After two nose jobs, a chin augmentation, and a face lift, I must say David Duke looks marvelous. I am curious however, who his surgeon is. I am thinking about getting a nose job myself but don't want to look like Michael Jackson. Like him, I also live in Louisiana. Can someone forward me his info?
he following list of massacres is by no means exclusive, but they reflect the nature of the Zionist occupation of Palestine and Lebanon and show that massacres and expulsions were not aberrations that happen in any war, but organized atrocities with only one aim, that is to have a Zionist state which is 'goyim rein'.
When people make these sorts of criticisms on Islam, it is not done as a constructive criticism, it is more like an outright dismissal. We can dismiss them as human beings because we treat women better than they do, and therefore we should just kill them all, men, women, and children, in order to rectify this situation.
michael coren is the intelligent one,is asking good questions where that stupid other idiot (the second one speaking who is flying to lebanon shortly) has no answers to,like beirut airport is a civillian airport!
reply from michael:but millitary planes also land there
then look at the face of the idiot, oooohhnhh yeeaaah,well that's true! it had slipped my mind for a moment BUT it is still civillian
giving Israel back da same violence that it puts out has caused dem 2 say da people hew retaliated were da terrorist now getting out your cameras an exposing dem 2 da world as much as you can is gonna do the most damage an thy wont be able 2 play victim any more because we walked into Israels trap 4 way 2 long an now its there turn 2 walk in 2 ares ,now remember it isent about race it is about unjust crooked governments there was other places like Israel in history ,u.s.england an roman.
What a load of rubbish McKeever. Sorry - I'm not for ethnic cleansing, apartheid, and killing civilians en masse like Israel is. It's NOBODIES cause except Israel's and brown-nosed politicians like you trying to appease the Israel blackmail lobby.
God what Israel War Crime Lovers thes Clare Mike and the Piece of Shit from the "freedom" party. Move the Fuck to israeHELL you Traitors of Canada. Canadians don't Support the TERROR STATE odf IsraeHELL. Coren the Biggest Zionist Slime on the TV.
Israel your so small. Do you understand what the consequences are if america stops backing you up ? Religion must be something spiritual. From and in your heart. Not a source to claim land out of. You socalled "Jews" are not that special. Once again there will be no g-d to save you from desaster. Imagine: That your culture is build on a fable. All this mess, blood and Human sacrifice for nothing. For a ferrytale. So, so sad.
Israel: 60 years of Misery & Ethnic-cleansing 6 wars 4 million Palestinian Refugees 3 million Occupied 1.5 million Abducted-hostages 254 km of an Apartheid- Wall 562 Humiliation-check-points 20K Political-prisoners 400 Children held? in Israeli Dungeons 468,831 new settlers on an Occupied land Disappearance of Palestine World Leader in UN Violations- 69
Is it morally right to kill terror leaders surrounded by innocent people?
If you let him live, he might kill innocent people from your side. So just ensure it is a good opportunity that will cost the minimum innocent casualties.
Does this change something?
Do you want to encourage terrorist to hide behind human shield?
imagine it was your child, mother or father who died? you have no pity?why many videos on GAZA are deleted?they don't want you to see the truth,truth shocks.
Hamas, like other terrorist organizations are destroying our western civilization and are not going to stop until everyone is under Islamic Law, the Sharia, back to the 7th century. They are shameless in the use of civilians for their criminal war.
Most of the world is weak, not well informed enough or indifferent. The only brave enought to face this reality are the Isarelis, because they have no alternative. GO ISRAEL !!!!
"Deliberate attacks on civilians that lack strict military necessity are war crimes. Israel's current violations of intrnational law extend a long pattern of abuse of the rights of Gazans. 80% of Gaza's residents are Palestinian refugees who were forced from their homes or fled in fear of Jewish terrorist attacks in 1948. For 60 yrs, Israel has denied the internationally recognized rights of Palestinian refugees to return to their homes -- because they are not Jews."
Hey, if don't have anything intelligent to say, then best to keep your mouth shut. A newspaper like the Wall Street Journal is normally conservative...that is...a backer of US interests. The quote is more interesting for that reason. Your rebuttal was plain stupid and ignorant...and that's being nice..
Sorry for my ignorance, but this unequivocally demonstrates the attempts of the anti-zionist to utilize any type of blasphemy and denunciation. For example, if it is a zionist slanted article, everyone states zionists control the media. When it is contrary to that notion, nothing is said. I would say more critical than ignorant.
The article is not really the issue. The facts are that Israel, in defiance of a decision from it's own Supreme Court, banned all foreign media from entering Gaza during the complete war. Why did they do so. They did it in order to control the images and the message that went out to the world. Did you watch the video of Livni in front of the Nationsl Press Club in Washington from just several days ago. They basically made it clear to her that her message was propaganda.
The simple fact is that during the war in Lebanon, the foreign media was running all over the place and making reports that ended up leaking classified information to the enemy. The ban on media in Gaza was to avoid all this. That was the main reason. Whether it was a convenient way to taint the story, I will leave that to you to decide.
There is no excuse for keeping the press out, against a judicial decision by the Israeli Supreme Court. It was illegal and not justified, no matter how much you may want to control media coverage. If Israel was justified, then everyone would do it. The truth on the battlefield is never a good thing for any invader, but it is a basic right that we alllow third party coverage in order to maintain the Geneva Convention rights and other human rights.
Livni either avoided or refused to answer any questions that called into questions the Israeli rationale for the war. They lied about the reason for so many deaths and casualties of Palestinians. They lied about who broke the ceasefire. They lied about the type of weapons they were using. They killed whole families and more, in order to attack one person. They justified a "war on terror" by thinking they could use Bush's rationale for killing people needlessly. I could go on and on...
The journalist at the National Press Club was right to call her a terrorist, and ask why a terrorist was invited to speak in front of the National Press Club. The world is not stupid. Livni thinks she has the support of the western world and she is wrong. She has the support of some western leaders, who suck up to the US. Those of us who aren't kissing ass, know that the Israelis were plain stupid and unethical to have gone into Gaza and killed 1200 people-the majority of whom were innocent.
In addition...you seem to want to resort to personal insults, rather than respond intelligently. It's hard to have much respect for anything you're saying. I can't see one substantial factual thing that you've said yet. Defensiveness and insults are the sign of someone who has already admitted they are in the losing position.
الموت لاسراءيل Death to Israel Mort à Israël Muerte a Israel 以色列去死 Смерть Израилю Morte a Israel イスラエルに死 Morte a Israele इज़राइल की मौत מוות לישראל Tod Israel Dood aan Israël
AIPAC has supported the funding of a number of Israeli military projects that have resulted in new additions to the arsenal of the United States Armed Forces. Israel's Arrow anti-missile system is now the most advanced working anti-ballistic missile system in the world. It is being mass produced at a Boeing plant in Huntsville, Alabama for use by both the United States and Israel.
Sid Ryan is really dumb! He is actuallya really stupid guy. It's kind of funny actually. Why is he even allowed on this program? He is an anti-semitic bitch!
your right cleanarab, israelis don't have to worry about having food, water, and medicine. do you know why? because israelis won the war with the palestinians, who were trying to eradicate them. the palestinians massacre israelis every chance they get, and yet the israelis have not destroyed the palestinians yet, even though they could in a single day.
i hate israel wankers, they kill one of their own and blame it on hamas then they kill 360 civilians and say we got revenge, y did muslims help these jews when hitler was gassing them they shouldnt have given then land to stay on now they ova takin im bred in uk if they dnt stop their terrorism britains gonna be ova there to fuckin rip their throats apart its a shame y nothing has happend, y havnt other countrys started bombing israel, when russia attacked georgia usa was talkin shit defending
georgia becasue its a small terrorist state, russia told them to piss of usa went quiet, have u heard the latest even though the UN and EU are upset by israel attcks usa is blaming hamas sayin yeh keep bombing them what are rockets against apachi helicopters tanks state of the art war machines usa hates muslims thats y muslims hate them
ha I love the word play of this video. first off he calls what HEZBOLLAH does as attacks and calls what israel does defense military strikes. then he calls the ones fighting for israel soldiers and the ones fighting for hezbollah terrorists. and thats where i pressed pause because i know this video is crap. the suicide bombings u hear about in israel are documented to be staged attacks by the actual israeli governments so that when 5 innocent jews die, israel can kill 100 innocent muslims.
as muslims we are not to kill innocent civilians just living their daily lives. but soldiers oppressing and killing innocent palestinian muslims and even christians are to be killed in battle or captured for ransom. the ones that fight the soldiers are the real freedom fighters. while the so called suicide bombings that kill innocent people are 99.9 percent of the time staged attacks just like 9/11 so that no peace treaty can be reached and so that israel can keep killing.
but at the same time i do believe hezbollah is shiite. and the shiites have no doubt about it strayed from the original islam. and all inventions and made up things in religion will lead to the hell fire.
palestinian kids are tought to hate kill and burn israeli flags, stop showing bunch of bodies lying down the floor, and on second later getting up, 90% of palestinians hate hizbollah and hamas, with out them we can all live together one day, with no terror, israel is not searching for blood, israel is searching for peace, if palestinian people want it, they need to take out hamas!
in the peace treaty between israel and hamas the slingshots hamas was shooting had stopped during the ceasefire,but part of the peace agreement was for israel to take the full blown blockade off of gaza so the palestinians could get basic necessities like food,water,electricity,etc.. and so people could get jobs and their economy could start up and running again. well guess what for the past 18 months israel has laid siege on gaza turning off all water and electricity and not allowing anything!
so guess what happened when israel broke the peace treaty and would not take the blockade off of gaza and the people were starving and not getting the medical attention they needed. hamas starting firing their slingshots over the inhumane wall that israel built to keep the palestinians caged in like animals.
they kidnapped our soldier, palestinians should speak out against hamas and take them out, they know the only ones to blame on this one is hamas, for 8 years they have been launching missiles at us with out any response from us, after kidnapping our soldier Gilad Shalit and holding him for over than 800 days now and massive rocket firing, what would u expect? us giving them flours? we are doing what every other country in the entire world would have done, IDF is defending its people from hamas
well you do know parts of hamas are owned and controlled by israel correct? it came out in the israeli newspapers that israel owns parts of hamas and founded them to be in oppostion of the PLO. so they kidnapped some soldiers because their people were under attack from these terrorist israeli soldiers. but they released him unharmed and untortured.unlike israel which picks up palestinians in the middle of the night(i witnessed it) and you never see them again.they get tortured! prisonplanet. com
and those slingshots that hamas shoots are only in response to israel laying siege on the palestine and gaza. with their checkpoints and inhuman blockade of gaza,not allowing any food or medicine in and cutting off all electricity and water for INNOCENT CIVILIANS. IAM SURE ISRAELIS DONT HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT HAVING NO FOOD OR DRINK OR MEDICINE.
-KILLING PALESTINIANS AT A RATIO OF 8 to 1 AND THEN CLAIMING YOU ARE THE VICTIM OF TERRORISM AND ANTISEMITISM IS SIMPLY LAUGHABLE BY ANY RATIONAL, LOGIC, RELIGION OR CREED. NO EXCUSE* IS CREDIBLE FOR THESE LEVELS OF TERRORISM. NOT EVEN THE JEWISH TORAH ALLOWS KILLING BEYOND AN EYE FOR AN EYE!
,~PLEASE MEMORIZE & POST THIS COMMENT ON OTHER ISRAEL RELATED VIDEOS.
UN resolution violations??? Well you've got to be kidding me. Israel has violated more UN reolutions than all countries on earth (all put together)!Either way, Arabs know that the UN is a biased and untrustworthy institution, set up for the interests of a few nations.
Israel is a regional power, but only for the meantime. US support is sure to shift as oil resources deplete and israel becomes more costly to protect. The creation of Israel will never be imposed on Arabs, trust me, I am one.
If 5 arab armies didn't attack simultaneously after this, and violate original UN Resol, there would have been a Palestine in 1948, a very large Palestine, & indefensible borders for Israel
The UN Partition Plan for Palestine or UN General Assembly Resolution 181 was a plan approved by the General Assembly on Nov 29, 1947 to terminate the British Mandate of Palestine by Aug 1, 1948, and facilitate the creation of 2 states, one Jewish and one Arab.
do you know how many u.n. resolutions israel breaks every day. israeli terrorist leaders themselves do not want peace. that is why they stage terrorist attacks on their own jewish people so then they can blame the muslims and kill thousands of them freely.
KILLING PALESTINIANS AT A RATIO OF "8 to 1" YEAR AFTER YEAR AND THEN CLAIMING ISRAEL IS THE VICTIM OF TERRORISM AND ANTI SEMITISM IS SIMPLY LAUGHABLE BY ANY RATIONAL, LOGIC, RELIGION OR CREED!!!. NO EXCUSES ARE CREDIBLE FOR THESE LEVELS OF USA SPONSORED ISRAELI STATE TERRORISM!!!. NOT EVEN THE JEWISH RELIGION ALLOWS KILLING BEYOND MERCIFULL SELF DEFENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.
Source of ratio: BT Selem ISRAELI Human Rights Group
This is the first time I watch Michael Coren, and I can gladly say that this guy is the dumbest journalist I'v ever seen!!! His arguments are weak, his facts are wrong or incomplete, he's not funny and his completely biased. The Prisoner exchange Sid predicted happened, including the release of Samir Kuntar!
Dear all, who cares who's right and who's wrong... both sides have their arguments and the reality of Israel is here to stay (Im convinced) and these blokes will not be changing their approach any soon.
Take sides... get ready for the battle. The fronts are open for all.
or
Take sides... and campaign for peace by changing yourself first.
user174, Checked out your page, you are one hateful fellow. If you put as much energy into a positive direction as you do toward hate, you might even discover that being a human has some upside. I'm not religious, and like you believe in evolution, but, I would wish you some sunshine on your sad racist existance.
konagnu, I am looking at your response to user174, and see that althoug he is more open with his hate for other people, you aren't much different, it is just what you hate that seperates the two of you. He hates Jews for Israel, while you hate Islam for the terrorists, when really your arguements make as much sense as representing christianity with Pat Robertson.
Most Jews and Muslims are decent people who just want to live their lives, and the sooner the two of you realize that, the better.
krypte, Either you are Muslim, or you know little about Islam & its view of kafirs & how they are to be treated. I have no problem with Muslim people, most just want to live their lives in peace. The problem as I (as well as many observers) see it is the radical clerics tend to be the driving force in Islam. The goal of Islam is that there remain no other religion on earth. It is the duty of Muslims to convert the Infidel by persuasion (no problem) or force (big problem). Look it up.
Just because the Jewish people exist, doesn't mean that the world needs to give them something. Why should Palestinians suffer just so a bunch of retarded Jewish people can feel safe even though they knowingly move near the highest consintration of people who hate them?
That isn't the issue though. Israel already exists, and so does Palestine, now Israel needs to leave Palestine the fuck alone and quit making colonies there.
Kripte, Do you not pay any attention to the news at all? Israel left Gaza & the West Bank THREE years ago destroying the homes of 6,000 Israeli settlers. Now what do you suggest Israel do when rockets are fire into civilian areas on a daily basis from Gaza, just watch there citizens get killed & injured? Why would you use the term "retarded"? Israel is the only democracy in the mid east. The Arab citizens in Israel have more rights than any Arabs living in Arab states. READ, start with the news!
These rights you speak of all all fake. Just look at what Israel did for the Palestinian votes when Palestine voted for Hamas. "You have the right to vote so long as you vote the right way" it's all bullshit.
6000, OMG, that's soo much!!! SARCASM
There are four hundred thousand settlers still in the West Bank. The people of Gaza and the West Bank view themselves as the same, and Gaza won't stop fighting till the West Bank is truely freed, and by that I mean ALL MILITANT ISRAELES MUST GO.
krypte, You are naive. Hamas has vowed the destruction of Israel. If your neighbor elected the guy that openly stated his intention to come into your home, kill you & your family, how would you react? Would you still allow that person into your house to work? Would you still give him free electricity, medical supplies, food, a job? If you say yes to this then you are suicidal. Thankfully, the Israelis are not. Hamas will never stop no matter what concessions the Israelis offer. They are Islamic.
Another example of American pro-Israeli propaganda! I agree with Israel's right to exist, but not to be a terrorist state with undeclared nuclear weapons and more UN condemnations than any other state!
War Sucks, especialy when u have no work , no proper shelter , no money & no goverment support. Thats the sides of Alot of Palo's & other Arab Countries. How many homeless Jews are there is Israel? How many people in Israel die from other countries Weapons? If only Humans didnt know what Revenge was.
msabih, Please consider the following: There are 13.5 million Jews worldwide. 1.9 BILLION Muslims and 54 Islamic states. Israel has the right to self-defense. If the Arabs loose a war, they go home, if Israel looses, they all die. Ask yourself why Arab states have refused to allow Palos to become citizens of their states. Palos left Israel in '48 at the request of Arab Govt's who were planning to invade. Arabs lost, They want a hostile population posed against Israel.
Why? 'Cos war is big business specially for the american military-industrial complex who, in order to sustain its growth, needs to feed the monsterous machinary throughout perpetual escalating conflicts. Therefor, peace is not their goal, instead of that they keep maintaining the shock between civilisations, deforming the media coverage in a way that it will always legitimate the use of force for their political agenda.
Wow! After watching that, It's hard to deny the existence of a massive pro-sionist lobby that shapes the media coverage of the middle-east conflicts. It is done in such a deceiving way! The ideoligical core of all this propaganda is volontary burried under layers of twisted and false assertions, it tries to appear as rational and objective to most tube believer yet it is only cheesy pro-sionist and neo-con gospel to promote war and perpetual aggression!
Kryptemonic, you wrote, "read views of some Israeli parties, like killing all arabs."
Until such parties gain control in Israel, there is no similarity between Israel and 'Palestine'.
Election is endorsement of methods and ideology. Palestinians have endorsed Hamas. This means they are not ready to sit at the adult table, let alone the negotiating table.
I've entertained your moral confusion and theocratic sympathy for long enough. Peace.
micheal coren is a loud mouth know it all, he as no redeeming quality ,he cant even debate , wen he is loosing an argument he bully's is way into it and interrupts at every opportunely , he must have been a great kid in school pushing every one around with is big mouth .
There is no point arguing sense with these anti-Semites. They are blind to everything but their hatred for Jews and Israel and are *impervious* to rational debate.
This clip was two years ago. Sid Ryan tried to make a big deal about the rules of war and how the Israeli soldiers were "captured" and not "kidnapped" I would like to hear what he thinks now, two years later, about the fact the Gilad Shalit has still not been returned, has not seen the Red Cross nor is there notice on his condition
it is a perverted collectivist notion that somehow an individual can be held accountable for a crime he did not commit or participate in simply because the government he happened to be born under made a bad moral judgement. that is ridiculous! only individuals can commit crimes and only individuals can justly be punished for them. unless every last one of those dead civilians are guilty of committing an act of aggression, their deaths were unnacceptable.
I think you misunderstand. Nobody is blaming Lebanese civilians for Hezbollah's aggression, or for the Lebanese government's impotency. They are blaming the initiator of violence, Hezbollah, for collateral deaths and human shield casualties.
I make a distinction between the two because, while I understand why one might be confused about who is to blame for collateral damage, there is no excuse for placing blame on Israel for human shield casualties.
Actually, Israel is at fault for human shield casualties, as they use human shields. One out of ten Israelis is at least a reservists, making one in ten a military target, yet they hide among the people of Israel.
Also, there are photos of Israelis holding Palestinian children infront of them as bullet shields or on their jeep to keep safe from attack. I'll send you a video.
Look, people do shitty things in war. But I don't see how you are going to convince me to support a place where Islamic law is the rule. In Israel, I could openly live as an Atheist. In the neighboring countries and territories, life would be short for me.
I checked out the videos. Trees getting torn up to build a security fence is sad, but it is not an example of collective punishment. Israel decided that was the best place to stop security risks. Neither of us are in a position to conclude it wasn't.
Regarding human shields, there are more convincing videos of Hezbollah and Hamas. Just wait for the end of your video and there are plenty. There is even one of a Palestinian giving a press conference saying it is official policy to use them.
I looked up the place on google earth, I found the valley easily as the white stuff on the ground made it stand out. It is just SW of Bethlahem, and East by NE of Efrata. There was pleanty of land they could have bult a fense on other than that, but the video said they were building sewers, and the Pales were fine if it was on there land but not in their trees. It is perfectly clear, that if it wasn't on purpose to hurt the Pales there, the Israelis really didn't give a shit about them.
But it does allow one to double check on things... to see who was right on the geography, and also anything visible from space can be checked for actual damage assesment from a bird's eye view. Israel says they don't target civilians, well google earth pictures of Beirut, and not just the ones where you have to click on the blue circles, beg to differ.
Google earth does not beg to differ - an aerial photo of a damaged building will NOT show the complete context of its destruction.
There are videos on this very web site that show Hezbollah rockets being fired from balconies on the 4th/5th story of Lebanese buildings. Only a monumental evasion of this fact could lead you to believe that Israel was targeting Lebanese civilians.
Hezbollah innitiated the war. Hezbollah took positions close to civilians and UN personnel. HEZBOLLAH is to blame.
OK, so where should Hezbollah fight then??? Any state that arms Hezbollah is automatically declared terrorist supportive. Urban warfare is the only way Hezbollah, whether it be good or bad, can stand a fighting chance agaisnt Israel. Israel arms itself too the teeth and then plays victim when it's enemies fight the only way they possibly can. Israel has Apaches, they easily could have hit those buildings with smaller rockets. 180 thousand homes were destroyed. ISRAELIS ARE THE BAD GUYS.
Hezbollah shouldn't fight. They should lay down arms. Islam is no excuse for starting a war. You cut Hezbollah all the slack in the world; it makes me think you would enjoy living as a dhimmi.
If Hezbollah chooses to fight, the Israeli military is obligated to kill them - no matter where they are. Israel also has a moral obligation not to risk its soldiers lives in helicopters when they have other means of destroying their attackers.
I realise that a lot of what Hezbollah does, they claim they do because of religion, that is because for them, religion is where they get their morals, but what are the morals they are trying to defend? They are fighting to free Palestine from it's opressors. It would be one thing if they were fighting to defend Palestine and killing thousands of Israeli civilians, but Israel is the conqueror and the murderer. I don't see, if you look at the whole picture that Hezbollah is the lesser of 2 evils.
When Hezbollah says stuff like that, you should take it seriously.
Anyway, I have to say this again: Hezbollah is an Iranian Pawn -for control of Lebanon, not helping Palestinians. Don't be confused.
You can't blame every conflict in the world on Israel, a country the size of Vancouver Island. You want to take sides with the Palestinians? Misguided, but fine. Just don't project their conflict on the rest of the MidEast. Arabs and non-Arab Muslims don't care about Palestinians. They never have.
I do not blame every confilt on Israel, but I do believe that Israel's existance and the West's aid of them has created a lot of conflict. I'll admit, there are a LOT of crazies in the middle east. It is because of that, that the middle east is fragile. I think that the Jewish people have been through a lot, but moving to Israel was not the answer, and their justification of the holocaust for their own actions makes things worse. I don't want Israel destroyed, but I want them out of Palestine.
How am I supposed to take that statement? In recent history there has never been an international consensus as to where "Palestine" begins and ends. One definition of Palestine includes all of Israel. By that definition, Israel must be destroyed.
In the past you've shown approval for pre-1967 borders. I disagree; much of that territory is required for Israel's self-defense. It's land they won in response to aggressive actions taken by Egypt and its allies (like closing the Straits of Tiran).
So Palestinians should suffer Israeli occupation just so Israel could feel a little bit safer??? Besides, Palestine actually wouldn't be a very good buffer at all, as I am sure with modern knoledge of warefare, any invading army would first arm Hamas, so when they can attack Israel to liberate Palestine, Hamas could sabotage Israeli supply lines and cut off reinforcements and even retreat. Israel would be a lot safer without Palestine. They might just increase international popularity too.
Religious dictators like this become less of a threat when ignored? Hamas Charter, article 11:
"[we believe] that the land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf consecrated for future Moslem generations until Judgement Day."
"This is the law governing the land of Palestine in the Islamic Sharia (law) and the same goes for any land the Moslems have conquered by force, because during the times of (Islamic) conquests, the Moslems consecrated these lands to Moslem generations till the Day of Judgement."
All Hamas is, is a more agressive response of the mob, to Fatah's failure to free Palestine. Hamas only has ten thousand jihadists, compared to over 2 million Palestinians who voted for them. Most of the Pales who voted Hamas don't feel that kind of extremism is needed, they just feel Hamas is the only group in Palestine with the balls to take on the Israeli thugs that plague their lives every day. Shit, you think Hamas is extreme, read views of some Israeli parties, like killing all arabs.
Krypte, The ignorance of the history of this conflict & the lack of understanding of the Islamic perspective that you display would be laughable if it were not so tragic. So many see one or two documentaries or reports skewed so far by Islamic propaganda that they suddenly find themselves experts much as the dolt named Sid in this youtube video. Take the time to educate yourself on the subject somewhere other than on Youtube or anti-Israel sights & you may not end up looking such a fool.
First off, I have NEVER been to an anti-Israeli sight.
I have developed my view and understanding by seeing others who have views in this conflict. Israels is the occupying force, and Israel's approach to national security always involves the suffering of it's neighbors' civilians. Also Israel continues to send colonies into occupied territories making it seem more like conquest than national defense. Because of this, I must side with Palestine, and ANY forces fighting for her liberation.
Krypte, Israel is NOT an occupying force. It is a nation formed in 1948 by the UN. They were attacked soon after by 6 Arab nations. The Arabs living in Israel left their homes at the request of the invading Arab nations with the promise of more land when the Jews were thrown out. They lost the war. The Arabs who chose to stay in Israel are citizens with the right to vote, to serve in office & worship as they please. Can Jews do that in Islamic states? Many "settlements" have been destroyed.
What the fuck do you call all the checkpoints and IDF in East Jerusalem and the West Bank. Israel is too an occupying force. They occupy the nation of Palestine, which consists of Gaza, the West Bank, and the Muslim and Christian quarters of Jerusalem.
Krypte, You spew without factual knowledge. When was the last time you were in Israel? When is the last time you read a book on the issue. Your understanding is clearly influenced by one side of the story. If you really care about the issue, study the history, visit the area and shape you opinions on facts. Both sides have their stories. I call the check points "self defense". Are you unaware of the suicide bombers, the threats to Israel's existence, daily rocket attacks, constant attacks?
I know Israel feels the need to leave their troops in Palestine for their own defense, but that is what an occupying force is. Israel occupies Palestine in part for their own defense, but also I have a feeling it is for their own conquest as they continue to move their own people into Palestine by form of colonization.
There is a debate as to whether Israel or Palestine is at fault for the conflict, but the idea that Israel is not an occupying force is quite foolish.
krypte, You discuss "Palestine" as if it were a nation. It is not. "Palestine" is a region that includes Israel, the Gaza strip, & the West Bank. (and more) Gaza & the West Bank are autonomous areas controlled and governed by "Palestinians". Israel "occupies" Israel. Israel is subjected to daily rocket attack from Gaza. Israelis are frequently injured & killed. There is no outrage in the press against the perpetrators of this terror, but the press screams when Israel defends herself.
Palestine has embassies, police, political parties, its own declared people numbering over two million, it even has a fucking flag.
Palestine is as much a nation as Israel is. What gives Israel the right to be a nation, but not Palestine. Shit, at least most Palestinians have actually lived there more than a century, most Israelis are foreigners. I'd say Palestine has more a right to exist than Israel, but Israel isn't going to go away, and neither is Palestine and you need to accept that.
krypte, Are you attempting to legitimize the Palestinians claim to the land based on how long they have lived there? If that is the case, why would the Jews not have primacy as they have been there for over 3000 years? My boy scout troop has a fucking flag. My town has police, my county (Hawaii) has a mayor's adjunct office in Honolulu (Oahu). Houston has 2 million people. . . so what! are all those Nations?
What gives Israel the right to be a nation? Try out UN resolution 181, 11/29/1947
Actually, if Hawaii... or Texas wanted to declare independence, I would support them in that. I think the declaration of independences is the most important document in the USA, and I believe every word of it.
Just because you are Jewish doesn't mean you have claim to Israel. Most Jews living in Israel are immigrents, while almost all Palestinians can actually say they have had ancestors living in Palestine since the Muslim expansion out of Arabia.
krypte, Within days after the US (& 30+other nations)recognized Israel, six arab nations invaded. The Arabs living in Israel were encouraged by the Arab Gov'ts to leave for their safety assuring them they could return once the Jews were driven out. The Arabs lost. Do they not have some responsibility to absorb their Arab brothers into their cultures? Left out of these discussions is the fact that 10s of 1,000s of Jews were forced out of Arab nations at the same time. Should they be allowed back?
My morality says yes, but my practicality says no.
I don't even know why the arab invasions decades ago are even an issue though today. Palestinians are their own declared people, STILL LIVING IN THEIR HOMES, and they should be allowed their own sovereign nation. Morally, Israeli settlers are just colonies, and practically, 5 million Jews moved to Israel in 50 years, they can move a half a million settlers out of Palestine in less than 5 years.
krypte, You state "I don't even know why the arab invasions decades ago are even an issue though today." It is important as history has brought all of us to where we are today. It's why History is so important. You may not know that already Israel has returned lots of land that was "settled" by Israelis. The homes of those settlers were destoryed and the land given to the Palestinans in hope for peace. The real issue is not land, it is Islam. Learn about Islam & much of this will be clarified.
It's not Islam. If Islam was a problem, Jews should have known better than to move from one people who hated them in Europe to another in the middle east and should get the fuck out of the human gene pool. The only religion at fault is the psuedo Jewish zionism which is hardly different from manifest destiny that brought Israelis there in the first place.
It won't be until ALL settlements are gone that there will be true peace. If you steal some land, you have to give it ALL back, not some.
this whole idea that somehow the CIVILIANS of a country can be held responsible for the actions of that country's politicians is just completely perverted. I can not be held accountable for the war in iraq simply because i live within the realm of george bush. if iraq were to issue a counter aggression to george bush's and the u.s. military's aggression, and i were to somehow die in the crossfire, that would NOT be morally acceptable in the least bit.
"this whole idea that somehow the CIVILIANS of a country can be held responsible for the actions of that country's politicians is just completely perverted."
In general: who empowers a country's politicians? Who pays for a soldier's bullets and bombs?
If you pay neighbour A to protect you, and he beats up neighbour B for that purpose, have you no responsibility for A's actions?
I agree with you, but I'd like to answer the question.
You are only at fault for neighbor A, if you do nothing in response to his actions. As Israelis do nothing, they are at fault. Also, as Israel is a democracy... at least for Israelis, they even continue to vote for these barbarians to lead them in their culteral genocide, I'd say the Israeli people are in a great deal of fault.
oh my god i cant believe these people ! are they serious or they r kidding me ! discussing if israel in self defense or not ! israel who occupied a whole county, displace a whole nation and killed 300.000 since then 189,000 under 5 years been killed, all this in self defense ! what the hell ! look at them how serious they r ! oh my god
I just looked at the Beirut airport on Google Earth, you can see the bomb damage and it is only on the runways, however it is very clear that it is only a civilian airport. There aren't many hangers, sure not enough to store enough fighters to do anything, probably regular maintnance hangers. There aren't many buildings, it's mostly parking lot and run way, it is very clear that the Beirut airport is almost completely a civilian airport save for maybe Lebanon customs officails.
You simply can't look at a satellite image of an airport and conclude that is or isn't a legitimate military target. All the googling in the world won't tell you how much material Hezbollah was moving through Beirut... If think you have abilities the rest of us don't have you should try getting a job for the military or state department. Don't be surprised if they laugh at you.
Look at it yourself. Unless hezbollah has secret fighter planes that even the government didn't even know about that came out of secret tunnels under the regular hangers in the airport, it really wasn't a military target. Besides, airports are some of the most regulated places in a country, Israel went to war with Hazbollah, not Lebanon, ever think if Lebanon's border with Syria as the place where they go their weapons? Why the hell would they need to fly them in? Israel was definately wrong.
You seem be falling trap to the idea that Lebanon is capable of enforcing its sovereignty. The Lebanese power structure quakes at the feet of Syrian and Iranian agents. Again, Hezbollah doesn't use fighter jets... It uses Katyusha rockets, often taking firing positions on top of hospitals and dense residential areas. These tactics and the people who employ them are responsible for Lebanese civilian casualties, not Israel.
Israel is the one who actually pulled the trigger that killed the civilians. It was a dumb fucking war and Israel shouldn't have entered. They went to save 2 soldiers that were captured, and in the end, they killed a bunch of civilians, never got those soldiers back and even lost more, AND because of it's recklesness, Hezbollah is more powerful than ever before. When you destroy someones home, they will want revenge. Israel not only badly handled that war they never of started, they lost.
A proper moral evaluation of civilian casualties places blame on the person who initiated the conflict. Just as Japan was ultimately responsible for the firebombing of Tokyo and the nuclear blasts at Hiroshima and Nagasaki, Hezbollah was responsible for the civilian casualties during the 2006 conflict.
At least you are right about Israel losing. Every time they threaten victory the international community pressures them to stop. That ensures Hezbollah will rearm and violence continues.
The people who initiated the conflict was not Hezbollah, the conflict was initiated when Israel started setting up settlements in Palestine and restricting and opressing palestinians in order to defend the settlements. It may be the Jewish homland, but it has been the homeland of the people of palestine since the muslim expansion from arabia one and a half thousand years ago. Israel is the occupying power, Hezbollah is trying to end the occupation and oppression of the people of palestine.
you are absolutely correct. i am completely repulsed by the fact that an objectivist would defend a rogue state which has absolutely no respect whatsoever for the rights of its subjects. israel bulldozes thousands upon thousands of homes annually, destroys settlements that were established many years before israel, and in doing so displaces literally millions of people. israel has demonstrated consistently its total disregard for the property rights of nonjewish residents. youre right.
Is it your position that Israel deserves no credit for this because they have forced taxation and conscription? The rights of Gentiles inside Israel proper are protected in the same way as Jews. Maybe you refer to occupied territories, where gangland warfare is the rule?
There, no organization exists to protect the rights of Palestinians, and Israel certainly has no obligation to do so. These people are so primitive they think honor killing and the stoning of a rape victims is acceptable.
I have nothing against taxation or conscription, however the large military reserve in Israel does make 1/10 Israelis a military target.
As a nation claiming to be a western democracy, it has an obligation to everyone that it occupies. These people do not wish to be occupied, and because of the occupation, they cannot fend for themselves. Israel fucked up their lives through conquest, murder, and occupation, they damn well have a duty to fix it.
I'd like to add, if they can't fix it, they better just leave, and that goes the same for the US in Iraq, Turkey in Kurdistan, and Russia in Chechnya.
Conscription is a moral abomination ("war-slavery" comes to mind).
I don't believe Israel or the US have any obligation to protect non-citizens. However, the must refrain from violating the rights of non-citizens (again, retaliatory collateral damage is not a violation of rights). If they establish governments like the US has in Iraq and Afghanistan, they have an obligation to establish a rights-respecting one. In this sense, I think the US has failed.
Israelis don't care enough about their country to volunteer for the military, if it weren't for Israel's universal draft, they'd have lost by now.
Israel has not established a real representative government in Palestine, and because Palestine is not an independant nation, they do not have a bill of rights, so aside from the UN, which Israel doesn't give a damn about, Palestinians don't have any legal rights? Why can't Israel just treat them like human beings because its the right thing to do
Don't be sure Israel's enemies are all willing combatants either. It's common for suicide bombers to be coerced.
All humans have rights. Governments are legitimate only to the extent that they protect those rights. It's the Israeli govmnt's job to defend Israelis. They remain responsible for this even when their enemies are near innocents.
Israel doesn't collectively punish - innocent deaths tend to be collateral damage. Conversely, Israel's enemies consistently target discos, weddings, etc.
Dude, I have a video of IDF pulling trees out of a hundred year old fruit farm owned by Palestinians, with no aim to turn the land into a settlement or a military base, what other purpose could pulling short fruit trees out of the ground than collective punnishment? Also, I have videos of IDF breaking Pale bones with slabs of stone on a hillside. There is also the friggen siege of Gaza.
If neither side wants to fight, why doesn't Israel leave Palestine so they can stop fighting eachother?
Remember, the nation of Palestine simply doesn't exist. This leads to competing claims as to what territory Palestinians should control.
Israel more or less annexed some of what it considered Palestine for reasons of strategic defense and religious ridiculousness.
Many Palestinians believe the whole area is Palestine, and want the Israelis retreat from the middle east entirely. That's why Israel simply can't leave; the Palestinians will constantly press the attack until Israel is gone.
Palestine does too exist, it even has an embassy in the US. Why does Israel, a nation of people who took nearly all their land by force from its rightful owners just in the last century have a right to exist, but the nation of the people who have lived there since the arab expansion of Islam nearly one and a half thousand years ago not exist? Israel should abandon all of their territory they didn't have before 1967, and any zionist, nazi, aryanist who doesn't leave should be simply fucked.
At the time of the creation of Israel, the Arabs made the point that they should not have to pay the price (provide territory for a Jewish state) when it was Germany that committed the atrocities and caused the Jewish diaspora. Why not, in their view, carve out territory in Germany and thereby punish those responsible for the internal dispossession of the Jews there. Coren of course adopts only Western propaganda, and hasn't the slightest grasp of this, labeling Israel a victim.
Is there little wonder there is no peace in Israel/Palestine when grown people like those in this video cant agree - OR even have the decency to hear the other persons point of view AND attempt to understand it. If your too close to the fire - get out and let someone who is objective debate it.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
Is it right to kill a murderer in self-defence? NO. He hasn't murdered you yet, so he's not a murderer. You can use reasonable force in an attack, which might involve killing.
Is Hezbollah a murderer by using human shields?: NO. That's a gross justification for collateral damage, and killing innocents on purpose is against Int. Law.
Is it wrong to trade prisoners: NO. Note that Hezbollah are "terrorists", Israelis are "soldiers".
Hi Paul: Thanks for responding. The original question is odd because it is assuming the fellow is a murderer BEFORE he has actually killed anyone. And if he had killed someone else before he attacked you, and this was proven in court, he would be in jail. So I really take issue with the original premise. A better question would be, "Is it murder to kill in self defence?" Even the law protects people in this situation, as long as it was really self-defence, and not pre-emptive or for revenge.
Israel was carved out of territory in the Middle East in 1948 by several hidden promises: to the Rothchild family who financially supported British ventures for a Jewish homeland, to Arabs in support of attacks against Turkish domination, to the French with the idea of dividing up the ME between them. These promises were conflicting, and has left an enormous mess in that region.
Sid is a complete asshole. Good on Michael for putting him in his place. I love at the end how he acts like his feelings are so hurt that Michael's interrupting him, when he just proposed that Islamic terrorists should be able to hide behind civilian shields and not be attacked, because cilivians might be killed in the process.
If a highly armed terrorist hides in a civilian home, and you let him escape, you are responsible for the hundreds of civilians he WILL kill in the future. AND you will be sending a message that using civilian shields works, thus endangering the lives of hundreds more. Dropping a bomb on that home instead is the moral choice to save the most lives.
truthadvocate: This of course is a pre-emptive strike you are suggesting, and is the same argument used by oppressive regimes in immemoriam to kill anyone by reason that they might kill others (Soviet Union), or commit treason (Cuba), or sedition (Communist China), or subvert authority (Nazi Germany), or just be in the way (Franco's Spain). By the way, your proposal is also against International Law, but I doubt you care about that.
israel has no fault for the 1 million refugees it's created or the 1,500 innocent civilians killed. all over 2 kidnapped soldiers that happened to be in lebanese soil. it's the "terrorists" fault. attacking israeli troops makes you a terrorist.
totally correct. israel holds no responsibility for the murder it committed. hezbollah shouldn't have kidnapped those 2 soldier(wich is in retaliation for the THOUSANDS of lebanese CIVILIANS that have been kidnapped). Israel holds no fault for destroying beirut in the 90's and killing some 60,000 people.
After two nose jobs, a chin augmentation, and a face lift, I must say David Duke looks marvelous. I am curious however, who his surgeon is. I am thinking about getting a nose job myself but don't want to look like Michael Jackson. Like him, I also live in Louisiana. Can someone forward me his info?
banacek8675 9 months ago
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bradchesney11 9 months ago
shadowofears 10 months ago
shadowofears 10 months ago
Abbasieh Massacre
Adloun Massacre
Saida Massacre
Fakhani Massacre
Beirut Massacre Sabra And Shatila Massacre
Jibsheet Massacre
Sohmor Massacre
Seer Al Garbiah
Maaraka Massacres
Zrariah Massacre
shadowofears 10 months ago
KAFR QASEM MASSACRE
Khan Yunis Massacre
The Massacre in Gaza City
AL-SAMMOU' MASSACRE
Aitharoun Massacre
Kawnin Massacre
Hanin Massacre
Bint Jbeil Massacre
shadowofears 10 months ago
NASER AL-DIN MASSACRE
THE TANTURA MASSACRE
BEIT DARAS MASSACRE
THE DAHMASH MOSQUE MASSACRE
DAWAYMA MASSACRE
HOULA MASSACRE
SHARAFAT MASSACRE
Salha Massacre
The Massacre at Qibya
shadowofears 10 months ago
he King David Massacre
The Massacre at Baldat al-Shaikh
YEHIDA MASSACRE
KHISAS MASSACRE
QAZAZA MASSACRE
The Semiramis Hotel Massacre
The Massacre at Dair Yasin
shadowofears 10 months ago
he following list of massacres is by no means exclusive, but they reflect the nature of the Zionist occupation of Palestine and Lebanon and show that massacres and expulsions were not aberrations that happen in any war, but organized atrocities with only one aim, that is to have a Zionist state which is 'goyim rein'.
shadowofears 10 months ago
When people make these sorts of criticisms on Islam, it is not done as a constructive criticism, it is more like an outright dismissal. We can dismiss them as human beings because we treat women better than they do, and therefore we should just kill them all, men, women, and children, in order to rectify this situation.
shadowofears 10 months ago
They dont consider Palestinians as humans may be subhumans or animals
shadowofears 10 months ago
@motorcityrobbie
what? lol YES THEY DO!
you're idiot lol.
MasbirimIsrael 1 year ago
michael coren is the intelligent one,is asking good questions where that stupid other idiot (the second one speaking who is flying to lebanon shortly) has no answers to,like beirut airport is a civillian airport!
reply from michael:but millitary planes also land there
then look at the face of the idiot, oooohhnhh yeeaaah,well that's true! it had slipped my mind for a moment BUT it is still civillian
stupid fuck,what a moron! really
drbable1 1 year ago
giving Israel back da same violence that it puts out has caused dem 2 say da people hew retaliated were da terrorist now getting out your cameras an exposing dem 2 da world as much as you can is gonna do the most damage an thy wont be able 2 play victim any more because we walked into Israels trap 4 way 2 long an now its there turn 2 walk in 2 ares ,now remember it isent about race it is about unjust crooked governments there was other places like Israel in history ,u.s.england an roman.
crazycoyotie 1 year ago
BALDY head is DUMB
Pig560 1 year ago
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00012581 1 year ago
Peace & Love! - 2 Words That Judaism and Jewish Know Nothing About!
avensina1 1 year ago
you mean israeli tourism...
urieldishi 1 year ago
Israel's cause is the whole worlds"
What a load of rubbish McKeever. Sorry - I'm not for ethnic cleansing, apartheid, and killing civilians en masse like Israel is. It's NOBODIES cause except Israel's and brown-nosed politicians like you trying to appease the Israel blackmail lobby.
dynaco 1 year ago
the BALD HEAD is lier,,, any one can see that he is lying
raju53 1 year ago
God what Israel War Crime Lovers thes Clare Mike and the Piece of Shit from the "freedom" party. Move the Fuck to israeHELL you Traitors of Canada. Canadians don't Support the TERROR STATE odf IsraeHELL. Coren the Biggest Zionist Slime on the TV.
suzieq0452 1 year ago
Sid Ryan - dangerously stupid fool
esabrieva 1 year ago
Israelis are Terrorists
Israel was born out of Terror
Google it "Irgun" the jewish Terrorgroup
They even kill the people who gave them there Land.
Jews are Soulless
eyMario83 2 years ago 2
guy u were right until u said jews are souless.
dont condemn the jewish populace for the actions of a few. doing so is every bit as ignorant, and irrationale as those u are condemning
seraphimWILLunite 2 years ago
Israel your so small. Do you understand what the consequences are if america stops backing you up ? Religion must be something spiritual. From and in your heart. Not a source to claim land out of. You socalled "Jews" are not that special. Once again there will be no g-d to save you from desaster. Imagine: That your culture is build on a fable. All this mess, blood and Human sacrifice for nothing. For a ferrytale. So, so sad.
StefanX1979 2 years ago
america and britain WILL NEVER stop backing isreal. period. same small # of people control those countries
seraphimWILLunite 2 years ago
Michael is a moron.
mingalabaa 2 years ago
And Paul comes in with the KO.
ymeg1 2 years ago
moelu4 2 years ago
Israel=Terrorist state and thorn in the United States side
xxmonickkkkaxx 2 years ago
known fact olmert confessed that they have planned 6 months before attacking lebanon so it was all planned
bobyloopo 2 years ago
Is it morally right to kill terror leaders surrounded by innocent people?
If you let him live, he might kill innocent people from your side. So just ensure it is a good opportunity that will cost the minimum innocent casualties.
Does this change something?
Do you want to encourage terrorist to hide behind human shield?
shainert 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
don't waste any more time.
Drop the bomb and nuke those lunatic iranians
God bless!
daddyil 2 years ago
Comment removed
daddyil 2 years ago
PALESTINE WILL BE FREE!
podriaserpeor 2 years ago
biased psychopaths, in normal (Human Beings Logic) not (apes logic) biased = lies
syncretize 3 years ago
imagine it was your child, mother or father who died? you have no pity?why many videos on GAZA are deleted?they don't want you to see the truth,truth shocks.
justicetolerance 3 years ago 2
Hamas, like other terrorist organizations are destroying our western civilization and are not going to stop until everyone is under Islamic Law, the Sharia, back to the 7th century. They are shameless in the use of civilians for their criminal war.
Most of the world is weak, not well informed enough or indifferent. The only brave enought to face this reality are the Isarelis, because they have no alternative. GO ISRAEL !!!!
aarch1 3 years ago
Wall St Journal today...
"Deliberate attacks on civilians that lack strict military necessity are war crimes. Israel's current violations of intrnational law extend a long pattern of abuse of the rights of Gazans. 80% of Gaza's residents are Palestinian refugees who were forced from their homes or fled in fear of Jewish terrorist attacks in 1948. For 60 yrs, Israel has denied the internationally recognized rights of Palestinian refugees to return to their homes -- because they are not Jews."
paulfornasier 3 years ago
Shit bro, i thought the media was controlled by zionists? Go back to your pit and vote for the NDP.
bryguyisfly 3 years ago
Hey, if don't have anything intelligent to say, then best to keep your mouth shut. A newspaper like the Wall Street Journal is normally conservative...that is...a backer of US interests. The quote is more interesting for that reason. Your rebuttal was plain stupid and ignorant...and that's being nice..
paulfornasier 3 years ago
Hahaha I am envious of your 1992 Corolla, your welfare check, your food stamps and your subsidized loft on Hastings street.
bryguyisfly 3 years ago
Sorry for my ignorance, but this unequivocally demonstrates the attempts of the anti-zionist to utilize any type of blasphemy and denunciation. For example, if it is a zionist slanted article, everyone states zionists control the media. When it is contrary to that notion, nothing is said. I would say more critical than ignorant.
bryguyisfly 3 years ago
The article is not really the issue. The facts are that Israel, in defiance of a decision from it's own Supreme Court, banned all foreign media from entering Gaza during the complete war. Why did they do so. They did it in order to control the images and the message that went out to the world. Did you watch the video of Livni in front of the Nationsl Press Club in Washington from just several days ago. They basically made it clear to her that her message was propaganda.
paulfornasier 3 years ago
The simple fact is that during the war in Lebanon, the foreign media was running all over the place and making reports that ended up leaking classified information to the enemy. The ban on media in Gaza was to avoid all this. That was the main reason. Whether it was a convenient way to taint the story, I will leave that to you to decide.
pitcalco 2 years ago
There is no excuse for keeping the press out, against a judicial decision by the Israeli Supreme Court. It was illegal and not justified, no matter how much you may want to control media coverage. If Israel was justified, then everyone would do it. The truth on the battlefield is never a good thing for any invader, but it is a basic right that we alllow third party coverage in order to maintain the Geneva Convention rights and other human rights.
paulfornasier 2 years ago
Livni either avoided or refused to answer any questions that called into questions the Israeli rationale for the war. They lied about the reason for so many deaths and casualties of Palestinians. They lied about who broke the ceasefire. They lied about the type of weapons they were using. They killed whole families and more, in order to attack one person. They justified a "war on terror" by thinking they could use Bush's rationale for killing people needlessly. I could go on and on...
paulfornasier 3 years ago
The journalist at the National Press Club was right to call her a terrorist, and ask why a terrorist was invited to speak in front of the National Press Club. The world is not stupid. Livni thinks she has the support of the western world and she is wrong. She has the support of some western leaders, who suck up to the US. Those of us who aren't kissing ass, know that the Israelis were plain stupid and unethical to have gone into Gaza and killed 1200 people-the majority of whom were innocent.
paulfornasier 3 years ago
In addition...you seem to want to resort to personal insults, rather than respond intelligently. It's hard to have much respect for anything you're saying. I can't see one substantial factual thing that you've said yet. Defensiveness and insults are the sign of someone who has already admitted they are in the losing position.
paulfornasier 3 years ago
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garyadamess 3 years ago
AIPAC has supported the funding of a number of Israeli military projects that have resulted in new additions to the arsenal of the United States Armed Forces. Israel's Arrow anti-missile system is now the most advanced working anti-ballistic missile system in the world. It is being mass produced at a Boeing plant in Huntsville, Alabama for use by both the United States and Israel.
xicanastyles 3 years ago
cleanarab is full of shit
rsbmd 3 years ago
Sid Ryan is really dumb! He is actuallya really stupid guy. It's kind of funny actually. Why is he even allowed on this program? He is an anti-semitic bitch!
rsbmd 3 years ago
Anti-semitic? Duhhhh, arabs are semites you fool!
xxmonickkkkaxx 2 years ago
your right cleanarab, israelis don't have to worry about having food, water, and medicine. do you know why? because israelis won the war with the palestinians, who were trying to eradicate them. the palestinians massacre israelis every chance they get, and yet the israelis have not destroyed the palestinians yet, even though they could in a single day.
VeritasJihad 3 years ago
i hate israel wankers, they kill one of their own and blame it on hamas then they kill 360 civilians and say we got revenge, y did muslims help these jews when hitler was gassing them they shouldnt have given then land to stay on now they ova takin im bred in uk if they dnt stop their terrorism britains gonna be ova there to fuckin rip their throats apart its a shame y nothing has happend, y havnt other countrys started bombing israel, when russia attacked georgia usa was talkin shit defending
fuckinshite0 3 years ago
georgia becasue its a small terrorist state, russia told them to piss of usa went quiet, have u heard the latest even though the UN and EU are upset by israel attcks usa is blaming hamas sayin yeh keep bombing them what are rockets against apachi helicopters tanks state of the art war machines usa hates muslims thats y muslims hate them
fuckinshite0 3 years ago
theyre no better than the other if you use the term terrorists,atleast hezbollah dont muder women and children,wake up...
motorcityrobbie 3 years ago 2
ha I love the word play of this video. first off he calls what HEZBOLLAH does as attacks and calls what israel does defense military strikes. then he calls the ones fighting for israel soldiers and the ones fighting for hezbollah terrorists. and thats where i pressed pause because i know this video is crap. the suicide bombings u hear about in israel are documented to be staged attacks by the actual israeli governments so that when 5 innocent jews die, israel can kill 100 innocent muslims.
cleanarab 3 years ago 2
as muslims we are not to kill innocent civilians just living their daily lives. but soldiers oppressing and killing innocent palestinian muslims and even christians are to be killed in battle or captured for ransom. the ones that fight the soldiers are the real freedom fighters. while the so called suicide bombings that kill innocent people are 99.9 percent of the time staged attacks just like 9/11 so that no peace treaty can be reached and so that israel can keep killing.
cleanarab 3 years ago
but at the same time i do believe hezbollah is shiite. and the shiites have no doubt about it strayed from the original islam. and all inventions and made up things in religion will lead to the hell fire.
cleanarab 3 years ago
kid you speak crap
soldiers are trained to defend not to kill
palestinian kids are tought to hate kill and burn israeli flags, stop showing bunch of bodies lying down the floor, and on second later getting up, 90% of palestinians hate hizbollah and hamas, with out them we can all live together one day, with no terror, israel is not searching for blood, israel is searching for peace, if palestinian people want it, they need to take out hamas!
DeDo10 3 years ago
Fuck eh.. well I'd hate anyone who decided to send a rocket attack onto me and the houses of my friends while we're all sleeping.
Great video.
YouBoob112 3 years ago
in the peace treaty between israel and hamas the slingshots hamas was shooting had stopped during the ceasefire,but part of the peace agreement was for israel to take the full blown blockade off of gaza so the palestinians could get basic necessities like food,water,electricity,etc.. and so people could get jobs and their economy could start up and running again. well guess what for the past 18 months israel has laid siege on gaza turning off all water and electricity and not allowing anything!
cleanarab 3 years ago
so guess what happened when israel broke the peace treaty and would not take the blockade off of gaza and the people were starving and not getting the medical attention they needed. hamas starting firing their slingshots over the inhumane wall that israel built to keep the palestinians caged in like animals.
cleanarab 3 years ago
they kidnapped our soldier, palestinians should speak out against hamas and take them out, they know the only ones to blame on this one is hamas, for 8 years they have been launching missiles at us with out any response from us, after kidnapping our soldier Gilad Shalit and holding him for over than 800 days now and massive rocket firing, what would u expect? us giving them flours? we are doing what every other country in the entire world would have done, IDF is defending its people from hamas
DeDo10 3 years ago
well you do know parts of hamas are owned and controlled by israel correct? it came out in the israeli newspapers that israel owns parts of hamas and founded them to be in oppostion of the PLO. so they kidnapped some soldiers because their people were under attack from these terrorist israeli soldiers. but they released him unharmed and untortured.unlike israel which picks up palestinians in the middle of the night(i witnessed it) and you never see them again.they get tortured! prisonplanet. com
cleanarab 3 years ago
and those slingshots that hamas shoots are only in response to israel laying siege on the palestine and gaza. with their checkpoints and inhuman blockade of gaza,not allowing any food or medicine in and cutting off all electricity and water for INNOCENT CIVILIANS. IAM SURE ISRAELIS DONT HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT HAVING NO FOOD OR DRINK OR MEDICINE.
cleanarab 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
-KILLING PALESTINIANS AT A RATIO OF 8 to 1 AND THEN CLAIMING YOU ARE THE VICTIM OF TERRORISM AND ANTISEMITISM IS SIMPLY LAUGHABLE BY ANY RATIONAL, LOGIC, RELIGION OR CREED. NO EXCUSE* IS CREDIBLE FOR THESE LEVELS OF TERRORISM. NOT EVEN THE JEWISH TORAH ALLOWS KILLING BEYOND AN EYE FOR AN EYE!
,~PLEASE MEMORIZE & POST THIS COMMENT ON OTHER ISRAEL RELATED VIDEOS.
jaggafeen 3 years ago
UN resolution violations??? Well you've got to be kidding me. Israel has violated more UN reolutions than all countries on earth (all put together)!Either way, Arabs know that the UN is a biased and untrustworthy institution, set up for the interests of a few nations.
Israel is a regional power, but only for the meantime. US support is sure to shift as oil resources deplete and israel becomes more costly to protect. The creation of Israel will never be imposed on Arabs, trust me, I am one.
jeishawi 3 years ago
If 5 arab armies didn't attack simultaneously after this, and violate original UN Resol, there would have been a Palestine in 1948, a very large Palestine, & indefensible borders for Israel
The UN Partition Plan for Palestine or UN General Assembly Resolution 181 was a plan approved by the General Assembly on Nov 29, 1947 to terminate the British Mandate of Palestine by Aug 1, 1948, and facilitate the creation of 2 states, one Jewish and one Arab.
thedevilsdisciple613 3 years ago
do you know how many u.n. resolutions israel breaks every day. israeli terrorist leaders themselves do not want peace. that is why they stage terrorist attacks on their own jewish people so then they can blame the muslims and kill thousands of them freely.
cleanarab 3 years ago
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KILLING PALESTINIANS AT A RATIO OF "8 to 1" YEAR AFTER YEAR AND THEN CLAIMING ISRAEL IS THE VICTIM OF TERRORISM AND ANTI SEMITISM IS SIMPLY LAUGHABLE BY ANY RATIONAL, LOGIC, RELIGION OR CREED!!!. NO EXCUSES ARE CREDIBLE FOR THESE LEVELS OF USA SPONSORED ISRAELI STATE TERRORISM!!!. NOT EVEN THE JEWISH RELIGION ALLOWS KILLING BEYOND MERCIFULL SELF DEFENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.
Source of ratio: BT Selem ISRAELI Human Rights Group
GreenSok 3 years ago
This is the first time I watch Michael Coren, and I can gladly say that this guy is the dumbest journalist I'v ever seen!!! His arguments are weak, his facts are wrong or incomplete, he's not funny and his completely biased. The Prisoner exchange Sid predicted happened, including the release of Samir Kuntar!
jeishawi 3 years ago 2
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Should Israel follow Syria's example?
Syria kills 5x more Arabs in 4x less time fighting terrorists...
Some argue that the event as one of the few occasions after the end of WW2 when an insurgency has been successfully dealt with by military force
Never again have Muslim extremists threatened the Syrian government.
Syria 25,000 arabs killed in 2 years (hama massacre) 1980-1981
Israel > 5,000 killed in 8 years 2000-2008 (bloodiest 8 yrs of Isr/P conflct, Pals called for intifada [blood])
thedevilsdisciple613 3 years ago
Dear all, who cares who's right and who's wrong... both sides have their arguments and the reality of Israel is here to stay (Im convinced) and these blokes will not be changing their approach any soon.
Take sides... get ready for the battle. The fronts are open for all.
or
Take sides... and campaign for peace by changing yourself first.
NidalZoghbi 3 years ago
Israel is a terrorist state
nagi04 3 years ago
user174, Checked out your page, you are one hateful fellow. If you put as much energy into a positive direction as you do toward hate, you might even discover that being a human has some upside. I'm not religious, and like you believe in evolution, but, I would wish you some sunshine on your sad racist existance.
konagnu 3 years ago
konagnu, I am looking at your response to user174, and see that althoug he is more open with his hate for other people, you aren't much different, it is just what you hate that seperates the two of you. He hates Jews for Israel, while you hate Islam for the terrorists, when really your arguements make as much sense as representing christianity with Pat Robertson.
Most Jews and Muslims are decent people who just want to live their lives, and the sooner the two of you realize that, the better.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
krypte, Either you are Muslim, or you know little about Islam & its view of kafirs & how they are to be treated. I have no problem with Muslim people, most just want to live their lives in peace. The problem as I (as well as many observers) see it is the radical clerics tend to be the driving force in Islam. The goal of Islam is that there remain no other religion on earth. It is the duty of Muslims to convert the Infidel by persuasion (no problem) or force (big problem). Look it up.
konagnu 3 years ago
krypte, BTW did you take a peek at user174's profile?
Regarding Jews, there are 13 million Jews on earth, 1,600,000,000 Muslims. Can earth not make a little space for a few Jews?
If Israel loses, half the population of Jews in the world may well be lost.
Why do so many hate so few?
BTW I'm neither Jewish or Christian.
konagnu 3 years ago
I am not part of any religion.
Just because the Jewish people exist, doesn't mean that the world needs to give them something. Why should Palestinians suffer just so a bunch of retarded Jewish people can feel safe even though they knowingly move near the highest consintration of people who hate them?
That isn't the issue though. Israel already exists, and so does Palestine, now Israel needs to leave Palestine the fuck alone and quit making colonies there.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Kripte, Do you not pay any attention to the news at all? Israel left Gaza & the West Bank THREE years ago destroying the homes of 6,000 Israeli settlers. Now what do you suggest Israel do when rockets are fire into civilian areas on a daily basis from Gaza, just watch there citizens get killed & injured? Why would you use the term "retarded"? Israel is the only democracy in the mid east. The Arab citizens in Israel have more rights than any Arabs living in Arab states. READ, start with the news!
konagnu 3 years ago
These rights you speak of all all fake. Just look at what Israel did for the Palestinian votes when Palestine voted for Hamas. "You have the right to vote so long as you vote the right way" it's all bullshit.
6000, OMG, that's soo much!!! SARCASM
There are four hundred thousand settlers still in the West Bank. The people of Gaza and the West Bank view themselves as the same, and Gaza won't stop fighting till the West Bank is truely freed, and by that I mean ALL MILITANT ISRAELES MUST GO.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
krypte, You are naive. Hamas has vowed the destruction of Israel. If your neighbor elected the guy that openly stated his intention to come into your home, kill you & your family, how would you react? Would you still allow that person into your house to work? Would you still give him free electricity, medical supplies, food, a job? If you say yes to this then you are suicidal. Thankfully, the Israelis are not. Hamas will never stop no matter what concessions the Israelis offer. They are Islamic.
konagnu 3 years ago
If hamas really was so criminal and unfit to be elected, Israel never should have allowed them to run in the first place.
Your arguement is crap. Israel is a psudo democracy that will turn the tables if ever something doesn't go their way.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Another example of American pro-Israeli propaganda! I agree with Israel's right to exist, but not to be a terrorist state with undeclared nuclear weapons and more UN condemnations than any other state!
Barrano1 3 years ago
poor michael coren, simply poor!
SYEUROPA 3 years ago 2
War Sucks, especialy when u have no work , no proper shelter , no money & no goverment support. Thats the sides of Alot of Palo's & other Arab Countries. How many homeless Jews are there is Israel? How many people in Israel die from other countries Weapons? If only Humans didnt know what Revenge was.
msabih 3 years ago
msabih, Please consider the following: There are 13.5 million Jews worldwide. 1.9 BILLION Muslims and 54 Islamic states. Israel has the right to self-defense. If the Arabs loose a war, they go home, if Israel looses, they all die. Ask yourself why Arab states have refused to allow Palos to become citizens of their states. Palos left Israel in '48 at the request of Arab Govt's who were planning to invade. Arabs lost, They want a hostile population posed against Israel.
konagnu 3 years ago
Why? 'Cos war is big business specially for the american military-industrial complex who, in order to sustain its growth, needs to feed the monsterous machinary throughout perpetual escalating conflicts. Therefor, peace is not their goal, instead of that they keep maintaining the shock between civilisations, deforming the media coverage in a way that it will always legitimate the use of force for their political agenda.
ZKaedes 3 years ago
Wow! After watching that, It's hard to deny the existence of a massive pro-sionist lobby that shapes the media coverage of the middle-east conflicts. It is done in such a deceiving way! The ideoligical core of all this propaganda is volontary burried under layers of twisted and false assertions, it tries to appear as rational and objective to most tube believer yet it is only cheesy pro-sionist and neo-con gospel to promote war and perpetual aggression!
ZKaedes 3 years ago 2
Kryptemonic, you wrote, "read views of some Israeli parties, like killing all arabs."
Until such parties gain control in Israel, there is no similarity between Israel and 'Palestine'.
Election is endorsement of methods and ideology. Palestinians have endorsed Hamas. This means they are not ready to sit at the adult table, let alone the negotiating table.
I've entertained your moral confusion and theocratic sympathy for long enough. Peace.
JJZeise 3 years ago
If you no longer care about human shields they wont be used anymore. :D
fortunatus 3 years ago
micheal coren is a loud mouth know it all, he as no redeeming quality ,he cant even debate , wen he is loosing an argument he bully's is way into it and interrupts at every opportunely , he must have been a great kid in school pushing every one around with is big mouth .
adlerbr12 3 years ago
Do you honestly believe that it was Michael Coren who interrupted at every opportunity? Did you happen to notice Mr. Ryan's behaviour?
PaulMcKeever 3 years ago
There is no point arguing sense with these anti-Semites. They are blind to everything but their hatred for Jews and Israel and are *impervious* to rational debate.
This clip was two years ago. Sid Ryan tried to make a big deal about the rules of war and how the Israeli soldiers were "captured" and not "kidnapped" I would like to hear what he thinks now, two years later, about the fact the Gilad Shalit has still not been returned, has not seen the Red Cross nor is there notice on his condition
pitcalco 2 years ago
it is a perverted collectivist notion that somehow an individual can be held accountable for a crime he did not commit or participate in simply because the government he happened to be born under made a bad moral judgement. that is ridiculous! only individuals can commit crimes and only individuals can justly be punished for them. unless every last one of those dead civilians are guilty of committing an act of aggression, their deaths were unnacceptable.
ProprietorOfSelf 3 years ago
I think you misunderstand. Nobody is blaming Lebanese civilians for Hezbollah's aggression, or for the Lebanese government's impotency. They are blaming the initiator of violence, Hezbollah, for collateral deaths and human shield casualties.
I make a distinction between the two because, while I understand why one might be confused about who is to blame for collateral damage, there is no excuse for placing blame on Israel for human shield casualties.
JJZeise 3 years ago
Exactly.
PaulMcKeever 3 years ago
Actually, Israel is at fault for human shield casualties, as they use human shields. One out of ten Israelis is at least a reservists, making one in ten a military target, yet they hide among the people of Israel.
Also, there are photos of Israelis holding Palestinian children infront of them as bullet shields or on their jeep to keep safe from attack. I'll send you a video.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Send me the video.
Look, people do shitty things in war. But I don't see how you are going to convince me to support a place where Islamic law is the rule. In Israel, I could openly live as an Atheist. In the neighboring countries and territories, life would be short for me.
JJZeise 3 years ago
I checked out the videos. Trees getting torn up to build a security fence is sad, but it is not an example of collective punishment. Israel decided that was the best place to stop security risks. Neither of us are in a position to conclude it wasn't.
Regarding human shields, there are more convincing videos of Hezbollah and Hamas. Just wait for the end of your video and there are plenty. There is even one of a Palestinian giving a press conference saying it is official policy to use them.
JJZeise 3 years ago
I looked up the place on google earth, I found the valley easily as the white stuff on the ground made it stand out. It is just SW of Bethlahem, and East by NE of Efrata. There was pleanty of land they could have bult a fense on other than that, but the video said they were building sewers, and the Pales were fine if it was on there land but not in their trees. It is perfectly clear, that if it wasn't on purpose to hurt the Pales there, the Israelis really didn't give a shit about them.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Dude, I've said it before, Google earth isn't a good resource for this!!! It doesn't give you enough information to be "perfectly clear" on anything.
JJZeise 3 years ago
But it does allow one to double check on things... to see who was right on the geography, and also anything visible from space can be checked for actual damage assesment from a bird's eye view. Israel says they don't target civilians, well google earth pictures of Beirut, and not just the ones where you have to click on the blue circles, beg to differ.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Google earth does not beg to differ - an aerial photo of a damaged building will NOT show the complete context of its destruction.
There are videos on this very web site that show Hezbollah rockets being fired from balconies on the 4th/5th story of Lebanese buildings. Only a monumental evasion of this fact could lead you to believe that Israel was targeting Lebanese civilians.
Hezbollah innitiated the war. Hezbollah took positions close to civilians and UN personnel. HEZBOLLAH is to blame.
JJZeise 3 years ago
OK, so where should Hezbollah fight then??? Any state that arms Hezbollah is automatically declared terrorist supportive. Urban warfare is the only way Hezbollah, whether it be good or bad, can stand a fighting chance agaisnt Israel. Israel arms itself too the teeth and then plays victim when it's enemies fight the only way they possibly can. Israel has Apaches, they easily could have hit those buildings with smaller rockets. 180 thousand homes were destroyed. ISRAELIS ARE THE BAD GUYS.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Hezbollah shouldn't fight. They should lay down arms. Islam is no excuse for starting a war. You cut Hezbollah all the slack in the world; it makes me think you would enjoy living as a dhimmi.
If Hezbollah chooses to fight, the Israeli military is obligated to kill them - no matter where they are. Israel also has a moral obligation not to risk its soldiers lives in helicopters when they have other means of destroying their attackers.
JJZeise 3 years ago
I realise that a lot of what Hezbollah does, they claim they do because of religion, that is because for them, religion is where they get their morals, but what are the morals they are trying to defend? They are fighting to free Palestine from it's opressors. It would be one thing if they were fighting to defend Palestine and killing thousands of Israeli civilians, but Israel is the conqueror and the murderer. I don't see, if you look at the whole picture that Hezbollah is the lesser of 2 evils.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
When Hezbollah says stuff like that, you should take it seriously.
Anyway, I have to say this again: Hezbollah is an Iranian Pawn -for control of Lebanon, not helping Palestinians. Don't be confused.
You can't blame every conflict in the world on Israel, a country the size of Vancouver Island. You want to take sides with the Palestinians? Misguided, but fine. Just don't project their conflict on the rest of the MidEast. Arabs and non-Arab Muslims don't care about Palestinians. They never have.
JJZeise 3 years ago
I do not blame every confilt on Israel, but I do believe that Israel's existance and the West's aid of them has created a lot of conflict. I'll admit, there are a LOT of crazies in the middle east. It is because of that, that the middle east is fragile. I think that the Jewish people have been through a lot, but moving to Israel was not the answer, and their justification of the holocaust for their own actions makes things worse. I don't want Israel destroyed, but I want them out of Palestine.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
How am I supposed to take that statement? In recent history there has never been an international consensus as to where "Palestine" begins and ends. One definition of Palestine includes all of Israel. By that definition, Israel must be destroyed.
In the past you've shown approval for pre-1967 borders. I disagree; much of that territory is required for Israel's self-defense. It's land they won in response to aggressive actions taken by Egypt and its allies (like closing the Straits of Tiran).
JJZeise 3 years ago
So Palestinians should suffer Israeli occupation just so Israel could feel a little bit safer??? Besides, Palestine actually wouldn't be a very good buffer at all, as I am sure with modern knoledge of warefare, any invading army would first arm Hamas, so when they can attack Israel to liberate Palestine, Hamas could sabotage Israeli supply lines and cut off reinforcements and even retreat. Israel would be a lot safer without Palestine. They might just increase international popularity too.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Religious dictators like this become less of a threat when ignored? Hamas Charter, article 11:
"[we believe] that the land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf consecrated for future Moslem generations until Judgement Day."
"This is the law governing the land of Palestine in the Islamic Sharia (law) and the same goes for any land the Moslems have conquered by force, because during the times of (Islamic) conquests, the Moslems consecrated these lands to Moslem generations till the Day of Judgement."
JJZeise 3 years ago
All Hamas is, is a more agressive response of the mob, to Fatah's failure to free Palestine. Hamas only has ten thousand jihadists, compared to over 2 million Palestinians who voted for them. Most of the Pales who voted Hamas don't feel that kind of extremism is needed, they just feel Hamas is the only group in Palestine with the balls to take on the Israeli thugs that plague their lives every day. Shit, you think Hamas is extreme, read views of some Israeli parties, like killing all arabs.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Krypte, The ignorance of the history of this conflict & the lack of understanding of the Islamic perspective that you display would be laughable if it were not so tragic. So many see one or two documentaries or reports skewed so far by Islamic propaganda that they suddenly find themselves experts much as the dolt named Sid in this youtube video. Take the time to educate yourself on the subject somewhere other than on Youtube or anti-Israel sights & you may not end up looking such a fool.
konagnu 3 years ago
First off, I have NEVER been to an anti-Israeli sight.
I have developed my view and understanding by seeing others who have views in this conflict. Israels is the occupying force, and Israel's approach to national security always involves the suffering of it's neighbors' civilians. Also Israel continues to send colonies into occupied territories making it seem more like conquest than national defense. Because of this, I must side with Palestine, and ANY forces fighting for her liberation.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Krypte, Israel is NOT an occupying force. It is a nation formed in 1948 by the UN. They were attacked soon after by 6 Arab nations. The Arabs living in Israel left their homes at the request of the invading Arab nations with the promise of more land when the Jews were thrown out. They lost the war. The Arabs who chose to stay in Israel are citizens with the right to vote, to serve in office & worship as they please. Can Jews do that in Islamic states? Many "settlements" have been destroyed.
konagnu 3 years ago
bull crap "Israel is NOT an occupying force"
What the fuck do you call all the checkpoints and IDF in East Jerusalem and the West Bank. Israel is too an occupying force. They occupy the nation of Palestine, which consists of Gaza, the West Bank, and the Muslim and Christian quarters of Jerusalem.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Krypte, You spew without factual knowledge. When was the last time you were in Israel? When is the last time you read a book on the issue. Your understanding is clearly influenced by one side of the story. If you really care about the issue, study the history, visit the area and shape you opinions on facts. Both sides have their stories. I call the check points "self defense". Are you unaware of the suicide bombers, the threats to Israel's existence, daily rocket attacks, constant attacks?
konagnu 3 years ago
I know Israel feels the need to leave their troops in Palestine for their own defense, but that is what an occupying force is. Israel occupies Palestine in part for their own defense, but also I have a feeling it is for their own conquest as they continue to move their own people into Palestine by form of colonization.
There is a debate as to whether Israel or Palestine is at fault for the conflict, but the idea that Israel is not an occupying force is quite foolish.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
krypte, You discuss "Palestine" as if it were a nation. It is not. "Palestine" is a region that includes Israel, the Gaza strip, & the West Bank. (and more) Gaza & the West Bank are autonomous areas controlled and governed by "Palestinians". Israel "occupies" Israel. Israel is subjected to daily rocket attack from Gaza. Israelis are frequently injured & killed. There is no outrage in the press against the perpetrators of this terror, but the press screams when Israel defends herself.
konagnu 3 years ago
Palestine has embassies, police, political parties, its own declared people numbering over two million, it even has a fucking flag.
Palestine is as much a nation as Israel is. What gives Israel the right to be a nation, but not Palestine. Shit, at least most Palestinians have actually lived there more than a century, most Israelis are foreigners. I'd say Palestine has more a right to exist than Israel, but Israel isn't going to go away, and neither is Palestine and you need to accept that.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
krypte, Are you attempting to legitimize the Palestinians claim to the land based on how long they have lived there? If that is the case, why would the Jews not have primacy as they have been there for over 3000 years? My boy scout troop has a fucking flag. My town has police, my county (Hawaii) has a mayor's adjunct office in Honolulu (Oahu). Houston has 2 million people. . . so what! are all those Nations?
What gives Israel the right to be a nation? Try out UN resolution 181, 11/29/1947
konagnu 3 years ago
Actually, if Hawaii... or Texas wanted to declare independence, I would support them in that. I think the declaration of independences is the most important document in the USA, and I believe every word of it.
Just because you are Jewish doesn't mean you have claim to Israel. Most Jews living in Israel are immigrents, while almost all Palestinians can actually say they have had ancestors living in Palestine since the Muslim expansion out of Arabia.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
krypte, Within days after the US (& 30+other nations)recognized Israel, six arab nations invaded. The Arabs living in Israel were encouraged by the Arab Gov'ts to leave for their safety assuring them they could return once the Jews were driven out. The Arabs lost. Do they not have some responsibility to absorb their Arab brothers into their cultures? Left out of these discussions is the fact that 10s of 1,000s of Jews were forced out of Arab nations at the same time. Should they be allowed back?
konagnu 3 years ago
My morality says yes, but my practicality says no.
I don't even know why the arab invasions decades ago are even an issue though today. Palestinians are their own declared people, STILL LIVING IN THEIR HOMES, and they should be allowed their own sovereign nation. Morally, Israeli settlers are just colonies, and practically, 5 million Jews moved to Israel in 50 years, they can move a half a million settlers out of Palestine in less than 5 years.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
krypte, You state "I don't even know why the arab invasions decades ago are even an issue though today." It is important as history has brought all of us to where we are today. It's why History is so important. You may not know that already Israel has returned lots of land that was "settled" by Israelis. The homes of those settlers were destoryed and the land given to the Palestinans in hope for peace. The real issue is not land, it is Islam. Learn about Islam & much of this will be clarified.
konagnu 3 years ago
It's not Islam. If Islam was a problem, Jews should have known better than to move from one people who hated them in Europe to another in the middle east and should get the fuck out of the human gene pool. The only religion at fault is the psuedo Jewish zionism which is hardly different from manifest destiny that brought Israelis there in the first place.
It won't be until ALL settlements are gone that there will be true peace. If you steal some land, you have to give it ALL back, not some.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
The death of innocent civilians is wrong. That's not the issue. The issue is: who is to blame?
When a terrorist turns others into human shields, he is responsible should they be killed by those who are attempting to annihilate the terrorist.
PaulMcKeever 3 years ago
this whole idea that somehow the CIVILIANS of a country can be held responsible for the actions of that country's politicians is just completely perverted. I can not be held accountable for the war in iraq simply because i live within the realm of george bush. if iraq were to issue a counter aggression to george bush's and the u.s. military's aggression, and i were to somehow die in the crossfire, that would NOT be morally acceptable in the least bit.
ProprietorOfSelf 3 years ago
"this whole idea that somehow the CIVILIANS of a country can be held responsible for the actions of that country's politicians is just completely perverted."
In general: who empowers a country's politicians? Who pays for a soldier's bullets and bombs?
If you pay neighbour A to protect you, and he beats up neighbour B for that purpose, have you no responsibility for A's actions?
PaulMcKeever 3 years ago
I agree with you, but I'd like to answer the question.
You are only at fault for neighbor A, if you do nothing in response to his actions. As Israelis do nothing, they are at fault. Also, as Israel is a democracy... at least for Israelis, they even continue to vote for these barbarians to lead them in their culteral genocide, I'd say the Israeli people are in a great deal of fault.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
oh my god i cant believe these people ! are they serious or they r kidding me ! discussing if israel in self defense or not ! israel who occupied a whole county, displace a whole nation and killed 300.000 since then 189,000 under 5 years been killed, all this in self defense ! what the hell ! look at them how serious they r ! oh my god
morafat 3 years ago
I just looked at the Beirut airport on Google Earth, you can see the bomb damage and it is only on the runways, however it is very clear that it is only a civilian airport. There aren't many hangers, sure not enough to store enough fighters to do anything, probably regular maintnance hangers. There aren't many buildings, it's mostly parking lot and run way, it is very clear that the Beirut airport is almost completely a civilian airport save for maybe Lebanon customs officails.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
You simply can't look at a satellite image of an airport and conclude that is or isn't a legitimate military target. All the googling in the world won't tell you how much material Hezbollah was moving through Beirut... If think you have abilities the rest of us don't have you should try getting a job for the military or state department. Don't be surprised if they laugh at you.
JJZeise 3 years ago
Look at it yourself. Unless hezbollah has secret fighter planes that even the government didn't even know about that came out of secret tunnels under the regular hangers in the airport, it really wasn't a military target. Besides, airports are some of the most regulated places in a country, Israel went to war with Hazbollah, not Lebanon, ever think if Lebanon's border with Syria as the place where they go their weapons? Why the hell would they need to fly them in? Israel was definately wrong.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
You seem be falling trap to the idea that Lebanon is capable of enforcing its sovereignty. The Lebanese power structure quakes at the feet of Syrian and Iranian agents. Again, Hezbollah doesn't use fighter jets... It uses Katyusha rockets, often taking firing positions on top of hospitals and dense residential areas. These tactics and the people who employ them are responsible for Lebanese civilian casualties, not Israel.
JJZeise 3 years ago
Israel is the one who actually pulled the trigger that killed the civilians. It was a dumb fucking war and Israel shouldn't have entered. They went to save 2 soldiers that were captured, and in the end, they killed a bunch of civilians, never got those soldiers back and even lost more, AND because of it's recklesness, Hezbollah is more powerful than ever before. When you destroy someones home, they will want revenge. Israel not only badly handled that war they never of started, they lost.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
A proper moral evaluation of civilian casualties places blame on the person who initiated the conflict. Just as Japan was ultimately responsible for the firebombing of Tokyo and the nuclear blasts at Hiroshima and Nagasaki, Hezbollah was responsible for the civilian casualties during the 2006 conflict.
At least you are right about Israel losing. Every time they threaten victory the international community pressures them to stop. That ensures Hezbollah will rearm and violence continues.
JJZeise 3 years ago
The people who initiated the conflict was not Hezbollah, the conflict was initiated when Israel started setting up settlements in Palestine and restricting and opressing palestinians in order to defend the settlements. It may be the Jewish homland, but it has been the homeland of the people of palestine since the muslim expansion from arabia one and a half thousand years ago. Israel is the occupying power, Hezbollah is trying to end the occupation and oppression of the people of palestine.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
you are absolutely correct. i am completely repulsed by the fact that an objectivist would defend a rogue state which has absolutely no respect whatsoever for the rights of its subjects. israel bulldozes thousands upon thousands of homes annually, destroys settlements that were established many years before israel, and in doing so displaces literally millions of people. israel has demonstrated consistently its total disregard for the property rights of nonjewish residents. youre right.
ProprietorOfSelf 3 years ago
Is it your position that Israel deserves no credit for this because they have forced taxation and conscription? The rights of Gentiles inside Israel proper are protected in the same way as Jews. Maybe you refer to occupied territories, where gangland warfare is the rule?
There, no organization exists to protect the rights of Palestinians, and Israel certainly has no obligation to do so. These people are so primitive they think honor killing and the stoning of a rape victims is acceptable.
JJZeise 3 years ago
I have nothing against taxation or conscription, however the large military reserve in Israel does make 1/10 Israelis a military target.
As a nation claiming to be a western democracy, it has an obligation to everyone that it occupies. These people do not wish to be occupied, and because of the occupation, they cannot fend for themselves. Israel fucked up their lives through conquest, murder, and occupation, they damn well have a duty to fix it.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
I'd like to add, if they can't fix it, they better just leave, and that goes the same for the US in Iraq, Turkey in Kurdistan, and Russia in Chechnya.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Conscription is a moral abomination ("war-slavery" comes to mind).
I don't believe Israel or the US have any obligation to protect non-citizens. However, the must refrain from violating the rights of non-citizens (again, retaliatory collateral damage is not a violation of rights). If they establish governments like the US has in Iraq and Afghanistan, they have an obligation to establish a rights-respecting one. In this sense, I think the US has failed.
JJZeise 3 years ago
Israelis don't care enough about their country to volunteer for the military, if it weren't for Israel's universal draft, they'd have lost by now.
Israel has not established a real representative government in Palestine, and because Palestine is not an independant nation, they do not have a bill of rights, so aside from the UN, which Israel doesn't give a damn about, Palestinians don't have any legal rights? Why can't Israel just treat them like human beings because its the right thing to do
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Don't be sure Israel's enemies are all willing combatants either. It's common for suicide bombers to be coerced.
All humans have rights. Governments are legitimate only to the extent that they protect those rights. It's the Israeli govmnt's job to defend Israelis. They remain responsible for this even when their enemies are near innocents.
Israel doesn't collectively punish - innocent deaths tend to be collateral damage. Conversely, Israel's enemies consistently target discos, weddings, etc.
JJZeise 3 years ago
Dude, I have a video of IDF pulling trees out of a hundred year old fruit farm owned by Palestinians, with no aim to turn the land into a settlement or a military base, what other purpose could pulling short fruit trees out of the ground than collective punnishment? Also, I have videos of IDF breaking Pale bones with slabs of stone on a hillside. There is also the friggen siege of Gaza.
If neither side wants to fight, why doesn't Israel leave Palestine so they can stop fighting eachother?
kryptemonic 3 years ago
Remember, the nation of Palestine simply doesn't exist. This leads to competing claims as to what territory Palestinians should control.
Israel more or less annexed some of what it considered Palestine for reasons of strategic defense and religious ridiculousness.
Many Palestinians believe the whole area is Palestine, and want the Israelis retreat from the middle east entirely. That's why Israel simply can't leave; the Palestinians will constantly press the attack until Israel is gone.
JJZeise 3 years ago
Palestine does too exist, it even has an embassy in the US. Why does Israel, a nation of people who took nearly all their land by force from its rightful owners just in the last century have a right to exist, but the nation of the people who have lived there since the arab expansion of Islam nearly one and a half thousand years ago not exist? Israel should abandon all of their territory they didn't have before 1967, and any zionist, nazi, aryanist who doesn't leave should be simply fucked.
kryptemonic 3 years ago
At the time of the creation of Israel, the Arabs made the point that they should not have to pay the price (provide territory for a Jewish state) when it was Germany that committed the atrocities and caused the Jewish diaspora. Why not, in their view, carve out territory in Germany and thereby punish those responsible for the internal dispossession of the Jews there. Coren of course adopts only Western propaganda, and hasn't the slightest grasp of this, labeling Israel a victim.
indoctus41 4 years ago
Is there little wonder there is no peace in Israel/Palestine when grown people like those in this video cant agree - OR even have the decency to hear the other persons point of view AND attempt to understand it. If your too close to the fire - get out and let someone who is objective debate it.
shikira 4 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Is it right to kill a murderer in self-defence? NO. He hasn't murdered you yet, so he's not a murderer. You can use reasonable force in an attack, which might involve killing.
Is Hezbollah a murderer by using human shields?: NO. That's a gross justification for collateral damage, and killing innocents on purpose is against Int. Law.
Is it wrong to trade prisoners: NO. Note that Hezbollah are "terrorists", Israelis are "soldiers".
indoctus41 4 years ago
By your logic, you have to wait until you are murdered before you "involve killing".
PaulMcKeever 4 years ago
Hi Paul: Thanks for responding. The original question is odd because it is assuming the fellow is a murderer BEFORE he has actually killed anyone. And if he had killed someone else before he attacked you, and this was proven in court, he would be in jail. So I really take issue with the original premise. A better question would be, "Is it murder to kill in self defence?" Even the law protects people in this situation, as long as it was really self-defence, and not pre-emptive or for revenge.
indoctus41 4 years ago
Paul McKeever is a man of depressingly low intellectual ability, and very little knowledge of the topic.
indoctus41 4 years ago
Israel was carved out of territory in the Middle East in 1948 by several hidden promises: to the Rothchild family who financially supported British ventures for a Jewish homeland, to Arabs in support of attacks against Turkish domination, to the French with the idea of dividing up the ME between them. These promises were conflicting, and has left an enormous mess in that region.
indoctus41 4 years ago
Sid is a complete asshole. Good on Michael for putting him in his place. I love at the end how he acts like his feelings are so hurt that Michael's interrupting him, when he just proposed that Islamic terrorists should be able to hide behind civilian shields and not be attacked, because cilivians might be killed in the process.
UzbekUkeleleist 4 years ago 4
shame on America!!!
watch?v=WKLVJIo6w9M
NabiIChitown1 4 years ago
If a highly armed terrorist hides in a civilian home, and you let him escape, you are responsible for the hundreds of civilians he WILL kill in the future. AND you will be sending a message that using civilian shields works, thus endangering the lives of hundreds more. Dropping a bomb on that home instead is the moral choice to save the most lives.
truthadvocate 4 years ago 2
truthadvocate: This of course is a pre-emptive strike you are suggesting, and is the same argument used by oppressive regimes in immemoriam to kill anyone by reason that they might kill others (Soviet Union), or commit treason (Cuba), or sedition (Communist China), or subvert authority (Nazi Germany), or just be in the way (Franco's Spain). By the way, your proposal is also against International Law, but I doubt you care about that.
indoctus41 4 years ago
Why did Ryan and Coran monopolize the discussion?
qtronman 4 years ago
What was the argument of Ryan? That a civilian life is more valuable than military? What an annoying loudmouth!
MisfitDoctor 4 years ago
israel has no fault for the 1 million refugees it's created or the 1,500 innocent civilians killed. all over 2 kidnapped soldiers that happened to be in lebanese soil. it's the "terrorists" fault. attacking israeli troops makes you a terrorist.
rOaCh2000 4 years ago
totally correct. israel holds no responsibility for the murder it committed. hezbollah shouldn't have kidnapped those 2 soldier(wich is in retaliation for the THOUSANDS of lebanese CIVILIANS that have been kidnapped). Israel holds no fault for destroying beirut in the 90's and killing some 60,000 people.
rOaCh2000 4 years ago
great debate. im jewish and i must say its funny to see this blatant pro israel bias from michael coren. he's a cohen after all : )
danndan6 4 years ago
a) ...killing a murderer in self-defence. Well, the fellow is not a murderer if he hasn't killed you yet.
b) Hezbollah would have enabled the murderer, the Israelis. Both would be murderers. Defensive military strike? What the hell is that?
c) Israeli "soldiers" for imprisoned "terrorists"? No, we're not biased here.
indoctus41 4 years ago