Does anyone know if there are any videos on YouTube of this actual performance? For some reason I really liked the sound of this version of "O Sole Mio."
Isn''t it interesting to watch someone at work, when we usually see him either in performance or in conversation? You see the intelligence and musicality one needs in order to build a performance, wherein you work hard but make it seem effortless. So fun! Are there more rehearsal videos around?
Without his "stupid covering" he wouldn't have gone so far, ever. His voice was pure brilliance and he took advantage of it and had it kept fresh till his last breath. Mostly because of his "stupid covering"...
i absolutely agree, pavarotti covered perfectly which allowed him to keep his voice fresh throughout his whole career. perfectly resonating note to note throughout his whole range. people who dont cover blow too much air through the passagio and damage the voice.
@ILoveTobin By the way, I am not referring to "covering" as support or whatnot, I am referring to "covering" as Pavarotti mentioned it. Like when he kept demo-ing that F sharp, all that was was more swallowed. Like in that Bel Canto clip, it was better when he did it "open." When you do the 2nd one that he demo'd, its harder to keep the voice free if you keep going in that direction. Eventually, you can't "cover" anymore and you choke!
@ilovetobin I think of it as a re-opening through the cover. Pav covers at F, I like F# and when I get to A it literally feels to me, and was taught to me, like covering on a very open pose.
He lost the voice after 30 years of overusing... and he choose to sing some Lirico Spinto roles not well suited for his voice, wich was a great and wonderful and shiny voice, but not that powerful as his armonics and shiny resonance could suggest.
In some roles he overcovered the voice and used too much breath (Radames, Otello...), ence his decline.
Remember he was professionaly singing since 1960, when he was 30... he began losing his vocie from the late '80...
It was the technique that did him in, he began losing his voice from the late 80s? Do you think is right? 50's should be a prime for an opera singer.. for a good example, look at Kraus.
I don't think he began loosing his voice due to his technique. It exists this funny and fancy idea that a singer could loose or not loose the voice due to the technique, wich is TOTALLY wrong. Many WORSTESTER (lol, this word do not exists) singers kept their voices till old age, and many accurate, technically well-developed and good singers lost thier voices while young.
Many singers smoked and drunk and did not loose their voices, others kept monastical lives in order to retain the voice...
Pavarotti began loosing his voice for MANY reasons but he never loose completely, till the old age. If you look at him in 60's and 70's he was a wonderful boy with a great voice. Then money and success spoiled him: he began fatter than a diabethic whale and very very lazy. And he choose to use his voice way too much, without moderation...
IMHO the simple fact that he began a fat whale could justify his poor health and the consequent inflection on the voice.
covered sound is never swallowed sound, if it is swallowed then its not covered and vice versa. a correctly covered sound is very heady and takes lots of support where as swallowing the sound is the lazy mans approach and sounds completely different. pavarottis voice never lost any placement and his covering is, was and will be the model for any tenor who wants to compare to his vocal perfection. voices coming from the swallowed side:peerce,tucker,gedda(exept for high notes) they have lower res
@Webarton I see I wasnt the only one you had this conversation with.... man oh man...
his technique did him in?.... so technique is bad? I dont know where you think he lost his voice. Last I recall his voice was pretty spot on up until the late 90's. Still had a strong C.
Kraus on the other hand.... Well first off, they are completely different voices. Different tambours. Kraus had easy high e Flats, Pav never did. Makes a difference being a lyric vs. a lyrical leggiero
@Webarton Oh my god! Are you kidding, that is so not true. Maybe be able to warmup to that, but not all tenors should be expected to sing that high, where as every damn voice is different. THATs why there are different classifications of tenors.
If YOU DONT KNOW THAT, then you dont know anything. That is like the most basic thing in the world. A high C isnt the easiest thing in the world. Yes it should be free and easy but only a few had that. Can you produce an effortless high C?
@aroncooker ALL tenors, REGARDLESS of the voice, can go up to Eb at LEAST.
EVERY real tenor should be able to warmup to Eb.
Gedda and Kraus could go way higher than Eb. Many of the great tenors had notes higher than Eb. This again, is regardless of voice difference between any tenor.
A C should not be a high note. For a professional tenor, it SHOULD be the easiest thing in the world.
We've had a go at this before, and you've understood nothing.
@Webarton you trying to tell me that every tenor is the same and all voices should be able to do the same thing. That makes no sense at all. So where did you hear that all tenors go up to e Flat? Where are you getting this crazy info?
Um and yeah, I've understood everything. That you have no idea what you are trying to talk about and dont understand anything about singing in the classical field. You have the ideas and the terms, but your confusion in everything is where you lack.
@Webarton BTW, hows the singing coming? You're a vocal performance major right? Are you training to be an opera singer one day? I dont think I ever really asked you.
@aroncooker Never said all voices are the exactly the same. But from a technical standpoint, they pretty much are. The same things need to be happening for proper position for all singers, regardless of voice type. You really don't understand anything I am saying.
If you take ANYTHING away from this, please remember that if you are with your teacher for a long time, and you STILL are having terrible difficulty with notes below a high C, then PLEASE find a new coach.
@Webarton Yes you are right! The same things have to be happening for the best production of sound and ease of the voice. But not every voice is the same and has the same capabilties. Maybe you should be more clear in what you say if you think I dont understand you anytime.
BTW, I dont have issues with any of those notes. We warm up to high D with no problem. But thinking that one day I will have a strong E flat is ludacris.
You have a basis of knowledge, but your confusing so much.
@Webarton Theres not much pressure up there at all because it is involving so much of a headier mix in the voice right now. Kraus did put it in the nose. Way too often in his later career.
I am speaking for myself, thats why this is so interesting to me. I mostly sing an "AH" right now that high. Its not about finding a separate position for each vowel. It singing each vowel in a more forward area (aka. the mask). But you have to discover how each vowel resonates in that spot.
@aroncooker Again, Kraus didn't put it in the nose. You need to learn your anatomy. The reason he used the mask so much was to avoid the throat pressure, if he dropped position it would crack. Instead he used to mask to keep the notes reliable in a sense.
No vowel resonates differently in any area, every vowel SHOULD resonate the SAME. The only reason you get DIFFERENT resonances with different vowels is because you're POSITIONING and using throat for each one. Your approach is wrong.
@Webarton Again, he did. It has nothing to do with anatomy. It is where the sound is resonating. You can easily hear it. Many other tenors have had reliable notes without singing in the nose.
Yes every vowel should resonate in the same area. And for many of the older tenors, that exactly what happened.
@Webarton - Mask is a word I just hate, but I can understand why people use it. And if we watch Kraus sing, and esp. if we listen to his master classes, we will receive the greatest voice lessons. Technique for DAYS, and sensitivity, and intelligence. Wonderful man. As to the the 'ee' situation: You both are right. Keep the voice forward behind the nose, keep the face activated, but of course as you go higher you are allowed to modify your vowel, while keeping the 'placement' steady.
@aroncooker You use EE to get the sound heady and out of the throat, THEN other vowels are just a matter of articulation with the lips, cheeks and jaw.
Again, this is the problem with all the singers/tenors nowadays, they are all making these vowels different and with their throats. Vowels are 0% tongue/throat/ anything. Sound just needs to keep as high position as possible and the lips articulate. This is about PRACTICALITY of the voice, if you don't understand this, I can't help you.
@Webarton First of all, stop assuming I dont understand anything. I understand everything you are saying, it's just half of it is wrong.
Any vowel can be in a heady spot. Yes they all should be, but singing EE isnt the only vowel that will do it. The lips have sooooo much to do with this. It does so much of the work in narrowing and bringing the sound forward so it can efficiently access the resonating chambers.
What you say is right in a sense, but has nothing to do with keeping the height
First of all, the first part of your response, I JUST SAID that.
And the second part,...what? Do you mean HIGH POSITION? Because it DOES. High position=resonating chambers=out of the throat= full support=correct placement=so on and so forth, these are all the same thing.
Also, am I the only one who thinks Kraus was the most annoying thing to ever listen to? It's just a gross voice. He sang way too nasal. And his entire conception was that every vowel should be sung in an "eee" place. Hence the reason he spreads so much when he sings higher notes.
Kraus did have a pretty darn small voice, the reason why people thought it was nasal was because he sometimes leaned into the mask a bit too much, but thats why he did so great in the houses, because he shook the crowd with his resonance. And yes, every vowel SHOULD be sung in the EE place because EE produces the most resonance. All other vowels can grab at the throat..other vowels are much harder.
@Webarton i would say he put it too far into the nose sometimes. Theres a difference between singing in the mask and singing in the nose. Actually every vowel should be produced with the vowel it is. It takes a long time to master that, but saying that every vowel is sung in a EE place is nonsense. Caruso, Tetrazzini, and Lehmann wrote so much on how much mastering the vowels has to do with it. any sound can be in the throat, even an EE vowel. Of course, some are more difficult than others
@aroncooker -- Naughty! Naughty! You don't sing your vowels in the throat, you attempt to sing them in the same place, i.e. more forward and bright without tinniness. This is a place somewhere right at the back of the nose. EE (with an 'eh' behind it ) approximates the place best. The vowels that sit back in the throat, like Ahh, and Oh, need to be mooved toward or into the oo-ee place in order to keep us from choking on them.
@aroncooker I cannot remember either, but I must have misunderstood you, since I tend to agree with all of your comments in your dialogues with Webarton, Yes, 'covering' is an essential technical element. To not cover is to blow your voice right out. And to think that all tenors vocalize to Eflat and effortless high C's is to misunderstand voices and fachs. Every voice is individual, and thank God for that. Kaufman isn't Florez, isn't Kraus isn't Bjorling. And no-one is Pavarotti.
@sopranosd Is covering an advanced technique? I've been trying to research "covering" on youtube and on google and all I get are Justin beiber album covers......please help a poor guy out xD.
@iTzJimBoi I think this might help. Type Pavarotti about covered sound in the YouTube search bar and listen to Pava's explanation and pay close attention to the actual vowel he uses when hitting the F#. I believe you will be able to hear the difference in sound from the other notes of the scale. Also read the information provided by the other posters on the page--some of them are spot on. hope this helps.
@iTzJimBoi What voice part are you? I'm a leggiero tenor...so I like to think of "covering" more in terms of vowel modification. Vocal maxims by Lamperti is a good book for singing in general.
@Grandtenore I believe I am a baritenor. I haven't been in any choir or singing class where a teacher has classified my voice but the sound I produce is somewhat deep, I have a few tenor notes.
@Webarton - I don't think 50's is the prime. It can still be a decade in which a singer still has his chops, but the prime of a singer's life is more in the 30's and 40's. Men's voices, so I'm told, mature at about 35, which I take to mean that is the vocal peak or near thereto. 50 is a long way from 35. Pavarotti had excellent technique, throughout his career, but developed a little edge from singing heavier roles which he would have done better to avoid.
your silly, he never lost his voice. also he never "over covered" there really is no such thing, if you could you wouldn't be on pitch and he always had perfect pitch. covering is the healthy way to keep heady resonance in the sound without having to over sing and push through notes in the passagio. pavarottis best singing was 70s and 80s. it was the height of his career. the only time he could be considered technically weak was in his early career. after learning the breath he just got better.
I agree. Pavarotti' s technique was the thing that made him so good. Not only the unique voice. He worked a lot in his early career. Technique was his " trump card" .
ForAll23...No, he was not the best. He stated himself that the greatest dramatic tenor of the past century was Franco Corelli who normally was categorized as a spinto tenor. Corelli when he was "on" which was usually could not be touched vocally. An absolutely incredible voice that would carry off the wallsof the old Met on Broadway. He and Del Monaco shared that distinciton. There were indeed great tenors during that era and all voice parts were deep in talent... Golden Age...
Pavarotti was technically brilliant, and that's where you're mistaken saying, that Corelli couldn't be vocally touched. His voice was of course great, vocally he may have been among the best, but the technique was the problem of those tenors, it wasn't then as cultivated and accomplished yet, so when Pavarotti's technique,vocal brilliance, talent and unique voice comes in, I have no doubt that he was the one who could not be touched at all.
Pavarotti himself called Corelli "the greatest dramatic tenor of the century".. look it up. You have a right to your opinion but unless you go back to the 50s and were listening to tenors then I agree to disagree. They all DO NOT sing lyric, spinto or dramatic roles as the voices were what they were and couldn't handle it. For sheer power and brilliance I'll take Corelli all day long..for beauty of a tenor voice I'll take Lanza though as you know he didn't pursue that career.
I believe that in singing terms, the definition of any great vocalist is that for the duration of the song or aria, they can put all other singers versions from your mind. All of the great tenors, baritones etc have been able to do this. All great singers MUST have a great technique, since a great voice cannot emerge from an average technique, the two go hand in glove. No single artist can ever be the greatest, since there has never been a single definitive voice that could please everyone.
no one compares to pavarottis technique i am also a fan of corelli but technical superiority belongs to pavarotti over any other tenor. this foundation allowed him to therefore sing more musically and phrase in ways other tenors couldn't. he is also the king of legato which is all about technique.
Corelli was indeed the dramatic tenor, Pav on the other hand was lyric, although they all sing spinto, leggiero and dramatic tenor roles. And that's where Pav stands out - he could do all of them perfectly. I can link bel canto with Pavarotti, but not with Corelli or Domingo, for instance.
Pavarotti's idol was Di Stefano, but his technique was so catastrophic, I guess only the voice, charisma and emotional attractiveness were the things that made Di Stefano an idol of the great Pavarotti.
I am sorry, but Luciano was the best, at his prime for sure the best, for those who love a different sound of voice, a little more darker, probably even the way of interpretation the role and the singing, so he will prefer Corelli or another tenor. but for me no one has such brilliant and unique voice as Luciano.
Sorry! I love Luciano Pavarotti but in the rehearsal of Forse la soglia attinse, Luciano dont go a tempo, is not problem of orchestra or conducter, is Luciano problem jejeje but in is one rehearsal dont problem! Pavarotti forever!!!! Bravo Maestro!
The sound of an angel.
Queenie145 1 week ago
@LoveTobin : could you please tell me why all classical singers cover one ear when they are recording?
marcela21884 2 weeks ago
@marcela21884 Wow, I don't know really. I think it's to hear yourself better.
ILoveTobin 2 weeks ago
How to sing with chewing gum in your mouth...that's a talent all by itself!!!
donerlich 2 weeks ago
Does anyone know if there are any videos on YouTube of this actual performance? For some reason I really liked the sound of this version of "O Sole Mio."
monksally 1 month ago
when pavarotti starts to sing at :34,the clouds part and the sun shines
cccorsetti 4 months ago 2
Isn''t it interesting to watch someone at work, when we usually see him either in performance or in conversation? You see the intelligence and musicality one needs in order to build a performance, wherein you work hard but make it seem effortless. So fun! Are there more rehearsal videos around?
sopranosd 1 year ago
i would love to listen the whole o sole mio song, from this footage, does he ends?:..
mauriciomille 1 year ago
Ninguém nunca percebeu que Pavarotti não entende porra nenhuma de musica, daí essa cara de que não está entendendo merda nenhuma?
gutoguidoegreg 1 year ago
He was the king of FA#..that's way he never lost he's voice..
MarcuCezar 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Voice is very fresh in this clip. Good to see.
He lost it cause of his stupid "covering".
Webarton 2 years ago
can you explain that please? this part with covering
Rope15 2 years ago
Without his "stupid covering" he wouldn't have gone so far, ever. His voice was pure brilliance and he took advantage of it and had it kept fresh till his last breath. Mostly because of his "stupid covering"...
ILoveTobin 2 years ago
i absolutely agree, pavarotti covered perfectly which allowed him to keep his voice fresh throughout his whole career. perfectly resonating note to note throughout his whole range. people who dont cover blow too much air through the passagio and damage the voice.
bigus 2 years ago
@ILoveTobin By the way, I am not referring to "covering" as support or whatnot, I am referring to "covering" as Pavarotti mentioned it. Like when he kept demo-ing that F sharp, all that was was more swallowed. Like in that Bel Canto clip, it was better when he did it "open." When you do the 2nd one that he demo'd, its harder to keep the voice free if you keep going in that direction. Eventually, you can't "cover" anymore and you choke!
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton But you're mistaken if you think that it happened to Pavarotti.
ILoveTobin 1 year ago
@ILoveTobin It happened all the time.
Webarton 1 year ago
@ilovetobin I think of it as a re-opening through the cover. Pav covers at F, I like F# and when I get to A it literally feels to me, and was taught to me, like covering on a very open pose.
viv3147 1 year ago
@viv3147 or to be clear, opening more through the cover
viv3147 11 months ago
He lost the voice after 30 years of overusing... and he choose to sing some Lirico Spinto roles not well suited for his voice, wich was a great and wonderful and shiny voice, but not that powerful as his armonics and shiny resonance could suggest.
In some roles he overcovered the voice and used too much breath (Radames, Otello...), ence his decline.
Remember he was professionaly singing since 1960, when he was 30... he began losing his vocie from the late '80...
edraith 2 years ago
It was the technique that did him in, he began losing his voice from the late 80s? Do you think is right? 50's should be a prime for an opera singer.. for a good example, look at Kraus.
Webarton 2 years ago
I don't think he began loosing his voice due to his technique. It exists this funny and fancy idea that a singer could loose or not loose the voice due to the technique, wich is TOTALLY wrong. Many WORSTESTER (lol, this word do not exists) singers kept their voices till old age, and many accurate, technically well-developed and good singers lost thier voices while young.
Many singers smoked and drunk and did not loose their voices, others kept monastical lives in order to retain the voice...
edraith 2 years ago
Pavarotti began loosing his voice for MANY reasons but he never loose completely, till the old age. If you look at him in 60's and 70's he was a wonderful boy with a great voice. Then money and success spoiled him: he began fatter than a diabethic whale and very very lazy. And he choose to use his voice way too much, without moderation...
IMHO the simple fact that he began a fat whale could justify his poor health and the consequent inflection on the voice.
edraith 2 years ago
wrong.
bigus 2 years ago
Comment removed
Webarton 2 years ago
covered sound is never swallowed sound, if it is swallowed then its not covered and vice versa. a correctly covered sound is very heady and takes lots of support where as swallowing the sound is the lazy mans approach and sounds completely different. pavarottis voice never lost any placement and his covering is, was and will be the model for any tenor who wants to compare to his vocal perfection. voices coming from the swallowed side:peerce,tucker,gedda(exept for high notes) they have lower res
bigus 2 years ago
it' s not about the age.
ILoveTobin 2 years ago
@Webarton I see I wasnt the only one you had this conversation with.... man oh man...
his technique did him in?.... so technique is bad? I dont know where you think he lost his voice. Last I recall his voice was pretty spot on up until the late 90's. Still had a strong C.
Kraus on the other hand.... Well first off, they are completely different voices. Different tambours. Kraus had easy high e Flats, Pav never did. Makes a difference being a lyric vs. a lyrical leggiero
aroncooker 1 year ago
@aroncooker A high C is NOTHING for a tenor. ALL tenors should be able to go up to Eb, if C is a tough note, this means WAYYY too much pressure.
Sorry, but if you don't know that, you don't know anything.
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton Oh my god! Are you kidding, that is so not true. Maybe be able to warmup to that, but not all tenors should be expected to sing that high, where as every damn voice is different. THATs why there are different classifications of tenors.
If YOU DONT KNOW THAT, then you dont know anything. That is like the most basic thing in the world. A high C isnt the easiest thing in the world. Yes it should be free and easy but only a few had that. Can you produce an effortless high C?
aroncooker 1 year ago
@aroncooker ALL tenors, REGARDLESS of the voice, can go up to Eb at LEAST.
EVERY real tenor should be able to warmup to Eb.
Gedda and Kraus could go way higher than Eb. Many of the great tenors had notes higher than Eb. This again, is regardless of voice difference between any tenor.
A C should not be a high note. For a professional tenor, it SHOULD be the easiest thing in the world.
We've had a go at this before, and you've understood nothing.
I agree to disagree, leave it at that.
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton you trying to tell me that every tenor is the same and all voices should be able to do the same thing. That makes no sense at all. So where did you hear that all tenors go up to e Flat? Where are you getting this crazy info?
Um and yeah, I've understood everything. That you have no idea what you are trying to talk about and dont understand anything about singing in the classical field. You have the ideas and the terms, but your confusion in everything is where you lack.
aroncooker 1 year ago
Comment removed
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton BTW, hows the singing coming? You're a vocal performance major right? Are you training to be an opera singer one day? I dont think I ever really asked you.
aroncooker 1 year ago
@aroncooker Never said all voices are the exactly the same. But from a technical standpoint, they pretty much are. The same things need to be happening for proper position for all singers, regardless of voice type. You really don't understand anything I am saying.
If you take ANYTHING away from this, please remember that if you are with your teacher for a long time, and you STILL are having terrible difficulty with notes below a high C, then PLEASE find a new coach.
Except for F sharp.
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton Yes you are right! The same things have to be happening for the best production of sound and ease of the voice. But not every voice is the same and has the same capabilties. Maybe you should be more clear in what you say if you think I dont understand you anytime.
BTW, I dont have issues with any of those notes. We warm up to high D with no problem. But thinking that one day I will have a strong E flat is ludacris.
You have a basis of knowledge, but your confusing so much.
aroncooker 1 year ago
@aroncooker If D is a problem for you, there's still most likely way too much pressure there.
Again, all tenors have Eb.
Kraus NEVER put it in the nose, he put it in the MASK.
Also, your reference to the other singers means nothing to me, I am speaking technique here, speak for yourself, not for the greats.
Can you do EE vowel at high D? or C? or even Bb? No, if you find a separate position for each vowel you're positioning and you lose.
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton Theres not much pressure up there at all because it is involving so much of a headier mix in the voice right now. Kraus did put it in the nose. Way too often in his later career.
I am speaking for myself, thats why this is so interesting to me. I mostly sing an "AH" right now that high. Its not about finding a separate position for each vowel. It singing each vowel in a more forward area (aka. the mask). But you have to discover how each vowel resonates in that spot.
aroncooker 1 year ago
@aroncooker Again, Kraus didn't put it in the nose. You need to learn your anatomy. The reason he used the mask so much was to avoid the throat pressure, if he dropped position it would crack. Instead he used to mask to keep the notes reliable in a sense.
No vowel resonates differently in any area, every vowel SHOULD resonate the SAME. The only reason you get DIFFERENT resonances with different vowels is because you're POSITIONING and using throat for each one. Your approach is wrong.
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton Again, he did. It has nothing to do with anatomy. It is where the sound is resonating. You can easily hear it. Many other tenors have had reliable notes without singing in the nose.
Yes every vowel should resonate in the same area. And for many of the older tenors, that exactly what happened.
aroncooker 1 year ago
@Webarton - Mask is a word I just hate, but I can understand why people use it. And if we watch Kraus sing, and esp. if we listen to his master classes, we will receive the greatest voice lessons. Technique for DAYS, and sensitivity, and intelligence. Wonderful man. As to the the 'ee' situation: You both are right. Keep the voice forward behind the nose, keep the face activated, but of course as you go higher you are allowed to modify your vowel, while keeping the 'placement' steady.
sopranosd 1 year ago
@sopranosd Finally, comments that make sense. It is a rarity on this youtube, consider that a compliment, lol.
Webarton 1 year ago
@aroncooker You use EE to get the sound heady and out of the throat, THEN other vowels are just a matter of articulation with the lips, cheeks and jaw.
Again, this is the problem with all the singers/tenors nowadays, they are all making these vowels different and with their throats. Vowels are 0% tongue/throat/ anything. Sound just needs to keep as high position as possible and the lips articulate. This is about PRACTICALITY of the voice, if you don't understand this, I can't help you.
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton First of all, stop assuming I dont understand anything. I understand everything you are saying, it's just half of it is wrong.
Any vowel can be in a heady spot. Yes they all should be, but singing EE isnt the only vowel that will do it. The lips have sooooo much to do with this. It does so much of the work in narrowing and bringing the sound forward so it can efficiently access the resonating chambers.
What you say is right in a sense, but has nothing to do with keeping the height
aroncooker 1 year ago
@aroncooker ...keeping..the height?
First of all, the first part of your response, I JUST SAID that.
And the second part,...what? Do you mean HIGH POSITION? Because it DOES. High position=resonating chambers=out of the throat= full support=correct placement=so on and so forth, these are all the same thing.
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton Yeah thats what I meant. I ran out of word space.... haha
In a higher position, a headier spot, a more forward area.
aroncooker 1 year ago
@Webarton The bottom line is, that for all practical purposes, if you are positioning ANYTHING when you sing, then you're already doing it wrong.
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton
Also, am I the only one who thinks Kraus was the most annoying thing to ever listen to? It's just a gross voice. He sang way too nasal. And his entire conception was that every vowel should be sung in an "eee" place. Hence the reason he spreads so much when he sings higher notes.
aroncooker 1 year ago
@aroncooker And THAT is also wrong.
Kraus did have a pretty darn small voice, the reason why people thought it was nasal was because he sometimes leaned into the mask a bit too much, but thats why he did so great in the houses, because he shook the crowd with his resonance. And yes, every vowel SHOULD be sung in the EE place because EE produces the most resonance. All other vowels can grab at the throat..other vowels are much harder.
Webarton 1 year ago
@Webarton i would say he put it too far into the nose sometimes. Theres a difference between singing in the mask and singing in the nose. Actually every vowel should be produced with the vowel it is. It takes a long time to master that, but saying that every vowel is sung in a EE place is nonsense. Caruso, Tetrazzini, and Lehmann wrote so much on how much mastering the vowels has to do with it. any sound can be in the throat, even an EE vowel. Of course, some are more difficult than others
aroncooker 1 year ago
@aroncooker -- Naughty! Naughty! You don't sing your vowels in the throat, you attempt to sing them in the same place, i.e. more forward and bright without tinniness. This is a place somewhere right at the back of the nose. EE (with an 'eh' behind it ) approximates the place best. The vowels that sit back in the throat, like Ahh, and Oh, need to be mooved toward or into the oo-ee place in order to keep us from choking on them.
sopranosd 1 year ago
@sopranosd wait, did i say something earlier to go against what you said here? I cant remember our conversation but I just saw it. haha
I completely agree with what you said, so Im not sure what comment I put earlier.
aroncooker 1 year ago
@aroncooker I cannot remember either, but I must have misunderstood you, since I tend to agree with all of your comments in your dialogues with Webarton, Yes, 'covering' is an essential technical element. To not cover is to blow your voice right out. And to think that all tenors vocalize to Eflat and effortless high C's is to misunderstand voices and fachs. Every voice is individual, and thank God for that. Kaufman isn't Florez, isn't Kraus isn't Bjorling. And no-one is Pavarotti.
sopranosd 1 year ago
@sopranosd haha, very true my friend. Nice to read some intelligent comments on here...
aroncooker 1 year ago
@sopranosd what is the first aria?, before the nap song o sole mio, thanks
mauriciomille 10 months ago
@mauriciomille Forse la soglia attinse, from Verdis Un ballo in maschera
ILoveTobin 10 months ago
@ILoveTobin thank you very much ILT
mauriciomille 10 months ago
@sopranosd Is covering an advanced technique? I've been trying to research "covering" on youtube and on google and all I get are Justin beiber album covers......please help a poor guy out xD.
iTzJimBoi 3 months ago
@iTzJimBoi I think this might help. Type Pavarotti about covered sound in the YouTube search bar and listen to Pava's explanation and pay close attention to the actual vowel he uses when hitting the F#. I believe you will be able to hear the difference in sound from the other notes of the scale. Also read the information provided by the other posters on the page--some of them are spot on. hope this helps.
appeace1 2 months ago
@iTzJimBoi What voice part are you? I'm a leggiero tenor...so I like to think of "covering" more in terms of vowel modification. Vocal maxims by Lamperti is a good book for singing in general.
Grandtenore 1 month ago
@Grandtenore I believe I am a baritenor. I haven't been in any choir or singing class where a teacher has classified my voice but the sound I produce is somewhat deep, I have a few tenor notes.
iTzJimBoi 1 month ago
Comment removed
MGGreeneStudio 1 month ago
@sopranosd Spot on, the thing is we need to focus on a high and forward not, otherwise the heavey vowels A and O will sit on the throat.
mrluistena 9 months ago
@Webarton - I don't think 50's is the prime. It can still be a decade in which a singer still has his chops, but the prime of a singer's life is more in the 30's and 40's. Men's voices, so I'm told, mature at about 35, which I take to mean that is the vocal peak or near thereto. 50 is a long way from 35. Pavarotti had excellent technique, throughout his career, but developed a little edge from singing heavier roles which he would have done better to avoid.
sopranosd 1 year ago
your silly, he never lost his voice. also he never "over covered" there really is no such thing, if you could you wouldn't be on pitch and he always had perfect pitch. covering is the healthy way to keep heady resonance in the sound without having to over sing and push through notes in the passagio. pavarottis best singing was 70s and 80s. it was the height of his career. the only time he could be considered technically weak was in his early career. after learning the breath he just got better.
bigus 2 years ago
I agree. Pavarotti' s technique was the thing that made him so good. Not only the unique voice. He worked a lot in his early career. Technique was his " trump card" .
ILoveTobin 2 years ago
true that my brother.
krunk52 1 year ago
@Webarton HAHAHAHAHAHAHa... I never get sick of hearing this funny joke
aroncooker 1 year ago
He was not the best, he was among the best. There has not been- and will not be any "the best" within the opera.
In addition to his greatness as a singer he was also, as seen in the video, a very charming person.
ForAll23 2 years ago
brunobrandy 2 years ago
Pavarotti was technically brilliant, and that's where you're mistaken saying, that Corelli couldn't be vocally touched. His voice was of course great, vocally he may have been among the best, but the technique was the problem of those tenors, it wasn't then as cultivated and accomplished yet, so when Pavarotti's technique,vocal brilliance, talent and unique voice comes in, I have no doubt that he was the one who could not be touched at all.
ILoveTobin 2 years ago
brunobrandy 2 years ago
I believe that in singing terms, the definition of any great vocalist is that for the duration of the song or aria, they can put all other singers versions from your mind. All of the great tenors, baritones etc have been able to do this. All great singers MUST have a great technique, since a great voice cannot emerge from an average technique, the two go hand in glove. No single artist can ever be the greatest, since there has never been a single definitive voice that could please everyone.
hiyadroogs 2 years ago
Regarding technique, I think Corelli knew better than Pavarotti.
edraith 2 years ago
no one compares to pavarottis technique i am also a fan of corelli but technical superiority belongs to pavarotti over any other tenor. this foundation allowed him to therefore sing more musically and phrase in ways other tenors couldn't. he is also the king of legato which is all about technique.
bigus 2 years ago
Just plain wrong.
@ edraith.
Bigus, I wouldn't say that Pavarotti's production was perfect...
Webarton 2 years ago
@edraith eeh, not really, at all
aroncooker 1 year ago
Corelli was indeed the dramatic tenor, Pav on the other hand was lyric, although they all sing spinto, leggiero and dramatic tenor roles. And that's where Pav stands out - he could do all of them perfectly. I can link bel canto with Pavarotti, but not with Corelli or Domingo, for instance.
Pavarotti's idol was Di Stefano, but his technique was so catastrophic, I guess only the voice, charisma and emotional attractiveness were the things that made Di Stefano an idol of the great Pavarotti.
ILoveTobin 2 years ago
I am sorry, but Luciano was the best, at his prime for sure the best, for those who love a different sound of voice, a little more darker, probably even the way of interpretation the role and the singing, so he will prefer Corelli or another tenor. but for me no one has such brilliant and unique voice as Luciano.
loveluciano1 2 years ago
Opera can not be measured the same way as sports.
There are "ordinary" singers, there are better singers and the great masters.
Who is the best among the great masters is simply a matter of taste.
Swim calmly. :-)
ForAll23 2 years ago
ForAll123....Well said. It was a joy during
the 50s and 60s to hear a real depth of
voices who would be considered under
the category of the grand masters during
the "golden age" of voice.
brunobrandy 2 years ago
a pavarotti nada se le puede criticar incluso en sus equivocaciones suena fantastico
mediterraneo1000 2 years ago
Sorry! I love Luciano Pavarotti but in the rehearsal of Forse la soglia attinse, Luciano dont go a tempo, is not problem of orchestra or conducter, is Luciano problem jejeje but in is one rehearsal dont problem! Pavarotti forever!!!! Bravo Maestro!
Marinausbcn 2 years ago
I've noticed he had those rhythm and tempo problems not only in rehearsals. But to sum up - he's the best! :)
ILoveTobin 2 years ago
gave him individuality and special interpretation.
bwaybud 2 years ago
The best TENOR
The worst orchestra...
ideiao 2 years ago
i agree
gacija 2 years ago
The greatest. Thanks for uploading
marcherst 3 years ago