The Silmarillion Ch10 Pt 1: Of the Darkening of Valinor

[rgaleny]

Is Ungoliant a Maya of Melkor's Evil Nature? Of Lesser tan that?

[Bellamuhs]

@rgaleny No, Ungoliath is an evil creature, indepent of Melkor...

[rgaleny]

@Bellamuhs If Melkor created a hierarchy of being's out of the Dissonant and discordant nature of his music, I guess I mean how does she rank in mirroring the hierarchy of the beings of the true music of the Valor. Yes, I agree, she is independent. But, as the Aniure be come the Valar, and have associated spirits in the Maya, I wondered if it was a worthwhile distinction because she is capable of over coming Melkor as he becomes diminished, Yet he is saved by his Balrogs. Oh well.

[rgaleny]

Respond to this video... When Ungolianth kills the two trees, it is then I IMAGINE that Melkor is diminished because she is sucking up "the life forces" and may very well had the power to take from him in the frenzy. Yet, even for the Valar there are things they can accomplish only once, and in this idea Melkor may simply be diminished because he squandered his powers. What do you think?

[Filby]

@rgaleny I believe Melkor was diminished because he invested his power into his realm in Middle-earth (and really, into Middle-earth itself) in the same way that Sauron poured his power into the One Ring. Tolkien once said that Arda itself was like unto Morgoth's Ring.

[rgaleny]

@Filby Thanks!

[Silencer2869]

hmmm the spider... is it the same as we see in Lord of the Rings?

[tolkenfan]

No Shelob (the spider from the Lord of the Rings) is a decedent of Ungoliant

[thedarknesscallingme]

@Silencer2869

this may be a very late reply but just in case you were wondering the spider known as Shelob is the last child of ungoliant. the spiderlings were hunted and most fled into Mirkwood and other places but Shelob headed east desperate to find dark shelter and so made her home in the mountains of mordor.