"O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors; they are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them. Verily Allah guideth not a people unjust. (The Noble Quran, 5:51)"
What does theese muslims say who are taking help and protection from nato to kill gaddafi?? This so called "jihad" in Libya is fake and the opposition har a bunch of criminals!!
The flag on his face is secular. Democracy goes against the basic principle which is tawhid Al-Hakamiyah which is that rule is for Allah. May Allah guide the Muslims.
@jihadifanclub they dont openly want sharia. You hear what you want to hear. Didn't you hear the young woman say she wants democracy? The interviewer tricks her into a position where she can't answer but silence is not approval. Like the koran says about marrying children, that its approved by the child by her (notice its only her not him) silence. Its 2011, ... we dont roll that way no mo! Thank God.
@CCDevlin I'm sure you know much more about the community that I live in than I do. I am even sure you know more about the woman in the video that has traveled to Libya and said the people their want Islam implemented in their government. No use of arguing because you will see sooner or later (God Willing).
@jihadifanclub my friend the woman in the video wants islam in her government. But she also strongly opted for democracy. And you cannot deny this. And this was my point all along that there are moderate muslims in the world. This is not a western made label. This is an obervation. Just like you have extremist vegetarians and extremist athletes. Its all about the character of the individual. Now I'm not denying muslims want islam. Ofcourse they do. Do they want full blown shariah? Alot do not.
@CCDevlin The point is that she says the people in Libya want Islam which is millions of people. When we say Islam we mean shariah. Shariah is every rule in regualtion in Islam from going to the toilet to buying and selling. Like the gentlemen said we are not able to over turn laws that Islam makes clear. Hence this is not a democracy because a democracy is not based upon religious laws. If we can't over turn the laws that Islam says then that means we Must follow all the laws of Islam
@jihadifanclub And when she will say her nakedness (what a word for hair) is a sinn, what do you think she will say when you ask her what she should be wearing according to her? A hijaab or a nikaab? You see there is a difference in interpretation. Im sure you have a clear idea of what she should wear. But she might see it different. And that is IF she feels she is sinful now. Because koran only states a womans beauty must be covered. And elsewhere it states she must cover her boozem. Not face.
@CCDevlin In Islam people have diffrent interpretations most people think hijab is enough. But like in any society we simply obey the law of that land. Muslims go by Quran and Sunnah not just Quran, that is a basic nessesity in Islam.
@jihadifanclub sorry but you saying that muslims obey the laws of the country you are in is a lie. The fundamentalists will always try to push their will in a country that has laws against their personal beliefs. Like when a country (turkey, france, belgium, holland) says no nikaab, people will be demonstrating in the streets. So actually its a false statement since we were actually discussing the very hijaab and nikaab when you made that statement.
@CCDevlin What I ment is when it comes to hijab or niqab that issue will be up to the MUSLIM ruler and people wil simply haft to obey in an ISLAMIC state.
@jihadifanclub i think you're in denial and make yourself believe that for instance that young women has the exact same beliefs as you. I strongly think she does not. She said she wants democracy. Stop denying that.
@CCDevlin I'm not in denial, the video shows that many Muslims are ignorant about Islam but all want Islam as a political system. You can see the confusion that comes up because democracy is such a vague word and means diffrent things to diffrent people. The media trries to paint a picture that Muslims want secularism like in the liberal West. This is not true what Muslims want is closer to Shariah hence people saying you can't change the Quran so alcohol would be banned.
@jihadifanclub you clearly don't know much about Islamic dogma and its effects. This is because you were not raised as a Muslim and see it as a fairytale. Muslims generally come from very strict systems where its considered haram to even criticize anything that has to do with islam. Thats why the interviewer is so "clever" with his questions. Many Muslims dont dare to reply in a way that will make them look like they would oppose or deny Islam. Because this is seen as a great shame. I could do
@jihadfanclub .. (cont) the same interview and steer them into saying they want democracy in every possible way. My point being: this is how people in Islamic countries win elections even, always using Islam because no one dares to speak up and critisize them after they've used the Islam in their speech. Bottom line: you can't start thinking for them and try to trick them into sharia. They must choose sharia! And you (including the interviewer) do not want this. You want to impose.
@jihadifanclub AND you might say: how do i know they dont want sharia? Well did you notice the lady. Did she wear a nikaab? Or even a Hijaab? Did she? No. She didnt. So based on that information, would you say she is happy to see sharia (Taliban, Iran) in her country Lybia? Please I want you to think about this. If you want her to have free will about it, notice that she's already got free will while she's talking to the interviewer. And she's doing so without a headcover. Which is her right.
@CCDevlin Many Muslims do not obey all the rules but it still does not mean they don't want to live under an Islamic system . Do all people that support democray and want to live under democracy vote? No. A Muslim can't be a Muslim if they reject Shariah. Muslims see Shariah as a perfect and when we disobey Shariah we see that as a flaw within ourselves and not the Shariah. The woman that is uncovered will tell you that her nakedness is a result of her sinning not that the Shariah is wrong.
@FatNThoed you are a bit silly. The woman is being trapped by his trick questions. Did you see a hijaab or nikaab on this woman? No. So would you say she wants sharia ? Absolutely not. I can guarantee you that she does not want sharia. She wants islam in her politics ofcourse. But thats different from getting sharia. Sharia means a lot of bad things for this young lady. So no, she won't vote for it. Thank God.
I see the people judging others on the comments, I dont think Prophet Muhammad (saas) judged others and called them Kafirs. Learn your deen, and never say that so and so isnt a muslim because of something they dont do.
This kaffir says "I don't wanna get into it" because she's a liar and not a true Muslim. I honestly think she was planted there. NO Muslim woud say the things she said ( No true Muslim).
Prophet Muhammad left flexibility in the form of government, and the leaders were chosen through several methods.
The appointed representatives of the Madina tribes gave him the Oath of Allegiance...they were "representing their people"...that is a fundamental principle of democracy.
You are not allowed to prohibit something that he did not, especially when you are forcing YOUR selective explanation of the word "democracy"
@islamophobia4dummies as the example of Mu’adh ibn Jabal shows there is no flexibility in "the form of government" because after this exchange between them the Messenger of Allah(saw) said, “Praise be to Allah for guiding the Messenger of Allah to what Allah and His Messenger love."So it is either islam or something else (aka kufr) in which we rule by and Muhammad(saw) would never praise Allah Ta'ala for the something else
@islamophobia4dummies i don't think the brother is forcing a selective explanation, he is simply pointing out two things that are common to every strain or variant of democracy which is that man decides the halal and haram and how its adoption sickens the minds and understanding of muslims so that they begin to believe and promote democracy and islam as one in the same.Now how sick is that for anyone to think themselves or others better suited in setting the limits than Allah Ta'ala
even in America, the US government cannot force the brother to practice anything haram.
In Sharia, a non-Muslim does not have to follow Sharia. For example, Christians and Jews can drink wine and eat pork, as it is not unlawful in their books.
No Islamic government in history has attempted to change what is halal and haram. And if an Islamic leader tries to do something against Islam, then people should speak out.
Allah told us what is halal and haram, and no "Islamic" government (modern or even the corrupt ones after Khulafa Alrashideen), ever dared to claim what is halal or haram.
Islam cannot be "voted out"...it is not a president or a parliament.
So what do YOU do in a country with a Muslim minority...Democracy is not by nature secular, but how do you live with yourself living in a secular democracy like the US.
@islamophobia4dummies Please notice how you and other muslims here (and all over the world) are always about "the rules". Thats not faith! You think you are a good Muslim if you dont eat pork and dont drink? These are just the sidelines of faith my friend. The little advices that your prophet made. And yet you chose this to be your expression of religion. Absolutely mindboggling. Why not live in peace with your neighbour instead of trying to rattle their tales and try to change them into you?
you are missing the point. That is to say that Islam would be the basis of any decisions, laws, constitution, judicial system, commercial courts...but Islam does not specify 1 way ONLY to select the leader, OR how to make the laws, OR how to make the courts, OR how to police the country, etc.
Don't tell me you think that quote would be enough to run a country.
@islamophobia4dummies also Allah Ta'ala says in Quran 5:49 "and so rule among them by what Allah has revealed" and in 48:28, 9:33 61:9 Allah Ta'ala informs us that ruling is very much the intent of islam
to Muslims oppressed by dictators, "democracy" means being liberated from their oppressors. Stop attacking Muslims for using terminology that the rest of the world understands. There are dozens of types of democracies, many of which would be perfectly compatible in Islamic law.
@islamophobia4dummies The very definition of Democracy in its essence is Anti Islam. It is therefore incorrect to associate the purity and light of Islam with the darkness and impurity of Man Made Law. If Democracy is truly a means of understanding Liberation this evil incorrect and ignorant mentality needs to change in the Ummah. Muslims need to educate themselves on the superiority of Islam and Shariah and understand the shirk and cancer of democracy.
there are many definitions of democracy, and you are forcing your negative meanings to people who are looking at the parts/definitions that are not in contradiction with Islam. And stop comparing "Islam" vs. "Democracy"...democracy is not a religion and fixed set of beliefs about God.
How can you label "democracy" as cancer, when MOST people view it in a positive light, and there are many aspects that are there in Islam. You cannot force your negative meaning on people.
@islamophobia4dummies sorry i thought you were against democracy. We probably differ on other things hence my comment on your statements earlier. But I m glad to hear a voice of reason between the nuts. You understand that democracy can be positive and certainly can go along side islam.
You see, one of the simplest and ONLY agreed upon principle of democracy is the rule of the people. This is in the roots of the word- dêmos (δῆμος, which means "people") and krátos (κράτος, which means "force" or "power"). Therefore, "people power". This being a FOUNDATIONAL principle of democracy is clearly at odds with Islam. As the brother in the video state from the Qur'an, "Verily the judgment is for Allah."
and what do Muslim "people" do if they have an unjust ruler? if they speak up, which Prophet Muhammad encouraged, then they are able to use "people power" in an Islamic way.
Everyone in Egypt, Tunisia, etc mean by "democracy" that they can elect their own leaders, rather than have a dictator.
@islamophobia4dummies why do you insist that democracy is just about voting or electing a leader? As history has witnessed inspite of whatever is imagined or idealized concerning democracy its practice has always come with man deciding the halal and haram
what I am saying is that the question that this video asks is FALSE....he is insisting on a secular definition of democracy, which would not be compatible with Islam, and which is not what Libyans and Egyptians are asking for.
There is no contradiction in Islam of Muslims to choose the leader...Prophet Muhammad did not prohibit this.
If you mean that the western "democracies" are hypocrites, then you are right, but we should still get to choose our leaders.
@islamophobia4dummies Again as history has witnessed inspite of whatever is imagined or idealized concerning democracy its PRACTICE has always come down to man deciding the halal and haram.yes the muslims have a right to choose their leader to rule them by shariah this is islam but democracy in contradiction to islam gives the muslims an option that Allah Ta'ala did not give them and that is to be ruled by other than shariah.so how is that you think these to be one and the same?
@islamophobia4dummies Allah Ta'ala has warned and forbidden the believers(2:104,4:46) from adopting "shell game terminologies" of which democracy,freedom and human rights very much are. There is a real danger in this like what we are witnessing of western intervention in libya where the enemies of islam feeling themselves welcomed to intervene by the muslims incessant call for democracy.
@islamophobia4dummies this shell game term human rights has no place in the narration of islamic history because what islam gave to slaves,women,etc was islam itself and the rights that come from it , rights as measured and shaped by Allah Ta'ala not human rights which is measured and shaped by man.42:17 if man can strike the balance(Mizaan) then of what purpose is the revelation?
@islamophobia4dummies and i am sorry to tell you that your beloved democracy with its false liberation has only given the muslims the option to freely NOT worship AllahTa'ala.and in case you forgot this worship of Allah Ta'ala has always came as something ordered and commanded (22:77,57:28,etc) not as something optional for the muslims.
Ibn Kathir: "meaning, 'Do not force anyone to become Muslim',..."
The verse was revealed to prevent some Muslims from trying to revert their children back to Islam (after having vowed them to Judaism through a pre-Islamic custom). This verse can't be abrogated, as clarified by the end of the verse: "... And he who rejects false deities and BELIEVES in Allah has grasped a firm handhold ..."
@islamophobia4dummies 2:256 applies to the non-muslims only so your quote of ibn kathir is correct as it has nothing to do with those who are already muslim/post shahadatain.i know this offends your very mordernist/democratic sensibilities but as i stated before islam(its systemic implimentation) liberated from that which stood in the way of the command to worship while only giving the non muslims the right to "freely worship"and to think otherwise would not only foolishly contradict all...
what offends me is people who want to force their ideas about Islam on me, especially when it contradicts with the majority of Islamic scholars.
what offends me is people who are so intolerant of other Islamically based opinions (that of the Sunni Majority schools of thought) that they would label everyone else's ideas as "modernist/democratic".
There is nothing HARAM about Muslims choosing our leader, and محرم الحلال كمحلل الحرام
@islamophobia4dummies Now i know you are purposely trying to mislead away from the haqq.Look your quote "There is nothing HARAM about Muslims choosing our leader" is correct IF this is done from an islamic aqeedah based platform and thereby achieving what pleases Allah Ta'ala which is ruling by what He Ta'ala has revealed but if you insist that this should be done on a democratic platform thereby pleasing shaytan and company then you are clearly in error and trying to mislead away from the haqq
@islamophobia4dummies Your quote is so open ended and democratically loaded it is like "There is nothing HARAM about Muslims choosing their partner" or "There is nothing HARAM about Muslims choosing to have sex" both quotes would be correct IF within the confines of what islam has dictated such as wali,marriage,no marriage of same-sex,no marriage to atheist,etc.but both are wrong if and when we insist on the modernist/democractic/western standard
@islamophobia4dummies As for Islamically based opinions you have presented like the one by ibn kathir have actually been against your argument itself and as to the others they were not so islamic.i myself am not trying to force anything,i am simply challenging with the haqq you and all others who envision and seek to create an islam in the image of democracy.the muslims are not obligated to follow the "majority of Islamic scholars"but we are obligated to follow what we find of the strongest ...
@islamophobia4dummies islamic evidence.This bayat you speak of was the first bayat of al aqabah and was in effect this group just taking shahadah like the sahaba in mecca who took the shahadah before them where at this point if an individual committed a sin then there was really no consequence in this life because the entity of the islamic state which impliments and enforces the shariah did not exist at that point but was established when Muhammad(saw) along the muslims of mecca ...
@islamophobia4dummies made the hijra the madina where Muhammad(saw) took the position of Head of State and where then the legislative ayat began to be revealed.
Your Lord is best aware of you. If He will, He will have mercy on you, or if He will, He will punish you. We have not sent thee (O Muhammad) as a warden over them.
You do not know of what you speak...who is the scholar from where you get your ideas?
فسألوا أهل الذكر إن كنتم لا تعلمون
21:7 {Ask the followers of the Reminder if ye know not}
@islamophobia4dummies I see now you wanna talk scholars, man stop playin. i have no interest in playing scholar cards with you where i'll see your scholar and i'll raise you another scholar because there's no point to that exchange and besides you can't even understand whats basic and fundamental concerning islam nor your beloved democracy.So this is where i sign off saying fare well mr.dummies with your beloved cheating whore democracy
brother, this depends entirely on the definition. It is clear that your definition is not the same as all definitions, nor is it correct for you to force your definition on all of humanity.
also, please refrain from making fatwas about what is haram, as Prophet Muhammad pbuh said:
"The most daring to make fatwa are the most daring to hell fire"
@islamophobia4dummies that we know of islamic history but also what is clearly understood of the punishments for muslims drinking alcohol,apostasy,zina,non payment of zakat,etc.If 2:256 was meant to apply to muslim then why the prohibition and punishment/law and order of islam?So you see LIBERATION comes only after the COMMAND this was true then as we know the start of the revelation to Muhammad(saw) began with a command to align himself and adhere to this blessed message and the liberation...
Muslims have a right to privacy, even if they commit sins "And Do Not Spy". It is not your job to invade a Muslim's privacy to FORCE them to not commit a sin, or to punish them for committing a sin in private.
Read the BAY3A given by the tribal representatives of Madina, and focus on what happens to people who commit sins:
1) if caught and purified
2) if not caught, and maybe God fogives them and maybe He punishes them
@islamophobia4dummies came later and holds true now where this ummah will continue to be without liberation until we align ourselves and adhere to what has been ordered and commanded by islam once again
It seems as if people are confusing ijmaa3 with democracy. These terms are not interchangeable. Find me ONE place with the Sunnah of the Prophet (SAWS), where people came out and voted. You will not find any like this. Part of the problem is that people are not correctly understanding democracy. I am Poli. Sci Masters students and I know for a fact scholars in my field still can't properly define the term- "democracy."
As far as we are concerened in Islam the Church is the State and there is no separation. Shariah Law is the only governing Constitution we need and shall always stand the test of time. We will never implement democracy in terms of the Western ideology by making amendments to a flawed system of Law. When a new Leader (Khalifa) is needed it is up to the people to select, choose, or vote (democratic process) based on what our beloved Nabi said and that is to choose a wise, pious follower of Shariah
Salaams to all, I believe the main point is being missed. The question asked to everyone is a catch "22". The way the brother is asking this question is understandable, but there is a BIG difference in the term democracy when applied to a Islamic country.Our Prophet said so and showed us how 'democracy should be implemented in an Islamic country. Which is to select (vote) a leader who is righteous and obeys the Shariah Law.It was the people that selected each Khalifa based on the above criteria
I wish all you muslims would go to one big country and stay out of the West. These muslims are here in the nice Western World running their mouths, because they have freedom here. They only have freedom here, because you are in a Christian, Western World. We have it nicer than you ever had it, and you know it. You come here to live a nicer life, yet you talk about fucking Islamic rule. Your Islam has kept you living like donkeys in the Sixteenth Century. You are a backwards people...stupid
@TropikalWaves The West didnt give humans the right to speak up. & exactly what part of Western rule is compatible with your version of christianity? Because I can name a thousand instances where it is NOT.
@dawahworks There is more freedom in the Western World. You can't hide from that truth. Islamic nations never provide great personal freedoms. The more Islamic the nation, the less personal freedoms one has (and the bigger hell hole the nation is!). America's shortcomings are only a result of it's failure to more closely follow Christianity, democracy, and capitalism. These are three winning ingredients. The USA is still the wealthiest nation in the history of the earth. Try again.LOL
Islam is definitely the problem. The rest of the world can see it clearly. Muslims fight with themselves and everyone else they come into contact with, no matter where they travel. Islam is an evil religion!!
@TropikalWaves I DISAGREE! I think that it's ARAB CULTURE that has led to DESTRUCTION of Arab nations. Cultures such as FEMALE GENITAL MUTILATION and so-called "HONOUR KILLINGS" have brought misery to parts of the Arab world. These beliefs are NOT ISLAMIC AT ALL!
In fact in Sudan Christian and Animists ALSO practice Female circumcision. Notice that there are a lot of Arabs in Sudan? This proves my point.
Islam like Christianity is based on SCRIPTURE. Most don't follow scripture properly.
In a nutshell, i think what they want is a democratic right to elect their leaders. Leaders who can implement and maintain the justice, law and order, the basis of which would be the Shariah. There can be laws which may not be directly from the shariah, like the maximum speed you can drive, traffic rules, there are aspects where shariah is silent on, the govt can make laws for that within the framework of shariah. Would such a system be against the teachings of Islam ? (honest question)
@lessirey traffic regulation of roads and hwys,air traffic control,and traffic regulation of the waterways and sea ports are all technical issues and very much a legitimate shura issue that will require the real Leader who is established by the islamic bayah method to consult those with the technical knowledge of how best to develope and manage these infrastructures that are very necessary in todays world. the shariah did not remain silent on the matters of this nature.we have many examples ...
@lessirey where the Prophet(saw) sought the technical knowledge and advice of those with the expertise in that area such when he consulted salman (ra) for the digging of the ditch.
@4onetimeonly Thanks for answering, by sharia remaining silent, i meant cases where there arent explicit rules and regulations laid out specifically on certain matters. As you said, these are technical matters, and can be decided by man according to their own environment WITHIN the framework of shariah.
In todays world, how would a nation practically transform from a Dictatorial govt to a Caliphate ? and how can we implement the bayah method ?
ps: honest questions with no additional intentions
@lessirey the people(especially those of power/army) of that nation must come to the resolve of islam as the only solution and alternative and support and align themselves with those groups or parties who from day one of their establishment has recognized the re-implementation of islamic system/khilafah as the crown of obligations and have adopted the methodology of the Prophet(saw) to acheive it .in my opinion initially the bayah will come from those aforementioned people of power/army just as
agree, but i would argue that its a highly idealistic situation, considering the current situations. take Egypt as an example, Mubarak has tried his best to suppress any kind of revival of the ummah.
The core problem here is that muslims themselves are not educated about islam & shariah, their knowledge is week, they have been brainwashed by the media for years.Though they have revolted, they have not revolted to bring shariah. In such a circumstance, how would we deal with this?
The concept would be against Islam because you would be attributing the right to elect a leader to other than Islam as if Islam is not sufficient. Islam is the only system that actually elects the leader by POPULAR VOTE. Therefore there is no need to call for any democracy. Islam is sufficient from beginning to end.
I think you are assuming that iam somehow against shariah, which is not true.
Iam totally for the shariah, but iam asking about how do you implement shariah in todays circumstances ?
people's mind need to be conditioned, it has been corrupted by years of media manipulation under dictatorial govts to the extend that even many muslims themselves hate, or are afraid of shariah. Shariah need to be implemented, but how do we go about doing it ? in practical terms i mean.
@lessirey Practically, those movements that have been calling for shariah the whole while need to move forward. They would organize an election of a Khalifah that will implement Islam over us. Also Majlis Shuraa would be appointed from the sincere Ulama as a check & balance system. The "new" laws will be made known by way of TV & radio & the Muslims will conform. Agenda #1 will be totally internal to restore the dignity we lost. Then inshaAllah Allah (swt) will once again smile upon our Ummah.
@lessirey we cannot adopt any methodology to restore Allah's rule that was not implemented by Rasoolullah (saw). This includes partmental implementations.
The Ummah has been under the extreme oppression of tyrants for far to long & the Ummah has born it the whole while. We must trust that the Ummah is far overdue for the dignity & justice of Islam. & believe me, even though the rulers have fully embraced kufr, the Ummah never has. She desires the dignity that only Islam can deliver. NOW!
but didnt the prophet implement the rules and regulations step by step ? like in the case of alcohol?
I've been in touch with many protestors in egypt from the beginning of the revolution, and the overwhelming picture i get from most of them are that they just want freedom and not at all interested in any shariah, while only a minority want it. The reason? Fear due 2 Pure lack of knowledge.
How would we practically bring shariah there? when muslims themselves doesnt like it there?
@lessirey No, Muhammad (saw) implemented Islam AS IT WAS REVEALED. We have it complete now. Therefore we have no excuses.
You have ayat addressing Makkan period (not under Islam) that addressed alcohol "morally", then the Maddani ayat (under Islamic rule) that addressed alcohol legislatively (including punishments).
Islam was revealed gradually YES. However Islam was IMPLEMENTED immediately.
agreed, but my point of concern is still remains. how do we implement shariah when the majority of a population is misguided about it? when they fear and dislike shariah ?
Yes, the majority of the population are muslims, but the dictatorial govt has brainwashed the minds of many.
from my observation, shariah can be implemented when people support it. How do we get there without educating them ? we currently only have worst examples of nations those who pretend to implement shariah
@lessirey No where in Islam does it say the "majority" must support truth before it can be implemented. Like you said 'they are MISGUIDED'.
Spain was majority kuffar & so was Madinah @ 1st, yet these where Islamic indeed.
& I agree that education is 1st. But like I said prior: All the avenues of media, schools, Masajid, etc... will be used to educate the masses. This way the misconceptions will be eradicated. We can do this with a smooth transition within... despite the western opposition.
Majority support isnt necessary, but they are actively opposing it due to their ignorance. People rather welcomed islam in Madhinah and spain. Unfortunately the reality in the ground is saddening, many consider shariah as oppressive and blind, due to examples set by some nations who pretent to implement sharia and due 2 yrs of intensive brainwashing & scaremongering.
Like you said, we shouldnt mind western opposition, but we should arm the people with courage, knowledge & dignity.
@lessirey Yet & still the Khilafah will return as promise by our beloved Rasool (saw). We can be part of the promise or obstacles.
Also Al-Khilafah will not return everywhere at once. It will start in a particular location & begin to annex other Muslim lands even peacefully. Doesnt necessarily need to emerge in a land of Islam haters. Insha Allah (ta) even the haters may began to desire Islam once they witness its true implementation.
btw, the case is very different in Libya as i understand from my limited knowledge and observation.
They are more strong in their deen, atleast i havent noticed much fear or hate against shariah like i saw among the protestors in egypt. I do not know much about other nations.
May Allah let us live in the times of Khilafah and help us regain our dignity and iman.
"Sovereignty belongs to Allah alone but He has delegated it to the State through its people for being exercised within the limits prescribed by Him as a sacred trust. The State shall exercise its powers and authority through the chosen representatives of the people."
"No legislation can be made repugnant to the Quran and Sunnah and this will take precedence over the whole of the Constitution."
@nilo723 Islam is a self cohesive & complete ideology & is NOT in need of uneducated dribble from non-political minded individuals that are too ignorant to accept it truly for what it is without bid3a. If you dont like Islam then please leave peacefully & not persist to corrupt its essence.
@nilo723 Actually it was mentalities such as yours that lead to the demise of Islam as a system. Never was a dumber statement uttered than "Islamic democracy". Next you will start calling for a "Trinity of Tawheed".
@dawahworks Democracy does not equal to secularism..Democracy means rule of the majority..
In any case if some group tries to impose its will on the majority, regardless of whether they are munafiqeen or momineen, the majority would fight back and defeat them..
Doesn't matter if you dig up your head in sand and refuse to listen, the fact remains that the Khilafah was destroyed by the Saudi Wahhabi movement..And its their distorted picture of Islam is what has messed up some people's brains..
@nilo723 Islam opposes your "rule of the majority". Allah (swt) is sovereign n Islam.
Selecting/electing a ruler thru voting is Wasilah (means) but the source of ruling is Tareeqah (method).
& Not even n Democracies r the majority given their way. E.g: The majority want the US troops home, but policy is made by the elites.
& wat wuld u democrats rule by while claiming 2 b Muslim? If u say Islam, then y do u keep bringing up MAJORITY RULE??? This means u r no better than the evil Saudi regime.
@dawahworks As i said, the majority's opinion would matter only in selection of rulers, not in legislation..You don't see referendums on judicial matters even in Western countries, so why would Muslim countries be given the option to choose halal and haram..No legislation can be made repugnant to the Quran and Sunnah.
And where does Islam specifically oppose the rule of majority? Plz don't bring up the verse which talks about judicial matters..Infact the Quran clearly lays down rules in (42:38)
@nilo723 If the Majority is only selecting a ruler, then how do you equate this with democracy??? Elections are a process NOT a system itself. You keep saying "rule of the majority" then in the same breath you say "Its only in selecting the ruler". Do you even know what "RULE OF THE MAJORITY means?
Shuraa is only in al-Mubahat (matters of choice) NOT in Halal & Haram.
& as for your question: "Where does Islam specifically oppose the rule of majority?" 18:26, 5:44,45,47 12:40 etc etc etc
@dawahworks As i said, "Plz don't bring up the verse which talks about judicial matters..You don't see referendums on judicial matters even in Western countries, so why would Muslim countries be given the option to choose halal and haram..No legislation can be made repugnant to the Quran and Sunnah.."
Your other references have got nothing to do with rulership or majority..
PS - Seems like you haven't really understood the concept of Democracy and are just taking emotional jibes at it..
@mahdi0123456789 you muslims will get the wrath of God upon you. You all have denied Jesus, the Son of God, so you will spend an eternity away from God. You all are following a false religion that teaches you to continue to live as if it's the Sixteenth Century....lol. No wonder all you muslims love to come into the beautiful, Christian Western World. You can't wait to get out of the nations that Islam ruined!!! **********
@nilo723 : Islam is a gutter religion. Everywhere Islam travels, it spreads poverty and filth. You idiots need to embrace democracy, capitalism, and Jesus Christ before it's too late! You will spend an eternity in hell for denying the Son of God, and you have guilty consciences. All your islamic nations are shit holes....nothing but chaos and poverty. Your islamic leaders have robbed you of all the oil money, and you're too stupid to know it...LMFAO. Stupid musliims.
@nilo723 You are so stupid to follow islam. Islam is a nasty, backwards religion that is only for losers. Islam has you all living as if it's the Sixteenth Century still....LMFAO! You still ride donkeys and camels...lol. mohammed was nothing but a stupid goat herder, who molested little children...some nice religious leader you follow. islam is a horrible religion that only breeds violence wherever it goes!!!
I must say this type of in-your-face-not-caring-about-being-politically-correct-or-your-feeling is highly ineffective. At the end of the day all it does is draw out dividing lines in our communities and draw people away from their deen.
the existence of democracy doesn't necessarily means u have the choice to vote Islam out .......you can lay foundation of uncompromising principles and still give the people the right to choose their leaders ...
@dahiya1 "lay uncompromising principles & still give the people the right to choose their leaders"
Thas basically: Islam. That's the very definition of what an Islamic 'political system' is; this is how it was with Umar's caliphate, 'Uthman, etc.
But unfortunately, democracy [under the guise, or using the guise of "freedom", which apparently seems to be a good concept; 'not being compelled', 'rights'] has a sinister connotation; ISLAM has the good of 'democracy' & is free of its evils.
@abdelbaasit1due to its source(man) there is no good of democracy only a false appearance there of while islam is the khayr due to Allah Ta'ala being its source-2:216” …… But it may happen that you hate a thing which is good for you, and it may happen that you love a thing which is bad for you.Allah knoweth ,you know not.”
@4onetimeonly ya (thanks 4 reminding of this critical Quranic verse), but what I meant 2say was, it contains a 'perceived good'; ie oh we have rights, freedom, we're not under any compulsion/dictatorship.
However, I agree - the sinister connotation in this democracy is that this freedom is 'boundless', limitless & does not respect the Hudud (limits) set by the Creator who alone knows whats good/bad for us. * Yes, Islam has no compulsion, it gives freedom & rights - but under the Law of Allah
@dahiya1 Do you follow the political processes of Democratic governments? Under Democratic governments NO principle is "uncompromising". Except that man has the final say as to what will be lawful & forbidden. Islam doesnt allow Muslims to use Islam as a "foundation" but in the reality act as sovereign.
@ElDiablo458 what exactly is islam suppose to be lying under?again for the muslims there isn't any choice in those matters(such as ruling and the steps to acheive it) where islam has already laid out a course of action-33:36.you asked"WHO SAID WE WANT ISLAM OUT?!" well democracy comes with its own pre set conditions and so whenever democracy is the platform of revival islam being out is always on the table ...
@ElDiablo458 this is the inherent nature of democracy and its conditions and islam will never accept these conditions just as the Prophet (saw) when approaching various tribes to support the launching of islam as system of life some them had conditions that he (saw) out right rejected
Subhan'Allah, sometimes its sad to see that we have Muslims who want to follow Islam and they are sincere brothers and sisters but they've been isolated from Quran & Sunnah for so long that they've forgotten their identities and what Islam really is and this is the reason why they've fallen into the fitnah of dunia where they can't really see what is wrong and what is right and the reasons behind it...
"...He(Allah) shares not His legislation with anyone." Quran 18: 26
May Allah reward you for educating these people akhi (dawahworks) Subhan'Allah they're calling for something they don't even understand, and they think the system of Libya is Islam lol. Ajeeb!! May Allah guide them and us. Ameen!
Pork is the best meat. Yum.
Sinnessa 2 months ago in playlist Uploaded videos
"O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors; they are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them. Verily Allah guideth not a people unjust. (The Noble Quran, 5:51)"
What does theese muslims say who are taking help and protection from nato to kill gaddafi?? This so called "jihad" in Libya is fake and the opposition har a bunch of criminals!!
MrMohammedr9 3 months ago
That non-hijabi talking about wanting Shariah, May Allah guide her so that she can Inshallah perserve Hijab.
Perseveranze 3 months ago
The flag on his face is secular. Democracy goes against the basic principle which is tawhid Al-Hakamiyah which is that rule is for Allah. May Allah guide the Muslims.
john1136 4 months ago
dude with the beard seemed sincere in his knowledge.. the others followed their desires a lil more
MuslimVlogGuy 5 months ago
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MuslimVlogGuy 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
These protesters. Smh..
MuslimVlogGuy 5 months ago
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MuslimVlogGuy 5 months ago
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MuslimVlogGuy 5 months ago
I guess people assume that democracy means "shura" i.e. which is right to an extent,
i think it would be better if you give a lecture on the subject i.e. democracy = law of Man etc
Allah knows best, but MashAllah good effort i guess it makes you realise what people know? i.e. what the view of the average Muslim is.
QuranTafseer 5 months ago
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QuranTafseer 5 months ago
If God exists thers no secularism
- The point that we must make..
penkallli 5 months ago
I'm shocked so many American Muslims openly want Shariah. Good work.
jihadifanclub 6 months ago
@jihadifanclub they dont openly want sharia. You hear what you want to hear. Didn't you hear the young woman say she wants democracy? The interviewer tricks her into a position where she can't answer but silence is not approval. Like the koran says about marrying children, that its approved by the child by her (notice its only her not him) silence. Its 2011, ... we dont roll that way no mo! Thank God.
CCDevlin 5 months ago
@CCDevlin I'm sure you know much more about the community that I live in than I do. I am even sure you know more about the woman in the video that has traveled to Libya and said the people their want Islam implemented in their government. No use of arguing because you will see sooner or later (God Willing).
jihadifanclub 5 months ago
@jihadifanclub my friend the woman in the video wants islam in her government. But she also strongly opted for democracy. And you cannot deny this. And this was my point all along that there are moderate muslims in the world. This is not a western made label. This is an obervation. Just like you have extremist vegetarians and extremist athletes. Its all about the character of the individual. Now I'm not denying muslims want islam. Ofcourse they do. Do they want full blown shariah? Alot do not.
CCDevlin 5 months ago
@CCDevlin The point is that she says the people in Libya want Islam which is millions of people. When we say Islam we mean shariah. Shariah is every rule in regualtion in Islam from going to the toilet to buying and selling. Like the gentlemen said we are not able to over turn laws that Islam makes clear. Hence this is not a democracy because a democracy is not based upon religious laws. If we can't over turn the laws that Islam says then that means we Must follow all the laws of Islam
jihadifanclub 5 months ago
@jihadifanclub And when she will say her nakedness (what a word for hair) is a sinn, what do you think she will say when you ask her what she should be wearing according to her? A hijaab or a nikaab? You see there is a difference in interpretation. Im sure you have a clear idea of what she should wear. But she might see it different. And that is IF she feels she is sinful now. Because koran only states a womans beauty must be covered. And elsewhere it states she must cover her boozem. Not face.
CCDevlin 5 months ago
@CCDevlin In Islam people have diffrent interpretations most people think hijab is enough. But like in any society we simply obey the law of that land. Muslims go by Quran and Sunnah not just Quran, that is a basic nessesity in Islam.
jihadifanclub 5 months ago
@jihadifanclub sorry but you saying that muslims obey the laws of the country you are in is a lie. The fundamentalists will always try to push their will in a country that has laws against their personal beliefs. Like when a country (turkey, france, belgium, holland) says no nikaab, people will be demonstrating in the streets. So actually its a false statement since we were actually discussing the very hijaab and nikaab when you made that statement.
CCDevlin 5 months ago
@CCDevlin What I ment is when it comes to hijab or niqab that issue will be up to the MUSLIM ruler and people wil simply haft to obey in an ISLAMIC state.
jihadifanclub 5 months ago
@jihadifanclub OK so you dont think muslims should have to obey the laws of the non-muslim country they live in? Eventhough Islam teaches this?
CCDevlin 5 months ago
@jihadifanclub i think you're in denial and make yourself believe that for instance that young women has the exact same beliefs as you. I strongly think she does not. She said she wants democracy. Stop denying that.
CCDevlin 5 months ago
@CCDevlin I'm not in denial, the video shows that many Muslims are ignorant about Islam but all want Islam as a political system. You can see the confusion that comes up because democracy is such a vague word and means diffrent things to diffrent people. The media trries to paint a picture that Muslims want secularism like in the liberal West. This is not true what Muslims want is closer to Shariah hence people saying you can't change the Quran so alcohol would be banned.
jihadifanclub 5 months ago
@jihadifanclub you clearly don't know much about Islamic dogma and its effects. This is because you were not raised as a Muslim and see it as a fairytale. Muslims generally come from very strict systems where its considered haram to even criticize anything that has to do with islam. Thats why the interviewer is so "clever" with his questions. Many Muslims dont dare to reply in a way that will make them look like they would oppose or deny Islam. Because this is seen as a great shame. I could do
CCDevlin 5 months ago
@jihadfanclub .. (cont) the same interview and steer them into saying they want democracy in every possible way. My point being: this is how people in Islamic countries win elections even, always using Islam because no one dares to speak up and critisize them after they've used the Islam in their speech. Bottom line: you can't start thinking for them and try to trick them into sharia. They must choose sharia! And you (including the interviewer) do not want this. You want to impose.
CCDevlin 5 months ago
@jihadifanclub AND you might say: how do i know they dont want sharia? Well did you notice the lady. Did she wear a nikaab? Or even a Hijaab? Did she? No. She didnt. So based on that information, would you say she is happy to see sharia (Taliban, Iran) in her country Lybia? Please I want you to think about this. If you want her to have free will about it, notice that she's already got free will while she's talking to the interviewer. And she's doing so without a headcover. Which is her right.
CCDevlin 5 months ago
@CCDevlin Many Muslims do not obey all the rules but it still does not mean they don't want to live under an Islamic system . Do all people that support democray and want to live under democracy vote? No. A Muslim can't be a Muslim if they reject Shariah. Muslims see Shariah as a perfect and when we disobey Shariah we see that as a flaw within ourselves and not the Shariah. The woman that is uncovered will tell you that her nakedness is a result of her sinning not that the Shariah is wrong.
jihadifanclub 5 months ago
amazing lol
u stuck me on that one lol
simple logic leads them to see that democracy doesnt work with the deen
deen is above
FatNThoed 6 months ago
@FatNThoed you are a bit silly. The woman is being trapped by his trick questions. Did you see a hijaab or nikaab on this woman? No. So would you say she wants sharia ? Absolutely not. I can guarantee you that she does not want sharia. She wants islam in her politics ofcourse. But thats different from getting sharia. Sharia means a lot of bad things for this young lady. So no, she won't vote for it. Thank God.
CCDevlin 5 months ago
Asalaam Aleikum
What Ayah did you quote at 6:58?
IT is 12:40 I beleive, how about the ayah in Surah Maida?
hbk711x 6 months ago
I see the people judging others on the comments, I dont think Prophet Muhammad (saas) judged others and called them Kafirs. Learn your deen, and never say that so and so isnt a muslim because of something they dont do.
ViciousBeats16 7 months ago
This kaffir says "I don't wanna get into it" because she's a liar and not a true Muslim. I honestly think she was planted there. NO Muslim woud say the things she said ( No true Muslim).
THAT1UMMAH 8 months ago
Hair wouldn't be blowing in that sisters hair if she followed the will of Allah (swt). Hijab.
THAT1UMMAH 8 months ago
these people are talking the truth now
kareemabdullah 8 months ago
very intellegent questions and answers
Islam is the way of life if the people choose for it to be so, and not all people deserve . this great way of life that Allah has given us
so until the day comes where people believe that their salvation depeneds on practicing islam , we will have shariah law and everybody will welcome it
clbosa 10 months ago
Prophet Muhammad left flexibility in the form of government, and the leaders were chosen through several methods.
The appointed representatives of the Madina tribes gave him the Oath of Allegiance...they were "representing their people"...that is a fundamental principle of democracy.
You are not allowed to prohibit something that he did not, especially when you are forcing YOUR selective explanation of the word "democracy"
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies as the example of Mu’adh ibn Jabal shows there is no flexibility in "the form of government" because after this exchange between them the Messenger of Allah(saw) said, “Praise be to Allah for guiding the Messenger of Allah to what Allah and His Messenger love."So it is either islam or something else (aka kufr) in which we rule by and Muhammad(saw) would never praise Allah Ta'ala for the something else
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies i don't think the brother is forcing a selective explanation, he is simply pointing out two things that are common to every strain or variant of democracy which is that man decides the halal and haram and how its adoption sickens the minds and understanding of muslims so that they begin to believe and promote democracy and islam as one in the same.Now how sick is that for anyone to think themselves or others better suited in setting the limits than Allah Ta'ala
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly
even in America, the US government cannot force the brother to practice anything haram.
In Sharia, a non-Muslim does not have to follow Sharia. For example, Christians and Jews can drink wine and eat pork, as it is not unlawful in their books.
No Islamic government in history has attempted to change what is halal and haram. And if an Islamic leader tries to do something against Islam, then people should speak out.
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
your entire argument is illogical.
Allah told us what is halal and haram, and no "Islamic" government (modern or even the corrupt ones after Khulafa Alrashideen), ever dared to claim what is halal or haram.
Islam cannot be "voted out"...it is not a president or a parliament.
So what do YOU do in a country with a Muslim minority...Democracy is not by nature secular, but how do you live with yourself living in a secular democracy like the US.
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies Please notice how you and other muslims here (and all over the world) are always about "the rules". Thats not faith! You think you are a good Muslim if you dont eat pork and dont drink? These are just the sidelines of faith my friend. The little advices that your prophet made. And yet you chose this to be your expression of religion. Absolutely mindboggling. Why not live in peace with your neighbour instead of trying to rattle their tales and try to change them into you?
CCDevlin 5 months ago
Islam is not a form of government
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies you are wrong islam definitely has a ruling system, It
has been narrated that Allah’s Messenger(saw) asked Mu’adh ibn Jabal before sending him to Yemen, “What would you rule by?” In reply he said, “By
the book of Allah.” He said, “What if you did not find the verdict in there?”
He said, “I would rule by the Sunnah of Allah’s Messenger.” Then he said,
“And what if you did not find the verdict in there?” Mu’adh answered, “I
would exert my own Ijtihad.”
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly
you are missing the point. That is to say that Islam would be the basis of any decisions, laws, constitution, judicial system, commercial courts...but Islam does not specify 1 way ONLY to select the leader, OR how to make the laws, OR how to make the courts, OR how to police the country, etc.
Don't tell me you think that quote would be enough to run a country.
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies also Allah Ta'ala says in Quran 5:49 "and so rule among them by what Allah has revealed" and in 48:28, 9:33 61:9 Allah Ta'ala informs us that ruling is very much the intent of islam
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly
of course we have to use what Allah has revealed to make our decisions...then do we use the Bible?
And the Quran states "Let the people of the Gospel Judge by that which God has revealed THEREIN"
So Sharia would not interfere with their inheritance, penal codes, commercial laws, etc, etc.
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
Democracy = Shirk
WAKE UP PEOPLE
dcfnfb1 11 months ago
@dcfnfb1
to Muslims oppressed by dictators, "democracy" means being liberated from their oppressors. Stop attacking Muslims for using terminology that the rest of the world understands. There are dozens of types of democracies, many of which would be perfectly compatible in Islamic law.
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies The very definition of Democracy in its essence is Anti Islam. It is therefore incorrect to associate the purity and light of Islam with the darkness and impurity of Man Made Law. If Democracy is truly a means of understanding Liberation this evil incorrect and ignorant mentality needs to change in the Ummah. Muslims need to educate themselves on the superiority of Islam and Shariah and understand the shirk and cancer of democracy.
dcfnfb1 10 months ago
@dcfnfb1
there are many definitions of democracy, and you are forcing your negative meanings to people who are looking at the parts/definitions that are not in contradiction with Islam. And stop comparing "Islam" vs. "Democracy"...democracy is not a religion and fixed set of beliefs about God.
How can you label "democracy" as cancer, when MOST people view it in a positive light, and there are many aspects that are there in Islam. You cannot force your negative meaning on people.
islamophobia4dummies 10 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies sorry i thought you were against democracy. We probably differ on other things hence my comment on your statements earlier. But I m glad to hear a voice of reason between the nuts. You understand that democracy can be positive and certainly can go along side islam.
CCDevlin 5 months ago
You see, one of the simplest and ONLY agreed upon principle of democracy is the rule of the people. This is in the roots of the word- dêmos (δῆμος, which means "people") and krátos (κράτος, which means "force" or "power"). Therefore, "people power". This being a FOUNDATIONAL principle of democracy is clearly at odds with Islam. As the brother in the video state from the Qur'an, "Verily the judgment is for Allah."
realtype2009 11 months ago
@realtype2009
and what do Muslim "people" do if they have an unjust ruler? if they speak up, which Prophet Muhammad encouraged, then they are able to use "people power" in an Islamic way.
Everyone in Egypt, Tunisia, etc mean by "democracy" that they can elect their own leaders, rather than have a dictator.
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies why do you insist that democracy is just about voting or electing a leader? As history has witnessed inspite of whatever is imagined or idealized concerning democracy its practice has always come with man deciding the halal and haram
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly
what I am saying is that the question that this video asks is FALSE....he is insisting on a secular definition of democracy, which would not be compatible with Islam, and which is not what Libyans and Egyptians are asking for.
There is no contradiction in Islam of Muslims to choose the leader...Prophet Muhammad did not prohibit this.
If you mean that the western "democracies" are hypocrites, then you are right, but we should still get to choose our leaders.
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies Again as history has witnessed inspite of whatever is imagined or idealized concerning democracy its PRACTICE has always come down to man deciding the halal and haram.yes the muslims have a right to choose their leader to rule them by shariah this is islam but democracy in contradiction to islam gives the muslims an option that Allah Ta'ala did not give them and that is to be ruled by other than shariah.so how is that you think these to be one and the same?
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies Allah Ta'ala has warned and forbidden the believers(2:104,4:46) from adopting "shell game terminologies" of which democracy,freedom and human rights very much are. There is a real danger in this like what we are witnessing of western intervention in libya where the enemies of islam feeling themselves welcomed to intervene by the muslims incessant call for democracy.
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly
sorry to tell you that it is Islam that LIBERATED the Muslims, Arabs, and many others to freely worship Allah.
Islam gave human rights to slaves, women, etc, LONG before the existence of the U.S.
Merely because the U.S. uses the term "democracy" to mean, for example, NOT having a dictator, this does not mean that we should support dictators.
You cannot have a meaningful conversation, with Muslims or non-Muslims, if you insist on a MUSTALAH that others disagree with.
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies this shell game term human rights has no place in the narration of islamic history because what islam gave to slaves,women,etc was islam itself and the rights that come from it , rights as measured and shaped by Allah Ta'ala not human rights which is measured and shaped by man.42:17 if man can strike the balance(Mizaan) then of what purpose is the revelation?
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies and i am sorry to tell you that your beloved democracy with its false liberation has only given the muslims the option to freely NOT worship AllahTa'ala.and in case you forgot this worship of Allah Ta'ala has always came as something ordered and commanded (22:77,57:28,etc) not as something optional for the muslims.
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly
2:256 "There is no compulsion in religion"
Ibn Kathir: "meaning, 'Do not force anyone to become Muslim',..."
The verse was revealed to prevent some Muslims from trying to revert their children back to Islam (after having vowed them to Judaism through a pre-Islamic custom). This verse can't be abrogated, as clarified by the end of the verse: "... And he who rejects false deities and BELIEVES in Allah has grasped a firm handhold ..."
Religion must not be forced, it's about BELIEF.
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies 2:256 applies to the non-muslims only so your quote of ibn kathir is correct as it has nothing to do with those who are already muslim/post shahadatain.i know this offends your very mordernist/democratic sensibilities but as i stated before islam(its systemic implimentation) liberated from that which stood in the way of the command to worship while only giving the non muslims the right to "freely worship"and to think otherwise would not only foolishly contradict all...
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly
what offends me is people who want to force their ideas about Islam on me, especially when it contradicts with the majority of Islamic scholars.
what offends me is people who are so intolerant of other Islamically based opinions (that of the Sunni Majority schools of thought) that they would label everyone else's ideas as "modernist/democratic".
There is nothing HARAM about Muslims choosing our leader, and محرم الحلال كمحلل الحرام
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies Now i know you are purposely trying to mislead away from the haqq.Look your quote "There is nothing HARAM about Muslims choosing our leader" is correct IF this is done from an islamic aqeedah based platform and thereby achieving what pleases Allah Ta'ala which is ruling by what He Ta'ala has revealed but if you insist that this should be done on a democratic platform thereby pleasing shaytan and company then you are clearly in error and trying to mislead away from the haqq
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies Your quote is so open ended and democratically loaded it is like "There is nothing HARAM about Muslims choosing their partner" or "There is nothing HARAM about Muslims choosing to have sex" both quotes would be correct IF within the confines of what islam has dictated such as wali,marriage,no marriage of same-sex,no marriage to atheist,etc.but both are wrong if and when we insist on the modernist/democractic/western standard
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies As for Islamically based opinions you have presented like the one by ibn kathir have actually been against your argument itself and as to the others they were not so islamic.i myself am not trying to force anything,i am simply challenging with the haqq you and all others who envision and seek to create an islam in the image of democracy.the muslims are not obligated to follow the "majority of Islamic scholars"but we are obligated to follow what we find of the strongest ...
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies islamic evidence.This bayat you speak of was the first bayat of al aqabah and was in effect this group just taking shahadah like the sahaba in mecca who took the shahadah before them where at this point if an individual committed a sin then there was really no consequence in this life because the entity of the islamic state which impliments and enforces the shariah did not exist at that point but was established when Muhammad(saw) along the muslims of mecca ...
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies made the hijra the madina where Muhammad(saw) took the position of Head of State and where then the legislative ayat began to be revealed.
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly
17:53
Tell My bondmen to speak that which is kindlier. Lo! the devil soweth discord among them. Lo! the devil is for man an open foe.
17:54
Your Lord is best aware of you. If He will, He will have mercy on you, or if He will, He will punish you. We have not sent thee (O Muhammad) as a warden over them.
You do not know of what you speak...who is the scholar from where you get your ideas?
فسألوا أهل الذكر إن كنتم لا تعلمون
21:7 {Ask the followers of the Reminder if ye know not}
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies I see now you wanna talk scholars, man stop playin. i have no interest in playing scholar cards with you where i'll see your scholar and i'll raise you another scholar because there's no point to that exchange and besides you can't even understand whats basic and fundamental concerning islam nor your beloved democracy.So this is where i sign off saying fare well mr.dummies with your beloved cheating whore democracy
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies
The people can't handle their own affairs, Democracy is HAram.
hbk711x 6 months ago
@hbk711x
brother, this depends entirely on the definition. It is clear that your definition is not the same as all definitions, nor is it correct for you to force your definition on all of humanity.
also, please refrain from making fatwas about what is haram, as Prophet Muhammad pbuh said:
"The most daring to make fatwa are the most daring to hell fire"
أجرؤكم على الفتيا أجرؤكم على النار
- Al Darimi... Munawi: "worthy as authentic"
islamophobia4dummies 6 months ago
@hbk711x you are haram when you speak to tell others what they should do. Let God decide who is right. Are you God?
CCDevlin 5 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies that we know of islamic history but also what is clearly understood of the punishments for muslims drinking alcohol,apostasy,zina,non payment of zakat,etc.If 2:256 was meant to apply to muslim then why the prohibition and punishment/law and order of islam?So you see LIBERATION comes only after the COMMAND this was true then as we know the start of the revelation to Muhammad(saw) began with a command to align himself and adhere to this blessed message and the liberation...
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly
Muslims have a right to privacy, even if they commit sins "And Do Not Spy". It is not your job to invade a Muslim's privacy to FORCE them to not commit a sin, or to punish them for committing a sin in private.
Read the BAY3A given by the tribal representatives of Madina, and focus on what happens to people who commit sins:
1) if caught and purified
2) if not caught, and maybe God fogives them and maybe He punishes them
islamophobia4dummies 11 months ago
@islamophobia4dummies came later and holds true now where this ummah will continue to be without liberation until we align ourselves and adhere to what has been ordered and commanded by islam once again
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
It seems as if people are confusing ijmaa3 with democracy. These terms are not interchangeable. Find me ONE place with the Sunnah of the Prophet (SAWS), where people came out and voted. You will not find any like this. Part of the problem is that people are not correctly understanding democracy. I am Poli. Sci Masters students and I know for a fact scholars in my field still can't properly define the term- "democracy."
realtype2009 11 months ago
As far as we are concerened in Islam the Church is the State and there is no separation. Shariah Law is the only governing Constitution we need and shall always stand the test of time. We will never implement democracy in terms of the Western ideology by making amendments to a flawed system of Law. When a new Leader (Khalifa) is needed it is up to the people to select, choose, or vote (democratic process) based on what our beloved Nabi said and that is to choose a wise, pious follower of Shariah
1Kaba1Ummah 11 months ago
Salaams to all, I believe the main point is being missed. The question asked to everyone is a catch "22". The way the brother is asking this question is understandable, but there is a BIG difference in the term democracy when applied to a Islamic country.Our Prophet said so and showed us how 'democracy should be implemented in an Islamic country. Which is to select (vote) a leader who is righteous and obeys the Shariah Law.It was the people that selected each Khalifa based on the above criteria
1Kaba1Ummah 11 months ago
Alhamdulilah. This was one of the best . Brothers and sister were sincere. May Allah give us knowledge so we can implement it
yusufchowdhury 11 months ago
This democracy is like the new false god
IslamInt1 11 months ago
I wish all you muslims would go to one big country and stay out of the West. These muslims are here in the nice Western World running their mouths, because they have freedom here. They only have freedom here, because you are in a Christian, Western World. We have it nicer than you ever had it, and you know it. You come here to live a nicer life, yet you talk about fucking Islamic rule. Your Islam has kept you living like donkeys in the Sixteenth Century. You are a backwards people...stupid
TropikalWaves 1 year ago
@TropikalWaves The West didnt give humans the right to speak up. & exactly what part of Western rule is compatible with your version of christianity? Because I can name a thousand instances where it is NOT.
dawahworks 11 months ago
@dawahworks There is more freedom in the Western World. You can't hide from that truth. Islamic nations never provide great personal freedoms. The more Islamic the nation, the less personal freedoms one has (and the bigger hell hole the nation is!). America's shortcomings are only a result of it's failure to more closely follow Christianity, democracy, and capitalism. These are three winning ingredients. The USA is still the wealthiest nation in the history of the earth. Try again.LOL
TropikalWaves 11 months ago
Islam is definitely the problem. The rest of the world can see it clearly. Muslims fight with themselves and everyone else they come into contact with, no matter where they travel. Islam is an evil religion!!
TropikalWaves 1 year ago
@TropikalWaves Despite your gross misconceptions, what do you call your "forces" all over in other countries causing mass loss of life?
dawahworks 11 months ago
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@TropikalWaves I DISAGREE! I think that it's ARAB CULTURE that has led to DESTRUCTION of Arab nations. Cultures such as FEMALE GENITAL MUTILATION and so-called "HONOUR KILLINGS" have brought misery to parts of the Arab world. These beliefs are NOT ISLAMIC AT ALL!
In fact in Sudan Christian and Animists ALSO practice Female circumcision. Notice that there are a lot of Arabs in Sudan? This proves my point.
Islam like Christianity is based on SCRIPTURE. Most don't follow scripture properly.
MrRebuttal 3 weeks ago
In a nutshell, i think what they want is a democratic right to elect their leaders. Leaders who can implement and maintain the justice, law and order, the basis of which would be the Shariah. There can be laws which may not be directly from the shariah, like the maximum speed you can drive, traffic rules, there are aspects where shariah is silent on, the govt can make laws for that within the framework of shariah. Would such a system be against the teachings of Islam ? (honest question)
lessirey 1 year ago
@lessirey traffic regulation of roads and hwys,air traffic control,and traffic regulation of the waterways and sea ports are all technical issues and very much a legitimate shura issue that will require the real Leader who is established by the islamic bayah method to consult those with the technical knowledge of how best to develope and manage these infrastructures that are very necessary in todays world. the shariah did not remain silent on the matters of this nature.we have many examples ...
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@lessirey where the Prophet(saw) sought the technical knowledge and advice of those with the expertise in that area such when he consulted salman (ra) for the digging of the ditch.
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly Thanks for answering, by sharia remaining silent, i meant cases where there arent explicit rules and regulations laid out specifically on certain matters. As you said, these are technical matters, and can be decided by man according to their own environment WITHIN the framework of shariah.
In todays world, how would a nation practically transform from a Dictatorial govt to a Caliphate ? and how can we implement the bayah method ?
ps: honest questions with no additional intentions
lessirey 11 months ago
@lessirey the people(especially those of power/army) of that nation must come to the resolve of islam as the only solution and alternative and support and align themselves with those groups or parties who from day one of their establishment has recognized the re-implementation of islamic system/khilafah as the crown of obligations and have adopted the methodology of the Prophet(saw) to acheive it .in my opinion initially the bayah will come from those aforementioned people of power/army just as
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@4onetimeonly
agree, but i would argue that its a highly idealistic situation, considering the current situations. take Egypt as an example, Mubarak has tried his best to suppress any kind of revival of the ummah.
The core problem here is that muslims themselves are not educated about islam & shariah, their knowledge is week, they have been brainwashed by the media for years.Though they have revolted, they have not revolted to bring shariah. In such a circumstance, how would we deal with this?
lessirey 11 months ago
@lessirey the bayah was initially given to the Prophet(saw) by the people of power who we know better by the beautiful title as the Ansar.
4onetimeonly 11 months ago
@lessirey
The concept would be against Islam because you would be attributing the right to elect a leader to other than Islam as if Islam is not sufficient. Islam is the only system that actually elects the leader by POPULAR VOTE. Therefore there is no need to call for any democracy. Islam is sufficient from beginning to end.
dawahworks 11 months ago
@dawahworks
I think you are assuming that iam somehow against shariah, which is not true.
Iam totally for the shariah, but iam asking about how do you implement shariah in todays circumstances ?
people's mind need to be conditioned, it has been corrupted by years of media manipulation under dictatorial govts to the extend that even many muslims themselves hate, or are afraid of shariah. Shariah need to be implemented, but how do we go about doing it ? in practical terms i mean.
lessirey 11 months ago
@lessirey Practically, those movements that have been calling for shariah the whole while need to move forward. They would organize an election of a Khalifah that will implement Islam over us. Also Majlis Shuraa would be appointed from the sincere Ulama as a check & balance system. The "new" laws will be made known by way of TV & radio & the Muslims will conform. Agenda #1 will be totally internal to restore the dignity we lost. Then inshaAllah Allah (swt) will once again smile upon our Ummah.
dawahworks 11 months ago
@dawahworks
" Agenda #1 will be totally internal to restore the dignity we lost. "
Couldn't agree more on that !!
As far as i've seen, the uprising spreading through the middle east are more to do with breaking away from oppression, than implementing shariah.
Honestly, in my personal view there needs to be a system which can act as an agent to implement shariah.
It might not be practically possible to directly implement shariah, when people themselves have no clue about it.
lessirey 11 months ago
@lessirey we cannot adopt any methodology to restore Allah's rule that was not implemented by Rasoolullah (saw). This includes partmental implementations.
The Ummah has been under the extreme oppression of tyrants for far to long & the Ummah has born it the whole while. We must trust that the Ummah is far overdue for the dignity & justice of Islam. & believe me, even though the rulers have fully embraced kufr, the Ummah never has. She desires the dignity that only Islam can deliver. NOW!
dawahworks 11 months ago
@dawahworks
but didnt the prophet implement the rules and regulations step by step ? like in the case of alcohol?
I've been in touch with many protestors in egypt from the beginning of the revolution, and the overwhelming picture i get from most of them are that they just want freedom and not at all interested in any shariah, while only a minority want it. The reason? Fear due 2 Pure lack of knowledge.
How would we practically bring shariah there? when muslims themselves doesnt like it there?
lessirey 11 months ago
@lessirey No, Muhammad (saw) implemented Islam AS IT WAS REVEALED. We have it complete now. Therefore we have no excuses.
You have ayat addressing Makkan period (not under Islam) that addressed alcohol "morally", then the Maddani ayat (under Islamic rule) that addressed alcohol legislatively (including punishments).
Islam was revealed gradually YES. However Islam was IMPLEMENTED immediately.
dawahworks 11 months ago
@dawahworks
agreed, but my point of concern is still remains. how do we implement shariah when the majority of a population is misguided about it? when they fear and dislike shariah ?
Yes, the majority of the population are muslims, but the dictatorial govt has brainwashed the minds of many.
from my observation, shariah can be implemented when people support it. How do we get there without educating them ? we currently only have worst examples of nations those who pretend to implement shariah
lessirey 11 months ago
@lessirey No where in Islam does it say the "majority" must support truth before it can be implemented. Like you said 'they are MISGUIDED'.
Spain was majority kuffar & so was Madinah @ 1st, yet these where Islamic indeed.
& I agree that education is 1st. But like I said prior: All the avenues of media, schools, Masajid, etc... will be used to educate the masses. This way the misconceptions will be eradicated. We can do this with a smooth transition within... despite the western opposition.
dawahworks 11 months ago
@dawahworks
Majority support isnt necessary, but they are actively opposing it due to their ignorance. People rather welcomed islam in Madhinah and spain. Unfortunately the reality in the ground is saddening, many consider shariah as oppressive and blind, due to examples set by some nations who pretent to implement sharia and due 2 yrs of intensive brainwashing & scaremongering.
Like you said, we shouldnt mind western opposition, but we should arm the people with courage, knowledge & dignity.
lessirey 11 months ago
@lessirey Yet & still the Khilafah will return as promise by our beloved Rasool (saw). We can be part of the promise or obstacles.
Also Al-Khilafah will not return everywhere at once. It will start in a particular location & begin to annex other Muslim lands even peacefully. Doesnt necessarily need to emerge in a land of Islam haters. Insha Allah (ta) even the haters may began to desire Islam once they witness its true implementation.
dawahworks 11 months ago
@dawahworks
Insha Allah, just hope we get to live in the times of Khilafah !
Brother, you could make a video on current state of "Shariah" in muslim lands.
lessirey 11 months ago
@dawahworks
btw, the case is very different in Libya as i understand from my limited knowledge and observation.
They are more strong in their deen, atleast i havent noticed much fear or hate against shariah like i saw among the protestors in egypt. I do not know much about other nations.
May Allah let us live in the times of Khilafah and help us regain our dignity and iman.
lessirey 11 months ago
The first Article of the Constitution should be -
"Sovereignty belongs to Allah alone but He has delegated it to the State through its people for being exercised within the limits prescribed by Him as a sacred trust. The State shall exercise its powers and authority through the chosen representatives of the people."
"No legislation can be made repugnant to the Quran and Sunnah and this will take precedence over the whole of the Constitution."
Now you have Islamic Democracy..
nilo723 1 year ago
@nilo723 Islam is a self cohesive & complete ideology & is NOT in need of uneducated dribble from non-political minded individuals that are too ignorant to accept it truly for what it is without bid3a. If you dont like Islam then please leave peacefully & not persist to corrupt its essence.
dawahworks 1 year ago
@dawahworks Enough with your hatred..This "holier than thou" mentality is what dealt the final blow on the Khilafah by the Saudi Wahhabi movement..
nilo723 1 year ago
@nilo723 Actually it was mentalities such as yours that lead to the demise of Islam as a system. Never was a dumber statement uttered than "Islamic democracy". Next you will start calling for a "Trinity of Tawheed".
dawahworks 1 year ago
@dawahworks Democracy does not equal to secularism..Democracy means rule of the majority..
In any case if some group tries to impose its will on the majority, regardless of whether they are munafiqeen or momineen, the majority would fight back and defeat them..
Doesn't matter if you dig up your head in sand and refuse to listen, the fact remains that the Khilafah was destroyed by the Saudi Wahhabi movement..And its their distorted picture of Islam is what has messed up some people's brains..
nilo723 1 year ago
@nilo723 Islam opposes your "rule of the majority". Allah (swt) is sovereign n Islam.
Selecting/electing a ruler thru voting is Wasilah (means) but the source of ruling is Tareeqah (method).
& Not even n Democracies r the majority given their way. E.g: The majority want the US troops home, but policy is made by the elites.
& wat wuld u democrats rule by while claiming 2 b Muslim? If u say Islam, then y do u keep bringing up MAJORITY RULE??? This means u r no better than the evil Saudi regime.
dawahworks 1 year ago
@dawahworks As i said, the majority's opinion would matter only in selection of rulers, not in legislation..You don't see referendums on judicial matters even in Western countries, so why would Muslim countries be given the option to choose halal and haram..No legislation can be made repugnant to the Quran and Sunnah.
And where does Islam specifically oppose the rule of majority? Plz don't bring up the verse which talks about judicial matters..Infact the Quran clearly lays down rules in (42:38)
nilo723 1 year ago
@nilo723 If the Majority is only selecting a ruler, then how do you equate this with democracy??? Elections are a process NOT a system itself. You keep saying "rule of the majority" then in the same breath you say "Its only in selecting the ruler". Do you even know what "RULE OF THE MAJORITY means?
Shuraa is only in al-Mubahat (matters of choice) NOT in Halal & Haram.
& as for your question: "Where does Islam specifically oppose the rule of majority?" 18:26, 5:44,45,47 12:40 etc etc etc
dawahworks 1 year ago
@dawahworks As i said, "Plz don't bring up the verse which talks about judicial matters..You don't see referendums on judicial matters even in Western countries, so why would Muslim countries be given the option to choose halal and haram..No legislation can be made repugnant to the Quran and Sunnah.."
Your other references have got nothing to do with rulership or majority..
PS - Seems like you haven't really understood the concept of Democracy and are just taking emotional jibes at it..
nilo723 1 year ago
@dawahworks can you please do a video about the situation the signs of judgement day and so forth.
mahdi0123456789 1 year ago
@mahdi0123456789 Insha Allah in the future.
dawahworks 1 year ago
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@mahdi0123456789 you muslims will get the wrath of God upon you. You all have denied Jesus, the Son of God, so you will spend an eternity away from God. You all are following a false religion that teaches you to continue to live as if it's the Sixteenth Century....lol. No wonder all you muslims love to come into the beautiful, Christian Western World. You can't wait to get out of the nations that Islam ruined!!! **********
TropikalWaves 1 year ago
@nilo723 : Islam is a gutter religion. Everywhere Islam travels, it spreads poverty and filth. You idiots need to embrace democracy, capitalism, and Jesus Christ before it's too late! You will spend an eternity in hell for denying the Son of God, and you have guilty consciences. All your islamic nations are shit holes....nothing but chaos and poverty. Your islamic leaders have robbed you of all the oil money, and you're too stupid to know it...LMFAO. Stupid musliims.
TropikalWaves 1 year ago
@TropikalWaves arent you the worst example of a man who call others to his own religion ?
lessirey 1 year ago
@lessirey No, you are just not used to someone telling you the truth. Islam has only brought death and destruction to every Arab nation.
TropikalWaves 1 year ago
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MrRebuttal 3 weeks ago
@nilo723 You are so stupid to follow islam. Islam is a nasty, backwards religion that is only for losers. Islam has you all living as if it's the Sixteenth Century still....LMFAO! You still ride donkeys and camels...lol. mohammed was nothing but a stupid goat herder, who molested little children...some nice religious leader you follow. islam is a horrible religion that only breeds violence wherever it goes!!!
TropikalWaves 1 year ago
I must say this type of in-your-face-not-caring-about-being-politically-correct-or-your-feeling is highly ineffective. At the end of the day all it does is draw out dividing lines in our communities and draw people away from their deen.
ahmarsidd 1 year ago 5
@ahmarsidd If your brother is wrong do you accept him for it?
Reluctanttreehugger 11 months ago
the existence of democracy doesn't necessarily means u have the choice to vote Islam out .......you can lay foundation of uncompromising principles and still give the people the right to choose their leaders ...
dahiya1 1 year ago 4
@dahiya1 That's what half the people half been trying to get at..Going around and dumbfounding fellow Muslims is what's wrong.
ElDiablo458 1 year ago
@dahiya1 have*
ElDiablo458 1 year ago
@dahiya1 "lay uncompromising principles & still give the people the right to choose their leaders"
Thas basically: Islam. That's the very definition of what an Islamic 'political system' is; this is how it was with Umar's caliphate, 'Uthman, etc.
But unfortunately, democracy [under the guise, or using the guise of "freedom", which apparently seems to be a good concept; 'not being compelled', 'rights'] has a sinister connotation; ISLAM has the good of 'democracy' & is free of its evils.
abdelbaasit1 1 year ago
@abdelbaasit1due to its source(man) there is no good of democracy only a false appearance there of while islam is the khayr due to Allah Ta'ala being its source-2:216” …… But it may happen that you hate a thing which is good for you, and it may happen that you love a thing which is bad for you.Allah knoweth ,you know not.”
4onetimeonly 1 year ago
@4onetimeonly ya (thanks 4 reminding of this critical Quranic verse), but what I meant 2say was, it contains a 'perceived good'; ie oh we have rights, freedom, we're not under any compulsion/dictatorship.
However, I agree - the sinister connotation in this democracy is that this freedom is 'boundless', limitless & does not respect the Hudud (limits) set by the Creator who alone knows whats good/bad for us. * Yes, Islam has no compulsion, it gives freedom & rights - but under the Law of Allah
abdelbaasit1 1 year ago
@dahiya1 Do you follow the political processes of Democratic governments? Under Democratic governments NO principle is "uncompromising". Except that man has the final say as to what will be lawful & forbidden. Islam doesnt allow Muslims to use Islam as a "foundation" but in the reality act as sovereign.
We cannot eat kufr cake with Islamic icing.
dawahworks 1 year ago
Why can't Islam be the underlying foundation (i.e constitution) and the people still have choice? WHO SAID WE WANT ISLAM OUT?!
ElDiablo458 1 year ago 2
@ElDiablo458 what exactly is islam suppose to be lying under?again for the muslims there isn't any choice in those matters(such as ruling and the steps to acheive it) where islam has already laid out a course of action-33:36.you asked"WHO SAID WE WANT ISLAM OUT?!" well democracy comes with its own pre set conditions and so whenever democracy is the platform of revival islam being out is always on the table ...
4onetimeonly 1 year ago
@ElDiablo458 this is the inherent nature of democracy and its conditions and islam will never accept these conditions just as the Prophet (saw) when approaching various tribes to support the launching of islam as system of life some them had conditions that he (saw) out right rejected
4onetimeonly 1 year ago
@ElDiablo458 Every arab country has an Islamic "constitution"
FATAL12SKILLZ 11 months ago
Allah reward you inshAllah. unlocking minds by the will of Allah!
FoAllah 1 year ago
Subhan'Allah, sometimes its sad to see that we have Muslims who want to follow Islam and they are sincere brothers and sisters but they've been isolated from Quran & Sunnah for so long that they've forgotten their identities and what Islam really is and this is the reason why they've fallen into the fitnah of dunia where they can't really see what is wrong and what is right and the reasons behind it...
"...He(Allah) shares not His legislation with anyone." Quran 18: 26
ripper00769 1 year ago 2
May Allah reward you for educating these people akhi (dawahworks) Subhan'Allah they're calling for something they don't even understand, and they think the system of Libya is Islam lol. Ajeeb!! May Allah guide them and us. Ameen!
MUWAHIDEEN 1 year ago
@MUWAHIDEEN Ameen!
dawahworks 1 year ago