Someone has been drinking a bit too much of Keynes koolaid. Hartmann is an economic illiterate and Friedman would destroy him if he were alive today. Thom, a PHD in Homeopathy doesn't mean you understand economics!
@bonfirejovi Freedman is the reaon that millions of US jobs are in China. Hartman would stomp Freedman in a debate. Paul Krugman would as well.
You Cons have been misrepresenting Keynes for decades crying about a weak dollar and Fiat currency when Keynes was responable for much of the provisions of Bretton Woods. What Liberal got rid of that? Ohh thats right, it was Nixon that dismantled Bretton Woods.
@MsZeitgeist85 - If you honestly think that Thom Hartmann could outdebate Milton Friedman then you are out of your mind. If you honestly think that Paul Krugman could outdebate Milton Friedman then you are out of your mind.
@jakeyw11 They could. Look at all the things Friedman was wrong on. I don't know why this guy is such a huge figure among the right today when he as such a bad reconrd as an economist.
@MsZeitgeist85 I'm curious to know what Milton Friedman was "wrong" about. We haven't even come close to freeing up the economy to the levels that Milton Friedman had advocated.
@jakeyw11 Lets see. Monetarism failed in the UK and Chile was almost destroyed by his privatization. He was predicting during the BAM Crisis of 1982 that we would have mass hyperinflation and it never happened. His Permenant Income theory has been discredited. He was wrong on health care although there was some truth to what he said about the AMA.
@MsZeitgeist85 - I'm not sure a fiscal policy can "fail" when it isn't properly adopted. Unless you're saying that central banks limited the growth of the money supply to a fixed amount and then the governmental spending was held in check. Chile's economy faired far better than many other economies of its region and Friedman's ideas were hardly totally adopted. The left is constantly being lied to about Milton Friedman by people like Naomi Klien and Thom Hartmann.
@jakeyw11 Part 2 He also privatized 212 state industrys and what happened? By 1982 poverty doubled and unemployment was 22% and things were so bad people were to desperate to fear bullets and they rioted over this. In that year Pinochet fired Friedman's Chicago School advisors and restored union rights and the minimum wage. So much for the Miracle of Chile. It wasn't untill he 90s that Chile became what it is today and this shows it was John Maynard Kenes not Friedman who saved Chile.
@jakeyw11 PART 1 People say that about Klien because she is a historian not an economist but what she said about Chile was right. The so called miracle of Chile was a fairy tale. In 73 when Pinochet took power by force unemployment was 4.3% and poverty was 20% when Pinochet braught in Friedman's team of advisors from Chicago and he privatized the national bank, the resources. He destroyed unions collective barganing rights, lowered taxes on industrys, slashed public workers, privatized pentions.
@jakeyw11 Another thing to note is that one of the reasons Friedman had clout on this was because Monetarism was an effective way to fight inflation but by the late 70s Monetarism was obsolete. Look what happened when Thatcher tried it in the UK. Manufacturing went down. Uneployment went through the roof and in 1986 The Bank of England was forced to abandon Monetarism.
See Health Care wasnt' the only thing Friedman was wrong on.
@MsZeitgeist85 FYI, Friedman's influence can still be seen today. Just look at the way the US addressed the financial contraction that should have occurred after the housing bubble started to burst. The Fed infused cash into the system to prevent bank failures. People claim banks are sitting on federal money... that isn't true at all. The Fed sent money to the banks to hedge against bank failures and bank runs that contributed to the great depression.
@jakeyw11 Oh you mean the bubble that Friedman's student Greenspan said didn't exist. And no the banks is sitting on billions there were mergers and the fed gave them money to pour liquidity into smaller banks and they took that money and gave themselves bonuses and not one banker is in jail for this.
I still stand by what I said before. Friedman wasn't even a good debater he was a TV personality thats why the old fallacys of Friedman's Permenant Income theory are still around today.
@MsZeitgeist85 It is such an absurd argument to say that Friedman wasn't a good debater... Watch the 2nd half of any of the PBS "Free to Choose" 1980 series and just about anyone can see that Friedman is able to make extremely intelligent and convincing arguments advocating his side of the issue at hand. Hartmann vs Friedman would be laughable most people that keep Tom on topic beat him in debates and Friedman vs Krugman would be a laugher too.
@jakeyw11 Styles make fights and debates. Friedman is good but he doesnt match up well with Hartmann. Friedman uses too many defensive strawman arguments and Hartmann eats that stuff up.
@MsZeitgeist85 I've seen Krugman debate universal health care before and Michael Cannon made him look absolutely foolish. I doubt that even Krugman would want to debate Friedman.
@jakeyw11 Michael Cannon is still selling our failed health care model of for profit health insurance that has failed everywhere it has been tried. THere is no such thing as a "Free Market" solution for health care and there never will be.
@jakeyw11 Why do you think Friedman has any credibility in this? He was thourally discredited after the BAM crisis and his experement in Chile went down in flames.
Thom Hartman is mentally retarded.
TimeWarp66 1 year ago
Someone has been drinking a bit too much of Keynes koolaid. Hartmann is an economic illiterate and Friedman would destroy him if he were alive today. Thom, a PHD in Homeopathy doesn't mean you understand economics!
bonfirejovi 1 year ago
@bonfirejovi Freedman is the reaon that millions of US jobs are in China. Hartman would stomp Freedman in a debate. Paul Krugman would as well.
You Cons have been misrepresenting Keynes for decades crying about a weak dollar and Fiat currency when Keynes was responable for much of the provisions of Bretton Woods. What Liberal got rid of that? Ohh thats right, it was Nixon that dismantled Bretton Woods.
MsZeitgeist85 1 year ago
@MsZeitgeist85 - If you honestly think that Thom Hartmann could outdebate Milton Friedman then you are out of your mind. If you honestly think that Paul Krugman could outdebate Milton Friedman then you are out of your mind.
jakeyw11 10 months ago
@jakeyw11 They could. Look at all the things Friedman was wrong on. I don't know why this guy is such a huge figure among the right today when he as such a bad reconrd as an economist.
MsZeitgeist85 10 months ago
@MsZeitgeist85 I'm curious to know what Milton Friedman was "wrong" about. We haven't even come close to freeing up the economy to the levels that Milton Friedman had advocated.
jakeyw11 10 months ago
@jakeyw11 Lets see. Monetarism failed in the UK and Chile was almost destroyed by his privatization. He was predicting during the BAM Crisis of 1982 that we would have mass hyperinflation and it never happened. His Permenant Income theory has been discredited. He was wrong on health care although there was some truth to what he said about the AMA.
MsZeitgeist85 10 months ago
@MsZeitgeist85 - I'm not sure a fiscal policy can "fail" when it isn't properly adopted. Unless you're saying that central banks limited the growth of the money supply to a fixed amount and then the governmental spending was held in check. Chile's economy faired far better than many other economies of its region and Friedman's ideas were hardly totally adopted. The left is constantly being lied to about Milton Friedman by people like Naomi Klien and Thom Hartmann.
jakeyw11 10 months ago
@jakeyw11 Part 2 He also privatized 212 state industrys and what happened? By 1982 poverty doubled and unemployment was 22% and things were so bad people were to desperate to fear bullets and they rioted over this. In that year Pinochet fired Friedman's Chicago School advisors and restored union rights and the minimum wage. So much for the Miracle of Chile. It wasn't untill he 90s that Chile became what it is today and this shows it was John Maynard Kenes not Friedman who saved Chile.
MsZeitgeist85 10 months ago
@jakeyw11 PART 1 People say that about Klien because she is a historian not an economist but what she said about Chile was right. The so called miracle of Chile was a fairy tale. In 73 when Pinochet took power by force unemployment was 4.3% and poverty was 20% when Pinochet braught in Friedman's team of advisors from Chicago and he privatized the national bank, the resources. He destroyed unions collective barganing rights, lowered taxes on industrys, slashed public workers, privatized pentions.
MsZeitgeist85 10 months ago
@jakeyw11 Another thing to note is that one of the reasons Friedman had clout on this was because Monetarism was an effective way to fight inflation but by the late 70s Monetarism was obsolete. Look what happened when Thatcher tried it in the UK. Manufacturing went down. Uneployment went through the roof and in 1986 The Bank of England was forced to abandon Monetarism.
See Health Care wasnt' the only thing Friedman was wrong on.
MsZeitgeist85 10 months ago
@MsZeitgeist85 FYI, Friedman's influence can still be seen today. Just look at the way the US addressed the financial contraction that should have occurred after the housing bubble started to burst. The Fed infused cash into the system to prevent bank failures. People claim banks are sitting on federal money... that isn't true at all. The Fed sent money to the banks to hedge against bank failures and bank runs that contributed to the great depression.
jakeyw11 8 months ago
@jakeyw11 Oh you mean the bubble that Friedman's student Greenspan said didn't exist. And no the banks is sitting on billions there were mergers and the fed gave them money to pour liquidity into smaller banks and they took that money and gave themselves bonuses and not one banker is in jail for this.
I still stand by what I said before. Friedman wasn't even a good debater he was a TV personality thats why the old fallacys of Friedman's Permenant Income theory are still around today.
MsZeitgeist85 8 months ago
@MsZeitgeist85 It is such an absurd argument to say that Friedman wasn't a good debater... Watch the 2nd half of any of the PBS "Free to Choose" 1980 series and just about anyone can see that Friedman is able to make extremely intelligent and convincing arguments advocating his side of the issue at hand. Hartmann vs Friedman would be laughable most people that keep Tom on topic beat him in debates and Friedman vs Krugman would be a laugher too.
jakeyw11 8 months ago
@jakeyw11 Styles make fights and debates. Friedman is good but he doesnt match up well with Hartmann. Friedman uses too many defensive strawman arguments and Hartmann eats that stuff up.
freakyfatdog 2 months ago
@MsZeitgeist85 I've seen Krugman debate universal health care before and Michael Cannon made him look absolutely foolish. I doubt that even Krugman would want to debate Friedman.
jakeyw11 8 months ago
@jakeyw11 Michael Cannon was bullshitting his ass off about canadian health care. Watch The Real News Network Single Payer debate.
Do you really think that there are more bankruptcys under Single Payer than what we have here. Here 62% of our bankruptcys are from medical debt.
Watch the video my friend Radio Hogan made called Friedman's Overcleverness which shows the fallacys of Friedmans Permenant Income theory.
MsZeitgeist85 8 months ago
@jakeyw11 Michael Cannon is still selling our failed health care model of for profit health insurance that has failed everywhere it has been tried. THere is no such thing as a "Free Market" solution for health care and there never will be.
MsZeitgeist85 8 months ago
@jakeyw11 Why do you think Friedman has any credibility in this? He was thourally discredited after the BAM crisis and his experement in Chile went down in flames.
MsZeitgeist85 8 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
What the hell are you blathering about? No wonder no one listens to Air UnAmerica.
bpentium 1 year ago
I approve.
MrSalamander7 2 years ago