311 And I suppose there is still a Firmament protecting us from the waters above? That the Earth sits upon pillars? That Adam could have named all the species in any conceivable amount of time?
You're falling into a trap known as 'Confirmation Bias', whereby you already believe something so you see only what will reinforce that belief and downplay or ignore any contradictory evidence. That's why psuedo-scientific malarkey such as what you posted could ever be convincing to you.
TheGeneralCritic 3 months ago
@TheGeneralCritic Yes well ok lets go with your story ,there was nothing and out of nothing came everything and then everything came with it's own intelligence and evolved into something ?
majorl311 3 months ago
@majorl311 No, I never made such a claim. I have no idea how the Universe came to be. We, as a species, have an idea of what happened moments AFTER the beginning- the expansion of the Universe, the coalescence of gas into stars, the formation of planets, etc. Where it all comes from, where matter comes from, are answers we do not yet have.
'I don't know' is a better answer than any other I have heard concerning the origin of the Universe, because it is intellectually honest and rational.
TheGeneralCritic 3 months ago
@TheGeneralCritic Godandscience org see what Einstein had to say about it and others,now leave me alone,your not an accident of nature we have a creator!
majorl311 3 months ago
@TheGeneralCritic all the signs are here for the second coming of Christ,the Four Horseman of the Apocalypse are near ,nations are in distress ,natural disasters are on the rise ,here is the scenario,a solar conveyor on the sun and a huge solar flare hits the earth and all communications and technology are wiped out,foods stocks in stores runs out ,oil is not available ,people panic and a crises the likes the world has never seen will ensue,because we relied on those things totally The end!
majorl311 3 months ago
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@TheGeneralCritic The Earth free-floats in space, affected only by gravity. While other sources declared the Earth sat on the back of an elephant or turtle, or was held up by Atlas, the Bible alone states what we know true- "He hangs the earth on nothing"-(Job 26:7)-
God is the super intelligence responsible for everything we now see,if man was not in rebellion then we would have peace!
majorl311 3 months ago
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@TheGeneralCritic Our bodies are made from the dust of the ground (Genesis 2:7 & 3:19). Researchers at NASA's Ames Research Center confirmed that every element in Humans can be found in the soil. Scientist have discovered that the Human body is comprised of some 28 base and trace elements- ALL of which are found in the dust of the ground.- Genesis not an accident that we have this account,its like the owners manual!
majorl311 3 months ago
@majorl311 I agree and disagree, I believe that it is okay to say something does not exist when there is no tangible definable, testable evidence of the said object. I don't mean your feelings or because someone got better who might have gotten better anyway. I mean a physical presence. or amputees regrowing limbs on record. If god were real no one would be arguing the case. But yes I can not present proof there is no god only that there is no need for the belief in god. watch these videos.
robtay1963 3 months ago
@robtay1963 God is the intelligent designer behind it all and atheists look around them and see complex design in the universe and upon the earth then they say were is the evidence of the creator when they are looking everyday at His creation !
majorl311 3 months ago
@majorl311 Ok, well may your god bless you....Nothing will ever convince you unless you want it too. I know because once I said the same things you said. But consider this, most of the time when you ask a Christian "What proof would make you see that there is no god or at least that the Biblical is not real", they will answer "Nothing could make me lost my faith". But Ask an atheist what would make you believe and you will get a whole list of things. so whose is closed minded. my list follows.
robtay1963 3 months ago