Chrysler Van Update and Diagnosis

[mrdestoryit]

What type of oil did you use in that van's engine? Please reply.

[uxwbill]

@mrdestoryit I don't recall what the Chrysler specified weight was, but we used high quality synthetic oil much of the time with this van. Why the engine broke would probably be revealed by taking apart the top end, yet none of us have done that.

[mrdestoryit]

@uxwbill Yeah but I see in this video that there was a lot of sludge in the engine Im guessing you used mobil1 oil?

[uxwbill]

@mrdestoryit Most of the time, yes. The sludge came as a big surprise, though it looks worse than it really was in this video. We did change the oil regularly...

[torythefanman]

you guys got some cool old cars.

[ahodina9811]

LUV YALL VIDS!!

[ventureelect]

Geez you really seem to like using the words. Keykeeper.

[MrRichierich1990]

wome, they never change the oil. just turn the key and go

[PolyphonicTheory]

Hey there. If you ever get around to repairing the van I have a massive stockpile of 3.3L Parts from a 2000 FlexFuel engine. Pistons, heads, even a brand new crankshaft. Send me a direct message if you are interested.

I'm working on doing an engine swap in a 1996 Plymouth Grand Voyager at the moment.

[pcressma]

Is it just me or does the "Key Keeper" sound like he is missing a few chromosomes in this video?

[wizard101emily]

wut ever happened to it

[uxwbill]

@wizard101emily It's still here, still waiting its turn for repair. Nobody really needs it now, and everything takes money. So it just sits and waits.

[grawey77]

These motors are usually very durably. Looks like a lack of oil changes.

[uxwbill]

@grawey77 We took pretty good care of this van's engine and changed the oil regularly, so I'm sure it wasn't that.

[grawey77]

@uxwbill Just junk the van unless its body and suspension is worth a new or rebuilt engine. You could also just part it out using ebay. Chrysler 3.3 and 3.8L engines usually hold up well like GM's 3.8L.

[uxwbill]

@grawey77 The body isn't too bad (couple of light dents, mainly from door dings) and the suspension is OK. Chrysler put a new interior into this van under their limited warranty, so that has fewer miles on it than the rest of the vehicle. (It's a long story having to do with a major air conditioning problem.)

I think it's worth at least a rebuilt engine, or maybe an engine from a van that was wrecked elsewhere.

[pcdoctor2]

Do you still have this van?

[MrBuickCentury]

This happend to my Grand Voyager last year.. But in my case the little ring of metall did not fell into the oil pan. I parked the car in the garage. Next morning i was going to fill the washer tank up. The car was running and of course with the hood open. And suddenly the little ring popped off and almost cracked the windshield. Glad i didn't get it in my forehead. I waited for a week to get a new ring like that. But its not very hard to fix if you got a new ring. ( Sorry for bad english )

[MrBuickCentury]

Im sorry for all the comments.. My computer is fucked:(

[MrBuickCentury]

This happend to my Grand Voyager last year.. But in my case the little ring of metall did not fell into the oil pan. I parked the car in the garage. Next morning i was going to fill the washer tank up. The car was running and of course with the hood open. And suddenly the little ring popped off and almost cracked the windshield. Glad i didn't get it in my forehead. I waited for a week to get a new ring like that. But its not very hard to fix if you got a new ring. ( Sorry for bad english )

[MrBuickCentury]

This happend to my Grand Voyager last year..But in my case, the ring of metall did not fell into the oil pan. The little ring suddenly came loose when the car stood running in the garage with the hood open..It just popped off and almost cracked the windshield. Glad i didn't get it in my forehead.. I waited a week for a new metall ring. But its not very difficult to fix. :)

[bigtoy63]

So what did happen to this little van? Is it going to have a new engine or did you scrap it? Looks like a nice and tidy car and it seems like it might be worth the effort and money :)

[uxwbill]

It is still around. We are looking at places to get an engine. One of the best deals so far seems to be $795 shipped. But is it too good to be true? That's what we're trying to find out.

[bigtoy63]

@bigtoy63 Well, it seems to be a fair price, is that a brand new engine or a used one... how bad a shape is the engine in and can it be salvaged with new parts, it's a cast iron block so it might if its not to mangeled? Anyways I'll be looking out for the continuin development.. seems in good shape other ways :) By the way, you make really entertaining videos... keep that up will'ya :)

[locoguy2427]

did u evr find out wat was wrong w/ this van?

[uxwbill]

It's right in the video...the #2 piston and piston skirt grenaded. Some chunks are in the oil pan. What a disaster.

[locoguy2427]

@uxwbill ohhh not good :( evr get it repaired?

[criind]

Make it a diesel... Like Dave at Davidsfarm did...

[uxwbill]

All we'd need is a suitable diesel engine. And more machining ability or equipment than I have, probably. So while it's a cool idea, I think I will have to pass on it.

[clutchbelt]

i have never seen a 3.3 with oil sludge

[uxwbill]

@clutchbelt You have now. :-(

I don't know what went wrong here. This van hasn't been absolutely completely and perfectly taken care of, but it hasn't been neglected either.

[THEtechknight]

Welcome to chrystler and thier oil sludge. In case you havent discovered already bill, look at the intrepid 2.7 motors youll understand maybe why your van did what it did. either way, time for a new motor....

[EthanCommins888]

Did you use synthetic oil? When was the last time it was changed?

[uxwbill]

Yes, and it was changed pretty regularly. As I remember, the last change came very late in the summer. It was almost fall.

[EthanCommins888]

Has the engine been shut off when it hasn't been fully warmed up many times?

[uxwbill]

No, this van was nearly always driven on the highway, for at least twenty miles whenever it was driven.

[2000V6]

Bill, its too bad u cant work on cars in ur garage.

[uxwbill]

The garage wouldn't really lend itself to putting a car in there and lifting it up. The roof beams would get in the way...

[HDXFH]

strange how it did that

[HDXFH]

isn't that a GM engine? their 3.8's are the best

[uxwbill]

This is a Chrysler van, with the Chrysler 3.3L V6. However, GM, Ford and Chrysler have all had a V6 engine with 3.8 liters displacement. (None are related other than by virtue of sharing the same displacement.)

Chrysler's 3.8 V6 is very similar to this engine.

[greywolf45]

Dd you ever get the van running, or is it still a work in progress? My mom has a 2000 Plymouth Voyager SE with the same engine. and about 105,789 miles on it.

[uxwbill]

It's still a work in progress. The video you've seen is really not that old--only a matter of days. (It was recorded on Saturday night going into Sunday. Yes we work late!)

The Keykeeper did a lot of the engine work, while I tinkered around in the garage with gluing a wireless router to the ceiling. Where needed, I lent a helping hand and found tools.

[greywolf45]

The 3.3L is a good, strong engine. To have a piston come apart like that is rare. Just hope the engine cylinder was not scored by what was left of that piston.

[Electra72]

is there another part coming after this where you actually turn over the motor?

[uxwbill]

I couldn't figure a good way to turn the motor and keep the camera in position. (Tripod? What's that?) But I did turn it over by hand, and the piston is still attached to its connecting rod.

[PVoyager]

I hope that there is a part 2!. What a shame, it has almost made 200000. Id love to hear this thing run again and not put it down. That is a freaken lot of sludge for Mobil 1! What did you say about the transmission cooler lines? I'm kind of

foggy on what you said there.

[uxwbill]

The transmission cooler lines leaked. And leaked and leaked and leaked and leaked. They stopped leaking when we finally fabricated some much sturdier replacements. It never leaked again after fixing the lines and the seal around the solenoid pack.

I don't how this will play out. Our plan is to start taking the top end of the engine apart to see what's up there. Honestly, I doubt this is a happy ending. This was a pretty serious malfunction that may have done a lot of other damage.

[Hiei2k7]

It can't end well when the Keykeeper says "Alright, Turn it"

[rhblakeman]

Yup I didnt think it sounded like a chain.... fun stuff - been there many times myself.

[Motorfordtoyota]

just go buy the engine out of the floppy cock van at davefarm. thats all you need.

or put a gm 3.8 in it that would be awsome. never seen that happen though. weird well thats chrysler for you i guess.

[uxwbill]

Someone already wrecked that engine by knocking the oil pan off of it. Dave "fixed" the spun bearings in a crude way, and while I don't remember the details, I know Loctite was involved somehow.

You'd have to be dedicated to put a GM 3800 into the van. I imagine lots of fabrication and swearing would be requirements. And I can't say this is something Chrysler engines are famous for--I'd never seen a malfunction so drastic with any other.

[MOTERHEAD69]

he prised the bearings out sanded them down drilled the holes out again and used locktite to put the bolts back in but he only needed it for the farm really

[Ajaces]

Quite interesting.

[itscool1968]

what model and make is that digital battery charger

[uxwbill]

It's a Schumacher Electric SSC-1500A 15/10/2 amp battery charger.

It's an interesting design, built around a switchmode power supply (instead of the heavy transformer and diodes that most other designs use) and a 50 instruction STMicroelectronics microcontroller. This makes it light and it should also be highly efficient.

Not that I took it apart or anything. :-)

[itscool1968]

not you no:)

you and i would have fun iam a computer tech my self build sell service and consult.

[mechanicwarrior20]

shit, looks like you have a lot more to worry about then just a timing chain jumping the cog You probably need a valve job also.

[uxwbill]

We will just have to see what happens. Hopefully another report will be forthcoming...

[MrMoterKid]

Seems very strange how a piston could just break like that.

[mgospeed31]

I am still shocked that this 3.3 failed in that fashion. As well as you maintain your cars, that sludge is also troubling.

[themaritimeman]

Wow, that looks like some serious hell that 3.3 went through. I'm guessing that motor has had it. :(

Kudos to The Keykeeper for playing the lead role in this video!

[mgospeed31]

That is what you call a faceplam moment.

[uxwbill]

The Keykeeper said it very well in this video when he said "oh shit".

[mgospeed31]

@uxwbill I don't know if I ever told you this, but when I am working on cars is when I have the bad habit of stringing curse words together to form complete sentences, so I don't blame him at all.

[uxwbill]

Heh! Yes, I've been there. You've already heard about the invented swear words, IIRC.

I'd have to admit to being *stunned* when the Keykeeper pulled those pieces out of the pan. Today, when the next door neighbor (also into cars) heard about it, he too was stunned.

The only explanation I've been able to come up with is a manufacturing defect. If that's true, though, why did it take nine years and almost 200,000 miles to show up?

[mgospeed31]

Indeed I have! :-)) That is just incredible. Your mother had been complaining about a tick in the top end, right? I don't know if that would have anything to do with how it failed though.

Unless it was overheated at any point, I can't think about what could have compromised the integrity of that piston. If you do wind up tearing that thing apart, it might be worth taking a look at the other pistons and seeing if they are showing signs of having the same type of damage.

[Bluetailvappy]

Kind of like the mystery oil leak I had in my truck. Oil started leaking from around the drain plug nut, 2 months and almost 2500 miles after the last oil change.

Still can't figure that one out.

Regardless, since the 4.3 v6 Vortec's oil pan removal procedure is enough to make a grown man cry, I am still using temporary plugs. Have had zero issues with them.

[naterade21]

i think u could use better lighting just saying tho

[uxwbill]

Next time, we'll leave the sun turned on.

Seriously, these short days are terrible. I hate coming home from work and...oh, it's dark.

[naterade21]

i know how u feel still got the dell if u want it its perfect nothing wrong with it crt monitor come with it aint puttin it on craigslist tho

[uxwbill]

You know, I've been meaning to ask you about that, but I figured it had been too long since I forgot. I'll send a private message soon.

[IHMan1066]

Yep id say thats the end of that motors life....its not normal to have that kind of sludge in the oil pan....especially if you stay on top of your oil like you said. Kind of a mystery. It probably damaged the sleeve/cylinder lining when that piston came apart....sorry for your loss. :(

[jaimehatespapi]

I think this was the Key Keepers biggest speaking role to date. That sucks about both cars. Couldn't you put some new sheet metal for the floorboards for that Reliant? It would be a shame to part it out.

[Beaverinzone25]

@jaimehatespapi i was thinking the same thing about the key keeper!

[mauser8mm192422]

to bad. really wonder what went wrong. i have owned two of these vans with 3.3L motors the first one had 236,000 miles on it and the one im driving right now has 160,000 mile with no problems.

[tpirjunky]

1:10 - excuse you, Keykeeper. lol

[CRXJDM88]

o man that sucks i hope its nothing big coz if its big then i am gusse your gonig to need to put a new engine in it and chrysler makes every things just to tell u ynkno13

[KMScarboy]

lol you need a rimshot at 3:54...

[tgredneck]

dang. when i heard the sound that engine was making when you guys started it up in the other video, I knew it was either a spun bearing or a busted piston skirt. whats the current plan for repairing the van?

[uxwbill]

I don't think we have a plan yet. We have a couple of options--buying a 1996 Ford minivan that has been in storage and belonged to a little old lady, fixing this van and not buying the other van, or not fixing this van at all.

I think a lot will hinge on how torn up the piston is. What a disaster!

[uxwbill]

Ooops. That last sentence should read "how torn up the *cylinder wall* is". Guess I had pistons on the brain or something.

[kjm1983]

I counted the van, Honda and the trusty red rocket.

I finally got to watch the last part of the vid and with that sludge and broken piston, that engine is finished, imo. Wonder if a valve broke the piston or something else?

[uxwbill]

This engine has had some noise in its top end for a while...maybe a lifter? It's been making that noise in the right place, so that the two could be related.

The Red Rocket still runs great and has a very young (total miles driven = 76700) engine and transmission. I'm hanging onto it for a while yet.

Don't know about the Honda. If cleaned, the interior would be in superb condition. It was fun to drive it, and we are short a car now...

[donbehatin]

Wow. That sucks.

At least it didn't fall out of park and roll at a high velocity into the local 500 year old tree like my truck did.

[kjm1983]

I think unfortunately you guys have about 3 cars that might not make it to the final round of eliminations. The question you might ask yourself is do you spend $500-600 on possibly another year of driving pleasure or do you take $500 or so for each one and let them be someone else's headache?

Hmmmmmmmmm.....

[uxwbill]

What's the third one?

[kjm1983]

LOL...you sure have a sharp wit, Bill :-) The keyring of power...you're the designated second-in-command Keykeeper if something happens to him. That's almost as good as 'a direct offering to the Gods of Carburetion"....

[R5alive]

Well at least the 3.3 and 3.8 engines are cheap and plentifull. Buy a cheap parts van with a bad transmission and swap the engines, or swap the transmissions if the new one is better. Last week I saw a 02 Town & Country Grand Caravan AWD in good running and driving condition for a asking price of $600.

[uxwbill]

Our transmission ought to be very good, since we've worked on it a lot to stop cooler line and solenoid pack leakage. This van's body isn't great, the A/C doesn't work any more (broke when it hit a deer), and it has a lot of small fit and finish issues. I don't know what we will be doing yet.

Hard to believe that an '02 van in good running/driving shape could be had for $600. Of course, I'm not sure that minivans hold their value well.

[R5alive]

There was over 150K miles on it. And most minivans get pretty beat up. It was on the kijiji website and minivans are considered disposable where I live. As soon as they need a few repairs or they start getting rusty people just get rid of them for next to nothing. Women don't trust driving their kids around in older vehicles. But tradesmen buy them and throw the seats out. If you ever get up to Ontario to visit davidsfarm or something you could pick up some pretty cheap wheels.

[ynkno13]

Chrysler made the Town and Country, not the Grand Voyager.

[NorthStarOlds]

no, they made the grand voyager and the town and country

[ynkno13]

Oh, I thought they did that when they discontinued Plymouth.

[uxwbill]

Trust me, we've got it right. This *is* a Chrysler Grand Voyager. When Chrysler was discontinuing the Plymouth brand, they phased out leftover models from the Plymouth brand and labeled them as Chrysler brand. I would guess that they did it to use up some of the Plymouth specific parts, such as model nameplates after they'd run out of Plymouth emblems or something.

[jovanvictoria]

damn that a bummer so is it a pistion skirt or a bearing? could not tell good luck man

[uxwbill]

It's a piston skirt as far as we can tell. Whatever is left of the piston appears to still be connected to its connecting rod.

[cbhonda90]

two cars with #2 pistons damaged............

[uxwbill]

Makes you wonder, doesn't it?

[drammensveien1]

your oilpan appear to be full of "asphalt" what type of oil do you use ???????. I planning to use something else. sincerely good luck! (-:

[uxwbill]

The van has had Mobil 1 run it since the first factory change. And it's been changed regularly--except for one time that it went a little further than it should have.

Makes no sense to me.

[drammensveien1]

yes you are completely right that Makes absolutely no sense ?????????????????????