The Great Health Care Debate

[dinkydkmg]

Private schools are better than public schools. I went to both. The Private sector is always better and more efficient than the public sector.

[TheSelfishAltruist]

@dinkydkmg Not in the case of healthcare. Public is more efficicent, and I can prove it with stats if you need me to, ad I can explain this apparent paradox VERY easily as well.

[dinkydkmg]

These guys are awesome. I tend to agree more with Medved, but Thom is also an intelligent and respectful guy as well.

[cmfluteguy]

I'm surprised Hartman could stop whoring gold long enough to do this!

[louise12345]

I couldn't believe that the voice speaking was Michael Medved, he is very cordial and reasonable sounding. On his show he can be a raging nut. Here he is moderated by a man who knows what he's talking about and he knows he can't bullshit because he'll be called on it.

[Lightmane321]

19 minutes in & Thom has totally defeated Michael, but because Michael is such a slick intelligent talker, his viewers probably don't agree.

It's amazing to me when you compare Michael's arguments vs. Thom's.

I'm shocked that we don't have around 90% of Americans in agreement with Thom. Thom has overcome every argument that Michael made.

Michael overcame nothing, yet just 1 year ago, I agreed with Michael.

Boy was I duped.

[Lightmane321]

I need to follow up, now that I finished listening. Michael tried to make Thom look 'dead wrong' there, at the end, but did you see how Thom totally destroyed Michael's point, regarding airplanes.

Hey Michael. Let's deregulate the airline industry, like we deregulate the banks & wall street, because as we all 'know'... the market will regulate itself, right? ROFL!!!!!

[serpentineflame]

Spending our way into oblivion with for profit blood sucking health insurers

[BasementFishFilms]

Alright, Thom, You need to just start being like "Listen you fuck! What the fuck are you talking about? Did you just listen what I fuckin' said? What the fuck Mike?!..."

This is terrible though, I think they put extra sugar in Micheal's Koo laid.

[univibe23]

This country has the best medical system in the world. We have the best medical schools, surgeons, and internists who pioneer more new techniques and med's than any country hands down. That bankruptcy claim is bogus! 49% of Americans don't want to change our HCS. Obama has the lowest approval rating of ANY President under 2 yrs into the 1 ST term--my G*D, he's making Carter look good.

[genYprogressive]

@univibe23 Lay off the crack pipe. Costa Rica has a better healthcare system than America. The Majority of people want Insurance Companys put out of buisness, and 62% of bankrupcys are from medical costs.

[univibe23]

@genY You must be smoking banana peels from Costa Rica!! More (Mike Moore) Bull Shit! I suppose you actually are one of drones who beleives Cuba is the place to be don't you! Wake up Lib! You can have Cuba AND C. Rica!! The US has the VERY BEST health care on the planet!!! World leaders (including Canadian) come HERE for health care--THE US!!!

[genYprogressive]

@univibe23 I said Health Care System genius boy. People form Canada come here for care and they are still covered by the Canadian System that pays for it. And for ever Canadian that comes here there are over 100 Americans that go to Canada for care. In the U.S. 45000 die each year because of no healthcare insurance. Costa RIca has a better system than the U.S. look it up on the WHO Healthcare System Rankings.

[univibe23]

@genYprogressive If you really believe for one minute that the Costa Rican HCS is better than ours---and worse yet you actually believe the WHO rankings--inotherwords you just blindly accept them w/o digging into how they come up with their various rankings--then all I can say to you is get your HC in Canada or CR. But let me and mine keep our fine system INTACT!!

[genYprogressive]

@univibe23 So you want to keep intact a system of for-profit insurance that makes its profits by killing 45000 people a year? And a system that makes it illegal for the Gov to negotiate lower prices and procedures, when I lived in London a year supply of Zocor is $110 and here Medicare pays $1485 for the same drug. And in the UK we don't pay $1400 for a 9 mile ambulance ride. You want to preserve this peice of shit you call a healthcare system. You are pathetic.

[univibe23]

@genYprogressive Boy are you Brainwashed!! Where are you getting your #'s? I have a friend living in Britian now--so I know the quality of HC and Dental care. Pathetic indeed! Here you can get Pravachol, Mevacor 3 mon. supply for $9. and many other med's. @Walmart, Kroger etc. Obama wants to creat a sys. he full well knows will be impos. to fund. Will have a 2 tiered system. Medicaid for the masses--for him and the Upper M. Class there will be a private sys. They sure won't use the GOV. system!!

[genYprogressive]

@genYprogressive Wrong Many welthy people in the UK use the NHS. There are 3 basic models for healthcare 1 The British NHS model 2 The German model that BIzmark created and 3. The Canadian Single-Payer System. Diffrent countrys have all imitated one of the 3 models. America is the only country that has for-profit health insurance. Why do you think that with 3 Healthcare models that have been imitated all over the world not 1 country has used the American System of for-profit insurance?

[hadenufnow]

REPEAL the TAX & JAIL Mandate bill nobody ever wanted..

[hadenufnow]

Kill the 3000 pg HC TAX & JAIL Trojan Horse Mandate Bill nobody wants..

Kill the bill..

Vote em out..

nobody wants it..

[ScottcNehrer]

I agree with you totally about openly debating this subject too. Thanks for replying

[johnlouisville]

Medved gave a surprising articulate debate as an advocate for the status quo and cartel of health insurance giants....a system which wastes money on a gargantuan level that dwarfs anything run by the government. I'm not sure why Thom did not make a huge issue of CIGNA - Nataline Sarkisyan case. Sadly, Medved's point of view will probably prevail...

[Kevitivity]

I appreciated how honest and adult this debate was.

[thbsooner]

i listened to this guyt today, i must say impressed... That A MORON LIKE HIM HAS A TALK show ! Yes our health care needs reform. His premise os that NO ONE SHOULD make any money in healthcare, just turn it over to the gov. Yet our gov cant even run current medicaid/care. In fact he said any dr making over 6 figures is too much. and that dr who say they will early retire cuz they wont make as much, his words, good ridence, U kiddin me I want the BEST / BRIGHTEST . they have earned it.

[ccsmine41]

Don't believe anything will change.....remember, our elected officials go with the flow of money! Where is the money? Private Insurance!

[miankhoji]

Medicare overhead around 4%

Health Insurance Company overhead 29%

Case closed

[butthetruth]

the present health system is the "free market" and it sucks.

[ScottcNehrer]

WRONG! Are you kidding or are you just flat out ignorant?

[butthetruth]

Could you please elaborate, or I take your comments are totally devoid of any substance, ala Sarah Palin.

[dancarollo]

The problem here is that "personal health" is a HUGE variable -- and has a lot to do with how well a person takes care of himself --- and is NOT simply a matter of what HAPPENS to you -- as in a fire, or auto accident, an attack by foreign invaders, etc.

It would also seem unfair to be paying tax into a system that covers medical costs for "careless" people.

[tacos4all]

It seems to me that fires, auto accidents and foreign invaders are all variables largely initiated by careless people over whom YOU would have no control.

That's the whole point of insurance, that you're protecting yourself from unexpected catastrophic costs.

[oggleman]

this guy has the free market as a religion he says "i believe in the free market" and "I trust the profit system", he can believe in the free market all he wants that doesn't make it the best way. "in profit we trust" would make a great punk rock song name

[bpentium]

If you're against "for profit" businesses then let's do away with "for profit" talk show hosts, esp the liberal ones. What kind of idiot are you Thom? Show us the way and do it for free.

[westt44]

america pays nearly twice as much for health care than any other country in the world.

america is ranked #37 in health care.

the #1 cause of bankruptcy in america is from health care bills.

a drug that costs 500$ in america only costs 14$ in canada.

in america, paper work comes first, health care comes second.

the problem? health insurance rates. insurance companies denying coverage to sick people. insurance companies paying their ceos millions/billions of dollars.

bad business is bad.

[bpentium]

If this is true, MOVE!!!

[bpentium]

How about seeing if you can fix medicare FIRST and then get trusted to run the rest.

[bpentium]

Medved wins.

[lisabob22]

I wonder In Medved ever gets tired of getting his ass kicked all the time by Thom?

[POPEWORSHIPER]

You just have to wonder why anyone would PROTECT the insurance company profits.

[snowjob19]

I love how Thom responded to most of Medved's "Do you mean to tell me," and "Are you serious," type questions with a simple yes.

[snowjob19]

I think one of the reasons Medved finds the socialist police and fire force we have acceptable is because it comes down to protecting property. And for many conservatives, property and profit come before people.

[tubesterini]

Without outside competition (a government sponsored public option), what incentive is there for these for-profit insurance companies to keep their soaring rates from continuing to skyrocket? How does that help American industry compete with the rest of the world? The middle-man for-profit insurance companies are hurting America's ability to compete in a world where other nations' industries don't have that responsibility. Wouldn't a public option HELP American industry in the long run?

[isortparcels]

Something needs to be done or health care will go belly up just like the banks and the auto industry. And when that happens what will it cost to fix it.

[ScottcNehrer]

How do you figure?

[isortparcels]

One of the reasons General Motors said they were losing money was employee health insurance cost. Major companies such as AT&T and the USPS for example are requiring their employees to pay more of the cost of health insurance. The health insurance companies also are raising their rates while providing less coverage. If this pattern continues who knows what the end result will be?

[isortparcels]

Anyway Scott my biggest concern is for you younger people. I'm an old guy and I have all the health insurance I'll ever need. But I have children in their 20's and they're the ones I care about.. Best Wishes G. F.

[ScottcNehrer]

Don't get me wrong . I am very concerned about our situation. Healthcare today is a mess. But I think If one understands Austrian Economics, the solution is clear. For too long we have let government, or "the state" interfere in the market system. Insurance companies, doctors , medical schools etc are all restricted heavily by the enforcement or regulations the state has put into place. Most intervention ends up restricting supply driving up cost,.

[isortparcels]

Well I support the doctors and medical schools 100% and I also think there is too much government interference and restriction on the medical side of healthcare. My gripe is with health insurance companies for individuals. There are a lot of people in lower paying jobs that can't afford any kind of health insurance . And maybe the insurers shouldn't cover routine doctor visits. Anyway I think this is something that should be debated in a mature way. Thanks for replying

[ScottcNehrer]

Exactly. Right I think the more money we pay directly to the doctor is definitely the way to go. Ultimately we need to make bigger changes for there to be actual stability.I believe if we had an unfettered market in health insurance it would be much more accessible to low income workers. But thats only if the overall market in general is a free market. Because right now people can't even get jobs if they need them. And there, the root problem lies, government intervention and the business cycl

[ScottcNehrer]

However, in this situation I think there are much more inefficiencies in the market for healthcare. That is not to say that a free market wouldn't solve them. I am always opposed to big government, because when you have it, big business takes over with the help from government. Too many people look to "the state" like they have something to offer us. When in reality they only bring to the table a climate for corruption and collusion among big business. That is why we have Corp America.

[ScottcNehrer]

The FREE MARKET offers all the regulation an informed society needs. The FREE MARKET encourages competition. If we had a FREE MARKET in healthcare, the big profits that people see in this market would send a signal to others that there is money to be made. More doctors, more medical schools, more insurance companies would pop up as a result and would compete against eachother to lower the price. the current meddling our govt is involved in does not allow this.They only create barriers to entry.

[jay123jd]

Scott, I guess you believe in a capitalism type utopia. Bank accounts do not grow unless there is greed and deals struck behind the scenes. It happens all over the world. This healthcare debate has the insurance companies and wall street jumpy. They see derivatives loosing a footing and now the goose that layed their golden egg is very close to being put on life support. See the markets go from glee to gloom in a little over a day. No surprise. Alot of scared big whales weighing their options.

[ScottcNehrer]

I'm not sure what you are getting at. All i am trying to say is that we dont have a free market in healtcare, and that is the root of our problems. As for banking and the financials, I say to hell with it all, buy gold and silver I trust some precious metals to hold there value much more that stocks or paper money. even if the stock market does go up, the dollar is going down soon.

[teleutube]

The only thing that has any teeth in "Obama's Plan" is the "Public Option", an essential mechanism for health care cost control, and, the prospect for a strong public option is looking slimmer and slimmer... everyday.

[johnlouisville]

Yep...and what do the Democrats do?....bargain it away.

[thecellarlife]

conservatives want to support the free market and really any form of capitalism, no matter how negative that sector of it may be, like the private insurance industry. they support profit from illness just because it is capitalism. its the 1950s mentality that a lot of this country has not let go of, that socialism is evil. it's obnoxious and stupid. and our politicians are fucking useless, lobbyist-cock sucking suits. i hope in the future that some of them prove me wrong.

[slapme7times]

I don't think he understands the distinction between profit based insurance companies and profit based doctors and hospitals.

As Thom Said, insurance companies are cutting people from their own plans in order to make money, which is far different from a doctor who tries to perform better at his job in order to attain a better reputation and thus more and higher paying customers.

[captcrais101]

Medved is a idiot

[DaHonestAbe]

He's not an idiot. But he is going in circles. And he is far too trusting (or at least trying to be) of for profit insurance companies.

[TheMikeBuck]

Thom wins.

[samvance]

#1 in responsiveness, #37 in everything else.

it would not be as important that we were "first in response" if we had universal preventive care to keep us from being last in everything else.

also, the problem with health ins co's being for-profit is that they can't profit if they fulfill all their obligations. that's why, when they pay your medical bill, they refer to it as "A LOSS."

if they pay it at all.

[YouEminent]

If you can't pay, it's number 180 in responsiveness.

[DaHonestAbe]

Amazingly it's been my conservative friends that say they want death panels for old folks. I of course replied, "Oh come on man!" But then they said, "Look man, would you rather have that money go to schools and infrastructure, or some 80 year old who is going to die soon?" So I guess they had a point to a degree.

[LouieArrighi]

whenever Thom was right, the Jewish manipulator changed subjects with his gay sounding voice.

[PoliticalSkeptic]

What does being Jewish have to do with it?

[LouieArrighi]

just that sarcastic attitude and then cutting Thom off. I'm Jewish myself, and I know my people. Peace

[Plutonwolf]

Thom is so fair. He could have taken on some easy meat talker like Beck or Hannity. He always aims for the intelligent to make his point

[PoliticalSkeptic]

Beck or Hannity might not do this type of debate for over 30 minutes. Plus Hannity and Beck is winning with the fear and scare tactics. So they know they need to keep pushing that. They know the threat of a fair philosophical debate risks actually INFORMING people to make an intelligent choice. They'd never do it.

[DaHonestAbe]

The closest thing I've seen Hannity do is debate Al Sharpton. Yeah, thats bold. Debate one of the least respected people on the left. How hard is that? But yeah, I'd rather see him debate someone intelligent like Medved, or maybe Prager than some fool like Hannity or Beck.

[PoliticalSkeptic]

Dude i have the ENTIRE 1.5 hour debate between Sharpton and Hannity and Sharpton tore him up sooooooo bad. But of course hannity didn't show the entire thing. If you want to see the whole thing send me an email and i'll send you a link.

[PoliticalSkeptic]

Thanks for posting this folks because i missed it yesterday