Hybrid Supercharger

[Warblade118]

Supercharger manufacturers have already found a way to nearly eliminate the parasitic loss of a supercharger while cruising. It's called a by-pass valve. According to Magnuson, on the M112, it only takes 1/3 of a HP to drive that supercharger in by-pass mode at 60mph.

Doesn't that pretty much render a electric supercharger in a street application moot?

[starionnsw]

24 volt nissan thats a good ki

[HondaKillerG]

My question is just how much electricity does this burn? If it's far more than the alternator can provide and does create a equal amount of power then it's not really worth it....

[oobuc5]

this has to be the best blow job iv seen

[Henzzman]

If you want power,all you have to do is get a huge ass blower with supercharger,cut a hole in your hood and stick it to your engine.Not to play around with vacuum cleaners.

[Draco1180]

this isn't a hybrid supercharger, its an electric supercharder, and i'll decrease your mpg cuz it'll put a load on the alternator, creating resistance for the engine. plus, the little computer that controls the rpm of that motor to keep the boost correct with give it lag, therefore, it would be cheaper and more effective to just buy a supercharger and bolt it on in the firstplace

[scarble]

Very cool Msharer.

Any word on an electric supercharger system actually being used in an automotive application?

Is the plan to use it like a plug-in-hybrid to charge the battery pack?

[007werewolf]

how much boost will this generate...?

[tmason1960]

ill take 2 plz bolt right on my twin 500+ hp will you take an i owe you ?? where are you located at ill be right over

[silver760]

thats one hell of a brushless motor and controller!

[Turbo617]

A turbocharger is easily twice as efficient, lighter, far more simple and reliable.

[viper2788]

i guess as long as its properly hooked up to the intake manifold, theoretically, it should work. how many psi can that thing produce anyway? and how much power does it require?

[aleksankazakov]

The turbine and compressor are high-speed aeromachines, as in a conventional turbocharger. The electrical motors run at speeds in excess of 120,000rpm and when used as generators, generate electricity at 98.5% electrical efficiency. High electrical efficiency is paramount, because there is no mechanical link between the turbine and compressor

[cyther39]

is it similar to turbocharger in cars?

[monandjay]

A turbocharger is a specific type of supercharger that uses engine exhaust to spin a centrifugal air pump.

[danielhattie2000]

wow that little fan moves a lot of air and turns up some rpm

[bensyer]

hahahaha

[free7day]

maybe all of your questions would be answered if you simply read up on how bmw is using an electric forced air unit on one of there cars

p.s. as far as improving gas milage along with horse power, an ecu can be programed to opitmize both.

[DPaqBassBone]

Maybe you should read up on the English language, to learn that you used the incorrect form of "their"

[maflagulator]

okay, speaking from personal/professional experience, not just theory:

During most any driving condition, the engine incurs "pumping losses" which is ENERGY required to inhale the air/fuel charge. If you have a supercharger (like I did) then the compressor is now pushing/assisting that air into the engine. My stock Mustang 5.0L got 16mpg. When I put a Vortech unit on it, I still got 16mpg but I made over 100hp more for when I wanted it. The efficiency of pumping is traded for the power added.

[maflagulator]

This would be far more efficient than a belt-driven compressor as it does not create a parasitic-drag constantly like a supercharger would, but it also consumes little quantities of energy of a long period of time in order to recharge the battery bank. It will even do so while you slow down, etc.

Great idea! :)

[scuzzo7]

Good explanation, that actually makes sense :-p Wouldnt a smaller, less noisy module be capable of reducing drag though?

[Turbo617]

Incorrect. Read up on your thermodynamics. The energy lost in conversion of mechanical energy to electric and back is much worse than a straight belt connection to the crankshaft and FAR worse than using the waste exhaust energy.

[scuzzo7]

That's beside my point and somewhat incorrect. Hybrid implies an electronic propulsion, this isn't that, this compresses air on the intake of the engine, again, allowing more air in and therefore more fuel in.

This can, in no way, save fuel, just produce more power by giving the engine the capability to burn more fuel. Notice, by the way, the immense cables and a voltage (or rpm?) check instead of an air flow meter. How is that information relative?

[tjbrownj]

Supposedly (I'm no mechanic) cars are tuned by the factory to run rich. If you were not to increase the amount of fuel injected then the extra air would just serve for a power increase, not added consumption, which would mean you're getting more HP for the same amount of fuel. I'm not sure if that is 100% true, but that's how I assume it would work (not saying I necessarily believe it, I need to see statistical proof first).

[scuzzo7]

Good theory but the engine management system checks the amount of airflow on the intake, so the more air it detects, the longer it lets the injectors blow gasoline into the cylinders. In other words, use more fuel.

[scuzzo7]

How does a supercharger increase efficiency? As far as i can understand it, it increases fuel consumption even if its not powered by the engine, simply because the point of a supercharger is to force more air in so there can be more fuel injected.. The only advantage, if you want to call it that, is that an engine can remain smaller while producing the same amount of power as a larger, heavier engine. Like in a smart car, however, on conventional engines it can dramatically shorten its lifespan.

[Msharer]

You are correct, it does allow the use of a smaller engine. However, it also uses energy stored in a battery bank during periods of cruise when needed for acceleration. In this manner the electrically driven supercharger, which operates independent of engine speed, represents a simple, attractive and cost-effective means of hybridization.

[scuzzo7]

Check my post above, even if you use stored power (even plug in) this device adds air, so the car adds fuel, its that simple. The air is not combustible or propelling so this doesn't constitute a hybrid system.

In short: The electric power is NOT converted to a driving force, hence, no hybrid.

[Eigdooog]

Even though its 5 months ago and you maybe dont care now BUT are these items a worthless waste of time and not worth buying from anwhere? Thanks

[scuzzo7]

I would think there's much better and more interesting ways to increase efficiency. I'm looking into dramatic fuel pre-heating, bringing it near boiling point prior to injection.

[mzdamx3rs]

thats stupid throw a big turbo on there with a restrictive exhaut and youll have exactly what you want. b getting it close to ignition temp it causes pre ignition or detonation, which will blow a hole in your piston crack a ring. bringing the fuel temp up would cause it to ignite to early in the compression stroke... maybe on a diesel it would work but a spark plug ignites fuel perfectly at a synchronized time

[scuzzo7]

True, but that's not possible for very small engines, although i know that wasnt what we were talking about here. I did figure out your point though and you're right, a normal well tuned engine would blow a gasket/piston/valve with prolonged usage of heated fuel.

It basically makes the fuel go near-gas before being detonated, spraying it only turns it into small drops which burn a lot slower.

[mrmichaelcross]

heating your fuel will drop your power output. try running your fuel lines threw the A.C. unit. it will cool the fuel and make it combust at the correct time

[boogdennard]

yes that is true heat is bad! the 200x ford lightning concept has a supercooler they run a fuel line thru the A/C condenser to supercool the fuel i wish they made it i would love to have it

[Draco1180]

@boogdennard actually its an intercooler and it cools the air comming out of the supercharger because the supercharger that they used is a roots style supercharger, and that type generates a warm air charger, so they put an intercooler to cool the air charge down to make it more efficient

[boogdennard]

@boogdennard yes they have a intercooler i have a 2001 an it has one but the 200x has a intercooler and a cupercooler also

[mrmichaelcross]

@boogdennard my brother had a 380 bens its fuel lines were routed threw the ac. if heat wer a good thing people wouldnt waste money on expencive innercoolers

[hhohydrogen]

@Msharer make an electric car instead

[Draco1180]

@scuzzo7 actually, a supercharger decreases your fuel consumption because your using the engine to drive it, and since the supercharger creates resistance it will require more fuel, and the fact that in large boost applications you need to add more fuel to keep the fuel to air ratio rich. and also, it would only decrease the life of the engine if it wasn't built for handling the boost

[therotaryrocket]

@scuzzo7 if it allows use of a smaller engine to get the same power, then you'll be saving gas by using a smaller engine...but still have the same power. yes, it's as simple as that and you already said it! Well I can't really think of how else it would increase efficiency, anybody?

[stupidplants]

@therotaryrocket more power= less effort required to do same amount of work lets say you gotta move something heavy up a flight of stairs would you rather have A: a 95lb woman or B: 220lb man carry it up? they are both capable but by the time the woman gets to the top she will be very tired and ask for food (body fuel) where as the man will get it up the steps with no problem and expect a thank you and nothing else. make sense? i dont know if its right but it makes sense right?

[HondaKillerG]

@stupidplants He would be able to do it more efficiently, but he'd still need the same amount of food she would, all else being equal.

[stupidplants]

@HondaKillerG

it would take more effort (energy) for the smaller person (less powerful engine) to do the same amount of work.

[HondaKillerG]

@stupidplants You don't say....

If you're talking about engines, though, the basis for forced induction is to pump in more air so that you can burn more fuel. There's a reason N/A cars that are turbocharged usually need a fuel delivery system upgrade.

[HondaKillerG]

@therotaryrocket Getting the same amount of power in a smaller engine requires the same amount of gas that you'd use in the larger engine. The only thing that might increase efficiency is if the engine was lighter....

[stupidplants]

@scuzzo7

the way i always understood those claims are, you increase the amount of power available, the less your engine has to work to get the same job done. like a 95 lb woman and 220lb man both trying to move the same object up a flight of steps.

make sense to you? i dont even know if its right, but it makes sense to me.

[Liftium]

@scuzzo7 OK I'll try to explain, forcing more air to the piston creates even bigger pressure after compression stroke, which means fuel burns with more efficiency giving you more power, you don't always have to add more fuel, you just making about 70% efficiency out of fuel instead of 40%.

[HondaKillerG]

@Liftium You'd have to do some serious tuning for that to work; just slapping that on wouldn't do.

[bularandall]

HOw long will the 36 volt setup work before a recharge is needed? Most electric superchargers have a consistant run time of only 15 seconds at a time. Is it the same for your unit ( supercharger)....LOL!

[stevenpneh]

looks like a starter motor with some kind of fan.

[krishields]

What is this running on - compress air (what PSI) ??

[Msharer]

For this test, we are using a 36VDC bank of batteries. The motor will operate from 14 - 54VDC. The test shows a high efficiency brushless motor (eCycle SolidSlot) close coupled to an Ogura supercharger. The result is an extremely powerful, electric supercharger that can be applied to almost any internal combustion engine. The result is more power, better fuel economy, less pollution.