If I Were Your Daughter?

[Siemianowicee]

@Stephen1553

A bit simple.

Maybe better to claim 'thinking' as the fault.

[Genderellaboutique]

I am transsexual. Born male, having surgery to become female. I am not gay, no attraction to men. A common question I am often asked is "don't you think God knew what he was doing when he created you?" My reply is "What about hermaphrodites who are born with both sexes? didn't God know what he was doing when he created them? If someone can be born with both sexes, then why is it not possible to be born in the wrong sex? God created us all unique and has a different plan for us all.

[walgar2]

In the name of God, why is there so much hatred? In the name of God, why is there so much destruction? In the name of God, why are there so many wars? In the name of God, why are there so many deaths? In the name of God, why is there so much pain? In the name of God ... why?

Sincerely ... Walter Garbotz, Ontario, Canada

[alwayspatriotic]

@walgar2 In the name of God, why don't we all follow God's Word?

[MultiSweetJessica]

@alwayspatriotic

Not to worry this - - - - - wont be around forever :D

So keep doing your false beliving your going down with me! Not to hell there is no such thing!

But to eternal sleep <3

[MisterPillow]

Correct me if I'm mistaken but is it not each Christian's one sole responsibility to tell people about Jesus? Yet somehow a random passage from the Old Testament keeps promoting discrimination, tears families apart, and denies a social minority their civil rights in the modern world? What about Love Thy Neighbor? Forgot about that one? If God condemns homosexuals then we will find out when we die, but in the mean allow the condemnation to remain with God, as he is the one to judge, not you guys.

[alwayspatriotic]

@MisterPillow Because we are to judge rightly the word of truth. To discern between right and wrong. John the Baptist was killed because he told the truth. I don't hate homosexuals.  I know homosexuality is a sin, and an abomination to God, however we are also told to love the sinner, and hate the sin. I hate homosexuality, because it is a sin, I do not hate the sinner. I will state openly that homosexuality is wrong, like adultery, stealing, murder, idolatry, etc.

[alwayspatriotic]

@MisterPillow I will also tell people about how to be saved from a life of sin. How to gain eternal life.  It is there available for all.

[skullosordie]

too bad she's a dyke. i'd fuck her.

[whywecantunite]

you need to get on your knees and pray to God for forgiveness from your sins...

[Tripp9]

@thunorrr Read the last chapters of Matthew and Mark. Upon salvation we are all considered "ministers". Read the Gospel again. You'll see where your thinking is flawed. As for correcting our own faults, that impossible without the leading of the Holy Spirit. Without Jesus you cannot know the Spirit nor the Father. Where did you get such foolish notions we are to sit back and do nothing? Jesus us our example and he did no such thing.

[joyfulCaroline]

Tracey, thank you for your podcast. I am not a teenager but I was very Christian at one time. I am a male-to-female transsexual who really love Christ but was shunned by the unconditional love-teaching church I grew up in when I came out as needing to be a girl. I was 32 at the time and haven't been able to go to church in 21 years. Your video tugged at my heart and I hope your message reached Pastor Warren. Thank you again.

[Isabella14233]

people should be allowed to be who they are

[Jiyanamiki]

I am a straight Christian, but I believe in gay rights. The people who don't believe in gay marriages because the bible says they're wrong are just hypocrites because the bible also says that eating shellfish, having your period, and going to the bathroom is wrong.

[timtglf]

@Jiyanamiki That made total sense.....???

[Jiyanamiki]

@timtglf How does it not?

[Tripp9]

@Jiyanamiki Reread the Bible...The Jewish Law, meant to expose your sin, is what says that.

[v01741r31]

@Jiyanamiki

The proper interpretive principle when differentiating between homosexuality and a priestly/dietary law, is to look at the books of Moses in context, and draw conclusions from deductive reasoning. You have to distinguish between civil, dietary, priestly, and moral commands. Clearly an act of murder was not just wrong only in the old covenant, it is truly wrong for all of time because it reflects God's character. Similarly lying is evil, God cannot lie.

[v01741r31]

@Jiyanamiki

The next step is to decide which category homosexuality falls under. In Leviticus, the act is described as an abomination. It goes under the same category as adultery, fornication, pornography, pedophilia, what have you. Abusers of themselves with man kind, etc. Further, go to the new testament, and clearly you find that it is viewed as a moral sin capable of keeping you from heaven, just as other sins do.

[v01741r31]

@Jiyanamiki

The Bible is clear, its wrong. So say people are born biologically 100% irreversibly, indisputably gay, it has nothing to do with culture, psychological factors, upbringing, etc. Would a person born like that, have an excuse to practice their lifestyle? What about people with a terrible temper, is it ok for them to act out on their anger? What about an alcoholic? Clearly, we all are born with problems, but it does not excuse us to act out.

[v01741r31]

@Jiyanamiki

So clearly, according to the Bible its wrong. We either throw out the passages that condemn it, or accept that female + female, or male + male is obviously not a proper fit, emotionally, sexually, psychologically, etc.

That said, its wrong that some Christians fixate on homosexuality obsessively, and neglect to address the problems of adultery, pornography, alcohol and drug abuse, etc. People need to focus on themselves a lot more than other people.

[jenniadriana]

The church and religion are the absolute most harmful forces in this world! A relationship with God and a belief in Christ is NOT religion or a church. It is not rules or lists of what is sin and what isn't. A relationship with God is simply that. He is our father, and our relationship with him is as child and father, not judge, jury, executioner, and political dictator. The people who have turned what they've misinterpreted the Bible into saying is sin, into the be-all, end-all of what is and

[jenniadriana]

is not acceptable as a societal norm. Parents, school teachers, brothers and sisters, friends, aunts, uncles, grandparents, even mental health professionals are creating more havoc and death than any gun, and car accident, and cancer ever could. When you kill a person's spirit, their individuality, their personality because who they are is not "good enough" for what you deem normal in society, you kill the person. There are so many zombies wandering around wondering why they are even alive.

[jenniadriana]

If we could see through these people's hardened exteriors, know their hearts, and let ourselves see their true identities, their authentic personalities, we would have a diverse, booming world, with more beauty and advancements than we could have ever dreamed. It is the oppression from those who refuse to make God's number one rule- his GOLDEN rule, even a thought in their minds- and that is to love one another. Not love one another so long as they live the way you want them to. But simply love!

[jenniadriana]

I hurt so much because I have suffered such ostracism, and I know so many others do as well, and for what? What good reason could they possibly have to deserve such treatment, and from people who are SUPPOSED to love them unconditionally and more deeply and intimately than anyone else in the world? It makes no sense. This entire world makes no sense. I cannot understand why there is so much hate beaming out of the one place that everyone should feel absolute love.. and acceptance.

[DJmichelleLove]

keep the faith tracey. and thanks.

[Jensagirl]

That was a very powerful statement or open letter to Pastor Warren. I as a transwoman will be right there with you. I hope that your dad will find that twinkle in his eyes that he had for you before you announced your sexual preference.

[1982mockingbird1982]

Its up to her father to develop a decent sense of morality. The blame shoudnlt go squarely on the person who's beliefs influenced her father

[forbesfoofighters]

this^

[AteEsixed]

Actually, homosexuality IS natural. It occurs in hundreds of species.

The human race is in no danger of extinction. Not only are we grossly overpopulated, but straight people aren't going to stop reproducing just because gay people exist.

The Bible condemns adultery much more strongly than it does homosexuality, but no one is launching an attack against adulterers. Some zealots seem to have selective morality.

And if there is a God, then it's God who made us each the way we are.

[virulentwestie]

@AteEsixed: hundreds of species eat their progeny. Wow maybe infanticide and cannibalism are also 100% natural and it is ok to do that for humans!

[whirlygirl99]

@virulentwestie did you honestly compare sexual orientation to cannibalism? wow, i guess common sense really isn't that common anymore. and if God didn't want homosexuality in this world, then it wouldn't exist at all, and everyone would be straight. if your fucking bible says that Jesus is supposed to love everyone, certainly that doesn't mean he's excluding over 10 percent of the population.

[linette1995]

@AteEsixed right on. right effin on.

[Tripp9]

You joined a discussion that was started way before you provided input. Your continued replies tells me you ARE curious to know the One True God. He is full of love but know that as much love as He has for you He has as much hatred for the sin that dwells in you. Call it what you will but no matter how you look at, transgender, gay, etc. homosexuality is a sin. The titles are simply Man's attempt to justify it. It doesn't matter what we think. It's what God says. Avoid His wrath today.

[Lordangers]

@Tripp9 Wow thanks trip. You sound just like that dick warren. You know what why should people bother trying to justify their sexuality when you so blindly deny it. I am going to avoid God's wrath by putting up with yours.

[Tripp9]

@Lordangers Good luck with that.  The only way to avoid His wrath is to accept what His Son has done for us, the sinner.

[jjppmm33]

that was an awesome speech. Yeah that guy's a dick for doing that.

[platypusguineapig]

i am catholic and i wouldnt condem you religon those who accept our lord and savior into their life all your sins will be justified in his name

[Tripp9]

To continually sin without repentance is telling God I hear you but don't care. You must read Romans for yourself. It clearly states against your reasoning.

Romans 2:12-13

Romans 6:1-2; 12-23

Take a look and let us know what you get out of it.

I get that through grace we are redeemed. But the evidence of that grace within us is our turning from sin.

The Holy Spirit transforms us upon entering our hearts. A person who knows Jesus cannot continue living in the sin they once knew and like it.

[DurkaDurkaMahn]

The "Holy Spirit" you are referring to is nothing but the hate-fueled ignorance of 2,000 year old civilizations that were before the days of Science, when "truth" was based on superstition and the fooling of the masses.

Congratulations.

[Tripp9]

The more "Science" looks into the complexity of life the more they prove the existence of God.

In fact, look at Laminin

[IntellectualAmy]

I always believe that when people have to create hatred, especially people whom SHOULD be preaching love and tolerance through the medium of religion, it always begs a question. And the question is 'what have you got to hide'? I always feel that those whom shout the loudest tend to hide their own 'immorality'. How many times have we seen Priests convicted of child abuse? How many Church leaders have been with Prostitutes?I hate hypocrasy. I really do.Rick Warren should consider these facts.

[jea740]

@IntellectualAmy Do you love your enemy

or follow any of jesus or spirtual teachings of the masters you can ask these so called religios people

[IntellectualAmy]

@jea740 - I know what's right and decent and I try to be fair and just. Isn't that enough?

[jea740]

@IntellectualAmy Im not attacking you im just saying that the religios leaders just folow the teaching they want to follow or tradition says

[IntellectualAmy]

@jea740 - Hiyas. I never said you were attacking me. But I think if a Pastor's church teaches him to extend their own brand of intolerence or bias, or bigotory, then the church and it's respective religeon is wrong.

[kelleydave1]

I recently read Tracey's book and would recommend it to anyone struggling with their sexuality. It was a quick, great read! Find it at her website :)

[Tripp9]

I was wondering why all the 'related vids' were of transexuals. Now I get it.

You did choose your sexual orientation. God made man and woman to be together.

You've chosen to go against that.

Beware your salvation is in jeopardy. Romans 1:21-32 & 1 Corinthians 6:9-10

Come back to Him. Repent. Those who do will not be cast out.

[katharine000]

If God created us all the way we are and the way 'He' wanted us to be, then he wouldn't have made gays. But he did. It's so much easier to be straight - it's more socially acceptable and many people struggle with the fact that they aren't attracted to the oposite sex but they just aren't and you can't change that. I'm not highly religious but I believe being a good Christian is being kind towards others and treating them as you'd like to be treated. I don't think discrimination is God's word.

[Tripp9]

God does cannot make gays. He made humans who chose to be gay. The excuse of "He made me that way" is for those who are too weak to overcome it so they blame their faults on someone else. Kinda like a "He did it..." things that kids do. You know?

1 Corinthian 6:9

1 Timothy 1: 8-10

Romans 6:23

[katharine000]

No, I don't know, sorry. Do you have any university education in gender socialization? Open your mind and stop hating on other people, it's fucking weak as shit. Anyways, it's not even your business. I'm straight and content with that, if someone is gay, cool that's them not me and it's not something I'm going to lose sleep over.

[Tripp9]

"Gender Socialization" sounds to me to be something founded upon Man's wisdom and not God's. Look around you and determine where Man's wisdom has gotten us. I have opened my mind and determined that if Man has any sort of smarts the problems of the world could be solved. But they aren't. Because of our sin we are where we are.

James 3:17

Revelation 20:14

Romans 10:9

You lost the argument with your accusations and cursing. There is no authority within it either.

Look into the Roman Road

[itsGagaBitch]

phah if people the same sex turn you on and the opp'osite doesnt....then its rly not your fault! you have no idea about being diffrent so DONT JUDGE!

[Tripp9]

Genesis 1:27

Deuteronomy 32:4

Habakkuk 1:13

Romans 6:23a

1 Corinthians 6:9

Revelation 13:14

Romans 6:23b

Take a moment to read these in the order they are in.

It does not matter what you believe concerning your vision of God. It matters what His word says.

Realize one more thing. In Heaven, the last thing you will hear before being cast out is the thunderous roar of those in His grace applauding Him for removing evil from such a perfect place. This includes relatives and friends.

[jjppmm33]

dubass

[jea740]

@Tripp9 O ok so it those text say hate gays?

Jesus tought people to kill every 1 who is does evil.

[Tripp9]

No, Allah and Muhammad teach to kill everyone who is evil.

Jesus teaches us to turn from our wicked ways and to help in that process we are to not associate with fornicators, idolaters, and such. To attempt a turning away from sin and having it there amongst influential friends will keep you from true repentance.

Read 1 Corinthians 5:7-13. All of chapter 5 really but pay attention to 13 as well. There is nothing about killing in there.

If Jesus says to kill then show me.

[greenlee7smythe]

if u say we "Choose" to be gay, then your telling us we can make ourselves get turned on by anything??? i dont know about you, but i can't look at a rock and force myself to get turned on by it! u cannot help what turns u on and whom you fall in love with. but to tell gays they should live a lie or live unhappy is pure bullshit. i belive in god....but not "YOUR" god. u wanna know what the reality is? your using the lord as a scapegoat for your own prejudices. plain and simple.

[Tripp9]

How about this? Homosexuality is unnatural. It does not guarantee the future of a species. Therefore, you are condemning the human race to extinction by promoting such an act. Not today, not tomorrow, but homosexuality does nothing for the propagation of mankind.

God isn't my scapegoat when I quote what He tells us through His words. Read them and you will be convicted of how wrong homosexuality is.

[greenlee7smythe]

okay U CANT CHOOSE WHO U FALL IN LOVE WITH OR ATTRACTED TO. AGAIN IF YOU CAN YOUR A FREAK. AND YEAH I BELIEVE THAT IF EVERY MAN AND WOMAN WERE STRAIGHT THEN THE WORLD WOULD BE OVERPOPULATED. I REFUSE TO LIVE A LIE OR UNHAPPY SIMPLY TO PLEASE "HIM" OR YOU. I LOVE MEN AND IM HAPPY WITH MY MAN. THAT SHOULD BE ENOUGH AND PRACTICE WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS, "THOU SHALL NOT JUDGE!"

ASSHOLE

[greenlee7smythe]

and if you have a rebuttal, i dont wanna hear any suggestion crap about what passage to read!!!! and for your fyi, god or jesus didnt write the bible, his deciples did. and i doubt the lord stood over their shoulder and said "yep write that...thats good" but that thought is too unimaginable to think about cause it means there is a possibility that what you were taught in religion growing up, is wrong. but to each their own.

[Tripp9]

The Lord did inspire man to write His words. If man is capable of such an intertwined book of law, lesson, and love then why in the time that we've been here on earth, even now in the modern times, haven't we written another as complex and relative as the Bible?

Because there is no need. God has already provided a way to know Him. Those who come to Him He will not cast out. You can trust in Christ. God has provided a savior and if you do not come to Him the fault will be yours.

[greenlee7smythe]

and one last thing. i detest people like you, because u go around preaching your religion when you have no right to. but with people like you, you know what your problem REALLY is???? YOU CAN'T STAND ANYONE WHO ISN'T JUST LIKE YOU! have a nice life. buh-bye.

[Tripp9]

Why do you hate God? Send me a personal message if you have too. I preach this message because it needs to be heard. We, as true Christians, that adhere to God's doctrine, not just go to church on Sunday, are commanded to be ambassadors of Christ. To be ambassadors mean we are to represent Christ to the fullest. Out of love for you, not bigoted hate, do I tell you what is against God's law. I have fulfilled my obligation. What you do now, after being shown what He says, is up to you.

[greenlee7smythe]

u cant change being gay. so there is nothing up to me to do. i cant change it. and i refuse to stay celibate to make biggots like you happy. i have the right to love, have sex, kiss, marry like u. just cause its with the same sex doesnt mean shit. and id advise u not to talk to me anymore.....im not a religious person so therefore my beliefs are not yours. many religions condradict each other and you have no right to tell anyone that your religion is "right" its all bull shit.

[Tripp9]

You are right in stating there is nothing you can do to change it. But there is one who can change it...the Holy Spirit. The more you read God's word the more you become convicted of how wretched we, as sinners, are.

Call out to God. Ask Him to convict you of your sins so you will know where you stand.

The reason religions contradict is because the Devil has made numerous counterfeit deities in an attempt to distract man from the Creator. How else would he pull someone from the narrow way?

[greenlee7smythe]

god did/does exsist and loves and excepts all...period. those who kill, rape, molest kids, hurt animals, etc are to be condemned. now go away

[Tripp9]

What is it you suppose keeps us from going wild across the earth? What keeps us from killing whomever, taking whatever, simply doing whatever? A conscience? God? What society accepts as good/evil? The grace of God is what contains us. He does love and He accepts all through His son Jesus Christ. You, me, we are too wretched, wicked, and are so horrible we deserve hell. Nothing more. But He has given us a way to turn from our sins- the Holy Spirit, His Word, His Son. Turn from sin today.

[greenlee7smythe]

i already told you this once and im not going to tell you again....FUCK OFF! LEAVE ME THE FUCK ALONE. WORSHIP YOUR "GOD" AND DIE IM AN ADULT AND WILL DO AS I PLEASE. AND JUST FOR YOUR FYI. IM TRANSGENDER. NOT GAY. DUMBASS.

[Lordangers]

@Tripp9 Prove God exists. I aint gay but it still fucks me off to listen to you abuse peoples decissions. They arnt hurting anyone are they? If I told you you could only watch certain tV programmes because I liked them would you complain? Or may be your evil because your dont agree with what I think. May be you should stop watching the news because allows people to humiliate those who have done bad instead of asking for God to forgive

[Tripp9]

@Lordangers God exist. Look around. As far as decisions imagine this...you're on an island, there is only so much fresh water yet the one dummy is your group won't stop drinking it. Do you stop him from drinking all of the water? Or do you allow him to continue down a path that will bring misery upon everyone there on the island? Simply warning someone about how their actions will bring condemnation is not hating them. In fact, it is an example of absolute love.

[Lordangers]

@Tripp9 Absolute love? How about I insult your way of living?! Also that island excuse is BS. If he was drinking salt water then we know for a fact that that will harm him. Yet there is no proof that being gay will hurt you in respect to your relationship with God. There is more evidence contradicting it. Infact most people here see it as saving your soul by trying to stop you from interfering with other people's private life and what desicions they make as an adult.

[Tripp9]

@Lordangers You're going to need to show me how being gay improves your relationship with God. We are all sinners. No doubt about that. But our greatest commission, as Christians, is to go out into the world so that they may hear the Word. Faith comes by hearing. The fact that it makes people uncomfortable shows you the need for it. That feeling is sin and it's wretchedness affecting you. No one can make it to heaven on their own. Submitting to Jesus through faith is the only way.

[Lordangers]

@Tripp9 Er how many gays here are uncomfortable about their faith? And I understand there may be social issues but try to ignore them for a sec and pretend that you are treated like anyone else. Would you still feel uncomfortable or would you accept it?

Being gay doesnt take you away from god same as being straight wouldnt. Neither take you closer, you should know only love can do that.

[thunorrr]

@Tripp9 Where in the bible does it indicate that we must go out into the world so that they may hear the word? Because I was under the impression that this was the duty of ministers. It is not our duty as Christians to convert, instruct or delineate the shortcomings of others, but to improve our own connection with our CHOSEN deity and correct our own faults. Live life with honor and do what is right, there is no need for this argument to take place.

[jdweekley]

@Tripp9 God exist (sic). Look around.

Huh? Just because YOU don't understand your environment is not proof that there is a god. I look around and I see natural phenomena, which requires no supernatural explanation. And no, I won't prove you wrong, because it's impossible to prove the non-existence of something! I believe that the prophet Russell was divinely inspired and his word is that there is a teapot in orbit around Uranus. Go ahead, prove the prophet wrong!

[Tripp9]

@jdweekley

ifa. hawaii. edu / ~barnes/ast110_06/gphah/uranus­.jpg

[jdweekley]

@Tripp9 Oookay. My teapot is orbiting Uranus at 6.81 km/s and it's the size of a normal teapot, so it's not going to show up in a photo from a "Survey of Astronomy Course" (as comforting as that photo is).

But your post nicely illustrates the simplicity of thought of the 'faithful'. You believe a single picture of dubious origin can prove or disprove an article of faith. It's similar to faith in a god because a collection of stories claims there is a god, despite a conspicuous lack of evidence.

[Tripp9]

@jdweekley Faith is what saves us. Not good works. Repentance of sin is what establishes a fellowship with God. Not acting proud. If you pray for God to show you, sit back and listen, He'll do so in His own time. But when He does it might not be something spectacular like a miracle but He will let you know.

Simply try a few prayers...or are you afraid that teapot of yours will come crashing down and prove everything you believe is wrong?

[jdweekley]

@Tripp9 I'm astounded at your simplicity. I don't REALLY believe in a teapot around Uranus, as fun as that sounds to me. I was using Russell's Teapot to illustrate how futile it is to try to argue with someone about a matter of faith.

I find it laughable that you think I'd pray to a god I so obviously don't believe in. I might as well pray to Zeus, Mithros or Deva leader and Supreme Ruler of the Vedic Gods. I believe in them as much as I believe in what ever 'god' you hear in your head.

[Tripp9]

@jdweekley God made us all, therefore, His fingerprint is instilled into everyone of us. Everyone believes in God. There isn't a person out there who doesn't. The question is what did God do to you that made you so mad you try every day to push Him away?

Did you get in trouble at church when you were a kid and decided "I'll show them..."

[jdweekley]

@Tripp9 I do not believe in god or gods or spirits or angels of any kind, so you are patently wrong. Jesus is a comforting myth. The Bible is a collection of fairy tales and the pondernations long-dead jews and ancient Europeans. No amount of laughable, magical thinking on your part will change that fact. I am an atheist.

But, if by chance, god or jesus or the blessed virgin mary or the FSM should appear before me, I will humbly eat my words. I seriously doubt that's going to happen.

[Tripp9]

@jdweekley It's a good thing God doesn't believe in Atheists isn't it? Also, if you see Jesus it may be because you are at the Throne Judgment. By then it'll be too late.

Don't let that happen. Acknowledge your sins before God and ask for forgiveness. Repent. It will only grow from there because you are establishing a fellowship with Him.

[jdweekley]

@Tripp9 I do not believe there is an afterlife. When you're dead, that's it. Same as a dog, a flower, a fish...dead is dead. So, why in the hell would I worry about some mythical Throne of Judgement. Oooooh, I'm so scared!

Even though, it's been really fun exploring your moronic lack of logic, I'm going to leave this poor message board alone now. Thank you for so thoroughly proving my point and my apologies for seeming rude, but you are a singularly spectacular idiot.

[Tripp9]

@jdweekley I'd rather be a spectacular idiot than to be voluntarily blind to all that is around me.

Atheist are going to get it worse. You see, they attribute the good in their life to themselves because "God does not exist" but what they don't realize is that all good is from God.

What does that mean? You are blatantly stealing His glory and for that your punishment will be like no other you have every received.

It doesn't matter what you believe. What matters is what the God says.

[jdweekley]

@Tripp9 Since I do not believe in god, I cannot think he did anything to me. I realized a LONG time ago that what was being taught in church was nonsense and not worth my attention. Sure, there's good to be learned there, but you can learn just as much from Shakespeare, or Kant, or Euripides, or Kurasawa. I don't need some 'celibate' priest to tell me what to think. Seriously, dude, you have really drunk the Koolaid, err, I mean Blood of Christ.

[Tripp9]

@jdweekley There's your mistake...the Catholic Church is a man made institution considering it "married" the state of Rome for protection. Like every marriage the partners acquire attributes from one another meaning it was infiltrated by pagan beliefs and no longer is about Jesus.

[jdweekley]

@Tripp9 Go ahead, commit murder - kill an adulterer. The bible says it's OK-Dokey. And even if it's not, just do it anyway. Stone a child. Steal from your neighbor. Own a slave. Beat your wife.

And what isn't specifically condoned in your bible, well, your god will forgive it ALL. Just be 'born-again'. Get out of jail, free. Go forth and sin some more.

No, thanks. I feel lucky just to be born once and I'm not about to waste my life thinking there's a better one after I am dead.

[Tripp9]

@jdweekley yeah...you don't know do you. God established law to maintain order in a lawless world. Besides, what you're quoting is law set aside for the Jews of that era.

Jesus released us from those obligations.

You really don't know how bound you really are do you?

[jdweekley]

@Tripp9 So, people who have never heard of Jesus Christ have no self control? They don't know right from wrong? They indiscriminately steal, rape and murder?

As a point of fact, we do NOT get our morality from religion. We get religion from our morality. And using a two thousand year old interpretation of morality is what is confounding you. If you wish to read the bible as a child would, then you are misunderstanding its purpose.

[Tripp9]

@jdweekley God's grace is what contains the sin within us.

Take a look at the brutalities of regimes man built that removed God and see how horrible they were to one another. See how they tortured one another in the name of "revolution". You will understand that when God and His expectations are removed you are left with heathens running about promoting "self" over "others".

I'll pray for you. The next event that causes you to pause and rethink life may be because of this moment.

[dbrzdejmasakr]

Fuck I hate religion. If it never existed the world would be a much better place.

[justanutadude]

Beautifully said! Horribly sad that your father should choose the church over the love of and for his daughter. That is the ugliness of religion. Live your life and just be the person you are, they will know the truth eventually and will say "we're sorry" or maybe not. It took them 400 to apologize to Galileo!

Good luck to you Tracy, I admire you and feel pity for your father.

[palobambu]

thanks a lot for this Tracey, this is for all the people that are fighting with the same kind of problem, just like me! thank you again, God bless you Tracey.

[fighterNut66]

For too long Christians and Muslims have preached a message of hate towards those who are different. Their absolutism is outdated and frankly ignorant based on what we are learning from Genetics. The middle ages people were tortured and killed when the suggested the Earth was not the center of the Universe. We look back and wonder how foolish the Church were. The fact is the Church has not changed, and is irrelevant and not fit for purpose in this modern age. Be true to yourself. Peace!

[Lermakerma17]

Great comment, couldn't agree more with you.

[tjaysone]

Great job Tracy, I love you for who you are. The organized religion is toxic to all. Fortunately, I was educated out of that long ago.

SusanJ

[TGurlwannabe]

The Unitarian-Universalist church welcomes gay, lesbian and transgender people, but each congregation is allowed to be different. It is not considered a Christian church any longer, despite respecting much of the Bible and Jesus. You might want to check it out.

[fdzwes]

Tracy, If you're frustrated with R. Warren I can't imagine how you'd feel about your Muslim pastor's response, or Buddist, or Hindu, or Eastern Orthodox, etc, etc. None of these ancient traditions affirm homosexuality.

Can't you say, "Rick Warren, maybe you're right about me. I have no other religion that accepts me like this. Understand I'm being taught by my life decisions as we all are. And I'm learning. Pray for me through this time." Humility works in all faith systems. :)

[MsAlexis456]

Google "Tracey G. Zoeller and The Pastor's Daughter"... She wrote a really helpful young adult novel!

[Vegannibal]

aww that made me want to cry. It WASN'T your choice. Science is gradually disproving that. Why would anyone choose to have their families disown them? There is nothing wrong with being gay, I hope your family sees that in time and don't waste the rest of their lives without being close to their little girl.

[TechnoHamster]

You'd be welcome in my church, (United Church of Canada).

♥ ♥ ♥

[itzyourcrayons]

awe, that's so nice : )

can i come too!

[JGTacoma]

Not only is Warren hateful toward homosexuals, he preaches, in his Saddleback Church, that Christian women are not justified in leaving and divorcing their husbands because of physical abuse. Once more we see the perversion of the teachings of Jesus, who, though I do not believe he was divine, taught gentleness, compassion, and non-judgmental charity toward other human beings.

I have never heard or read of an agnostic or atheist burning anyone at the stake.

[pianohbc]

The methods may differ but atheists cause millions to be murdered in the regiemes of communism, and in the policies and laws which allow abortion and genocide. A true believer would never murder but would stand on the word of God as truth even if it cost them their own life

[BardCoennius]

Interesting that virtually ALL the pedophiles I've heard about are married, heterosexual (or "celibate" as in RC priests) Christian males.

One wonders how many little boys Pastor Warren has buggered.

[Bowerlamp]

Thank you for sharing your story with us. It makes me so angry that homosexuals are treated in this way. Have we learned nothing from the civil rights movement? I'm no expert on scripture, but when I truly listen to the Holy Spirit/God/conscience/whatever­-you-want-to-call it, I know without question that denying a group of people their natural rights because they are different is wrong.

[mirrorlessmusic]

That website is lying through it's teeth. I looked up every scripture on it's home page and they were all twisted! Jesus never affirmed a gay couple, nor did he say some were born gay (eunuch does not mean gay).  The Ruth and Naomi reference is way off too. But I still am not angry....I love people and want them to know that God will forgive them if they turn from homosexual ways...as well as other sinful things. Jesus makes all things new!!!

[JanewaysGirl]

Gee I never would have guess your reaction. /sarcasm. I guess we've come full circle then. That website offers reference proof. You've got...? So in the end we sit here and tell each other "you're wrong". End of discussion.

[mirrorlessmusic]

I care about you. Here is a simple verse. "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals" 1 Tim 1:9-10  But there is hope in Jesus...He is stretching out His hand to you :)

[JanewaysGirl]

Why don't we just save everyone some time and you just go see the web page "would jesus discriminate org" K? It's pointless to post 500 characters at a time.

[mirrorlessmusic]

PLEASE READ THIS (if you read nothing else)--> Jesus Christ loves everyone who struggles with their particular sin. (homosexuality, lying, womanizing, pre-marital sex, pride) His love is so great. But if we desire to be in God's Kingdom we have to submit to His ways. If you don't want to live in God's Kingdom of love, peace, joy, hope, and eternal life...don't make Jesus your Lord. If you do and (you won't regret it)....you must turn away from sin...and put all of your trust in JESUS.

[JanewaysGirl]

Being homosexual is not a sin. You either cannot or will not offer proof to your claim therefore I must conclude that your rendering of Scripture is either sloppy or simply false. Thanks for the chat. I hope you find the path.

[deathoftheendless]

Fuck off Jesus freak and keep your "god" away from me.

GAY PRIDE!!!

[JanewaysGirl]

You've said that already. Yet again you offer no example or prof of your claim. I understand very well the differences but I have doubts that you do. Lindsey Lohan?? How old are you?

[mirrorlessmusic]

am not angry at all at people's lack of knowledge or understanding as to what the Bible says about Homosexuality.

Also I am not angry that people don't understand the difference between Old Testament Laws and New Testament teachings. Both the OT and NT condemn homosexual behavior. Jesus says...regardless of how we think we were "BORN" we must be BORN AGAIN (John 3:3) to see God's Kingdom. Then once we're reborn we are called to live according to God's word.

[mirrorlessmusic]

I am unconcerned with debates. But I am concerned with the salvation of people who have chosen to live gay or bi-sexual lifestyles. Lindsay Lohan was not born a homosexual any more than pinocchio was born a liar. They both chose to act out their....desires to disobey the loving God who created them. Oh, if we only knew the love of God we would stop making up excuses to live how we want and we would run into His trustworthy arms. You may not trust Christians...but you can trust JESUS.

[mirrorlessmusic]

replace Pinocchio with any LIAR that you know if that helps.

[JanewaysGirl]

Again Mirror, I ask you to prove your claim. You may be unconcerned with debates yet you continue to throw out unsubstantiated claims. Shut up or put up and stop Bible bashing.

[JanewaysGirl]

There was a time when most Christians believed slavery was the will of God. There was a time when most Christians believed women should not be allowed to vote. There was a time when most Christians believed that interracial marriage was wrong. Each position was elaborately supported with biblical arguments -- and each position, we can now clearly see, was dead wrong. These are issues of cultural prejudice as is YOUR argument.

[JanewaysGirl]

You confidently assert that God did not create homosexual people "that way." This is important because they realize if God did create gays "that way," rejecting them would be tantamount to rejecting Gods work in creation. Some Christians are fond of saying, "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve!" To bolster their position, they often cite Jesus words in Matthew 19:4-5.

[JanewaysGirl]

For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by others, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let anyone accept this who can. In the ancient world, including ancient Jewish culture (as reflected in the Talmud), natural or born eunuchs were not associated with missing testicles.

[JanewaysGirl]

Rather, they were associated with stereotypically effeminate characteristics and behavior (just like modern gay men), and were thought by Rabbi Eliezer to be subject to cure (just like modern gays). Unlike Rabbi Eliezer, Jesus feels no need to cure these born eunuchs. He speaks no words of condemnation. Rather he lists people born gay alongside another honored class (eunuchs for the kingdom), and accepts them as a natural part of Gods creation order. And that's only ONE example.

[JanewaysGirl]

Do some homework before you speak. And don't try to twist Scripture and language to your view. It would be historically inaccurate to picture eunuchs as a bunch of straight men who were castrated. There are MANY historical references to so-called natural or born eunuchs. Rabbi Eliezer refers to eunuchs by nature. He asserts that natural eunuchs can be cured, a statement that would make no sense if he were talking about men who had physical genital defects.

[mirrorlessmusic]

I am not angry at all at people's lack of knowledge or understanding as to what the Bible says about Homosexuality.

Also I am not angry that people don't understand the difference between Old Testament Laws and New Testament teachings. Both the OT and NT condemn homosexual behavior. Jesus says...regardless of how we think we were "BORN" we must be BORN AGAIN (John 3:3) to see God's Kingdom. Then once we're reborn we are called to live according to God's word.

[mirrorlessmusic]

I pray that she will see the love of Jesus on the cross...and turn to the truth of the Bible. Homosexuality is displeasing to God and people who don't turn away from it will end up eternally seperated from God in hell. But Christians we must show them the love of Jesus and his truth so that they will turn away from their rebellion and turn to the compassionate Savior who died on the cross to set them free!!!! I don't want anyone to go to Hell.

[badpappy]

That's not true. That's your interpretation of scriptures that were written in ancient languages in the context of those times. What did Jesus say about it in the gospels? He says a lot about adultery and divorce.

Enjoy your shrimp cocktail while you swim with people of the opposite sex wearing mixed fibers in your clothes. Then go have yourself executed for those crimes against the "Holiness Code."

[JanewaysGirl]

Prove it. I can disprove it. I'll even use the KJV. Name the time and place. You are repeating the sin of Sodom with your attitude. There are 5 distinct Scriptures that affirm gay people and their relationships. Jesus Himself said that some are born gay.

[mirrorlessmusic]

I promise you that following Jesus and living according to the Bible is so much greater (and will be even much, much greater) than any lifestyle you decide to live. I know tons of people who lived full-out gay who have found healing, love, peace, and salvation in JESUS CHRIST. They've turned from not only homosexual ways but also from prostitution, womanizing, orgies, etc. I know people who were born LIARS...and yet when they were Born Again in Christ's love...they found healing.

[THEREIZNOGOD]

choice or nature: homosexuality is about as terrible and questionable as pink sweaters. there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. what's wrong is the fact that christians are so holy on gay marriage but they never protest murder, divorce, rape, wife beating, or child molestation... or working on the sabbath-which we all know really upsets god

[endbigotry]

I hope Rick Warren and all the others who are causing so much harm to their young congregants will listen carefully to your words: spiritual violence. They are on the wrong side of history.

[BradNYC]

Thank you for making this very moving, sincere video. Everyone should see it.

[ALOVEBALLAD]

Tracey thank you for your heartfelt letter to Pastor Warren. Know that your salvation is not in question because Jesus died to redeem everyone no matter their sexual preference. Since he lives in your heart he blood has cleansed you from all unrighteousness as it has for all believers. You are his daughter and he will never leave you nor forsake you! I am a same gender loving male but I am first and foremost a redeemed child of God and in his eyes I have been made the righteousness of Christ.

[jinglefield]

Thanks for your story, bless you and I hope your father will have a change of heart and mind.

[lynteddy97]

Thank you so much for your heartfelt message. Your book, The Pastor's Daughter, was a great read. I wish it was written 8 years earlier for my parents to have read when I came out.

[Janis22h]

Thank you for sharing your heart. Rev. Warren, please watch this video and end your campaign of religious-based bigotry.

[Edwin572]

Wonderful story Tracey. It's sad when people who call themselves Christians are so blind to what the Bible says and instead see it through the eyes of traditions which are so often wrong.I used to be one of them but God opened up my eyes to the truth and I'm so glad he did. I hope that what you have to say has a positive effect on Rick Warren to get him going in the right direction. With man this seems impossible but WITH GOD ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE.

[billk700]

So straightforward and heartfelt.

Pastor Warren literally doesn't know what he's talking about. He needs feedback.

Thank you so much doing this, Ms. Zoeller.

[NUTRIAMAN2441]

thank you for posting this Tracy. It's very moving, very wise and hopefully will open minds. It's sad that we continue to have to communicate this message to the narrow-minded.

[Gary19Milton52]

Tracey- Thank you for speaking in such a moving and personal way. Thousands of people have similar stories. I come from a Pentecostal background. Personally, I don't care if someone believes I'm not going to make it to heaven. That is their right just as they may may believe Muslims or Jews are not going to make it. What is wrong is when a minister equates gay marriage to incest, pedophilia or equates being gay to having AIDS. Ministers should not mislead people. Gary Palmer

[RodneyLee1960]

Thanks for doing this, Tracy. I am moved by your honesty and courage. I stand with you in my own experiences as a gay man, and as a Christian.

[aideenj]

This is great.

Seriously, I'm so sick of the institutional Church and its failure to make any progress on this issue. I hear things like that and think 'wouldn't the world be better if we were all atheists?', and then I snap out of it, but it's still a stumbling block to my faith.