shes quite amazing! i have just begun to really appreciate opera after learning an italian arts songs, which i will perform at a recital. I do believe that she does sound better when singing in a more classical style...yet I love her voice no matter what she sings :)
Renee started in Jazz. For someone to say she is embarrasing herself by singing this beautiful song obviously shows that person is lacking in the knowledge and understanding of Renee and her history. Being able to sing in this style is just one of the qualities that makes her classical singing so great. I would say to Idagnefoki get over your self and your arrogance and really listen with an open ear to a great singer making all kinds of music her own! I bet you can't do it.
Renee Fleming has never hit a bad note no matter what she is singing--she just sounds different singing this type song and I love her no mater what she sings.
@Idagnefoki I highly doubt she's embarrassed by an emotionally riveting, note-perfect delivery of a classic. I for one am grateful she doesn't limit herself to a single genre.
Anyways, how about that Renee Fleming huh? Personally I'm not very fond of her rendition of Hallelujah here, it just doesn't feel very natural. I am a huge fan of her work, but I feel as if this was a bit under par. Maybe it's just because I'm predisposed to her singing classically, although I thought it was absolutely beautiful when she sang Amazing Grace after the attacks on 9/11.
I'm gonna go out on a limb here, and state that I do NOT like this. I love Renee Fleming's wonderful voice, when she sings opera. This song, this music -- which I love when sung by other singers such as k d lang, the Canadian tenors, etc. - this is not suited to Ms. Fleming's awesome singing voice, which BEGS to be singing opera. Opera, not pop music. It's like listening to Barbra Streisand trying to sing Desdemona's "Willow Song". It just ain't right!
IT'S A FASCINATING ALBUM which requires really listening carefully over repeated playings and considerable time. She's trying to plow new ground and what she's attempting is difficult and slippery to grasp but worth the effort.
Listened to your music, Halleluja on SBS Australia, loved it, bought your cd (black hope) immediately. Thank you for producing and singing this song and others. Luv!
I love Renee Fleming but never thought in a million years believe she could sing rock or pop. I did not care for her Haunted Heart jazz album and her Broadway duets album with Bryn Terfl was a little too operatic and contrived. But Dark Hope is magnificent. Its as if Anita Baker and Annie Lennox voices were mixed together. I would say that for opera she is a lyric soprano but for for pop/rock she should stay contralto because this range is so earthy and beautiful
@MrCafiero No opera singers are mic'd; an overall performance may be amplified through the use of strategically placed condenser mics , but no specific opera singer will ever be mic'd in an operatic performance. Please refrain from making stupid comments from now on.
@tenor220 Well, denial gets you nothing. I know MANY people who have witnessed it first hand. Not just them being mic'd, but it cutting out during a performance. Get a clue.
@MrCafiero lol funny thing!... they do it but without anyone's knowledge!... it's done in complete secrecy!... a few years ago anna netrebko (one of today's so called great start) confessed to having had a microphone between her breasts before she had her first child!! ... at the time it was going on, nobody knew!!!... so generally , they're not supposed to be amplified but if a voice is too small relartive to the other singers they secretly shove a mic in the cleavage!
@nicktabus1000 Right....that must be the case! LOL! NOT! I have professional friends or peopel I have worked with including singers, conductors and COACHES who have ALL witnessed it first hand. It is common knowledge for those who are in the business and who are not just sticking their heads in the sand.
@MrCafiero I'm not going to argue with you. Obviously you haven't been to good opera houses... Because in good opera houses the singers aren't "mic'd". Us the audience would notice it, it would sound very different. It also probably wouldn't work because the opera house has the acoustics for acoustic singing, not mic'd singing.
@nicktabus1000 Oh, so the Met, NYC opera, SF Opera, Teatro Real in Madrid etc. are all bad houses? Get a clue. Nothing will change for the better while people like you allow these places to get away with it. Get a backbone guy.
@MrCafiero Actually, I take lessons at the Eastman school and last semester I went to see my teacher perform in an opera. She wasn't mic'd. Not even secretly. The auditoriums are built to carry the sound so that, when coupled with the projection of the singers, it fills the full auditorium.
@kudasango So, because you go to Eastman that means no opera singers are every mic'd? I don't think so. Many are mic'd. It isn't debatable, but it is a fact.
@MrCafiero I didn't say I go to Eastman, I said I take lessons there. Stop being to defensive, you're making yourself look bad. I didn't say that opera singers are never mic'd, I said that every opera I've seen, including my teacher's recital, refrained from the use of microphones.
Now stop being so butthurt over such a petty thing.
@kudasango Oh, you take lessons there. Even better. WHo cares if the operas you seen weren't mic'd to your knowledge. I know successful artists, directors and conductors who have had HUGE, no small, HUGE careers and have witnessed it. So YOU get over YOURSELF. There is no point in defending a lie. That is pathetic.
@MrCafiero The fact that you are getting so upset over such a petty thing really testifies to your self-righteousness and an obvious desire to be recognized. I find it rather sad. I have nothing to get over if my own experiences are true. Quite frankly, the size of a person's career has no hold over the extent of their talent. Justin Bieber is famous isn't he? My argument is simply this: Many opera performances are not mic'd, that is the way they did it prior to technological advancement as well
@kudasango You are really just not well thought out. Nothing you are saying is going against what I am saying, but yet you go on and on. WHO CARES if a couple recitals you saw weren't mic'd. Many are. And people are not aware of it. That is not fair. Opera houses are not being honest. Whether it is 50 or 1000 or 10000. It is wrong. And who said being famous means you are good? ROFL! I think NOT. Nothing I said applies to that.
@kudasango Wow, it is petty if operas are being mic'd and shouldn't be? People like you are disgusting and part of the whole problem. That is why CRAP is accepted now.
@MrCafiero Stop. Go back. Point out EXACTLY where I said ANYTHING about my stance on using microphones in opera. I said that the ones I've seen didn't use them, and that you should be happy about that because it means those ones aren't using microphones. You have some major comprehension issues.
@kudasango You are seriously one of the most stupid people I have ever had a conversation with. I have said FROM THE BEGINNING, it does NOT MATTER IF A COUPLE OF RECITALS you saw were not mic'd. So your original comment was STUPID! I already know, as I also said, that not EVERY SINGLE OPERA ON EARTH IS MIC'D. So your comments are beyond idiotic.
@MrCafiero hahaha dude you have some major internet rage problems. Calm down before you give yourself an aneurysm. The whole point of my initial post was to say "hey check it out, I've seen several operas that never used microphones. Isn't that cool? Doesn't that mean there's hope yet?" Then you raged. Hard.
@MrCafiero How is that self-important? That's exactly the same thing as you saying that you know people who have seen a few performances that do use microphones. You think anybody really cares if microphones are used or not? They care just about as much as they care about the fact that some don't use them. So now you're moving into semantics. And apparently you also don't know the difference between a performance and a recital...
@kudasango Wait, you, who isn't anyone, saw a recital? And you think that is the same as professionals who have sung with these people, at these venues, and also directors, coaches, conductors is the same thing? Delusional much. Even Marilyn Horne warned about mic's years ago. And the Teatro Real is a major house. I am not the ONLY one claiming this stuff. ROFL! Unbelievable.
@MrCafiero Again, trying to demean me by saying I "isn't anyone" (yes, your grammar IS that bad), is a very weak argument tactic. But I digress...I have seen recitals, yes, but I'm not talking about recitals. I'm talking about actual operas that I have seen. I would hope that you would understand the difference here. And, again, I'm not saying microphones aren't used. I'm not even trying to argue anything. I was simply pointing out the fact that I haven't run into that issue in my experience.
@MrCafiero You're the one who immediately jumped on the defensive with no provocation whatsoever. If you can't deal with the fact that some people who have seen several professionally performed operas have not run into the issue of seeing a performance that uses microphones, then perhaps you should consider not posting something about how you have experienced it, because you're bound to run into someone who thinks "oh wow, I've never seen that happen actually".
CAPS LOCK DOES NOT MAKE YOU SOUND IMPORTANT. SEE? I DON'T SOUND IMPORTANT RIGHT NOW. IT JUST MAKES US ALL SOUND SILLY AND THEN NOBODY CAN TAKE THE COMMENT SERIOUSLY. O_O
@kudasango So, here we are at the true rage filled person. Hector projector much? ROFL! Same with the self righteous crap. You were self righteous with your first comment because what does it matter if one person at Eastman saw a couple of recitals? ROFL! Truly amazingly ironic.
I'm not defending a lie, since what I'm saying is obviously true. The claims you've been throwing out are far more far fetched than any example I have presented. The fact that you have to claim that you know people with "huge" careers, and the fact that that seems to be the only thing you can say, is what is "pathetic". Who cares if the people that YOU know use microphones? That doesn't change the fact that opera is traditionally sung without microphones.
@kudasango I never said people, "I KNOW" use mics. Can you read? They have witnessed others using mics. Do you really think I am going to name those people on her for little old you? ROFL! The LIE is that people are mic'd when they are supposed to be unmic'd. Simple. Listen to the crowd reaction at the Teatro Real in Spain. The singers were obviously mic'd. In a major house. It isn't MY claim, it was THERE's. So get clue.
@MrCafiero Protip: Taking the time to actually read a comment before replying to it helps to ensure that your reply actually makes sense. Everything you just said is either a restatement of something I already said, or is a very clear indication that you either didn't read what I said or you don't have the ability to read and comprehend.
@kudasango Read your protip to yourself. You are guilty. And now you take what I wrote about you not really saying anything that goes against what I am saying, and you are using it yourself. LAME! Find something to do.
@MrCafiero I wasn't trying to argue against you. You were simply talking about how a lot of people use microphones in operas nowadays, I just gave examples of when I've seen operas that didn't use microphones. It wasn't an argument, hence the "actually" not the "no, you're wrong". You're self-righteous self should have been happy to hear about it, since it shows that there are opera houses that aren't being "deceptive". You're just a miserable and defensive person is all.
@kudasango You make no sense. You sound like an idiot. You are not arguing against me, but then make a freaking point that has ANY relevance to my original point. Oh wait....you can't. It has nothing to do with "rage" or "self righteousness"...that just makes you feel better about your lame arguments. So if you are not arguing against me then stop writing stupid things.
@MrCafiero How can my arguments be lame if I'm not making arguments? You haven't provided a single post that holds any merit to it, you're just going off on rage-spewing tangents with grammar that would make a five year old blush. I'm pretty sure that sharing an experience about how I've never experienced an opera that used microphones is a.) pretty relevant to what you're saying, and b.) not stupid considering the fact that life experiences don't have the capacity to be "stupid"
And the protip was about actually reading comments so that when you rage you rage for the right reason. I'm not raging, but you apparently are. I've actually been thoroughly reading your (poorly written) comments, you apparently haven't been returning the courtesy. :P
But all of this bickering is beside the point of this video. So I'm just going to go back to admiring Renee Fleming's voice instead of continuously arguing like I was silly enough to start doing.
@kudasango Probably a Fleming fan or a person in denial that mic's aren't used. ROFL! If a million people say a stupid thing, it is STILL a stupid thing. Too bad for them.
@MrCafiero Please point out where I said microphones are never used. Because I never did. Not once. And reporting a fact, in my case the fact that not a single opera I've seen used microphones (and yes, I know this for sure. I was not tricked), cannot be stupid. It is a fact, not an opinion. That would be like saying that 2+2=4 is stupid.
And hehehe it's okay, I understood what you were saying :)
>Probably a Fleming fan or a person in denial that mic's aren't used.
Are you even reading your own posts at this point? I don't think you're really in a position to be mocking my intelligence when you have very limited grammatical abilities, lapses in logic, and immediately have to resort to defensiveness rather than logical responses. I don't think you know what self-righteous means...I recommend you look it up.
@kudasango I was not talking about you when I wrote that. I was talking about whoever spam'd. OMG...this is hysterical. You are so stupid and boring I cannot waste any more time on you. You are no one, doing nothing, but watching vid's on youtube.
@MrCafiero With every post you make it becomes clearer and clearer to me that you have no conversational skills whatsoever. And I'm sure that you and I are at the same caliber of importance, considering the fact that we're both spending our time posting on a youtube video. And your angertastic performance was going on long before I decided to share a simple point of view. So believe what you want, I'm just gonna go on doing my little college thing and you can do your little music thing. :)
And I am a Fleming fan, but I've actually never seen her perform yet, though I'm going to see her next month. So I don't know what being a fan of a certain musician has to do with any of this...
And using "oh you're just a __ fan" as justification for anything takes away every right you think you ever had to claim that I am stupid hahahaha :P
@kudasango I see, well, that explains it. She may have recorded OK early on, but the voice is not near the level it should be. Not anything like the greats. And that is due to a complete lack of good teaching and mic's and enhancement that trick people like you.
@kudasango Wow. I teach a 5 Time Grammy Award winner, have toured extensively, been in the studio, also I teach graduates of Juilliard who have won major competitions. And yet I can hear it. But then again, I have been to many major houses. Thanks for your input though.
@MrCafiero You say that like it makes you socially competent or likable. In the end your demeanor speaks louder than your accomplishments. If you're responding to my comments like a five year old throwing a tantrum, odds are that is the kind of person you are. The funny thing is that for all the experience you have you must be much older than me, and yet I have somehow displayed far more maturity than you have by not jumping directly to name calling and such the way you did.
@MrCafiero You do know that teaching students doesn't automatically increase your ability to tell if someone is mic'd or not, right? I've actually spent time with sound engineers and the like, so I'm pretty sure that gives me just about as much qualification to hear the distortion in sound quality that comes with using a microphone. I'm sure if I'd been at the performances you went to that used them, I'd be able to tell as well. Credentials mean nothing in areas they don't apply to. :)
@kudasango You are ignorant of real voice teaching or you would not make such an idiotic statement. Secondly, I have worked with "sound engineers" and many of them are totally lacking in knowledge about the voice. And I am talking about big name engineers. And none of this matters anyway since you said that some operas are mic'd - well you did not refute it. So, case closed.
@MrCafiero You are just absolutely desperate for people to think you are important, aren't you? The only thing you seem qualified to do is ramble on about how you have worked with "the biggest and the best" and how somehow that makes you worth listening to. You could have all the musical knowledge in the world, and yet, if they were to see how quickly your mental capacity reduces to that of an infant when faced with conflicting views, very few people would be inclined to listen to it.
@MrCafiero You claim that it is "people like me" that are a part of the problem. But the difference between you and I is that I am actually willing to look in the mirror and admit my faults. You, however, are so caught up in some sense of self-importance that you don't seem to notice how much of a stereotype you are. Every word that you write paints a picture of a pretentious diva with his nose turned upward sneering down at the rest of the world, feeling that none can touch his accomplishments.
@kudasango You have no clue how stupid your comments are and if you did you would be embarrassed. I have people coming in from all over the world and top schools who beg for this training. NO JOKE!. If they read the crap you are writing they would laugh. I give all my energy, time and training to fixing many voices that are majorly damaged by the crap system that is developing singers that need to be mic'd. You are so out of line it is offensive.
@MrCafiero As much as I enjoy getting a good laugh from pointless arguments on youtube, six pages is quite long enough. I have read through this little verbal squabble, and I have a few things that I would like to point out… Hopefully, this will make you stop and think about what this looks like from another person’s point of view. Despite what you may think, you are the one making a fool of yourself, not Kudasango.
@MrCafiero Let’s start from the beginning, shall we? You were talking about how singers are mic’d and how this offends you, and it needs to be addressed. Kudasango stumbles upon this, and recalls a few situations in which she has seen operas performed at Eastman, where the singers were NOT mic’d due to the acoustics of the building. Am I correct?
@MrCafiero Here is where it gets tricky… You then proceed to assume she was saying that ALL opera singers are not mic’d. I never read the words “all opera singers” in Kudasango’s statement. So she clarifies to say that all of the operas witnessed by her personally were not mic’d. At this point, it’s clear that there was a misunderstanding. Conversation over, right? No.
@KappaOodobi OK, so, there is obviously no need at all, in any way, to state the obvious like she did. Obviously not every single opera is mic'd - as she was saying - and obviously not ALL operas are mic'd - as I was saying. So the whole thing has been pointless based on stating the glaringly obvious from the beginning. It doesn't have anything to do with the point that NO OPERAS should be mic'd because..then...it isn't opera. That is what should be clear here.
@MrCafiero Moving on, contrary to what you thought, her mentioning that she took lessons at Eastman was not a statement made in attempt to prove some sort of authority, it was simply her way of saying she has experience with listening to professionals, and she is not just some random person saying “hay guyse lok i think i no sumtin” as you seem to think she is.
@MrCafiero By the way, at this point, she has already apologized for the misunderstanding, making her the one who wears the pants in this argument. You can’t seem to accept that someone witnessed something that is a counterclaim to your argument. Yes, you may have at one point said that not every opera is mic’d; however, maybe she just accidentally looked over that before she commented. Again, a misunderstanding which she apologized for.
@MrCafiero You’re also accusing her of not actually reading your comments, but rather just re-stating things. I have a question. How can she re-state anything you’ve said if she hadn’t read it first? So what if she IS re-stating things. Have you ever heard of someone backing up their claim with evidence? That’s what she’s doing, and so am I. It’s basic writing skills to persuade someone to believe your claim. Which you have yet to do correctly, by the way.
@MrCafiero I have SO much more I can say, but I will chose not to. I will say this though, a teacher who continuously talks down to someone (over the internet, no less) doesn’t deserve to be a teacher. Oh, and I know what it takes to be a teacher, I’m studying to be one. (I hope you just thought that statement was idiotic, because EXACTLY how you sound every time you try to validate your point by informing us of your life achievements, which by the way, I don’t give a flying fuck about).
@MrCafiero Long story short: Suck it up, get the metal rod out of your ass, and the plugs out of your ears, and calm down. It’s not that big of a deal. You say your students will laugh at what she’s saying? Well guess what. I’m laughing at everything you’re saying because you’re just so damn stubborn. Now accept that this is all a misunderstanding, apologize as she already did, and relax. Fighting over the internet gets you nowhere in life.
@MrCafiero You're supposedly a grown man and yet I find that so hard to believe when the only things you seem to know how to say are "OMG" "ROFL" "idiot" "stupid" "moron" and "get a life". What? Do you not know how to disagree with people intelligently and so name calling becomes your last line of defense? I think the music community should be less concerned with the use of microphones and more concerned with the kinds of people they're apparently hiring to teach...
@kudasango What is your obsession? Know to go on and on and on. Now it is about using OMG and ROFL? This is just so stupid. And then you ask why I insult you. There is no other way of communicating with someone like you. You don't get it. You get obsessed and just are exhaustive without saying anything. Stick with the MAIN point. You are not here to teach manners to anyone.
This is an invalid point considering the fact that the first reply you ever made to my initial comment (which was discussing the use of microphones) was an insult.
@MrCafiero Okay, this got way out of hand a very long time ago and should have been over by now. So I'm just going to step back and take a breath and say this: You're absolutely right, the use of microphones in opera is a very sad thing and is not a very good practice. I think that the fact that you are teaching students to have voices that are strong without them is a great thing. It's really going to help ameliorate the problem, and I wish you the best of luck with that endeavor.
@MrCafiero However, if I could make one suggestion it would be to make an effort to be more understanding when people say something that doesn't necessarily mesh with what you believe. It really helps your case to be gentle, instead of insulting them right off the bat. People don't respond well to that. I also understand that I myself got carried away by it as well, but I'm pretty sure we can both agree on the main argument that using microphones in opera is not a good practice.
@MrCafiero Yes, I know that no one asked me to say anything, but I felt like I had to since the argument was going nowhere, and still is. Also, the fact that you keep using words such as "stupid", "idiot", and "moron" is quite annoying. Yes, you can say I have no life; however, this is the internet, and I do have a life. You've never met me, I've never met you. Yet here we are, you called me an idiot. Think. I approached this situation in a logical manner. What part of that was idiotic?
@kudasango ROFL! Really? Baseless? And you know this how? First of all, you don't know me at all, or my teaching, or my students. SO YOU have no basis you twit.
@MrCafiero You don't know me either, and yet you have no problem calling me stupid, calling me a twit, and continuously mocking my intelligence when you can't even carry on a mature conversation. You could win every prize and honour in the world yet at the end of the day, you are still only flesh and blood and nothing more. I don't know why you say I "have no basis". Basis for what? Arrogance? Not once have I claimed to be better than anyone, yet that seems to be one thing you just love to do.
@kudasango After you start insulting me with stupid comments then for sure I will call you out on it. Stop with the "arrogance" slant...it is SO childish. The fact is your first comment didn't really have any relevence. You just stated the obvious. My point was that mic'ing opera should stop. Do you agree? If you do then fine. Move on.
@MrCafiero Hm, and here I was under the impression that voice teachers needed to have social skills. There goes that theory. I'm not out of line, go back and read the first comment I posted. It was not offensive, it was not attacking anything. Then read your first reply to me. It was rude, it was defensive, it made me wonder if you were twelve years old. I have absolutely no respect for people like you. It is easy to be a good musician, it takes dedication to be a good person. You fail at that.
@MrCafiero Musicianship, and teaching, takes a certain level of professionalism that you obviously lack. The mature and adult thing to do would have been to calmly disagree with me, not to jump off the rail like a pretentious fool and immediately spew off grammatically poor insults that were completely unwarranted. What is insulting is watching somebody who clearly has no understanding of logical debate nor premise to mock me trying to undermine my intelligence. Actually, it's pathetic really.
@MrCafiero The fact that a grown man uses netspeak makes me question how seriously I should be taking you. You keep telling me to get over it, and yet here you are replying anyway. You're the only one here who seems to be throwing off insults in some hope that you could damage my self esteem. The fact is though, the fact that you get so angry and hateful over a single comment makes me feel rather bad for you.
@kudasango WHAT? So no one uses the internet to communicate? Are you for real? Just because you don't like what I said to you doesn't really matter. What matters is my students and what I am doing and the people who care about the truth. And the truth is the art of opera, great opera, is dying because of mic's and bad teaching. Voices are not how they used to be. So instead of worrying about my manners why don't you just move on? Seriously, you have major transference issues.
@MrCafiero If your goal is to get people to see that the use of microphones is hurting the voices of students, then what ever made you think that insulting people and attacking them is an effective way to get that message across? Do you think that any of them will be willing to take you seriously? You don't even give the benefit of the doubt, you just jump right in with nothing but nasty things to say and destroy your credibility right then and there.
@MrCafiero Where did that internet comment come from? Are you referring to my mention of your use of netspeak? Netspeak is the use of acronyms like "OMG" and "ROFL"
@MrCafiero If you're the professional adult you claim to be, then why haven't you stopped by now? This is what 15 year old girls do. They keep fighting a lost cause, and it never ends because neither side is willing to admit defeat. In this case, there will be no defeat no matter who stops commenting first. Might I add that using the phrase "OMG" to someone who has been taking note of your grammatical skill level is probably not the best idea. But what do I know? I'm an "idiot", right?
@KappaOodobi Hypocrite much? Why don't you stay on a point that matters. You are going to insult internet grammar as a means of making you feel good about yourself? ROFL! The point of all of this, and what actually matters, is that mic's are being used at many opera houses and that is wrong. So get a grip and move on. I don't need to convince people like you. You have yet to realize how completely insignificant you are in all actuality. But the internet makes you feel mighty.
@MrCafiero Slow down there speed racer... How am I being hypocritical? I never directly insulted you for using "internet grammar", I was simply pointing out that if someone is taking note of your grammar, you should use proper grammar so that you don't make a new problem. Why do you think this has gotten so off topic? You keep bringing in irrelevant details, which generate more conversation. She just agreed with you on your main topic. I would say "Thank you, I'm sorry for the misunderstanding."
@MrCafiero We're all insignificant if you really think about it. No matter what we all die in the end. However, she's working to make the world a better place by teaching, you're working to make the music industry return to its former glory by teaching. I'd say your both equally significant (or insignificant if you want to look at it that way) contributors to society. I say we end the banter and go back to being as happy and productive as we can in our actual lives. Don't you think?
@kudasango We are not all insignificant. Otherwise why should anyone bother living? What someone teaches and the results of that teaching make it and the person significant. Certainly someone like Puccini was significant. So, no, we are not all insignificant. As for pointless banter....yeah, that should stop.
@MrCafiero Well then why do you insist on calling someone whom you know nothing about insignificant? I'd say that's a tad hypocritical but hey, to each their own I suppose.
When I say insignificant, I mean on a universal scale. In the grander scheme of things, we're just dots on a page really. But you're right, if you can succeed in making the lives of those you know better and making the world a happier place, that is significance. So there you go, we're all equally significant in that case.
@kudasango I insist based on their comments. And because I also have taught students of just about every "top" teacher and famous coach out there. I have not heard any great singers coming out of Eastman on the level of the greats of the past. And I know the damage or limitations they have caused singers. Additionally, the importance of keeping opera grand is paramount. Accepting mediocrity, such as Fleming, or completely destroying the art by mic'ing it is a disgrace.
@MrCafiero Wait, so you're saying that based on what I said you can tell if I'm significant or not? I simply write a comment, and that condemns me to a life of being insignificant? I see no logic in that statement... But whatever. I'll keep doing my art thing, you keep doing your music thing. The significance of my life can't be judged by some random guy. Hell, I could just as easily call you insignificant considering I haven't seen solid evidence of your "significant" life's work. But I won't.
@MrCafiero If we're going to base a person's significance on the merit of their comments, then I'm afraid you may not like what you see in the mirror. Every post you make is an assault not only to the English language, but also to your credibility. Any person who cannot hold a calm and logical conversation with people who disagree with them, and whom have offered a kind word, is not deserving of any respect.
@MrCafiero If you feel the need to throw out "credentials" that may or may not be true in order to try to convince people that you have any authority or any intelligence at all, then you obviously have neither. If you are as successful as you claim yourself to be, then get off your high horse, stop throwing around "I did this" and "I did that" and actually back things up with well thought out replies instead of infantile name-calling. I don't listen to tantrums, I listen to logic. So use it.
@MrCafiero hahaha oh so you're caught up in the pretentiousness of the whole "Eastman vs. Julliard" thing? How very sad that you hold such bitterness. You remind me of a music teacher I had the displeasure of working with a few years ago who held unending resentment towards Josh Groban for no apparent reason. Everyone just assumed that he was bitter because he was less successful than Mr. Groban. I hope for your sake this isn't the vibe you give off in real life.
@kudasango What? Eastman v Juilliard? What are you talking about? I think they are both horrible. I don't are about any competition between both. They have horrid voice teachers. And Groban studied speech level which is also crap.
@MrCafiero Groban is still world famous and his voice is still in tact after all these years. Wait, why were you mentioning the fact that you teach Julliard students like it was a basis for bragging rights if you think the school is so horrible? That makes no sense.
Also, having met Dr. McIver who is the head of the Eastman choir department, I'd have to say his teaching style is very healthy and natural and respectable. I see nothing wrong with it. Plus none of the students use microphones. :)
@kudasango Right, Groban is great. No mic's or enhancement there. If you think that then it is all I need to know. I wrote that I teach graduates of Juilliard and the like. And the POINT is that they could not get good teaching at those schools. This is just too exhausting to keep having to correct your complete misunderstandings of what I write. I will waste no more of my time.
@MrCafiero Did I ever say that Groban doesn't use microphones? No, not once. The only thing I said is that he is world famous. That is not a statement of whether I think he's great or not or if he uses microphones or not. You just said he's crap, I just said he's world famous. And saiying that you "teach graduates of Julliard who have won competitions" and things like that, implies that you think Julliard gives you bragging rights, otherwise you would have mentioned your issue with the teaching.
@MrCafiero Clarity is a wonderful thing, you know. And it's really great for discussion. Assumptions, however, are something to avoid. Just a few pointers before we go off on our merry ways.
Also, do yourself a favour and lose the Messiah complex.
@kudasango Whether I mistype or not doesn't change your condition. I truly have met only a few people in my life who are as daft as you are. And I really should not argue with you anymore because you cannot help it that you just are not very swift. It is just the way you are. So go on and be merry. Ignorance is bliss.
@kudasango Glad you are feeling better. I thought you were just being argumentative and difficult for a while until I realized the true problem. Glad to clear it up. Be blissful.
@MrCafiero Lastly, my mentioning that I take lessons at Eastman was not a claim to authority, it was simply a way to set up the story of when I went to see the recital. You jump on the defensive far too easily, though I should apologize if that was misleading.
@kudasango Well, believe or not I have more authority than you do on this for a number of reasons. Firstly, I was highly trained by a master teacher. Secondly, I have friends, conductors, directors and colleagues who have witnessed mic'ing in major houses. Thridly, I teach many singers on a high level. I NEVER, EVER wrote that ALL opera performances are mic'd. So your arguments against what I am writing is based on a presumption on your part. Reading what is not there.
You said: And who said being famous means you are good?
When I had already said: the size of a person's career has no hold over the extent of their talent. Justin Bieber is famous isn't he?
And the fact that you were accusing me of claiming authority because I take lessons at Eastman, then going on to say that you have authority by taking lessons from a master teacher is the definition of hypocrisy.
@kudasango Again, who cares if you saw a recital. It has nothing to do with what I originally wrote and your comments thereafter have been nothing, but off the point. Again, it doesn't MATTER if you saw a recital here or there that was not mic'd. It has NOTHING to do with my original point. So your original argument should not have even been written. So enough of your crap.
@tenor220 Sorry, but this is simply not true and Mr. Cafiero is correct. There have been some notable opera singers who have been body mic'd in important opera houses on a regular basis. Of course, they wouldn't want the public to know about this, but those backstage, including the technical crew, know this goes on. And yes, there have been some embarrassing audio mishaps during performances.
@hassaine I love Renee Fleming ( I have even posted a video of her singing Amazing Grace at the 9/11 site) and I dearly love K.D. Lang's version of Halleluja,
but, the most spectacular version of this song is by Jeff Buckley ... just search
for Jeff Buckley Halleluja ... it's the one with the 15,000,000 hits, with good reason.
She does this really well...makes more sense than the pop singers do (sorry, lee, jason). And she has no problem singing the long hallelujah in one breath...hate it when they breathe in the middle of a word.
I think this is beautiful. One of my favourite covers of this song. As an operatic singer I love what she's doing. I think music belongs to everyone, and we shouldn't put sounds in boxes, nor performers. A person with a great voice is a person with a greta voice, and Fleming is certainly one of those. She's also a precious communicater - someone who really makes you resonate in sympathy with her.
@Scalatti I agree,it is dull as dishwater.She should have left this song to Jeff Buckley & K.d. Lang.Her voice just sounds weird too,the way she forms words is so odd and off.
@montsyblackmadonna Yes; props to her for being careful about the common flaw of classical singers sounding too classical when they try to cross over, but she's going to the other end of the spectrum, and intentially slurring and slouching vocally, which isn't quite working.
shes quite amazing! i have just begun to really appreciate opera after learning an italian arts songs, which i will perform at a recital. I do believe that she does sound better when singing in a more classical style...yet I love her voice no matter what she sings :)
mdiwan2597 1 month ago
She butchered the song!
MySensualWorld 5 months ago
Renee started in Jazz. For someone to say she is embarrasing herself by singing this beautiful song obviously shows that person is lacking in the knowledge and understanding of Renee and her history. Being able to sing in this style is just one of the qualities that makes her classical singing so great. I would say to Idagnefoki get over your self and your arrogance and really listen with an open ear to a great singer making all kinds of music her own! I bet you can't do it.
buddlight3nc 6 months ago 2
Wow! Side of her I have never seen before!! I love it!!
tresia622 6 months ago
מדהימה
dman2442 6 months ago
Renee Fleming has never hit a bad note no matter what she is singing--she just sounds different singing this type song and I love her no mater what she sings.
96meimei 6 months ago
sorry sweety, but you should go back to classical - that's where I adore you. You are embarasing yourself
Idagnefoki 10 months ago
@Idagnefoki I highly doubt she's embarrassed by an emotionally riveting, note-perfect delivery of a classic. I for one am grateful she doesn't limit herself to a single genre.
abaxteria 10 months ago
amazing voice!
AILEMAC62 11 months ago
Shit, her pop voice is beautiful, quite dark actually :)
WestVoice 11 months ago 5
Dunno whose voice is more beautiful, Renee Fleming's or Audra McDonalds =D both musical virtuosos!!
Falln4DarkAngel 1 year ago
@Falln4DarkAngel Check out alison crowe's! It's amazing!
BtArocks3133 10 months ago
Anyways, how about that Renee Fleming huh? Personally I'm not very fond of her rendition of Hallelujah here, it just doesn't feel very natural. I am a huge fan of her work, but I feel as if this was a bit under par. Maybe it's just because I'm predisposed to her singing classically, although I thought it was absolutely beautiful when she sang Amazing Grace after the attacks on 9/11.
kudasango 1 year ago
I'm gonna go out on a limb here, and state that I do NOT like this. I love Renee Fleming's wonderful voice, when she sings opera. This song, this music -- which I love when sung by other singers such as k d lang, the Canadian tenors, etc. - this is not suited to Ms. Fleming's awesome singing voice, which BEGS to be singing opera. Opera, not pop music. It's like listening to Barbra Streisand trying to sing Desdemona's "Willow Song". It just ain't right!
Peppi94 1 year ago
Funny how she's probably the only international artist who has recorded both Mozart's Alleluia from Exultate Jubilate, and Cohen's Hallelujah lol xD
Drelnis 1 year ago
Comment removed
Drelnis 1 year ago
good stuff =)
PS: one of the greatest opera singers alive: yes, however,
america's favorite soprano: gross overstatement
raigekimaru 1 year ago
@raigekimaru ? then who is America's favorite American soprano?
Drelnis 1 year ago
IT'S A FASCINATING ALBUM which requires really listening carefully over repeated playings and considerable time. She's trying to plow new ground and what she's attempting is difficult and slippery to grasp but worth the effort.
waynebrasler 1 year ago
Sorry, I like RF, but this was painful. B'bye....
victrola2007 1 year ago
I say nothing against her album, but why those gloves.....
ChaudeB 1 year ago
@anneayer: Fleming recorded a jazz album, Haunted Heart, a few years ago...
jvrooman1 1 year ago
Renée I would love to hear you do a jazz album!!!!
anneayer 1 year ago
Great Album I hope you record more music like this. I really enjoy listening to you sing..Thank You
hrsouder 1 year ago
Listened to your music, Halleluja on SBS Australia, loved it, bought your cd (black hope) immediately. Thank you for producing and singing this song and others. Luv!
EthioOz 1 year ago
I love Renee Fleming but never thought in a million years believe she could sing rock or pop. I did not care for her Haunted Heart jazz album and her Broadway duets album with Bryn Terfl was a little too operatic and contrived. But Dark Hope is magnificent. Its as if Anita Baker and Annie Lennox voices were mixed together. I would say that for opera she is a lyric soprano but for for pop/rock she should stay contralto because this range is so earthy and beautiful
vvrvelasco 1 year ago
Many opera singers today *ARE* mic'd. The Met has been mic'ing certain singers for years. This is a very boring performance. KD Lang is far better.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero No opera singers are mic'd; an overall performance may be amplified through the use of strategically placed condenser mics , but no specific opera singer will ever be mic'd in an operatic performance. Please refrain from making stupid comments from now on.
tenor220 1 year ago
@tenor220 Well, denial gets you nothing. I know MANY people who have witnessed it first hand. Not just them being mic'd, but it cutting out during a performance. Get a clue.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero lol funny thing!... they do it but without anyone's knowledge!... it's done in complete secrecy!... a few years ago anna netrebko (one of today's so called great start) confessed to having had a microphone between her breasts before she had her first child!! ... at the time it was going on, nobody knew!!!... so generally , they're not supposed to be amplified but if a voice is too small relartive to the other singers they secretly shove a mic in the cleavage!
CallasAfrica 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Its never happened, im sorry, opera singers are not mic'd. Have you ever been to an opera?
nicktabus1000 1 year ago
@nicktabus1000 Are you for real??? ROFL!
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Opera singers, while "IN THE OPERA" Not concerts, or galas, are not mic'd
nicktabus1000 1 year ago
Comment removed
nicktabus1000 1 year ago
Of course when performing in an arena, or outdoors they need mic's
nicktabus1000 1 year ago
@nicktabus1000 Right....that must be the case! LOL! NOT! I have professional friends or peopel I have worked with including singers, conductors and COACHES who have ALL witnessed it first hand. It is common knowledge for those who are in the business and who are not just sticking their heads in the sand.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero I'm not going to argue with you. Obviously you haven't been to good opera houses... Because in good opera houses the singers aren't "mic'd". Us the audience would notice it, it would sound very different. It also probably wouldn't work because the opera house has the acoustics for acoustic singing, not mic'd singing.
nicktabus1000 1 year ago
@nicktabus1000 Oh, so the Met, NYC opera, SF Opera, Teatro Real in Madrid etc. are all bad houses? Get a clue. Nothing will change for the better while people like you allow these places to get away with it. Get a backbone guy.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@nicktabus1000 ROFL! You must be insane.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Actually, I take lessons at the Eastman school and last semester I went to see my teacher perform in an opera. She wasn't mic'd. Not even secretly. The auditoriums are built to carry the sound so that, when coupled with the projection of the singers, it fills the full auditorium.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango So, because you go to Eastman that means no opera singers are every mic'd? I don't think so. Many are mic'd. It isn't debatable, but it is a fact.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero I didn't say I go to Eastman, I said I take lessons there. Stop being to defensive, you're making yourself look bad. I didn't say that opera singers are never mic'd, I said that every opera I've seen, including my teacher's recital, refrained from the use of microphones.
Now stop being so butthurt over such a petty thing.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Oh, you take lessons there. Even better. WHo cares if the operas you seen weren't mic'd to your knowledge. I know successful artists, directors and conductors who have had HUGE, no small, HUGE careers and have witnessed it. So YOU get over YOURSELF. There is no point in defending a lie. That is pathetic.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero The fact that you are getting so upset over such a petty thing really testifies to your self-righteousness and an obvious desire to be recognized. I find it rather sad. I have nothing to get over if my own experiences are true. Quite frankly, the size of a person's career has no hold over the extent of their talent. Justin Bieber is famous isn't he? My argument is simply this: Many opera performances are not mic'd, that is the way they did it prior to technological advancement as well
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango You are really just not well thought out. Nothing you are saying is going against what I am saying, but yet you go on and on. WHO CARES if a couple recitals you saw weren't mic'd. Many are. And people are not aware of it. That is not fair. Opera houses are not being honest. Whether it is 50 or 1000 or 10000. It is wrong. And who said being famous means you are good? ROFL! I think NOT. Nothing I said applies to that.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@kudasango Wow, it is petty if operas are being mic'd and shouldn't be? People like you are disgusting and part of the whole problem. That is why CRAP is accepted now.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Stop. Go back. Point out EXACTLY where I said ANYTHING about my stance on using microphones in opera. I said that the ones I've seen didn't use them, and that you should be happy about that because it means those ones aren't using microphones. You have some major comprehension issues.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango You are seriously one of the most stupid people I have ever had a conversation with. I have said FROM THE BEGINNING, it does NOT MATTER IF A COUPLE OF RECITALS you saw were not mic'd. So your original comment was STUPID! I already know, as I also said, that not EVERY SINGLE OPERA ON EARTH IS MIC'D. So your comments are beyond idiotic.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero hahaha dude you have some major internet rage problems. Calm down before you give yourself an aneurysm. The whole point of my initial post was to say "hey check it out, I've seen several operas that never used microphones. Isn't that cool? Doesn't that mean there's hope yet?" Then you raged. Hard.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango OMG...I cannot stop laughing. THANK GOD you told me you saw a couple of recitals that weren't mic'd. Self important much? ROFLMAO!
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero How is that self-important? That's exactly the same thing as you saying that you know people who have seen a few performances that do use microphones. You think anybody really cares if microphones are used or not? They care just about as much as they care about the fact that some don't use them. So now you're moving into semantics. And apparently you also don't know the difference between a performance and a recital...
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Wait, you, who isn't anyone, saw a recital? And you think that is the same as professionals who have sung with these people, at these venues, and also directors, coaches, conductors is the same thing? Delusional much. Even Marilyn Horne warned about mic's years ago. And the Teatro Real is a major house. I am not the ONLY one claiming this stuff. ROFL! Unbelievable.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Again, trying to demean me by saying I "isn't anyone" (yes, your grammar IS that bad), is a very weak argument tactic. But I digress...I have seen recitals, yes, but I'm not talking about recitals. I'm talking about actual operas that I have seen. I would hope that you would understand the difference here. And, again, I'm not saying microphones aren't used. I'm not even trying to argue anything. I was simply pointing out the fact that I haven't run into that issue in my experience.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero You're the one who immediately jumped on the defensive with no provocation whatsoever. If you can't deal with the fact that some people who have seen several professionally performed operas have not run into the issue of seeing a performance that uses microphones, then perhaps you should consider not posting something about how you have experienced it, because you're bound to run into someone who thinks "oh wow, I've never seen that happen actually".
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero One last thing,
CAPS LOCK DOES NOT MAKE YOU SOUND IMPORTANT. SEE? I DON'T SOUND IMPORTANT RIGHT NOW. IT JUST MAKES US ALL SOUND SILLY AND THEN NOBODY CAN TAKE THE COMMENT SERIOUSLY. O_O
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango So, here we are at the true rage filled person. Hector projector much? ROFL! Same with the self righteous crap. You were self righteous with your first comment because what does it matter if one person at Eastman saw a couple of recitals? ROFL! Truly amazingly ironic.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
I'm not defending a lie, since what I'm saying is obviously true. The claims you've been throwing out are far more far fetched than any example I have presented. The fact that you have to claim that you know people with "huge" careers, and the fact that that seems to be the only thing you can say, is what is "pathetic". Who cares if the people that YOU know use microphones? That doesn't change the fact that opera is traditionally sung without microphones.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango I never said people, "I KNOW" use mics. Can you read? They have witnessed others using mics. Do you really think I am going to name those people on her for little old you? ROFL! The LIE is that people are mic'd when they are supposed to be unmic'd. Simple. Listen to the crowd reaction at the Teatro Real in Spain. The singers were obviously mic'd. In a major house. It isn't MY claim, it was THERE's. So get clue.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero
0/10
Troll harder
And lrn2grammar
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Wow you need to get a life.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Protip: Taking the time to actually read a comment before replying to it helps to ensure that your reply actually makes sense. Everything you just said is either a restatement of something I already said, or is a very clear indication that you either didn't read what I said or you don't have the ability to read and comprehend.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Read your protip to yourself. You are guilty. And now you take what I wrote about you not really saying anything that goes against what I am saying, and you are using it yourself. LAME! Find something to do.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero I wasn't trying to argue against you. You were simply talking about how a lot of people use microphones in operas nowadays, I just gave examples of when I've seen operas that didn't use microphones. It wasn't an argument, hence the "actually" not the "no, you're wrong". You're self-righteous self should have been happy to hear about it, since it shows that there are opera houses that aren't being "deceptive". You're just a miserable and defensive person is all.
You mad?
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango You make no sense. You sound like an idiot. You are not arguing against me, but then make a freaking point that has ANY relevance to my original point. Oh wait....you can't. It has nothing to do with "rage" or "self righteousness"...that just makes you feel better about your lame arguments. So if you are not arguing against me then stop writing stupid things.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero How can my arguments be lame if I'm not making arguments? You haven't provided a single post that holds any merit to it, you're just going off on rage-spewing tangents with grammar that would make a five year old blush. I'm pretty sure that sharing an experience about how I've never experienced an opera that used microphones is a.) pretty relevant to what you're saying, and b.) not stupid considering the fact that life experiences don't have the capacity to be "stupid"
kudasango 1 year ago
And the protip was about actually reading comments so that when you rage you rage for the right reason. I'm not raging, but you apparently are. I've actually been thoroughly reading your (poorly written) comments, you apparently haven't been returning the courtesy. :P
But all of this bickering is beside the point of this video. So I'm just going to go back to admiring Renee Fleming's voice instead of continuously arguing like I was silly enough to start doing.
kudasango 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@kudasango The protip was stupid for the reasons already stated. You are obsessed with rage for some reason.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero lol someone flagged you as spam XD
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Probably a Fleming fan or a person in denial that mic's aren't used. ROFL! If a million people say a stupid thing, it is STILL a stupid thing. Too bad for them.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero I meant to write "mic's are used". ROFL!
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Please point out where I said microphones are never used. Because I never did. Not once. And reporting a fact, in my case the fact that not a single opera I've seen used microphones (and yes, I know this for sure. I was not tricked), cannot be stupid. It is a fact, not an opinion. That would be like saying that 2+2=4 is stupid.
And hehehe it's okay, I understood what you were saying :)
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango I never said you did. ROFL!! I said your point is irrelevant to my point. Comprehension 101. Or maybe 99 in your case! ROFL!
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero
>I never said you did.
see
>Probably a Fleming fan or a person in denial that mic's aren't used.
Are you even reading your own posts at this point? I don't think you're really in a position to be mocking my intelligence when you have very limited grammatical abilities, lapses in logic, and immediately have to resort to defensiveness rather than logical responses. I don't think you know what self-righteous means...I recommend you look it up.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango I was not talking about you when I wrote that. I was talking about whoever spam'd. OMG...this is hysterical. You are so stupid and boring I cannot waste any more time on you. You are no one, doing nothing, but watching vid's on youtube.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero With every post you make it becomes clearer and clearer to me that you have no conversational skills whatsoever. And I'm sure that you and I are at the same caliber of importance, considering the fact that we're both spending our time posting on a youtube video. And your angertastic performance was going on long before I decided to share a simple point of view. So believe what you want, I'm just gonna go on doing my little college thing and you can do your little music thing. :)
kudasango 1 year ago
And I am a Fleming fan, but I've actually never seen her perform yet, though I'm going to see her next month. So I don't know what being a fan of a certain musician has to do with any of this...
And using "oh you're just a __ fan" as justification for anything takes away every right you think you ever had to claim that I am stupid hahahaha :P
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango I see, well, that explains it. She may have recorded OK early on, but the voice is not near the level it should be. Not anything like the greats. And that is due to a complete lack of good teaching and mic's and enhancement that trick people like you.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero I grew up around soundboards. I can tell when microphones are being used.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Wow. I teach a 5 Time Grammy Award winner, have toured extensively, been in the studio, also I teach graduates of Juilliard who have won major competitions. And yet I can hear it. But then again, I have been to many major houses. Thanks for your input though.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero You say that like it makes you socially competent or likable. In the end your demeanor speaks louder than your accomplishments. If you're responding to my comments like a five year old throwing a tantrum, odds are that is the kind of person you are. The funny thing is that for all the experience you have you must be much older than me, and yet I have somehow displayed far more maturity than you have by not jumping directly to name calling and such the way you did.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero You do know that teaching students doesn't automatically increase your ability to tell if someone is mic'd or not, right? I've actually spent time with sound engineers and the like, so I'm pretty sure that gives me just about as much qualification to hear the distortion in sound quality that comes with using a microphone. I'm sure if I'd been at the performances you went to that used them, I'd be able to tell as well. Credentials mean nothing in areas they don't apply to. :)
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango You are ignorant of real voice teaching or you would not make such an idiotic statement. Secondly, I have worked with "sound engineers" and many of them are totally lacking in knowledge about the voice. And I am talking about big name engineers. And none of this matters anyway since you said that some operas are mic'd - well you did not refute it. So, case closed.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero You are just absolutely desperate for people to think you are important, aren't you? The only thing you seem qualified to do is ramble on about how you have worked with "the biggest and the best" and how somehow that makes you worth listening to. You could have all the musical knowledge in the world, and yet, if they were to see how quickly your mental capacity reduces to that of an infant when faced with conflicting views, very few people would be inclined to listen to it.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero You claim that it is "people like me" that are a part of the problem. But the difference between you and I is that I am actually willing to look in the mirror and admit my faults. You, however, are so caught up in some sense of self-importance that you don't seem to notice how much of a stereotype you are. Every word that you write paints a picture of a pretentious diva with his nose turned upward sneering down at the rest of the world, feeling that none can touch his accomplishments.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango You have no clue how stupid your comments are and if you did you would be embarrassed. I have people coming in from all over the world and top schools who beg for this training. NO JOKE!. If they read the crap you are writing they would laugh. I give all my energy, time and training to fixing many voices that are majorly damaged by the crap system that is developing singers that need to be mic'd. You are so out of line it is offensive.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero As much as I enjoy getting a good laugh from pointless arguments on youtube, six pages is quite long enough. I have read through this little verbal squabble, and I have a few things that I would like to point out… Hopefully, this will make you stop and think about what this looks like from another person’s point of view. Despite what you may think, you are the one making a fool of yourself, not Kudasango.
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Let’s start from the beginning, shall we? You were talking about how singers are mic’d and how this offends you, and it needs to be addressed. Kudasango stumbles upon this, and recalls a few situations in which she has seen operas performed at Eastman, where the singers were NOT mic’d due to the acoustics of the building. Am I correct?
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Here is where it gets tricky… You then proceed to assume she was saying that ALL opera singers are not mic’d. I never read the words “all opera singers” in Kudasango’s statement. So she clarifies to say that all of the operas witnessed by her personally were not mic’d. At this point, it’s clear that there was a misunderstanding. Conversation over, right? No.
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@KappaOodobi OK, so, there is obviously no need at all, in any way, to state the obvious like she did. Obviously not every single opera is mic'd - as she was saying - and obviously not ALL operas are mic'd - as I was saying. So the whole thing has been pointless based on stating the glaringly obvious from the beginning. It doesn't have anything to do with the point that NO OPERAS should be mic'd because..then...it isn't opera. That is what should be clear here.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Moving on, contrary to what you thought, her mentioning that she took lessons at Eastman was not a statement made in attempt to prove some sort of authority, it was simply her way of saying she has experience with listening to professionals, and she is not just some random person saying “hay guyse lok i think i no sumtin” as you seem to think she is.
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@MrCafiero By the way, at this point, she has already apologized for the misunderstanding, making her the one who wears the pants in this argument. You can’t seem to accept that someone witnessed something that is a counterclaim to your argument. Yes, you may have at one point said that not every opera is mic’d; however, maybe she just accidentally looked over that before she commented. Again, a misunderstanding which she apologized for.
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@MrCafiero You’re also accusing her of not actually reading your comments, but rather just re-stating things. I have a question. How can she re-state anything you’ve said if she hadn’t read it first? So what if she IS re-stating things. Have you ever heard of someone backing up their claim with evidence? That’s what she’s doing, and so am I. It’s basic writing skills to persuade someone to believe your claim. Which you have yet to do correctly, by the way.
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@MrCafiero I have SO much more I can say, but I will chose not to. I will say this though, a teacher who continuously talks down to someone (over the internet, no less) doesn’t deserve to be a teacher. Oh, and I know what it takes to be a teacher, I’m studying to be one. (I hope you just thought that statement was idiotic, because EXACTLY how you sound every time you try to validate your point by informing us of your life achievements, which by the way, I don’t give a flying fuck about).
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Long story short: Suck it up, get the metal rod out of your ass, and the plugs out of your ears, and calm down. It’s not that big of a deal. You say your students will laugh at what she’s saying? Well guess what. I’m laughing at everything you’re saying because you’re just so damn stubborn. Now accept that this is all a misunderstanding, apologize as she already did, and relax. Fighting over the internet gets you nowhere in life.
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@KappaOodobi Shut up and get a life. No one asked for your rant or for you to be involved. Idiot.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero You're supposedly a grown man and yet I find that so hard to believe when the only things you seem to know how to say are "OMG" "ROFL" "idiot" "stupid" "moron" and "get a life". What? Do you not know how to disagree with people intelligently and so name calling becomes your last line of defense? I think the music community should be less concerned with the use of microphones and more concerned with the kinds of people they're apparently hiring to teach...
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango What is your obsession? Know to go on and on and on. Now it is about using OMG and ROFL? This is just so stupid. And then you ask why I insult you. There is no other way of communicating with someone like you. You don't get it. You get obsessed and just are exhaustive without saying anything. Stick with the MAIN point. You are not here to teach manners to anyone.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero
>And then you ask why I insult you
This is an invalid point considering the fact that the first reply you ever made to my initial comment (which was discussing the use of microphones) was an insult.
lrn2logic
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Okay, this got way out of hand a very long time ago and should have been over by now. So I'm just going to step back and take a breath and say this: You're absolutely right, the use of microphones in opera is a very sad thing and is not a very good practice. I think that the fact that you are teaching students to have voices that are strong without them is a great thing. It's really going to help ameliorate the problem, and I wish you the best of luck with that endeavor.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero However, if I could make one suggestion it would be to make an effort to be more understanding when people say something that doesn't necessarily mesh with what you believe. It really helps your case to be gentle, instead of insulting them right off the bat. People don't respond well to that. I also understand that I myself got carried away by it as well, but I'm pretty sure we can both agree on the main argument that using microphones in opera is not a good practice.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Yes, I know that no one asked me to say anything, but I felt like I had to since the argument was going nowhere, and still is. Also, the fact that you keep using words such as "stupid", "idiot", and "moron" is quite annoying. Yes, you can say I have no life; however, this is the internet, and I do have a life. You've never met me, I've never met you. Yet here we are, you called me an idiot. Think. I approached this situation in a logical manner. What part of that was idiotic?
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@KappaOodobi Thank you for this. I'll admit the 2 posts I just made are a bit heated but if there's one thing I can't stand it's baseless arrogance.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango ROFL! Really? Baseless? And you know this how? First of all, you don't know me at all, or my teaching, or my students. SO YOU have no basis you twit.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero You don't know me either, and yet you have no problem calling me stupid, calling me a twit, and continuously mocking my intelligence when you can't even carry on a mature conversation. You could win every prize and honour in the world yet at the end of the day, you are still only flesh and blood and nothing more. I don't know why you say I "have no basis". Basis for what? Arrogance? Not once have I claimed to be better than anyone, yet that seems to be one thing you just love to do.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango After you start insulting me with stupid comments then for sure I will call you out on it. Stop with the "arrogance" slant...it is SO childish. The fact is your first comment didn't really have any relevence. You just stated the obvious. My point was that mic'ing opera should stop. Do you agree? If you do then fine. Move on.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Hm, and here I was under the impression that voice teachers needed to have social skills. There goes that theory. I'm not out of line, go back and read the first comment I posted. It was not offensive, it was not attacking anything. Then read your first reply to me. It was rude, it was defensive, it made me wonder if you were twelve years old. I have absolutely no respect for people like you. It is easy to be a good musician, it takes dedication to be a good person. You fail at that.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango You don't "know" me at all. Save it you moron.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Musicianship, and teaching, takes a certain level of professionalism that you obviously lack. The mature and adult thing to do would have been to calmly disagree with me, not to jump off the rail like a pretentious fool and immediately spew off grammatically poor insults that were completely unwarranted. What is insulting is watching somebody who clearly has no understanding of logical debate nor premise to mock me trying to undermine my intelligence. Actually, it's pathetic really.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango OMG, get a life and stop commenting. Get over it. Move on. Stop obsessing. You are pathetic. If there is no argument then shut up.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero The fact that a grown man uses netspeak makes me question how seriously I should be taking you. You keep telling me to get over it, and yet here you are replying anyway. You're the only one here who seems to be throwing off insults in some hope that you could damage my self esteem. The fact is though, the fact that you get so angry and hateful over a single comment makes me feel rather bad for you.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango WHAT? So no one uses the internet to communicate? Are you for real? Just because you don't like what I said to you doesn't really matter. What matters is my students and what I am doing and the people who care about the truth. And the truth is the art of opera, great opera, is dying because of mic's and bad teaching. Voices are not how they used to be. So instead of worrying about my manners why don't you just move on? Seriously, you have major transference issues.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero If your goal is to get people to see that the use of microphones is hurting the voices of students, then what ever made you think that insulting people and attacking them is an effective way to get that message across? Do you think that any of them will be willing to take you seriously? You don't even give the benefit of the doubt, you just jump right in with nothing but nasty things to say and destroy your credibility right then and there.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Where did that internet comment come from? Are you referring to my mention of your use of netspeak? Netspeak is the use of acronyms like "OMG" and "ROFL"
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero If you're the professional adult you claim to be, then why haven't you stopped by now? This is what 15 year old girls do. They keep fighting a lost cause, and it never ends because neither side is willing to admit defeat. In this case, there will be no defeat no matter who stops commenting first. Might I add that using the phrase "OMG" to someone who has been taking note of your grammatical skill level is probably not the best idea. But what do I know? I'm an "idiot", right?
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@KappaOodobi Hypocrite much? Why don't you stay on a point that matters. You are going to insult internet grammar as a means of making you feel good about yourself? ROFL! The point of all of this, and what actually matters, is that mic's are being used at many opera houses and that is wrong. So get a grip and move on. I don't need to convince people like you. You have yet to realize how completely insignificant you are in all actuality. But the internet makes you feel mighty.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Slow down there speed racer... How am I being hypocritical? I never directly insulted you for using "internet grammar", I was simply pointing out that if someone is taking note of your grammar, you should use proper grammar so that you don't make a new problem. Why do you think this has gotten so off topic? You keep bringing in irrelevant details, which generate more conversation. She just agreed with you on your main topic. I would say "Thank you, I'm sorry for the misunderstanding."
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@MrCafiero We're all insignificant if you really think about it. No matter what we all die in the end. However, she's working to make the world a better place by teaching, you're working to make the music industry return to its former glory by teaching. I'd say your both equally significant (or insignificant if you want to look at it that way) contributors to society. I say we end the banter and go back to being as happy and productive as we can in our actual lives. Don't you think?
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango We are not all insignificant. Otherwise why should anyone bother living? What someone teaches and the results of that teaching make it and the person significant. Certainly someone like Puccini was significant. So, no, we are not all insignificant. As for pointless banter....yeah, that should stop.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Well then why do you insist on calling someone whom you know nothing about insignificant? I'd say that's a tad hypocritical but hey, to each their own I suppose.
When I say insignificant, I mean on a universal scale. In the grander scheme of things, we're just dots on a page really. But you're right, if you can succeed in making the lives of those you know better and making the world a happier place, that is significance. So there you go, we're all equally significant in that case.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango I insist based on their comments. And because I also have taught students of just about every "top" teacher and famous coach out there. I have not heard any great singers coming out of Eastman on the level of the greats of the past. And I know the damage or limitations they have caused singers. Additionally, the importance of keeping opera grand is paramount. Accepting mediocrity, such as Fleming, or completely destroying the art by mic'ing it is a disgrace.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Wait, so you're saying that based on what I said you can tell if I'm significant or not? I simply write a comment, and that condemns me to a life of being insignificant? I see no logic in that statement... But whatever. I'll keep doing my art thing, you keep doing your music thing. The significance of my life can't be judged by some random guy. Hell, I could just as easily call you insignificant considering I haven't seen solid evidence of your "significant" life's work. But I won't.
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@MrCafiero If we're going to base a person's significance on the merit of their comments, then I'm afraid you may not like what you see in the mirror. Every post you make is an assault not only to the English language, but also to your credibility. Any person who cannot hold a calm and logical conversation with people who disagree with them, and whom have offered a kind word, is not deserving of any respect.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero If you feel the need to throw out "credentials" that may or may not be true in order to try to convince people that you have any authority or any intelligence at all, then you obviously have neither. If you are as successful as you claim yourself to be, then get off your high horse, stop throwing around "I did this" and "I did that" and actually back things up with well thought out replies instead of infantile name-calling. I don't listen to tantrums, I listen to logic. So use it.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero hahaha oh so you're caught up in the pretentiousness of the whole "Eastman vs. Julliard" thing? How very sad that you hold such bitterness. You remind me of a music teacher I had the displeasure of working with a few years ago who held unending resentment towards Josh Groban for no apparent reason. Everyone just assumed that he was bitter because he was less successful than Mr. Groban. I hope for your sake this isn't the vibe you give off in real life.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango What? Eastman v Juilliard? What are you talking about? I think they are both horrible. I don't are about any competition between both. They have horrid voice teachers. And Groban studied speech level which is also crap.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Groban is still world famous and his voice is still in tact after all these years. Wait, why were you mentioning the fact that you teach Julliard students like it was a basis for bragging rights if you think the school is so horrible? That makes no sense.
Also, having met Dr. McIver who is the head of the Eastman choir department, I'd have to say his teaching style is very healthy and natural and respectable. I see nothing wrong with it. Plus none of the students use microphones. :)
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Right, Groban is great. No mic's or enhancement there. If you think that then it is all I need to know. I wrote that I teach graduates of Juilliard and the like. And the POINT is that they could not get good teaching at those schools. This is just too exhausting to keep having to correct your complete misunderstandings of what I write. I will waste no more of my time.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Did I ever say that Groban doesn't use microphones? No, not once. The only thing I said is that he is world famous. That is not a statement of whether I think he's great or not or if he uses microphones or not. You just said he's crap, I just said he's world famous. And saiying that you "teach graduates of Julliard who have won competitions" and things like that, implies that you think Julliard gives you bragging rights, otherwise you would have mentioned your issue with the teaching.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Clarity is a wonderful thing, you know. And it's really great for discussion. Assumptions, however, are something to avoid. Just a few pointers before we go off on our merry ways.
Also, do yourself a favour and lose the Messiah complex.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Thanks for the PM by the way, I'll be sure to "go fuck myself" as soon as possible. :)
I'm glad we had this opportunity to expose our true colours. They're quite dark aren't they?
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Don't forget your an idiot. Truly an idiot.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero I'm trying to resist the urge to note how ironic it is to call me an idiot when you used "your" instead of "you're".
But it's just so funny XD
Thanks for reminding me though :) I can't believe I forgot about that part!
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Whether I mistype or not doesn't change your condition. I truly have met only a few people in my life who are as daft as you are. And I really should not argue with you anymore because you cannot help it that you just are not very swift. It is just the way you are. So go on and be merry. Ignorance is bliss.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Ad hominem: saving people like you from having to use logic for centuries.
Okay I'm done now. Let's get this comment section back on track. :D
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Glad you are feeling better. I thought you were just being argumentative and difficult for a while until I realized the true problem. Glad to clear it up. Be blissful.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero And the symphony fades.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Ah.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Can I just say I'd really like to meet you in real life?
KappaOodobi 1 year ago
@MrCafiero Lastly, my mentioning that I take lessons at Eastman was not a claim to authority, it was simply a way to set up the story of when I went to see the recital. You jump on the defensive far too easily, though I should apologize if that was misleading.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Well, believe or not I have more authority than you do on this for a number of reasons. Firstly, I was highly trained by a master teacher. Secondly, I have friends, conductors, directors and colleagues who have witnessed mic'ing in major houses. Thridly, I teach many singers on a high level. I NEVER, EVER wrote that ALL opera performances are mic'd. So your arguments against what I am writing is based on a presumption on your part. Reading what is not there.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@MrCafiero
>Secondly, I have friends
I call shenanigans on this. You have no friends.
kudasango 1 year ago
@MrCafiero
For example.
You said: And who said being famous means you are good?
When I had already said: the size of a person's career has no hold over the extent of their talent. Justin Bieber is famous isn't he?
And the fact that you were accusing me of claiming authority because I take lessons at Eastman, then going on to say that you have authority by taking lessons from a master teacher is the definition of hypocrisy.
kudasango 1 year ago
@kudasango Again, who cares if you saw a recital. It has nothing to do with what I originally wrote and your comments thereafter have been nothing, but off the point. Again, it doesn't MATTER if you saw a recital here or there that was not mic'd. It has NOTHING to do with my original point. So your original argument should not have even been written. So enough of your crap.
MrCafiero 1 year ago
@tenor220 Sorry, but this is simply not true and Mr. Cafiero is correct. There have been some notable opera singers who have been body mic'd in important opera houses on a regular basis. Of course, they wouldn't want the public to know about this, but those backstage, including the technical crew, know this goes on. And yes, there have been some embarrassing audio mishaps during performances.
maestralala 1 year ago
I love Renee.. a this is not bad at all.. But this is where K.D. Lang reigns supreme...
candide43201 1 year ago
@candide43201 I agree, I prefer K. D. Lang's version. But this one is nice :)
ajamesu 1 year ago
@ajamesu Agreed K.D. Lang definitely gives the best version of this song.
hassaine 1 year ago
@hassaine I love Renee Fleming ( I have even posted a video of her singing Amazing Grace at the 9/11 site) and I dearly love K.D. Lang's version of Halleluja,
but, the most spectacular version of this song is by Jeff Buckley ... just search
for Jeff Buckley Halleluja ... it's the one with the 15,000,000 hits, with good reason.
Dimitrios
dnworks 1 year ago
Not your best Renee
SusanECoates 1 year ago
génial elle a une superbe voix
guildbart 1 year ago
@guildbart Le version de K.D. Lang est supérieure.
hassaine 1 year ago
mine stops, frustratingly, just as she's to start sining... at 3:05. anyone else have the same problem?
jeanneadele 1 year ago
She does this really well...makes more sense than the pop singers do (sorry, lee, jason). And she has no problem singing the long hallelujah in one breath...hate it when they breathe in the middle of a word.
raythespian 1 year ago
This is far better than chocolat!!!!!!!!!!
moniquetb 1 year ago
I think this is beautiful. One of my favourite covers of this song. As an operatic singer I love what she's doing. I think music belongs to everyone, and we shouldn't put sounds in boxes, nor performers. A person with a great voice is a person with a greta voice, and Fleming is certainly one of those. She's also a precious communicater - someone who really makes you resonate in sympathy with her.
Brava
Hearnoevil8 1 year ago 2
I think she does beautifully! I'm a big fan of Renee Fleming's Operatic voice, but she does a magnificent job with this new album! It's beautiful!
violinist1990 1 year ago 2
I think somebody has a lots of problems here! It is not R.F.
nowvay 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Dreck, nothing but shallow, silly dreck. And dull as dishwater, to boot. So give it the boot, if you will.
Scalatti 1 year ago
@Scalatti I agree,it is dull as dishwater.She should have left this song to Jeff Buckley & K.d. Lang.Her voice just sounds weird too,the way she forms words is so odd and off.
montsyblackmadonna 1 year ago
@montsyblackmadonna Yes; props to her for being careful about the common flaw of classical singers sounding too classical when they try to cross over, but she's going to the other end of the spectrum, and intentially slurring and slouching vocally, which isn't quite working.
jgonnerman85 1 year ago