I think it is unfair however to call it a liturgical game. The basic substance of what their doing, 99% of the prayers and such are all genuine and within their tradition. If they have a "few" tiny byzantinizations that may dissappear over time. We may realize that this could be a healthy natural development to import a few minor customs associated with eastern christianity into western. Considering the lack of reverence shown in the novus ordo latin churches, this is a welcome change!
Kevin has a valid point. I will agree that making the sign of the cross in this form of litany is perhaps a bit odd. What is happening in this instance is that the others are copying the bishops actions, more so than doing it themselves. The intention is holy, they dont know any better. That being said I think in the litany of "Pope Gelasius" or St Martin, used in ROCOR's western rite, the crossing would make more sense, because those are longer petitions almost identical to the greek ectenia.
One of the interesting things is that, the litany for john the baptist is a post-reformation custom, but than the other litanies of the type are older, so it could be seen as a good example of authentic orthodox innovation. Many or most newer pre-1962 traditional latin prayers, are harmonious with Orthodox teachings.
This just looks like a nutty hodge-podge. A Latin Litany of the Saints, with a bunch of Greek style crossing (I especially like the fellow that throws his hand out in the middle of the air after each Greek sign of the cross). There are NO liturgical directions for the sign of the cross to be made after each innvocation in the Western Litany. if this is the Orthodox western rite, please just go Greek and quite playing liturgical games.
A holy and exemplary pastoral visit by His Grace, Bishop Mark. And how appropriate an occasion to restore the custom of the "Fire of St. John" as a para-liturgical event. I have participated in these celebrations in France & Germany (mostly in parishes of ECOF), but have not known of its practice here in the USA, other than in Albany, NY in the 1990's.
I think it is unfair however to call it a liturgical game. The basic substance of what their doing, 99% of the prayers and such are all genuine and within their tradition. If they have a "few" tiny byzantinizations that may dissappear over time. We may realize that this could be a healthy natural development to import a few minor customs associated with eastern christianity into western. Considering the lack of reverence shown in the novus ordo latin churches, this is a welcome change!
LiturgicalChants 1 month ago
Kevin has a valid point. I will agree that making the sign of the cross in this form of litany is perhaps a bit odd. What is happening in this instance is that the others are copying the bishops actions, more so than doing it themselves. The intention is holy, they dont know any better. That being said I think in the litany of "Pope Gelasius" or St Martin, used in ROCOR's western rite, the crossing would make more sense, because those are longer petitions almost identical to the greek ectenia.
LiturgicalChants 1 month ago
One of the interesting things is that, the litany for john the baptist is a post-reformation custom, but than the other litanies of the type are older, so it could be seen as a good example of authentic orthodox innovation. Many or most newer pre-1962 traditional latin prayers, are harmonious with Orthodox teachings.
LiturgicalChants 1 month ago
This just looks like a nutty hodge-podge. A Latin Litany of the Saints, with a bunch of Greek style crossing (I especially like the fellow that throws his hand out in the middle of the air after each Greek sign of the cross). There are NO liturgical directions for the sign of the cross to be made after each innvocation in the Western Litany. if this is the Orthodox western rite, please just go Greek and quite playing liturgical games.
Kevin41581 5 months ago
A holy and exemplary pastoral visit by His Grace, Bishop Mark. And how appropriate an occasion to restore the custom of the "Fire of St. John" as a para-liturgical event. I have participated in these celebrations in France & Germany (mostly in parishes of ECOF), but have not known of its practice here in the USA, other than in Albany, NY in the 1990's.
Stgeorgealbany 8 months ago