European Crisis; Hitlers Sudeten Demand; etc 1938/9/19

[Elberiver11]

Germany took Sudetenland back , and freed 3.5 Million Germans from CZECH TYRANNY.

So dont you complain about the "bad nazis", you moron. Because if YOU had not stolen our land, your silly Hitler would not even exist. The world war is Czech, Polish and ALLIED guilt.

[Skyvlk]

@Elberiver11 How far in the history are you willing to go? Who started what first?

IIRC, Germans got this silly idea about Drang nach Osten more than thousand years ago and the rest of CEE's history is the endless "push" between Germanic and Slavic tribes, later kingdoms, even later nations. Every conflict between them was rooted in the previous war.

[Elberiver11]

The Americans, British and French robbed Sudetenland in 1919 and made CZECH TANKS invade and open fire on unarmed German demonstrators. They even killed children, like in e.g. the Massacre of KAADEN March 1919

3.5 Million Germans were taken by force, America and Britain called it "democracy". In truth this "democracy" was a placing millions unter Alien rule and Czech terror.

Hitler was fully right to teach the Czechs a lesson! They started the invasion, not in 1938 but in 1919.

[nutguy187]

THIS IS CESKO!

[trevlacme]

The evil British kept millions of Germans and Hungarians in forgein lands to purposefully weaken us. All Germany did was to reclaim lands that had been part of Germany and inhabited by Germans for millions of years. But who is in control now? Germany is Europe!

[Skyvlk]

@trevlacme Part of what? The country has existed for less than 150 years, before that there was nothing resembling a German state, only countless smaller or larger lands.

[trevlacme]

@Skyvlk The Sudenten lands have been part of Austria for hundreds of years.

[Skyvlk]

@trevlacme Sudetenland was a part of Bohemia. Now Bohemia was a duchy/kingdom in Holy Roman Empire, but HRE was passed down to Habsburgs and Austrian Empire. Modern Germany was a separate, hostile entity centered around Kingdom of Prussia, and they had no territorial claims to Czech lands.

Anyway a good advice would be to avoid starting stupid unnecessary wars. Loss of WW1 was huge for Austrians, Germans and Hungarians. WW2 -> expulsions. Czechs suffered the same after starting Thirty Year War.

[trevlacme]

@Skyvlk Österreichisch Schlesien was an automous part of Bohemia only beacuase of its location and never because of any connection to the Czechs. The problem is the denial of this builds distrust and further problems.

[Elberiver11]

@Skyvlk Austria was PART of the HRE, you moron. Learn history.

Sudetenland was populataed by Germans for over 700 years. Czechs were too stupid to have their own state, they were part of Austria, too. In 1919, Czech Tanks invaded Sudetenland and opened Fire on innocent, unarmed German people, who were peacefully demonstrating. You Czech monsters also killed children in 1919. You stole Sudetenland by military force.

So who started? The Czechs started by military invasion in 1919.

[Skyvlk]

@Elberiver11 We were to stupid to have our own state? The duchy and later the Kingdom of Bohemia was a state, just like any other. German settlers were invited to Sudetenland by Czech king.

As far as I am concerned, it was their rightful home, but it was still part of Bohemia, and they were ruled by King of Bohemia.

[Skyvlk]

Anyway, we did not invade anything, except calling in army to settle down local violent rabble :). Germans were simply too pigheaded to accept that they were no longer THE ruling class in our lands. Injured pride is a nasty stuff and Hitler used their feelings as a convenient tool to remove one of bigger obstacles in his initial European conquest.

Their minority rights were great for that time, even decent by our modern standards.

[Elberiver11]

@Skyvlk PS: you may call the "expulsion" a Genocide. Czechs and Poles murdered over 2.0 Million German children, women and old people after the war was over. Shame on you monsters! Not for your grandfather's wicked crimes, but for hiding your GENOCIDES.

Poland and Czechs should be excluded from European Union for crimes against humanity.

[Skyvlk]

@Elberiver11: About 40-50k people died during expulsion and by random revenge acts in Czechoslovakia, that was a result of joint German-Czech investigation after war. 2M+ numbers are coming from populists.

Even the real numbers were high enough to call it a genocide, I don't deny that.

But if I lived in that period, I would be supporting the expulsion. After WW2, 6 years of terror and massacres and hundreds of thousands of victims...there was NO future for these people in same state, period.

[Skyvlk]

I had the opportunity to go through written and told memories of many Czechs from WW2.

The amount of fear they had to live in for 6 years under German occupation is almost unimaginable by our generation. This fear and suppressed hate simply exploded at the end of war, and there was no way to keep them under control.

Benes Decrees came in to stop the uncontrolled chaotic violence and executions of Germans. Funny how his Decrees are now remembered AS the main symbol of the violence...

[Elberiver11]

@Skyvlk German emperors have ruled in German land for 1000 years, you moron. How stupid are you? You Czechs are as stupid as your American and Soviet friends.

HRE = Holy Roman Empire of German nation, 1st German Empire. Only the name is "Roman", you moron.

[SirVaclav]

Hello, I am sudeten but my family was forced to immigrate after the racist benes laws. I was forced to live in UK my entire life instead of my homeland. Sudeteland was supposed to go to Österreich after WW1, but, the czechs didnt want to give it up. The Benes laws forced thousands of ethnic germans to immigrate forcibly and without compisation. There is not much of my homeland left and it is sad that USA gets away with a genocide of a culture.

[MrLasicak]

@SirVaclav According to agreement between CSR and West Germany, german state should compensate german property left in Czechoslovakia. Czechoslovakia gave up its reparation. Germans in Sudeten were citizens of enemy state on our teritory in 1945. It was their freedom choise in 1938. In fact I do not remember ANY german demonstration AGINST occupation of rest Czechoslovakia in 1939.It was not about german national freedom, but your thirst for domination in this area...U try, U loos...

[trevlacme]

@SirVaclav I agree, we are Germans from Romania where it was much worse. My familyhad to walk from Romania to Hungary and then Austria. But thank god we are now in America.

[Elberiver11]

@MrLasicak It was not your territory - it was Austrian Territory, stolen by Czech bandits and killers in March 1919.

You live on stolen land, and all the houses you live in are stolen houses.

Give the land back to Germany.

[trevlacme]

@SirVaclav I agree, we are Germans from Romania where it was much worse. My familyhad to walk from Romania to Hungary and then Austria. But thank god we are now in America.

[strangerinwhite]

What no sound ?

[eduardalet]

War is always an exercise in stupidity , it doesn't solve problems it creates them. For the idiot who says Dresden was justice , it was a war crime. War  should be fought strictly by the rules of war. The cause of the second world war can be found in the first world war , feuding monarchists ,people still admire their royal families , what a joke. They should all be abolished , if it weren't for them the second world war would have never happened. People are stupid by nature.good luck.

[AZsaturn]

An aim of this raid was the extortion of the quick capitulation. It did not succeed . But in Japan it succeeded .

[Kang5030]

@eduardalet

You just spout one ignorance after another.

First of all, "rules of war"? War is among the few things that has no rules. Whatever "moral" guidelines put in place are done by cowards and those too weak or wicked to defend their interests any other way.

As for your little vendetta against nobility... I hope you enjoy stupidity. You'll be bathing in it for the rest of your life at this rate.

[smiergus]

so you telling me goodbye? i'm so sad :)

but at final i must say piotrek, you are good nazi :) and dresden was justice :)

[92hardcore1974]

"they don't like it up'em captain mainwaring sir" apparently elberiver does!!!!!

[smiergus]

Das einzig interesseante an deiner Lebensgeschichte ist, wie du aus dem Versuchslabor entkommen bist :D

[arka67]

Czesc ! Jak sie czujesz ?

jestes moim Przyjacielem, Czy rozumiesz ?

You have to work on your Polish, you making no sence, is not even funny !

[arka67]

Elba !

you are jumping too often to extreme side of the issues. Forget about Nazi, calling people Nazi helps no one. Specially German patriot like you. With history passing Germany manage to have opinion of a Tyrant and War monger, and Not only in Poland and Russia, also in Canada and other countries. Germany doesnt disserve that opinion. But you calling people NAZI. Is making things worst, not better. TALK about how good Germany is, not whats wrong with UK. In the past.

[smiergus]

this:"Ich steche Dir die Augen raus und pisse dir ins Gehirn, du kleines schwules Arschloch! " are nazi words? are you crazy? it means: "germans are really nice people, everybody like them", unless my translator did it wrong :D

[smiergus]

hey, i told you i'm not nazi. nazi is synonym of germany. show me which countires did i insult?

if you talk about dresden, i just said it was justice, becouse it was. everybody says that.

[dturtleneck]

For those Germans - who expressed their gratitude to Czechoslovakia in many ways - the Munich treaty was a real desaster.

[dturtleneck]

After an "activistic" approach among the Sudeten-German politicians prevailed (i. e. the policy of cooperation with the Czechs and Slovaks), the Germans had their representants in the Czechoslovak government (since 1926 to 1938); a social care minister between 1929 and 1934, (i.e. in the years ot the great eonomic crisis when this ministry was a key one) was a German (Ludwig Czech). After Hitler seized power in Germany, many democratic German refugees found their resort in Czechoslovakia.

[dturtleneck]

those who wanted to establish a just and democratic republic as well as those who used the lowest human instincts so that to pursue their political career. There were definitely nationalist Czech politians who tried to "avenge themselves" to the Germans. Anyhow, the Germans in Czechoslovakia enjoyed considerably more liberties and rights then the Czechs in the Austrian monarchy.

[dturtleneck]

Czechoslovakia was a democratic country - there was a direct and equal right of vote to the National Assembly (Czechoslovakia´s parliament) as well as to municipal board, the rights of national minorities were protected etc. Like in any country with this system of governement, this was an opportunity for political career for people of very different characters also in Czechoslovakia. There were generous politicians as well as narrow-minded ones;

[dturtleneck]

The history of the Austrian empire was relatively long and the conditions there in 1914 were quite different than those in, say, 1800. Many democratic reforms were carried out in the empire in the last 100 years of it´s existence. Nevertheless, it was still a state with many feudal relics-a very strong position of the emperor within the constitutional system, many privileges for aristocracy, electoral system which ensured disproportionate representation of the Germans in municipal boards etc.

[dturtleneck]

I do not know Gerard Radnitzky, I doubt that he is Czech - his first name doesn´t sound Czech at all. Anyhow, the oppinion that since Czechoslovakia inhereted many problems of the Habsburgs´ empire, there had been no reason for disintegration of the Habsburg empire is relatively spread.

In judging weather a regime in any state was oppressive or not, it is necessary to take into consideration that any state is an entity which develops during the course of time and the terms are changing.

[smiergus]

you dirty nazi rat, where did you learned that polish? :D

did your nazi mother didn't teach you not to talk over somebody behind his back? :)

but after all piotrek, you are good nazi :D

i know a little bit german too, for example:

Auf die knie, und heul'/winsel' um Vergebung :D

[arka67]

Je suis Canadien Francais du Quebec.

[2oo8Autunno]

Changez votre clavier! "Français" avec Cedille!

[arka67]

, including me, My family was burned alive in their house, by SS in July 1943. Today we are called criminals and I am being spited and called names. All of you who would like to talk or discuss issues, have some respect, and you will see you will get the respect back from many people. Some Poles are simply racist and anysemitic bigots, well I suggest do not talk to them.

[arka67]

Polish German relationships have been completely destroyed, mainly because of Nazi in Germany, But also because of years of anti Polish Ethnic cleansing policies of almost all German Gouvernamnts since 1780.

Since 1939 in Poland there was a real and sincere HATE toward Germans, every Polish family was effected by the WAR, many families simply disappeared, Every Polish Person on YouTube who is screaming and yelling, I guarantee you had a close relative killed in the WAR

[arka67]

Today redrawing new borders between Poland and Germany is just INSANE, Poland , Czech and Lithuania will never allow, even an inch of territory to be transfer to Germany. personal claims of German citizens should be address to German Government in Berlin, Not To Poland or On YouTube for that matter.

[arka67]

Expelling ethnic Germans was wrong. Poles who try to justify this crime are wrong. Germany has a legitimate claim, specially to Pomerania and western Silesia, areas where there was almost no Polish presents for centuries. I believe that Silesia and Pomerania are historically Slavic lands. Gdansk was part of Polish Kingdom since creation of Polish state. Prussia was part of Polish Kingdom as Royal Prussia, there for Polish claim prevail. Partition of Polish Kingdom in 1780 was illegal act.

[arka67]

Decision to expel Germans was made, without Poland, polish Gouv. in London has broken relations with Moscow after Katyn in 43, Gen. Sikorski was dead. Stalin drew borders between Poland and Germany himself. Until 1956 whole Polish Gouvernamnt, Polish Army, And SB (militia) was govern by Bolsheviks from Soviet Russia. To Blame today's generation of young Poles and trying to claim territory is bringing the HATE Back to our Polish German relations.

[arka67]

ElbaRiver sorry for calling you a piece of shit I see you make sense sometimes. I respect you trying to speak polish.

[Kukapetal]

Arka, lol. He's nuts :P

[arka67]

Kukapel@ you have disrespected me (spited on me) with no reason, once, almost every mail from you, you finished with insults , like a bigot ect..

I don't recall even once calling you names, (except last email) , you have never apologized to me for any of it. You lack of respect to my person, was just too much.. .

My opinions are maybe controversial. BUT Respect is everything in any coexistence between people. If I here from you again insults to my person, you will here from me again.

[Kukapetal]

Nah, Peter, he's an asshole. Trust me on this one.

[dturtleneck]

As far as I could get fammiliar with you, you try to heckle Polish people so that to blame them for insulting you then!

[dturtleneck]

How do you dare to reproach others to have called you bad names when you do the same? In another discussion, you wrote that I was a silly person, although I hadn´t offended you in any way.

[2oo8Autunno]

ElbeNazi

Yes, the nazi shit is on every day. You are the proof. Even the most primitive nazis during their terror regime (like Dr. Ley and Streicher) did not use a language like yours! I watched them live in the Radio, online!

Wann folgen Sie Ihrem Führer? Kugel in den Kopf!

[arka67]

Stalin made decisions to remove Germans, he did it because he knew, if Germans stay in Pomerania there will be a next WAR, Germans are people who will not sit and take, they will stand up. If the border was there to be moved, German Ethic cleansing had to happen. Stalin draw the borders himself. It's interesting that today in 2009. Europe in peaceful it's never been that peaceful since probably day one.

[Kukapetal]

In other words, Stalin wanted to commit an injustice against the German people but knew they would not take it lying down so he decided to commit an even bigger injustice by brutally ethnically cleansing them from their homelands to head off trouble

And you're defending him?

If the Germans had been allowed to complete the Holocaust, there would have been no issues with Jews in Europe and the Middle East issues caused by Israel would be nonexistent. That doesn't make the Holocaust a good thing

[arka67]

Stalin is indefensible. Stalin killed about 2 mil polish People. How can defend Stalin ? Purge ? Communism ?

Expelling Germans was Wrong, Stalin would not do it without UK and US. they were allied.

Holocaust issue you should not even touch it. this is so fucked up. that is a different disunion

[arka67]

Native Germans have right under Czech constitsion

[AZsaturn]

@ElbeRiver

Germans from former Royal Prussia they escaped? From where? Where? How? Perhaps they did not like the polnische wirtschaft?

[AZsaturn]

@ElbeRiver

You sleep during the day?

[arka67]

I went to bed at 4 am. if Elba is in Europe. it had to be least 10am. I guess he is sleeping. that was one hell discussion. I think slowly and surly they are getting the point. Story of Polish German relationship is completely fucked up.

[2oo8Autunno]

I wonder what all these discussions are about. If I want to travel from Germany to Poland, can I not simply buy an airplane ticket and go where I want? I thought Poland is in the European Community. When I go from Germany to France, there is no control at the frontier. You can even buy a house in France as a German. All these endless discussions were understandable 50-60 years ago! ElbeRiver needs these quarrels. He writes hateful, offending posts, especially against British and Swiss people.

[Kukapetal]

In my experience, he writes hateful offending posts in response to hateful offending posts from said British and Swiss people. Makes me wonder if you're not telling the whole story.

[s0l0turn]

I had been living in Germany under Hitler as a boy. When the American soldiers came to my home town Heidelberg on 30 March 1945, I was not even 13 years old. How can anybody say I am a nazi? I even was not yet in the Hitler Youth, but only in the "German Jungvolk". But the WAY how ElbeRiver wrote that I was a nazi tells everything about him!

[Kukapetal]

And I am asking what prompted him to say that stuff. he usually calls people Nazis when they say something bigoted or express approval or denial of war crimes of some sort.

[AZsaturn]

My dear s0l0turn.

The man is a gregarious creature. People are not as leopards. We live in herds. Individuals are then, when it is necessary to buy or to scrap the car. The yacht or the television set. But in matters of very of mass, we are a herd.

[arka67]

ElbeRiver caled me a Nazi and the Fashist, and I was borne in 1967. I am not going to defend Elberiver but I think he loves Germany so much, that he forgets about Respect too often.

[2oo8Autunno]

But didn't you realize yet that he is not all there? Just look at my channel how he "embellished" it!

LOL

[2oo8Autunno]

It is Elbe's character to stir up people of different countries against each other. As I know how to trace all the comments he writes on the channels of other users, I know: On video comments from Bretagne or Alsace, he writes against Paris. On Bask videos against Spain and so on. I had to laugh when he tried to stir up a user from Ireland against the UK. The Irishman was offended, having proudly fought against nazis!

People want their peace! As ElbeLazy does not work, he wants quarrels!

[arka67]

Why Germans fled Poland in 1970 and 1980 ? thousands. Why Germans left Russia in 1990 ?

No Germans wanted to stay in Poland and serve a Polish State. What is a polish state anyway ?? Those who stayed in 1930 , were the 5th Colum. you know that. if anybody can complain in 1930 it was Ukrainians. but Ukraine never had a country before. What should we do ?? today is different. everyone has it's piece. let's ALL MOVE ON.

[arka67]

Listen ! you should know , you have some connection with Polish people. story is presented simple : gas chambers and one by one. until is all done. I know sound horrific and you don't feel responsible for that. even I am sicken. Anyone should sicken by this. this is the reason Why we should all move on. Stop blaming game. and Move ON.all of US. Steinbach Germans too. should stop it. Just move on.. Prussia is Polish Silesia too. we had no control over that. don't blame ME. I am not responsible

[Kukapetal]

Forget it.

Prussia is not Polish, and neither is Silesia or Pomerania. The Sudetenland is not Czech. East Prussia is not Russian. Memel is not Lithuanian. These countries cannot keep other ethnic groups' homelands forever.

Did the Poles "move on" and forget about it after their own country was carved up? Or did they do what they could to preserve their identity and fight for their home? For the displaced Germans, it is the same. As it is for all displaced people.

[arka67]

unfortunately your chances to achieve anything are non. in this geopolitical situation nothing will happen. I say you can only blame yourself. you blow it. I had nothing to do with it. Polish people after what they went through they will not even talk to you. many Germans as much as they would like Stettin. reality is they will NOT get it, and they know it !

[Kukapetal]

I didn't have anything to do with it either, so why do you keep saying that "I" blew it?

As long as I was responsible for "blowing it," I'm going to hold you responsible for "doing it." Sound fair? :P

Nothing lasts forever. The "status quo" junkies like you and the guilt mongers in Germany will eventually give way to people who are interested in righting wrongs. Yes, even those wrong that were comitted against germans!

Have a nice night, Bigot

[arka67]

i will be ready sitting on the Oder river with stick, waiting for you to show up. make you sure you have some good Alarm System in your Car, Car theft is real problem in Poland.

[Kukapetal]

With a stick?? Dear God, the combined might of the Polish army is in worse shape than years of Polak jokes have led me to believe.

[arka67]

I though you will take this as a joke. Polish Army is all in Afganistan.

[Kukapetal]

Well no wonder things are going so poorly over there!

[2oo8Autunno]

What I shall never understand: Nowadays, if any person, German, or not, wants to visit Stettin, can he not visit the city or even live there? Poland is in the European Union like France. At least once in a month, I go to Alsace in France. As to avoid the traffic in Basel, I don't cross the Swiss-French border, but I go at first to Germany, and from Germany to France there is no checking at the border at all.

[arka67]

problem is once you came to Stettin Poland , and you want to live there, and have kids in School, and get a job. you have to do it all in Polish. you have to learn the language of the Land, it is polish. and that's the problem for many Germans.

[2oo8Autunno]

arka67

Yes, you are right. I did not see the problem from this point of view, living in 4-lingual Switzerland. My children grew up with 2 languages. In family we speak Italian, at school, my children had to speak Zürich-German. Written German is quite different from the dialect. Young people even write their SMS's in Swiss German!

But I think 64 years after the war one should accept reality. No use whining about the past. Having suffered much under the war, I say: Peace is most important!

[Hernanbarna]

@arka67 remember part of Poland was stealed to germans... part of Prussia with its well known capital of Danzig, schlesien... now full of slavs occupants.

[arka67]

@Hernanbarna

you have no idea about history and people who live in Pomerania and ex Prussia , so please do not make any statements , you are embarrassing yourself !! Gdansk or Danzig IS NOT Prussia !! 

Slavic people, were living in Pomerania for thousands of years, Germans came to Prussia. by invitation of Polish kings ! That was the argument used by Stalin to justify transfer Silesia and Pomerania to Poland !!

[trevlacme]

@arka67 A nice place for Poland is somehwere beyond the Urals, or where ever Stalin has sent them.

[arka67]

@trevlacme

It is not like you did not try ???

I am sure , you will try again, and we will be ready !

[arka67]

@Hernanbarna

also , you have to know !

Polish ppl, believe that Germans stole Pomerania and Silesia 300 years earlier !!

[AZsaturn]

Yet I understand Prussia. There existed more or less two hundred years. But Sudetenland? It existed only seven years. Kresy? Record to yourself that we do not want the Kresy. Yourself conquer Kresy and form the oversea colony of U.S.A..

[Kukapetal]

I'll "record to myself" that you don't want the "Kresy." Now, if only I knew what a "Kresy" was.

And the Sudentenland didn't exist for only 7 years. It existed as a named and politically important region for that long, but the region itself had always existed and was the native homeland of Germans for centuries. Just because it was only historically significant for a short period of time doesn't mean the native Germans don't have rights.

[arka67]

KRESY is; whatever east of today's Poland

[AZsaturn]

@Kukapetal

Are you like "Mysterious Cities Of Gold"?

Every region on this Earth is old. Earth has about 4.500.000.000 years. But people are not plants. If in some place it does not please to them, they can move. Germany was several steps further. I do not know how this matter is seen by present Czeches. But they should know that NPD is still legal. Perhaps this day week no longer will be? Who rules Germany? That cannot make something so banal as declare illegal so hideous party as NPD?

[Kukapetal]

I can't understand what you are saying.  As usual.

[dturtleneck]

As far as Sudetenland is concerned, it has been Czech since the 9th century (we can say, since any statehood has been constituted in this territory). Actually, the Germans were immigrants there, although the first wave of them came as early as in the 13th century.

[trevlacme]

@Kukapetal I completely agree and anyone should know that the Poles and others have to move eastward and out of central and eastern Germany.

[Kukapetal]

The silly thing is, if you insult him, he'll whine about it for WEEKS! I once "spit" on his profile after he said some nasty bigoted comment and he's still crying about it.

[arka67]

after all I said....... how can you say my history starts in 1933. plus I don't Watch German TV . I have no idea about what you watch. and it's been a while since I left Europe. I have no idea if you up to dated with Kenigsberg !

[arka67]

we are Slavic people, same origin. I have no problem with Slovaks or Czechs or Ukrainians or Lithuanians even Russians I respect them. They part of our History. They were not trying to exterminate Poles. Like Germans tried.

[Kukapetal]

That's right, you've got no problem with the, regardless of what they do, because they are related to your ethnic group.

Sounds a little racist.

You know, that thing you bitch about the Nazis being?

[arka67]

Confused , because you want to be confuse. land change hands all the time. History is all about lands changing hands. Pomerania was part of German sate for centuries. well is not today. that is the realty. which we all have to accept. unless you want to start a new WAR. 1943 Warsaw was part of Germany. Poles had no chance to win anything. that was the realty of that TIME. Now is 2009 and you have no friends in Poland or Russia. so good luck with your claims.

[arka67]

Czechoslovakia was the real beginning of the WAR, for me. after that no one should have any questions where Hitler was going. Aim was not Gdansk or Sudety. if Hitler had any feelings for German ppl. he would allow the to get out of Konigsberg or Breslau, before Russians showed up. How criminal was that. I am surprised you such good Germans and you say nothing about that. Using Ger. Civilians as shields. so Sick. no humanity at all.

[Kukapetal]

Psst! Poland also took part in the dismembering of Czechoslavakia.

They should have some territory taken from them so they learn the consequences of their actions, don't you think? Big meanies.

[arka67]

that was a mistake, should never happen. that was WRONG.

[Kukapetal]

So then, they should give a chunk of their land to the Czechs to make up for it, right? They need to live with the consequences of their actions.

[AZsaturn]

@Kukapetal

You right. Already several times I apologized Czeches and Slovaks. And I will make this once again, because I am ashamed : I am sorry. I am sorry also Lithuanians for Vilnius.

[arka67]

Each lost Soviet division was replaced. Plus all the brutality on civilians, many Ruskis would simply switch sides, but SS did not take any prisoners. such a stupidity on the part of Germans. Koch was running Ukraine, but he did not believe Ukrainians are real people. and on on ... make no sense to me.

[arka67]

Brits, are very much to blame, Chamberlin was an idiot, even Wehrmaht generals did not trust Adolf. but he did. it was a joke before 1938. Still Hitler was stoppable, many people around and close to Hitler could simply kill him. Many Germans knew very well , where Hitler is going. RUSSIA . he wanted EAST. and this is what I don't understand, an average German General should know, that Barbarossa will not succeed. Hitler believed but where were all the others ???

[arka67]

You had your War with French in 1871 and Napoleon before that. you won! you should never get yourself involved in 1914. Your leaders failed again in 1914. and you lost that war. and the Blame game began. Germans are the victims. even Stafenber in 1944 was hoping the get Poznan back to Germany. it's just so sad that so many German's leader never seen Poland as nation. Poland was the place before Russia. Let me say it again; next World Conflict Germany will knock on the Polish door. I am sure.

[2oo8Autunno]

Don't feed the trolls!

But didn't you realize yet that ElbeRiver is not all there! Just look what he wrote on my channel and HOW he wrote it! He is an evil racist and shameless slanderer! When I once wrote that my daughter-in-law is black and she speaks 5 languages he replied she is a prostitute and she leaned the languages with her clients. The he wrote that my daughter and even my poor mother are whores, too! Just look what his friend 1914Tannenberg wrote on my channel!

They all call me dirty!

[arka67]

listen you want to fixe all the problems of the world on YouTube, easy ! shit happens everyday, this is the reason why I love history. you can learn so much. History is also real life. I was many times in Germany few times I was also in DDR. you could sense that this is a different people. I don't hate Germans. But they should stick with making BMWs. idea that you are better then others, or a superior race, or some other shit like that. just make me sick.

[Kukapetal]

The idea that the germans have had wrongs done to them and the idea that they think they are some "Master Race" do not automatically go hand in hand. Stop clouding the issue.

[2oo8Autunno]

Don't feed the trolls!

[arka67]

Your German leaders have failed to acted when they had a chance, they should kill Hitler before the war started. But your leaders failed. they had no gats, they were weak. and this the reason why you lost Pomerania and Silesia.

[arka67]

Germany is allowed to mourn it;s victims, but don't bring it to Poland. and don't play blaming game with poles. Steinbach is doing a good job. you will have a museum in Berlin. Just make sure all the facts are accurate. last time I checks 700 000 died, including victims in War operations. Massacres have accrued. Polish people were also killed by red Army. specially in Silesia. Woman were raped. that was a fucken WAR, it was a fucked up situation.

[arka67]

as a principle, I have to say, expelling Germans from Eastern Europe was WRONG. as you probably know Wyszynski went to Germany in 1966 and apologized. and got so much shit for that in Poland.

Well if it's wrong it's wrong. But I also know why Stalin did it, I also know that US and UK approved it. I also know to blame today's Poland for that in insane. WP and militia was run 100% by soviets. Poland till 1956 was a real communist country. To blame Kowalski from Lublin is stupid.

[arka67]

Churchill sold Poland and other eastern countries to Stalin for nothing. They sold Poland in 1939. they Sold Baltic states. I am not a friend of British. I think they are the reason Why Hitler managed to make so much in Europe.

USA after 911, was scared, everyone was scared, I was in NY week after, it was like a WARZONE. Bush made mistakes, too many. US is paying a price for those mistakes every day. I hope Obama will make same difference. I hope so.

[arka67]

YouTube Poland, is very sensitive to the idea of German suffering, specially after the WAR. that idea will never FLY in Poland. this is the origin of so much hate on Polish side. the last 250 years of history. it's a very sensitive issue.

Stalin was a war criminal, But Red Army did sacrificed 20 mil ppl. you have to respect that. and they did the Job. Stalin and Berria should be executed 10 may 1945.

[arka67]

I know it's shocking for you to read this. I have no problem to say that. just give Germans a good leader, bring some paranoia propaganda, 10 - 20 years of brain washing. and you will see the effects. Germany is a very powerful country. they made Jews disappeared from Europe. I think Germany is like a sleeping beast. it will wake up one day. EU is a good think for Europe. that will keep quiet for same time. that madness 60 years ago was real. I have no illusions that can be repeated again

[arka67]

I read many comments on YouTube, Germans have real problem with idea, that they lost so much 60 years ago. they blame everyone, Russian, Poles , Mongols , Brits even Italians, for Greece offensive, which delayed Barbarossa.

many Germans regret, that they lost the WAR. interesting fact is, that once you watch so many movies on YouTube, War generation also was devastated that they lost. That means they really wanted to WIN. And that to me is very scary.

god bless Red Army !!

[arka67]

I would agree with statement that territory was Germany. that was the PAST. today is different story. in 1938 that was Czech Republic. not Germany. and you by force wanted to change a status quo.

I also believe that in the Next WORLD Conflict, Germany will try to claim that parts of Poland. I also believe that Germany even today, would prefer Poland to disappear from the MAP. I have no illusions. This is reason, I support close alliance with USA. Poland should be more friendly with Russia

[Kukapetal]

I'm still confused. Does it remain the original ethnic group's land when a new ethnic group moves in and becomes the majority or doesn't it? You keep saying contradictory things.

"just becose many Germans moved there over the centries, doesn't make it Germany."

and later:

That (ethnically cleansed territory) "was Germany. That was in the past! Today is a different story!"

Seems like you keep changing the rules to keep the Germans in the wrong.

[arka67]

Bohemia is a histricly Slavic land, just becose many Germans moved there over the centries, doesn't make it Germany. Krakow and Lwow was also part of Austria prier to 1918, many Germans lived there, if they wated their freedom, They should be part Austria as a Austria's citizens !! where do you draw the LINE ?? How about Germans in Posen ? why don't you make this Germany ??

[Kukapetal]

Because Germans weren't the ethnic majority in those areas you mentioned.

They were in the Sudetenland, though.

[arka67]

But Sudetenland was never a country ! there is no such entety! that was one of the reason why Stalin expelled all the ethnic Germans. He was scared that Germany will use this argument again in the future. Hitler used that argument to start the WAR. looks to me, You still dont get it where is the problem ?? you honestly belive, that if you live somewhere , it's yours. I have news for you, It is not yours. It's part of Czech State.

[Kukapetal]

It wasn't a country, it was a region. And that region was naturally populated with German people. They did not conquer it, they did not ethnically cleanse it, they simply came to be the majority in that region through natural population shifts over the centuries. And they had the right to decide what country they wanted to be a part of, just like every other ethnic group. That region was placed in Czechoslovakia artificially by the allies at the end of WWI. Against the wishes of the people

[arka67]

this is where we differ, I don't believe Sudeten Germans had a right to make this land part of Germany. they were Germans living in Czechoslovakia. that was the reality of life. You started the WAR because of that. And at the end you lost everything! and now you sit and cry! those were the days, where your leaders should step up. and make some serious education. Sudety and Gdansk is not worth starting a WAR. Let's respect our neighbors, Czech and polish people are our Friends. Sounds ridicules?

[Kukapetal]

"Czechoslavakia" was an artificial country created by the allies at the end of WWI. They were Germans living in Czechoslavakia only because the allies said so. They were artificially placed into an artificial country and they didn't like it. The map should have been drawn along ethnic lines as much as humanly possible.

They were worth starting a war over them if the people wanted to return to Germany. A country has a right to protect its people.

[Kukapetal]

And before WWII, the Poles and Czechs were not good neighbors, and they were not good friends. Why should Germans have to respect neighbors who were oppressing their people?

They were an ethnic majority in the Sudetenland, their settlement of it was natural population shift, they wanted to be a part of Germany, and they were artificially placed in an artificial state. Everything points to them being the rightful owners of the land. You are just siding against them because they are German

[arka67]

Czechoslovakia was a real country, it's historical reality. you live in denial. you use the same arguments as you leaders prier 1938. those arguments were wrong then and are wrong today. Consequences of your actions are such that you lost Sudety and Pomerania and Silesia. you should learn from it. and move on. Goebbels is dead. Poland was not a perfect country in 1938. But was respectful to it's minorities. it was a touché issue specially after Hitler took over.there was no Joke with Germans

[Kukapetal]

No, it was an artificial construct made by smashing three ethnic groups together into an artificial nation. Hence why it eventually split along ethnic lines. Wait, so when it did finally split in half, who was robbing whom? Did the Czechs rob the Slovaks or vice versa? Another mystery for the ages.

Again, you make no good argument for why "my" leaders' arguments were wrong back in 1938. (for the 800th time, I'm an American and I wasn't born back then).

[Kukapetal]

The arguments, again, are that the germans were the ethnic majority their, they had come to be so through peaceful means rather than through violence, and they wanted to be a part of Germany. You've said nothing to refute that. Your logic seems to be "Well, the Nazis used that argument, so it's automatically wrong!" The Nazis were assholes, but not everything they said or thought was wrong. Why shouldn't a natural ethnic majority have the right to decide what nationality it wants to be?

[Kukapetal]

Also, Poland was respectful to its minorities?

Wow, does anyone have any Depends, because I think I might wet myself from laughing at that statement.

[arka67]

Poland was an anti-Semitic country at the time 1938 , still is to same degree. But it was a democratic country had it's laws to protect minorities.

[dturtleneck]

Czechoslovakia was as artificial as the German or Austrian empires were.

[arka67]

that's a very good point

Austrian and German empire was a legitimate state, BUT in regards to territories which they have took possession in previous years. It was not legitimate !!!

Just because German nationals have lived there, territory historically was part of Czech, Poland or other state.

[Kukapetal]

All empires are somewhat artificial, but at least the german one was mostly ethnic German. The Austrian was multi-ethnic and it is good that it was broken up. But Czechoslovakia was also artificial because it was multi-ethnic too. There were Czechs, Germans, Slovaks and others. It should have been divided along ethnic lines, with the german parts going to Germany and the Czech and Slovak parts going to their respective ethnic groups. That would have been fair to all the people living there.

[arka67]

Bohemia was part of Austria for 400 years ! and you Czech wanted the freedom!!

wow!!!! what a statement? you really something? You really think that Germany owns Europe. 400 years earlier Czech also wanted freedom. You just took it away !!

[Nippon131]

Invasion?? Ha ha... Germans lived in Czech kingdom only due to mercy from czech king Premysl Otakar II., but the land where they lived was czech! Look for the historical maps and there you can easily find a borders of a Czech kingdom and after Czechoslovakia. Both nationts lived together for hundreds years without problems. Only Swine Hitler looked some really false problems (of course without evidence).

[Nippon131]

You are quite ignorant and stupid! Czechs and Germans (living in czech lands) lived together without problems until the time when the Greatest Murder in whole history of people, Hitler, was not in a post of had of Germany. He fabricated of false stories about problematic relations.

[FightingforTRUE]

You are an real idiot. I am not Check, but I am happy that Germany lost War. Because they still think what Hitler told them! YOU ARE BANDITS YOURSELF!!!

[arka67]

You moved there and you claim its yours. It was yours, and then you wanted more and more. Glogow became Glagau, Poznan Posen , Warszawa Warshaw. Extermination , assimilation , prosecution. Germany was treading its Slavic neighbors like dirt, and you are an example that Germany did not change that much. Finnly in 1945 Slavs pushed you back ! and now all you can do, is SIT AND CRY. You Dumb Fuck piece of Shit.

[arka67]

Stalin made you go where you belong, Germans are all over the world, Today they estimate over 2 min Germans still living Russia, go and claim Walga river as a part of Germany. Just because Germans are in Poland this do not makes it Germany. You have been moving East over centuries. Moravia Bohemia Silesia those are all Slavic areas, populated by Germans over hundreds of years

[xgalba00]

In Sudetenland in Czechoslovakia, which were given to Hitler by covard Britain and France to appease Hitler we had bigger fortification than Maginote line in France and also if you don't know it Skoda Works, 2nd biggest factory in Europe producing arms and Panzer tanks, which Hitler wanted so badly. Therefore the attack on Poland and then on France was so fast (Blitzkrieg)

[383335029]

France and United Kingdom= the biggest traitors

[nikdohad]

In 1938 Great Britain and France betray Czechoslovakia, and let Nazi Germany to steal part of our land. Only Serbs stay with us -- 60 000 serbs volounteers was ready to help us.

I will never forget!!!

KOSOVO IS SERBIA!!!

[Redtide]

Well, my Dad told me that the British tanks are chased by Japanese bicycles in our part of the world.. balls-less piece of English shit..

[express770]

This newsreel has typical English quality. Particularly the sound.

[pardomauri]

it`s a shit

[djtrip83]

with audio would have been even better!

[kokpit]

Poor quality but very interesting for me, thank you!