Edita Gruberova - Lucrezia Borgia - final aria 2008

[levieuxpiano]

Je ne comprends pas bien ces querelles, souvent anglo-saxonnes. On est loin (mais pas très loin cependant) de Callas et Gencer, et alors ? Il demeure que Gruberova, sans tout à fait la voix et l'italianità de ce rôle, en a été une interprète de haut vol au terme de sa glorieuse décennie belcantiste. Brava !

[luciacindy]

This woman is crazy ..... incredible- I love her

[niletomei]

O___o' not for the singing itself, but for the audience's reaction... way too much!!! (at least for her ACTUAL conditions)

[mariadelamor21]

No debe haber existido una voz más bella en el mundo!!!! Impresionante!!!!

[adballet]

@gustopheles There is a difference between "artistic expression" and "acting." And the technique of acting in a play, in an opera, and in a ballet are completely different. Believe me, one should not be messing up with each others art forms because they would look bad, and I mean, really bad. I have seen that in ballet before. If they can't pirouette they start "acting." One does not need to hit 10 pirouettes at a time to dance Swan Lake, but a well placed double would be nice.

[gustopheles]

@adballet That's entirely arbitrary. I don't know whether you're genuinely trying to engage in a dialogue, or simply have the last word, so I'm ducking out.

[MisterPapageno]

@adballet Not so different from singing. When a singer isn't able to sing, they start barking, screaming and speaking instead of singing (see Cura, Villazon). I always ask myself: if you are not able to do your profession well, why not changing job? It's so simple!

[leoneimperatore89]

diciamo che l'eleganza non le appartiene, l'urlo molto di più.

[DiegoMartinazzoli]

@ leoneimperatore89

L'eleganza le appartiene. L'urlo no. Vista e rivista dal vivo, mi ha insegnato cos'è un suono correttamente appoggiato e PROIETTATO. Cosa che oggi, almeno qui in Italia, si sente sempre di meno.

[MrJago80]

Per me è inascoltabile qui!

[dunketto93]

L'acuto finale è penoso.

[AlexVoltage]

Oh, this is amazing.

Thanks for sharing!

[gencerito]

LA SIGNORA CANTA LA LUCREZIA BORGIA MA NO LA LUCREZIA BORGIA DI DONIZETTI,CANTA LA LUCREZIA BORGIA DI STRAUSS...TUTTI I PORTAMENTI CHE USA NON SONO BELCANSTISTA

[mariloly38]

BRAVA DIVA

[BeatricediTenda]

She was absolutely incredible... amazing E sharp! Really powerful...! Thanks for the Video!

[mariloly38]

DIVA,DIVA,DIVA

[TheTheArtOfMusic]

BRAVISSIMA!!!!

[InformedListener]

Mmm...is this role the best one for the great Gruberova?

[skitzo429]

my god, what the hell happened to her between this performance and the one earlier this year??

[DiegoMartinazzoli]

Nothing! I saw her live and I can assure you that she was still perfect!!

[skitzo429]

um, ive seen her video of the 2009 production, hellen keller could tell she was a hot mess, you need your ears examined

[robertleicester]

I think the tessitura is a little bid to low for her,so the trills doesn't sound so easy, like her higher notes.I think both-Devia and Gruberova-have their merits and their troubles with this part.Devia is better in the fast coloraturasections and her trills in the middle sound better.Otherwise Gruberova surpasses Devia in other passages:She has much more volume in her laser-like high notes,while Devias sound a little bid thin and her pianissimi are more finely

[contediluna74]

Considerata l'età... (sessanta passati) portentosa! Una grande tecnica e grande cantante! Grazie per il video!

[Leanrosso]

Quiero agradecer a Coloraturafan x los inmensos aportes q'hace constantemente en este sitio.Muchas personas no tenemos la posibilidad de asistir a este tipo de eventos por diferentes motivos y de la unica manera que podemos disfrutarlos es gracias a los aportes de personas realmente amables como el. NO soy musico ni cantante profesional.Creo que Edita Gruberova, mas alla de las criticas, es una cantante consumada y ha hecho y sigue haciendo interpretaciones extraordinarias con su voz.

[Drelnis]

omg at this age and she could still manage a long Eb, it might not be her best, but still, what's Era Desso without an Eb?

[belcantofan159]

I wonder how you can tell that the long note "might not be her best" from the miserable sound quality of that clip.

[Drelnis]

how else can people like Callas? Tebaldi? Scotto? Galvany? Sills? Early Sutherland? be appreciated? From the "miserable sound quality".

Gruberova is like what, approaching 60? Have you seen her early recordings, those fussy fuzzy ones which the sound quality is so much more miserable?

Now those were good Ebs, to beable to hit Ebs at this age is already magical for Gruberova, are you saying her Ebs at 60 is better than her prime?

[belcantofan159]

Callas etc. can be appreciated by listening to high quality CDs played with appropriate CD players etc. But not these cheap youtube clips.

[coloraturafan]

The quality may vary, but these "cheap" youtube clips offer performances that most people would never have access to.... so this is a service that should be respected. If you don't personally enjoy this clip, or others, don't watch them.

[belcantofan159]

of course I respect the service provided by youtube (otherwise I wouldn't be surfing youtube). you are absolutely right, youtube gives access to performances that are not otherwise available.

I just don't find it fair when the singers are judged - in that aggressive manner - based on their "performance" on youtube

It's a little like looking at a Picasso painting through sunglasses and saying: This is badly painted...

[ChrisStockslager]

I do agree that being able to hit an Eb at 60 is amazing, but it still sounds just a bit flat before she brings it up a bit. Sutherland's last Eb still sounded wonderful. But I guess it's just a matter of technique and aging.

[Drelnis]

Hey Chris :D

Yeah, I mean it's probably not the best she's ever done, by all means not the best that's ever done, but I'm happy atleast we still have this, I mean who else is there on today's stage that can sing Lucrezia? Fleming, that's one, but probably no one else ;)

I'm still grateful Gruberova's voice is still on today's stage, that's all :P

[ChrisStockslager]

I dunno, the new-ish Sarah Coburn is incredible. She is a lyric coloratura, but, from what I heard, she has a great lower register. And, her Fs are very huge, let alone her E-flats. Check her out, she's great!

[coloraturafan]

I totally agree with you about Sarah Coburn, she is by far the most promising of the newer singers that I have seen. However, she is not to the point where she would sing this role. I saw her Lucia, and it was a perfect vocal fit. I heard her high f in person and it was very large. I tend to think she would do well in operas like Sonnambula, Puritani, Don Pasquale, Il Turco in Italia ect,...

[coloraturafan]

I love Gruberova, but sorry.. if you are looking for a current singer who's voice fits this role: Mariella Devia. That is all I can say :)

[ChrisStockslager]

Devia does sound awesome for how old she is. And, do you think Sarah doesn't have the lower register enough yet, or just isn't old enough?

[coloraturafan]

Devia is 61, and I am going to see her in Lucrezia Borgia in Feb. With Sarah, I think she will grow into heavier roles with time, she has a wonderful technique and a truly beautiful voice, maybe one of the most beautiful I have ever heard live. Time will tell if Borgia is a role she can sing.

[ChrisStockslager]

I think so too, about Sarah. I wonder what Joan would sound like if she randomly started singing again (after loads of practice)?

[skitzo429]

she would sound about a 5th lower, because she would transposing it down at least that much, things were coming down a third by the time she retired

[ChrisStockslager]

So, she'd be in the more mezzo-y range? And I meant, could her breath support be built back up, and what would her timbre sound like? That is a good observation, though, about the 5th lower. And I wonder if the transposition later was because of years and years of strenuous singing, or simply old age?

[skitzo429]

i dont know, i doubt it would be a 5th, she just wouldnt be singing at all. most women lose their high notes, and usualyl the low notes too as they age, sutherland often transposed htings down as she got older

[ChrisStockslager]

That's true (losing high notes). Gruberova's Eb isn't stable at all anymore. I wonder why Joan had her Eb up until she was 60, then it just disappeared, rather than get shaky, like this one?

[belcantofan159]

@ChrisStockslager

I have seen and heard Gruberova in Munich recently on several occasions. By listening to this movie you just cannot tell how great her high notes (still) are.

[daphnebeloved]

@belcantofan159 Yeah, videos just cant capture how projecting, resonating, sparkling and big her hight notes can be live, I think she has the best hight notes live of all divas!

[ChrisStockslager]

@daphnebeloved .....Sutherland had bigger and high notes. 

[thomastmwc]

@ChrisStockslager

and Devia has the most controlled and best supported :)

[ChrisStockslager]

@thomastmwc At this age, compared to Sutherland at the same age, Devia does. However, from ages thirty to fifty, I think Sutherland had better controlled and supported high notes than Devia. I.E: the "Gia mia..." duet from "Norma" where Sutherland sustains a flawless steady-as-a-rock high Eb for something like seven or eight seconds.

[thomastmwc]

@ChrisStockslager OMG you have to watch this: watch?v=EHJLluTKYDk

[ChrisStockslager]

@thomastmwc I must say, I miss all the ornaments in the da capo section! Haha. But a very delicate approach by Devia. Not sure if I like the portamento into the Eb6, but a very lovely performance. I think in their primes in terms of breath control, Sutherland and Devia were on the same level. Devia's breath control aged better. I think Sutherland always had her beat on powerful and beautiful high notes up until 1987-1990.

[thomastmwc]

@ChrisStockslager you miss WHOSE ornaments??

"Not sure if I like the portamento into the Eb6" OMG you know what, in fact, I'm a counter tenor and I have a more or less same singing approach that Gruby uses (of cz I'm much worse than she is, she's a queen c'mon). This somewhat Germanic school of singing allows fast coloratura - I can do fast coloratura in the upper tessitura, too. But for these kinds of last high notes, at least to me, a glissando/portamento is necessary, pros and cons I'd say

[ChrisStockslager]

@thomastmwc The ornaments in the da capo section that are sung by many sopranos. I don't know about countertenors, but I like it better when sopranos, mezzos, tenors, baritones, and basses have clean attacks on notes. I just prefer not scooping or sliding into notes. To my ears it sounds lazy. Not saying it's incorrect or anything, it's just what I prefer. :)

[ChrisStockslager]

@thomastmwc Oh, haha, I know what you mean now. I meant in the Devia version you sent me, I missed the ornaments in the second half of the cabaletta that Sutherland and other sopranos tend to sing. Perhaps it does require scooping, but all the same, no .... just no. Haha. :P

[thomastmwc]

@ChrisStockslager no I'm saying, every technique has its pros and cons. Perhaps Gruby's technique requires scooping lol :P

[thomastmwc]

@ChrisStockslager this one also: watch?v=OB5y5aNeN3A&feature=re­lated

also search for Maria Stuarda's Prayer, Sutherland fails there. Here voila : watch?v=SZW5tryk-E4

Plus, I've never heard Sutherland sing "Ah! Verranno a te sull’aura I miei sospiri ardenti" in 1 single line, not even at her prime.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a Sutherland fan; at her prime, her agility, ornaments, and trills are unequalled. But speaking of breath control, I must say Miss Devia is THE QUEEN.

W/ all due respect

[raigekimaru]

@coloraturafan

I can't speak for her personally, but generally, 61 is WAY too old to be singing coloratura roles

[gustopheles]

@coloraturafan I can't stand behind Devia - I don't understand the appeal, or her popularity. No one's acting can hold a candle to Gruberova's, especially as Lucrezia and as Elizabetta in Roberto Devereux

[adballet]

@gustopheles You can't simply wave the very essence of your art form and compensate with the very essence of another one. Artistic interpretation should be beyond technique, which is by far the case of Ms. Devia.

[gustopheles]

@adballet Devia is notorious for waving an important aspect of her art form - acting, which has a pivotal role in opera - and compensating for it with the sheer technical abilities of her voice. Don't you agree that you've just contradicted yourself? Having good voice isn't "the very essence" of opera.

[adballet]

@gustopheles I have seen Ms. Devia's acting on videos and in person, and I completely disagree with you. However, she does follow the "less is more" doctrine which I find extremely classy. And neither of them are actresses, they are opera singers, therefore singing should not be waived. One does not have to exhibit virtuoso abilities like Ms. Devia for artistic expression but the essence of the art form should be there, which is singing.

[gustopheles]

@adballet Again, they are both singing actresses. It's not a matter of your disagreeing with me; it's simply that your assessment is incorrect.

That said, my aesthetic is different from yours: I favor visceral performances to "classy" ones, so our stances on Devia and Gruberova conflict accordingly.

[adballet]

@gustopheles Besides, I don't really get Ms. Gruberova's acting being so incredible. I don't even understand why Lucrezia is so happy at the end of the aria like in this video. She just just poisoned her own son and lover and he died in front of her eyes. If there is any acting form Ms. Gruberova's part is the wrong acting.

[gustopheles]

@adballet I defer to my last statement - our aesthetics differ, and unlike you, I don't interpret Gruberova as being happy. That's like saying she seemed happy in the final aria of Lucia di Lamermoor. It's called a mad scene for a reason.

[adballet]

@gustopheles And I stil think she looks completely happy at the end of this aria and I don't think Lucrezia is mad, she is just in complete despair. And Ms. Gruberova doesn't look mad either in this video.

[asisecanta]

I was there on 1st March 2008. Unforgettable one woman's show!!!!

[fanofbelcanto]

Gruberova she's still the only one who can make sentional performance. She deserves the title of Prima donna assoluta. When you see her live, on stage or at the concert, she is magical !

[DiegoMartinazzoli]

Right you are!

[FraSarn]

I was there too...unforgetable evening. But it wasn't only HER...Ewa Podles as Maffio Orsini was just beyond believe. What do you think?

[bellinicallas]

MARAVILLOSAAAAA!!!! BRAVA EDITA

[vitellia]

Those sustained high C sounded damned odd. The ornaments in general were unattractive and unstylish. Ok, so she has awesome (a little wobbly) high Eb, so what, really? This performance was just a showcase of her high notes. I'd rather get her CDs.

[InformedListener]

Mmm...A+ for effort. I don't think that the 60+ Gruberova should be messing with this aria anymore. She sang it so well earlier, it's kinda painful to hear her yodelling like this now. Even Sutherland knew when the hold them, when to fold em, when to walk away, and when to run...

[belcantofan159]

"She sang it so well earlier" When did she sing it before. Her debut was 2008...

[ivanleop]

Wow!!! in her age singing this, OMG!!! She is really the queen of coloratura!

[lungdoc]

Plese keep in mind the lady is past her sixties. I am not aware of any other of the legendary singers singing these roles so late in their careers.

[coloraturafan]

Mariella Devia :)

[lungdoc]

Another great singer of course.

[spsp2sp3sp3dsp3d2]

Yes, Devia is another one. Sometimes I forget her age because you really couldn't tell by the way she sings.

[CzarDodon]

Ok! make excuses if you like....

I think she would do better either to retire or do something she can do well at this late stage of her career. come on! This is embarrasing, be honest please!

[vivaldiano]

La Devia sicuramente è arrivata oggettivamente alla stessa età con una vocalita molto più smagliante ed integra!Ed ha anche molto più gusto, classe e stile!

La Gruberova resta un TOTEM del bel canto che, pur mantenendo una certo aplomb vocale,ha pero fatto ormai il suo tempo.

[eradesso]

amen fratello!

[ildivino83]

I think this sounds absolutely horrible! A lot of times she sounds like she's really laboring while she's doing the coloratura.... not pretty.... :(

[albertogrilo]

I Love her. I saw her in Barcelona first performance. Is this in Barcelona?

[sevoflurane]

I have to say I am not a fan of this approach to operatic singing. Words and lines are tremendously distorted. I find the breaks within the same word particularly annoying. One of the beauties of the belcanto style is the ability to "attack" the note cleanly, which unfortunately is lacking here. Chapeau to the stamina of Gruberova, though!

[belcantofan159]

"attack the note cleanly"

how can you tell? the sound quality of this clip is pathetic...

sounded completely different and very clean (...) live in the operahouse

[BeauTenor]

Well. I've never been a huge fan of Grubi. I think she was wonderful in some things (lighter bel canto, and Mozart to be sure), but I never really cared for her in heavier stuff like this, I also never really liked her phrasing or her big sliding approach to her high notes. That heing said though, I do respect that at her age, she's still singing relatively well, and shows no sign of lowering the parts (which she'd have had to do if she'd had a bigger voice). Brava.

[WiseMonki]

Still in great vocal shape... BRAVO!!!

[robertleicester]

This is out of this world. Gruberova sings the e-flat exactly on the word "puni-tor", where other singers just sing a vocalise. I think the parts of this aria, which are in the middle of the voice are better sung by Devia and Sutherland,they have more "meat" in this area of the voice. But with this endless acuti, which is sung very dramatic also, she surpasses all this great ladies.

[MusicaParola]

We, the listeners, win. Fleming was booed at La Scala in this role, but so were Callas and Pavarotti in other operas. We're fortunate to have both Fleming and Gruberova. As far as Edita in this performance... I can only say bravissima! What a lady.

[Jabe88]

Fleming or Gruberova... I wonder who "wins"

[figaro0606]

Wow! That was amazing! Does anyone have the full concert? Is it for sale? I would love to see the whole thing.

[leporello89]

It's in Barcelona???????? Please, could you post D'Arcangelo part??? :)

[operadude32]

I ABSOLUTELY love seeing her release her "appoggio" after the final high note (you see her ribcage collapse). And then, when she throws her head back as if to say, " I did it!".

Truly stellar singing for the first assumption of the role and for someone who just turned 61! You go GIRL!

Brava!!!!

[spsp2sp3sp3dsp3d2]

This concert was such a huge success for Gruberova. Someone posted audio of her "era desso" a few months ago, but its been taken down and I've been trying to vain to find it. Thank you so much for posting this. Do you have more? "Com'e bello!"?

[operaeater]

I have it, I can send it to you, if u want

[spsp2sp3sp3dsp3d2]

I would love it. Thanks!