I like how she started screaming about her dead son then Larry's all "you have a dead kid?" and Jenny goes, oh shit, I'm beautiful and not used to people callnmg me out on my crap....
GOOGLE: " CDC conducting vaccine surveillance operation on American families (see the documents)' by Mike Adams of NaturalNewsdtcm~ & you notice how the ProPharma Shills LOVE to vote up their OWN comments?? ;)
It was VERY disturbing to me to hear Jenny tell that one doctor that she would rather her child have one of those preventable (through vaccines) diseases than autism. I had mumps when I was a young child and my relative had mumps also which developed into encephalitis, from which he has sequelae still to this day (no, our parents were not negligent in regard to vaccinating us, but rather this was before the MMR was invented).
i believe her, i also think that its not only vaccines that are causing autism and other ailements, its the air we breath and the food we eat. i don't understand why people are so harsh on her, like when she said " my child died infront of me" we all know she is metephorically speaking. she is trying to get people to listen and then maybe enough research can be done to either back up or refute the link between vacc. and autism ,but without enough long term research one can never be sure.
The most likely cause is a genetic mutation. Research "Fragile X". If she wants to be taken seriously, she should stop the emotional crap and rely on facts. There is a chance that her son never had autism to begin with. However, epiliptic symptoms are present in 20-30% of autistic cases. A lot of parents of autistic children can't stand her due to her poor character.
Wow is she retarted. People have died from getting those diseases she claims she could go without the vaccine for. Her child died in front of her? She had more then one child? thats news to me. i could have sworn she said her kid was doing great. hmmm.... Lets just run with what Jenny says cause she has all those years of medical schoo... oh, wait.... how did she find out about what her kid had and how to fix it? google? yeah... thats what i thought.
I really am sorry that in this world of fast communication, we need a mechanism to quickly determine whose opinion might carry some weight and depth of thought, and whose opinion is just that of a thoughtless, uneducated stooge. The inability to spell common English words is prima facie evidence that the user's education is lacking, and that he/she is a doddering ignoramus. >;^)
I suppose that attempting to point out that there is a very large difference between the inability to spell, and simply misspelling a word would be lost on you. But as we all know, you really shouldn't judge a book by its cover. You can sit there and assume what you will about me, but without knowledge of my education you just end up sitting there making false assumptions and looking like a complete and utter "RETARD"
Wow, you learned how to spell 'retarded' correctly. Did you look it up in the dictionary? Did you see your picture next to the definition?
I don't have to assume anything. I was just foolin' with you about the spelling, thickwit. The real reason I objected to your earlier post was your calling Jenny McCarthy 'retarted', (sic). I guess that means you think she's stupid, and doesn't know what she's talking about. How much research have you done on the subject? Zero? Exactly.
Your right, I have done absolutely zero research on the mater. But i'm not the one going on national tv telling people what to or not to do based purely off of research done on the web. I'm not the one arguing with professionals claiming them to be wrong and me to be right. She is a complete and utter retard. And anyone who just googles things, and then thinks that they are better then people who spend their whole lives studying these things are retards too.
Here's the thing. Vaccines in the US contain Thimerosal, a compound which is 49.6% mercury by weight. Look it up. Some vaccines in the US contain over 100times the EPA maximum 'safe' limit of mercury, PER DOSE, for a child. Mercury is a neurotoxin. That is, it kills brain cells. It is linked to autism, cardiovascular disease, seizures, MENTAL RETARDATION, hyperactivity, dyslexia and many other conditions. I'm concerned YOU may have received too many vaccinations in your own life already!
Honestly, if you have not researched the matter yourself (as you have said) then how do you know she is wrong? Are you making assumptions about her intelligence? I want to know how you are so sure Jenny McCarthy has done no research. I suppose the doctors and other parents who agree with her have not done a single, tiny bit of research either?
I didnt say she hasnt done any research. She claims she did research on google for christ sakes. Would you go to a doctor that did his medical schooling through google? "Dont worry, i googled how to do this." There are doctors on both sides of this argument. What im saying is that untill they can prove without a shadow of a doubt that these vaccinations are the true cause of autism, then we should contrine to do what has worked. again, try not to defend the retard who is a google expert
I think Jenny meant to say this information is widely available, not that she utilizes Google as her sole source. Even if she got her information this way, there are medical doctors saying the same things. I agree the link isn't proven, but until the link is DISPROVED, beyond a shadow of a doubt, you can't go around calling people idiots for asking questions. Nobody should ever believe something without looking into it themselves.
The thing is, Im not trying to disprove anything. She is the one claiming that these vaccinations are the cause of autism. What she has to do is prove that there is a link. Shes the attacker. As the attacker its her job to provide proof. And nothing short of her going to medical school will be enough research. And the medical doctors saying the same thing still have to prove to me that there is in fact a link.
I guess it just confuses me that people seem to think Jenny McCarthy is the only person saying this. If you can't listen to someone because they took naked pictures years ago or because they aren't a doctor, fine. But don't assume they are wrong because of those things. Jenny isn't the best source so ignore her and listen to the guy sitting next to her! Do research!
heres the issue, just like oprah, (who has supported her) Jenny has a fanbase that is willing to do anything she says without listening to both sides of the story. Whether she likes it or not, too many people are taking the idea that they shouldnt medicate their kids. Other children have died as a result of one parent not medicating their kids. I'm fine with a figurehead promoting such an idea. But when they do it without giving both sides of a story it becomes a risk. she is retarted.
Wait a minute. Jenny McCarthy has *never* said to not medicate children. Medication treats an illness whereas vaccination (hopefully) prevents it. She says in this interview that she is not against vaccines. She just wants them to be safer and for each child to be individually assesed as a candidate for these vaccines. Not everyone benefits from every vaccine and this is well known. I think you should rewatch the video though, you may have misunderstood her points.
Thats the major problem. weither she likes it or not, thats what some people are taking away from her messages. its not just this video where she says shes not against all vaccines that people hear. If this were the only video she had then i would be fine with her. But the problem is she goes on all kinds of shows and isnt exactly clear about her point most of the time, mainly due to her inability to debate. and there no way i could submit my brain to these videos again. i believe torture is bad
Bottom line, she may not speak clearly, but that doesn't mean she is wrong. And never has she said she doesn't believe in medicating children. Attack her for the things she says, not the ones you've made up.
You may not be trying to disprove anything, but you seem very sure that Jenny (and presumably all who agree with her) are "retarded" even though you haven't researched the matter at all. Your absolute conviction about a subject you admittedly know nothing about is astonishing.
Those who agree with her because she said so are retarded. If they happen to be on the same side as her because they believe what the doctors have said then fine. But if you watch this interview, she attacks the doctors who say she has no proof over and over all but screaming at them. She is retarded and has no idea how to debate
She might not know how to debate or even speak her point clearly, but that does not mean she is wrong. Just as a spelling error does not prove a lack of intelligence. I don't know if you can really fault a person for getting a bit emotional about their children. It was clearly expected that she might do this, hence why a doctor is with her to calmly say the things she can't.
Again like i stated, here its fine since both sides can be represented equally, but when she goes on her talk shows and on oprah and her opposition trys to get a word in edgewise she goes off like she always does and no-one stops her. Like i said and will always firmly believe, she is a retard and needs to learn that while granted, there might just be a link, let the medical professionals take care of it and just be a spokesperson for it like other celebrity's doe for their causes.
A spokesperson how? Like Eva Mendes posing nude to speak out against fur? No wait, everybody looks down on Jenny's past photos. Maybe she should play a benefit concert like U2? Ah, she's not a singer. Basically, you just don't like that the woman is outspoken and maybe a little too passionate about the topic. Solution? Change the channel when she comes on or better yet, don't watch TV. But don't confuse her for her basic message.
Lead panit was ever present until 1976. Abestos was in every known insulation in the world. gas toxins were exposed to familys coal burning for heat was mass co2 exposure. All of which are toxic. Why is autisum only a real issue untill the late 80s? who knows but our kids have always been exposed to toxic chemicals. But not untill the late 80s were the toxins injected under the skin evading all our immune systems safeguards.
To say that you can clear Autism is a true testament of her lack of education. When she has a medical degree and has developed a cure, then she can say there is a cure! Isn't it possible that her incompetent FORMER pediatrician miss diagnosed Evan?
She claimed that Evan was diagnosed in 5 minutes. This is highly unlikely considering the various tests involved. These include blood and urine tests along with behavior observations and brain scans.
Do you think she literally means in five minutes? Isn't this more likely an expression meaning the doctor immediately suspected autism? Do you never use hyperbolic terms in speech? From what I can tell, most people do. They just don't have bored people on websites picking apart their every word.
So if a doctor cures my child's pneumonia, I cannot tell people he recovered from pneumonia without having a medical degree? What sort of logic is that? It is possible Evan was misdiagnosed but if your child was diagnosed with any sort of ASD and you thought that was incorrect, would you not seek another opinion? Do you have a medical degree? If not, according to your logic, you should never comment on ANY aspect of health.
Listen to her comment on 1:10-1:17. I guess she never saw what measles or polio does to children. I would vaccinate my children for Hepititus. This is due to the fact that my aunt died of it when she was only 2 years old. I personally believe that she is after publicity. I don't mind David Kirby saying that vaccines might contribute to autism as he is more educated than McCarthy. "Big Pharma" and the anti vaccine crowd have the same goal; autism prevention. (abortion)
Hypothetically, if you were a celebrity of some sort and your child recovered from a disease without a known cure, wouldn't you tell the world? Is there nothing in your life now that you wish you could let people know? I don't blame the woman for utilizing her resources for a good cause, most people would do the same. How many other celebrities give to charities and everybody oohs and ahhs over their great deeds, yet this woman says something unpopular and you all leap at her.
Jenny McCarthy isn't "using her resources for a good cause", Ladygish. She is a new age nut case ("Indigo Mom" to a "Crystal Child") who is using "her resources" to kill children. The number of vaccine preventable deaths since June 2007, currently stands at 458, how many of them did her misinformation kill? These figures are available at jennymccarthybodycount (dot) com.
Honestly, I laughed out loud when I loaded that website. How absurd can you get? Are you implying that every single unvaccinated child in this country was born to parents who listen to Jenny McCarthy? Are you saying vaccination is 100% effective? Are you unaware of certain religious groups which do not allow medical treatment? I laughed even harder when I looked at that website's "source." This is a prime example of why you need to look into everything yourself. They link to several CDC tables
I have to admit that the links describing Jenny McCarthy's wacky "Crystal Child" and "Indigo Mom" beliefs were very amusing, Ladygish. It's amazing that anybody takes that woman seriously, though I hardly think the preventable deaths, and illnesses caused by vaccine denial are funny. It's because vaccination isn't 100% effective that many vulnerable groups depend on herd immunity, which people like McCarthy are threatening. What evidence backs your CDC conspiracy theory?
which tell the number of cases of various diseases as reported by "selected cities." A case of a disease does NOT mean the person died. After looking through the entire page, I finally came across a table of numbers of deaths from "all causes" from select cities. Getting hit by a truck does not equal death by measles. Seriously, click on the death statistic and click one of the listings to see the source. Even more silly, the tables don't count the entire country, only some cities. So even if
this site was correct in assuming all of the cases listed had died, they wouldn't even be counting a large percentage of the US and therefore wouldn't be counting all of the deaths. I'm honestly not sure *what* they were counting. Now a CDC table I found about vaccine preventable illnesses AND deaths as reported in the National Center for Health Statistics Mortality Report had no information available on the mortality rates. I will gladly message you a link to this PDF if you would like.
The jennymccarthybodycount website shows statistics for VACCINE PREVENTABLE deaths, and VACCINE PREVENTABLE illnesses, Ladygish. How does the fact that people also die from causes which couldn't be prevented by vaccination, or that the tables may not "count the entire country" alter the fact that vaccine denial kills people?
It doesn't alter the fact at all. But I would like to know where they got their figures. It's all well and good to say X number of people died from ___, anyone can make those things off the top of their heads. It doesn't make it true though. Maybe I am reading it wrong, but I don't see where the websites source contains the information they claim it does. I like to work with hard facts, not emotion appeals. I'm not saying there aren't vaccine preventable deaths, I'm saying give me a REAL number.
You obviously haven't gone to the Frequently Asked Questions section of the jennymccarthybodycount website, Ladygish. I'm glad you like hard facts, perhaps you could give me some "hard facts" disproving these statistics.
lol. No. That site is not worth my or anyone else's time. I'm sure you'll interpret this response negatively, but it's a silly website. I DID provide you the real data, freaking READ what I type. Let me copy/paste my post from a day ago: "...table I found about vaccine preventable illnesses AND deaths as reported in the National Center for Health Statistics Mortality Report had no information available on the mortality rates. I will gladly message you a link to this PDF if you would like."
Now, from my standpoint, I have statistics from the National Center for Health Statistics Mortality Report which is the source the CDC utilizes...or jennymccarthybodycount. Are you serious? I don't care about their FAQ, I went directly to their sources which contained irrelevant tables. I guess I was supposed to be overwhelmed by the impressive CDC tables and wasn't supposed to actually read them. (2 posts)
I debate people with a wide variety of wacky beliefs in Youtube, but few have the body count associated with vaccine denial, Ladygish. The jennymccarthybodycount website makes a very important point. You have yet to produce any data which shows a link between vaccination and autism.
This entire argument is like saying all air travel should be halted until a way can be found to make planes crash proof. With any kind of treatment there will always be a small percentage who have unfortunate side effects, the point of the treatment is the greater good. Even the hardest conspiracy theorists have to concede that immunisation has taken away one of the greatest threats to infants. I'd rather my child be autistic and alive than dead from a preventable disease.
Who knows, autistics have many unique skills. However, some people are rediculously paranoid and will deny any evidence that is presented against them. I personally believe that Jenny McCarthy is in for herself more than Evan. As I said, look at her remarks at 1:07-1:15. She is an over-prevledged brat who has not seen a real tradgedy. "Evan died in front of me for two minutes." Big deal, I lost a lot of friends due to gang violence and I saw the look on their parents' faces.
Then I guess you know how painful the loss of a child is. Just because Jenny McCarthy has money doesn't mean she doesn't experience pain or emotion. How can someone from a middle class family be "over-preveledged[sic]?" If she were poor, your comments would be very different.
Measles, mumps and chicken pox can be treated if the parent has that information. Many children have been treated effectively with natural medicine for homeopathy. I would take measels just as Jenny would only because I know what to do.
you would take measles? complications include pneumonia and life long lung disease, blindness, severe permanent brain injury and in 1 in 1000 cases death. there is no cure, treatment is purely symptomatic so if complications occur there is very little you can do. the incidence is still low but as more parents choose not to vaccinate this will surely rise as herd immunity i lost. if you look at the numbers the chance that your child will get measles (and subsequent sequelae)
if not vaccinated is higher than the chance that they will get autism even if causality had been proved (which it has never been). Measles can be a devastating condition for both child and parent just as autism is, so i don't think it can be dismissed so flippantly. I agree that parents should be given the choice whether their child is immunised or not. But given the current proven scientific data on the risks of either choice i would choose vaccination.
we need our kids to be tested before vaccines are given but I am sure they will fight tooth and nail because of cost. further more i also pick measles. children die of measles when they are unhealthy all ready. once again test the system.
what do the children need to be tested for? test the system in what way? i agree that worldwide the mortality in less developed countries caused by measles is higher to due other co-morbidities such as HIV infection. however the fact is that 1 in 1000 previously healthy children die or develop permanent brain damage in the USA. this does not take in to account other conditions vaccinated for such as meningitis, diptheria, polio, haemophilus B, hepatitis. if children aren't vaccinated they are
at higher risk of these conditions, which can have a much higher morbidity and mortality rates, would you pick one of these? Policy cannot be influenced by anecdotal evidence and hearsay, a court of law would never prosecute on such grounds so why should the CDC change policy. Once there has been unequivocal, reproducible scientific evidence of causality then policy can be reviewed and changed accordingly.
"Once there has been unequivocal, reproducible scientific evidence of causality then policy can be reviewed and changed accordingly."
To do this they first have to look at the cases and they wont, they will ignore us to save face for as long as possible. been playing the game for 2 decades
i'm not sure what this statement implies. What cases have not been looked at? are you saying that in the 11 years since the initial Wakefield paper in the Lancet (which has been discredited) that the medical community, not only in the US but world wide has not researched the matter? there have been hundreds of case controlled, retrospective cohort and epidemiological studies around the world which have failed to show a statistical link b/w vaccination and autism.
"you seem to imply that the entire medical profession all over the world is performing a cover up, and thereby putting children at risk to save face" no other countries are taking action. we are not. the uSA
also you seem to imply that the entire medical profession all over the world is performing a cover up, and thereby putting children at risk to save face. this is not only a slight on these people as doctors and professionals but as human beings. what tests would you propose? is there one magic test that will tell us the strength of a childs immune system at birth?at 3 months ? at 6 months? will it be PCR analysis, DNA sequencing, immuno based assay? which do you propose?
they are very intelligent. they know what testing to do. I do believe they want to save face other wise more action and research would have bee done by now. 2 decades is a very long time. sorry my message is off, broke my arm yesterday hard to type
i'm not sure i understand your view point, you concede the medical profession are intelligent enough to know which tests to run but are unwilling to accept their results.
you seem to suggest that the scientific community not only in America but the whole world is acting together in conspiracy to purposely mislead the public. the basis of scientific research is to prove or disprove the recognised theory. they would be desperate to try and prove a link b/w vaccines and autism and be he 1st ones to do so. sometimes so desperate that they will manipulate results hence Dr Wakefield's paper.
still not getting it, why do you want people to look at your son. if it is your belief that vaccination is a direct cause of his autism then i respect that. however this is you opinion and can only be interpreted as anecdotal evidence. this should not influence the whole vaccination program.
there are millions saying, "look at my son" soon they will have no choice but to really look. its coming. soon. especially when they do a new count. the 1 in 150 is seven years old. so all i can say to ignorance is, "look at my son". sorry i cant give u more to argue about.
still not getting it, why do you want people to look at your son. if it is your belief that vaccination is a direct cause of his autism then i respect that. however this is you opinion
you enjoy trying to fuck with parents? your sick. you respect me? talk to the hand
still not getting it, talk to what hand? i'm not trying to fuck with anyone. i was unaware that there were 'millions' of autistic children claiming to be a result of vaccination. all you can say to ignorance is 'look at my son' - i don't even know what that means, just words with no logical basis. your argument seems similar to the analogy that because the earth looks flat it must be so.
Nobody is saying there is a conspiracy of doctors. The problem is the CDC is not willing to admit it's mistake in expanding the vaccination schedule without calculating the cumulative mercury load. Since doctors (and lay people) get their information from the CDC, they don't know it's wrong. You can't help it if you aren't taught properly. But just shrugging off parents is absurd, how can there be so many that are so wrong? This belief they are all irrational is preposterous.
vaccines-cause-autism crowd. There are parents that molest and kill their children and according to the idea that parents are experts because they are the parents of affected children, those types of parents knew how to treat children by sex and murder.
You are incorrect. Have you heard of Hannah Poling? The US government awarded her family compensation for autism brought on by her vaccinations. This is not hearsay. The reason she was affected is due to a mitochondrial disorder which 2/3 of autistic children have. This is something we could test for prior to vaccination.
According to the CDC from 1/1/08 to 7/31/08, 131 cases of measles were reported to the National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases (NCIRD). At least 15 of those patients, including four children younger than 15 months of age, were hospitalized. No deaths have been reported.
The CDC recently upped it's estimation of the prevalence of autism to 1%. One in 100 children in the US have an ASD. Which do you think is more common?
that proven to be components of these vaccines. Also, the one doctor said that he saw 3 deaths of bacterial meningitis. He has had probably thousands of patients over the years. I would like to know how many patients of his have be diagnosed with autism and why his 3 cases (although sad and unfortunate) are somehow more notable than all of the cases of autistic children he probably encounters.
One expert said that getting a vaccine is like getting 1 thousandth the effect of getting the disease. But in reality, would a person ever contract all 36 diseases (even a mild case) within such a short span of time? How can the immune system be expected to develop a correct and efficacious immunity to so many different virus strains within the vaccine. Additionally, how can we expect an infant or child's body to have the ability to effectively excrete the harmful preservatives and additives
This episode of LK is pathetic. Here we have experts in the medical field, yet Larry plays on people's emotions by playing irrelevant, albeit sad, footage of children with autism, attempting to make an implicit link of this disease with vaccination. And how absurd to say, Ms. McCarthy, that you would pick a childhood disease like the measles over autism any day, when the measles, and the like for that matter, have killed many more people than are affected by autism. Truly pathetic.
Damn you're right. As long as the rate of autism among children is less than measles over the years we should forget it and just keep giving kids autism. They are acceptible losses right? YOU are pathetic.
Wow!!! She really gets upset when people that know what they are talking about speak. How dare Larry King allow educated physicians who were not sought out by the bunny speak.
Talk to my mother and parents like her, talk to me, talk to autistics. We would tell you the same thing; vaccines do not cause autism and we are people with emotions, we can speak for ourselves. We don't need some air-headed attention whore like Jenny.
So you would kill your autistic child for your selfish reasons. Pathetic, you don't deserve to be gifted with any child. Grow up because once you're a parent, you have to give up your wild-and-young days behind.
Out of the whole debate Jenny had nothing intelligent to say about the subject. All the scientist were citing research and studies and Jenny just sat there acting like she actually knows anything. This is what pisses me off about celebrities, they don't know shit about science.
And you don't know shit about autism. Not one of these doctors can tell us what causes autism, BUT they are one hundred percent sure it's NOT vaccines. Pathetic.
And you don't know shit about autism and science. we have more evidence to suggest that it have something to do with one genes.Properly conducted studies and population studies show no evidence linking vaccines in any way, and prove that the rate of autism does not go down in unvaccinated populations.
So do you honestly believe autism is caused by one, single, solitary factor? How can 1% of all US children have this gene you are referring to? The causes are numerous and trying to choose one is pointless. Genes, environmental exposures, mitochondrial disorders...these things are all part of it. Have you actually read the studies you are referring to?
it's not a matter of belief, it's a matter of accepting the current science that is available. I should have inserted "might" in my sentence because their is not a scientific consciences on what the cause of autism is. genes can mutate and cause problems in humans, but my entire point was we currently don't know the cause but their studies being conducted; something that Jenny McCarthy doesn't understand.
Exactly. If no one knows the cause, how can so many people swear vaccines are unrelated? Many people, yourself included, are scoffing at the very idea in one breath, then admitting you don't know in the next. The answer is you DON'T know and nobody does. So unless you can absolutely prove to me there is no correlation, you need to stop insulting others. For all you know, it'll turn out that YOU are the one who doesn't know shit about autism and science.
because the evidence that we do have isn't leading towards vaccines. you clearly have no idea what you're talking about and haven't looked at the evidence. So stop talking and let the scientists do their work and stop listening to celebrities who don't know a thing about science.
I have been researching this extensively over the past few months. I have been obtaining the full texts of peer-reviewed studies from a number of online databases and medical journals. I have actually read the entire studies. Can you say the same? I don't listen to celebrities, I don't even watch TV. Your assumptions are not only entirely incorrect, but pointless. Learn the facts before commentating.
Actually, I have read some studies. you think just because you read some studies that you know better then all the scientist that have researched for years? Please, get over yourself! Let the real scientists do their work.
No. I have never claimed to know better. I personally feel that the correlation has not been completely disproven. I think more research is needed. There are many concerns about conflicts of interest in the researchers with many of those studies.
I don't care to convince you. The point is I am entitled to read the available material and form my own opinion. I just wanted to point out your rudeness to others is unnecessary, pointless, and useless. You can't possibly know you are right.
Autism rates do not decrease when you administer vaccines later in life, or in single dosages. There are many reasons for this, and they also address why Jenny McCarthy's proposal to test childrens' immune systems before administering vaccines Is useless. Pathetic.
No one knows what the cause of autism is. Jenny and other "curbies" THINK they know the cause. Her science is "THIS IS EVAN, HE IS CURED...AND THAT'S MY SCIENCE!!!" In other words, it's nothing but emotion and quack treatments.
By eliminating vaccines as a cause of autism, we are one step closer to finding the cause of autism. People like you and Jenny would rather have a dead child than an autistic child anyday, how selfish of you.
The controversy of whether vaccines cause autism has been around for a very long time. It is a failure of the medical establishment, the CDC and the pharmaceutical companies to clearly and convincingly describe to the public exactly how vaccines do not cause autism. The inability, or reluctance, to educate the patient, in this case, the parents, as to precisely how they have nothing to fear with vaccination, is probably the heart of this controversy.
The controversy of whether vaccines cause autism has been around for a very long time. It is a failure of the medical establishment, the CDC and the pharmaceutical companies to clearly and convincingly describe to the public exactly how vaccines do not cause autism. The inability, or reluctance, to educate the patient, in this case, the parents, as to precisely how they have nothing to fear with vaccination, is probably the heart of this controversy.
There are a lot of families that have evidence that there children became autistic immediately after vaccination. The Poling family settled a case out of court that clearly indicated that vaccines have caused autism. But the judge was very careful in explaining that it was only responsible in this particular case. And this is also a clear indication of all of the fears regarding liability in this case. While it may be true that childhood vaccination may save lives, it comes at a cost.
A relatively small percentage of children who are getting vaccinated will become autistic. Exactly why they are becoming autistic is being clouded by those parties who have the most to loose as a result of legal liability. These autistic children are the collateral damage that is the result of vaccination. As cruel as this fact is, it is the reason that the experts, that is, the doctors and the CDC, do not really want to cast any doubt on the safety of the vaccination program.
In their purely scientific reasoning, it would be better to ignore the relationship between vaccinations and autism, than to frighten all the parents in the country who might then not get their children vaccinated. These same experts believe that it is far less worse for the population to suffer a few autistic children than to risk an outbreak of epidemics that they say would cause a huge number of deaths.
But when you are the parent of an autistic child, when you are the one parent in one hundred and fifty that has to raise an autistic child, the collateral damage theory is tough to accept. And there is very little money available for the families of autistic children. Most parents whose children are diagnosed with autism, usually divorce.
Guess again, my mother never saw me as collateral damage or thought that I was kidnapped by autism. She tought me how to socialize. I hate to tell you this, but parents of neurotypical children also divorce many times as well. Financial issues are not the sole problem. My parents divorced before I was born. Not because of money problems, but because my dad happened to be an egocentric prick.
So before you think all of this talk about the relationship between autism and vaccinations is being fabricated so the parents of autistic children have someone to blame, or they are looking for easy money, check out the Poling family. And ask yourself a couple of questions. Such as: Do doctors always tell the truth? And is there such a thing as a medication that doesn't have a side effect?
Fact: There is NO link between MMRs and autism. All recent research has concluded that there's no correlation. In fact, autism rates continue to rise, despite a decrease in MMR vaccinations and the removal of thimerosal in vaccines.
All this nonsense, thanks to a SMALL study in 1998 where Dr. Wakefield "alleged" there was a link. But the study did NOT include any scientific testing to find out if there actually "was" a link!
And now, Measles cases are rising as MMR vaccinations decline.
I would have to disagree. If you could please link to your references? I have yet to find a study that shows vaccines are safe. The Danish study is flawed, a fact acknowledged in the paper itself. It seems that many people reference this study without actually reading it. There also appear to be many conflicts of interest involving the people who make our vaccine policies. You are also only talking about the MMR, not the numerous other shots recommended for children.
The whole myth of a link between vaccination and autism started as a result of flawed study by corrupt MD Andrew Wakefield (watch?v=BYy1kvOYNJI) who was illicitly paid £55,000 by lawyers to conduct a skewed study, and who has subsequently been barred from practising medicine in the UK. McCarthy's dissemination of misinformation has decreased immunization rates and thus increased incidence of measles, a highly contagious and sometimes deadly disease. She should stick to Playboy.
he was railroaded for exposing the truth. Plus Wakefield isn't the only MD sounding the alarm. If you dig deeper you will see that there is a connection between vaccines and a bunch of disorders including autism. Im not saying all vaccines are bad but injecting mercury, aluminum, etc is not good for your health no matter what the FDA, big phrama and TV tell you.
After it was discovered that Andrew Wakefield, had received major funding from British trial lawyers seeking evidence, ten of his Lancet paper's twelve co-authors retracted its interpretation of an association between MMR vaccine and autism. Subsequent epidemiological evidence reviews by the Centres for Disease Control, the Institute of Medicine of the National Academy of Sciences, the UK National Health Service, and Cochrane Library all found no link between the vaccine and autism.
google this> UNICEF Nigerian Polio Vaccine Contaminated with Sterilizing Agents Scientist Finds >ALSO>Under the auspices of the World Health Organization (WHO), UNICEF, and the Philippine Dept. of Health, more than 3.4 million women were recently vaccinated against tetanus. Beta-human chorionic gonadotrophin (hCG) has been discovered in samples of the vaccine, which has the potential of permanently sterilizing the women as well.> there is a long history of these "mistakes", hmm whats going on?
The risk of adverse side effects from vaccines is minuscule. For example, the risk for anaphylaxis from the Hepatitis B Virus vaccination is around 1 in 600,000. This is about the same risk as being struck by lightning. I assume you wouldn't want to go back to the early 20th century when polio epidemics swept the country. For example, 2,500 cases of polio ended up at one Los Angeles hospital between May and November of 1934. And in 1952, the U.S. had 21,000 cases of paralytic polio.
Technically, the Danish study was funded by the CDC (who would look very bad if it came out that vaccines cause harm) and a Danish manufacturer of mercury preservative for vaccines. If that's not a conflict of interest, I don't know what is. You can view the memos and emails between CDC employees trying to find someone who would give them the study they needed online. There are also emails to others who would not provide the CDC with the data they needed.
lol. Desperate? No. You'll have to bear with me as I find the appropriate sources to prove this, I haven't compiled a full list yet. I don't consider clearly biased websites or Wikipedia valid sources but if they are acceptable to you, I can provide them immediately. Sorry for the delay, it takes time wallowing through government websites and the CDC has moved/deleted many relevant links. This is probably best done in private message as I can't link here. Would that be acceptable to you?
I would prefer to keep the discussion completely public, and on this discussion thread. It should be possible to summarise your evidence in 500 characters, Ladygish.
I agree, keeping it public is preferrable. I only suggested private message to allow for links and better readability. You have to admit that 500 character blocks are not the easiest way to do this. If you don't care to actually see the sources yourself, I can summarize them tomorrow. Just personally I like to see proof of the claims people are making and had assumed you are the same.
I'd love to see as much of the evidence as possible, Ladygish. The 500 character count is not all bad, it forces mental discipline, if you can squeeze everything you want to say into 500 characters the quality of the resultant posts tends to rise.
An example of conflict of interest in our vaccine policy making, this is a direct copy/paste from a transcript of the May 15, 2001 House of Representatives meeting:
At the time the Rotashield vaccine was approved and recommended for universal use, the following conditions existed: (1) That members, including the chair, of the FDA and CDC advisory committees who make these decisions own stock in drug companies that make vaccines. (2) That individuals on both advisory committees
own patents for vaccines under consideration or affected by the decisions of the committee. (3) That three out of five of the members of the FDA's advisory committee who voted for the rotavirus vaccine had conflicts of interest that were waived. (4) That seven individuals of the 15 member FDA advisory committee were not present at the meeting, two others were excluded from the vote, and the remaining five were joined by five temporary voting members who all voted to license the product.
(5) That the CDC grants conflict-of-interest waivers to every member of their advisory committee a year at a time, and allows full participation in the discussions leading up to a vote by every member, whether they have a financial stake in the decision or not. (6) That the CDC's advisory committee has no public members--no parents have a vote in whether or not a vaccine belongs on the childhood immunization schedule. the FDA's committee only has one public member.
Were these members of the FDA and CDC breaking any laws by holding these shares in major pharmaceutical companies at this time? How many of these people owned shares in the company that manufactured the Rotashield vaccine? How does any of this prove a link between childhood vaccination and autism, anyway?
According to a 2007 report from the Department of Health and Human Services, the CDC routinely allows conflicts of interest to go UNREPORTED. "For almost all special Government employees, CDC did not ensure that financial disclosure forms were complete in 2007...CDC did not identify or resolve potential conflicts of interest for 64 percent of special Government employees in 2007..CDC did not ensure that 41 percent of special Government employees received required ethics training in 2007."
No, they did not break the law but this is a serious issue because "Committees play an influential role in decision making for the Federal Government. Committee members (i.e., SGEs) are typically involved in work outside the Federal Government in the same areas as their committees work. To protect the committees integrity and credibility, agencies must not permit SGEs with conflicts of interest to inappropriately influence their committees work."
Please reread my post. I begin with "An example of conflict of interest in our vaccine policy making." I am giving an example of the rampant conflicts of interest which exist in our vaccine making policy. Surely you are not implying that these conflicts have NO effect on any element of the decision-making process? This information does not prove a link with autism and I clearly did not say it did. Rather, it shows how those in charge of directing further research are biased.
As I showed in several examples just posted to you, many studies have proven thimerosal to be toxic (both in animals and to human cells) and many suggested that assuming the same toxicity for ethyl- and methyl mercury is incorrect and dangerous. So to round up the different points and bring it to one conclucison, I am awaiting the list of studies you have which prove there is no toxicity to mercury. (I'll try to record this in the future to help you keep track. This response is 4 posts long.)
If the CDC really does routinely allow conflicts of interest to go unreported, doesn't fill in their financial disclosure forms, and really did "not ensure that 41 percent of special Government employees received required ethics training in 2007", how exactly would that prove a link between vaccination and autism, Ladygish?
I know it's hard to keep track of everything in here, you're confusing two lines of conversation. You asked "Were these members of the FDA and CDC breaking any laws by holding these shares in major pharmaceutical companies at this time?" to which I responded that the CDC was under investigation. This is an example of a conflict of interest influencing public policy. In less than a year it had to be withdrawn from the market due to safety issues. Less than a year after these fine men and women
who stood to financially benefit from a vaccine, pushed it onto US children with terrible results. If the CDC allowed this, what makes you so sure their research isn't tainted either? Or is it only a problem some of the time? The Health & Human Services report seems to suggest otherwise. This, ONCE AGAIN, does not prove anything about a link. It is just an observation about the less than ethical standards of the group telling us everything is fine. I'm not explaining this again. Sheesh.(2 posts)
You are launching an ad hominem attack on the FDA, CDC and their members in order to draw attention away from the fact that you can't prove a link between vaccination and autism, Ladygish.
If there is no link, why did the CDC outsource the vaccine safety database to keep it clear of the Freedom of Information Act? It costs millions yearly to hide this data and no scientist outside of the CDC has been allowed to see it. Why is it such a secret if there's nothing to find?
We haven't established that the CDC did outsource the vaccine safety database "to keep it clear of the Freedom of Information Act", Ladygish. Outsourcing usually saves money, which is why it's a common business and governmental practice, how could such an instance of outsourcing possibly cost more than an in-house solution? Your baseless conspiracy assertions aren't doing anything to make the case for a link between vaccination and autism.
Hannah Polling was clearly affected by something, and the timing of it is very suspicious of vaccines. The court felt there was enough evidence to award the family compensation, however all this shows is that children with mitochondrial disorders may be susceptible to vaccine injury. It doesnt prove an overall connection between vaccines and autism. Hopefully the publicity over this case will encourage more research into the causes of autism is causing autism.
example, the gardasil vaccine is being pushed to 11year old girls to 40 year old women and now is in the process of being approved for boys. It only protects you against 4 of a hundred strains and so far has caused 21 deaths and 9749 adverse reactions, including 78 outbreaks of genital warts and 10 miscarriages. the cdc recommends it, will you take the shot or give it to kids?
Gardasil is designed to prevent infection with HPV types 16, 18, 6, and 11. HPV types 16 and 18 currently cause about 70% of cervical cancer cases, and also cause some vulva, vaginal, penile and anal cancers. HPV types 6 and 11 cause about 90% of genital warts cases. 9,749 reports of VAERS out of 16 million doses is 0.06%. It is important to note that a report to VAERS does not mean there is a connection between the vaccine and the event. It means the event took place following vaccination.
we can go back and forth, but I know parents with vaccine injured kids, so I don't need any more proof. Just because the corporate controlled media and the billion dollar pharmaceutical market say vaccines are good, that doesn't mean that all those parents are wrong.
You're getting emotionally bogged down and are not looking at things logically Rogue. Irrespective of what the "corporate controlled media" or the very emotional Jenny McCarthy says, the evidence is clear, the number of people alive today because of vaccination, dwarfs the number of people reporting any sort of adverse reaction. The only study reporting a link between Autism and vaccine was conducted by disgraced, struck off, former MD Andrew Wakefield who was in the pockets of trial lawyers.
During the 20th century, it is estimated that smallpox was responsible for 300500 million deaths, Ladygish. As recently as 1967, the World Health Organization estimated that 15 million people contracted the disease and that two million died in that year. After successful vaccination campaigns throughout the 19th and 20th centuries, the WHO certified the eradication of smallpox in December 1979. To this day, smallpox is the only human infectious disease to have been completely eradicated.
ever since my son had his first vaccinations.the same night he had a seizure and i accused my babysitter for drugging him we need to take a poll on how many people skipped there vaccinations..all we need is statistics to prove these government doctors that there trying to keep our children from figuring out how corrupt our government is ..they want us ignorant..
you really can't tell from the youtube video, but the guy on the far right was sweating bullets. he seemed very nervous and guilty as hell, like he knew he was lying on national tv.
MockingbirdXX, What I see are parents who are too lazy to discipline their children and want to drug them instead, have them diagnosed by me with autism so they can be eligible for all sorts of social services and benefits at the expense of taxpayers and children who actually do have autism. I am not "big drug" anything. Is your child unruly? Must be autism. Has little Johnny never been taught to sit still or behave appropriately in public? Must be autism...
Not everyone with mental retardation is autistic, but, unfortunately if the patient doesn't present with a specific syndrome such as down's, they are tagged "autistic". Hence the overdiagnosis problem. Less than 1 percent of patients in my clinic actually have autism, but every parent is so desparate to hear this diagnosis so they can have something or someone to blame for their problem. I could actually vomit just listening to the whining that goes on. Get over it already.
tinlizzy; Nice bedside manner. You are just a drug company puppet and you don't even know it lol. 'Doctors' are there primarily as pharma pushers and have the cheek to come out with statements like this berk below my comment. You sir, should be struck off along with 95% of your quack colleagues.
tinlizzy is right you imbiscile. All of the sudden a stripper has all the answers. These vaccines save thousands of lives and the only reason for this is a conspiracy of doctors. Nice. I think you might be a little paranoid.
I love it, the only way you can disagree is to be a drug company conspirator.
I like how she started screaming about her dead son then Larry's all "you have a dead kid?" and Jenny goes, oh shit, I'm beautiful and not used to people callnmg me out on my crap....
DaleRobby 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Google: " " Stop the Walgreens flu shot harassment! Employees rewarded with iPads for meeting vaccination recruitment goals?"
Thursday, October 13, 2011~ Mike Adams, The Health Ranger At Natural News Dt Cm~
promiseIsaih60 3 months ago in playlist Jenny McCarthy on Larry King Live, Autism and Vaccines
This has been flagged as spam show
GOOGLE: " Flu Shots Contain More than 250 Times the EPA’s Safety Limit for Mercury"
by
Anthony Gucciardi
promiseIsaih60 3 months ago in playlist Jenny McCarthy on Larry King Live, Autism and Vaccines
This has been flagged as spam show
GOOGLE: " CDC conducting vaccine surveillance operation on American families (see the documents)' by Mike Adams of NaturalNewsdtcm~ & you notice how the ProPharma Shills LOVE to vote up their OWN comments?? ;)
promiseIsaih60 3 months ago in playlist Jenny McCarthy on Larry King Live, Autism and Vaccines
I also noticed that the older pediatrician who is on "Jenny's side" and has a son with autism. There is an association with older parents and autism.
brainbid 2 years ago
It was VERY disturbing to me to hear Jenny tell that one doctor that she would rather her child have one of those preventable (through vaccines) diseases than autism. I had mumps when I was a young child and my relative had mumps also which developed into encephalitis, from which he has sequelae still to this day (no, our parents were not negligent in regard to vaccinating us, but rather this was before the MMR was invented).
brainbid 2 years ago
get serious.
absoftitanium 2 years ago
God bless Jenny McCarthy and others like her
Nanumir 2 years ago
i believe her, i also think that its not only vaccines that are causing autism and other ailements, its the air we breath and the food we eat. i don't understand why people are so harsh on her, like when she said " my child died infront of me" we all know she is metephorically speaking. she is trying to get people to listen and then maybe enough research can be done to either back up or refute the link between vacc. and autism ,but without enough long term research one can never be sure.
hajeh 2 years ago
The most likely cause is a genetic mutation. Research "Fragile X". If she wants to be taken seriously, she should stop the emotional crap and rely on facts. There is a chance that her son never had autism to begin with. However, epiliptic symptoms are present in 20-30% of autistic cases. A lot of parents of autistic children can't stand her due to her poor character.
aspie101 2 years ago
*eyeroll* show of hands...who believes what this bitch just said?
Stephie2007 2 years ago
*eyeroll* sorry, I do and I'm a member of MENSA
Nanumir 2 years ago 2
Wow is she retarted. People have died from getting those diseases she claims she could go without the vaccine for. Her child died in front of her? She had more then one child? thats news to me. i could have sworn she said her kid was doing great. hmmm.... Lets just run with what Jenny says cause she has all those years of medical schoo... oh, wait.... how did she find out about what her kid had and how to fix it? google? yeah... thats what i thought.
darthkimball 2 years ago
You know how you can tell when someone is RETARDED? When they can't even SPELL the fucking WORD! Ya moron.
absoftitanium 2 years ago
wow, thank you spelling nazi. god forbid someone has a fucking spelling error. if you dont have anything constructive to say, then kindly stfu.
darthkimball 2 years ago
I really am sorry that in this world of fast communication, we need a mechanism to quickly determine whose opinion might carry some weight and depth of thought, and whose opinion is just that of a thoughtless, uneducated stooge. The inability to spell common English words is prima facie evidence that the user's education is lacking, and that he/she is a doddering ignoramus. >;^)
absoftitanium 2 years ago
I suppose that attempting to point out that there is a very large difference between the inability to spell, and simply misspelling a word would be lost on you. But as we all know, you really shouldn't judge a book by its cover. You can sit there and assume what you will about me, but without knowledge of my education you just end up sitting there making false assumptions and looking like a complete and utter "RETARD"
darthkimball 2 years ago
Wow, you learned how to spell 'retarded' correctly. Did you look it up in the dictionary? Did you see your picture next to the definition?
I don't have to assume anything. I was just foolin' with you about the spelling, thickwit. The real reason I objected to your earlier post was your calling Jenny McCarthy 'retarted', (sic). I guess that means you think she's stupid, and doesn't know what she's talking about. How much research have you done on the subject? Zero? Exactly.
absoftitanium 2 years ago 2
Your right, I have done absolutely zero research on the mater. But i'm not the one going on national tv telling people what to or not to do based purely off of research done on the web. I'm not the one arguing with professionals claiming them to be wrong and me to be right. She is a complete and utter retard. And anyone who just googles things, and then thinks that they are better then people who spend their whole lives studying these things are retards too.
darthkimball 2 years ago
Here's the thing. Vaccines in the US contain Thimerosal, a compound which is 49.6% mercury by weight. Look it up. Some vaccines in the US contain over 100times the EPA maximum 'safe' limit of mercury, PER DOSE, for a child. Mercury is a neurotoxin. That is, it kills brain cells. It is linked to autism, cardiovascular disease, seizures, MENTAL RETARDATION, hyperactivity, dyslexia and many other conditions. I'm concerned YOU may have received too many vaccinations in your own life already!
absoftitanium 2 years ago
Honestly, if you have not researched the matter yourself (as you have said) then how do you know she is wrong? Are you making assumptions about her intelligence? I want to know how you are so sure Jenny McCarthy has done no research. I suppose the doctors and other parents who agree with her have not done a single, tiny bit of research either?
ladygish 2 years ago
I didnt say she hasnt done any research. She claims she did research on google for christ sakes. Would you go to a doctor that did his medical schooling through google? "Dont worry, i googled how to do this." There are doctors on both sides of this argument. What im saying is that untill they can prove without a shadow of a doubt that these vaccinations are the true cause of autism, then we should contrine to do what has worked. again, try not to defend the retard who is a google expert
darthkimball 2 years ago
I think Jenny meant to say this information is widely available, not that she utilizes Google as her sole source. Even if she got her information this way, there are medical doctors saying the same things. I agree the link isn't proven, but until the link is DISPROVED, beyond a shadow of a doubt, you can't go around calling people idiots for asking questions. Nobody should ever believe something without looking into it themselves.
ladygish 2 years ago
The thing is, Im not trying to disprove anything. She is the one claiming that these vaccinations are the cause of autism. What she has to do is prove that there is a link. Shes the attacker. As the attacker its her job to provide proof. And nothing short of her going to medical school will be enough research. And the medical doctors saying the same thing still have to prove to me that there is in fact a link.
darthkimball 2 years ago
I guess it just confuses me that people seem to think Jenny McCarthy is the only person saying this. If you can't listen to someone because they took naked pictures years ago or because they aren't a doctor, fine. But don't assume they are wrong because of those things. Jenny isn't the best source so ignore her and listen to the guy sitting next to her! Do research!
ladygish 2 years ago
heres the issue, just like oprah, (who has supported her) Jenny has a fanbase that is willing to do anything she says without listening to both sides of the story. Whether she likes it or not, too many people are taking the idea that they shouldnt medicate their kids. Other children have died as a result of one parent not medicating their kids. I'm fine with a figurehead promoting such an idea. But when they do it without giving both sides of a story it becomes a risk. she is retarted.
darthkimball 2 years ago
Wait a minute. Jenny McCarthy has *never* said to not medicate children. Medication treats an illness whereas vaccination (hopefully) prevents it. She says in this interview that she is not against vaccines. She just wants them to be safer and for each child to be individually assesed as a candidate for these vaccines. Not everyone benefits from every vaccine and this is well known. I think you should rewatch the video though, you may have misunderstood her points.
ladygish 2 years ago
Thats the major problem. weither she likes it or not, thats what some people are taking away from her messages. its not just this video where she says shes not against all vaccines that people hear. If this were the only video she had then i would be fine with her. But the problem is she goes on all kinds of shows and isnt exactly clear about her point most of the time, mainly due to her inability to debate. and there no way i could submit my brain to these videos again. i believe torture is bad
darthkimball 2 years ago
Bottom line, she may not speak clearly, but that doesn't mean she is wrong. And never has she said she doesn't believe in medicating children. Attack her for the things she says, not the ones you've made up.
ladygish 2 years ago
You may not be trying to disprove anything, but you seem very sure that Jenny (and presumably all who agree with her) are "retarded" even though you haven't researched the matter at all. Your absolute conviction about a subject you admittedly know nothing about is astonishing.
ladygish 2 years ago
Those who agree with her because she said so are retarded. If they happen to be on the same side as her because they believe what the doctors have said then fine. But if you watch this interview, she attacks the doctors who say she has no proof over and over all but screaming at them. She is retarded and has no idea how to debate
darthkimball 2 years ago
She might not know how to debate or even speak her point clearly, but that does not mean she is wrong. Just as a spelling error does not prove a lack of intelligence. I don't know if you can really fault a person for getting a bit emotional about their children. It was clearly expected that she might do this, hence why a doctor is with her to calmly say the things she can't.
ladygish 2 years ago
Again like i stated, here its fine since both sides can be represented equally, but when she goes on her talk shows and on oprah and her opposition trys to get a word in edgewise she goes off like she always does and no-one stops her. Like i said and will always firmly believe, she is a retard and needs to learn that while granted, there might just be a link, let the medical professionals take care of it and just be a spokesperson for it like other celebrity's doe for their causes.
darthkimball 2 years ago
A spokesperson how? Like Eva Mendes posing nude to speak out against fur? No wait, everybody looks down on Jenny's past photos. Maybe she should play a benefit concert like U2? Ah, she's not a singer. Basically, you just don't like that the woman is outspoken and maybe a little too passionate about the topic. Solution? Change the channel when she comes on or better yet, don't watch TV. But don't confuse her for her basic message.
ladygish 2 years ago
Lead panit was ever present until 1976. Abestos was in every known insulation in the world. gas toxins were exposed to familys coal burning for heat was mass co2 exposure. All of which are toxic. Why is autisum only a real issue untill the late 80s? who knows but our kids have always been exposed to toxic chemicals. But not untill the late 80s were the toxins injected under the skin evading all our immune systems safeguards.
anthonyw713 2 years ago 6
"we know what we know" the parents don't get respect.
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago 3
To say that you can clear Autism is a true testament of her lack of education. When she has a medical degree and has developed a cure, then she can say there is a cure! Isn't it possible that her incompetent FORMER pediatrician miss diagnosed Evan?
ashleygartrell 2 years ago
She claimed that Evan was diagnosed in 5 minutes. This is highly unlikely considering the various tests involved. These include blood and urine tests along with behavior observations and brain scans.
aspie101 2 years ago
Do you think she literally means in five minutes? Isn't this more likely an expression meaning the doctor immediately suspected autism? Do you never use hyperbolic terms in speech? From what I can tell, most people do. They just don't have bored people on websites picking apart their every word.
ladygish 2 years ago
So if a doctor cures my child's pneumonia, I cannot tell people he recovered from pneumonia without having a medical degree? What sort of logic is that? It is possible Evan was misdiagnosed but if your child was diagnosed with any sort of ASD and you thought that was incorrect, would you not seek another opinion? Do you have a medical degree? If not, according to your logic, you should never comment on ANY aspect of health.
ladygish 2 years ago
You notice she asks him if "we are considered acceptable loss." He wont answer the question.
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago 2
Listen to her comment on 1:10-1:17. I guess she never saw what measles or polio does to children. I would vaccinate my children for Hepititus. This is due to the fact that my aunt died of it when she was only 2 years old. I personally believe that she is after publicity. I don't mind David Kirby saying that vaccines might contribute to autism as he is more educated than McCarthy. "Big Pharma" and the anti vaccine crowd have the same goal; autism prevention. (abortion)
aspie101 2 years ago
Hypothetically, if you were a celebrity of some sort and your child recovered from a disease without a known cure, wouldn't you tell the world? Is there nothing in your life now that you wish you could let people know? I don't blame the woman for utilizing her resources for a good cause, most people would do the same. How many other celebrities give to charities and everybody oohs and ahhs over their great deeds, yet this woman says something unpopular and you all leap at her.
ladygish 2 years ago
Jenny McCarthy isn't "using her resources for a good cause", Ladygish. She is a new age nut case ("Indigo Mom" to a "Crystal Child") who is using "her resources" to kill children. The number of vaccine preventable deaths since June 2007, currently stands at 458, how many of them did her misinformation kill? These figures are available at jennymccarthybodycount (dot) com.
alexistarr 2 years ago
Honestly, I laughed out loud when I loaded that website. How absurd can you get? Are you implying that every single unvaccinated child in this country was born to parents who listen to Jenny McCarthy? Are you saying vaccination is 100% effective? Are you unaware of certain religious groups which do not allow medical treatment? I laughed even harder when I looked at that website's "source." This is a prime example of why you need to look into everything yourself. They link to several CDC tables
ladygish 2 years ago
I have to admit that the links describing Jenny McCarthy's wacky "Crystal Child" and "Indigo Mom" beliefs were very amusing, Ladygish. It's amazing that anybody takes that woman seriously, though I hardly think the preventable deaths, and illnesses caused by vaccine denial are funny. It's because vaccination isn't 100% effective that many vulnerable groups depend on herd immunity, which people like McCarthy are threatening. What evidence backs your CDC conspiracy theory?
alexistarr 2 years ago
which tell the number of cases of various diseases as reported by "selected cities." A case of a disease does NOT mean the person died. After looking through the entire page, I finally came across a table of numbers of deaths from "all causes" from select cities. Getting hit by a truck does not equal death by measles. Seriously, click on the death statistic and click one of the listings to see the source. Even more silly, the tables don't count the entire country, only some cities. So even if
ladygish 2 years ago
this site was correct in assuming all of the cases listed had died, they wouldn't even be counting a large percentage of the US and therefore wouldn't be counting all of the deaths. I'm honestly not sure *what* they were counting. Now a CDC table I found about vaccine preventable illnesses AND deaths as reported in the National Center for Health Statistics Mortality Report had no information available on the mortality rates. I will gladly message you a link to this PDF if you would like.
ladygish 2 years ago
The jennymccarthybodycount website shows statistics for VACCINE PREVENTABLE deaths, and VACCINE PREVENTABLE illnesses, Ladygish. How does the fact that people also die from causes which couldn't be prevented by vaccination, or that the tables may not "count the entire country" alter the fact that vaccine denial kills people?
alexistarr 2 years ago
It doesn't alter the fact at all. But I would like to know where they got their figures. It's all well and good to say X number of people died from ___, anyone can make those things off the top of their heads. It doesn't make it true though. Maybe I am reading it wrong, but I don't see where the websites source contains the information they claim it does. I like to work with hard facts, not emotion appeals. I'm not saying there aren't vaccine preventable deaths, I'm saying give me a REAL number.
ladygish 2 years ago
You obviously haven't gone to the Frequently Asked Questions section of the jennymccarthybodycount website, Ladygish. I'm glad you like hard facts, perhaps you could give me some "hard facts" disproving these statistics.
alexistarr 2 years ago
lol. No. That site is not worth my or anyone else's time. I'm sure you'll interpret this response negatively, but it's a silly website. I DID provide you the real data, freaking READ what I type. Let me copy/paste my post from a day ago: "...table I found about vaccine preventable illnesses AND deaths as reported in the National Center for Health Statistics Mortality Report had no information available on the mortality rates. I will gladly message you a link to this PDF if you would like."
ladygish 2 years ago
Now, from my standpoint, I have statistics from the National Center for Health Statistics Mortality Report which is the source the CDC utilizes...or jennymccarthybodycount. Are you serious? I don't care about their FAQ, I went directly to their sources which contained irrelevant tables. I guess I was supposed to be overwhelmed by the impressive CDC tables and wasn't supposed to actually read them. (2 posts)
ladygish 2 years ago
I debate people with a wide variety of wacky beliefs in Youtube, but few have the body count associated with vaccine denial, Ladygish. The jennymccarthybodycount website makes a very important point. You have yet to produce any data which shows a link between vaccination and autism.
alexistarr 2 years ago
This entire argument is like saying all air travel should be halted until a way can be found to make planes crash proof. With any kind of treatment there will always be a small percentage who have unfortunate side effects, the point of the treatment is the greater good. Even the hardest conspiracy theorists have to concede that immunisation has taken away one of the greatest threats to infants. I'd rather my child be autistic and alive than dead from a preventable disease.
locon2k 2 years ago
Who knows, autistics have many unique skills. However, some people are rediculously paranoid and will deny any evidence that is presented against them. I personally believe that Jenny McCarthy is in for herself more than Evan. As I said, look at her remarks at 1:07-1:15. She is an over-prevledged brat who has not seen a real tradgedy. "Evan died in front of me for two minutes." Big deal, I lost a lot of friends due to gang violence and I saw the look on their parents' faces.
aspie101 2 years ago
Then I guess you know how painful the loss of a child is. Just because Jenny McCarthy has money doesn't mean she doesn't experience pain or emotion. How can someone from a middle class family be "over-preveledged[sic]?" If she were poor, your comments would be very different.
ladygish 2 years ago
Measles, mumps and chicken pox can be treated if the parent has that information. Many children have been treated effectively with natural medicine for homeopathy. I would take measels just as Jenny would only because I know what to do.
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago
you would take measles? complications include pneumonia and life long lung disease, blindness, severe permanent brain injury and in 1 in 1000 cases death. there is no cure, treatment is purely symptomatic so if complications occur there is very little you can do. the incidence is still low but as more parents choose not to vaccinate this will surely rise as herd immunity i lost. if you look at the numbers the chance that your child will get measles (and subsequent sequelae)
jonroader89767 2 years ago
if not vaccinated is higher than the chance that they will get autism even if causality had been proved (which it has never been). Measles can be a devastating condition for both child and parent just as autism is, so i don't think it can be dismissed so flippantly. I agree that parents should be given the choice whether their child is immunised or not. But given the current proven scientific data on the risks of either choice i would choose vaccination.
jonroader89767 2 years ago
we need our kids to be tested before vaccines are given but I am sure they will fight tooth and nail because of cost. further more i also pick measles. children die of measles when they are unhealthy all ready. once again test the system.
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago
what do the children need to be tested for? test the system in what way? i agree that worldwide the mortality in less developed countries caused by measles is higher to due other co-morbidities such as HIV infection. however the fact is that 1 in 1000 previously healthy children die or develop permanent brain damage in the USA. this does not take in to account other conditions vaccinated for such as meningitis, diptheria, polio, haemophilus B, hepatitis. if children aren't vaccinated they are
jonroader89767 2 years ago
test the immune system to see what predispositions are there and test to see how string it is before shots are given.
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago
at higher risk of these conditions, which can have a much higher morbidity and mortality rates, would you pick one of these? Policy cannot be influenced by anecdotal evidence and hearsay, a court of law would never prosecute on such grounds so why should the CDC change policy. Once there has been unequivocal, reproducible scientific evidence of causality then policy can be reviewed and changed accordingly.
jonroader89767 2 years ago
"Once there has been unequivocal, reproducible scientific evidence of causality then policy can be reviewed and changed accordingly."
To do this they first have to look at the cases and they wont, they will ignore us to save face for as long as possible. been playing the game for 2 decades
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago 2
i'm not sure what this statement implies. What cases have not been looked at? are you saying that in the 11 years since the initial Wakefield paper in the Lancet (which has been discredited) that the medical community, not only in the US but world wide has not researched the matter? there have been hundreds of case controlled, retrospective cohort and epidemiological studies around the world which have failed to show a statistical link b/w vaccination and autism.
jonroader89767 2 years ago
"you seem to imply that the entire medical profession all over the world is performing a cover up, and thereby putting children at risk to save face" no other countries are taking action. we are not. the uSA
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago 2
also you seem to imply that the entire medical profession all over the world is performing a cover up, and thereby putting children at risk to save face. this is not only a slight on these people as doctors and professionals but as human beings. what tests would you propose? is there one magic test that will tell us the strength of a childs immune system at birth?at 3 months ? at 6 months? will it be PCR analysis, DNA sequencing, immuno based assay? which do you propose?
jonroader89767 2 years ago
they are very intelligent. they know what testing to do. I do believe they want to save face other wise more action and research would have bee done by now. 2 decades is a very long time. sorry my message is off, broke my arm yesterday hard to type
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago 2
'no other countries are taking action. we are not. the uSA' i don't understand?
the parents don't get respect from who?
jonroader89767 2 years ago
i'm not sure i understand your view point, you concede the medical profession are intelligent enough to know which tests to run but are unwilling to accept their results.
jonroader89767 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
look at my son
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago
you seem to suggest that the scientific community not only in America but the whole world is acting together in conspiracy to purposely mislead the public. the basis of scientific research is to prove or disprove the recognised theory. they would be desperate to try and prove a link b/w vaccines and autism and be he 1st ones to do so. sometimes so desperate that they will manipulate results hence Dr Wakefield's paper.
jonroader89767 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
look at my son
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago
what point are you making with this statement
jonroader89767 2 years ago
very simple. it means, look at my son.
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago
still not getting it, why do you want people to look at your son. if it is your belief that vaccination is a direct cause of his autism then i respect that. however this is you opinion and can only be interpreted as anecdotal evidence. this should not influence the whole vaccination program.
jonroader89767 2 years ago
there are millions saying, "look at my son" soon they will have no choice but to really look. its coming. soon. especially when they do a new count. the 1 in 150 is seven years old. so all i can say to ignorance is, "look at my son". sorry i cant give u more to argue about.
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago
Your "Look at my son!!!!" attitude is due to the belief that vaccines caused your child to be autistic.
aspie101 2 years ago
still not getting it, why do you want people to look at your son. if it is your belief that vaccination is a direct cause of his autism then i respect that. however this is you opinion
you enjoy trying to fuck with parents? your sick. you respect me? talk to the hand
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago
still not getting it, talk to what hand? i'm not trying to fuck with anyone. i was unaware that there were 'millions' of autistic children claiming to be a result of vaccination. all you can say to ignorance is 'look at my son' - i don't even know what that means, just words with no logical basis. your argument seems similar to the analogy that because the earth looks flat it must be so.
jonroader89767 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
look at my son
KimberlyMahurin 2 years ago
Nobody is saying there is a conspiracy of doctors. The problem is the CDC is not willing to admit it's mistake in expanding the vaccination schedule without calculating the cumulative mercury load. Since doctors (and lay people) get their information from the CDC, they don't know it's wrong. You can't help it if you aren't taught properly. But just shrugging off parents is absurd, how can there be so many that are so wrong? This belief they are all irrational is preposterous.
ladygish 2 years ago
"you enjoy trying to fuck with parents?"
Arragance. That' the problem with the
vaccines-cause-autism crowd. There are parents that molest and kill their children and according to the idea that parents are experts because they are the parents of affected children, those types of parents knew how to treat children by sex and murder.
aspie101 2 years ago
Shut the fuck up, ass-pee.
absoftitanium 2 years ago
What does this even mean?? Because there are mentally unbalanced parents, no one should be assumed capable of raising children?
ladygish 2 years ago
You are incorrect. Have you heard of Hannah Poling? The US government awarded her family compensation for autism brought on by her vaccinations. This is not hearsay. The reason she was affected is due to a mitochondrial disorder which 2/3 of autistic children have. This is something we could test for prior to vaccination.
ladygish 2 years ago
According to the CDC from 1/1/08 to 7/31/08, 131 cases of measles were reported to the National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases (NCIRD). At least 15 of those patients, including four children younger than 15 months of age, were hospitalized. No deaths have been reported.
The CDC recently upped it's estimation of the prevalence of autism to 1%. One in 100 children in the US have an ASD. Which do you think is more common?
ladygish 2 years ago
that proven to be components of these vaccines. Also, the one doctor said that he saw 3 deaths of bacterial meningitis. He has had probably thousands of patients over the years. I would like to know how many patients of his have be diagnosed with autism and why his 3 cases (although sad and unfortunate) are somehow more notable than all of the cases of autistic children he probably encounters.
butterflybaby1025 2 years ago
One expert said that getting a vaccine is like getting 1 thousandth the effect of getting the disease. But in reality, would a person ever contract all 36 diseases (even a mild case) within such a short span of time? How can the immune system be expected to develop a correct and efficacious immunity to so many different virus strains within the vaccine. Additionally, how can we expect an infant or child's body to have the ability to effectively excrete the harmful preservatives and additives
butterflybaby1025 2 years ago
"Are they independent studies? NOOOOOO"
I hate to say this to you Jenny, but Google does not count as a university where they do real research.
aspie101 3 years ago
Based on your extensive research I assume? Sorry but Wikipedia doesn't count either.
ladygish 2 years ago
This episode of LK is pathetic. Here we have experts in the medical field, yet Larry plays on people's emotions by playing irrelevant, albeit sad, footage of children with autism, attempting to make an implicit link of this disease with vaccination. And how absurd to say, Ms. McCarthy, that you would pick a childhood disease like the measles over autism any day, when the measles, and the like for that matter, have killed many more people than are affected by autism. Truly pathetic.
skeptoid1974 3 years ago
Damn you're right. As long as the rate of autism among children is less than measles over the years we should forget it and just keep giving kids autism. They are acceptible losses right? YOU are pathetic.
cosnowmomma 2 years ago
Wow!!! She really gets upset when people that know what they are talking about speak. How dare Larry King allow educated physicians who were not sought out by the bunny speak.
Southsider75 3 years ago
Listen to her selfish remarks at 1:10-1:15.
I bet that she would rather have a dead child than an autisitic child any day. Hopefully Evan would strangle her stupid ass.
aspie101 3 years ago
Obviously you have never had an autistic child.
cosnowmomma 2 years ago
Talk to my mother and parents like her, talk to me, talk to autistics. We would tell you the same thing; vaccines do not cause autism and we are people with emotions, we can speak for ourselves. We don't need some air-headed attention whore like Jenny.
aspie101 2 years ago
So you would kill your autistic child for your selfish reasons. Pathetic, you don't deserve to be gifted with any child. Grow up because once you're a parent, you have to give up your wild-and-young days behind.
aspie101 2 years ago
How dare he bring in a playmate to speak on a serious issue.
aspie101 3 years ago
Out of the whole debate Jenny had nothing intelligent to say about the subject. All the scientist were citing research and studies and Jenny just sat there acting like she actually knows anything. This is what pisses me off about celebrities, they don't know shit about science.
hiten369 3 years ago 2
And you don't know shit about autism. Not one of these doctors can tell us what causes autism, BUT they are one hundred percent sure it's NOT vaccines. Pathetic.
cosnowmomma 2 years ago
And you don't know shit about autism and science. we have more evidence to suggest that it have something to do with one genes.Properly conducted studies and population studies show no evidence linking vaccines in any way, and prove that the rate of autism does not go down in unvaccinated populations.
hiten369 2 years ago
So do you honestly believe autism is caused by one, single, solitary factor? How can 1% of all US children have this gene you are referring to? The causes are numerous and trying to choose one is pointless. Genes, environmental exposures, mitochondrial disorders...these things are all part of it. Have you actually read the studies you are referring to?
ladygish 2 years ago
it's not a matter of belief, it's a matter of accepting the current science that is available. I should have inserted "might" in my sentence because their is not a scientific consciences on what the cause of autism is. genes can mutate and cause problems in humans, but my entire point was we currently don't know the cause but their studies being conducted; something that Jenny McCarthy doesn't understand.
hiten369 2 years ago
Exactly. If no one knows the cause, how can so many people swear vaccines are unrelated? Many people, yourself included, are scoffing at the very idea in one breath, then admitting you don't know in the next. The answer is you DON'T know and nobody does. So unless you can absolutely prove to me there is no correlation, you need to stop insulting others. For all you know, it'll turn out that YOU are the one who doesn't know shit about autism and science.
ladygish 2 years ago
because the evidence that we do have isn't leading towards vaccines. you clearly have no idea what you're talking about and haven't looked at the evidence. So stop talking and let the scientists do their work and stop listening to celebrities who don't know a thing about science.
hiten369 2 years ago
I have been researching this extensively over the past few months. I have been obtaining the full texts of peer-reviewed studies from a number of online databases and medical journals. I have actually read the entire studies. Can you say the same? I don't listen to celebrities, I don't even watch TV. Your assumptions are not only entirely incorrect, but pointless. Learn the facts before commentating.
ladygish 2 years ago
Actually, I have read some studies. you think just because you read some studies that you know better then all the scientist that have researched for years? Please, get over yourself! Let the real scientists do their work.
hiten369 2 years ago
No. I have never claimed to know better. I personally feel that the correlation has not been completely disproven. I think more research is needed. There are many concerns about conflicts of interest in the researchers with many of those studies.
I don't care to convince you. The point is I am entitled to read the available material and form my own opinion. I just wanted to point out your rudeness to others is unnecessary, pointless, and useless. You can't possibly know you are right.
ladygish 2 years ago
Autism rates do not decrease when you administer vaccines later in life, or in single dosages. There are many reasons for this, and they also address why Jenny McCarthy's proposal to test childrens' immune systems before administering vaccines Is useless. Pathetic.
hiten369 2 years ago
No one knows what the cause of autism is. Jenny and other "curbies" THINK they know the cause. Her science is "THIS IS EVAN, HE IS CURED...AND THAT'S MY SCIENCE!!!" In other words, it's nothing but emotion and quack treatments.
By eliminating vaccines as a cause of autism, we are one step closer to finding the cause of autism. People like you and Jenny would rather have a dead child than an autistic child anyday, how selfish of you.
aspie101 2 years ago
That's because NO ONE knows exactly what causes autism.
aspie101 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
The controversy of whether vaccines cause autism has been around for a very long time. It is a failure of the medical establishment, the CDC and the pharmaceutical companies to clearly and convincingly describe to the public exactly how vaccines do not cause autism. The inability, or reluctance, to educate the patient, in this case, the parents, as to precisely how they have nothing to fear with vaccination, is probably the heart of this controversy.
DavidSaddler1231 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
The controversy of whether vaccines cause autism has been around for a very long time. It is a failure of the medical establishment, the CDC and the pharmaceutical companies to clearly and convincingly describe to the public exactly how vaccines do not cause autism. The inability, or reluctance, to educate the patient, in this case, the parents, as to precisely how they have nothing to fear with vaccination, is probably the heart of this controversy.
DavidSaddler1231 3 years ago
There are a lot of families that have evidence that there children became autistic immediately after vaccination. The Poling family settled a case out of court that clearly indicated that vaccines have caused autism. But the judge was very careful in explaining that it was only responsible in this particular case. And this is also a clear indication of all of the fears regarding liability in this case. While it may be true that childhood vaccination may save lives, it comes at a cost.
DavidSaddler1231 3 years ago
A relatively small percentage of children who are getting vaccinated will become autistic. Exactly why they are becoming autistic is being clouded by those parties who have the most to loose as a result of legal liability. These autistic children are the collateral damage that is the result of vaccination. As cruel as this fact is, it is the reason that the experts, that is, the doctors and the CDC, do not really want to cast any doubt on the safety of the vaccination program.
DavidSaddler1231 3 years ago
In their purely scientific reasoning, it would be better to ignore the relationship between vaccinations and autism, than to frighten all the parents in the country who might then not get their children vaccinated. These same experts believe that it is far less worse for the population to suffer a few autistic children than to risk an outbreak of epidemics that they say would cause a huge number of deaths.
DavidSaddler1231 3 years ago
But when you are the parent of an autistic child, when you are the one parent in one hundred and fifty that has to raise an autistic child, the collateral damage theory is tough to accept. And there is very little money available for the families of autistic children. Most parents whose children are diagnosed with autism, usually divorce.
DavidSaddler1231 3 years ago
Guess again, my mother never saw me as collateral damage or thought that I was kidnapped by autism. She tought me how to socialize. I hate to tell you this, but parents of neurotypical children also divorce many times as well. Financial issues are not the sole problem. My parents divorced before I was born. Not because of money problems, but because my dad happened to be an egocentric prick.
aspie101 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
So before you think all of this talk about the relationship between autism and vaccinations is being fabricated so the parents of autistic children have someone to blame, or they are looking for easy money, check out the Poling family. And ask yourself a couple of questions. Such as: Do doctors always tell the truth? And is there such a thing as a medication that doesn't have a side effect?
DavidSaddler1231 3 years ago
Fact: There is NO link between MMRs and autism. All recent research has concluded that there's no correlation. In fact, autism rates continue to rise, despite a decrease in MMR vaccinations and the removal of thimerosal in vaccines.
All this nonsense, thanks to a SMALL study in 1998 where Dr. Wakefield "alleged" there was a link. But the study did NOT include any scientific testing to find out if there actually "was" a link!
And now, Measles cases are rising as MMR vaccinations decline.
AaronCookdotCom 3 years ago 4
Anyone who has any doubt about vaccines causing autism should google the Simpsonwood transcript.
rogueweapon 3 years ago
I would have to disagree. If you could please link to your references? I have yet to find a study that shows vaccines are safe. The Danish study is flawed, a fact acknowledged in the paper itself. It seems that many people reference this study without actually reading it. There also appear to be many conflicts of interest involving the people who make our vaccine policies. You are also only talking about the MMR, not the numerous other shots recommended for children.
ladygish 2 years ago
The whole myth of a link between vaccination and autism started as a result of flawed study by corrupt MD Andrew Wakefield (watch?v=BYy1kvOYNJI) who was illicitly paid £55,000 by lawyers to conduct a skewed study, and who has subsequently been barred from practising medicine in the UK. McCarthy's dissemination of misinformation has decreased immunization rates and thus increased incidence of measles, a highly contagious and sometimes deadly disease. She should stick to Playboy.
alexistarr 3 years ago 2
he was railroaded for exposing the truth. Plus Wakefield isn't the only MD sounding the alarm. If you dig deeper you will see that there is a connection between vaccines and a bunch of disorders including autism. Im not saying all vaccines are bad but injecting mercury, aluminum, etc is not good for your health no matter what the FDA, big phrama and TV tell you.
rogueweapon 3 years ago
After it was discovered that Andrew Wakefield, had received major funding from British trial lawyers seeking evidence, ten of his Lancet paper's twelve co-authors retracted its interpretation of an association between MMR vaccine and autism. Subsequent epidemiological evidence reviews by the Centres for Disease Control, the Institute of Medicine of the National Academy of Sciences, the UK National Health Service, and Cochrane Library all found no link between the vaccine and autism.
alexistarr 3 years ago
google this> UNICEF Nigerian Polio Vaccine Contaminated with Sterilizing Agents Scientist Finds >ALSO>Under the auspices of the World Health Organization (WHO), UNICEF, and the Philippine Dept. of Health, more than 3.4 million women were recently vaccinated against tetanus. Beta-human chorionic gonadotrophin (hCG) has been discovered in samples of the vaccine, which has the potential of permanently sterilizing the women as well.> there is a long history of these "mistakes", hmm whats going on?
rogueweapon 3 years ago
The risk of adverse side effects from vaccines is minuscule. For example, the risk for anaphylaxis from the Hepatitis B Virus vaccination is around 1 in 600,000. This is about the same risk as being struck by lightning. I assume you wouldn't want to go back to the early 20th century when polio epidemics swept the country. For example, 2,500 cases of polio ended up at one Los Angeles hospital between May and November of 1934. And in 1952, the U.S. had 21,000 cases of paralytic polio.
alexistarr 3 years ago
Technically, the Danish study was funded by the CDC (who would look very bad if it came out that vaccines cause harm) and a Danish manufacturer of mercury preservative for vaccines. If that's not a conflict of interest, I don't know what is. You can view the memos and emails between CDC employees trying to find someone who would give them the study they needed online. There are also emails to others who would not provide the CDC with the data they needed.
ladygish 2 years ago
Do you have any proof of this alleged Danish CDC conspiracy, or are you just getting desperate, Ladygish?
alexistarr 2 years ago
lol. Desperate? No. You'll have to bear with me as I find the appropriate sources to prove this, I haven't compiled a full list yet. I don't consider clearly biased websites or Wikipedia valid sources but if they are acceptable to you, I can provide them immediately. Sorry for the delay, it takes time wallowing through government websites and the CDC has moved/deleted many relevant links. This is probably best done in private message as I can't link here. Would that be acceptable to you?
ladygish 2 years ago
Comment removed
alexistarr 2 years ago
I would prefer to keep the discussion completely public, and on this discussion thread. It should be possible to summarise your evidence in 500 characters, Ladygish.
alexistarr 2 years ago
I agree, keeping it public is preferrable. I only suggested private message to allow for links and better readability. You have to admit that 500 character blocks are not the easiest way to do this. If you don't care to actually see the sources yourself, I can summarize them tomorrow. Just personally I like to see proof of the claims people are making and had assumed you are the same.
ladygish 2 years ago
I'd love to see as much of the evidence as possible, Ladygish. The 500 character count is not all bad, it forces mental discipline, if you can squeeze everything you want to say into 500 characters the quality of the resultant posts tends to rise.
alexistarr 2 years ago
An example of conflict of interest in our vaccine policy making, this is a direct copy/paste from a transcript of the May 15, 2001 House of Representatives meeting:
At the time the Rotashield vaccine was approved and recommended for universal use, the following conditions existed: (1) That members, including the chair, of the FDA and CDC advisory committees who make these decisions own stock in drug companies that make vaccines. (2) That individuals on both advisory committees
ladygish 2 years ago
own patents for vaccines under consideration or affected by the decisions of the committee. (3) That three out of five of the members of the FDA's advisory committee who voted for the rotavirus vaccine had conflicts of interest that were waived. (4) That seven individuals of the 15 member FDA advisory committee were not present at the meeting, two others were excluded from the vote, and the remaining five were joined by five temporary voting members who all voted to license the product.
ladygish 2 years ago
(5) That the CDC grants conflict-of-interest waivers to every member of their advisory committee a year at a time, and allows full participation in the discussions leading up to a vote by every member, whether they have a financial stake in the decision or not. (6) That the CDC's advisory committee has no public members--no parents have a vote in whether or not a vaccine belongs on the childhood immunization schedule. the FDA's committee only has one public member.
ladygish 2 years ago
(I will also provide a link to this if you would like.)
ladygish 2 years ago
Were these members of the FDA and CDC breaking any laws by holding these shares in major pharmaceutical companies at this time? How many of these people owned shares in the company that manufactured the Rotashield vaccine? How does any of this prove a link between childhood vaccination and autism, anyway?
alexistarr 2 years ago
According to a 2007 report from the Department of Health and Human Services, the CDC routinely allows conflicts of interest to go UNREPORTED. "For almost all special Government employees, CDC did not ensure that financial disclosure forms were complete in 2007...CDC did not identify or resolve potential conflicts of interest for 64 percent of special Government employees in 2007..CDC did not ensure that 41 percent of special Government employees received required ethics training in 2007."
ladygish 2 years ago
No, they did not break the law but this is a serious issue because "Committees play an influential role in decision making for the Federal Government. Committee members (i.e., SGEs) are typically involved in work outside the Federal Government in the same areas as their committees work. To protect the committees integrity and credibility, agencies must not permit SGEs with conflicts of interest to inappropriately influence their committees work."
ladygish 2 years ago
Please reread my post. I begin with "An example of conflict of interest in our vaccine policy making." I am giving an example of the rampant conflicts of interest which exist in our vaccine making policy. Surely you are not implying that these conflicts have NO effect on any element of the decision-making process? This information does not prove a link with autism and I clearly did not say it did. Rather, it shows how those in charge of directing further research are biased.
ladygish 2 years ago
As I showed in several examples just posted to you, many studies have proven thimerosal to be toxic (both in animals and to human cells) and many suggested that assuming the same toxicity for ethyl- and methyl mercury is incorrect and dangerous. So to round up the different points and bring it to one conclucison, I am awaiting the list of studies you have which prove there is no toxicity to mercury. (I'll try to record this in the future to help you keep track. This response is 4 posts long.)
ladygish 2 years ago
If the CDC really does routinely allow conflicts of interest to go unreported, doesn't fill in their financial disclosure forms, and really did "not ensure that 41 percent of special Government employees received required ethics training in 2007", how exactly would that prove a link between vaccination and autism, Ladygish?
alexistarr 2 years ago
I know it's hard to keep track of everything in here, you're confusing two lines of conversation. You asked "Were these members of the FDA and CDC breaking any laws by holding these shares in major pharmaceutical companies at this time?" to which I responded that the CDC was under investigation. This is an example of a conflict of interest influencing public policy. In less than a year it had to be withdrawn from the market due to safety issues. Less than a year after these fine men and women
ladygish 2 years ago
who stood to financially benefit from a vaccine, pushed it onto US children with terrible results. If the CDC allowed this, what makes you so sure their research isn't tainted either? Or is it only a problem some of the time? The Health & Human Services report seems to suggest otherwise. This, ONCE AGAIN, does not prove anything about a link. It is just an observation about the less than ethical standards of the group telling us everything is fine. I'm not explaining this again. Sheesh.(2 posts)
ladygish 2 years ago
You are launching an ad hominem attack on the FDA, CDC and their members in order to draw attention away from the fact that you can't prove a link between vaccination and autism, Ladygish.
alexistarr 2 years ago
If there is no link, why did the CDC outsource the vaccine safety database to keep it clear of the Freedom of Information Act? It costs millions yearly to hide this data and no scientist outside of the CDC has been allowed to see it. Why is it such a secret if there's nothing to find?
ladygish 2 years ago
We haven't established that the CDC did outsource the vaccine safety database "to keep it clear of the Freedom of Information Act", Ladygish. Outsourcing usually saves money, which is why it's a common business and governmental practice, how could such an instance of outsourcing possibly cost more than an in-house solution? Your baseless conspiracy assertions aren't doing anything to make the case for a link between vaccination and autism.
alexistarr 2 years ago
google Hannah Poling. the court ruled that the MMR caused her autism.
rogueweapon 3 years ago
Hannah Polling was clearly affected by something, and the timing of it is very suspicious of vaccines. The court felt there was enough evidence to award the family compensation, however all this shows is that children with mitochondrial disorders may be susceptible to vaccine injury. It doesnt prove an overall connection between vaccines and autism. Hopefully the publicity over this case will encourage more research into the causes of autism is causing autism.
alexistarr 3 years ago
example, the gardasil vaccine is being pushed to 11year old girls to 40 year old women and now is in the process of being approved for boys. It only protects you against 4 of a hundred strains and so far has caused 21 deaths and 9749 adverse reactions, including 78 outbreaks of genital warts and 10 miscarriages. the cdc recommends it, will you take the shot or give it to kids?
rogueweapon 3 years ago
Gardasil is designed to prevent infection with HPV types 16, 18, 6, and 11. HPV types 16 and 18 currently cause about 70% of cervical cancer cases, and also cause some vulva, vaginal, penile and anal cancers. HPV types 6 and 11 cause about 90% of genital warts cases. 9,749 reports of VAERS out of 16 million doses is 0.06%. It is important to note that a report to VAERS does not mean there is a connection between the vaccine and the event. It means the event took place following vaccination.
alexistarr 3 years ago
we can go back and forth, but I know parents with vaccine injured kids, so I don't need any more proof. Just because the corporate controlled media and the billion dollar pharmaceutical market say vaccines are good, that doesn't mean that all those parents are wrong.
rogueweapon 3 years ago
You're getting emotionally bogged down and are not looking at things logically Rogue. Irrespective of what the "corporate controlled media" or the very emotional Jenny McCarthy says, the evidence is clear, the number of people alive today because of vaccination, dwarfs the number of people reporting any sort of adverse reaction. The only study reporting a link between Autism and vaccine was conducted by disgraced, struck off, former MD Andrew Wakefield who was in the pockets of trial lawyers.
alexistarr 3 years ago
Wrong. If you care, I can provide sources.
ladygish 2 years ago
During the 20th century, it is estimated that smallpox was responsible for 300500 million deaths, Ladygish. As recently as 1967, the World Health Organization estimated that 15 million people contracted the disease and that two million died in that year. After successful vaccination campaigns throughout the 19th and 20th centuries, the WHO certified the eradication of smallpox in December 1979. To this day, smallpox is the only human infectious disease to have been completely eradicated.
alexistarr 2 years ago
That should read "300 to 500 million deaths".
alexistarr 2 years ago
ever since my son had his first vaccinations.the same night he had a seizure and i accused my babysitter for drugging him we need to take a poll on how many people skipped there vaccinations..all we need is statistics to prove these government doctors that there trying to keep our children from figuring out how corrupt our government is ..they want us ignorant..
jmysliwy 3 years ago
I agree with her point of view, however I think she handles herself in the wrong manner. She debates like a child.
LaurenPockets 3 years ago 2
you really can't tell from the youtube video, but the guy on the far right was sweating bullets. he seemed very nervous and guilty as hell, like he knew he was lying on national tv.
agzer0 3 years ago
Dr. McCarthy is an idiot.
dtpark1213 3 years ago
MockingbirdXX, What I see are parents who are too lazy to discipline their children and want to drug them instead, have them diagnosed by me with autism so they can be eligible for all sorts of social services and benefits at the expense of taxpayers and children who actually do have autism. I am not "big drug" anything. Is your child unruly? Must be autism. Has little Johnny never been taught to sit still or behave appropriately in public? Must be autism...
TinLizzy1959 3 years ago
Not everyone with mental retardation is autistic, but, unfortunately if the patient doesn't present with a specific syndrome such as down's, they are tagged "autistic". Hence the overdiagnosis problem. Less than 1 percent of patients in my clinic actually have autism, but every parent is so desparate to hear this diagnosis so they can have something or someone to blame for their problem. I could actually vomit just listening to the whining that goes on. Get over it already.
TinLizzy1959 3 years ago
tinlizzy; Nice bedside manner. You are just a drug company puppet and you don't even know it lol. 'Doctors' are there primarily as pharma pushers and have the cheek to come out with statements like this berk below my comment. You sir, should be struck off along with 95% of your quack colleagues.
mockingbirdxxx 3 years ago 2
tinlizzy is right you imbiscile. All of the sudden a stripper has all the answers. These vaccines save thousands of lives and the only reason for this is a conspiracy of doctors. Nice. I think you might be a little paranoid.
I love it, the only way you can disagree is to be a drug company conspirator.
You probbaly think 9/11 was an inside job too.
mulax01 3 years ago