You really need to go back to Never, Never Land. Educate yourself on economics before making such statements. Have you noticed inflation which is a tax that you and I pay, bubbles in the market, inflation, oh and did I mentioned inflation? Do you know that the Feds is a private institution determining the worth of currency in the US... Wake up please!!
Inflation = Change in the price level. Prices change, inevitable. As long as it is kept under control, it is fine. Inflation has been stabilized in the developed world for the past few decades!! Growth in the US, real growth, has off course kept ahead of inflation. BTW, the FED does NOT control(although they may play a role, it is not significant) the value of the currency!, supply and demand for US dollars abroad determines the price of the dollar.
... wow I can't believe theres members on the banking committee who think we are still on the gold standard... what world are some of these politicians living in?
Please support this good, honest and principled man's candidacy for President in any way you can. He will restore America's greatness. Join Meetup, donate money, become a delegate, spread the word. RON PAUL 2008!
Paul is an idiot and a traitor, who has the same agenda as Bin Laden. If he practiced medicine like he recommends for economics, his name would have been Josef Mengele...
He's simply a demagague with good sound bites and no clue.
If you agree at all with Dr. Ron Paul you need to realize his message will not spread widely unless he get's a good portion of votes in the GOP primaries. To advance these ideas as many people as possible need to register republican for their own states primary and then make sure to vote for Ron Paul. Inaction on the part of supporters is the only thing that will kill this movement. We need everyone to register and vote. Please take action now, or your freedoms will be lost all too soon.
Our economy is based on oil, not gold... not paper, it's the oil behind the products and services that we provide in trade to the world, thus creating the value. But the oil production is in terminal decline... and more and more countries have caught on, and we have this massive debt now. Oil prices go up, the value of our dollar goes down.
Lol, they are speaking of calculating the M3 like it's rocket science... It's M2+Intrabankloans+Repos+Largetimedeposits+Eurodols. The only hassle is eurodols, but that's it...
i was referring to Iraq and the middle east, but then, don't stop commenting, you look more and more like a fool and a bigot with each word... OH, i get it, you are trying to be middle eastern! right, like they care who Ron Paul is... OMG you are such a freakin idiot!
and by the way, we are not easy to kill MF, but then, Bush already publicly told them to "bring it on," so i don't have to repeat the stupidity of a hollow Puppet... and our women are already out there kicking ass!
you're an utter WANKER...but you have an absolute right to demonstrate that fact to the whole planet - a right RP supports to the hilt. However, you also have a right to stop talking such utter shit.
Majellanz is the best rationale for people to not support Paul. He has no points to make other than ad hominem attacks, and that's typical of Paul supporters.
That's why the moveonDotorg and dhimmicratic underground are his biggest supporters - it doesn't take a brain.
Ron Paul is a traitor and an economic idiot who's ideas of fixing the money supply would destroy the economy.
Ron Paul a traitor? Jesus where are people getting this stuff.. No a traiter is George Bush. Ron Paul is the farthest from a political traitor I've seen in my entire life. As for liking or disliking RP supporters, who cares. Watch the man running not the supporters for sakes.
Ron Paul is a traitor b/c he echos the same sentiments as Bin Laden. He argues for our surrender in Iraq, and that we not use the military to destroy bin laden or the nations that aid him.
His comments undermine the morale of our troops. " "Congressmen who willfully take action during wartime that damage morale and undermine the military are saboteurs, and should be arrested, exiled or hanged." - oft attrib to A. Lincoln (but perhaps a paraphrase).
Ron Paul argues that we leave Iraq; we aren't surrendering to anyone, it's not a real war and it's not in our home country. It was not declared and who are we fighting? we are fighting people who want us out of the middle east because we are a forceful foreign occupying force. We are trying to prevent a civil war which is their own fucking business.. and probably won't break out into anything major. Already 60,000 American soldiers wounded or dead and over a million Iraqis wounded or dead.
Paul wants to use mercenaries in purusing bin laden, not our troops - which he wants constrain to our borders. He didn't even want to call 9/11 a terrorist attack, but an act of "air piracy' in the bill he proposed to use the mercenaries versus committing troops to afstan. He's an idiot and a traitor.
Ron Paul is a traitor and an idiot. He's a mouthpiece for bin laden and would abandon our allies and friends to Al Quaeda. If he gets his way and our military was cut to 20%, we'd be fighting AQ in our borders, not outside of them.
Ron Paul Rules...He is for personal liberties, He is for "Hard Assets", He is for decentralized government, He is for transparency and checks on the government, He is for privacy, personal liberty and economic freedom for an individual...Ron Paul Rocks...
I believe he tells where he stands on the pardon in the 3rd GOP debate.
I believe he says that he would not pardon him. I am not sure what he says specifically about 11110, but I know he wants paper to be backed by hard currency like gold and silver.
Ron Paul doesn't even understand the Fed is an agency of the US government, he doesn't even understand we tried the gold standard before and it failed miserabley.
He is the Neville Chamberlain and Herbert Hoover of our day, rolled into one. The moveonDOTorg crowd can have him.
you, sir, are a misinformed idiot. The Fed is absolutely NOT an agency of the government. It is a private bank with a charter issued by the government in 1914 (or maybe 1918..I forget)..it has a board of directors and is PRIVATELY OWNED>
Lol.. calling me names, along with your inability to look up gov't organizational charts or to read the Federal Reserve Act doesn't change the facts.
The Fed is a quasi gov't agency, listed as a gov't agency on all official docs and has a gov website, hires thru the gov't agency. There is no private ownership - as is commonly understood.
I think you miss the point. The point is, if the is a Quasi agency as it could be called then it isn't an agency. Just because congress handed the control of our money doesn't legitimize it as a US agency. A US agency has to directly answer to congress ie, CIA, FEMA, FBI etc.. The Fed answers to no one but themselves. We done even choose the head of the FED The Banks do.
WE only get to pick from a list of 5 that the FED its self discribes. If The FED doesn't have to answer to congress than it's not a US agency. Thats the point.
Don't be stupid. The fed does answer to congress. They give thousands of reports to Congress, both in paper and in person, as well as no senior management can be hired without Congress' approval. They are as much of a gov't agency as teh CIA, FNMA. And again you're wrong, Reagan, Bush I and Clinton all chose Greenspan, Bush II chose Bernanke - both of which had to appear before Congress and get approval for confirmation. Get new info sources. Yours suck, as does Paul.
No I am sorry you are wrong. Congress has no authority to do a systematic or Volentary (which means even if the FED wanted to disclose hard funds they could not by law) The report are internally structured and dictated by the fed.
You are also SO very wrong about Congress choosing the senior manager (head) of the FED. As I stated below the Fed allows the president to choose from a list a five ( that the fed themselves choose, no one has any say in the select of the five OTHER THAN THE FEDERAL RESERVE. YOU CAN NOT SAY THE PRESIDENT APPOINTS ANYONE. These thing can be gooogled. You sir are wrong and I will brandish the proof if you would like
The Federal Reserve Banks are owned by private member banks (see below). Each member bank owns nonnegotiable shares of stock in its regional Federal Reserve Bank; see below). In Lewis v. United States,[18] the United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit stated that "the Reserve Banks are not federal instrumentalities for purposes of the FTCA [the Federal Tort Claims Act], but are independent, privately owned and locally controlled corporations."
Those are the regionals, and they are technically private for TAX matters as in the Lewis decision, and their 'ownership' is all the commercial banks in their region. But's it's ownership without control. The "owners" can't change the marketing, the products, enter new markets or exhibit any vestige of ownership commonly inferred by such in the public domain. They are still a U.S. govn't agency. Look at the orginizational charts.
Read the Federal Reserve Act or google bernanke confirmation... I never said Congress "chooses" I said they confirm - they have oversight. In addition the "list" for the head is the current sitting govenors, there's no submission by 'banks'.
Exactly "confirm" not choose. No one chooses except the private bankers. PRIVATE. Confeirnation means nothing if a private bank chooses who dicates interest rate and ultimatly our economies.
"inflationary taxes?" Lol.. what jewel of a site did you get that from?
Secondly, we're off the gold standard. Tried it and it failed. We'd never have the prosperity we have if we were on the gold standard. The cost of money would be too high. Why does Paul hate that so many Americans can now own their own house???
In a defacto sense, the dollar is backed by gold or whatever - you can take the dollar and buy gold. The dollar is jsut a superior trading medium.
In a nutshell, throughout history the gold standard has served as an artificial constriction on the ability of currency to expand sufficiently to support economic growth. By making currency scarce, the gold standard facilitated the bankers' control of the economy.
Con't: It was the bankers who got the governments of the world to go onto the gold standard after 1870 by undermining the utilization of silver. This allowed the bankers to control the world's monetary supply to the detriment of economic democracy until the 1930s, when gold became only a denominator of international trade, not a backing of domestic currencies.
Also, gold may or may not prevent inflation, because there are many things bankers can do to inflate the currency if they wish to. This happened with the inflation during and after World War I. This was a financial crime by which the bankers deliberately destroyed the value of the remaining paper greenbacks and silver certificates from post-Civil War days.
What is your solution to our seemingly uncontrollable debt and inflation? Let's stop talking about Gold, if it bothers you so much. Let's talk about YOUR solution, Claymof. Are you a financial expert, or do you just masquerade as one on Youtube?
If you want to control the debt then vote for congressmen who won't spend more than the gov't takes in.
Inflation hasn't been a factor in the economy for since Greenspan made the connection between it and interest rates back in 79. It's the major reason we've not had the boom/bust cycles and very modest recessions, even after the catastrophe of 9/11.
You obviously know nothing of econ or history... compare recessions and inflation to what we had under the gold standard - look at when Roosevelt devalued the dollar - under the gold.
I am for hard currency... But besides what Roosevelt did was a problem with fiat currency he devalued the dollar, and prolonging the depression imo. This is hardly even a credible argument against the gold standard. We are so much better off today but how many more times can the Fed bail us out before our dollar crashes? I tell you the crash is coming soon. We are worse off with beurocrats fluctating the price of a currency then it being maintained by a natraul free market
we were on the gold std when Roosevelt devalued. In addition, we've acheived unheard of levels of prosperity and leisure time. This would not be possible under the gold standard, as would home ownership for the average American - the price of money would be prohibitive.
Why is it there are no countries on the gold standard any more? B/c it didn't work then, and wouldn't work now.
We weren't really on the gold standard then... The fed wasn't regulating the dollar to gold. Why do you think the market crashed in 29? Because the fed was witholding the money because they thought they could get the value to increase after a decade of over inflating in the 20s. What FDR did hurt the economy even more and prolonged the depression
The US took gold out of private citizens hands in 29, but we remained on the gold std.. went off of it under Nixon in 71.
The depression started due to smoot-hawley and other factors.. the gold std had nothing to do with it. Following the econ theory at the time the Fed tightened, which ended up worsening the depression... now they prevent such.
We were on the "gold standard" thats what they say but they weren't playing by the rules. According to the Chicago school econ theory the market crashed due to the fed with tightening down. They over inflated it in the 20s, and wasn't linked to gold.
Chicago school?? It says nothing of the kind - playing by the rules. Bottom line, the dollar was backed by Gold. And was during the early 20's - which you call 'inflationary' However, in fact, inflation was absent, with virtually no increase in prices during the mid-1920s while the government sector was shrinking.
the fed wasn't playing by the rules man. Do you honestly believe they were actually regulating the usd to gold? no they weren't they over printed in the 20s and tightened up in 29 and crashed the market. This isn't an argument against the gold standard because we werent on it.
... yeah thats what they say but their actions said other wise... You even said that the fed was controlling the output of currency even tightening it... was this because they were regulating to the ammount of gold??? No we incread our gold we should have been PRINTING more not witholding. so we werent on the standard regardless of what is said.
Nice to see you again, especially now that gold is $775 per oz. Last time we talked it was $670. This was a couple months ago.
The reason I came back was to point that out, but now that I'm here, I would also like to point out that the "Gold STD" enforced by the Federal Reserve will not work either. You're partially right about that.
I'm glad to see Gold up.... those people that bot it 20 years ago on Paul's recommendation are just now getting their principal back... too bad they're still way behind on an inflation adjusted basis.
After the war/iran/subprime crisis, it'll go back to 350....
Speaking of war/iran/subprime crisis... How long should we watch gold climb? $1000 per oz? If the coming recession continues, wouldn't it create other economic problems?
Doesn't it seem like there is an intentional economic meltdown occurring?
Since the industrial revolution begain, low paying manual jobs have always sifted to less industrialized nations. In additions, the Unions killed the auto industry back in the 60's and 70's...we're still paying for that.
Employment is at all time highs, with higher wages.
you gotta remember, Paul was warning of impending doom in the 80's... he's clueless. free trade has created more jobs than it cost... look at all the help wanted signs around, all the companies hiring.
Soldier? If true, that's kinda amazing. Most I know don't have any idea who Paul is and those that do, can't stand his cut and run strategy. They don't want another Vietnam and want to win/finish the job.
I guess it is only amazing because you won't find most soldiers who support Ron Paul out in the open talking about it. They are ostracized for not going along with the status quo.
There are many of us who vehemently oppose the foreign policy of this administration.
I am not alone. And when he wins New Hampshire, more of us will organize and speak up for him to build his momentum.
This whole *cut and run* nonsense was made up by the same people who lied and said Iraq had WMDs.
Well, i doubt there are many who are 'ostracized'.. looking at the milblogs, I have yet to find one in support of paul, most again can't stand him. There are about a 1000 out there, and I've surely not visited them all, but his support in the mil is very, very slim by any standard.
Also, I'm glad to see I have managed to capture the attention of a scholar. At least my arguments have not been wasted on some IRS agent or some other lame occupation. =)
I am surprised to find such a knowledgeable person trolling the YouTube commentary. Don't you have a thesis to be working on? Or is this part of your research?
No, this is a hobby... I came across some of Paul's lies/distortions and many people were beleiving them b/c they were unchallenged. Then he gets big into supporting Bin Laden's agenda, that was enough for me.
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I don't like that he's embraced bin laden's agenda, that he never met a conspiracy theory he didn't embrace, that he's ignorant of the Constitution, particularly the 16th, that he demagoges often, such as on the McCarthy bill, proclaiming himself the only congressman to care about the 2A - Bullchit.
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Bin Laden and RP both want the same things: US to retreat in Iraq, ME and Afstan, US to leave AQ alone overseas, US military to abandon it's allies in the fight, US to shrink it's military, US to cut and run as Bin Laden predicted they would (after Somolia in 92).
Agreed. Youtube's 500-character-limit is pathetic. Honestly, these commentaries have the potential to be actual forums, but I guess Youtube caters to the ADHD generation.
Although I enjoy keeping discussions open to others to chime in, I agree that email will definitely be faster.
I was just responding to someone and got so frustrated with the limitation (on my own channel, no less) that I gave up. You can't possibly articulate anything here. It's as if YouTube wants to suppress written communication.
Before I turned in, I Googled "YouTube character limit pathetic" just to see who else agrees with me... your comment here was the #1 result. I found it quite fitting that it was a Ron Paul supporter who made it!
bin Laden wants us in Iraq. He couldn't believe that we'd incvade a muslim nation like Iraq, get bogged down there for five years, and not be able to achieve success. This war has played right into his hands.
really, that's pretty stupid. AQ is in complete disarry in Iraq, has squandered huge resources and goodwill - proving the Americans are the good guys to millions and millions of Arabs. You need better information... A letter was just released two days ago from an AQ commander talking about how bad it was the past year, he's down to 20 men from over 600.
I got my information from "The Looming Tower: Al Qeada and The Road To 9/11." Remember, this isn't a two or three year war in their eyes. They have a plan for a twenty year war and this kind of quagmire was the one thing they needed to advance to the next stage in their plan.
There is no, NO, "private banker' choice. The President chooses from the current govenors, submits to congress for confirmation. It's that simple. Just like all the other government agencies that report to the President and Congress - CIA, FNMA...
Lol.. You can buy your own mortgage can't you? The Fed buys and sells US debt to adjust money supply - as they were commissioned to do by the Congress on behalf of the US Treasury. That doesn't mean they are 'private" as is commonly understood.
WE only get to pick from a list of 5 that the FED its self discribes. If The FED doesn't have to answer to congress than it's not a US agency. Thats the point.
it is incredible to me that a presidential candidate needs to raise 100 million to run, raises it from special interests and then pays it to five media barons who encourage polarization and division between liberals and conservatives while privately leaving the agenda untouched. I fear Paul would lose his life before he could shut the fed, or make any significant change.
The real menace of our Republic is the invisible government which like a giant octopus sprawls its slimy legs over our nation. At the head is a small group of banking houses generally referred to as international bankers. This coterie runs our government for their own selfish ends. It operates under cover of a self-created screen and seizes our executive officers legislative bodies schools courts newspapers and every agency created for the public protection."
Ok, discredit the quote, but tell me then, if it's a government agency, why is there no congressional oversight of the fed, no published(for your government) minutes of fed meetings, what other government agency can claim this?
Seiously, I am prepared to be proven wrong but you have succeeded in none of that, you have merely said that my information is inaccurate, you have given me no evidence to suggest this is so.
Den... I can't prove that that "something didn't happen" - that is impossible. You can google the quote, and find out the source or see where it's admitted that Wilson never said it. It's not in his speeches, writings or memoirs. Since "Jekyll" it's just "attributed" to him, with no source - why, there is no source docs.
You refute that woodrow wilson said something but you have no source to back it up, you refute my information, but you provide nothing to support it,look for yourself at the minutes on their website, it only says who attended, and a very broad and brief statement, you are certainly one of the victims of your polarized media.Your argument is that you're right and everyone else is wrong, and I'm not interested in a discussion like that, Go fuck yourslf
Really? Don't be an idiot, even if you're a Ron Paul Supporter. Google "Federal Reserve Minutes" - you can see the copies and the discussions or go the Federal Reserve website , they're under FOMC.
Find me the doc or speech of the Wilson quote. Or I can do the same thing:
Denbosz said "Ron Paul is an idiot and a traitor."
See - we agree! Thanks for the kind words. Classy and typical of the RP 'hate america' group.
I don't hate america at all, but I'm not American, I just know how you are percieved by others around the world and can see your personal freedoms going to hell in a hand cart, anyone that votes only according to his oath of office to uphold the constitution, would certainly seem like someone the world could relate to. You're current president is percieved as someone who helps his friends to make lots of money but doesn't give a rats arse about his constituency, or his constitution.
American's haven't lost one bit of personal freedom. That's bunk.
To Americans - perception is nothing. Look at clinton - according to the international elites, he was loved by everyone. It is on his watch that the WTC, the Cole, Somolia, two American Embassies and other attacks occurred on Americans without one effective strike against AQ. In fact, AQ grew tremendously under Clinton's watch. He had a chance to arrest Osama and didn't.
Ron Paul has fed you guys sooo many lies, you can't see or think straight. But most people can see and understand what he says and are disgusted by it. That's why he's a no show in any real poll, not stacked by moveonDOTorg and Dhimmicratic Underground - his two most loyal supporters in blaming America.
I have unwittingly ruined my country, a great industrial nation is controlled by it's system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated in the hands of a few men. Woodrow Wilson Who, passed the federal reserve act in 1913, while congress was on holiday. you can argue semantics all day, call it ownership, or control, either way it is not in the hands of your government.
PLEASE, PLEASE, Learn to google. That quote attributed to President Wilson, IS A LIE. WILSON NEVER STATED IT. It was cooked up in Creatures of Jekyll Island - if I remember, but it's never been attributed to Wilson and doesn't appear in anything he said or wrote.
So who told you that this quite was a lie, and who controls your system of credit? the fed is not subject to federal oversight and does not disclose to government the contents of it's meetings, what other govt. agency can do this? As for being responsible for your acts, Is America in no way responsible, when it in fact created al quaeda to fight the russians in Afghanistan? But of course, your probable argument will be that if they hadn't we would all be speaking Russian now.
that is simply not true, the fed is not a government agency like the CIA or the FDIC, it's governors are given fourteen year terms by a president, that is the extent to which it is federal, it's ownership is not clear because they are secretive, but it most definitely is not the government.
Just like the CIA, FDIC, GNMA, FNMA - its directors report to the President, it's employees all are Federal employees, it's audited annually by the GAO, and all 'profits' are returned to the US Treasury. It cannot acquire, or be acquired by private companies, it cannot change it's mission or alter its services.
It is an 'independent' government agency. Simple fact.
Again, as far as the Federal Reserve being a US government agency, it has a DOTgov website - available only to US government agencies and it's in every
government agency listing such as the one on the White House site (youtube won't let me post a link).
There is simply no denying, by any standard that the Fed is a government agency.
so tell me another government agency that is not owned by the government. Do your own research and if you can give me a list of the owners of the fed, I'd like to see it, as would Ron Paul. The two major powers which have privately owned central reserve banks are yours and the English.
you need to quit the propaganda rags and take a look at that "ownership". It's unlike the 'ownership' of any other 'private company' in the world.
It's ownership without the ability to hire or fire, without input in management decisions, no board meetings, no ability to sell, required by the nature of their business (all public US registered banks).
The 'ownership' is not ownership of control, it's not even called ownership by the Fed or Gov't.
the banks simply have to buy shares of 'capital stock' (that is not limited, has no authorized or outstanding amount, and does not trade.
However one would define a private corp - the fed won't meet that requirement. It does meet the definitions of a gov't agency and is so listed by everyone - gov't and private corps who deal with the gov't.
Whe I grew up the dollar was backed up by gold. It was at Ft Knox mostly (remember the movie Goldfinger?) I think that there isn't enough gold to go around to back all the dollars that have been printed. Our debt is not repayable, and our income tax pays for the interest owed the Fed Reserve, we do not own the gold anymore, so who does own it?
Not a penny of our taxe goes toward interest owed the Federal Reserve. The Fed is a gov't agency, and the gold in Ft Knox is owned by the US and other nations that have deposited their supplies there.
Think gold - think expensive to store, controlled by a few.
Ron paul is an idiot who parrots bin laden's talking points. he would abandon our allies in Iraq, leaving them to the same fate our friends who trusted us experienced in South Vietnam.
RP hates the fact Americans are more prosperous and own more homes than ever. He would take us back to the dark ages economically.
Paul knows less about econ and 'fiat currency' than he does about history. Bottom line- Americans have never been more prosperous in their history. He hates that, for whatever convoluted logic.
Not only that, he's a mouthpiece for Bin Laden. That's why the moveon moonbats support him so, not conservatives.
Your response is a masterpiece of ignorance and epithet posing as dialogue. Try actually watching a Paul speech or reading one of his articles to get some idea what he believes, and stop letting Fox News tell you what to think. Ron Paul is for free-market Capitalism, wealth (yes, he even says as much), and national security. Which is why he wants to secure our border against future bin Ladins instead of securing the borders of other nations, such as Iraq.
You need to quit listening to the propaganda and understand ideas have consequences. RP would defend our borders against Bin Laden??? Like he did before 9/11? His isolationism combined with a healthy dose of Neville Chamberlain would give bin laden free reign in the rest of the world - paul would defend our borders when we were surrounded, not to mention leaving the problem to solve for our kids or grandkids.
-Economists educated by the current fiat monetary system are 'polishing a turd', in other words, they are math geniuses hired by counterfeiters, to shift credit debt all around the globe to keep the bill collectors at bay.
- Bin Laden's father was in business with the Carlyle group, co-chaired by George HW Bush. Bin Laden was trained by the CIA. He was watched over by the CIA prior to 9-11 and he was hanging out in Pakistan when I was in Afghanistan.
Economists have produced the greatest prosperity and most leisure time the world has ever seen. They've provided capital necessary for the economy to grow - impossible under a gold standard.
Most every large international corp has done business with the Laden Group. Find some real info then get back to me.
Ah.. a masters student in the Ron Paul School of Econ. Ignoring completely the high levels of employment, productivity, leisure, it's all about credit cards, as if that was the source of everyone's money.
Hmmm.. folks have been living off of credit cards for 50 years.
In addition Paul's 'economic theory' - is simply bunk. That is why it's not supported by any educated economist. If he practiced medicine like he does econ, his nickname would be Josef Mengele.
where are your facts? He doesn't know how the money circulates in your country, like everyone else, but he does seem to be the only person in elected office who is trying to get the fed to tell him. by the way the problems of the rest of the world are yours to solve?
My facts??? - The prosperity of the last 50 years, Jefferson fighting the islamistics and RP denying both. If you listed to RP in the 80's - and bot gold when he said, you'd be desititute by now. A faulty logic demands bad responses. RP is proof of that.
Most people are in a 30-year home loan funded by fiat currency that loses value faster than the loan is repaid.
So, in essence, most home owner today are going to buy their house at least 2 times, if not 3 or 4.
Now we are seeing a RECORD number of foreclosures. Of course this could be attributed in part to poor financial planning on the home owners' part, but it's still an indication of the overall health of the economy.
The "housing bubble" is rather narrowly focused, in addition, there were greater bubbles in the gold eras - they called them boom cycles and then the bust. We've not experieinced a severe 'bust' since we went off the gold std in the 60's. Hey if you and Ron Paul want to go back to lower purchasing power and depressions, go right on.
You also abuse stats, again, congrats to Paul. He taught you. Look at the foreclosure rates - there have been higher - under the gold standard. The reason they are at a 'RECORD' number is there are many more home owners. It's pathetic you and Paul think that home ownership is a bad idea.
Sounds good, Claymof. Go vote for Romney or Hilary or whoever. Keep fighting the Iraq war. Keep paying income tax. Keep the crappy health care system. Keep the inflation rate rising and the deficit growing. You can keep it all! Polishing the brass on the Titanic.
It doesn't take a genius to know that printing lots of unbacked currency dilutes the value of existing currency. Please back up your claims with facts.
That's only one part of the equation. the part left out is the expansion of the economy. If you want to know true inflation, look at the value of goods in labor hours.
In the 20's an average worker had to work 3 months to buy a decent suit. Today, he has to work 1 week or less. Which economy do you want? Which is inflation?
That's a poor analogy. "I remember when candy bars were only a nickel!" my dad used to say.
It sounds like you are educated by the modern economic system and are ingrained in it like someone who is about to retire from the IRS and doesn't want to lose their social pension.
Oh the irony (or should I say hypocrisy?). "Nice ad hominem...moonbats"
Speaking of facts, I haven't seen you produce any as yet. Let's revisit your ignorant statement that Ron Paul wants Americans to be poor. Where do you get that, and what do you do with the numerous statements of his that he wants free markets so that we can be even more wealthy? watch?v=RahgC1eptgk He even implies he wants there to be more Bill Gates-type billionaires. So how can you say he hates wealth?
If you haven't seen me post facts, then you can't read. That's not my problem. If RP's dream came true - gold standard, there would be no expansion of capital, money would be prohibitively expensive and controlled by a few powerful bankers - as would the gold. Same as in the previous gold standard.
He doesn't understand what he's saying so he can ad lib most anything - re: more billionaires.
fr54om 1879-the late 18901s after the civil war when america went back to the gold standard they experienced growth, real growth of 4 % per annum, it was only the bankers that ruined that by denting confidence with fractional reserve banking when depositors could not retrieve their own money.
actually, when you have a depression (like you have under the gold standard) or war (like the civil when economic production is greatly reduced/destroyed) there is sufficient currency to allow for an expansion to previous levels. There's not enough to fund current levels. Do the math, rather than examine one small sample biased period. The Reconstruction Period kept the South down and poor for decades
periods of time do not keep people down and poor,if you look into that I think you will find that debt undertaken from banks to finance the war was what kept the south down and poor for decades.
Lol.. that's funny. Since the north burned the schools, wouldn't rebuild them, put illiterate blacks in authority making decisions, stole the remaining capital and possession from those that had it, it was a very punitative period.
Then the reaction give the radical racist southerners a foothold and control. the animosity/bitterness lasted for decades, not an inducement to raising new capital and improving the education systems.
that and the fact that gold was controlled by a few northern banks. There was no capital in the south or to invest in the south. Paul would take us back to a few controlling the capital - lower home ownership etc.
The economists have not created our wealth and purchasing power. You yourself used labor hours as a measure. That should have made it clear to you that purchasing power is a result of higher productivity, not currency manipulation. That's owed largely to the advance of technology and to enterprising capitalists, not economists.
Argue the facts, not straw men Punchey. I didn't say economists created, I said they supplied the liquidity to grow the economy - which wouldn't be possible under gold. That created the prosperity, which has increased purchasing power - true deflation, not inflation.
But back to the original point of my comment, you can disagree with the idea of the gold standard, but my question is, given the facts, how can you claim Ron Paul doesn't like Americans to be wealthy? Back that assertion up with facts, because I've just disproved it with facts.
You've produced no facts, just rhetoric unfounded in the reality of this economy. Paul would implement a gold standard - which would have the same effect it did before - concentrate power in the hands of the few and limit opportunities to access capital for new business. Money would be more expensive. We tried the gold std before and it failed. Bretton Woods failed. Kennedy and Nixon knew it.
We've had unparalled prosperity for 50 years. It's not a fluke. Ron Paul can't stand that.
Is the housing bubble not a fact? Is rapid inflation not a fact? Are record numbers of foreclosures and bankruptcies not fact? Is China's $1.3 trillion USD not a fact? Are rising health care costs not a fact? Is unratified federal income tax not a fact? Is the multi-trillion dollar deficit not a fact?
We ran out of gold in 1971, there were no more reserves of gold to trade for dollars held abroad. Currency floating works just as well.
mjcrcol 3 years ago
You really need to go back to Never, Never Land. Educate yourself on economics before making such statements. Have you noticed inflation which is a tax that you and I pay, bubbles in the market, inflation, oh and did I mentioned inflation? Do you know that the Feds is a private institution determining the worth of currency in the US... Wake up please!!
carlossjoel10 3 years ago
Inflation = Change in the price level. Prices change, inevitable. As long as it is kept under control, it is fine. Inflation has been stabilized in the developed world for the past few decades!! Growth in the US, real growth, has off course kept ahead of inflation. BTW, the FED does NOT control(although they may play a role, it is not significant) the value of the currency!, supply and demand for US dollars abroad determines the price of the dollar.
mjcrcol 3 years ago
Fight the powers that be...
TEAPARTY 07 Dec 16th...
TEAPARTY07dotcom
/watch?v=p_3LY1UmYhA
cormex55 4 years ago
... wow I can't believe theres members on the banking committee who think we are still on the gold standard... what world are some of these politicians living in?
Mattes50A05 4 years ago
Please support this good, honest and principled man's candidacy for President in any way you can. He will restore America's greatness. Join Meetup, donate money, become a delegate, spread the word. RON PAUL 2008!
johnb321 4 years ago
Paul is an idiot and a traitor, who has the same agenda as Bin Laden. If he practiced medicine like he recommends for economics, his name would have been Josef Mengele...
He's simply a demagague with good sound bites and no clue.
claymof 4 years ago
If you agree at all with Dr. Ron Paul you need to realize his message will not spread widely unless he get's a good portion of votes in the GOP primaries. To advance these ideas as many people as possible need to register republican for their own states primary and then make sure to vote for Ron Paul. Inaction on the part of supporters is the only thing that will kill this movement. We need everyone to register and vote. Please take action now, or your freedoms will be lost all too soon.
FatalDaze 4 years ago 5
Go Ron Go!
winninghammer 4 years ago
Our economy is based on oil, not gold... not paper, it's the oil behind the products and services that we provide in trade to the world, thus creating the value. But the oil production is in terminal decline... and more and more countries have caught on, and we have this massive debt now. Oil prices go up, the value of our dollar goes down.
Grey80002 4 years ago
Ron Paul's monetary policies are in the company of those like Winston Churchill, who did not Britain to leave the gold standard.
proguitar17 4 years ago
We are not in a decared war. Hence, it is illegal.
proguitar17 4 years ago
Lol, they are speaking of calculating the M3 like it's rocket science... It's M2+Intrabankloans+Repos+Largetimedeposits+Eurodols. The only hassle is eurodols, but that's it...
squasj 4 years ago
Ron Paul's the Man... If you're a Bin Laden Fan....
claymof 4 years ago
Bin Laden in more popular than Bush because people like Ron Paul are not respected... thanks for helping Bin Laden Claymore! A real Patriot...
longsushao 4 years ago
Lol... you haji are sooo stupid. Is why you're so easy to kill.
If Bin Laden were more popular than Bush in this country, then Paul's rankings would go thru the roof - cuz they support the same things.
Now go back and cower behind the women and children.
claymof 4 years ago
i was referring to Iraq and the middle east, but then, don't stop commenting, you look more and more like a fool and a bigot with each word... OH, i get it, you are trying to be middle eastern! right, like they care who Ron Paul is... OMG you are such a freakin idiot!
longsushao 4 years ago
and by the way, we are not easy to kill MF, but then, Bush already publicly told them to "bring it on," so i don't have to repeat the stupidity of a hollow Puppet... and our women are already out there kicking ass!
longsushao 4 years ago
you're an utter WANKER...but you have an absolute right to demonstrate that fact to the whole planet - a right RP supports to the hilt. However, you also have a right to stop talking such utter shit.
Majellanz 4 years ago
Majellanz is the best rationale for people to not support Paul. He has no points to make other than ad hominem attacks, and that's typical of Paul supporters.
That's why the moveonDotorg and dhimmicratic underground are his biggest supporters - it doesn't take a brain.
Ron Paul is a traitor and an economic idiot who's ideas of fixing the money supply would destroy the economy.
What's bin laden want him to do next?
claymof 4 years ago
Ron Paul a traitor? Jesus where are people getting this stuff.. No a traiter is George Bush. Ron Paul is the farthest from a political traitor I've seen in my entire life. As for liking or disliking RP supporters, who cares. Watch the man running not the supporters for sakes.
batmanthe 4 years ago
Ron Paul is a traitor b/c he echos the same sentiments as Bin Laden. He argues for our surrender in Iraq, and that we not use the military to destroy bin laden or the nations that aid him.
His comments undermine the morale of our troops. " "Congressmen who willfully take action during wartime that damage morale and undermine the military are saboteurs, and should be arrested, exiled or hanged." - oft attrib to A. Lincoln (but perhaps a paraphrase).
claymof 4 years ago
What does surrender in Iraq have to do with OBL? OBL is in Pakistan. Take the troops out of Iraq and use them to find OBL!!!
dantej32 4 years ago
Lying scum.. he WANTS to go after Bin Laden this has been expressed by him many times, unlike Bush who puts him on low priority.
batmanthe 4 years ago
Ron Paul argues that we leave Iraq; we aren't surrendering to anyone, it's not a real war and it's not in our home country. It was not declared and who are we fighting? we are fighting people who want us out of the middle east because we are a forceful foreign occupying force. We are trying to prevent a civil war which is their own fucking business.. and probably won't break out into anything major. Already 60,000 American soldiers wounded or dead and over a million Iraqis wounded or dead.
batmanthe 4 years ago
Paul wants to use mercenaries in purusing bin laden, not our troops - which he wants constrain to our borders. He didn't even want to call 9/11 a terrorist attack, but an act of "air piracy' in the bill he proposed to use the mercenaries versus committing troops to afstan. He's an idiot and a traitor.
claymof 4 years ago
Ron Paul's the man
SteveBKNY 4 years ago
Ron Paul is the only candidate that speaks the truth. The rest use sound bites and slogans for the ignorant masses.
Puckbubba 4 years ago
Ron Paul is a traitor and an idiot. He's a mouthpiece for bin laden and would abandon our allies and friends to Al Quaeda. If he gets his way and our military was cut to 20%, we'd be fighting AQ in our borders, not outside of them.
claymof 4 years ago
idiot
Bellator656 4 years ago
the amazing ron paul
ungobob 4 years ago
Ron Paul Rules...He is for personal liberties, He is for "Hard Assets", He is for decentralized government, He is for transparency and checks on the government, He is for privacy, personal liberty and economic freedom for an individual...Ron Paul Rocks...
favouritemartian 4 years ago
Exellent post kereport, thank you.
Good quality, also.
SmokescreenNinjaz 4 years ago
I really want to hear what Ron Paul has to say about Executive order 11110. Also, what about getting a pardon for Kent Hovind?
wauft 4 years ago
I believe he tells where he stands on the pardon in the 3rd GOP debate.
I believe he says that he would not pardon him. I am not sure what he says specifically about 11110, but I know he wants paper to be backed by hard currency like gold and silver.
kisstheclowns 4 years ago
Ron Paul 2008. Vote for Truth !
PERU84 4 years ago
Yea paper out of a thin air is the way to go
PERU84 4 years ago
Ron Paul speaks the truth about the terrorizing of are monetary policy right here in this country
PERU84 4 years ago
Ron Paul doesn't even understand the Fed is an agency of the US government, he doesn't even understand we tried the gold standard before and it failed miserabley.
He is the Neville Chamberlain and Herbert Hoover of our day, rolled into one. The moveonDOTorg crowd can have him.
claymof 4 years ago
you, sir, are a misinformed idiot. The Fed is absolutely NOT an agency of the government. It is a private bank with a charter issued by the government in 1914 (or maybe 1918..I forget)..it has a board of directors and is PRIVATELY OWNED>
Sambeauxrme 4 years ago
Lol.. calling me names, along with your inability to look up gov't organizational charts or to read the Federal Reserve Act doesn't change the facts.
The Fed is a quasi gov't agency, listed as a gov't agency on all official docs and has a gov website, hires thru the gov't agency. There is no private ownership - as is commonly understood.
Don't be stupid, learn to google.
claymof 4 years ago
I think you miss the point. The point is, if the is a Quasi agency as it could be called then it isn't an agency. Just because congress handed the control of our money doesn't legitimize it as a US agency. A US agency has to directly answer to congress ie, CIA, FEMA, FBI etc.. The Fed answers to no one but themselves. We done even choose the head of the FED The Banks do.
Windsblow 4 years ago
WE only get to pick from a list of 5 that the FED its self discribes. If The FED doesn't have to answer to congress than it's not a US agency. Thats the point.
Windsblow 4 years ago
Don't be stupid. The fed does answer to congress. They give thousands of reports to Congress, both in paper and in person, as well as no senior management can be hired without Congress' approval. They are as much of a gov't agency as teh CIA, FNMA. And again you're wrong, Reagan, Bush I and Clinton all chose Greenspan, Bush II chose Bernanke - both of which had to appear before Congress and get approval for confirmation. Get new info sources. Yours suck, as does Paul.
claymof 4 years ago
No I am sorry you are wrong. Congress has no authority to do a systematic or Volentary (which means even if the FED wanted to disclose hard funds they could not by law) The report are internally structured and dictated by the fed.
Windsblow 4 years ago
You are also SO very wrong about Congress choosing the senior manager (head) of the FED. As I stated below the Fed allows the president to choose from a list a five ( that the fed themselves choose, no one has any say in the select of the five OTHER THAN THE FEDERAL RESERVE. YOU CAN NOT SAY THE PRESIDENT APPOINTS ANYONE. These thing can be gooogled. You sir are wrong and I will brandish the proof if you would like
Windsblow 4 years ago
The Federal Reserve Banks are owned by private member banks (see below). Each member bank owns nonnegotiable shares of stock in its regional Federal Reserve Bank; see below). In Lewis v. United States,[18] the United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit stated that "the Reserve Banks are not federal instrumentalities for purposes of the FTCA [the Federal Tort Claims Act], but are independent, privately owned and locally controlled corporations."
Windsblow 4 years ago
Those are the regionals, and they are technically private for TAX matters as in the Lewis decision, and their 'ownership' is all the commercial banks in their region. But's it's ownership without control. The "owners" can't change the marketing, the products, enter new markets or exhibit any vestige of ownership commonly inferred by such in the public domain. They are still a U.S. govn't agency. Look at the orginizational charts.
claymof 4 years ago
Read the Federal Reserve Act or google bernanke confirmation... I never said Congress "chooses" I said they confirm - they have oversight. In addition the "list" for the head is the current sitting govenors, there's no submission by 'banks'.
claymof 4 years ago
Exactly "confirm" not choose. No one chooses except the private bankers. PRIVATE. Confeirnation means nothing if a private bank chooses who dicates interest rate and ultimatly our economies.
Windsblow 4 years ago
So, tell me do you believe inflationary taxes are a farce. Do you believe that our (the people of the USA) money is still back by gold?
Windsblow 4 years ago
"inflationary taxes?" Lol.. what jewel of a site did you get that from?
Secondly, we're off the gold standard. Tried it and it failed. We'd never have the prosperity we have if we were on the gold standard. The cost of money would be too high. Why does Paul hate that so many Americans can now own their own house???
In a defacto sense, the dollar is backed by gold or whatever - you can take the dollar and buy gold. The dollar is jsut a superior trading medium.
claymof 4 years ago
How did the gold standard fail?
Windsblow 4 years ago
In a nutshell, throughout history the gold standard has served as an artificial constriction on the ability of currency to expand sufficiently to support economic growth. By making currency scarce, the gold standard facilitated the bankers' control of the economy.
claymof 4 years ago
Con't: It was the bankers who got the governments of the world to go onto the gold standard after 1870 by undermining the utilization of silver. This allowed the bankers to control the world's monetary supply to the detriment of economic democracy until the 1930s, when gold became only a denominator of international trade, not a backing of domestic currencies.
claymof 4 years ago
Also, gold may or may not prevent inflation, because there are many things bankers can do to inflate the currency if they wish to. This happened with the inflation during and after World War I. This was a financial crime by which the bankers deliberately destroyed the value of the remaining paper greenbacks and silver certificates from post-Civil War days.
claymof 4 years ago
What is your solution to our seemingly uncontrollable debt and inflation? Let's stop talking about Gold, if it bothers you so much. Let's talk about YOUR solution, Claymof. Are you a financial expert, or do you just masquerade as one on Youtube?
lidixmang 4 years ago
If you want to control the debt then vote for congressmen who won't spend more than the gov't takes in.
Inflation hasn't been a factor in the economy for since Greenspan made the connection between it and interest rates back in 79. It's the major reason we've not had the boom/bust cycles and very modest recessions, even after the catastrophe of 9/11.
claymof 4 years ago 2
haha yeah... fiat currency is great... don't mind the huge recessions and inflation
Mattes50A05 4 years ago
You obviously know nothing of econ or history... compare recessions and inflation to what we had under the gold standard - look at when Roosevelt devalued the dollar - under the gold.
We're sooo much better off today.
claymof 4 years ago
I am for hard currency... But besides what Roosevelt did was a problem with fiat currency he devalued the dollar, and prolonging the depression imo. This is hardly even a credible argument against the gold standard. We are so much better off today but how many more times can the Fed bail us out before our dollar crashes? I tell you the crash is coming soon. We are worse off with beurocrats fluctating the price of a currency then it being maintained by a natraul free market
Mattes50A05 4 years ago
we were on the gold std when Roosevelt devalued. In addition, we've acheived unheard of levels of prosperity and leisure time. This would not be possible under the gold standard, as would home ownership for the average American - the price of money would be prohibitive.
Why is it there are no countries on the gold standard any more? B/c it didn't work then, and wouldn't work now.
claymof 4 years ago
We weren't really on the gold standard then... The fed wasn't regulating the dollar to gold. Why do you think the market crashed in 29? Because the fed was witholding the money because they thought they could get the value to increase after a decade of over inflating in the 20s. What FDR did hurt the economy even more and prolonged the depression
Mattes50A05 4 years ago
The US took gold out of private citizens hands in 29, but we remained on the gold std.. went off of it under Nixon in 71.
The depression started due to smoot-hawley and other factors.. the gold std had nothing to do with it. Following the econ theory at the time the Fed tightened, which ended up worsening the depression... now they prevent such.
claymof 4 years ago
We were on the "gold standard" thats what they say but they weren't playing by the rules. According to the Chicago school econ theory the market crashed due to the fed with tightening down. They over inflated it in the 20s, and wasn't linked to gold.
Mattes50A05 4 years ago
Chicago school?? It says nothing of the kind - playing by the rules. Bottom line, the dollar was backed by Gold. And was during the early 20's - which you call 'inflationary' However, in fact, inflation was absent, with virtually no increase in prices during the mid-1920s while the government sector was shrinking.
Get new info sources.
claymof 4 years ago
the fed wasn't playing by the rules man. Do you honestly believe they were actually regulating the usd to gold? no they weren't they over printed in the 20s and tightened up in 29 and crashed the market. This isn't an argument against the gold standard because we werent on it.
Mattes50A05 4 years ago
believe what you want, by statue, the dollar was tied to gold until 71... believe it or not.
claymof 4 years ago
... yeah thats what they say but their actions said other wise... You even said that the fed was controlling the output of currency even tightening it... was this because they were regulating to the ammount of gold??? No we incread our gold we should have been PRINTING more not witholding. so we werent on the standard regardless of what is said.
Mattes50A05 4 years ago
@Claymof,
Nice to see you again, especially now that gold is $775 per oz. Last time we talked it was $670. This was a couple months ago.
The reason I came back was to point that out, but now that I'm here, I would also like to point out that the "Gold STD" enforced by the Federal Reserve will not work either. You're partially right about that.
lidixmang 4 years ago
I'm glad to see Gold up.... those people that bot it 20 years ago on Paul's recommendation are just now getting their principal back... too bad they're still way behind on an inflation adjusted basis.
After the war/iran/subprime crisis, it'll go back to 350....
claymof 4 years ago
Speaking of war/iran/subprime crisis... How long should we watch gold climb? $1000 per oz? If the coming recession continues, wouldn't it create other economic problems?
Doesn't it seem like there is an intentional economic meltdown occurring?
lidixmang 4 years ago
"intentional economic meltdown"?? I don't follow, and I certainly don't see that, just the normal fluctuations....
We've had two or three recessions since 1990, they passed as this one will also.
claymof 4 years ago
'Intentional economic meltdown'.
Yes. It is very apparent.
Just look at the convergence of NAFTA-style policies coming into the horizon, somewhat behind the scenes.
Look at the ridiculous subprime crisis. How on earth could the larger banks possibly NOT know this was going to happen?
Take a look at the foreign policy of this administration. Just asked Congress for another $46 billion for Iraq.
Total borrowed from China to date: $1.4trillion.
lidixmang 4 years ago
Of course the list goes on.
-Outsourcing of millions of skilled labor positions
-Dismantling of the US tool and dye maker industry
-Dismantling of US automaker industry
-Expansion of international 'free trade' organization powers, ie NAU, NAFTA, etc.
lidixmang 4 years ago
Since the industrial revolution begain, low paying manual jobs have always sifted to less industrialized nations. In additions, the Unions killed the auto industry back in the 60's and 70's...we're still paying for that.
Employment is at all time highs, with higher wages.
claymof 4 years ago
you gotta remember, Paul was warning of impending doom in the 80's... he's clueless. free trade has created more jobs than it cost... look at all the help wanted signs around, all the companies hiring.
This is no meltdown.
claymof 4 years ago
@Claymof,
What is your occupation? Be honest.
lidixmang 4 years ago
ph.d student, finance.
claymof 4 years ago
What is yours?
claymof 4 years ago
Soldier.
lidixmang 4 years ago
Soldier? If true, that's kinda amazing. Most I know don't have any idea who Paul is and those that do, can't stand his cut and run strategy. They don't want another Vietnam and want to win/finish the job.
Anyway, thanks for your service.
claymof 4 years ago
I guess it is only amazing because you won't find most soldiers who support Ron Paul out in the open talking about it. They are ostracized for not going along with the status quo.
There are many of us who vehemently oppose the foreign policy of this administration.
I am not alone. And when he wins New Hampshire, more of us will organize and speak up for him to build his momentum.
This whole *cut and run* nonsense was made up by the same people who lied and said Iraq had WMDs.
lidixmang 4 years ago
Well, i doubt there are many who are 'ostracized'.. looking at the milblogs, I have yet to find one in support of paul, most again can't stand him. There are about a 1000 out there, and I've surely not visited them all, but his support in the mil is very, very slim by any standard.
claymof 4 years ago
On the contrary, Ron Paul's military donations are more than all other candidate combined, save Obama.
I say give it time. After Ron wins New Hampshire, more will step up. His message is popular with the troops, they just don't know it yet.
lidixmang 4 years ago
Also, I'm glad to see I have managed to capture the attention of a scholar. At least my arguments have not been wasted on some IRS agent or some other lame occupation. =)
I am surprised to find such a knowledgeable person trolling the YouTube commentary. Don't you have a thesis to be working on? Or is this part of your research?
lidixmang 4 years ago
No, this is a hobby... I came across some of Paul's lies/distortions and many people were beleiving them b/c they were unchallenged. Then he gets big into supporting Bin Laden's agenda, that was enough for me.
claymof 4 years ago
So, which lies/distortions are you talking about? You seem fixated on the Gold Standard issue. What else do you not like about him?
lidixmang 4 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
I don't like that he's embraced bin laden's agenda, that he never met a conspiracy theory he didn't embrace, that he's ignorant of the Constitution, particularly the 16th, that he demagoges often, such as on the McCarthy bill, proclaiming himself the only congressman to care about the 2A - Bullchit.
That's Paul...
claymof 4 years ago
Okay, I gotta ask. What is bin laden's agenda and how does RP embrace it?
Which conspiracy theories are you talking about?
How is he ignorant of the Constitution? (besides the 16th-- that's totally debatable)
What politician doesn't demagogue?
I don't mind turning this into a lengthy discussion if you don't.
lidixmang 4 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Bin Laden and RP both want the same things: US to retreat in Iraq, ME and Afstan, US to leave AQ alone overseas, US military to abandon it's allies in the fight, US to shrink it's military, US to cut and run as Bin Laden predicted they would (after Somolia in 92).
claymof 4 years ago
I don't mind long discussions, but youtube limits comments to 500 characters. Kinda hard to discuss much.
If you're seriously interested, email me at claymof AT yahoo DOT com.
claymof 4 years ago
Agreed. Youtube's 500-character-limit is pathetic. Honestly, these commentaries have the potential to be actual forums, but I guess Youtube caters to the ADHD generation.
Although I enjoy keeping discussions open to others to chime in, I agree that email will definitely be faster.
lidixmang 4 years ago 5
@lidixmang
I was just responding to someone and got so frustrated with the limitation (on my own channel, no less) that I gave up. You can't possibly articulate anything here. It's as if YouTube wants to suppress written communication.
Before I turned in, I Googled "YouTube character limit pathetic" just to see who else agrees with me... your comment here was the #1 result. I found it quite fitting that it was a Ron Paul supporter who made it!
You lightened my mood considerably. Thanks!
N37BU6 1 year ago
@N37BU6
I hear ya. Glad to help. Cheers!
KyleJosephSanders 1 year ago
bin Laden wants us in Iraq. He couldn't believe that we'd incvade a muslim nation like Iraq, get bogged down there for five years, and not be able to achieve success. This war has played right into his hands.
Annie55marie 4 years ago
really, that's pretty stupid. AQ is in complete disarry in Iraq, has squandered huge resources and goodwill - proving the Americans are the good guys to millions and millions of Arabs. You need better information... A letter was just released two days ago from an AQ commander talking about how bad it was the past year, he's down to 20 men from over 600.
We're kickin' ass... enjoy it.
claymof 4 years ago
I got my information from "The Looming Tower: Al Qeada and The Road To 9/11." Remember, this isn't a two or three year war in their eyes. They have a plan for a twenty year war and this kind of quagmire was the one thing they needed to advance to the next stage in their plan.
Annie55marie 4 years ago
You're an idiot and your rhetoric is pathetic.
UnhealthySalad 4 years ago
There is no, NO, "private banker' choice. The President chooses from the current govenors, submits to congress for confirmation. It's that simple. Just like all the other government agencies that report to the President and Congress - CIA, FNMA...
claymof 4 years ago
The Fed holds 790 billion in US debt which means part of the national debt is held privately by the Federal Reserve. (key word privately)
This is a fact. look it up. Now you tell me how can the united states be indebt to its self? Hmmm.... good question
Windsblow 4 years ago
Lol.. You can buy your own mortgage can't you? The Fed buys and sells US debt to adjust money supply - as they were commissioned to do by the Congress on behalf of the US Treasury. That doesn't mean they are 'private" as is commonly understood.
claymof 4 years ago
WE only get to pick from a list of 5 that the FED its self discribes. If The FED doesn't have to answer to congress than it's not a US agency. Thats the point.
Windsblow 4 years ago
it is incredible to me that a presidential candidate needs to raise 100 million to run, raises it from special interests and then pays it to five media barons who encourage polarization and division between liberals and conservatives while privately leaving the agenda untouched. I fear Paul would lose his life before he could shut the fed, or make any significant change.
denbosz 4 years ago
The real menace of our Republic is the invisible government which like a giant octopus sprawls its slimy legs over our nation. At the head is a small group of banking houses generally referred to as international bankers. This coterie runs our government for their own selfish ends. It operates under cover of a self-created screen and seizes our executive officers legislative bodies schools courts newspapers and every agency created for the public protection."
---John Hylan, NY Mayor 1918-1925
LadyKofNYC 4 years ago
Ok, discredit the quote, but tell me then, if it's a government agency, why is there no congressional oversight of the fed, no published(for your government) minutes of fed meetings, what other government agency can claim this?
denbosz 4 years ago
Uh, there is congressional oversight, there are published minutes of meetings, and the CIA, FDIC, FNMA - all are treated the same.
Seriously you need new info sources.
claymof 4 years ago
Seiously, I am prepared to be proven wrong but you have succeeded in none of that, you have merely said that my information is inaccurate, you have given me no evidence to suggest this is so.
denbosz 4 years ago
Den... I can't prove that that "something didn't happen" - that is impossible. You can google the quote, and find out the source or see where it's admitted that Wilson never said it. It's not in his speeches, writings or memoirs. Since "Jekyll" it's just "attributed" to him, with no source - why, there is no source docs.
claymof 4 years ago
You refute that woodrow wilson said something but you have no source to back it up, you refute my information, but you provide nothing to support it,look for yourself at the minutes on their website, it only says who attended, and a very broad and brief statement, you are certainly one of the victims of your polarized media.Your argument is that you're right and everyone else is wrong, and I'm not interested in a discussion like that, Go fuck yourslf
denbosz 4 years ago
Really? Don't be an idiot, even if you're a Ron Paul Supporter. Google "Federal Reserve Minutes" - you can see the copies and the discussions or go the Federal Reserve website , they're under FOMC.
Find me the doc or speech of the Wilson quote. Or I can do the same thing:
Denbosz said "Ron Paul is an idiot and a traitor."
See - we agree! Thanks for the kind words. Classy and typical of the RP 'hate america' group.
claymof 4 years ago
I don't hate america at all, but I'm not American, I just know how you are percieved by others around the world and can see your personal freedoms going to hell in a hand cart, anyone that votes only according to his oath of office to uphold the constitution, would certainly seem like someone the world could relate to. You're current president is percieved as someone who helps his friends to make lots of money but doesn't give a rats arse about his constituency, or his constitution.
denbosz 4 years ago
American's haven't lost one bit of personal freedom. That's bunk.
To Americans - perception is nothing. Look at clinton - according to the international elites, he was loved by everyone. It is on his watch that the WTC, the Cole, Somolia, two American Embassies and other attacks occurred on Americans without one effective strike against AQ. In fact, AQ grew tremendously under Clinton's watch. He had a chance to arrest Osama and didn't.
claymof 4 years ago
America will never be loved by the elites and press. But we're the only nation having to build a fence to keep people out.
Say what you want, the 'tired and poor' of the world love it here and built something great. The elites can't stand that.
We'll never be loved by the world, but we will be respected - Teddy Roosevelt.
claymof 4 years ago
Ron Paul has fed you guys sooo many lies, you can't see or think straight. But most people can see and understand what he says and are disgusted by it. That's why he's a no show in any real poll, not stacked by moveonDOTorg and Dhimmicratic Underground - his two most loyal supporters in blaming America.
He is a traitor and an idiot.
claymof 4 years ago
Ron Paul has fed you guys sooo many lies, you can't see or think straight.
He is a traitor and an idiot.
claymof 4 years ago
I have unwittingly ruined my country, a great industrial nation is controlled by it's system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated in the hands of a few men. Woodrow Wilson Who, passed the federal reserve act in 1913, while congress was on holiday. you can argue semantics all day, call it ownership, or control, either way it is not in the hands of your government.
denbosz 4 years ago
ROTFLMAO...
PLEASE, PLEASE, Learn to google. That quote attributed to President Wilson, IS A LIE. WILSON NEVER STATED IT. It was cooked up in Creatures of Jekyll Island - if I remember, but it's never been attributed to Wilson and doesn't appear in anything he said or wrote.
claymof 4 years ago
So who told you that this quite was a lie, and who controls your system of credit? the fed is not subject to federal oversight and does not disclose to government the contents of it's meetings, what other govt. agency can do this? As for being responsible for your acts, Is America in no way responsible, when it in fact created al quaeda to fight the russians in Afghanistan? But of course, your probable argument will be that if they hadn't we would all be speaking Russian now.
denbosz 4 years ago
that is simply not true, the fed is not a government agency like the CIA or the FDIC, it's governors are given fourteen year terms by a president, that is the extent to which it is federal, it's ownership is not clear because they are secretive, but it most definitely is not the government.
denbosz 4 years ago
Fact: The Federal Reserve is a goverment agency.
Just like the CIA, FDIC, GNMA, FNMA - its directors report to the President, it's employees all are Federal employees, it's audited annually by the GAO, and all 'profits' are returned to the US Treasury. It cannot acquire, or be acquired by private companies, it cannot change it's mission or alter its services.
It is an 'independent' government agency. Simple fact.
claymof 4 years ago
You probably think Federal Express is a government agency too you moron.
Sambeauxrme 4 years ago
Again, as far as the Federal Reserve being a US government agency, it has a DOTgov website - available only to US government agencies and it's in every
government agency listing such as the one on the White House site (youtube won't let me post a link).
There is simply no denying, by any standard that the Fed is a government agency.
claymof 4 years ago
so tell me another government agency that is not owned by the government. Do your own research and if you can give me a list of the owners of the fed, I'd like to see it, as would Ron Paul. The two major powers which have privately owned central reserve banks are yours and the English.
denbosz 4 years ago
you need to quit the propaganda rags and take a look at that "ownership". It's unlike the 'ownership' of any other 'private company' in the world.
It's ownership without the ability to hire or fire, without input in management decisions, no board meetings, no ability to sell, required by the nature of their business (all public US registered banks).
The 'ownership' is not ownership of control, it's not even called ownership by the Fed or Gov't.
claymof 4 years ago
Continued:
the banks simply have to buy shares of 'capital stock' (that is not limited, has no authorized or outstanding amount, and does not trade.
However one would define a private corp - the fed won't meet that requirement. It does meet the definitions of a gov't agency and is so listed by everyone - gov't and private corps who deal with the gov't.
claymof 4 years ago
Whe I grew up the dollar was backed up by gold. It was at Ft Knox mostly (remember the movie Goldfinger?) I think that there isn't enough gold to go around to back all the dollars that have been printed. Our debt is not repayable, and our income tax pays for the interest owed the Fed Reserve, we do not own the gold anymore, so who does own it?
rhisome 4 years ago
Not a penny of our taxe goes toward interest owed the Federal Reserve. The Fed is a gov't agency, and the gold in Ft Knox is owned by the US and other nations that have deposited their supplies there.
Think gold - think expensive to store, controlled by a few.
claymof 4 years ago
Great rant YR - did you learn that on moveonDOTorg - where most of RP's supporters are?
Why don't you point me to the Supreme Court decision that says Income taxes are illegal. I can point to about 100 cases where they were ruled legal.
Iraq - same thing, try the facts, you'll learn something.
Oh, I can find 10 lies in Freedom to Fascism in the first 5 minutes. Nice to see where you get your facts from... lol.
claymof 4 years ago
Don't be an idiot.
The Iraq war was legal, under UN and US laws. Was authorized and funded by Congress.
Income taxes are legal, as evidenced by hundreds of court cases and not one constitutional law scholar arguing they are not.
Ron Paul is a traitor, and Bin Laden's hero.
claymof 4 years ago
Ron Paul is the new craze among EVERYONE seeking the truth.
eu4ik 4 years ago
Hello fellow american
Giuliani is out of control.
All we hear from him is 9/11, but do you remember Rudy before then?
WE sure do.
Check out what our fellow ferrets are saying about him:
Just Search for nyferrets on youtube
Yours truly,
mike
leader of the ny ferrets
member of ferrets for freedom
nyferrets 4 years ago
i am a prof trader...this man is a genius!!!!
shrado 4 years ago
Ron paul is an idiot who parrots bin laden's talking points. he would abandon our allies in Iraq, leaving them to the same fate our friends who trusted us experienced in South Vietnam.
RP hates the fact Americans are more prosperous and own more homes than ever. He would take us back to the dark ages economically.
claymof 4 years ago
Paul wants all Americans to be wealthy through the free market, and doesn't want us impoverished by inflated fiat currency. Get your facts straight.
Punchey 4 years ago
Paul knows less about econ and 'fiat currency' than he does about history. Bottom line- Americans have never been more prosperous in their history. He hates that, for whatever convoluted logic.
Not only that, he's a mouthpiece for Bin Laden. That's why the moveon moonbats support him so, not conservatives.
claymof 4 years ago
Your response is a masterpiece of ignorance and epithet posing as dialogue. Try actually watching a Paul speech or reading one of his articles to get some idea what he believes, and stop letting Fox News tell you what to think. Ron Paul is for free-market Capitalism, wealth (yes, he even says as much), and national security. Which is why he wants to secure our border against future bin Ladins instead of securing the borders of other nations, such as Iraq.
Punchey 4 years ago
You need to quit listening to the propaganda and understand ideas have consequences. RP would defend our borders against Bin Laden??? Like he did before 9/11? His isolationism combined with a healthy dose of Neville Chamberlain would give bin laden free reign in the rest of the world - paul would defend our borders when we were surrounded, not to mention leaving the problem to solve for our kids or grandkids.
claymof 4 years ago
You seam to be really impressed with your own percieved intelligence. Again you are a D-bag. Sorry for my lack of typing ability in my last reply.
Whatthafuhkdude72 4 years ago
The only thing you should apologize for is your lack of reasoning ability, as typlified by your name. Of course, you are a RP supporter.
claymof 4 years ago
-Economists educated by the current fiat monetary system are 'polishing a turd', in other words, they are math geniuses hired by counterfeiters, to shift credit debt all around the globe to keep the bill collectors at bay.
- Bin Laden's father was in business with the Carlyle group, co-chaired by George HW Bush. Bin Laden was trained by the CIA. He was watched over by the CIA prior to 9-11 and he was hanging out in Pakistan when I was in Afghanistan.
lidixmang 4 years ago
Economists have produced the greatest prosperity and most leisure time the world has ever seen. They've provided capital necessary for the economy to grow - impossible under a gold standard.
Most every large international corp has done business with the Laden Group. Find some real info then get back to me.
claymof 4 years ago
If I apply for 25 credit cards, yes, I can have a lavish lifestyle too, for a while, until I have to pay it all back.
lidixmang 4 years ago
Ah.. a masters student in the Ron Paul School of Econ. Ignoring completely the high levels of employment, productivity, leisure, it's all about credit cards, as if that was the source of everyone's money.
Hmmm.. folks have been living off of credit cards for 50 years.
You make this easy. Ron Paul taught you well.
claymof 4 years ago
In addition Paul's 'economic theory' - is simply bunk. That is why it's not supported by any educated economist. If he practiced medicine like he does econ, his nickname would be Josef Mengele.
claymof 4 years ago
where are your facts? He doesn't know how the money circulates in your country, like everyone else, but he does seem to be the only person in elected office who is trying to get the fed to tell him. by the way the problems of the rest of the world are yours to solve?
denbosz 4 years ago
My facts??? - The prosperity of the last 50 years, Jefferson fighting the islamistics and RP denying both. If you listed to RP in the 80's - and bot gold when he said, you'd be desititute by now. A faulty logic demands bad responses. RP is proof of that.
claymof 4 years ago
By prosperity, do you mean 'Housing bubble'?
Most people are in a 30-year home loan funded by fiat currency that loses value faster than the loan is repaid.
So, in essence, most home owner today are going to buy their house at least 2 times, if not 3 or 4.
Now we are seeing a RECORD number of foreclosures. Of course this could be attributed in part to poor financial planning on the home owners' part, but it's still an indication of the overall health of the economy.
lidixmang 4 years ago
The "housing bubble" is rather narrowly focused, in addition, there were greater bubbles in the gold eras - they called them boom cycles and then the bust. We've not experieinced a severe 'bust' since we went off the gold std in the 60's. Hey if you and Ron Paul want to go back to lower purchasing power and depressions, go right on.
Leave us out.
claymof 4 years ago
You also abuse stats, again, congrats to Paul. He taught you. Look at the foreclosure rates - there have been higher - under the gold standard. The reason they are at a 'RECORD' number is there are many more home owners. It's pathetic you and Paul think that home ownership is a bad idea.
claymof 4 years ago
Sounds good, Claymof. Go vote for Romney or Hilary or whoever. Keep fighting the Iraq war. Keep paying income tax. Keep the crappy health care system. Keep the inflation rate rising and the deficit growing. You can keep it all! Polishing the brass on the Titanic.
lidixmang 4 years ago
Hmmm.. Ron Paul was saying that in the 80's. Those people who listened to him are now poor - having lost almost all to his lousy advice.
If he practiced medicine like he does economics, his name would be Josef Mengele....
claymof 4 years ago
Hey winner. Your so-called educated aconomists are the ones that have totally fuhkt the system up in the first place. D-Bag.
Whatthafuhkdude72 4 years ago
It doesn't take a genius to know that printing lots of unbacked currency dilutes the value of existing currency. Please back up your claims with facts.
Punchey 4 years ago
That's only one part of the equation. the part left out is the expansion of the economy. If you want to know true inflation, look at the value of goods in labor hours.
In the 20's an average worker had to work 3 months to buy a decent suit. Today, he has to work 1 week or less. Which economy do you want? Which is inflation?
claymof 4 years ago
That's a poor analogy. "I remember when candy bars were only a nickel!" my dad used to say.
It sounds like you are educated by the modern economic system and are ingrained in it like someone who is about to retire from the IRS and doesn't want to lose their social pension.
lidixmang 4 years ago
No, you don't understand. Ron Paul's poor analogy is using only one limited measure - inflation. It paints a distorted picture.
The reality of it is, simply, Americans have never, NEVER, had greater purchasing power with their labors.
End of story - that is prosperity, that's progress.
claymof 4 years ago
You sir, are an idiot.
sidrosteel 4 years ago
Nice ad hominem.. that's what you moonbats do when you can't argue the facts. No wonder your a Ron paul supporter.
claymof 4 years ago
Oh the irony (or should I say hypocrisy?). "Nice ad hominem...moonbats"
Speaking of facts, I haven't seen you produce any as yet. Let's revisit your ignorant statement that Ron Paul wants Americans to be poor. Where do you get that, and what do you do with the numerous statements of his that he wants free markets so that we can be even more wealthy? watch?v=RahgC1eptgk He even implies he wants there to be more Bill Gates-type billionaires. So how can you say he hates wealth?
Punchey 4 years ago
If you haven't seen me post facts, then you can't read. That's not my problem. If RP's dream came true - gold standard, there would be no expansion of capital, money would be prohibitively expensive and controlled by a few powerful bankers - as would the gold. Same as in the previous gold standard.
He doesn't understand what he's saying so he can ad lib most anything - re: more billionaires.
claymof 4 years ago
fr54om 1879-the late 18901s after the civil war when america went back to the gold standard they experienced growth, real growth of 4 % per annum, it was only the bankers that ruined that by denting confidence with fractional reserve banking when depositors could not retrieve their own money.
denbosz 4 years ago
actually, when you have a depression (like you have under the gold standard) or war (like the civil when economic production is greatly reduced/destroyed) there is sufficient currency to allow for an expansion to previous levels. There's not enough to fund current levels. Do the math, rather than examine one small sample biased period. The Reconstruction Period kept the South down and poor for decades
claymof 4 years ago
periods of time do not keep people down and poor,if you look into that I think you will find that debt undertaken from banks to finance the war was what kept the south down and poor for decades.
denbosz 4 years ago
Lol.. that's funny. Since the north burned the schools, wouldn't rebuild them, put illiterate blacks in authority making decisions, stole the remaining capital and possession from those that had it, it was a very punitative period.
claymof 4 years ago
Then the reaction give the radical racist southerners a foothold and control. the animosity/bitterness lasted for decades, not an inducement to raising new capital and improving the education systems.
That's what kept the south down.
claymof 4 years ago
that and the fact that gold was controlled by a few northern banks. There was no capital in the south or to invest in the south. Paul would take us back to a few controlling the capital - lower home ownership etc.
claymof 4 years ago
The economists have not created our wealth and purchasing power. You yourself used labor hours as a measure. That should have made it clear to you that purchasing power is a result of higher productivity, not currency manipulation. That's owed largely to the advance of technology and to enterprising capitalists, not economists.
Punchey 4 years ago
Argue the facts, not straw men Punchey. I didn't say economists created, I said they supplied the liquidity to grow the economy - which wouldn't be possible under gold. That created the prosperity, which has increased purchasing power - true deflation, not inflation.
claymof 4 years ago
Wrong again. You: "Economists have produced the greatest prosperity and most leisure time the world has ever seen."
Punchey 4 years ago
In context - they were supplying liquidity for the economy to grow. I'm sorry you don't understand econ, but then hey, you're a Ron Paul guy.
claymof 4 years ago
But back to the original point of my comment, you can disagree with the idea of the gold standard, but my question is, given the facts, how can you claim Ron Paul doesn't like Americans to be wealthy? Back that assertion up with facts, because I've just disproved it with facts.
Punchey 4 years ago
You've produced no facts, just rhetoric unfounded in the reality of this economy. Paul would implement a gold standard - which would have the same effect it did before - concentrate power in the hands of the few and limit opportunities to access capital for new business. Money would be more expensive. We tried the gold std before and it failed. Bretton Woods failed. Kennedy and Nixon knew it.
We've had unparalled prosperity for 50 years. It's not a fluke. Ron Paul can't stand that.
claymof 4 years ago
Is the housing bubble not a fact? Is rapid inflation not a fact? Are record numbers of foreclosures and bankruptcies not fact? Is China's $1.3 trillion USD not a fact? Are rising health care costs not a fact? Is unratified federal income tax not a fact? Is the multi-trillion dollar deficit not a fact?
Yep. You sure h