HK could make basically print money if they offered semi-auto versions of the G36 to civilians. Thing is, they're almost ashamed they make guns and they must hate money. For 3k I'd convert an SL8 but since it'd cost about 5k total...it's hard to think it's really worth it.
@AZRanger that doesn't even make sense. so are you pro h&k? because every normal person should be they make accurate dependable firearms that are second to none.
I can tell by your lack of proper punctuation, that your intelligence level is slightly impaired. One would need to look no further than an article called: "HK. Because you suck and we hate you" to understand. Try Googling it sometime, schmuck.
The steel HK weapons are nothing more than overpriced stamped garbage. The plastic rifles melt. On top of this, they sneer at the U.S. civilian gun owner.
Retarded fanboiis such as yourself are part of the problem.
@AZRanger aren't you cool thinking your smart correcting my punctuation. explain to me then, why does h&k supply a huge majority of the worlds military's? why does the united states government use mk23's, mp5's, gmg's, and g36's? along with allot of pmc's around the world, are you saying you know more about their weapon systems than the us gov? lmao
Both the XM8 and the HK G36 were both rejected by the US Govt.
Currently FN...NOT HK makes the main battle Rifle for US Forces
Currently FN...NOT HK makes both the LMG and GPMG for US Forces
Currently Colt..NOT HK makes the Carbine
HK copies CETME for the G3
HK copies Stoner for the HK416
HK copied FN for its MG43
You're absolutely right though, HK does so much for the US. govt. Never mind the fact that they disdain US civilian gun owners. Cuz you suck and HK hates you!
@AZRanger ohh okay to start off cetme bought the rights to build the design of the g3, they didn't make it. second, the 416 is just a gas operated m4. stoner wasn't the one that came up with that. and third, the mg43 is just a modified mg42. if anyone is copying anyone it would be fn because GERMANY had the gun designs first! and fourth, I COULD GIVE A FUCK ABOUT WHAT HK THINKS. they make good guns. PERIOD. if you wanted them to like you then move to Germany or be german you fuck!
Hk416 is more a Stoner design than an HK design. 416 piston is based on the the G36. G36 piston is based on Stoner's AR-16. 416's upper can drop on an AR lower. Piston driven Rifle? Stoner was first
MG42 is a Vorgrimler designed roller-locked weapon. MG43 is conventional gas operated weapon. HK got the design from FN.
Finally, how do you know HK makes good guns? Do you own one? How about proof?
@AZRanger And Vorgrimmler was a former mauser Engineer. The complete team around Vorgrimmler were german engineers. The CETME is a german invention, based on the StG45. They just moved to spain, because germany was not allowed to develope small arms at this time. MG43? What is that? There is NO weapon that is named this way. I rather think, that you are talking about the MG4 and it's internals are way different from the FN Minimi. So you think HK makes bad guns? How about proof?
CETME was created by Germans in Spain. My point was was CETME was first. MG-43 is HK's designation. MG4 is the German Govt. designation.
HK guns are overrated. HK is horrible to American civilian gun owners. Their USP pistols are almost as good as Glock for twice the price. The G36 sucks (XM8 did too). HK is overrated, overpriced, but does excellent marketing.
I owned an HK G36 derivative. My proof is based on my ownership of those guns. Can you say the same?
@AZRanger Who cares about american gun owners? You think they special? HK does not treat them different, than they treat british, australian, german and swiss gun owners. The G36 sucks? Thats a joke, isn't it? I do not own one, but i use it almost every day in military service. US soldiers in Afghanistan tell very different than you. They would fucking love to have a G36 instead of the jam-o-matic M16 / M4. HK didn't abandoned the design. They still use it with various models.
US soldiers want a rifle that melts with sustained full auto fire? M16 is not perfect by far but it excels in the non-melt test.
The US rejected HK's plastic wondergun. HK had to go out and "improve" on Stoner's design. Even they didn't submit for testing their outdated, inferior, roller locked monstrosity. I wonder why they had to improve on Stoner when, according to you, Vorgrimmler's design was so superior?
@AZRanger HAHAHAHAHAHA.... G36 melts with substained auto fire? Are you retarted? Do you have any idea of material construction? The duro plast polymer material used on the G36 is more temperature resistant than steel. You have ever fired a G36? I'm not talking about a semi auto devirative, i'm talking about a G36A1. I'm doing auto fire almost every day with it. Melting? Not in a hundred years. Better learn something about chemistry before talking bullshit about things you know very little about
"The duro plast polymer material used on the G36 is more temperature resistant than steel."
Plastic more heat resistant than steel? Um...ok!
Another thing that I know is that as an American civilian, I can buy an AR-15, spare parts, ammunition, magazines, an optic for far less money. I can equip 3 AR's for the same price of 1 G36.
@AZRanger Learn something about chemistry and polymer materials. Plastic is a word, used by amateurs and people who have no clue about composite materials. Get over it, if HK would be that bad, who does it come that most governments of the world buy their products. And they do not watch commercials, they test weapons for years before buying them. Thats a fact.
So is polymer plastic or is it not? Does it have a higher melting point than steel?
Is that why the G36's barrel, barrel extension, bolt, bolt carrier, and trunnion are steel?
I am really curious to see why you feel personally slighted when HK products and the company is lambasted?
I don't like the AR because its American. I have a couple AK's and my pistol of choice is Austrian. My bolt action rifle is made by FN. Benelli makes my personal shotgun.
"Piston driven rifle? Stoner was first!" that is simply bullshit. The german StG44 from 1943 was the first gas operated, piston driven assault rifle. So it's more like Stoner copied the design of Schmeisser. When you talk about copying, tell the whole story! I wonder why you'd always came up with Stoner? Is it your daddy? Most of his designs sucked, the AR15 system for example is inferior in almost every way to most assault rifles in the world.
For the first piston driven AR, it is a known fact that Stoner was first in this area. It is not secret that his AR-16 and AR-18 were copied by HK engineers when they created the G36.
@AZRanger Again, Stoner was NOT first. Schmeisser was. Looks like you can't get over the fact, that Stoner took most of his ideas from german engineers, who developed their stuff during WW2. The StG 44 was the first assault rifle that was piston driven, that is a fact. Stoner was not first, this guy even thought until his death, that a non piston driven system is the best solution for an assault weapon. And he was so wrong.
I never said the first piston driven assault rifle was anything but a German design.I did say Stoner was first in the development of an AR (Armalite Rifle) that worked with a piston design. By the way, the direct impingement action of the AR-15 was borrowed from the French and Swedish.
@AZRanger You said exactly : "Piston driven rifle? Stoner was first!" And thats simply bullshit. Oh, i'm not mad because someone says HK is bad. I just wanna know how it comes, that most of the worlds govts use HK products if they're that bad? Civilians may be stupid enough to believe commerzials, but governments have test procedures before buying weapons. Your argument makes no sense, it's like saying that Ferrari builds shitty cars.
The world laud's HK's 416. A PISTON DRIVEN AR15 DERIVATIVE. The thing is Stoner was first with this concept but opted to incorporate a direct impingement action. Go back and read what I wrote.
For the US civilian gun owner, HK makes little sense...JUST LIKE FERRARI. When one considers cost, performance, parts availability, and maintenance; unless you are wealthy, both are extremely bad investments.
HK's G36 and XM8 were both rejected by the US military. HK then proceeds to "improve" on Stoner's design and develops a piston driven AR-15. Fanboys such as yourself think that this is some spectacular achievement and fail to recognize that Stoner had already designed a piston driven AR derivative.
Stoner's design sucked yet HK copied the AR-16 and AR-18 when developing the G36. Stoner's AR-15 is inferior yet HK copied the design when developing the HK416.
@AZRanger The US Military? You mention a military, that uses a inferior system for more than 50 years only because every better system was not american? Is that a joke? The american military is not the best example for intelligent decisions. There are dozens of militaries around the world, that choosed better weapons. They were simply free from this laughable patriotism. And btw, You know what makes a weapon cheap? Production numbers. Nothing else, thats why the AR15 is cheap and the G36 is not.
@AZRanger I didn't say, that HK products are superior, there are a lot of companies building good weapons.
Rifles? So the M16 rifle is build by FN? Thought that was Colt... Don't tell me anything, Colt does build rifles for the US military only for one reason. Because they're american. Just watch some videos about Colt and the history of the M16 adaption. Then we'll see. As you said, that makes perfect sense
FN makes the rifle, GPMG, and LMG for the US. Colt makes the carbine version (M4). Colt is actually on its way out and will be replaced if they don't come up with some sort of innovative new rifle or adaptation. Though I agree that they were kept solely because they were the 1st manufacturer.
I don't like HK because they're products are extremely expensive when comparing cost vs performance. My first pistol was a USP compact. My son will inherit it but I actually prefer Glock now.
BTW, MG4 is not a roller locked weapon like the MG3. It is a traditional gas gun like the FN Minimi. If roller locked was God's gift to mankind, why did HK essentially abandon the design?
@AZRanger The roller locked weapon is anything else than bad. The G3 is as accurate as a M16 and as reliable as an AK. You can burie it in mud and treat it like shit, it will still fire well and accurate. Don't tell me anything about those weapons, i have seen it with my own eyes. Also the MG42 / MG3 is way better than most other MG's, although the design is the oldest one that is still in use. The M60 for example was a failed try to copy the MG42.
You fail in debating 101. Who cares whether it is good or bad? The point I made is that HK abandoned this technology. Roller locked weapons were replaced because they were found lacking. Again, who cares about roller locked weapons when HK abandoned the design.
We are not discussing the M60. We are discussing HK's disdain for civilian gun owners. And their apparent knack for copying the designs of others. G36 has more in common with Stoner's design than it does with Vorgrimmler.
@AZRanger Found lacking? inferior roller lock? Damn, you are good in making jokes. The roller locked system is just damn expensive in production, nothing else. Who said, the G36 is based on Vorgrimmlers design? And for the M60. My point was, that they tried to copy the design of the MG42 (roller locked) because their soldiers were scared to death, when they only heard the bone saw and failed. The system was simply too complicated for them, but the MG3 proofs the system to be reliable an accurate
"The roller locked system is just damn expensive in production, nothing else."
The roller locked design is inferior to conventional methods of production due to cost. If its cost prohibitive when compared to other designs, it is in fact INFERIOR. Especially if the same reliability/results can be obtained via other methods.
G36 is based more on Stoner's design than Vorgy's. You praise HK for their roller locked weapons but even they abandoned the design.
@AZRanger Omg, don't you get it? Who was talking about money? Technical, the roller locked system is a great system. Otherwise it would not have been produced succesfully for 50 years. The G3 beats all assault rifles in terms of reliability. The SWAT team of the Kennedy Space Center has documented 571.000 rounds, fired by ONE MP5, every other smg has a life cycle of 40.000 rounds. But yeah, the roller locked system is inferior and HK has bad quality. ROFL
Ok I got it wrong...since the roller locked system "beats all others in reliability," HK has abandoned the superior design of the roller locked system for an INFERIOR traditional design.
@AZRanger All in one, your wrong statement about the G36 melting, sounds like the american propaganda of WW2. Where they tried to tell their soldiers the laughable bullshit, that the StG44 is more dangerous for the shooter than for the target and that the M1 Garand is superior to this weapon. You have owned a semi auto G36 derivative and wanna tell me something about auto fire? Is that a joke? Better ask some spanish or german soldiers about the G36. Unless the US soldiers, they love their rifle
Aside from the melting factor, as a US civilian gun owner, I can equip 3 comparable AR-15's for the same price of a G36. Just like the INFERIOR roller locked design, the G36 is cost prohibitive when compared to the AR-15. I carry the responsibility of not only training with my rifle but with the maintenance as well. Since G36 parts are difficult if not impossible to obtain, an AR-15 makes more sense to a US civilian gun owner.
Their USP pistols are okay and are almost as reliable as Glock for twice the price. My pistol of choice is Glock. My long gun of choice is definitely not an HK product.
Thanks for the info. I really didn't think their guns got any better over there. Btw, you should block VpR81 after you slam him across the head with facts and info!
Actually I welcome debate. I am not perfect and am always willing to learn from others. Though in this case I do not believe that I am incorrect. I do appreciate your feedback and apologize for missing your earlier comment.
That's perfectly fine. After I saw some of your earlier debates between hoplophobic fools from Germany (like Jazz and Frozen Monkey), I thought blocking people would have been a good idea.
But then again, making them look like idiots is probably more satisfying and better lol! Btw, I may get a long gun soon down the road. But I can't go over $700. What is the best one I should get?
Remember that everything is a compromise in some way shape or form; however, a gun with no availability of replacement parts simply becomes a very expensive club. Also, what do you need it to do?
I like the AR platform. Check out AR15 dot com. DSA sells an upper for 285. Add to that a bolt and charging handle along with a complete Plum Crazy lower and you have an effective defensive tool for sub $700.
Used AR's of better quality can be had for 600-700 dollars.
My main need is a home defense weapon. I've checked out the AR's and I've also seen Olympic Arms as an option. Do you have any experience with this brand in particular?
I also checked out the DSA ZM4 parts. I really like this one as well, but is this a better way to go opposed to Olympic Arms?
I actually prefer the AR for home defense. Less chance for over-penetration than a shotgun or pistol.
Though I have had good luck with the Oly .45ACP AR conversions, I have no experience with their 5.56 rifles. I do like DSA's price. Though Stag is another good brand. Kits can be purchased for around $500. Add to that a stripped lower and you're in perfect shape. Ditto for Rock River and Bushmaster.
Its hard to beat a Bravo Company upper though MPI, HPT, chrome lining, etc. etc.
Thanks for the help! I'm gonna get a DSA ZM4 A2 lower receiver for sure. As for the upper, I heard Stag is the low end of the AR-15 product line from several people, as well as Bushy and RRA. Is this true?
If not, then RRA or Oly will be my way to go. I've always been a fan of the AR-15!
Stag (CMT) is one of the few true manufacturers that does not outsource. CMT was a source for Colt. IMHO, Stag is way better than Oly.
The lower is of little consequence. Heck, some of my Cav's are plastic. The best place to invest is the barrel, upper, and BCG. Bravo Co., LMT, Colt, Noveske, and Daniel Defense are among the best. 2nd tier include Bushy, RRA, Stag, DSA etc. 3rd tier would be DPMS and OLY.
4150 CMV HPT barrel steel is the best. BCG that is MPI, HPT, & SP is the best
In that case, I'll get a Stag 20' standard A3 upper and a DSA ZM4 A2 lower. Will these two fit together, cause I heard that some aren't interchangeable?
Btw, the gun I'm gonna build is going to be an M16 style AR-15.
You will have less issues with a 20" barrel. Though I do have a 11.5" SBR, the barrel is a Sabre Defense. Generally speaking, the smaller the barrel length, the more problems you may encounter. This has to do with dwell time and the amount of gas the action receives. 20" and rifle length gas systems tend to be the most reliable.
As far as the upper and lower, you shouldn't have any issues. The only problems between uppers and lowers tend to be with Colt and their large pin guns.
Thanks for the tip and all the help! Do you know any manufactures that sell M16 A2/A3 style lower receivers that are of good quality besides DSA though?
Any of the reputable manufacturers should be fine. Try to find one local and avoid the FFL charge. Here in Phoenix, we have a plethora of local manufacturers. If you buy local you will avoid the $25-$50 FFL transfer fee
The lower will be an AR-15 (semi auto) as opposed to M16 (full auto/burst). I prefer the A1 stock, as I find the A2 far too long. Though the collapsible is nice too as you can shorten/lengthen the gun to your liking. My current rifles sport either Vltor or A1 stocks.
We have a few gun dealers from where I'm from, like Kames, Gander Mt, Fin Feathers and Fur, etc. I'll go checking around sometime when I have enough $ to purchase this gun.
I'll try several out, and see which one fits me the best. Though most likely the A2 since I have long and big arms. I'm definitely going to get a Stag 20" A3 upper. After all, the Stag Ar-15 is the most popular purchase of special forces teams according to Larry Correia. It must be doing something right!
i like guns because they are fun im not going to sit here and say they are for my personal or family protection because i dont have a gun ready at all times and i dont plan on killing someone i would hate to have to do that but i mean i have an ar and really to me its a toy i mean a lethal toy at that but its not something im going to take way too seriously
The 2nd Amendment is not about duck hunting. Go read the Constitution again and please pay attention to those pesky Bill of Rights. Go read about the Holocaust. Then go read the The Gulag Archipelago.
Governments only promise Freedom. Only personal arms deliver it.
@AZRanger lustig dass du so von waffengesetzen redest, wo wir hier in deutschland eins der strengsten haben damit so etwas wie der holocaust nicht wieder passiert.
Taking guns away from the citizenry was exactly the factor that lead to the Holocaust. Guns in the hands of Jews was not the problem. It was guns in the hands of a murderous government that proved to be disastrous for the Jews. Please don't tell me you're that moronic to believe that gun laws actually prevent a tyrannical government from forcing their creed down the throats of others. Tyrannical and homicidal governments have the power BECAUSE of strict gun laws.
"One man with a gun can control 100 without one." -Vladimir Lenin
"Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun." -Mao Zedong
"We don't let them have ideas. Why would we let them have guns?" -Josef Stalin
"The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by doing so." -Adolf Hitler
Go away and study history. Genocides happen because people with guns prey on those who don't. An evil individual with a gun can be dangerous.; HOWEVER, this danger pales in comparison when an evil government has all the guns.
No other instrument in history can compare to the ruthless killing efficiency of state sponsored murder.
@AZRanger Ich hab dir doch schon recht gegeben. Und ja die deutschen waffengesetze sind schlecht. Anscheinend verstehst du nicht ganz was ich meinte (vielleicht hab ich mich nicht gut erklärt) jedenfalls bin ich in diesen themen deiner meinung. Deswegen das k, damit wollte ich sagen: "Okay du hast deine Meinung gut und sachlich begründet und mich überzeugt."
I was disappointed with the G36 at least I can say I don't have brand myopia. I'd prefer the G3 to this, the FN-FAL, even the Ruger 556 (6.8SPC). The G36 falls into the trap of having all these "new innovative features" that don't function as well as the features that have been around for a century or so. Doesn't cool well, double optic sights may look great on the drawingboard but--position of the charging handle is kind of awkward.
@airsoftfreak312 30 rounds are high-cap retard. your name is airsoftfreak, you're used to shooting 500 plastic BBs in a magazine. grow some balls, shoot a real gun that cycles 30 rounds, then talk.
if anything, 5-10 would be a generous standard capacity
@lllBASlll oh my god, the capacity of a magazine that may be standard for a particular gun is completely unrelated to what is considered high or standard. a magazine for a 1911 is generally 8 rounds, a magazine for an m4 is typically 30 rounds. though they're both standard for the guns they're used with, one is still a high-cap 30-round, and the other is still a standard-cap 8-round
because the standard magazine capacity for a psg1 is 5, the standard for a g3/g91 is 20, standard for HK417 is 5-20, m14 is 10 to 20. hell, even the early m16 was 20rd
Oh man, we're talking about 5,56 (.223) rifles like the G36 and M4! And M16 is an exception 'cause it's an older model.
But anyway, we just wanted to tell you, that 30 rounds are not high cap for a g36 or any other rifle of it's type. You don't need to talk about pistols or other calibers, cause that's like comparing mini to ferrari...
Yeah. Its funny though heckler and Koch came out with a the sl8 and USC, it did not take very long for people to figure out how to convert them back to the UMP, and the g36 (like these people)
amen AZRANGER i agree with you all the way i am also a civillian sheapdog like you and i dont know what the fuck that nazie commie libral frozenmonkey was talking a bout its people like him that are being pussies and jack holes that dont know the first thing a bout guns that are getting all these retarted ass gun laws passed
I am proud that of the work I did on that conversion. I also sold that gun many moons ago, thus the reason for my videos. It was unique as it also took G36 magazines and it had a shortened fixed stock.
This was during the AWB so I couldn't use a folding stock, with German mags. The AWB forced you to use American mags, if you had the folding stock attached. I liked the G36 magazines better, so I modified the stock and made it fixed instead of folding.
I am not a HK "fan boy" or anything or I have fired a rifle in real life but if the plastic melts from long periods of fire. Then why some Middle Eastern countries like Jordan and Saudi Arabia uses this gun? Or how about the German troops using this gun in Afghanistan? Does that make them stupid? (or the German government in this case issuing the G36 to the German troops, not the troops themselves.)
I don't know if it makes them stupid, per se, but all weapon systems have their disadvantages.
Even my precious AR15.
With that said, for the American Shooter who has to maintain his or her weapon, there is no better choice for a lightweight, semi-automatic rifle. Especially when you can do all of the work on your rifle with nothing more than hand tools.
Have tons of money? By all means do a conversion.
Want a rifle for training, shooting, protecting your rights? By an AR15.
Yeah true.....something about the G36 doesn't feel like a true rifle lol. It's maybe the plastic lol. AR15's are true rifles. Maintain that baby and it will respect you back. The HK G36 is a nice rifle (with respect) but I'll take it over with a AR15 anyday.
There are two things in favour of de HK rifles. The ambidextrous fire controls (I'm left-handed :P) and they are very reliable. I don't now how they shot or other caracteristics but like ALL weapons they can kill. Most soldiers use the cheapest weapon that his country has bought for their, not the best.
PD: The best weapon (for me) is the FN F2000. It is the only 100% ambidextrous weapon (bullpup design, ambidextrous fire controls and front ejection system).
Yet the US was able to defeat the communists at every major battle, including the Tet Offensive. We sure the hell didn't pull out of Vietnam due to M16's "shortcomings."
The M4 feels like a toy, yet the G36 is mostly plastic. Also the M36/XM8 was dropped after thorough testing.
M4/M16 series of rifles are battle proven.Nuff said.
Like that conversion, very nice. After everything was done and all the money spent, would you say it was worth it? As I am considering something like this...
If you have money to spend and want something unique, do the conversion.
If you want to train, compete, practice, and maintain your own rifle, get an AR-15. For the money you would spend on a G36 conversion, you could equip 2 AR's, with optics, and also have enough money for spare parts.
I find it amusing/ironic that in the "information age," most people are completely and utterly ignorant. Look at some of these replies for absolute proof.
The standart G36 also has a 3x optic and a red dot every of these is pretty good. You can aim perfect with those. YOu just should keep both eyes open at the red dot ^^
I have a G36 and shooting it almost every Day. We have that as standart Rifle and it is just the best you can have. Sand , water and dirt doesn't make it jam.
You are correct, you don't "HAVE TO" post any videos of you with your G36. The problem is most people who tout this weapon system have only heard about it and never shot it. You have professionals who use it (due to a bureaucrats) and keyboard jockeys who swear by it. You seem to fall in the latter category.
But I digress...
My gun was made by HK. Your ignorance is quite astounding. Do yourself a favor and google "HK because you suck and we hate you."
Ah nice how you sort people just because of their knowledge.
Ignorance, oh man how true you are....I don't know what you are doing with your rifle but i never saw a melting G36.
And as i read in later comments that isn't a real G36 from the Amry just a replica so i don't think YOU can tell us anything about the G36 using by our Army.
If HK would build such bad weapons the US Military wouldn't use them.
Sort due to knowledge? Damn right! For someone who has so much experience with the G36 you sure do lack proof...but I digress.
You are ignorant. The SL8 is the civilian version of the G36. The gun will accept G36 bolts, G36 magazines, G36 lower parts, G36 sights. The only real differences are cosmetic.
The US military dumped the XM8 like a hot potato. I wonder why?
Our boys on the ground use the "inferior" Stoner designed direct -mpingement gun. I wonder why HK came out with the HK416? Hmm...
The fact is HK, as an arms company, is not American civilian friendly.
Saying "HK makes the best weapons" is rather ignorant. What other guns do you own/use that can qualify you to make that statement?
I have fired both the G36 and AR-15. I prefer the AR. When one considers that a civilian can maintain his or her weapon, with readily available parts and tools, the clear cut winner is the AR. Hell, I can build 3 AR's for the price of 1 G36. The AR-15 dominates in competition as well.
And you are the typical elitist Euro. I didn't say U.S. Arms are superior to German Arms in every way.
What you and your ilk fail to grasp is this has nothing to do with an AR being American made. BTW, my side arm of choice for competition/training/self defense is Glock.
I have tried the G36 and by my experience I hated it. Due to:
-Cost
-Upkeep
-Maintenance
-Parts are scarce/expensive
-HK does not provide support to civilians
The fact is your government picks up the tab for your weapon.
The G36 isn't a civilian gun! It's a Assault Rifle so why should HK sell those to civilian? just to get some more frenzy in America? Doesn't there every Child has a gun and kills his teachers or just some other civilian?
We have the orginal G36 you just a replica of the civilan version!
HK weapons suck. BTW, you don't build anything. Your airsoft and video game experience means little to me.
You would think that with Germany's past, you guys would learn from history. The SS deserved your trust Ja?
The last time I checked, when citizens were barred from owning firearms, millions of Jews died. The Nazi's weren't so successful when it came to cleaning out the Warsaw ghetto. Maybe that is why Israel has adopted the slogan, "Never Again!" Germans like you have it all wrong.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
hk is a good company but you cant say that the m16 and m4 sucks. unlike hk guns the m16 and m4 are made by MORE THAN ONE COMPANY. an m16 can be better than a g36 anyday as long as you buy it from a reliable company.
Yeah HK is horrible to American gun owners. Even to law enforcement. I hope they get turned down by every enforcement agency until they get their act together.
@DasBeck no offense to HK lovers, but I have checked out the g36 and its a piece of shit. it is an over-engineered, complicated disaster that looks better then it actually is. I would much rather have an M4, hell I would take an AK over the HK. the AK ain't much in terms of bells and whistles but at least you can rest assured it will work and its easy to use.
@Alexn1067 i fired thousands of rounds with my G36 - without any jams! And I also do not know anybody who had a jam with live firing rounds. And be sure, that we use our weapons in every environment...from european woods to the afghanistan wasteland.
Indeed, the G36 jams a lot with blank ammo...but in my opinion, that cant be an argument for the M4.
Do yourself a favor. Buy an M16, use it and then criticize it. I very much doubt you even use a G36 but I digress. Playing with Airsoft doesn't count either.
As a citizen (not a subject) I am allowed to own semi-automatic military style rifles. Just cuz you bend over and grab your ankles for your govt. doesn't mean I do it.
Every child here does not shoot his teacher. BTW, Robert Steinhaeuser and Tim Kretschmer were both German.
HK SL8 is a semi automatic G36. Both are overpriced plastic.
The Bundeswehr use the G36. The problem is I doubt you are in the Bundeswehr.
You chide cvilians who own guns. You talk about school mass shootings, yet I say both have been a problem with Germany's past. There have been school shootings in Germany. And there has also been civilian disarmament (the holocaust was a direct result).
You bring up both subjects in our discourse because the fact is you can't argue facts. What do either of these things have to do with the G36 and its shortcomings?
First of all SHUT THE FUCK UP about BUSH, 2nd of all you stupid fucks can't fight a fucking war to save your ass, a few thousand troops who don't do jack shit but piss around a base don't count toward fighting the war. ALso wtf is wrong with being a patriot, Are you mad because we can be proud of our history and you cannot, well I will say that my ancestors do make great weapons, but unfortunately Germany and the rest of europe is deteriorating into a incompetent, broken dream of a eutopic era
HK sucks. Their elitist management sucks. Their policies suck.
You are the fool who is a "Patriot," arguing for an arms company that you have no control over. Though truly you aren't even a citizen, your a subject. When your government tells you to bend over, the only thing you ask for is more lube.
There are plenty of US Arms company's that suck. I don't offense or try to defend an inferior product.
Hey AZ let me know if u need any help in schooling this euro douche bag, I am so tired of these people its not even funny. The sad thing is he isn't even in the military. In Iraq as long as we had our m4's lubed we were good to go, although we were in abrams, that sand gets everywhere and they still held up pretty well.
HEY JAZZ sprech sie deutch, kussen mein arsche :) mein deutsch ist nicht so gut aber ICH kann verstehen mehr dann Ich kann sprechen.
what a pussy. I WANT TO SEE THAT THING FULL AUTO CMON
sharki9876 4 months ago
@sharki9876 Full auto? this is a civillian range. I don't think it's converted
TehBloodyYank556 4 months ago
@sharki9876 It's a SL8 converted into a G36 body, you moron. The SL8 only features single-shot.
bf2lover42 4 months ago
@eliminatr1221 The guy who saw the gun.
withtheoldbreed 6 months ago
i believe phoenix is < that way
Sinzai09 9 months ago
Made in Germany :)
TheDanidox 9 months ago
Usery Pass! Good place.
HK could make basically print money if they offered semi-auto versions of the G36 to civilians. Thing is, they're almost ashamed they make guns and they must hate money. For 3k I'd convert an SL8 but since it'd cost about 5k total...it's hard to think it's really worth it.
drewnwalker 11 months ago
My first pistol was an HK USP compact and it was also my last.
Haven't bought another HK since.
AZRanger 11 months ago
@AZRanger that doesn't even make sense. so are you pro h&k? because every normal person should be they make accurate dependable firearms that are second to none.
floridabowhunter 9 months ago
@floridabowhunter
I can tell by your lack of proper punctuation, that your intelligence level is slightly impaired. One would need to look no further than an article called: "HK. Because you suck and we hate you" to understand. Try Googling it sometime, schmuck.
The steel HK weapons are nothing more than overpriced stamped garbage. The plastic rifles melt. On top of this, they sneer at the U.S. civilian gun owner.
Retarded fanboiis such as yourself are part of the problem.
AZRanger 9 months ago
@AZRanger aren't you cool thinking your smart correcting my punctuation. explain to me then, why does h&k supply a huge majority of the worlds military's? why does the united states government use mk23's, mp5's, gmg's, and g36's? along with allot of pmc's around the world, are you saying you know more about their weapon systems than the us gov? lmao
floridabowhunter 9 months ago
@floridabowhunter
Both the XM8 and the HK G36 were both rejected by the US Govt.
Currently FN...NOT HK makes the main battle Rifle for US Forces
Currently FN...NOT HK makes both the LMG and GPMG for US Forces
Currently Colt..NOT HK makes the Carbine
HK copies CETME for the G3
HK copies Stoner for the HK416
HK copied FN for its MG43
You're absolutely right though, HK does so much for the US. govt. Never mind the fact that they disdain US civilian gun owners. Cuz you suck and HK hates you!
AZRanger 9 months ago
@AZRanger ohh okay to start off cetme bought the rights to build the design of the g3, they didn't make it. second, the 416 is just a gas operated m4. stoner wasn't the one that came up with that. and third, the mg43 is just a modified mg42. if anyone is copying anyone it would be fn because GERMANY had the gun designs first! and fourth, I COULD GIVE A FUCK ABOUT WHAT HK THINKS. they make good guns. PERIOD. if you wanted them to like you then move to Germany or be german you fuck!
floridabowhunter 9 months ago
@floridabowhunter Your stupidity is astounding!
Cetme was created first by Vorgrimler in Spain.
Hk416 is more a Stoner design than an HK design. 416 piston is based on the the G36. G36 piston is based on Stoner's AR-16. 416's upper can drop on an AR lower. Piston driven Rifle? Stoner was first
MG42 is a Vorgrimler designed roller-locked weapon. MG43 is conventional gas operated weapon. HK got the design from FN.
Finally, how do you know HK makes good guns? Do you own one? How about proof?
AZRanger 9 months ago
@AZRanger And Vorgrimmler was a former mauser Engineer. The complete team around Vorgrimmler were german engineers. The CETME is a german invention, based on the StG45. They just moved to spain, because germany was not allowed to develope small arms at this time. MG43? What is that? There is NO weapon that is named this way. I rather think, that you are talking about the MG4 and it's internals are way different from the FN Minimi. So you think HK makes bad guns? How about proof?
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
CETME was created by Germans in Spain. My point was was CETME was first. MG-43 is HK's designation. MG4 is the German Govt. designation.
HK guns are overrated. HK is horrible to American civilian gun owners. Their USP pistols are almost as good as Glock for twice the price. The G36 sucks (XM8 did too). HK is overrated, overpriced, but does excellent marketing.
I owned an HK G36 derivative. My proof is based on my ownership of those guns. Can you say the same?
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger Who cares about american gun owners? You think they special? HK does not treat them different, than they treat british, australian, german and swiss gun owners. The G36 sucks? Thats a joke, isn't it? I do not own one, but i use it almost every day in military service. US soldiers in Afghanistan tell very different than you. They would fucking love to have a G36 instead of the jam-o-matic M16 / M4. HK didn't abandoned the design. They still use it with various models.
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
US soldiers want a rifle that melts with sustained full auto fire? M16 is not perfect by far but it excels in the non-melt test.
The US rejected HK's plastic wondergun. HK had to go out and "improve" on Stoner's design. Even they didn't submit for testing their outdated, inferior, roller locked monstrosity. I wonder why they had to improve on Stoner when, according to you, Vorgrimmler's design was so superior?
HK...because you suck and we hate you!
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger HAHAHAHAHAHA.... G36 melts with substained auto fire? Are you retarted? Do you have any idea of material construction? The duro plast polymer material used on the G36 is more temperature resistant than steel. You have ever fired a G36? I'm not talking about a semi auto devirative, i'm talking about a G36A1. I'm doing auto fire almost every day with it. Melting? Not in a hundred years. Better learn something about chemistry before talking bullshit about things you know very little about
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
"The duro plast polymer material used on the G36 is more temperature resistant than steel."
Plastic more heat resistant than steel? Um...ok!
Another thing that I know is that as an American civilian, I can buy an AR-15, spare parts, ammunition, magazines, an optic for far less money. I can equip 3 AR's for the same price of 1 G36.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger Learn something about chemistry and polymer materials. Plastic is a word, used by amateurs and people who have no clue about composite materials. Get over it, if HK would be that bad, who does it come that most governments of the world buy their products. And they do not watch commercials, they test weapons for years before buying them. Thats a fact.
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
So is polymer plastic or is it not? Does it have a higher melting point than steel?
Is that why the G36's barrel, barrel extension, bolt, bolt carrier, and trunnion are steel?
I am really curious to see why you feel personally slighted when HK products and the company is lambasted?
I don't like the AR because its American. I have a couple AK's and my pistol of choice is Austrian. My bolt action rifle is made by FN. Benelli makes my personal shotgun.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger Oh and btw... WTF Stoner?
"Piston driven rifle? Stoner was first!" that is simply bullshit. The german StG44 from 1943 was the first gas operated, piston driven assault rifle. So it's more like Stoner copied the design of Schmeisser. When you talk about copying, tell the whole story! I wonder why you'd always came up with Stoner? Is it your daddy? Most of his designs sucked, the AR15 system for example is inferior in almost every way to most assault rifles in the world.
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
For the first piston driven AR, it is a known fact that Stoner was first in this area. It is not secret that his AR-16 and AR-18 were copied by HK engineers when they created the G36.
You say his designs sucked, yet HK copied them.
Again...you fail in the debate department.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger Again, Stoner was NOT first. Schmeisser was. Looks like you can't get over the fact, that Stoner took most of his ideas from german engineers, who developed their stuff during WW2. The StG 44 was the first assault rifle that was piston driven, that is a fact. Stoner was not first, this guy even thought until his death, that a non piston driven system is the best solution for an assault weapon. And he was so wrong.
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
I never said the first piston driven assault rifle was anything but a German design.I did say Stoner was first in the development of an AR (Armalite Rifle) that worked with a piston design. By the way, the direct impingement action of the AR-15 was borrowed from the French and Swedish.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger You said exactly : "Piston driven rifle? Stoner was first!" And thats simply bullshit. Oh, i'm not mad because someone says HK is bad. I just wanna know how it comes, that most of the worlds govts use HK products if they're that bad? Civilians may be stupid enough to believe commerzials, but governments have test procedures before buying weapons. Your argument makes no sense, it's like saying that Ferrari builds shitty cars.
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
The world laud's HK's 416. A PISTON DRIVEN AR15 DERIVATIVE. The thing is Stoner was first with this concept but opted to incorporate a direct impingement action. Go back and read what I wrote.
For the US civilian gun owner, HK makes little sense...JUST LIKE FERRARI. When one considers cost, performance, parts availability, and maintenance; unless you are wealthy, both are extremely bad investments.
The US tested the G36 and XM8 and rejected both.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@VpR81
HK's G36 and XM8 were both rejected by the US military. HK then proceeds to "improve" on Stoner's design and develops a piston driven AR-15. Fanboys such as yourself think that this is some spectacular achievement and fail to recognize that Stoner had already designed a piston driven AR derivative.
Stoner's design sucked yet HK copied the AR-16 and AR-18 when developing the G36. Stoner's AR-15 is inferior yet HK copied the design when developing the HK416.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger The US Military? You mention a military, that uses a inferior system for more than 50 years only because every better system was not american? Is that a joke? The american military is not the best example for intelligent decisions. There are dozens of militaries around the world, that choosed better weapons. They were simply free from this laughable patriotism. And btw, You know what makes a weapon cheap? Production numbers. Nothing else, thats why the AR15 is cheap and the G36 is not.
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
So when countries choose HK products, its simply because they're superior. When a country does not, its out of civic virtue?
Is that why we Americans use FN products? For our armed forces Rifles, LMG's, and GPMG's?
That makes perfect sense!
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger I didn't say, that HK products are superior, there are a lot of companies building good weapons.
Rifles? So the M16 rifle is build by FN? Thought that was Colt... Don't tell me anything, Colt does build rifles for the US military only for one reason. Because they're american. Just watch some videos about Colt and the history of the M16 adaption. Then we'll see. As you said, that makes perfect sense
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
FN makes the rifle, GPMG, and LMG for the US. Colt makes the carbine version (M4). Colt is actually on its way out and will be replaced if they don't come up with some sort of innovative new rifle or adaptation. Though I agree that they were kept solely because they were the 1st manufacturer.
I don't like HK because they're products are extremely expensive when comparing cost vs performance. My first pistol was a USP compact. My son will inherit it but I actually prefer Glock now.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@VpR81
Almost forgot. The US Military also issues Italian Pistols and Italian Shotguns.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@VpR81
BTW, MG4 is not a roller locked weapon like the MG3. It is a traditional gas gun like the FN Minimi. If roller locked was God's gift to mankind, why did HK essentially abandon the design?
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger The roller locked weapon is anything else than bad. The G3 is as accurate as a M16 and as reliable as an AK. You can burie it in mud and treat it like shit, it will still fire well and accurate. Don't tell me anything about those weapons, i have seen it with my own eyes. Also the MG42 / MG3 is way better than most other MG's, although the design is the oldest one that is still in use. The M60 for example was a failed try to copy the MG42.
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
You fail in debating 101. Who cares whether it is good or bad? The point I made is that HK abandoned this technology. Roller locked weapons were replaced because they were found lacking. Again, who cares about roller locked weapons when HK abandoned the design.
We are not discussing the M60. We are discussing HK's disdain for civilian gun owners. And their apparent knack for copying the designs of others. G36 has more in common with Stoner's design than it does with Vorgrimmler.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger Found lacking? inferior roller lock? Damn, you are good in making jokes. The roller locked system is just damn expensive in production, nothing else. Who said, the G36 is based on Vorgrimmlers design? And for the M60. My point was, that they tried to copy the design of the MG42 (roller locked) because their soldiers were scared to death, when they only heard the bone saw and failed. The system was simply too complicated for them, but the MG3 proofs the system to be reliable an accurate
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
Again you fail in debate 101.
"The roller locked system is just damn expensive in production, nothing else."
The roller locked design is inferior to conventional methods of production due to cost. If its cost prohibitive when compared to other designs, it is in fact INFERIOR. Especially if the same reliability/results can be obtained via other methods.
G36 is based more on Stoner's design than Vorgy's. You praise HK for their roller locked weapons but even they abandoned the design.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger Omg, don't you get it? Who was talking about money? Technical, the roller locked system is a great system. Otherwise it would not have been produced succesfully for 50 years. The G3 beats all assault rifles in terms of reliability. The SWAT team of the Kennedy Space Center has documented 571.000 rounds, fired by ONE MP5, every other smg has a life cycle of 40.000 rounds. But yeah, the roller locked system is inferior and HK has bad quality. ROFL
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
Ok I got it wrong...since the roller locked system "beats all others in reliability," HK has abandoned the superior design of the roller locked system for an INFERIOR traditional design.
Gotcha!
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger All in one, your wrong statement about the G36 melting, sounds like the american propaganda of WW2. Where they tried to tell their soldiers the laughable bullshit, that the StG44 is more dangerous for the shooter than for the target and that the M1 Garand is superior to this weapon. You have owned a semi auto G36 derivative and wanna tell me something about auto fire? Is that a joke? Better ask some spanish or german soldiers about the G36. Unless the US soldiers, they love their rifle
VpR81 8 months ago
@VpR81
Aside from the melting factor, as a US civilian gun owner, I can equip 3 comparable AR-15's for the same price of a G36. Just like the INFERIOR roller locked design, the G36 is cost prohibitive when compared to the AR-15. I carry the responsibility of not only training with my rifle but with the maintenance as well. Since G36 parts are difficult if not impossible to obtain, an AR-15 makes more sense to a US civilian gun owner.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@floridabowhunter
Stop basing your self worth/self esteem on this shitty company.
larrycorreia.wordpressDOTcom/2007/10/09/hk-because-you-suck-and-we-hate-you/
AZRanger 9 months ago
@AZRanger
I have a question. Has the customer support over at HK gotten any better? If it has, do you still think I should buy from them?
WenchesOfRedemption 11 months ago
@WenchesOfRedemption
Their USP pistols are okay and are almost as reliable as Glock for twice the price. My pistol of choice is Glock. My long gun of choice is definitely not an HK product.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger
Thanks for the info. I really didn't think their guns got any better over there. Btw, you should block VpR81 after you slam him across the head with facts and info!
WenchesOfRedemption 8 months ago
@WenchesOfRedemption
Actually I welcome debate. I am not perfect and am always willing to learn from others. Though in this case I do not believe that I am incorrect. I do appreciate your feedback and apologize for missing your earlier comment.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger
That's perfectly fine. After I saw some of your earlier debates between hoplophobic fools from Germany (like Jazz and Frozen Monkey), I thought blocking people would have been a good idea.
But then again, making them look like idiots is probably more satisfying and better lol! Btw, I may get a long gun soon down the road. But I can't go over $700. What is the best one I should get?
WenchesOfRedemption 8 months ago
@Wenches
Remember that everything is a compromise in some way shape or form; however, a gun with no availability of replacement parts simply becomes a very expensive club. Also, what do you need it to do?
I like the AR platform. Check out AR15 dot com. DSA sells an upper for 285. Add to that a bolt and charging handle along with a complete Plum Crazy lower and you have an effective defensive tool for sub $700.
Used AR's of better quality can be had for 600-700 dollars.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger
My main need is a home defense weapon. I've checked out the AR's and I've also seen Olympic Arms as an option. Do you have any experience with this brand in particular?
I also checked out the DSA ZM4 parts. I really like this one as well, but is this a better way to go opposed to Olympic Arms?
WenchesOfRedemption 8 months ago
@Wenches
I actually prefer the AR for home defense. Less chance for over-penetration than a shotgun or pistol.
Though I have had good luck with the Oly .45ACP AR conversions, I have no experience with their 5.56 rifles. I do like DSA's price. Though Stag is another good brand. Kits can be purchased for around $500. Add to that a stripped lower and you're in perfect shape. Ditto for Rock River and Bushmaster.
Its hard to beat a Bravo Company upper though MPI, HPT, chrome lining, etc. etc.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger
Thanks for the help! I'm gonna get a DSA ZM4 A2 lower receiver for sure. As for the upper, I heard Stag is the low end of the AR-15 product line from several people, as well as Bushy and RRA. Is this true?
If not, then RRA or Oly will be my way to go. I've always been a fan of the AR-15!
WenchesOfRedemption 8 months ago
@Wenches
Stag (CMT) is one of the few true manufacturers that does not outsource. CMT was a source for Colt. IMHO, Stag is way better than Oly.
The lower is of little consequence. Heck, some of my Cav's are plastic. The best place to invest is the barrel, upper, and BCG. Bravo Co., LMT, Colt, Noveske, and Daniel Defense are among the best. 2nd tier include Bushy, RRA, Stag, DSA etc. 3rd tier would be DPMS and OLY.
4150 CMV HPT barrel steel is the best. BCG that is MPI, HPT, & SP is the best
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger
In that case, I'll get a Stag 20' standard A3 upper and a DSA ZM4 A2 lower. Will these two fit together, cause I heard that some aren't interchangeable?
Btw, the gun I'm gonna build is going to be an M16 style AR-15.
WenchesOfRedemption 8 months ago
@Wenches
You will have less issues with a 20" barrel. Though I do have a 11.5" SBR, the barrel is a Sabre Defense. Generally speaking, the smaller the barrel length, the more problems you may encounter. This has to do with dwell time and the amount of gas the action receives. 20" and rifle length gas systems tend to be the most reliable.
As far as the upper and lower, you shouldn't have any issues. The only problems between uppers and lowers tend to be with Colt and their large pin guns.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger
Thanks for the tip and all the help! Do you know any manufactures that sell M16 A2/A3 style lower receivers that are of good quality besides DSA though?
WenchesOfRedemption 8 months ago
@Wenches
Any of the reputable manufacturers should be fine. Try to find one local and avoid the FFL charge. Here in Phoenix, we have a plethora of local manufacturers. If you buy local you will avoid the $25-$50 FFL transfer fee
The lower will be an AR-15 (semi auto) as opposed to M16 (full auto/burst). I prefer the A1 stock, as I find the A2 far too long. Though the collapsible is nice too as you can shorten/lengthen the gun to your liking. My current rifles sport either Vltor or A1 stocks.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger
We have a few gun dealers from where I'm from, like Kames, Gander Mt, Fin Feathers and Fur, etc. I'll go checking around sometime when I have enough $ to purchase this gun.
I'll try several out, and see which one fits me the best. Though most likely the A2 since I have long and big arms. I'm definitely going to get a Stag 20" A3 upper. After all, the Stag Ar-15 is the most popular purchase of special forces teams according to Larry Correia. It must be doing something right!
WenchesOfRedemption 8 months ago
@Wenches
Make sure you check out Palmetto State Armory on ARF dot com. I have seen some pretty smoking deals on uppers and lowers.
AZRanger 8 months ago
HK is the best
Flossengeber 11 months ago
@airsoftfreak312 your 20 cents? lol
newspot221 11 months ago
nice gun. i might use one of these in the next music video i make
witedevl 1 year ago
Dear Santa...
orvidon 1 year ago
i like guns because they are fun im not going to sit here and say they are for my personal or family protection because i dont have a gun ready at all times and i dont plan on killing someone i would hate to have to do that but i mean i have an ar and really to me its a toy i mean a lethal toy at that but its not something im going to take way too seriously
KILLSWITCHnut 1 year ago
@KILLSWITCHnut
The 2nd Amendment is not about duck hunting. Go read the Constitution again and please pay attention to those pesky Bill of Rights. Go read about the Holocaust. Then go read the The Gulag Archipelago.
Governments only promise Freedom. Only personal arms deliver it.
Your firearms are there to protect your Freedom.
AZRanger 9 months ago
@AZRanger lustig dass du so von waffengesetzen redest, wo wir hier in deutschland eins der strengsten haben damit so etwas wie der holocaust nicht wieder passiert.
JohLenMic 8 months ago
@JohLenMic
Taking guns away from the citizenry was exactly the factor that lead to the Holocaust. Guns in the hands of Jews was not the problem. It was guns in the hands of a murderous government that proved to be disastrous for the Jews. Please don't tell me you're that moronic to believe that gun laws actually prevent a tyrannical government from forcing their creed down the throats of others. Tyrannical and homicidal governments have the power BECAUSE of strict gun laws.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger k . schreib merkel einen brief ^^
JohLenMic 8 months ago
@JohLenMic
"One man with a gun can control 100 without one." -Vladimir Lenin
"Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun." -Mao Zedong
"We don't let them have ideas. Why would we let them have guns?" -Josef Stalin
"The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by doing so." -Adolf Hitler
WenchesOfRedemption 8 months ago
@JohLenMic
The 3rd Reich had gun control laws that it inherited from the Weimar republic. You sir FAIL when it comes to history.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger junge ich hab mit "k. schreib merkel einen brief" dir doch schon recht gegeben. Und was soll das mit dem "sir" ich bin 14.
JohLenMic 8 months ago
@JohLenMic
Go away and study history. Genocides happen because people with guns prey on those who don't. An evil individual with a gun can be dangerous.; HOWEVER, this danger pales in comparison when an evil government has all the guns.
No other instrument in history can compare to the ruthless killing efficiency of state sponsored murder.
AZRanger 8 months ago
@AZRanger Ich hab dir doch schon recht gegeben. Und ja die deutschen waffengesetze sind schlecht. Anscheinend verstehst du nicht ganz was ich meinte (vielleicht hab ich mich nicht gut erklärt) jedenfalls bin ich in diesen themen deiner meinung. Deswegen das k, damit wollte ich sagen: "Okay du hast deine Meinung gut und sachlich begründet und mich überzeugt."
JohLenMic 8 months ago
@JohLenMic My apologies to you. Thank you.
AZRanger 8 months ago
G36 + 3x scope = amazing combo
ww2footage 1 year ago
I was disappointed with the G36 at least I can say I don't have brand myopia. I'd prefer the G3 to this, the FN-FAL, even the Ruger 556 (6.8SPC). The G36 falls into the trap of having all these "new innovative features" that don't function as well as the features that have been around for a century or so. Doesn't cool well, double optic sights may look great on the drawingboard but--position of the charging handle is kind of awkward.
oeyesea 1 year ago
i like steyr more for some reason even though its much older
exitre 1 year ago
@airsoftfreak312 30 rounds are high-cap retard. your name is airsoftfreak, you're used to shooting 500 plastic BBs in a magazine. grow some balls, shoot a real gun that cycles 30 rounds, then talk.
if anything, 5-10 would be a generous standard capacity
GettingPissedMan 1 year ago
@GettingPissedMan
Have you ever shot a real gun? I've never heard about the G36 or m4 standard mags beeing high cap mags...
Shoot a real gun that cycles 30 rounds, then talk.
lllBASlll 1 year ago
@lllBASlll its astounding how dumb you are.
GettingPissedMan 1 year ago
@GettingPissedMan
You serious? If yes, then it's outstanding how dumb you are...
I'm talking about REAL firearms and their REAL magazines. A G36 has a standard 30 round magazine, as well as the m4.
I don't mean the limitations of any range. Got that?!
lllBASlll 1 year ago
@lllBASlll oh my god, the capacity of a magazine that may be standard for a particular gun is completely unrelated to what is considered high or standard. a magazine for a 1911 is generally 8 rounds, a magazine for an m4 is typically 30 rounds. though they're both standard for the guns they're used with, one is still a high-cap 30-round, and the other is still a standard-cap 8-round
GettingPissedMan 1 year ago
@GettingPissedMan
But we have the same opinion about a 30 round mag beiing standard capacity for a rifle?
Doesn't matter, what relation exists between pistols and rifles. You said 30 rounds are high capacity and they're not! They're standard for a rifle.
lllBASlll 1 year ago
@lllBASlll really?
because the standard magazine capacity for a psg1 is 5, the standard for a g3/g91 is 20, standard for HK417 is 5-20, m14 is 10 to 20. hell, even the early m16 was 20rd
GettingPissedMan 1 year ago
@GettingPissedMan
Oh man, we're talking about 5,56 (.223) rifles like the G36 and M4! And M16 is an exception 'cause it's an older model.
But anyway, we just wanted to tell you, that 30 rounds are not high cap for a g36 or any other rifle of it's type. You don't need to talk about pistols or other calibers, cause that's like comparing mini to ferrari...
lllBASlll 1 year ago
Good job converting that thing. It looks like the real deal. Too bad you can't just get them like that in the first place.
Riflemanm16a2 1 year ago
g36 coming to slovak army !!!
Kozoroh2 1 year ago
Heckler & Koch --> The Best Weapons ever!
LeadersAirsoftSBK 1 year ago
You can tell when they are SL8 conversions. The buttstock protrudes out of the rear farther back then a normal G36.
Popsicle22754 2 years ago
So this was actually a conversion of an SL8?
Panzerfaust26 2 years ago
Actually, SL8 is a conversion of G36 ;)!
Jensemann88 2 years ago
Yeah. Its funny though heckler and Koch came out with a the sl8 and USC, it did not take very long for people to figure out how to convert them back to the UMP, and the g36 (like these people)
badgerattoadhall 2 years ago
amen AZRANGER i agree with you all the way i am also a civillian sheapdog like you and i dont know what the fuck that nazie commie libral frozenmonkey was talking a bout its people like him that are being pussies and jack holes that dont know the first thing a bout guns that are getting all these retarted ass gun laws passed
airsoftfreak312 2 years ago 2
Finally a person with some wisdom.
My God is there that few of us out there?
AZRanger 2 years ago 2
@AZRanger Guns found the United States of America,why make laws against our building blocks?Makes no sense :)
TriggerManxL 1 year ago
Comment removed
Cobac 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@AZRanger He may have wisdom but his grammar sucks .
Cobac 1 year ago
Very jelous... All I've ever been able to shoot was the Sl8 (g36 varient wsie)...
TheFatAssCat 2 years ago
Rkade, the lack of punctuation confused me.
I failed on my argument or Frozenmonkey?
AZRanger 2 years ago
Do you hate the G36/SL8 conversion or not?!
You have 3 videos (what looks like may have been 4 before) and your avatar is a guy holding the G36/SL8 conversion or what ever!
snakevenom56 2 years ago
I hate HK fan boys.
The G36 conversion is expensive for what you get.
Would I do it again? Hell no.
Parts are expensive and hard to find. I can build several AR-15's with optics for the price of 1 G36.
They are interesting because they are unique. They are not better than the AR15.
AZRanger 2 years ago
If you love your AR-15s so much then put up videos of them!
The SL8/G36 videos and your avatar makes it look like you love it.
snakevenom56 2 years ago
I am proud that of the work I did on that conversion. I also sold that gun many moons ago, thus the reason for my videos. It was unique as it also took G36 magazines and it had a shortened fixed stock.
This was during the AWB so I couldn't use a folding stock, with German mags. The AWB forced you to use American mags, if you had the folding stock attached. I liked the G36 magazines better, so I modified the stock and made it fixed instead of folding.
AZRanger 2 years ago
Oh yeah. Nice rifle by the way :)
fireback2 2 years ago
I am not a HK "fan boy" or anything or I have fired a rifle in real life but if the plastic melts from long periods of fire. Then why some Middle Eastern countries like Jordan and Saudi Arabia uses this gun? Or how about the German troops using this gun in Afghanistan? Does that make them stupid? (or the German government in this case issuing the G36 to the German troops, not the troops themselves.)
fireback2 2 years ago
I don't know if it makes them stupid, per se, but all weapon systems have their disadvantages.
Even my precious AR15.
With that said, for the American Shooter who has to maintain his or her weapon, there is no better choice for a lightweight, semi-automatic rifle. Especially when you can do all of the work on your rifle with nothing more than hand tools.
Have tons of money? By all means do a conversion.
Want a rifle for training, shooting, protecting your rights? By an AR15.
AZRanger 2 years ago
Yeah true.....something about the G36 doesn't feel like a true rifle lol. It's maybe the plastic lol. AR15's are true rifles. Maintain that baby and it will respect you back. The HK G36 is a nice rifle (with respect) but I'll take it over with a AR15 anyday.
fireback2 2 years ago
Nice rifle.
phildaguy 2 years ago
Wouldn't "shoot as fast as you can" mean full auto?
92benno92 2 years ago
There are two things in favour of de HK rifles. The ambidextrous fire controls (I'm left-handed :P) and they are very reliable. I don't now how they shot or other caracteristics but like ALL weapons they can kill. Most soldiers use the cheapest weapon that his country has bought for their, not the best.
PD: The best weapon (for me) is the FN F2000. It is the only 100% ambidextrous weapon (bullpup design, ambidextrous fire controls and front ejection system).
PaxMu 2 years ago
You state they are "very reliable" yet you have never shot one.
Can you even own a gun in Spain?
AZRanger 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@AZRanger:
first: im not a hk fanboy and im not a member of the bundeswehr yet.
but my brother shoot with both weapons (g36 and m4) and he told me the m4 feels like a toy gun.
he could shoot better with the g36 (also like a lot us-soldiers who have shoot with the g36)
and the m16 wasnt really successful in vietnam.
it really often jams, thats a fact.
iJohnny1990 2 years ago
Yet the US was able to defeat the communists at every major battle, including the Tet Offensive. We sure the hell didn't pull out of Vietnam due to M16's "shortcomings."
The M4 feels like a toy, yet the G36 is mostly plastic. Also the M36/XM8 was dropped after thorough testing.
M4/M16 series of rifles are battle proven.Nuff said.
AZRanger 2 years ago
Like that conversion, very nice. After everything was done and all the money spent, would you say it was worth it? As I am considering something like this...
72chevelless530 2 years ago
If you have money to spend and want something unique, do the conversion.
If you want to train, compete, practice, and maintain your own rifle, get an AR-15. For the money you would spend on a G36 conversion, you could equip 2 AR's, with optics, and also have enough money for spare parts.
AZRanger 2 years ago
Dude that's a friggin insane. And that's a really nice shooting range too I've been there a couple times.
Jurneyz 2 years ago
Thanks for the kind words!
AZRanger 2 years ago
After reading some of the comments I am amazed you haven't gone insane.
Ahuuunryhippo 2 years ago
I find it amusing/ironic that in the "information age," most people are completely and utterly ignorant. Look at some of these replies for absolute proof.
AZRanger 2 years ago
Comment removed
Ahuuunryhippo 2 years ago
What do you think of the top optic?
Ahuuunryhippo 2 years ago
It worked. Eye relief was terrible though. The 3x powered optic had a very limited field of view.
AZRanger 2 years ago
"it works" is a very polite answer..
a great german gun journal called it "the crappiest version of its price class..."
Gangleri33 2 years ago
LOL...
Thanks for the vote of confidence. The optic I am liking more an more on my AR15's is the Leupold CQT.
AZRanger 2 years ago
The standart G36 also has a 3x optic and a red dot every of these is pretty good. You can aim perfect with those. YOu just should keep both eyes open at the red dot ^^
JazzJaRa 2 years ago
And you are speaking out of experience?
These optics suck.
There are better and cheaper alternatives.
AZRanger 2 years ago
I have a G36 and shooting it almost every Day. We have that as standart Rifle and it is just the best you can have. Sand , water and dirt doesn't make it jam.
HK just make the best weapons.
So YES i can speak out of experience!
JazzJaRa 2 years ago
For someone who "shoots almost every day" your profile lacks proof.
G36 sucks due to the fact that the trunnion can melt due to extended rapid fire sessions.
Who cares about dirt, water, or sand when your gun is useless due to a melted trunnion.
How many mags have you fired in succession?
AZRanger 2 years ago
I don't have to write ANYTHING in my Profil.
I shoot the G36 many times with Fullauto and nothing melt! maybe you have a cheap copy of it?!
I don't think HK would sell a weapon which melts away.
How many mags? you are asking a Soldier how many mags he shot? do you really think i count that?
Its good to know i can count on my weapon after a beachlanding or in a desert. While your rifles jam after a waterbath or a bit of dust.
JazzJaRa 2 years ago
You are correct, you don't "HAVE TO" post any videos of you with your G36. The problem is most people who tout this weapon system have only heard about it and never shot it. You have professionals who use it (due to a bureaucrats) and keyboard jockeys who swear by it. You seem to fall in the latter category.
But I digress...
My gun was made by HK. Your ignorance is quite astounding. Do yourself a favor and google "HK because you suck and we hate you."
HK products and their support sucks.
AZRanger 2 years ago
Ah nice how you sort people just because of their knowledge.
Ignorance, oh man how true you are....I don't know what you are doing with your rifle but i never saw a melting G36.
And as i read in later comments that isn't a real G36 from the Amry just a replica so i don't think YOU can tell us anything about the G36 using by our Army.
If HK would build such bad weapons the US Military wouldn't use them.
G36C
MP5
and i am sure they will get the MP7 too
JazzJaRa 2 years ago
Sort due to knowledge? Damn right! For someone who has so much experience with the G36 you sure do lack proof...but I digress.
You are ignorant. The SL8 is the civilian version of the G36. The gun will accept G36 bolts, G36 magazines, G36 lower parts, G36 sights. The only real differences are cosmetic.
The US military dumped the XM8 like a hot potato. I wonder why?
Our boys on the ground use the "inferior" Stoner designed direct -mpingement gun. I wonder why HK came out with the HK416? Hmm...
AZRanger 2 years ago
The fact is HK, as an arms company, is not American civilian friendly.
Saying "HK makes the best weapons" is rather ignorant. What other guns do you own/use that can qualify you to make that statement?
I have fired both the G36 and AR-15. I prefer the AR. When one considers that a civilian can maintain his or her weapon, with readily available parts and tools, the clear cut winner is the AR. Hell, I can build 3 AR's for the price of 1 G36. The AR-15 dominates in competition as well.
AZRanger 2 years ago
As i said you seem to be the typical patriotic American.
US is and must be always the best.
Just look at the weapons done by Rheinmetall why the US Army is using the 120mm Gun for their tanks from a GERMAN manyfactur? its melting too eh?
JazzJaRa 2 years ago
And you are the typical elitist Euro. I didn't say U.S. Arms are superior to German Arms in every way.
What you and your ilk fail to grasp is this has nothing to do with an AR being American made. BTW, my side arm of choice for competition/training/self defense is Glock.
I have tried the G36 and by my experience I hated it. Due to:
-Cost
-Upkeep
-Maintenance
-Parts are scarce/expensive
-HK does not provide support to civilians
The fact is your government picks up the tab for your weapon.
AZRanger 2 years ago
My criticism of both HK and its abomination has nothing to do with country of origin. My sidearm of choice (read best) is a Glock 21SF.
I state my preference after extensive research and trial. I have shot both (extensively), have you?
3 realities I have come to:
-The G36 sucks
-HK sucks
-HK fanboys suck
Get over it
I pay to acquire, fix, and maintain my weapons. As a citizen, I am responsible for me and my own. Are you?
Hell, give me an AK (definitely not American) instead of an HK.
AZRanger 2 years ago
However i would say.
M16 sucks already in Vietnam
M4 sucks jammed after dust and water
M60 a joke compared to the MG3
M249 < MG 4
So i can proudly say
G36 rocks!
The G36 isn't a civilian gun! It's a Assault Rifle so why should HK sell those to civilian? just to get some more frenzy in America? Doesn't there every Child has a gun and kills his teachers or just some other civilian?
We have the orginal G36 you just a replica of the civilan version!
JazzJaRa 2 years ago
Try to shoot a REAL G36 and you will love it too.
Get over it that we build better weapons.
And stop with your "Patriotism"
It won't work to convince me!
I could count every weapon i shoot already and there were also a REAL M4 and M16.
So sotp making jokes.
JazzJaRa 2 years ago
HK weapons suck. BTW, you don't build anything. Your airsoft and video game experience means little to me.
You would think that with Germany's past, you guys would learn from history. The SS deserved your trust Ja?
The last time I checked, when citizens were barred from owning firearms, millions of Jews died. The Nazi's weren't so successful when it came to cleaning out the Warsaw ghetto. Maybe that is why Israel has adopted the slogan, "Never Again!" Germans like you have it all wrong.
AZRanger 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
hk is a good company but you cant say that the m16 and m4 sucks. unlike hk guns the m16 and m4 are made by MORE THAN ONE COMPANY. an m16 can be better than a g36 anyday as long as you buy it from a reliable company.
maybusmoonjelly 2 years ago
HK is unfriendly to US civilian shooters.
They, their elitist management, and their elitist policies suck.
Google "HK because you suck and we hate you"
AZRanger 2 years ago
Yeah HK is horrible to American gun owners. Even to law enforcement. I hope they get turned down by every enforcement agency until they get their act together.
DasBeck 2 years ago 4
@DasBeck no offense to HK lovers, but I have checked out the g36 and its a piece of shit. it is an over-engineered, complicated disaster that looks better then it actually is. I would much rather have an M4, hell I would take an AK over the HK. the AK ain't much in terms of bells and whistles but at least you can rest assured it will work and its easy to use.
Alexn1067 1 year ago
@Alexn1067 yeah I'm no HK lover so I totally agree with you. I'll take an AK any day with a smile on my face
DasBeck 1 year ago
@Alexn1067 i fired thousands of rounds with my G36 - without any jams! And I also do not know anybody who had a jam with live firing rounds. And be sure, that we use our weapons in every environment...from european woods to the afghanistan wasteland.
Indeed, the G36 jams a lot with blank ammo...but in my opinion, that cant be an argument for the M4.
stemnot 1 year ago
@Alexn1067 the g36 does always work
TheAaronSpears 1 year ago
Do yourself a favor. Buy an M16, use it and then criticize it. I very much doubt you even use a G36 but I digress. Playing with Airsoft doesn't count either.
As a citizen (not a subject) I am allowed to own semi-automatic military style rifles. Just cuz you bend over and grab your ankles for your govt. doesn't mean I do it.
Every child here does not shoot his teacher. BTW, Robert Steinhaeuser and Tim Kretschmer were both German.
HK SL8 is a semi automatic G36. Both are overpriced plastic.
AZRanger 2 years ago
I don't think the Bundeswehr is using Airsoft weapons so i don't think i use one.
And i don't even play wargames so stop making prejudices!
Also you can only argue with "Germany = Nazis" -.-
Look up to USA what crimes they did and you have the same class. We (Germans) a fighting a War now which YOUR President (Bush) began!!
If the US is so stong they should make it down their on their own.
As i said the US wouldn't buy German weapons if their were crap!
Its senseless to agure with aPatriot
JazzJaRa 2 years ago
The Bundeswehr use the G36. The problem is I doubt you are in the Bundeswehr.
You chide cvilians who own guns. You talk about school mass shootings, yet I say both have been a problem with Germany's past. There have been school shootings in Germany. And there has also been civilian disarmament (the holocaust was a direct result).
You bring up both subjects in our discourse because the fact is you can't argue facts. What do either of these things have to do with the G36 and its shortcomings?
AZRanger 2 years ago
First of all SHUT THE FUCK UP about BUSH, 2nd of all you stupid fucks can't fight a fucking war to save your ass, a few thousand troops who don't do jack shit but piss around a base don't count toward fighting the war. ALso wtf is wrong with being a patriot, Are you mad because we can be proud of our history and you cannot, well I will say that my ancestors do make great weapons, but unfortunately Germany and the rest of europe is deteriorating into a incompetent, broken dream of a eutopic era
majormayhem1 2 years ago 3
-M16: Good enough to defeat the communists in every major skirmish, including the failed Tet Offensive.
-M4: So sucky that HK had to ditch their piece of shit plastic gun to make an "improved M4." I thought the plastic was better?
-M60: like the MG3 was derived from the MG42. You're right it was doomed from the beginning...LOL
-MG4: Another HK copy cat gun. If German's design the best, why not be original?
HK: Because you suck and we hate you!
HK: In a world of compromise, some plagiarize!
AZRanger 2 years ago
I stop here, its senseless. You agure out of patriotism not out of facts.
You MUST say that US weapons are best because you are American.
I don't care which weapon i have to use as long it is doing its job and the G36 is doing it very well!
Also i am not a weapon fetishist like you.
Ans i could swear i shot more Rifles then you did! And i mean REAL Military weapons NOT military "LOOKS LIKE" weapons (replicas of civilian versions)
Even your lovely AR and i wouldn't give my G36A2 for a AR.
JazzJaRa 2 years ago
So as i said you can agure further with your "We are America we are best"
but i stop here because i have better things to do.
JazzJaRa 2 years ago
HK sucks. Their elitist management sucks. Their policies suck.
You are the fool who is a "Patriot," arguing for an arms company that you have no control over. Though truly you aren't even a citizen, your a subject. When your government tells you to bend over, the only thing you ask for is more lube.
There are plenty of US Arms company's that suck. I don't offense or try to defend an inferior product.
Good German Guns: JP Sauer & Son, Mauser
Bad American Guns: Special Weapons, Lorcin, Raven
AZRanger 2 years ago
How am I not arguing facts? M16 was successful in Vietnam. HK did copy the M4. The M60 was based on the MG42. The MG4 is a copy of the M249.
You are a whiny elitist Euro who can't discuss facts.
There are US weapons that suck. Hell that are quite a few.
The best handgun IMHO is Glock.
The problem is you are an HK fan boy and you take issue with someone who thinks negative of their product. Realize that this doesn't affect you.
It doesn't mean Germany sucks. It means HK does.
AZRanger 2 years ago
Hey AZ let me know if u need any help in schooling this euro douche bag, I am so tired of these people its not even funny. The sad thing is he isn't even in the military. In Iraq as long as we had our m4's lubed we were good to go, although we were in abrams, that sand gets everywhere and they still held up pretty well.
HEY JAZZ sprech sie deutch, kussen mein arsche :) mein deutsch ist nicht so gut aber ICH kann verstehen mehr dann Ich kann sprechen.
majormayhem1 2 years ago 3
Thanks man!
I get sick and tired of all the HK fan boys. Equally moronic are the hoplophobes and future weapons fans.
I find that most criticism of the Stoner built system (AR-15/M16/M4) are from internet know-it-all's who have zero experience with it.
AZRanger 2 years ago
How much did you pay for it?
JustinMekdessie 2 years ago
I built it for $3500
AZRanger 2 years ago
which shooting range is that
tannmann7557 2 years ago
Rio Salado Sportsman's Club, Mesa AZ.
AZRanger 2 years ago
german weapons are the best ;P
mortie3D 2 years ago 19
And you are saying this out of personal experience?
Please enlighten me with your vast knowledge of the world's assault rifles.
BTW, quoting mack from Future Weapons does not count as personal experience.
AZRanger 2 years ago