If a G&W short hop back airs and you're running at him, you can anticipate his bair and just wait outside of range to punish, and G&W knows this, so he will probably sometimes DI into with his bair and hit you for trying to punish a whiffed one. If you anticpate this and shield a bit more ahead in your dash or something, you can punish him out of shield with your forward momentum, which is the point of this video.
tl;dr due to reaction time, consistent perfect spacing doesn't exist.
is this game and watch nub? of course hes going to get shield grabbed. when he SH bair's the kid, hes all of what an inch away from him? his spacing is terrible. try doing it against a game and watch that keeps his distance enough to the point where only the had is connecting with the shield and if hes hitting against the shield he pulls out. i use marth and no Neutral A reaches him let alone Dolphins Slash. Point it out if im missing something but im pretty sure im right?
Use turtle when your opponent is in the air. G&W B-air is still a good move. Those were badly spaced B-air's. G&W has good aerial mobility to chase your opponent with B-air.
Great post / video, Praxis. This is exactly the kind of stuff that we need to teach both new and veteran players to improve. The community needs more great info like this with supported videos / posts.
WTH if GnW knows how to space the bair is nearly impossible to punish. If your shield is already damaged, it's usually a safe shield poke. GnW bair is nonwhere a "bad" move because SOMETIMES you can punish it.
it's pretty obvious you can't use this method very long. one hit and your shield is almost depleted. if i were a gnw main i would STILL go for the hit, take the punishment, then pressure you with my smashes (assuming i were going for the kill) or the turtle again. you can't shield two turtles in succession. even if you somehow do, there's no way you can shield anything else after
Unfortunately, this video is incredibly misleading for a couple of reasons. First off, spacing was practically non-existent, and the turtle was commonly performed point blank in these examples. Also, there was literally no timing variation in when the turtle was executed. It was practically always done immediately out of a full hop. Lastly, and likely most importantly, air control during the aerial was not shown. Turtle is good. It was still an informative and good video, despite all this.
Unfortunately, I couldn't get a G&W main to be willing to help me on the video :P Regardless, considering that I've played every G&W in the country and beaten all of them except UTD Zac (last stock, last game, he 9'd me at 30% :( ) with Peach and 3-0'd Hylian, I'd say that my tactics against G&W are, at the very least, effective.
It's not like there are many good G&W mains besides UTD Zac, and I doubt many of them were played in recent times. Suggesting that there are such universal methods of beating the turtle while using examples such as this can only be labeled as misleading, sorry to say. I know there are a lot of character specific things that can be done in certain scenarios against the Turtle, but the examples shown are just silly. I'd rather debate this on the forums, though, so I'll end it with this message!
@NPPodcast nah dude non of these situations are realistice with a good G&W Main.. u acting like we gonna sit right ovr u and use turtle no it dosnt work like that we use the hit box at its best to the point that the turtle head isnt even touching sumtimes.. the only real charater that can punish it is snake be4 it hits him
I agree that your accomplishments make you a credible source, though Turtle is still a good move, lol.
However, without spacing, variation of timing, and perhaps a couple of real game clips, this video is far from how good it should be. Did you really need a GnW main to have someone space Bairs on you?
@SothE700k no, actually the point of the video was supposed to be that GW's Bair is a bad move, not that a bad player using GW's Bair makes it a bad move.
Also, the weak jab can combo into grab. He gets out of hitstun, but he gets out of it just above the ground. If he touches the ground, he gets grabbed before the landing lag ends, and he can't jump away before the grab connects and he has no aerials faster than 8 frames, so jab grab on an aerial G&W is actually really safe most of the time. There's a LOT of weak jab followups.
What's The Music?
jasongunning2468 1 month ago
actually his b-air is one of the best in the game......
youranoob1111 4 months ago
Basically, we have to block? Thanks for the tip.
CaCatoe 8 months ago
Suddenly GaW spaced... :O
wwwilliam0024 10 months ago
Spacing or Fast Fall
This Video is a Sh*t!
FernHades7 1 year ago
@FernHades7 So's your mom.
NPPodcast 1 year ago
7 gaw mains b mad
SolidSoul40373 1 year ago
If a G&W short hop back airs and you're running at him, you can anticipate his bair and just wait outside of range to punish, and G&W knows this, so he will probably sometimes DI into with his bair and hit you for trying to punish a whiffed one. If you anticpate this and shield a bit more ahead in your dash or something, you can punish him out of shield with your forward momentum, which is the point of this video.
tl;dr due to reaction time, consistent perfect spacing doesn't exist.
Itakio 1 year ago
:D I love you praxis :D
SiriHakuoh 1 year ago
OH NO! They're on to us now! GaW mains, we must assemble and create new, apparently unpunishable tactics!
Wolvenblaze 1 year ago
If the G&W doesn't have the sense to float away once he sees you're shielding it, he DESERVES to get punished like that.
I liked the Cynthia remix though. Good times.
Sph34r 1 year ago
So basically shield hope they space like a noob. Then get raped by his pokes and smashes since your shield is now useless.
PKrockin 1 year ago
Peach mains... I can't take them seriously, sorry :>
J0ttem 1 year ago
praxis, you suck, this is a 2008 video that you are making in 2010 like game and watch is still a relavent character lol. get outta here bad kid. =P
daKIDgamer 2 years ago
News flash Praxis. Every aerial in the game is terrible when spaced terribly. ololo
Blackysworth 2 years ago
NOOOO lol i main GnW an i thought i wuz only person 2 kno that...... crap ;p
bowsh534 2 years ago
awesome piece of info, very useful in G&W matches. grats, Praxis ^^
Eduardomsc 2 years ago
Love the music :)
RaykuThunder 2 years ago
Too bad this doesn't work for yoshi. No oos options.
wadlet 2 years ago
is this game and watch nub? of course hes going to get shield grabbed. when he SH bair's the kid, hes all of what an inch away from him? his spacing is terrible. try doing it against a game and watch that keeps his distance enough to the point where only the had is connecting with the shield and if hes hitting against the shield he pulls out. i use marth and no Neutral A reaches him let alone Dolphins Slash. Point it out if im missing something but im pretty sure im right?
IKimGuD 2 years ago
@IKimGuD 1:30
"He can pull out, but most characters can punish this too"
tree2992 1 year ago
Marth can SDI out of it, and do fair -> side-b LOL
MegaBeanz 2 years ago
You forgot to address the fact that he can fastfall it if he has enough space to not get shield grabbed, which is almost all of the time.
Itakio 2 years ago
Actually nevermind, you didn't forget, but I still think it's pretty uncommon to be in a position where you can't fastfall it.
Itakio 2 years ago
Use turtle when your opponent is in the air. G&W B-air is still a good move. Those were badly spaced B-air's. G&W has good aerial mobility to chase your opponent with B-air.
Caliberchamp 2 years ago 5
Only bad G&W players constantly buffer SH B-air as an approach. Get that shit out of here Praxis.
A2ZOMG 2 years ago 3
Great post / video, Praxis. This is exactly the kind of stuff that we need to teach both new and veteran players to improve. The community needs more great info like this with supported videos / posts.
Excellent job!
MetalMusicMan04 2 years ago
how do you DI out of bair?
nimsln 2 years ago
WTH if GnW knows how to space the bair is nearly impossible to punish. If your shield is already damaged, it's usually a safe shield poke. GnW bair is nonwhere a "bad" move because SOMETIMES you can punish it.
Aludes 2 years ago 3
it's pretty obvious you can't use this method very long. one hit and your shield is almost depleted. if i were a gnw main i would STILL go for the hit, take the punishment, then pressure you with my smashes (assuming i were going for the kill) or the turtle again. you can't shield two turtles in succession. even if you somehow do, there's no way you can shield anything else after
tuestresfat 2 years ago
fucking combo breakers o_o
masuat 2 years ago
Unfortunately, this video is incredibly misleading for a couple of reasons. First off, spacing was practically non-existent, and the turtle was commonly performed point blank in these examples. Also, there was literally no timing variation in when the turtle was executed. It was practically always done immediately out of a full hop. Lastly, and likely most importantly, air control during the aerial was not shown. Turtle is good. It was still an informative and good video, despite all this.
NDSstudios 2 years ago 6
Unfortunately, I couldn't get a G&W main to be willing to help me on the video :P Regardless, considering that I've played every G&W in the country and beaten all of them except UTD Zac (last stock, last game, he 9'd me at 30% :( ) with Peach and 3-0'd Hylian, I'd say that my tactics against G&W are, at the very least, effective.
Turtle is bad. :P
NPPodcast 2 years ago
It's not like there are many good G&W mains besides UTD Zac, and I doubt many of them were played in recent times. Suggesting that there are such universal methods of beating the turtle while using examples such as this can only be labeled as misleading, sorry to say. I know there are a lot of character specific things that can be done in certain scenarios against the Turtle, but the examples shown are just silly. I'd rather debate this on the forums, though, so I'll end it with this message!
NDSstudios 2 years ago
@NPPodcast nah dude non of these situations are realistice with a good G&W Main.. u acting like we gonna sit right ovr u and use turtle no it dosnt work like that we use the hit box at its best to the point that the turtle head isnt even touching sumtimes.. the only real charater that can punish it is snake be4 it hits him
Sonjeff7 1 year ago
@NPPodcast you've never played me :)
GodismyRock89 1 year ago
@NPPodcast
I agree that your accomplishments make you a credible source, though Turtle is still a good move, lol.
However, without spacing, variation of timing, and perhaps a couple of real game clips, this video is far from how good it should be. Did you really need a GnW main to have someone space Bairs on you?
Pierce7d 1 year ago
@NDSstudios short hop*
fowskate 7 months ago
I smell MORE drops in the tier list now for our 2D hero.
SothE700k 2 years ago
Oh man, if I were to master this, G&W MIGHT be a tolerable character to fight. :x
FireKirby7 2 years ago
Nice vid. Can I get the name of the song(s)?
jjvirus 2 years ago
They're from the 4th gen pokemon games. The first one is from fighting a legendary roaming pokemon. The second is when you fight cynthia.
nova2029 2 years ago
Nice video!!
CommanderBeef101 2 years ago
Is this News to people midwest has been doing this for years now :)
Juntahh 2 years ago
spacing was pretty awful in nearly all the video clip examples
burk33 2 years ago 10
That was the point.
SothE700k 2 years ago
@SothE700k no, actually the point of the video was supposed to be that GW's Bair is a bad move, not that a bad player using GW's Bair makes it a bad move.
burk33 2 years ago
I wanna see him space it CORRECTLY and get punished by something that isn't a weak jab or long/laggy grab.
Try harder...
GunmasterLombardi 2 years ago
Depends on the character.
Also, the weak jab can combo into grab. He gets out of hitstun, but he gets out of it just above the ground. If he touches the ground, he gets grabbed before the landing lag ends, and he can't jump away before the grab connects and he has no aerials faster than 8 frames, so jab grab on an aerial G&W is actually really safe most of the time. There's a LOT of weak jab followups.
NPPodcast 2 years ago
you do realize he has an up b that becomes invincible on frame 5?
ArturitoBurrito 1 year ago
However, admittedly, Ice Climbers can't do anything if the Bair is spaced right.
though I have succeeded in SDIing down into the ground and grabbing in a match once or twice, then solo Popo CGing till Nana caught up.
NPPodcast 2 years ago
Thanks alot, now I can't main Mr. GaW anymore. =/
:P
ThisIsWEB 2 years ago
Stop bairing.
NPPodcast 2 years ago
But that's not fair! ;)
ThisIsWEB 2 years ago 3
I see what you did thar
Sveet 2 years ago
cool video
mateuszskibicki1 2 years ago