Roots in Sewer Line

[wnsautter]

This worked great for me. Almost 2 years, very dry summers and still no sewer problems. I used rock salt in the spring and fall. As for the tree itself, it never looked better!

PS Get a camera in the line first so you can see the path of the pipe. Then rent a power auger (about $20 for 4 hours). With roots involved a hand auger is a bad idea.

[genesisPlumbing]

I would just replace the pipe. The roots are not only going to be in one spot. They will be on all the joints. Its gonna cost you some money,but problem will be solve!!

[mrmetal99]

wow thanks the pipe here gets roots in it all the time clogging it and then floods my basment with water.Roto-Rooter isnt cheap to use there snake with blades try 500 bucks.this is a great tip thanks

[fflumpy]

Thanks for the vid...how often should i put the sulfate in?

[Modivo]

Call 811 "Before You Dig!" They will contact all services (Cable, Electric Co., etc) to come to your home and mark the areas where cables and wires are buried on your property.

[aegdenham]

This video has me inspired to deal with my extremely deep and persistent roots annually clogging up my sewer. I know exactly where the sewer line is and the precise depth. I've also sourced the copper sulfate. Problem is that I can't find a hand auger with extensions for love nor money! Six hours of research on this and I simply must be missing something. Any leads on sources for renting? Buying?

[AsktheBuilder]

@aegdenham Google it. Last resort: extended post hole digger or 12-inch auger on a bobcat.

[GRATZIANI2002]

too much work1..better cut the trees..

[AsktheBuilder]

@GRATZIANI2002 Are you kidding me? It's easy to install the pipe. Trees add all sorts of value to a property.

[GRATZIANI2002]

@AsktheBuilder of coarse I i'm kidding!, but to inject cooper sulfate in soil, any deep any quantity , any step , looks to me a little tricky !...by the way, sure , the soil in more permeable in trench area , where is this poison to go?..and what's making after, let's say 3 years?..

[WinterHaven]

@AsktheBuilder If you live in Florida like I do, I cut down every tree that I had. I hate them!

[AsktheBuilder]

@WinterHaven From henceforth, Thee shall be known as WinterHaven Tree HATER.

[WinterHaven]

@AsktheBuilder Actually you are right on that. I know law makers and I got a few interested in a "Tree Accountability Act" bill proposal for 2012. In other words, if someone's else's tree does damage to your property, they pay. They also must pay for trimming trees that go into power lines instead of the city paying it. That is, if a person owns a tree, that individual is 100% accountable for the damage it does outside of one's property.

[NOLIMIT69NOLIMIT2000]

Yea that seems like a waste of money in the long run. I have 172 ft of pipe from my house to the city pipe and I rented a trench digger and paid $174 for 3 days. I then put in PVC which roots can't invade unless the pipe breaks. Since then no more Roto Rooter. I love doing stuff right the first time.

[smtc5b]

You are giving very bad advice, very unafe advice as well. Tree rots should not be able to enter a healthy sewer line. Keep your tree watered, a thirsty tree will look for water in the sewer. If you have a tree root problem in your sewer chances are you will have sewer line problems. Might consider replacing it.

[AsktheBuilder]

@smtc5b I hate to say this, but you don't seem to get it. Roots do enter cracked and old sewer lines. Typically the problem is with old clay pipes. My method fixes the issue very inexpensively so you don't have to replace or reline the sewer. If the pipe is collapsed, that's a different issue. Then replacement is warranted.

[dondebo13]

I have roots in my septic tank drain field causing back up. Can I pour these crystals right into my septic tank to desolve the root problem. Let me know because they are telling me I need a whole new system..... Thanks!

[AsktheBuilder]

@dondebo13 No, that will not work. You need to poison the soil around the pipes in the leach field. I would absolutely engineer a second set of pipes on top of the leach field pipes that will allow you to distribute the copper sulfate solution into the soil above and around the leach field pipes. Sounds like you have a serious tree issue near you.

[CodeV75]

What about putting the copper sulfate into the distribution box and letting the solution run down the line? That should target the roots that were getting into the leach line... or would that mess up the bacteria that the leach line needs to do the job they are supposed to do?

[AsktheBuilder]

No no no no no......... Go back an watch the video again. You want to get the roots *before* they get into the pipes.

[feariekelly]

will the copper sulfate crystal work after they get into the pipes?

[tscholent]

as a professional gardener some of my customers have approached me for this problem.After seeing your clip I googled all issues at stake some more...and I urge you to do the same...learning never hearts.

[AsktheBuilder]

Mr. Pro Gardener,

How hard is it to say here what it is you discovered? Go ahead, take a chance..... But make sure the sources you quote have solid science behind them. What I can tell you, as I'm a master plumber and geologist, is that this methodology stops root growth in the soil just above and around the sewer pipe. If you tell us that the copper sulfate poisons people and whatever, be sure you have rock-solid evidence, not conjecture.

[tscholent]

as a professional gardener I have been approached many times about this problem and have always refered customers to plumbers.However after seeing your clip I have googled the issues at stake some more and I urge you to do the same...learning never hurts.

[AsktheBuilder]

Thanks for the advice. How about sharing what you discovered.

[brianbaldwin03]

What is the best way to locate a 4" Clay sewer main without getting a plumber out? How will I know the depth?? The utility companies are useless. I know where it comes out of the house, we dug it up today and added a GCO. Should I just prod around for it and mark it? I am having major root infiltration at each joint.

Signed,

New Homeowner

[AsktheBuilder]

Maybe a divining rod. But if that doesn't work, you need a sewer outfit that has the electronic equipment that will tell you where it is and how deep it is. It's worth it to get this data so you can install the pipes I show in this video at the right place and the right height.

[uprrconductor1]

Hey Tim. many people think they know better than you (sometimes they do), but none of them put up their own videos of how to do it their right way. i use your videos on alot of home repairs and i thank you for your knowlege and all the free advice and how to videos you put on youtube.

[AsktheBuilder]

Indeed. I try to show methods that have worked well for me for many years. In the home-improvement world, there are often many correct ways to solve a problem.

[kleintoolking]

well if a homeowner can't replace their shit pipe then they got no business owning a home.i mean that's alot of people's approach to everything "oh how can i keep from replacing it"

[AsktheBuilder]

Did you really type that? Were you lucid? Are you telling me that you can do every upgrade or repair to your home at the drop of a hat? That you have a fully funded sinking fund that has $35,000 - 50,000 in it just waiting to spend it on anything you want to do? If so, you are in a very tiny minority. Many people, for all sorts of reasons, have very tiny savings accounts. If you have a large one, take your video camera and show us on your channel the recent balance. Just tape over your acct #.

[krazypaws]

If you have gone to all the trouble to locate the pipe why not dig it up and replace it...it seems you have a lot of time on your hands anyway.Although your method has some (limited) merit ,it seems to me that its just a bandaid fix at best and you represent it as an actual repair. I am not saying its a bad idea to kill everything around your pipe. Of course you had the line professionally located and you didn't just probe around and hit a rock. Its still better to fix the pipe.

[AsktheBuilder]

Because that operation could be very expensive and disruptive. What's more the pipe may be in great shape and a tiny crack in a mortar joint in a clay system may have let the root in. I would say replace the pipe if it's indeed broken. Keep in mind many people may not have the money to do that expensive repair and need a band aid until they can afford it.

[royalfuzziness]

Copper sulfate is good stuff, but i just pour it down the toilet flush it and let it sit over night in the line.

[AsktheBuilder]

Not good enough. You need to poison the soil around the pipe. Putting it in the pipe does nothing to stop the growth of the roots.

[plumbcrazy33]

Three reasons why you shouldn't do this:

1. A heavy rain can force the pipe out of the ground... just enough for you to hit it with the lawn mower.

2. Copper sulfate used in this method can and WILL kill grass roots, possibly leaving your yard brown and patchy.

3. If it aint broke, don't fix it!!!

No, I didn't go to your website. No, I'm not a builder. Yes, I am a Master plumber / Master Drain layer.

I enjoy most of your videos. This one however, is a bad idea.

[AsktheBuilder]

Thanks for the comment. I have installed no less than ten of these. Never has rain of any type lifted the pipe out of the ground much less frost. Never has any grass been killed. The copper sulfate is being delivered about 6 - 10 feet down. Uh, the pipe is broken, that's why the roots are getting in. You may want to delete your comment as people who identify who you are may not hire you.....

[4BORE]

Copper sulfate is very dangerous for the environment. Goes down the sewer and eventually lands in the ocean into our food and water thanks. KIlls roots and affects peoples health. Real cool thanks

[AsktheBuilder]

(Head shaking...) Let's see, using your analogy, we should stop using drain cleaner, throw away paint brushes and rollers instead of cleaning them, and ban all pesticides and herbicides. Can you show me the white paper where copper sulfate placed deep in the subsoil - away from the A soil profile - migrates to the ocean and poisons fish? Speaking of fish, responding to your comment is like shooting them in a barrel.

[drummerdude6485]

Wow, that is cool! Did you think of this method on your own?

[AsktheBuilder]

Yes. Thanks! It works really well if you get the end of the vertical pipe about 2 feet directly over the top of the sewer line.

[drummerdude6485]

Yeah, that is really cool! I will have to try it the next time I am digging a foundation this summer.

[bambamluck]

i have never heard of your method is this something you thought of on your own?

have you ever considered root x?that is of course afte the line is cleaned mechanically.

[AsktheBuilder]

I congratulate you on your continuing education. People discover new things each day. Yes, I developed this method myself. RootX doesn't solve the problem at all. It doesn't stop the roots from entering the pipe. My method stops the roots from entering the pipe by creating a natural biocide zone around the pipe that roots can't tolerate.

[AsktheBuilder]

Did you not pay attention to the video? Did you go read the columns about this method at my website? This method kills the roots *before* they enter the pipe. Your proposed method doesn't. You want to create a barrier around the pipe where the roots can't enter. Watch my Roof Moss video as well for further proof. The crystals in the container in this video are copper sulfate.

[itsmeray01]

Where Can We find a hand operate auger 2 1/2 inch like the one you have ?

Thanks

[AsktheBuilder]

I wrote several columns about this at my website. Go there and find them. In and around the columns you will see companies that sell them. Use "tree roots" as your keywords in my search engine to find the columns.

[itsmeray01]

Great TIP !

Ok now you tell us to drill and insert the pipe 2 feet above the sewer line should we install several pipes above the sewer line in the area of root problem?

Question:: How much spacing should there be between pipes in order to get complete coverage .

Thanks !

[AsktheBuilder]

Yes, I would install several pipes. Space them 6-feet apart from one another directly over the sewer line.

[hootinouts]

Unfortunately copper sulfate is highly toxic to aquatic animals if it finds it's way into their habitat.

[AsktheBuilder]

Have you got any independent-source white papers that confirm this and to what degree? I'm not doubting you, it just would be nice to see the hard scientific data that backs up your statement.

[AsktheBuilder]

The movement of the solution depends on the soil makeup. Impossible for me to comment.

[topdjcom]

weird that's all my neighbors use is foam killer they have 2 trees near the lateral, he says he uses it one a year and the problem has stopped. I was going see if I can bore sideways and down. Will the copper sulfate follow the pipe out under road? how far will the copper sulfate leach into the soil? keep in mind this was all dug up 18 months ago so it's not fully compacted. thanks for your advice.

[topdjcom]

well I put a water softener in the house Im hoping the salt brine discharge will help. otherwise I have to try drilling sideways to install a pipe like your video. And hit it with foaming root killer too. What is he best time of the year to add root killer, Im in the northeast.

[AsktheBuilder]

The brine and foamer are useless. You must poison the soil outside the pipes so the roots can't get in.

[topdjcom]

I have a PVC pipe that ends 6 feet from the road and is tile from there to the main in the road, I have roots out toward the road. I think they follow the pipe to joint. How can I get them, drill sideways?

[AsktheBuilder]

How about following the advice in this video?????? Insert several of the pipes I show above the sewer line and poison the soil so the roots will not grow near the sewer pipe.

[topdjcom]

yes but the the issue is under the road, I paid 1300 to have them dig up and replaced a bad coupler between the tile and newer PVC over a year ago, and this summer it plugged up , I had them camera the pipe and the roots are what they claim is the issue now of course its 10 feet under the road, will the copper seep out around the pipe? and soil, I have a clean out 6 feet from road edge. Nice how they they blamed the coupler took my money then comeback to tell me its roots a year later.

[AsktheBuilder]

Sounds like you have a mess.

[FerretDude15]

when my mom had to fix it , she opened up the line and it exploded right in her face! XD

[nigeusa]

my wife has just placed a weeping pussy willow about 2 feet away from our main water line coming in to the house, she desparately wants to keep it there, it has only planted recently, should it be moved?

[AsktheBuilder]

You should be fine.

[Shawn32685]

No, the tree will not harm your water line. A water line has much tighter pressurized connections as apposed to gravity piping systems utilizing push together joints much different than a copper soldered pipe or a piece of high density polyethylene both the most common water line materials.

[shb1230]

Dear Builder,

You did a decent job showing how to clean a drain, but there are better ways out there that aren't as toxic to the environment. Copper Sulfate is very toxic to the ground, you yourself mentioned that the ground would be poisoned. Not smart buddy. Second, the product RootX kills the root on the inside of the pipe, it foams and gets everything in there AND it is environmentally safe. IE doesn't kill fish or soil. It takes years to reverse those effects. Let's be better than that.

[AsktheBuilder]

shb1230, Thanks for your comment. I suggest you look in the literature. Copper sulfate is approved for the use I show and will not cause any issues when used in this manner. It is a naturally occurring mineral - chalcanthite s CuSO4. It is best to stop the roots outside the pipe, not hope that the foam *might* get all of the roots.

[hmr2505]

You are right that there is no perfect way to keep roots out of pipes, there are better ways to do it than copper sulfate. Imagine killing all ground around pipes just to keep roots out. It is ridiculous. The fact that you mentioned you would poison the ground is a terrible thing to do. Copper sulfate in the dosages that you put in are toxic to the environment, regardless if there is an aquifer, well, or anything else around. Again, just because you can use it, does not mean that you should.

[AsktheBuilder]

Holley,

Table salt can poison the ground. What about rock salt used by the thousands of tons to melt snow? Copper sulfate is not a man-made artificial chemical. There are thousands of chemicals you use each day directly and indirectly. If you are going to take this stance, there can be no double standard. You need to stop using all chemicals and stop the indirect pollution you cause by consuming just about everything.

[zoobie77]

i'm sure the whole line is not all full roots why not camera the line find where the problem is in the line and then do this process instead of putting all these pipes in the lawn on a long sewer run

[AsktheBuilder]

At the first point of entry, the roots can be so thick you can't get by with the camera.

[markv33]

Please be very weary of following this guy's advice. First he is not a master plumber. Second if he is doing plumbing work without a license then he is in violation and any work he has done needs redone and inspected only when preformed by a master plumber. Builders only subcontract and never really have done any hands on work themselves.

[AsktheBuilder]

Markv33, Sigh! I am a master plumber. There are many excellent builders who are hands-on as I was for over 20 years. I did the plumbing work with permits on just about all of my jobs. It's not a good idea to make blanket statements unless you can prove them. You may want to start doing research about things before you make embarrassing comments. I also suggest you start making your own videos. There are none at your channel, so we all are thinking that you may be a blow hard.

[JamieWTX]

How far apart do you suggest placing the pipes?

[AsktheBuilder]

I would say every 6 feet along the sewer line. You need to make overlapping cones of treated soil.

[nigeusa]

Please forgive my ignorance, what do you mean overlapping cones ?

[AsktheBuilder]

The solution seeps from the bottom of the pipe making an up side down funnel. Make sense now?

[jmcmahon2]

That seems like a lot of work. I use a foaming product called RootX once a year, and it does a fantastic job. The foam fills the pipe and escapes through any cracks in the pipe to attack the roots on the outside as well. $35 a year, and I have no more problems.

[rktompsett]

Best advice I've seen

[Drifter0001]

Roots seriously make flushing crap down a reversal thank God for Copper Sulfate. And is it possible to just flush some of the crystals down with the same effect?

[AsktheBuilder]

You do not get the same effect. Most residential sewer lines are either 4 or 6 inches in diameter. The volume of water in a normal toilet flush only fills the pipe to a level of 1 inch. Just those roots touching the water get copper sulfate. You want to poison the soil outside the pipe so the roots never get in.

[dasenuff]

damn these tree hugging fools! california(and denve..and maybe oregon and washington) might have a permit for everything but not the rest of the country has socialist ounty laws!

[BlazerLT]

Introducing any chemical, especially a biocide to a underground aquifer without government approval, inspection and permits is against the law in the US, and in Canada.

Regardless of anyone being a plumber, and/or a builder, that is not an EPA bypass to introducing toxic chemicals to any ground situation. This also could lead to liability if you poison a soil area that is being used by a neighbours tree.

[AsktheBuilder]

Would you do all of us a favor and support your comment with the citation of the actual law, and any exclusions for private property? You may be correct, but you have to prove it. Looking forward to your response.

[BRADADAVIS]

Doing something like this is just plain WRONG. Adding chemicals to soil, to "POISON THE SOIL" is VERY WRONG and I am sure I could get any EPA associate to condem these actions. How about hiring a licensed plumbing contractor to camera the line and fix any breech in said. Plumbing is for professionals, not glorified handymen. Jeopardising lives is no joke. How far away from any well are you?

[AsktheBuilder]

Thanks for your comment! Copper sulfate is approved for outdoor use. Copper is a natural biocide which is why it is used in roof-shingle granules to stop algae growth. Wells are never supposed to be located downslope of a sewer or septic tank line. I happen to be a licensed plumbing professional and a professional builder. I look forward to watching videos on your channel so that I can tap into your knowledge. Let me know when they are uploaded so I can subscribe.

[BlazerLT]

Please don't take anything I say as putting your hard work down, you do a great job. =)

You have to understand that approval for outside (topical use)and introducing anything directly into a ground water source are two distinct and different situations meriting two different testing and environmental conditions.

Anyone thinking of doing this should contact their local government offices for information on whether they can use this in this situation.

[AsktheBuilder]

Thanks! Sometimes it is hard to understand the tone of a comment. I am all for keeping the ecosystem pure. I just did a search on Google about copper sulfate. There are many government websites that clearly state it is approved for use outdoors. Seems like there might be some conflicts within our government bodies. Go figure!

[rktompsett]

Screw the EPA

[madskyiv]

If you apply CUSO4 outside (vs. inside in your drainpipes), you must first call the county extension agent. It's a good idea because you will certainly attract attention with an auger that long.

[etfasteddie]

Getting a plumber to locate the exact location of your sewer pipe and its depth can cost a minimum of $200. Can't you just use the auger to hand drill into the soil until you hit hard surface(your pipe) without breaking it through? Is that easy to do?

[AsktheBuilder]

You may hit a rock thinking you are above the sewer line. Sewer pipes are not always installed in a straight line. Getting the location marked as well as depth at different spots as it goes out into your yard is worth more the $200.00. :-)

[oldspice777]

Is copper sulfate SAFE to apply to soil at that depth? Couldn't it affect the ground water supply--and if so, would it be properly treated/removed by a standard water treatment facility? Believe me, I want a permanent solution to this problem, but I am very concerned about water quality.

[AsktheBuilder]

Copper sulfate has been used for years by farmers to control problems in ponds and lakes. I am not a chemist, so I can't answer your questions. I can tell you that copper is a highly-effective biocide and it is about to receive approval by a key government agency as a virus and bacteria killer. You might want to do some research on Google to get answers to your questions.

[kalijasin]

I dont have this problem but this is very helpful!! Thanks for posting this video.