ATI Hardware Physics Demo

[haxfactory]

I got my 4830 for $60 and I got an 8800 GT SLI setup for about $80. The sad thing is they will still max most games out at 1080p. Hell, a single 8800 GT played Crysis all settings highest at 1080p with no AA. In SLI, it easily maxes it out.

[haxfactory]

Then you have to remember some games scale better to ATI and some scale better to nVidia. So the difference is somewhat irrelevant.

I should mention that the GTX 260 is quite a bit more powerful than a GTS 250 (which like i said is a rebranded 9800 GTX+) though. The additional core unlocked revisions were even more powerful. If you overclocked (which does go better on nVidia to core and shaders not being linked) it could have been even more power and 4870s could overclock well.

[MrRenar11]

well i have ati radeon x700 (bad)

[d3tach3d]

and this was over 4 years ago......when are fucking games going to really use this shit.

[d34d10ck]

@d3tach3d

Never. This was non interactive physics, which is totally outdated nowadays.

[brandonhughes7]

i have a ATI Radon 4000 Series is that a good one to be using with games. Because i used to have a ATI Radon 200 series and the game burned t out.

[FRURMELLL]

Where can I download that demo?

[MrKillswitch88]

I got my x1900xt and still waiting -.-

NVM got gtx460 @860mhz core with shader linked at stock volts.

[plandercozeron]

nvidia suck cocks O_o

[grineti5]

I have an ATi Radeon HD 5650 and it's awesome :D

[snelpiller]

where can I download this and run on my comp?

[TerracideDK]

@snelpiller

You can't...ATI/AMD is all talk and no show when it comes to hardware physics.

Hell, even today PhysX could run on AMD GPU's...if AMD gave a ratt's ass...

[meishongzai]

@TerracideDK CPU also can run physics...

[TerracideDK]

@meishongzai

Only by a MUCH lower factor than a GPU...read up.

[snelpiller]

I want to try this software :(

[d34d10ck]

All you guys who are impressed by this demo know, that this is a non interactive physics simulation from the old days, don't you? It's pure eye candy and can not used for gameplay, since it runs on free vertex shaders and can't send any information about the simulation to the CPU.

That's why the game engine doesn't know if the player got hit by an object for example.

[Angarsk1991]

IM SICK OF DEMOS. PUT IT IN GAMES!!!!

[TheInfiniteNexus]

@Angarsk1991 seriously



[Angarsk1991]

@TheInfiniteNexus  Hell ya. ATi can make bank and make costumers happy for one time.

[RatRaper]

nice demo... Definately more exiting than those integrated in ati-programs today.

[guily6669]

I also prefer ATI. But hey it's sad both nvidia and ati always show lot's of those demonstrations to say wooo "we'r the best buy us". Then most likely we simply use the main game physics and not really the physics made by either ati or nvidia...

There's only a few games which we use nvidia cuba and physicx, but not as main physics of the game, it's just added effects to the game...

[captaincough]

I went to the store the other day. A large named brand box store. And They had a 8800GTX 399.99 beside a HD5870 399.99 unbelievable no believe it its true

[shearerforgold]

1.28 million? fuck off

[prcko101]

shut up nv idiot fan

[MMadsen]

Yes, that's right. But not untill 2007 (which was a year after)..

[szitmadafaka]

Yes its work on ati but the cpu calculate the physics not the gpu so its have to be very powerfull.

[TonkatrainHONKHONK]

Your an idiot.

One person claimed that they had. As of now there is no way known of hacking the physx api to work on a amd/ati card. You can however use hacked drivers to make an nvidia card do physx with an ati card present.

[Cirvjakaac1]

Mosh pit xD

[steriftv]

XD hell yeah

[xan1242]

Thats Havok physics!

[loppeglia]

have you physx on ati?

double n00b?!

[ronnysoeberg]

better in terms of speed is normally true for nvidia. however, most nvidia cards are pretty much OC'ed from the factory and run hot as all hell.

ATI have gone for a more intelligent solution in their cards, that being actually designing new stuff instead of just slapping a bigger fan on something and pushing the mhz.

After having nvidia cards breaking down on me quite a few times i'm now always buying ati. I'm sure ati users have had their cards going bad as well, but so far i'm good :)

[loppeglia]

Nvidia Physx is better

[Feder147]

ati has more shaders for a reason (physx support)

[lootehcris]

ati dosnt support physx rofl!!!!!! wow how dumb are you

physx is nvidias tech..............

physics can be made by anyone which is what ati have done, or havok

[Feder147]

i didnt mean physx i ment physics support, its a reason ati has more stream processors than nvidia. Nvidia doesnt need as much stream processors because it has physx support integrated and ati doesnt. Ati uses more shader power because of physics in the games not physx.

[Necry3d]

physx is pure bullcrap , ati got a much better physic inwork that mac done, that mac promise outpwns physx with just simple code

[TonkatrainHONKHONK]

ati does not have a physics engine in the works. There was havok FX but it was canceled.

[moutapt]

is this demo downloadable anywere?

[oc5nsli341nforce4]

I would love to do that on my x1900xt right now. :(

[Feder147]

thats a nice card, still can max out most games out even batman. I had that before my 4890 but had to change cuz of win 7. Get a 5870 when u can:D

[oc5nsli341nforce4]

OH I will once I can get a job then it will be added to my collection. :)

[BlaBlaBlaZ2]

@afterburn13

well I have a stupid weak nvidia ge4 mx440 se and it sucks! and If I need a new graphics card I must change everything on my pc to make the graphics card to workX( I hate nvidia's se4 graphics card. I'd rather pick Ati.

[unokilo321]

man wtf you talking about rich spoiled person? I work part time and scrape by after paying bills, but dude unless your a kid with no job then there is no reason anyone can't have a good pc, I saved up for almost a year and I just bought my computer in march, I now have a phenom a gtx 260, and a 22in monitor, my old pc was a amd 4000+ and a ati x1300 with 2gb ram on a 17in crt. save your money yo or buy one part at a time.

[5thhorsman]

I have gtx260 im happy with it but I wanted the ATI card just that I got a good deal on a nvida chipset Mother board and went with nvida card as well ,

[pokerface3699]

it depends on the card, not the company

[Konfleik]

but high end cards are fuckin expensives

[toxic996]

funnay :D

[WalterSolano]

wow

[therevengeofsaladboy]

It's a shame Havok FX got the plug pulled.

[cyther39]

nvidia cards are always over prized for its performance!.. ati is better hd4870 is way more powerfull than gtx260 yet gtx260 is much more expensive...

[Pawecio10]

gtx 295 is better than

[tkpenalty]

I'd love to have what you're smoking because a HD4870 isn't as fast as a GTX260.

[emax27]

tkpenalty, that's gotta do a lot with the game's code optimization... and because most game devs are in nvidia's TWIMTBP, normally their games will be optimized for them.

[emax27]

One good example of code optimization was Hitman Blood Money ver 1.00... when IO interactive developed it using GF6600 series, their optimized code run so well on them... the downside was that GF7 and GF8 was running like crap... literally. In a day of the launch date, IOI provided a patch that removed the 6600 optimization thus the game was running better for the rest of the cards but a bit slower on the 6600.

[emax27]

Now imagine that devs pre-optimize game code but you lack the proper driver to make it work... nv gets out a BigBang driver and suddenly you see a big improvement over the competition.

If code would've been optimized also for ATI, things would've been the other way around.

[mkri96]

@cyther39 A 4870 doesnt stand a chance upon a 260 gtx lol. If you knew right, you would know that the 260 gtx "equal" card is a 5770, and a 4870 isnt better than a 5770

[ViennaMoose]

@mkri96 A 4870 and 5770 are pretty much the same speeds, just different architecture.

[greyfoxzero]

@mkri96 A 4870 1gb will compete with a gtx 260, depends on the game. Plenty of benchmarks out there that show the perform pretty close to each other. Some games even favor it and that goes for the 5770, some titles show the 4870 being faster than the 5770 while others show it worse. All 3 cards perform very close for most games.

[point6000x]

@cyther39 same 2 years later. 6990 = better than 590, CF 6970 even moar better then 6990 even if its nearly the same.

[minotauros91]

@cyther39 That's because you pay for quality. A nvidia card will last you *LONGER* and nvidia card's go !GREAT! paired with a intel processor so your card wont need a GPU. There fore a gtx260 with a core i7 extreme and your pc is *guaranteed* to last you a very long time, depending on how you take care of your pc.

[haxfactory]

@cyther39 The 4870 was not more powerful than the GTX 260. A 4870 was about as powerful as a 9800 GTX+ (aka the GTS 250). ATI boasted some huge raw GFLOP numbers that didn't show up in game performance. A 4830 in real life performance is about as good as an 8800/9800 GT. I should know, I have them. 4830 and 4850 aren't too different in performance a decent overclock and the 4830 can out perform it. the 4850 and 4870 aren't a very big gap either. The 4830 can't quite match the 4870 overclocked.

[Stephenlee5]

I got a Radeon X1600. Works nicely with ATITool to up the speed for some gaming.

[piroman665]

lol it's havock i saw full video

[noobschoolbus37]

ati sucks and know 1 cares about all your shitty pc specs

[ArcticSheep]

ati rules you stupid loser

[ArcticSheep]

holyyy shiit your stupid. right now ati is DOMINATING!!! in bang for buck. you get the same performance from a 200$ ati as you do with 400$ nvidia

if you like sucking nvidias dick i have no problem but dont go around boasting about it everywhere

[cyther39]

i'm a ati fan boy too.. lols

"sucking nvidia's dick" lol!!!!

[Echoix]

Talk to the new beast HD4870X2. There is no nvidia card that can go on par with it. so shut your mouth.

Flame away.

[Iwillkillyou35]

You just wait nvidia always, and I mean ALWAYS has a trick up their sleeve. We will see something that will blow everything else away soon. A new "8800gtx" will come out and dominate. (I am referencing the 8800's dominance for years, not indicating an 8800 refresh.)

[cyther39]

8800 is a crap and f%$# expensive!! the ATI HD 4870 will blow it away!!!

[Iwillkillyou35]

Well duh. The 8800gtx is old now (but still great)

If you knew how to read you would have noticed that I put the "8800gtx" in quotations and then went further to explain that I was not talking about the 8800gtx being the best card out now. I was talking about the position it filled for the past few years when it was the best. There are many cards which are better now.

[sergi5122]

noobschoolbus, your nickname matches you. you dont know SHIT about PCs and how they work.

save the world. kill your self.

[noobschoolbus37]

dude fuck off im sorry im not a fucking super goddamn NERD so you do the world a favor and kill your self asshole

[sergi5122]

why post shit about something you dont know? you just proved that you are dumbfuck. twice.

[Kaeles]

lawl, "know 1 cares" come on, learn how to spell man.

Anyhow, the new hd 4870 cards blow the nvidia cards out of the water, even in super computing applications. With 800 Stream Processors, you can do some amazingly parallel stuff. Not saying that nvidia isn't good, cause the cuda interface is alot nicer than stream as far as I can tell.

[DCW09]

Hmmm ATI or Nvidia, I personally have been a AMD/ATI fan for a long time, But i do have to go out and say that ATI does have Driver issues with some games. Were as Nvidia from what i can tell dose not. more over i guess it all comes down to who you are IE: Bang for the buck = ATI/AMD or 'Potentially' Future Resistant Nvidia/Intel (even though Nvidia and Intel are not merged company's its just a comparison)

[chootastic]

I have to say, that whilst i agree with youo, i think it's the fault of the software developers, rather than ATI. I've watched programming in games get sloppier and sloppier

[sonofhendrix]

When will this be available?? the end of feburary......... Does anyone remember duke nukem forever?

[pasdo345]

ur mom sucks

[SprayedToTheBone]

I have this engine i download it from their site.

Cool stuff realy.

[masterchief3k]

Ati has way more stream procs than any nvidia card, if ati and crytek teamed up, crysis would be much smoother.

[erictech603]

Nope the difference is clock speed. ATI does have more stream processors, but nvidia's are much, much faster. For example, a an ATI card may have 300 stream processors, but they all have to run at the same speed as the main GPU (say 750mhz) Whereas Nvidia's card may only have 128, but they all run at 1800mhz. 128x1800=230,400, and 300x750=225,000. The difference isn't HUGE, but Nvidia is faster because of the unlinked shaders. 8800gt is faster than 3870, GTX 260/280(both) is faster than 4870 etc

[djlobb]

actually, considering the price difference thats a poor comparison! lol, the 4870 only scored slightly under the 260 in Crysis (made for nvidia) and wasn't far off from the 280, now consider this, for under the price of 1 280GTX card, you can buy 2 4870s and crossfire them, I'm actually holding off and I'm gonna pair 2 4870 X2 cards, my goal is to thrash Crysis! lol (BTW, I currently own a 9800GTX)

[erictech603]

I was talking performance. As far as prices go, ATI win, while nvidia jacks their prices way up. Basically you choose between not spending an arm and a leg, or getting over-kill performance. I was saying statistics, personally I am kind of an ATI/INTEL guy because crossfire scales better and works on tons of intel mobo's and intel's procs hands down spank AMD.

[djlobb]

thats ok, because up until 2006 AMD was spanking Intel for atleast 3 years.

but during this process people still bout P4's lol, so theres no reason people can't buy cheap AMD x2 chips nowadays. P.S I've always been an nVidia fan, but I'm gonna jump to ATi with these new cards. Crossfire actually works much better on the new AMD/ATi 7 series chipsets, especially the R790 which has currently the fastest intergrated graphics on any motherboard, and it uses that GPU to assist in processing.

[cyther39]

FU&%ing LIE!!!

[cyther39]

hd 4870 beats gtx 260!! even gtx 280 in some cases! still hd 4870 is cheaper than the two..

[AcETeA12]

That looks like in PlayStation 3 preview.

[Reapper93]

your mom is and ati in a noobox

[darkshiv]

Do you need 2 PCI-E slots for sli or crossfire?

[JerezJulio]

So AnnoyedDragon it seems in the end you lose. Nvidia will probably prove to you sooner rather than later, that GPUs are in fact General vector processor suitable for any kind calculation let it be physic, graphics or otherwise. Hey Dragon what are you going to do now? Are you going to ask for you money back?

[djlobb]

your really lame dude, your precous company "nVidia" has actually announced onboard support for Ageia PhysX software so HAH, lol, putting down someone just because they chose to buy a seperate card to do a certain part.

[ArcticSheep]

people laughed about the gpu when it came out but look at it now.

[vmelkon]

How does this thing work? Render to texture? What API did they use?

[AnnoyedDragon]

Ironic that despite Nvidia and ATI fighting each other for dedicated hardware physics; receiving much fan support and doing lots of promotion, Ageia who was looked down on by both crowds ended up winning as the hardware physics market leader.

Now I am sure there will be those here that disagree, while waiting for that to happen I think I'll play a few PhysX enabled UT3 maps and then after maybe blow up some environments in Warmonger.

Cheerio :)

[JerezJulio]

Let us not forget that the kind of physics based on pseudo laws that can be done in PPU can also be done with GPU many times over faster and better, Since GPUs like g8800 are far superior math vector processors and are accessible to any developer.

Take a look at the game Crysis.

Are you are Ageia employee or representative that you seem to go in a PR campaign for them.

[AnnoyedDragon]

Aren't you that software physics developer on the other video? Either way I didn't announce Ageia winning just on personal belief.

Havok FX is dead, Intel killed its progress when they bought Havok leaving both Nvidia and ATI without a GPU physics API. GPGPU hardware implementation is still years away from finalisation and every developer says coding on the GPU is a bitch.

Nvidia has gone quiet; ATI announced putting it aside for now, Agiea is the only one left in the hardware physics game.

[AnnoyedDragon]

Besides, as a dev yourself shouldn't you know GPU physics is only visual effects because of the hardware limitations of GPU architecture? It doesn't matter how many objects they can simulate if they have no impact on the game play.

I'm not too worried about Crysis either since its physics aren't that advanced, strip away the visual effects and they really aren't that special.

[JerezJulio]

You are too absolve in your promotiong of PPU physics, that you are saying things that are simple wrong.

With the new SDK to program the newer GPUs like g8800 with CUDA, GPU physics is not longer for visual effect.

I am a CUDA register developer and for way I can see the G8800 is a better vector processor than the Cell. I do not know about the PPU arch but it has been said that it is like the PS3 Cell so there you go.

[AnnoyedDragon]

Yet every GPU physics based demonstration has been a visual effect, both Nvidia and ATI when pushing GPU physics only dealt with effects. If they marketed it for affect physics they would have blown the PPU out of the market, so why didn't they?

If it could impact game play we would have seen it already and we wouldn't be having this conversation right now. Besides juggling physics/graphics on the GPU causes all sorts of issues not directly related to the function itself...

[AnnoyedDragon]

By this I am referring to available resources for physics in line with ever GPU hungry games to keep up with the demand for better visuals, portability with console systems to suit modern cross platform development needs and the suitability of the required performance in mainstream markets.

It is a bad idea to target high end and highly expensive hardware for such a thing.

[krononomikon]

simply put:

GPUs are optimised for their main job, while the PPU is optimised for its own job... if one were to start to try to be more compatible with the other's job, it would lose part of that factor that leads to its optimisation efficiency

in conclusion, you're best off with both, not with either/or...

[xMaStRmAtTx]

yes but you can also get a ageia physics card to go with your ati or nvidia card kinda like running sli or crossfire where you put the gfx card in and you put the physx card in an available pci-e port.

[martyG1991]

i love phyisics but probley wont even get a new card i cant really be bothered to pay all that money i will wait awhile first.

[henry7696]

god these new physics 'games' look so shit. even as a demo, i wouldnt want any new game to look like this! with shit flying about everywhere. just unecessary selling points for games that wont even support this.

[ubentu]

, no it's innovative, you need tech like this to do dynamic dirt clumps in games that have ground/object dampening

[henry7696]

what games are these? the best games coming out wont support this, can be as innovative as it wants, developers are still stearing clear

[avgdvl]

dear god, I hope you're joking, otherwise there is no hope for you.

[henry7696]

oh yeah sorry, hellgate london, which dropped it anyway. such a piece of crap, crysis, cod4, gears of war, the orange box? nope, none of them support it, this technology is dead in the water, just like ageias physx.

[ArcticSheep]

i can't beleive we still have people like you in this world..

[faro0485]

Did he say he was using three cards??? Hmmm is it possible to have sli/crossfire with three or more cards? I believe you can have it down with them workstations, how about pcs?

[oscarstegland]

With Crossfire you can have 3...2 for graphics and one for physics.

[mon0293]

Ah, I see. Thanks

[arranmc182]

still its better to buy a true Physics card wil a PPU not a GPU trying to be a PPU so i [proper Physics card will kick the ass of any graphics crad running as a Physics card

[venist]

ppus suck at the moment why get one? its a waste of money all together.

[oscarstegland]

Have you tried it so you know that that's true. The only PPU on the market is Ageia Physx which has support for about 3 games. This is a GPU with modified drivers so it works on games that have already been released as it works as an override in the catalyst driver to make it focus on physics.

[Mistloch]

i change my nvidia card....because ati had better physics

[MrMako1]

ATI vs. Nvidia? AMD vs Intel. Being a fanboy is a very bad thing as a consumer. Buy which ever one is the best for the price at the time and that'll keep prices down and innovation up. Want proof? We wouldn't even be hearing about GPU physics acceleration if Ageia hadn't come in and try to create a new PPU market. Competition is a good thing.

[w1p30ut3r]

acceleration... and ati don't cry when we put fsaa and HDR... the nvidia and ati tecnology are almost identical... we can run ati demos on nvidia cards for example... so... I will wait and go ATI one more time with dx10... maybe later... nvidia... this is like AMD vs Intel... today, AMD is better even with worst memory and less L2 memory... incredible, but it is true :)

And for who likes nvidia because don't likes canadians... sorry... but racism today its not the way!

[ubentu]

huh? nvidia is santa clara based right?

[cyther39]

is AMD nd ATI a canadian company?

[l0lum4d]

ati started in canada, but amd did not

[w1p30ut3r]

ati card with dx10 becaude microsoft and ati are working toogueter with this tecnology... and the ati starts first than nvidia to produce the physics

[w1p30ut3r]

well... i'm a nvidia AND ati fan... and today I agree that ati is better than nvidia... I know because the benchs don't lie, and the image quality tests even... I have a nvidia card... but my next aquisition will be a

[rampagexxx]

Not even close to blowing Nvidias sorry ass goodbye.

Geforce8 has its own dedicated physics processor that will blow this away.

[iwanthalo3]

it hasn't, look at nvivia's website

[cyther39]

no! it has no dedicated proc! it uses it's shaders for the physics...

[cyther39]

loser! go live with ur expensive stupid barbeque cooking grilled geforce 8800!!

4870 is d'best!!!

[Iwillkillyou35]

ok, first of all my 8800gtx runs under 60C on full load, second of all it is not sold anymore. So stop saying it is expensive. (I know used ones are sold) The used ones are still a good deal. The 8800gtx still has tons of life left in it it. Crysis is just unoptimized.

[necktwister]

this surely kicks nvidea's sorry ass goodbye!

[IronJackalTw]

it's just a DEMO not side-by-side real world test of actual performance on the graphic card...

[NintendoKain]

This could lead to kick ass magical tornado spells in games!

[nanahara72]

WOW