@nickgilla It is not true Josephus didn't write about Jesus. Dr. Gary Goldberg proves he did at his Josephus website. Also Alice Whealey, PhD does in her book "Josephus on Jesus" Josephus wrote the TF and the James the brother of Jesus passage. There is NO doubt about it.
@nickgilla Hell even Joseph Atwill with his nutty idea Josephus conspired with Rome to fake Jesus and Christianity holds Josephus wrote the TF but JUST AS IT READS IN EXTANT COPIES TODAY. That is not true. Dr. Louis Feldman, Dr. Alice Whealey, Dr. Gary Goldberg etc have all shown that the original read "was believed to be the Christ" and not "was the Christ' Josephus was a traitor to the Jews but still a Jew who did NOT believe Jesus was the Christ. See Origen from second century!!
Zeitgeist APPEARS to have some "answers," but, being a student of Hebrew and Jewish lore, I noticed a ton of mistakes in its "pagan parallel" section. If the movie's creators are mistaken in the areas I'm familiar with, I'd have to conjecture that they are equally wrong elsewhere.
horus and egypt books are myth, all were invented by man in the 1200 to manipulate history and so you believed in a bunch of old dog faces man who build brick blocks, lol, nothing really existed, all grafitti, ald dead underground were moved there so to manipulate history, all is myth.
THE TRUE ACCEPT IT, I DONT BELIEVE IN EGYPT GRAFITTIES, HISTORIAN ARE GIVING INVENTED INTERPRETATIONS TO EGYPT BOOK AND GRAFFITIES, NO ONE KNOW THE MEANING OF THE EGYPTS GRAFFITI, GRAFITTIES WERE INVENTED SO YOU CAN BE MANIPULATED IN CERTAIN WAY, BECAUSE YOU STUPID HUMANS BELIEVED ALL STUPIDITY, EGYPTS NEVER EXISTED! ! ! THE JUST WERE CREATED IN THE 1200 AFTER CHRIST TO MANIPULATE HISTORY. ZEIGHEIST DO NOT EXIST !. PROVE IT, CAN'T BE PROOVEN.
@changingmyself I accept the fact that the egyptian book is an invented book to manipulate history, so you all dumbs believed in fake invented egyptian book and with ridiculous interpretation. lol.
'Smite ye the enemies of my father, and hurl ye them down into your pits because of that deadly evil which they have done against the Great One, [which] found (?) him that begot me. That which belongeth to you to do in the Tuat is to guard the pits of fire according as Ra hath commanded, and I set [this] before you so that, behold, ye may do according to what belongeth to you [to do].' This god standeth over (or, by) the pits."
"Then saith Horus unto those gods who are behind the shrine:--
"Make inquisition for me, O gods who are in the following of Khenti Amenti, stand ye up, and withdraw ye not yourselves, and be ye masters over yourselves, and come, and live delicately on the bread of HU, and drink ye of the ale of Maat, and live ye upon that whereon my father liveth there.
"Water is the element naturally used for cleansing the body, and its symbolic use entered into almost every ... The ritual of washing was similar to baptism in its purifying implications"
Joel B. Green has been associate dean for the Center for Advanced Theological Studies since 2008 and professor of New Testament interpretation at Fuller Theological Seminary
Ancient Egyptian Religion: An Interpretation -Henri Frankfort - Page 113
"The followers of Horus purify Pepi, They bathe him, they dry him, They recite for him the Spell of the Right Way; They recite for him the Spell of Ascent. Pepi ascends to Heaven. He embarks in the boat of Re. Pepi commands for him"
As what this video said that religion could be the best tool to control the people. Rome who was the powerful ruler before decided to mix paganism and christianity. That's why some christians worship images even if the bible doesn't tell them so. If the bible was just originated from some of egyptians culture why does the bible tells us not to worship images while we know that egyptians before have images of their gods. We cannot relate the bible from some of the egyptians books, culture, etc..
‘’The Christian religion is a parody on the worship of the sun, in which they put a man called Jesus Christ in the place of the sun, and pay him the adoration originally given to the sun.’’ USA Founding Father Thomas Pain
Jesus is a story that has the same pattern as the Horus story.The pagan story came before the Egypt story of Horus.It was about the sun only.The Egyptians are the ones that turned the sun into a man named Horus the sun god.Then in Rome they took the Horus sun god story and changed it to Jesus the sun of god.If you can't see that then you are nothing more than a lost brainwashed sheep like the rest of your sheeple.Go hide in your book and get out of our way this world is ours now.
@BoutAvi : The idea that the "Trinity" is a new creation is false. The WORD "Trinity" came into fasion in the last 1,000, but the Gospels, particularly St. John, are clear that there is the Father, the Son and the Comforter (Holy Spirit).
Every one seems to get there anwsers from the internet such good information you find on here????Why not ask God to come to you? Why be scared to get on your knees and ask Jesus to save you? Or is everyone to scared to know the truth. Instead of making videos like this so call proving that Jesus is fake ....the biggest trick the devil ever did was convice the world he does not exist. People should ask GOD to set them free OPEN my eyes lord let me see what is real!God answers he set me free.love
Today, if you want to get rich or attract attention, start a new religion.... or write a book against religion (Dawkins, Harris and Co.). As far as Chrisianity is concerned, thousands are being healed, and lives regenerated daily. Bless the Jesus myth !!!
This is total crap! Anybody with even a modicum of historical, religious knowledge will see straight through this! Wow. Some people will do anything to get attention..but when it comes at the expense of historical and religious facts..they have gone too far and ventured into the realm of lies!
religion sucks, it gives no answers. science raises good points, and many eye brows, but to many times has science proven itself to be no more correct than religion. the only usefull science that exists is medical science, and science that will help make the world a better place, to bad all of the scientists arent spiritual, because they lack the heart of gold jesus supposedly had. our worlds fucked up, religions fucked it up, and science is to heartless to fix it
Evidence, logic and reason WILL PREVAIL. Humans continue to evolve. While the magic of thousands of religions was useful---even selected biologically---through human history, we now have SCIENCE. Let's hope that someday soon, the Vatican will become The Museum of European Christianity! and Mecca will become Disney's Islamic Park!
Jesus is real. Even His enemies, unbeliever Jews' , believed that Jesus did perform all the miracles, but they didn't believe that He was the Son of God. And you know, Jesus Christ is my GOD and my Savior.
Awesome I have already been making DVDs & handing this video out for free with the end of Bill Mahrs Religulous added to the end and people are loving it.We have the religious by the balls & after 2,000 years of their repression we are not going to let go.It is our turn to make fun of the religious so bad that they burn their own bible & tear down their own churches out of embarrassment.If you're tired of this blind rule it is time to stand our time is now.Give the religious the facts they need.
@spaceshipidentified Have you ever ask God for a sign that he is real? U seem to think you know about all these relgions but i can tell you have never read the bible, Why have so much anger in you heart? Tear down the churches why does it even bother you if people believe? They help others? they do good things and live happy lifes . Dare to ask and you will be surprised what u will get. I will pray that Jesus set you free and may you bring glory unto the kindom of jesus christ AMEN.
@vanessaneto1 Your wrong my parents sent me to church for years and everything in that book sounds wrong.Even as a kid I could tell it bull crap so what is your problem.I know you were born gullible and the religion is now playing you.Religion is an elaborate lie and I don't need it to see when someone needs my help.You by laying claim to that book you are admitting you can't be good with out it.You can't help someone or be nice with out a book telling you so.
@vanessaneto1 Did you not watch the video Jesus never existed I'll recap.The pagans made a story about the sun passing past the stars in the sky.The shortening of the days until it hits the winter solstes Dec 25 when the sun lays within the cross constellation. Easter is the equinox when the day becomes longer than night when the sun regains strength bringing spring.Egypt took that story and changed the sun into Horus the sun god .Rome later change the Horus' story into Jesus the son of god.
@spaceshipidentified : The Dec. 25th date was picked by Rome, no one is claiming Jesus was actually born that date. Jesus lived in a time where there were contemporaneous reports of His life (in anthropological terms, something written within 50 years, about an event in ancient times IS CONTEMPORANEOUS). There is more evidence of Jesus than Socrates.
@ScottMacFie There is zero evidence Jesus ever existed all evidence you think you have was crafted by people to get them to come to their church and worship. The Dec 25 date is obviously right because you celebrate it every year. The cross you carry is a pagan symbol of the sun calendar passing the 12 constellations. Not a single historian before, during or after the fake time Jesus never mentioned him once. Your priests even admit the Adam and eve story is nonsense.
@spaceshipidentified : The Dec. 25 date is NOT the original date, but was a Roman date, the regular date had always been Jan 6/7, as still celebrated by Orthodox Christians (2,000 years old, called "Old Calendar"). Seriously, I mean this, you really are ignorant, and need to read up before commenting.
We know there was a mitochondrial Eve, just as their was creation Ex Nihilo, (Big Bang) as St. Augustine claimed over a thousand years ago.
@ScottMacFie Seeing as how I know there never was a Jesus I am sure the old calender was fabricated once the Christians found out India & the Myans both used Dec 25 to mark the winter solstec. On top of the fact the bible was stolen from stories all over the middle east.No way they fitted 2 of every animal on the ark.It is scientifically proven all these people with all this DNA difference could not of come from just Adam & Eve.I seen the aliens your lie does not explain that or anything at all.
How is there no higher name than the name of Jesus if the letter J was created around 500 years ago by the europeans. Please fact check with any search engine on the internet.
@goruu The ones who believe in Jesus r the ones who fight against their own lust, greed......then how come we r the incapable ones??? This shows that u havnt understood Jesus!!! if u dont believe in Jesus than what do u believe in??? Explain that to me goruu.!!!!
@HolyRaider707 There are many Pastor who sexually prey on young children, thats lust. If you have seen many Mega-churches, the pastor uses the donator's money to fund their huge nontaxable mansion, thats greed and selfish minds. Because Christians like you do not know your own bible, thats ignorance.
If you want proof of my claims, go ahead and ask for it.
@goruu hey goruu....u believe in somtin...i wanna knw abt it....this is leadin to a discussion..y dont u send in me ur proofs of ur claims at christuwarriors@gmail(dot)com....we'll chat thru mails.....i wod nvr say that ur wrong as far are pastors n christians are concerned...but in Jesus Christ u are....lemme knw wat u think bot tis...
Who is to say that the events of Horace are not just an egyptian interpretation of Jesus? and regardless, so what if the story overlaps? who is to say that all these other interpretations are just different and passed down descriptions of the same events. if anything this reinforces christian religion.
@galaxy5saskue In court, Witney claims John killed Gordon. But Paul claims Uehling killed Gordan. Mary claims Gordan didn't die, it was his sister that died.
So does the judge puts Britney to Jail because he has faith to god?
Or should the judge put Gordan to jail because there is solid evidence of his DNA, witness, objects to back it up?
@galaxy5saskue - "Who is to say that the events of Horace [you mean Horus] are not just an egyptian interpretation of Jesus?" - Well, the Egyptian artifacts (Pyramid texts, Book of the Dead, etc) came many many hundreds of years BEFORE Jesus. So how could it POSSIBLY be the other way around?
May God have mercy upon your soul.I do hope you repent, because the time is arriving and You will soon witness the real truth. Jesus said : "I AM THE WAY, THE TRUTH, AND THE LIFE. NONE SHALL COME TO THE FATHER IF NOT THROUGH ME." By the way no egyptian religion or anyother religion for that matter claim to have resurrected. And it is the Holy Spirit that fills us with the conviction that Jesus and all He said is true, like Jesus said the Holy Spirit gave testimony of Him.
Take a look at "Fooled by Religion 1/3" on my channel.
This story of Jesus is complete bull shit. It has simply survived because of this absurd book called the bible which turns weak people's minds into mush.
@54tumelo56 , Misinformation ? that is a good one. There is no book on the earth that has more misinformation in it than the bible. That is unless you actually believe in talking snakes, Adam and Even procreating and inbreeding to start the population, great floods save 2 of EVERY animal, talking bushes, destruction and murder in Sodom and Gomorrah and walking on water. No, no misinformation there.
@JesusWasAnAsshole That's not misinformation. There are no factual, historical objections to the things you listed, just like in this video where it deals with conspiracy theories instead of historical facts.
@galaxy5saskue , I hope to convene attention. I would like for intelligent people to realize that there is no god or jesus and that in fact, believing in such fairy tales is detrimental to society.
People need to make life decisions and suffer the consequences when they make bad ones. Do what is in you heart and be good to others . There is no magical invisible man waiting to reward or punish you
Since you used the word "incredioubly ", I am not including you in my target audience.
That is NOT the story scholars agree on, and in fact, Osiris (the brother of Isis) was said to be the father of Horus, who was known mostly as a "sky" god, not the "sun" god (as if sun/son in English means they meant that in ancient Egyptian). Horus was not baptized, did not walk on water, heal the blind, raise the dead. And assertions that he did are later biases of anti-Christian scholars. A swamp is NOTHING like a manger.
@ScottMacFie : rightly said scott. N if anyone wants proof about Jesus being real, jus look around, look at hte no. of christians.Many came in the name of the "Messiah", but only one prevailed.This was the really one. This was Our Lord Jesus Christ+++
@HolyRaider707 The amount of christians does not prove that Jesus is real. Thats absurd. There are many hindu's. Does this prove that Krishna is real? noooooo. Sorry but you gotta come up with better proof than that.
@ScottMacFie christians can lie to themselves as much as they need to. good reasoning on the other hand points to an evolution of religion. there are many simaralities with earlier gods and the christ myth. all it takes is a bit of critical thinking to find the truth in these myths. that last sentence just about sums up . lol. like stephen hawking said. science shall win.
@ScottMacFie dude.. your totally missing the point... the fact that there are any similarities is a testament to how freaking made up all these religions are. A complete man made fabrication. There should be NO comfort in some factual inaccuracies here and there. Virgin births, rising from the dead, floods, etc. can be dispersed among various religions before jesus' time and thats convincing enough to start thinking critically. Doesnt need to be spot on to evoke some skepticism.
@Johnf85 : No, the point is, when atheists point out all these "similar" stories, research reveals that they are either NOT similar at all, or were written AFTER the events of the OT (when considered "similar") or after the events of the NT Gospels, when considered similar. For example, there are almost NO similarities in the Mithras myth, until AFTER Christ lived, and even then, things like "both born in a cave" are argued...nowhere is Jesus claimed to have been born in a cave.
@ScottMacFie Bull I researched it well and I've seen the book of the dead.I also seen the Kane and able story on the wall of Carnac way before the bible.Ancient Sumerians 6,000 years ago had the 7 days of creation and the Noah’s ark story written in far better detail.The building the church originated with Zeus along with holy water and tiding or what ever it is called when you fools agree to give a set amount of money every pay check.The bible stole stories from every where making it a lie.
@ScottMacFie Except for the fact in all the history I have seen books and videos all say it was the sun god Horus. The sun is their one god only just like god is your one god only except Jesus his son or sun is excepted as god.One person can't be two face it like the Egyptians calling the sun god and also took the form as Horus a man that got his power from the sun.I saw the pic of the inscriptions Horus did get baptized,walked on water the sun setting over the ocean,healed the blind sunrise.
@spaceshipidentified : You DO realize, right, that the English words "Sun" and "Son" are not the same in ancient Egyptian, nor in Aramaic. There is nothing about Jesus being a "sun", and a significant amount of the Horus story has NO similarities to Jesus. That's like saying, "Save by the bell" is the SAME story as "Glee" because both involve kids, going to a school, oh, and a principal, and teachers. So they are the SAME show. Glee was OBVIOUSLY patterned off of Saved by the Bell.
@spaceshipidentified : You DO realize, right, that the English words "Sun" and "Son" are not the same in ancient Egyptian, nor in Aramaic. There is nothing about Jesus being a "sun", and a significant amount of the Horus story has NO similarities to Jesus. That's like saying, "Save by the bell" is the SAME story as "Glee" because both involve kids, going to a school, oh, and a principal, and teachers. So they are the SAME show. Glee was OBVIOUSLY patterned off of Saved by the Bell.
@ScottMacFie Jesus is a story that has the same pattern as the Horus story.The pagan story came before the Egypt story of Horus.It was about the sun only.The Egyptians are the ones that turned the sun into a man named Horus the sun god.Then in Rome they took the Horus sun god story and changed it to Jesus the sun of god.If you can't see that then you are nothing more than a lost brainwashed sheep like the rest of your sheeple.Go hide in your book and get out of our way this world is ours now.
@spaceshipidentified: It's like 100 years from now, saying GLEE is nothing but SAVED BY THE BELL, and GLEE never existed, but was taken from "ancient" shows liked SAVED BY THE BELL, the FACTS OF LIFE, and the COURTSHIP OF EDDIE'S FATHER...see ! ALL of them involve children, and have a "father" somewhere, or teens, or take place in LA...all these barely recognizable similarities, and stretching whatever POSSIBLE similarities there are as if they are major, then claim GLEE never existed.
@ScottMacFie I've never watched either of those shows.You are trying to jump off topic about the fact Jesus never existed.Jesus is just a retold story from Egypt where they changed the name from Horus to Jesus it is written in the book of the dead.The book of the dead is the original name of the bible because that is all that book brings is death worshipers.A bunch of Christian freaks that can't wait to die to get to a place that does not exist.The priest know you will be to dead to complain.
@ScottMacFie he was the sky god but his eyes represented the moon and the sun.so yeah sometimes he was refered as the sun. he lost an eye fighting seth (the left eye, the moon eye) and he also later combined himself with the SUN god becoming Ra-Harakhte (Horus of the two horizons) . anyway he had many names before that.. Haroeris (Horus the Elder) an early form of Horus (God of light), Horus Behudety In the form of Horus of Edfu, he represented the midday sun see where i'm going with this? ye
@RaitoDenki: Setting aside the contemporaneous accounts of Jesus (in anthropological terms), all these comparisons are EXTREMELY tenuous attempts by non-believers to draw similarities, and make what appear as slight "changes" in definitions to fit the alleged "pattern", so, as pointed out before, we get "he was born in a cave...get it !?! Just like Christ". Or so and so was crucified, only to find out he was shot by an arrow or something.
If Jesus is not real so what about those people who testified the existence of Jesus Christ. We know that there are records in history which can say that christians before were persecuted because of their faith. Some of them were killed because of defending their faith on Jesus. So what's the reason then? For sure it is because some of them have seen Jesus and witnessed his works that for them was worth dying for...
@EsterlitaLadeza7 - It was the Romans who invented "Jesus Christianity".
Titus Flavius (the good son) destroyed Jerusalem in 70 AD. Josephus Flavius wrote the history of this war, c75 AD.
The ministry of Jesus (Gospels) is based on the conquests of Titus (Jewish War). This means that Jesus Christ never actually existed. This explains a number of things, for example - Why Luke & Acts are dedicated to Sabinus Flavius, the uncle of Titus.
They back-dated Jesus to a generation before Titus.
If they were really the one who invented "Jesus Christianity". why they need to persecute Christians? The Persecution of Christians in the Roman Empire began during the Ministry of Jesus and continued intermittently over a period of about three centuries until the time of Constantine when Christianity was legalized. Shortly thereafter it became the state religion of the Roman Empire. See it was not the Romans.. when they have seen that christians were increasing in number and ..
The term “Christian” simply means a follower of a Christ – a leader claiming to have been foreseen by the Jews’ messianic prophecies. The word Kristos is Greek for the Hebrew word Messiah. So while the Romans did indeed persecute “Christians” in the way that history recorded, these were not “Roman Christians” but Jewish zealots.
The Romans stole their history and invented Jesus Christianity. You see? It was the Romans.
@changingmyself - I think he has read that book, the name evades me, about how all of history was made-up and there was no dark ages. It jumps from Roman Empire (c 500 AD) to the early Renissance (c 1200 AD).
That still doesn't explain why he thinks Rome doesn't exist.
Either way, he is wrong (understatement of the year).
then they realized that they couldn't stop it anymore so they decided to just accept Christianity since it became more powerful and they were afraid these people will be united to against them. That's why during the time of Constantine Christianity was legalized.
similarities is not enough for us to judge that Jesus is not real. for me the reason why there are plenty of similarities is this..we know that Egypt/Rome was a pagan country. When christianity was started the romans were threaten that lead them to persecute the christians. But inspite of all of these chirstianity became stronger so what did the roman do they legalized christianity for them, then they mixed christianity and paganism for them to unite the christians and pagans.
Ever been called up at 3 am because a demon was scratching words on a young Wikken girl's back. And after you arrived saw the scratches appear for 30 minutes on her right in front of your eyes after while batteries in the cameras of others around you died? I have. And God was the reason that it left. I have to say, I agree with a lot that is here, but not the religious aspect. I used to be an athiest but God has set me free. And He is coming back.
@mcordima Ya, the supernatural is definately real dispite what anybody says. My father had a few encounters with demons and I get goosebumps just listening to his stories.
@54tumelo56 Yes the supernatural is very real. Very Very real. I grew up in a house with ghosts or "demons" whatever you want to call them. Changed my worldview forever. I think Its time for our human race to start thinking outside the box a little bit. Arguing isnt gonna help anyone. Only frustration will result. Think about Jesus, eat some shrooms, smoke a little pot, go sit ouside in the forest. Let your soul speak to you. Call to God from within not out. Let your soul speak to you.disconect
Christianity (after Jesus) was created as a pagan alternative to combat and compete against the immorality of the Roman Empire. When the Roman Republic changed into the Roman Republic then corruption and immorality became the norm and this set this stage for the Christians under Paul to propogate a political & religious alternative. Christianity was/is a PROTEST movement which removed any evidence of the Jewish JESUS and replaced him with a paganized version of his life.
I agree with you on most of your points except it was also done (IMHO) to propagate white ethnocentrism since he was a man of color and to diminish his authority by changing his name which is not 'jesus". No where in the ancient text does this name appear. Paganism is a tool that the enemy uses to "muddy" the waters of the believer & it's everywhere we have to diligently weed it out & to seek YHWH's true words he gave to his ppl, not what has been handed down to man via the enemy!!
The Christian religion is NOT what Jesus taught or knew. After his natural death on Earth(which means He will never return) Paul and others created a "Gospel" to compete against the Roman Pagan system by adopting some of the pagan themes.The Roman pagan ideas of worship derive from ANCIENT EGYPT !!! Augustine's ppl years later were ignorant of many things and not knowing that all of christianity was created ouf duress and concealment of identity and barrowing to fight against immorality.
So here you are saying that the very 'bible" you are using as a resource to these truths is wrong? You mentioned that he died a natural death and will not return...so what about all of the people who saw and touched him after his ascension according to your bible how do you explain these events? What about Revelations where he is to return to the earth to "meet his people in the air"...all false? What "bible" are you reading from, do you consider yourself a Christian or not?
Proof of syncretism of Christianity to Pagan religions start here--->/watch?v=DNJ2RZJMG3k
Proof that Horus did have 12 disciples that he commissioned to do the work of his father, was born of the virgin Isis, and other Zeitgeist claims start here===> /watch?v=rdbgou-Jt-g
Zeitgeist debunked was debunked...with primary sources.
HOW THIS ZEITGEIST DOESNT BELIEVE WITH BAD AND GOOD TO BE JUDGED HERE AT THE LAST DAY? THE SPIRT SHOULD BE STRONG WHEN CHOSEN BY GOD...FOR ZEITGEIST NO WAR NO KILLINGS...HOW CAN A GOOD SPIRIT BE ASSOCIATED WITH THE EVIL ONE? THERE SHOULD BE A SEPARATION IN BETWEEN WEAK AND STRONG, THATS WHY WE ARE HERE IN THIS WORLD FOR A MERE TEST..AND THIS IS NOT A HEAVEN...GOD IS NOT UNFAIR OR MAN-MADE GOD FOR WHAT THIS MOVEMENT IS TRYING TO EMPHASIZE. WE SHOULD LEARN FROM OUR MISTAKE...BEWARE!!
If anyone wants to research this some more I would recommend "the Jesus mysteries" by tim freke an peter gandy.
Yep the true Christ has been kept from us, well most of us,Leonardo new who he/what it was and he also new the Vatican new! He had an inside man. Go research if your interested. The last supper:- is a knostic work
i know this is hard to understand but just because a majority of people believe something does NOT make it true. it doesnt matter how many raving lunatics write books about starwars and star trek... doesnt make them true either.. christians dont even know what they believe.. they dont read the bible they just scroll to the end and click i agree (like an internet service agreement)
@Bonanzanick "i know this is hard to understand but just because a majority of people believe something does NOT make it true"
Not difficult to understand. And your right. But take into account there are billions of people that testify to the existence of Christ. Is it possible for a made-up story to grow like this under persecution? I'd say no, not a chance.
Look at the mark Jesus left on history compared to Krishna, or Horus, or any other deity he is compared to and there is no comparison.
my lord 54tumelo56 your story is the one full of holes, nazareth,.. city jesus came from supposidly... wasnt even established till 30 years AFTER his death... but someone how it was a thriving city back then.. theres also dozens of historians around the time of crhist and save FOR ONE, which isnt even eyewitness testimony, none of them have ANY account of jesus. the jews kept records of all false messiah crucifixians... but they just left jesus out for fun?
"Well what we know about Roman Mithraism dates after the early Christian writings and really we don't know much."
Actually Mithraism pre-dates Christianity and both existed side-by-side in Rome for a number of years. In fact, some of the Christian churches are built on the ruins of Mithraic temples. Most of what we know comes from the early church fathers who complained that Mithraism had copied Christianity - IN ADVANCE, mind you.
"the bible does say that jesus taught in the synogogue as a child, and the teachers marvelled. "
That sounds very impressive until you know that by Jewish custom, children were not allowed into the inner sanctum where the priests gathered. The story is written by someone who was unfamiliar with Jewish customs and is impossible.
This claim is ridiculous. More books have been written about Jesus than any other person in history. Our system of time is based on His life. He is the founder of the largest and fastest growing religion in the world. Despite the extreme persecution of the early church, Christianity exploded and spread like wildfire. Nobody evened questioned His existence in writing until the 1800s. No rational person could say Jesus didn't exist. thruthem, take a world history class.
@54tumelo56 -More books have been written about Jesus than any other person in history.
True, BY BELIEVERS OF THE STORY, however, not one historian or writer of the time that Jesus was supposed to have lived wrote one single thing - unusual considering there were a good number of historians and the miracles of Jesus would certainly have been something novel to write about. Anything outside of the bible has been hearsay written many years later or forgeries.
@LoraSinger - Christianity didn't quite explode and NOT Jesus, but Paul was the founder of Christianity which didn't become remotely organized until 385 AD when it became the state religion under Theodosius.. Christianity then "exploded" as you say because it KILLED OFF any opponents. More have died at the hands of Christians than there were ever martyrs.
@LoraSinger 3) As a matter of fact, 54, if you read your bible a bit more closely, you will find that Jesus was a practicing Jew who upheld Torah and didn't preach to Gentiles but rather to the diaspora who were being hellinized under Roman rule. He directed his apostles to avoid gentile towns and had no interest in establishing a new religion. Paul, however, did, without ever meeting Jesus or ever studying under his apostles. He borrowed a bit of pagan stuff and made it up as he went.
@LoraSinger "if you read your bible a bit more closely, you will find that Jesus was a practicing Jew...and didn't preach to Gentiles...and had no interest in establishing a new religion" If YOU read the bible more closely then you would know that Jesus DID in fact end up preaching to Gentiles and that he was butting heads with the religious Jewish leaders all through the gospels. And of course Jesus had no interest in establishing a religion. God does not care for religions.
Jesus said, Go not into the way of the Gentiles.. (Matthew 10:5) …..but go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel (Matthew 15:24) , "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the nation of Israel.".
Of course he butted head with the religious leaders of that day. They were appointed by the Romans or did you even know that?
No Jesus did not establish a new religion because he was born, lived and died a JEW>
@54tumelo56 ' Jesus said, Go not into the way of the Gentiles.. (Matthew 10:5) …..but go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel (Matthew 15:24)
, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the nation of Israel."
Of course he butted heads with the Jewish religious leaders. They were all Roman appointed and that was the problem. The Jews, including Jesus, hated them because they were cooperating with the Romans. Try cracking open a history book.
@LoraSinger crack a history book? I think you should crack a world history book or an encyclopaedia, or better yet, crack the bible open, read the ENTIRE first four books and then come back and tell me he didn't preach to Gentiles instead of nitpicking 2 scriptures. And yes, Christians were under EXTREME persecution. Every disciple of Jesus died a martyr's death. Please tell me who would willingly give their life for a lie.
@54tumelo56 - And yes, Christians were under EXTREME persecution. Every disciple of Jesus died a martyr's death. Please tell me who would willingly give their life for a lie."
Jesus apostles were Jewish and believed Jesus to be the fully human messiah predicted for the Jews. The so-called "martyrs" deaths are church tradition ONLY. Those who give their life willingly for a cause are those who are so brainwashed that they believe in the cause, whether it is right or wrong.
@LoraSinger 2) In fact, Jesus apostles and those followers who remained were called Ebionites or Nazarenes and were killed by Romans and later hunted down and killed by the Roman Catholic church.
@LoraSinger forgive me, I meant every disciple died a martyr's death except for John who got banished. The disciples abandoned Jesus went he went to the cross and then nothing happened, no resurrection and suddenly you think they are willing to give there life for the gospel?? Peter denied Christ 3 times for fear of death. Then Peter boldly preached the gospel until they crucified him upside down. What changed him? I guess he was "brainwashed" by someone after they killed "his messiah" right?: /
@54tumelo56 - Everyone of Jesus disciples were practicing Jews, tume, including Peter. They were not Christians as you know them today. Jesus followers later were called Nazarenes or Ebionites. They expected a fully human messiah prophecied for the Jews. Jesus actual followers existed until around 400 AD when the Catholic Church (newly organized after being made the state religion in 385 under Theodosius) declared them heretics, hunted down and murdered them.
@LoraSinger 2) Actually, even in 70 AD, when Rome destroyed Jerusalem and the Jerusalem Church with it, many of Jesus followers fled to other areas.
Most of what you have written is purely church tradition including Peter having been the first pope. Unless, Catholics can acknowledge a Jewish pope, I find the story stretches the imagination by a fair bit. Paul was the first to develop Christianity as it is today.
There is a lot of material and most of it is pretty easy reading, not to mention interesting. Go to early christian doctrines and early christianity at the top.
@LoraSinger Why do you keep saying Peter was Jewish and that he believed in the messiah that was prophesied? Most of the Jews rejected Jesus. They expected an earthly king, not a lowly carpenter. Peter was Jewish and believed in the messiah when he denied Christ and abandoned him. People don't drastically change without cause. What do you suggest changed him if it wasn't seeing Christ resurrected?
@54tumelo56 Because Peter WAS Jewish. The Messiah prophecied for the Jews was to be fully human and there were tasks that he was to fulfill during his lifetime in order to be recognized as the true messiah. Jesus did not fulfil them and was therefore considered to be a false messiah. What do I think "changed him" ? I would be inclined to think that church tradition and falsifications of the church would play a large part.
@LoraSinger 2) Consider that Matthew 28:19 is a forgery. In the oldest copies of the bible, it reads "in my name" and not "in the name of the father, son and holy ghost". The last 12 chapters of Mark are also an add on as is the beginning of Matthew. There was a lot of forging going on in those days, it seems.
@LoraSinger "What do I think 'changed him'... church tradition and falsifications of the church..."
There was no "church tradition" or church at this time. Even so "Church tradition" DOES NOT change people that dramatically or quickly. HISTORIANS believe that the disciples DID see something to warrant there change in behavior. The only people that reject the existence of Christ are those who hate Christianity or those who have not done proper historical homework. Jesus did fulfilled the OT
@54tumelo56 - You forget that the bible was not compiled and named until the fourth century, when the editing was done by Chruch fathers. It is WRITTEN that this is what happened which doesn't make it necessarily so. I have no hatred for Christianity but I do believe that Christians who have not studied the history involved with it, accept church tradidtions without question. The Jewish bible (not quite like your OT) makes no mention of Jesus.
@LoraSinger Also notice that it was women who discovered Jesus' empty tomb. Women weren't even credible witnesses in that day. If the gospel writers were just gonna make this up then using women to discover the resurrection would not have helped there case. They would have had men discover the tomb for credibility.
@54tumelo56 -"notice that it was women who discovered Jesus' empty tomb. ...."
Mark was first text written and the others which followed were based on the previous ones. Notice that the story became bigger and bigger with time. Mark was written 30 years after the fact and the last gospel, that of John almost 80 years later. The average lifespan of that time was about 40 years so it's doubtful that any of them were doing anything but passing on oral legends they had heard.
I have read the entire four books. I was particularly taken with the description of the findings after Jesus death. As just a little exercise, compare who first came the next morning, what time they came, who was there, what they found. Enjoy the contradictions, tume.
More died at the hands of Christians than there ever were marytrs, tume. Christians were eventually thrown right out of Rome for their trouble making.
It seems that you are quite able to quote scriptures to uphold what you are saying. Aren't these supposed to be the actual words of Jesus and if they are, why do you deny them, except because they don't support your stance?
@LoraSinger "not one historian...wrote one single thing" Jesus was a commoner! A carpenter! He didn't lead a rebellion or hold an office or anything of the sort, yet atheists expect historical records to be filled with writings about him. He stayed in the background until he was 30 years old and died at age 33. That's 3 short years. Even so this video names 3 historians and does a weak job of discrediting them.Also most historians believe Josephus DID originally write something about Jesus
@54tumelo56 -That is why common people rather than historians wrote about.....
Really??? Then you are aware that the writers of the gospels are anonlymous and that the names, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John were given to the texts when the bible was compiled in the fourth century? Did you also know that Matthew 28:19 is a forgery, added after the Council of Nicea, or that the last 12 chapters of Mark are non-existant in the oldest copies of the bible?
@LoraSinger Every disciple of died a martyr's death. Please tell me who would willingly give there life for a lie? Matthew, mark, luke, and john were named after the people that were believed to have written them. Matthew, the tax-collector and disciple of Jesus, Mark, John Mark an associate of Peter, Luke the physician, and John the beloved disciple. And I don't know what you've read, but Josephus didn't describe what you just did, neither did tacitus who were both within 100 yrs of Jesus' life
@54tumelo56 Matthew, mark, luke, and john were named after the people that were believed to have written them. "
BELIEVED is the bottom line. The actual writers were anonymous. In fact there were dozens of texts that were destroyed and not admitted into the bible when it was compiled. Four was chosen because of the four directions, four winds etc. and such logical reasons. Josephus mentions of Jesus were never used before the fourth century and the forgeries are ascribed to Eusabius.
@LoraSinger The forgeries are irrelevant, I already told you that most historians believe he originally wrote something about Christ. The words of Josephus could have been changed, but they were NOT made up, which is what's important here.
As far as your "exercise", here's an exercise for you: Go pick a recent event that happened. Then pick 4 people that were there to tell you what happened. If the stories aren't EXACTLY the same would you assume the event never happened??
@54tumelo56 Forgeries are never irrelevant because they convey a falsification and Eusabius, one of the church fathers was known to "doctor" the books. Biblical scholars have alread established that Josephus mention of Jesus were either totally or partially forgeries. As I posted before, these were never used by any Christian apologist before the time of Eusabius.
You wrote, "here's an exercise for you....recent event....4 people."
Isn't the bible considered to be perfect and inerrant?
@LoraSinger "Biblical scholars have alread established that Josephus mention of Jesus were either totally or partially forgeries." A small minority of scholars reject Josephus' account entirely. A vast majority except it as authentic aside from a few words or phrases that could have been added.
"As I posted before, these were never used by any Christian apologist before the time of Eusabius." As I posted before. Nobody challenged the existed of Christ in writing until the 1800s
@54tumelo56 - I believe that the man existed, but only as a man, that the miracles were later additions which grew with oral tradition until finally being written to paper. I would expect that historians of his time did not write about him because there was nothing to write about. A yes, there were challenges against both the biblical scribes and the belief itself even in the beginning. In later years, as church power reached its peak, it was too dangerous to speak one's mind.
@LoraSinger 2) For instance, Minucius Felix (160-250 C.E) wrote:
"For in that you attribute to our religion the worship of a criminal and his cross, you wander far from the neighborhood of the truth, in thinking either that a criminal deserved, or that an earthly being was able, to be believed God...
@LoraSinger Some of the new testament is written as early as 48 A.D. That's not a terrible long time to establish oral traditions and exaggerations. It would be unprecedented in all of history for a lie to have spread as quickly as Christianity did under persecution. You say Paul was the founder of Christianity and made stuff up as he went. He was brutally beaten too many times to number, He received 39 lashes 5 times, beaten with rods 3 times, and stoned once. All for stuff he "made up"???
@54tumelo56 - There are two schools of thought, Generally conservative scholars like to bring the date up while mainstream historians give Mark the date of between 60 and 80 AD. The idea of a virgin birth, a man-god, vicarious atonement, human sacrifice (forbidden to Jews) had to come from somewhere and it didn't come from Judaism, therefore, it would seem probable that it came from somewhere like Rome where all of these were part of established pagan belief. Paul was a Roman citizen.
@54tumelo56 Isaiah 7:14 is a prophecy for King Ahaz. Read it in context then go down to 16 "Yea, before the child shall know to refuse the evil, and choose the good, the land whose two kings thou hast a horror of shall be forsaken. " Christian misinterpretation, tume. None of the prophecies in the Tanakh are for Jesus.
I doubt that Paul was beaten or whipped. To attack a Roman citizen carried a deah penalty and there is reason to believe, both from Josephus writings and from Acts....
@LoraSinger 2) that he was attached to the Herodian court . I would be inclined to think that Paul was attempting to gain sympathy and confessed that he wasn't above lying to achieve his goals.
@LoraSinger The prophesy had a dual meaning. It was used in Matthew to refer to Jesus. I don't think the heir to the throne of Ahaz was called "Immanuel", meaning "God with us"
"None of the prophecies in the Tanakh are for Jesus."
Isaiah 40:3;42:1-4;49:3 52:13-14;53:1-12;Psalm 22:8,14,16,18 None meant for Jesus? The New Testament is full of allusions to the OT prophesies.
Your conspiracy theory still has too many flaws. You believe Paul started Christianity even tho he persecuted Christians.
@54tumelo56 You missed the key line, tume " before the child shall know to refuse the evil, and choose the good, the land whose two kings thou hast a horror of shall be forsaken. " Of course the NT is full of allusions to the OT prophecies, it was written USING them. The Tanakh is not about Jesus, tume.
He was trying to quell rebellion. There WERE NIO Christians of the type there are today. There were only Jewish Christians who believed in a fully human "annointed" leader.
@54tumelo56 - I don't think the heir to the throne of Ahaz was called "Immanuel", meaning "God with us"
There is no mention of it being his heir. Quite simply the prophecy is made that the woman is to give birth to a boy and before he knows good from evil, Ahaz will have overcome the three kings who were in opposition to him.
@54tumelo56 -Isaiah 40:3;42:1-4;49:3 52:13-14;53:1-12;Psalm 22:8,14,16,18 None meant for Jesus? The New Testament is full of allusions to the OT prophesies.
Would you like to have the REAL interpretations sent to your mailbox? Since the OT is written by Jews, for Jews, in their own language and set in their own culture using idioms particular to them, I tend to go with their interpretations.
Don't belive this DISINFO! The Author Peter Joseph is part of the NEW AGE AGENDA! LOOK AT THE GEORGIAN GUIDE STONES!!
IlluminatiSckMyBallz 2 days ago
This video loses all credibility due to false information.
Look up the Debunked version.
JoshxNorris 2 weeks ago
@zmoney682 - See the work of the schools of history known collectively to be analyzing the "historical Jesus" Wikipedia has a decent article.
nickgilla 1 month ago
@nickgilla test
boblackey1 1 week ago
@nickgilla test. Why can't I post on this site? What bullshit this video is!
boblackey1 1 week ago
@nickgilla Google James Tabor, PhD and go to his BLOG for a much closer picture of the historical Jesus than this crap.
boblackey1 1 week ago
@nickgilla It is not true Josephus didn't write about Jesus. Dr. Gary Goldberg proves he did at his Josephus website. Also Alice Whealey, PhD does in her book "Josephus on Jesus" Josephus wrote the TF and the James the brother of Jesus passage. There is NO doubt about it.
boblackey1 1 week ago
@nickgilla WWWDOTJOSEPHUSDOTORG for Dr. Goldberg's fine Josephus website.
boblackey1 1 week ago
@nickgilla Hell even Joseph Atwill with his nutty idea Josephus conspired with Rome to fake Jesus and Christianity holds Josephus wrote the TF but JUST AS IT READS IN EXTANT COPIES TODAY. That is not true. Dr. Louis Feldman, Dr. Alice Whealey, Dr. Gary Goldberg etc have all shown that the original read "was believed to be the Christ" and not "was the Christ' Josephus was a traitor to the Jews but still a Jew who did NOT believe Jesus was the Christ. See Origen from second century!!
boblackey1 1 week ago
Is there a list of sources for this piece? I'm writing an essay on this premise.
zmoney682 3 months ago
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Zeitgeist APPEARS to have some "answers," but, being a student of Hebrew and Jewish lore, I noticed a ton of mistakes in its "pagan parallel" section. If the movie's creators are mistaken in the areas I'm familiar with, I'd have to conjecture that they are equally wrong elsewhere.
MojaveViper29 3 months ago
horus and egypt books are myth, all were invented by man in the 1200 to manipulate history and so you believed in a bunch of old dog faces man who build brick blocks, lol, nothing really existed, all grafitti, ald dead underground were moved there so to manipulate history, all is myth.
onlinecrimes 3 months ago
THE TRUE ACCEPT IT, I DONT BELIEVE IN EGYPT GRAFITTIES, HISTORIAN ARE GIVING INVENTED INTERPRETATIONS TO EGYPT BOOK AND GRAFFITIES, NO ONE KNOW THE MEANING OF THE EGYPTS GRAFFITI, GRAFITTIES WERE INVENTED SO YOU CAN BE MANIPULATED IN CERTAIN WAY, BECAUSE YOU STUPID HUMANS BELIEVED ALL STUPIDITY, EGYPTS NEVER EXISTED! ! ! THE JUST WERE CREATED IN THE 1200 AFTER CHRIST TO MANIPULATE HISTORY. ZEIGHEIST DO NOT EXIST !. PROVE IT, CAN'T BE PROOVEN.
onlinecrimes 3 months ago
Unmasking the Pagan Christ: An Evangelical Response to the Cosmic Christ Idea By Stanley E. Porter,
"The actual resurrection of Horus is described in this way:
Wake up, Horus, Thy protection is established, Make thou happy the heart of the mother Isis."
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself Horus for his mother Isis..."
"At the basic leven there are some similarities in the stories of Horus and Jesus. Both are divine men who die and return to life."
Stanley E. Porter President and Dean, Professor of New Testament
B.A. Point Loma College, San Diego, California
M.A. Claremont Graduate School, Claremont, California
M.A. Trinity Evangelical Divinity School, Deerfield, Illinois
Ph.D. University of Sheffield, England
changingmyself 3 months ago
Performed miracles
The Egyptian Book of the dead: translation and commentary, Volume 1 By Edouard Naville Page 3
"The raising up or the resurrection here spoken of is not only the soul but of the body of the deceased person..." Also listed above under magic.
Horus raised his 4 children from the dead.
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself I accept the fact that the egyptian book is an invented book to manipulate history, so you all dumbs believed in fake invented egyptian book and with ridiculous interpretation. lol.
onlinecrimes 3 months ago
@onlinecrimes An invented book? You have got to be joking.
changingmyself 3 months ago
'Smite ye the enemies of my father, and hurl ye them down into your pits because of that deadly evil which they have done against the Great One, [which] found (?) him that begot me. That which belongeth to you to do in the Tuat is to guard the pits of fire according as Ra hath commanded, and I set [this] before you so that, behold, ye may do according to what belongeth to you [to do].' This god standeth over (or, by) the pits."
changingmyself 3 months ago
Book of Gates Chapter 5
12 Gods behind the shrine
"Then saith Horus unto those gods who are behind the shrine:--
"Make inquisition for me, O gods who are in the following of Khenti Amenti, stand ye up, and withdraw ye not yourselves, and be ye masters over yourselves, and come, and live delicately on the bread of HU, and drink ye of the ale of Maat, and live ye upon that whereon my father liveth there.
changingmyself 3 months ago
12 disciples
The Pyramid Texts state that Horus DID have followers.
Utterances 453-486:
897a. "Thou causest the Followers of Horus to be satisfied."
921a. "The Followers of Horus purify N."
changingmyself 3 months ago
The Ancient Egyptian Pyramid Texts By R. O. Faulkner Page 7
Utterance 35
"Your purification is the purification of Horus...Seth, Thoth..."
changingmyself 3 months ago
Dictionary of Jesus and the Gospels - Page 55
Joel B. Green, Scot McKnight, I. Howard Marshall
"Water is the element naturally used for cleansing the body, and its symbolic use entered into almost every ... The ritual of washing was similar to baptism in its purifying implications"
Joel B. Green has been associate dean for the Center for Advanced Theological Studies since 2008 and professor of New Testament interpretation at Fuller Theological Seminary
changingmyself 3 months ago
The Ancient Egyptian Pyramid Texts By R. O. Faulkner Page 188 Pyramid Text 512
"Raise yourself, my father, recieve these your Four pleasant provision-jars
bathe in the Lake of Anubis (Anup), be cleansed in the Lake of the Netherworld."
changingmyself 3 months ago
Ancient Egyptian Religion: An Interpretation -Henri Frankfort - Page 113
"The followers of Horus purify Pepi, They bathe him, they dry him, They recite for him the Spell of the Right Way; They recite for him the Spell of Ascent. Pepi ascends to Heaven. He embarks in the boat of Re. Pepi commands for him"
changingmyself 3 months ago
Comment removed
EsterlitaLadeza7 4 months ago
As what this video said that religion could be the best tool to control the people. Rome who was the powerful ruler before decided to mix paganism and christianity. That's why some christians worship images even if the bible doesn't tell them so. If the bible was just originated from some of egyptians culture why does the bible tells us not to worship images while we know that egyptians before have images of their gods. We cannot relate the bible from some of the egyptians books, culture, etc..
EsterlitaLadeza7 4 months ago
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‘’The Christian religion is a parody on the worship of the sun, in which they put a man called Jesus Christ in the place of the sun, and pay him the adoration originally given to the sun.’’ USA Founding Father Thomas Pain
spaceshipidentified 4 months ago
Jesus is a story that has the same pattern as the Horus story.The pagan story came before the Egypt story of Horus.It was about the sun only.The Egyptians are the ones that turned the sun into a man named Horus the sun god.Then in Rome they took the Horus sun god story and changed it to Jesus the sun of god.If you can't see that then you are nothing more than a lost brainwashed sheep like the rest of your sheeple.Go hide in your book and get out of our way this world is ours now.
spaceshipidentified 4 months ago
The film is not anything new, look at the books of the Jews written over thousands of years.
BoutAvi 5 months ago
Jesus was born a Jew, died as a Jew, and there is evidence that accredited.
And all the other things such as: the Trinity, the Son of God, etc. They were influenced by Roman and Greek stories.
The film illustrates what the Jews always claimed that Jesus was a wise man but an ordinary person.
BoutAvi 5 months ago
@BoutAvi : The idea that the "Trinity" is a new creation is false. The WORD "Trinity" came into fasion in the last 1,000, but the Gospels, particularly St. John, are clear that there is the Father, the Son and the Comforter (Holy Spirit).
ScottMacFie 4 months ago
Every one seems to get there anwsers from the internet such good information you find on here????Why not ask God to come to you? Why be scared to get on your knees and ask Jesus to save you? Or is everyone to scared to know the truth. Instead of making videos like this so call proving that Jesus is fake ....the biggest trick the devil ever did was convice the world he does not exist. People should ask GOD to set them free OPEN my eyes lord let me see what is real!God answers he set me free.love
vanessaneto1 5 months ago
Today, if you want to get rich or attract attention, start a new religion.... or write a book against religion (Dawkins, Harris and Co.). As far as Chrisianity is concerned, thousands are being healed, and lives regenerated daily. Bless the Jesus myth !!!
ruffomaldito 5 months ago
This is total crap! Anybody with even a modicum of historical, religious knowledge will see straight through this! Wow. Some people will do anything to get attention..but when it comes at the expense of historical and religious facts..they have gone too far and ventured into the realm of lies!
Appleman165 6 months ago
@Appleman165
Then again, anyone with a modicum of religious knowledge won't be religious, so there you have it.
crackerkiller89 5 months ago
religion sucks, it gives no answers. science raises good points, and many eye brows, but to many times has science proven itself to be no more correct than religion. the only usefull science that exists is medical science, and science that will help make the world a better place, to bad all of the scientists arent spiritual, because they lack the heart of gold jesus supposedly had. our worlds fucked up, religions fucked it up, and science is to heartless to fix it
superXdude420 7 months ago
Evidence, logic and reason WILL PREVAIL. Humans continue to evolve. While the magic of thousands of religions was useful---even selected biologically---through human history, we now have SCIENCE. Let's hope that someday soon, the Vatican will become The Museum of European Christianity! and Mecca will become Disney's Islamic Park!
BrentGrainger2000 7 months ago
Jesus is real. Even His enemies, unbeliever Jews' , believed that Jesus did perform all the miracles, but they didn't believe that He was the Son of God. And you know, Jesus Christ is my GOD and my Savior.
SahidApartemen 7 months ago
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everyone please come to my channel
we must praise to our lord and savior
even if you don't subscribe at least take a look inside, please and thank you for your time
elmersglue82 8 months ago
Awesome I have already been making DVDs & handing this video out for free with the end of Bill Mahrs Religulous added to the end and people are loving it.We have the religious by the balls & after 2,000 years of their repression we are not going to let go.It is our turn to make fun of the religious so bad that they burn their own bible & tear down their own churches out of embarrassment.If you're tired of this blind rule it is time to stand our time is now.Give the religious the facts they need.
spaceshipidentified 8 months ago
@spaceshipidentified Have you ever ask God for a sign that he is real? U seem to think you know about all these relgions but i can tell you have never read the bible, Why have so much anger in you heart? Tear down the churches why does it even bother you if people believe? They help others? they do good things and live happy lifes . Dare to ask and you will be surprised what u will get. I will pray that Jesus set you free and may you bring glory unto the kindom of jesus christ AMEN.
vanessaneto1 5 months ago
@vanessaneto1 Your wrong my parents sent me to church for years and everything in that book sounds wrong.Even as a kid I could tell it bull crap so what is your problem.I know you were born gullible and the religion is now playing you.Religion is an elaborate lie and I don't need it to see when someone needs my help.You by laying claim to that book you are admitting you can't be good with out it.You can't help someone or be nice with out a book telling you so.
spaceshipidentified 5 months ago
@vanessaneto1 Did you not watch the video Jesus never existed I'll recap.The pagans made a story about the sun passing past the stars in the sky.The shortening of the days until it hits the winter solstes Dec 25 when the sun lays within the cross constellation. Easter is the equinox when the day becomes longer than night when the sun regains strength bringing spring.Egypt took that story and changed the sun into Horus the sun god .Rome later change the Horus' story into Jesus the son of god.
spaceshipidentified 5 months ago
@spaceshipidentified : The Dec. 25th date was picked by Rome, no one is claiming Jesus was actually born that date. Jesus lived in a time where there were contemporaneous reports of His life (in anthropological terms, something written within 50 years, about an event in ancient times IS CONTEMPORANEOUS). There is more evidence of Jesus than Socrates.
ScottMacFie 4 months ago
@ScottMacFie There is zero evidence Jesus ever existed all evidence you think you have was crafted by people to get them to come to their church and worship. The Dec 25 date is obviously right because you celebrate it every year. The cross you carry is a pagan symbol of the sun calendar passing the 12 constellations. Not a single historian before, during or after the fake time Jesus never mentioned him once. Your priests even admit the Adam and eve story is nonsense.
spaceshipidentified 4 months ago
@spaceshipidentified : The Dec. 25 date is NOT the original date, but was a Roman date, the regular date had always been Jan 6/7, as still celebrated by Orthodox Christians (2,000 years old, called "Old Calendar"). Seriously, I mean this, you really are ignorant, and need to read up before commenting.
We know there was a mitochondrial Eve, just as their was creation Ex Nihilo, (Big Bang) as St. Augustine claimed over a thousand years ago.
ScottMacFie 4 months ago
@ScottMacFie Seeing as how I know there never was a Jesus I am sure the old calender was fabricated once the Christians found out India & the Myans both used Dec 25 to mark the winter solstec. On top of the fact the bible was stolen from stories all over the middle east.No way they fitted 2 of every animal on the ark.It is scientifically proven all these people with all this DNA difference could not of come from just Adam & Eve.I seen the aliens your lie does not explain that or anything at all.
spaceshipidentified 4 months ago
Did you know an anagram of Christ is ST RICH
Iancrockert 8 months ago
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How is there no higher name than the name of Jesus if the letter J was created around 500 years ago by the europeans. Please fact check with any search engine on the internet.
34eeelive 9 months ago
god bless
poomanny 9 months ago
People who often do not believe in Jesus are people who r incapable of comming out of their lust ,greed and selfish minds....
HolyRaider707 9 months ago
@HolyRaider707 Funny how people who do accept 'Jesus' are incapable of coming out of their lust, greed, selfish minds, and ignorance.
goruu 9 months ago
@goruu The ones who believe in Jesus r the ones who fight against their own lust, greed......then how come we r the incapable ones??? This shows that u havnt understood Jesus!!! if u dont believe in Jesus than what do u believe in??? Explain that to me goruu.!!!!
HolyRaider707 9 months ago
@HolyRaider707 There are many Pastor who sexually prey on young children, thats lust. If you have seen many Mega-churches, the pastor uses the donator's money to fund their huge nontaxable mansion, thats greed and selfish minds. Because Christians like you do not know your own bible, thats ignorance.
If you want proof of my claims, go ahead and ask for it.
goruu 9 months ago
@goruu hey goruu....u believe in somtin...i wanna knw abt it....this is leadin to a discussion..y dont u send in me ur proofs of ur claims at christuwarriors@gmail(dot)com....we'll chat thru mails.....i wod nvr say that ur wrong as far are pastors n christians are concerned...but in Jesus Christ u are....lemme knw wat u think bot tis...
HolyRaider707 9 months ago
@HolyRaider707 I don't use Email anymore.
goruu 9 months ago
Who is to say that the events of Horace are not just an egyptian interpretation of Jesus? and regardless, so what if the story overlaps? who is to say that all these other interpretations are just different and passed down descriptions of the same events. if anything this reinforces christian religion.
galaxy5saskue 9 months ago
@galaxy5saskue In court, Witney claims John killed Gordon. But Paul claims Uehling killed Gordan. Mary claims Gordan didn't die, it was his sister that died.
So does the judge puts Britney to Jail because he has faith to god?
Or should the judge put Gordan to jail because there is solid evidence of his DNA, witness, objects to back it up?
It reinforces Christian's ignorance.
goruu 9 months ago
@galaxy5saskue - "Who is to say that the events of Horace [you mean Horus] are not just an egyptian interpretation of Jesus?" - Well, the Egyptian artifacts (Pyramid texts, Book of the Dead, etc) came many many hundreds of years BEFORE Jesus. So how could it POSSIBLY be the other way around?
gekritzl 3 months ago
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Jesus Christ is Lord of lords and King of kings. Keith Thompson debunked this garbage, do not believe it.
cashmny78 10 months ago
May God have mercy upon your soul.I do hope you repent, because the time is arriving and You will soon witness the real truth. Jesus said : "I AM THE WAY, THE TRUTH, AND THE LIFE. NONE SHALL COME TO THE FATHER IF NOT THROUGH ME." By the way no egyptian religion or anyother religion for that matter claim to have resurrected. And it is the Holy Spirit that fills us with the conviction that Jesus and all He said is true, like Jesus said the Holy Spirit gave testimony of Him.
CristoViveyViene 10 months ago
Take a look at "Fooled by Religion 1/3" on my channel.
This story of Jesus is complete bull shit. It has simply survived because of this absurd book called the bible which turns weak people's minds into mush.
JesusWasAnAsshole 10 months ago
@JesusWasAnAsshole Why would we watch your video, It has the same misinformation as this video does.
54tumelo56 10 months ago
@54tumelo56 , Misinformation ? that is a good one. There is no book on the earth that has more misinformation in it than the bible. That is unless you actually believe in talking snakes, Adam and Even procreating and inbreeding to start the population, great floods save 2 of EVERY animal, talking bushes, destruction and murder in Sodom and Gomorrah and walking on water. No, no misinformation there.
JesusWasAnAsshole 10 months ago 13
@JesusWasAnAsshole That's not misinformation. There are no factual, historical objections to the things you listed, just like in this video where it deals with conspiracy theories instead of historical facts.
54tumelo56 10 months ago
@JesusWasAnAsshole
Why is it you insist on debating your beliefs in incredioubly offensive ways? what do you hope to accomplish from adopting a name "Jesuswasanasshole"
galaxy5saskue 9 months ago
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@galaxy5saskue , I hope to convene attention. I would like for intelligent people to realize that there is no god or jesus and that in fact, believing in such fairy tales is detrimental to society.
People need to make life decisions and suffer the consequences when they make bad ones. Do what is in you heart and be good to others . There is no magical invisible man waiting to reward or punish you
Since you used the word "incredioubly ", I am not including you in my target audience.
JesusWasAnAsshole 9 months ago
That is NOT the story scholars agree on, and in fact, Osiris (the brother of Isis) was said to be the father of Horus, who was known mostly as a "sky" god, not the "sun" god (as if sun/son in English means they meant that in ancient Egyptian). Horus was not baptized, did not walk on water, heal the blind, raise the dead. And assertions that he did are later biases of anti-Christian scholars. A swamp is NOTHING like a manger.
ScottMacFie 1 year ago 12
@ScottMacFie : rightly said scott. N if anyone wants proof about Jesus being real, jus look around, look at hte no. of christians.Many came in the name of the "Messiah", but only one prevailed.This was the really one. This was Our Lord Jesus Christ+++
HolyRaider707 9 months ago
@HolyRaider707 The amount of christians does not prove that Jesus is real. Thats absurd. There are many hindu's. Does this prove that Krishna is real? noooooo. Sorry but you gotta come up with better proof than that.
Johnfrooshlover 8 months ago
@ScottMacFie christians can lie to themselves as much as they need to. good reasoning on the other hand points to an evolution of religion. there are many simaralities with earlier gods and the christ myth. all it takes is a bit of critical thinking to find the truth in these myths. that last sentence just about sums up . lol. like stephen hawking said. science shall win.
kram83au 7 months ago
@ScottMacFie dude.. your totally missing the point... the fact that there are any similarities is a testament to how freaking made up all these religions are. A complete man made fabrication. There should be NO comfort in some factual inaccuracies here and there. Virgin births, rising from the dead, floods, etc. can be dispersed among various religions before jesus' time and thats convincing enough to start thinking critically. Doesnt need to be spot on to evoke some skepticism.
Johnf85 4 months ago
@Johnf85 : No, the point is, when atheists point out all these "similar" stories, research reveals that they are either NOT similar at all, or were written AFTER the events of the OT (when considered "similar") or after the events of the NT Gospels, when considered similar. For example, there are almost NO similarities in the Mithras myth, until AFTER Christ lived, and even then, things like "both born in a cave" are argued...nowhere is Jesus claimed to have been born in a cave.
ScottMacFie 4 months ago
@ScottMacFie Bull I researched it well and I've seen the book of the dead.I also seen the Kane and able story on the wall of Carnac way before the bible.Ancient Sumerians 6,000 years ago had the 7 days of creation and the Noah’s ark story written in far better detail.The building the church originated with Zeus along with holy water and tiding or what ever it is called when you fools agree to give a set amount of money every pay check.The bible stole stories from every where making it a lie.
spaceshipidentified 4 months ago
@ScottMacFie Except for the fact in all the history I have seen books and videos all say it was the sun god Horus. The sun is their one god only just like god is your one god only except Jesus his son or sun is excepted as god.One person can't be two face it like the Egyptians calling the sun god and also took the form as Horus a man that got his power from the sun.I saw the pic of the inscriptions Horus did get baptized,walked on water the sun setting over the ocean,healed the blind sunrise.
spaceshipidentified 4 months ago
@spaceshipidentified : You DO realize, right, that the English words "Sun" and "Son" are not the same in ancient Egyptian, nor in Aramaic. There is nothing about Jesus being a "sun", and a significant amount of the Horus story has NO similarities to Jesus. That's like saying, "Save by the bell" is the SAME story as "Glee" because both involve kids, going to a school, oh, and a principal, and teachers. So they are the SAME show. Glee was OBVIOUSLY patterned off of Saved by the Bell.
ScottMacFie 4 months ago
@spaceshipidentified : You DO realize, right, that the English words "Sun" and "Son" are not the same in ancient Egyptian, nor in Aramaic. There is nothing about Jesus being a "sun", and a significant amount of the Horus story has NO similarities to Jesus. That's like saying, "Save by the bell" is the SAME story as "Glee" because both involve kids, going to a school, oh, and a principal, and teachers. So they are the SAME show. Glee was OBVIOUSLY patterned off of Saved by the Bell.
ScottMacFie 4 months ago
@ScottMacFie Jesus is a story that has the same pattern as the Horus story.The pagan story came before the Egypt story of Horus.It was about the sun only.The Egyptians are the ones that turned the sun into a man named Horus the sun god.Then in Rome they took the Horus sun god story and changed it to Jesus the sun of god.If you can't see that then you are nothing more than a lost brainwashed sheep like the rest of your sheeple.Go hide in your book and get out of our way this world is ours now.
spaceshipidentified 4 months ago
@spaceshipidentified: It's like 100 years from now, saying GLEE is nothing but SAVED BY THE BELL, and GLEE never existed, but was taken from "ancient" shows liked SAVED BY THE BELL, the FACTS OF LIFE, and the COURTSHIP OF EDDIE'S FATHER...see ! ALL of them involve children, and have a "father" somewhere, or teens, or take place in LA...all these barely recognizable similarities, and stretching whatever POSSIBLE similarities there are as if they are major, then claim GLEE never existed.
ScottMacFie 4 months ago
@ScottMacFie I've never watched either of those shows.You are trying to jump off topic about the fact Jesus never existed.Jesus is just a retold story from Egypt where they changed the name from Horus to Jesus it is written in the book of the dead.The book of the dead is the original name of the bible because that is all that book brings is death worshipers.A bunch of Christian freaks that can't wait to die to get to a place that does not exist.The priest know you will be to dead to complain.
spaceshipidentified 4 months ago
@ScottMacFie he was the sky god but his eyes represented the moon and the sun.so yeah sometimes he was refered as the sun. he lost an eye fighting seth (the left eye, the moon eye) and he also later combined himself with the SUN god becoming Ra-Harakhte (Horus of the two horizons) . anyway he had many names before that.. Haroeris (Horus the Elder) an early form of Horus (God of light), Horus Behudety In the form of Horus of Edfu, he represented the midday sun see where i'm going with this? ye
RaitoDenki 4 months ago
@RaitoDenki: Setting aside the contemporaneous accounts of Jesus (in anthropological terms), all these comparisons are EXTREMELY tenuous attempts by non-believers to draw similarities, and make what appear as slight "changes" in definitions to fit the alleged "pattern", so, as pointed out before, we get "he was born in a cave...get it !?! Just like Christ". Or so and so was crucified, only to find out he was shot by an arrow or something.
ScottMacFie 4 months ago
@ScottMacFie well want it or not there are plenty of similarities.
RaitoDenki 4 months ago
If Jesus is not real so what about those people who testified the existence of Jesus Christ. We know that there are records in history which can say that christians before were persecuted because of their faith. Some of them were killed because of defending their faith on Jesus. So what's the reason then? For sure it is because some of them have seen Jesus and witnessed his works that for them was worth dying for...
EsterlitaLadeza7 4 months ago
@EsterlitaLadeza7 - It was the Romans who invented "Jesus Christianity".
Titus Flavius (the good son) destroyed Jerusalem in 70 AD. Josephus Flavius wrote the history of this war, c75 AD.
The ministry of Jesus (Gospels) is based on the conquests of Titus (Jewish War). This means that Jesus Christ never actually existed. This explains a number of things, for example - Why Luke & Acts are dedicated to Sabinus Flavius, the uncle of Titus.
They back-dated Jesus to a generation before Titus.
Franknarfable 4 months ago
If they were really the one who invented "Jesus Christianity". why they need to persecute Christians? The Persecution of Christians in the Roman Empire began during the Ministry of Jesus and continued intermittently over a period of about three centuries until the time of Constantine when Christianity was legalized. Shortly thereafter it became the state religion of the Roman Empire. See it was not the Romans.. when they have seen that christians were increasing in number and ..
EsterlitaLadeza7 3 months ago
@EsterlitaLadeza7 - I see what you're saying, but that not correct.
The term “Christian” simply means a follower of a Christ – a leader claiming to have been foreseen by the Jews’ messianic prophecies. The word Kristos is Greek for the Hebrew word Messiah. So while the Romans did indeed persecute “Christians” in the way that history recorded, these were not “Roman Christians” but Jewish zealots.
The Romans stole their history and invented Jesus Christianity. You see? It was the Romans.
Franknarfable 3 months ago
THE ROMANS NEVER EXISTED ,
onlinecrimes 3 months ago
@onlinecrimes - What on earth have you been reading? You think the Romans never existed? Really?
Franknarfable 3 months ago
@Franknarfable He is obviously retarded.
changingmyself 3 months ago
@changingmyself - I think he has read that book, the name evades me, about how all of history was made-up and there was no dark ages. It jumps from Roman Empire (c 500 AD) to the early Renissance (c 1200 AD).
That still doesn't explain why he thinks Rome doesn't exist.
Either way, he is wrong (understatement of the year).
Franknarfable 3 months ago
then they realized that they couldn't stop it anymore so they decided to just accept Christianity since it became more powerful and they were afraid these people will be united to against them. That's why during the time of Constantine Christianity was legalized.
EsterlitaLadeza7 3 months ago
similarities is not enough for us to judge that Jesus is not real. for me the reason why there are plenty of similarities is this..we know that Egypt/Rome was a pagan country. When christianity was started the romans were threaten that lead them to persecute the christians. But inspite of all of these chirstianity became stronger so what did the roman do they legalized christianity for them, then they mixed christianity and paganism for them to unite the christians and pagans.
EsterlitaLadeza7 4 months ago
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@ScottMacFie well want it or not there are plenty of similarities.
RaitoDenki 4 months ago
new age
eagletalons2007 1 year ago
Everyone realizes how absurd this is right...?
He totally warps everything, even to the point of making stuff up out of thin air.
For example:
jofwu1 1 year ago
Ever been called up at 3 am because a demon was scratching words on a young Wikken girl's back. And after you arrived saw the scratches appear for 30 minutes on her right in front of your eyes after while batteries in the cameras of others around you died? I have. And God was the reason that it left. I have to say, I agree with a lot that is here, but not the religious aspect. I used to be an athiest but God has set me free. And He is coming back.
mcordima 1 year ago
@mcordima Ya, the supernatural is definately real dispite what anybody says. My father had a few encounters with demons and I get goosebumps just listening to his stories.
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 Yes the supernatural is very real. Very Very real. I grew up in a house with ghosts or "demons" whatever you want to call them. Changed my worldview forever. I think Its time for our human race to start thinking outside the box a little bit. Arguing isnt gonna help anyone. Only frustration will result. Think about Jesus, eat some shrooms, smoke a little pot, go sit ouside in the forest. Let your soul speak to you. Call to God from within not out. Let your soul speak to you.disconect
HiGhLiKeAlLaDin 4 months ago
@mcordima LOL. Sure, "god" only revealed himself in such a way ONLY to you. I bet.
TheOrcasRule 11 months ago
@mcordima , that is absolutely impossible and the non mind-melted-into-mush people on this site realize this.
How old was this young wikken girl ? She was either accosted or part of a prank. You, were the mark.
JesusWasAnAsshole 10 months ago
Christianity (after Jesus) was created as a pagan alternative to combat and compete against the immorality of the Roman Empire. When the Roman Republic changed into the Roman Republic then corruption and immorality became the norm and this set this stage for the Christians under Paul to propogate a political & religious alternative. Christianity was/is a PROTEST movement which removed any evidence of the Jewish JESUS and replaced him with a paganized version of his life.
cris750 1 year ago
@cris750
I agree with you on most of your points except it was also done (IMHO) to propagate white ethnocentrism since he was a man of color and to diminish his authority by changing his name which is not 'jesus". No where in the ancient text does this name appear. Paganism is a tool that the enemy uses to "muddy" the waters of the believer & it's everywhere we have to diligently weed it out & to seek YHWH's true words he gave to his ppl, not what has been handed down to man via the enemy!!
young1s4u4 1 year ago
The Christian religion is NOT what Jesus taught or knew. After his natural death on Earth(which means He will never return) Paul and others created a "Gospel" to compete against the Roman Pagan system by adopting some of the pagan themes.The Roman pagan ideas of worship derive from ANCIENT EGYPT !!! Augustine's ppl years later were ignorant of many things and not knowing that all of christianity was created ouf duress and concealment of identity and barrowing to fight against immorality.
cris750 1 year ago
@cris750
So here you are saying that the very 'bible" you are using as a resource to these truths is wrong? You mentioned that he died a natural death and will not return...so what about all of the people who saw and touched him after his ascension according to your bible how do you explain these events? What about Revelations where he is to return to the earth to "meet his people in the air"...all false? What "bible" are you reading from, do you consider yourself a Christian or not?
young1s4u4 1 year ago
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Proof of syncretism of Christianity to Pagan religions start here--->/watch?v=DNJ2RZJMG3k
Proof that Horus did have 12 disciples that he commissioned to do the work of his father, was born of the virgin Isis, and other Zeitgeist claims start here===> /watch?v=rdbgou-Jt-g
Zeitgeist debunked was debunked...with primary sources.
changingmyself 1 year ago
forgot to mention the influence of Persians on Christianity!
juanchisgomez 1 year ago
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HOW THIS ZEITGEIST DOESNT BELIEVE WITH BAD AND GOOD TO BE JUDGED HERE AT THE LAST DAY? THE SPIRT SHOULD BE STRONG WHEN CHOSEN BY GOD...FOR ZEITGEIST NO WAR NO KILLINGS...HOW CAN A GOOD SPIRIT BE ASSOCIATED WITH THE EVIL ONE? THERE SHOULD BE A SEPARATION IN BETWEEN WEAK AND STRONG, THATS WHY WE ARE HERE IN THIS WORLD FOR A MERE TEST..AND THIS IS NOT A HEAVEN...GOD IS NOT UNFAIR OR MAN-MADE GOD FOR WHAT THIS MOVEMENT IS TRYING TO EMPHASIZE. WE SHOULD LEARN FROM OUR MISTAKE...BEWARE!!
KelvongKlein 1 year ago
true true true. thank you . and its transform to a terrorism. when somebody start talk about 911?? and control demolition.........
kresowaty 1 year ago
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God does exist.
SummerSunshine1988 1 year ago
Very well put together film!
If anyone wants to research this some more I would recommend "the Jesus mysteries" by tim freke an peter gandy.
Yep the true Christ has been kept from us, well most of us,Leonardo new who he/what it was and he also new the Vatican new! He had an inside man. Go research if your interested. The last supper:- is a knostic work
Jesusizjdoe 1 year ago
stop commenting these arguments about whos right and wrong beleive what you want to belive this video is just showing you the truth nothing else ;)
natho369 1 year ago
i know this is hard to understand but just because a majority of people believe something does NOT make it true. it doesnt matter how many raving lunatics write books about starwars and star trek... doesnt make them true either.. christians dont even know what they believe.. they dont read the bible they just scroll to the end and click i agree (like an internet service agreement)
Bonanzanick 1 year ago
@Bonanzanick "i know this is hard to understand but just because a majority of people believe something does NOT make it true"
Not difficult to understand. And your right. But take into account there are billions of people that testify to the existence of Christ. Is it possible for a made-up story to grow like this under persecution? I'd say no, not a chance.
Look at the mark Jesus left on history compared to Krishna, or Horus, or any other deity he is compared to and there is no comparison.
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 ...Because Jesus actually existed. Krishna and Horus did not.
54tumelo56 1 year ago
my lord 54tumelo56 your story is the one full of holes, nazareth,.. city jesus came from supposidly... wasnt even established till 30 years AFTER his death... but someone how it was a thriving city back then.. theres also dozens of historians around the time of crhist and save FOR ONE, which isnt even eyewitness testimony, none of them have ANY account of jesus. the jews kept records of all false messiah crucifixians... but they just left jesus out for fun?
Bonanzanick 1 year ago
Herstori has been TamPered with , by the Devil Masuns.
july95211 1 year ago
childrens get brainwashed in da schools with religions!
kebabmaxdu 1 year ago
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"Well what we know about Roman Mithraism dates after the early Christian writings and really we don't know much."
Actually Mithraism pre-dates Christianity and both existed side-by-side in Rome for a number of years. In fact, some of the Christian churches are built on the ruins of Mithraic temples. Most of what we know comes from the early church fathers who complained that Mithraism had copied Christianity - IN ADVANCE, mind you.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
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"the bible does say that jesus taught in the synogogue as a child, and the teachers marvelled. "
That sounds very impressive until you know that by Jewish custom, children were not allowed into the inner sanctum where the priests gathered. The story is written by someone who was unfamiliar with Jewish customs and is impossible.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
This claim is ridiculous. More books have been written about Jesus than any other person in history. Our system of time is based on His life. He is the founder of the largest and fastest growing religion in the world. Despite the extreme persecution of the early church, Christianity exploded and spread like wildfire. Nobody evened questioned His existence in writing until the 1800s. No rational person could say Jesus didn't exist. thruthem, take a world history class.
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 Of the bearded impostors, only Mohammed actually existed. (Joseph Smith shaved)
thruthem 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 -More books have been written about Jesus than any other person in history.
True, BY BELIEVERS OF THE STORY, however, not one historian or writer of the time that Jesus was supposed to have lived wrote one single thing - unusual considering there were a good number of historians and the miracles of Jesus would certainly have been something novel to write about. Anything outside of the bible has been hearsay written many years later or forgeries.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger - Christianity didn't quite explode and NOT Jesus, but Paul was the founder of Christianity which didn't become remotely organized until 385 AD when it became the state religion under Theodosius.. Christianity then "exploded" as you say because it KILLED OFF any opponents. More have died at the hands of Christians than there were ever martyrs.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger 3) As a matter of fact, 54, if you read your bible a bit more closely, you will find that Jesus was a practicing Jew who upheld Torah and didn't preach to Gentiles but rather to the diaspora who were being hellinized under Roman rule. He directed his apostles to avoid gentile towns and had no interest in establishing a new religion. Paul, however, did, without ever meeting Jesus or ever studying under his apostles. He borrowed a bit of pagan stuff and made it up as he went.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger "if you read your bible a bit more closely, you will find that Jesus was a practicing Jew...and didn't preach to Gentiles...and had no interest in establishing a new religion" If YOU read the bible more closely then you would know that Jesus DID in fact end up preaching to Gentiles and that he was butting heads with the religious Jewish leaders all through the gospels. And of course Jesus had no interest in establishing a religion. God does not care for religions.
54tumelo56 1 year ago
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@54tumelo56 - "Jesus did preach to gentiles"
Jesus said, Go not into the way of the Gentiles.. (Matthew 10:5) …..but go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel (Matthew 15:24) , "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the nation of Israel.".
Of course he butted head with the religious leaders of that day. They were appointed by the Romans or did you even know that?
No Jesus did not establish a new religion because he was born, lived and died a JEW>
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 ' Jesus said, Go not into the way of the Gentiles.. (Matthew 10:5) …..but go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel (Matthew 15:24)
, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the nation of Israel."
Of course he butted heads with the Jewish religious leaders. They were all Roman appointed and that was the problem. The Jews, including Jesus, hated them because they were cooperating with the Romans. Try cracking open a history book.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger crack a history book? I think you should crack a world history book or an encyclopaedia, or better yet, crack the bible open, read the ENTIRE first four books and then come back and tell me he didn't preach to Gentiles instead of nitpicking 2 scriptures. And yes, Christians were under EXTREME persecution. Every disciple of Jesus died a martyr's death. Please tell me who would willingly give their life for a lie.
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 - And yes, Christians were under EXTREME persecution. Every disciple of Jesus died a martyr's death. Please tell me who would willingly give their life for a lie."
Jesus apostles were Jewish and believed Jesus to be the fully human messiah predicted for the Jews. The so-called "martyrs" deaths are church tradition ONLY. Those who give their life willingly for a cause are those who are so brainwashed that they believe in the cause, whether it is right or wrong.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger 2) In fact, Jesus apostles and those followers who remained were called Ebionites or Nazarenes and were killed by Romans and later hunted down and killed by the Roman Catholic church.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger forgive me, I meant every disciple died a martyr's death except for John who got banished. The disciples abandoned Jesus went he went to the cross and then nothing happened, no resurrection and suddenly you think they are willing to give there life for the gospel?? Peter denied Christ 3 times for fear of death. Then Peter boldly preached the gospel until they crucified him upside down. What changed him? I guess he was "brainwashed" by someone after they killed "his messiah" right?: /
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 - Everyone of Jesus disciples were practicing Jews, tume, including Peter. They were not Christians as you know them today. Jesus followers later were called Nazarenes or Ebionites. They expected a fully human messiah prophecied for the Jews. Jesus actual followers existed until around 400 AD when the Catholic Church (newly organized after being made the state religion in 385 under Theodosius) declared them heretics, hunted down and murdered them.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger 2) Actually, even in 70 AD, when Rome destroyed Jerusalem and the Jerusalem Church with it, many of Jesus followers fled to other areas.
Most of what you have written is purely church tradition including Peter having been the first pope. Unless, Catholics can acknowledge a Jewish pope, I find the story stretches the imagination by a fair bit. Paul was the first to develop Christianity as it is today.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger 3) Tume, try reading: thestoryofchristianityDOTcom.
There is a lot of material and most of it is pretty easy reading, not to mention interesting. Go to early christian doctrines and early christianity at the top.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger Why do you keep saying Peter was Jewish and that he believed in the messiah that was prophesied? Most of the Jews rejected Jesus. They expected an earthly king, not a lowly carpenter. Peter was Jewish and believed in the messiah when he denied Christ and abandoned him. People don't drastically change without cause. What do you suggest changed him if it wasn't seeing Christ resurrected?
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 Because Peter WAS Jewish. The Messiah prophecied for the Jews was to be fully human and there were tasks that he was to fulfill during his lifetime in order to be recognized as the true messiah. Jesus did not fulfil them and was therefore considered to be a false messiah. What do I think "changed him" ? I would be inclined to think that church tradition and falsifications of the church would play a large part.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger 2) Consider that Matthew 28:19 is a forgery. In the oldest copies of the bible, it reads "in my name" and not "in the name of the father, son and holy ghost". The last 12 chapters of Mark are also an add on as is the beginning of Matthew. There was a lot of forging going on in those days, it seems.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger "What do I think 'changed him'... church tradition and falsifications of the church..."
There was no "church tradition" or church at this time. Even so "Church tradition" DOES NOT change people that dramatically or quickly. HISTORIANS believe that the disciples DID see something to warrant there change in behavior. The only people that reject the existence of Christ are those who hate Christianity or those who have not done proper historical homework. Jesus did fulfilled the OT
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 - You forget that the bible was not compiled and named until the fourth century, when the editing was done by Chruch fathers. It is WRITTEN that this is what happened which doesn't make it necessarily so. I have no hatred for Christianity but I do believe that Christians who have not studied the history involved with it, accept church tradidtions without question. The Jewish bible (not quite like your OT) makes no mention of Jesus.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger Also notice that it was women who discovered Jesus' empty tomb. Women weren't even credible witnesses in that day. If the gospel writers were just gonna make this up then using women to discover the resurrection would not have helped there case. They would have had men discover the tomb for credibility.
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 -"notice that it was women who discovered Jesus' empty tomb. ...."
Mark was first text written and the others which followed were based on the previous ones. Notice that the story became bigger and bigger with time. Mark was written 30 years after the fact and the last gospel, that of John almost 80 years later. The average lifespan of that time was about 40 years so it's doubtful that any of them were doing anything but passing on oral legends they had heard.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 -read the ENTIRE first four books "
I have read the entire four books. I was particularly taken with the description of the findings after Jesus death. As just a little exercise, compare who first came the next morning, what time they came, who was there, what they found. Enjoy the contradictions, tume.
More died at the hands of Christians than there ever were marytrs, tume. Christians were eventually thrown right out of Rome for their trouble making.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 of nitpicking 2 scriptures. "
It seems that you are quite able to quote scriptures to uphold what you are saying. Aren't these supposed to be the actual words of Jesus and if they are, why do you deny them, except because they don't support your stance?
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger "not one historian...wrote one single thing" Jesus was a commoner! A carpenter! He didn't lead a rebellion or hold an office or anything of the sort, yet atheists expect historical records to be filled with writings about him. He stayed in the background until he was 30 years old and died at age 33. That's 3 short years. Even so this video names 3 historians and does a weak job of discrediting them.Also most historians believe Josephus DID originally write something about Jesus
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 ...That is why common people rather than historians wrote about him such as Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 -That is why common people rather than historians wrote about.....
Really??? Then you are aware that the writers of the gospels are anonlymous and that the names, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John were given to the texts when the bible was compiled in the fourth century? Did you also know that Matthew 28:19 is a forgery, added after the Council of Nicea, or that the last 12 chapters of Mark are non-existant in the oldest copies of the bible?
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger Every disciple of died a martyr's death. Please tell me who would willingly give there life for a lie? Matthew, mark, luke, and john were named after the people that were believed to have written them. Matthew, the tax-collector and disciple of Jesus, Mark, John Mark an associate of Peter, Luke the physician, and John the beloved disciple. And I don't know what you've read, but Josephus didn't describe what you just did, neither did tacitus who were both within 100 yrs of Jesus' life
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 Matthew, mark, luke, and john were named after the people that were believed to have written them. "
BELIEVED is the bottom line. The actual writers were anonymous. In fact there were dozens of texts that were destroyed and not admitted into the bible when it was compiled. Four was chosen because of the four directions, four winds etc. and such logical reasons. Josephus mentions of Jesus were never used before the fourth century and the forgeries are ascribed to Eusabius.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger The forgeries are irrelevant, I already told you that most historians believe he originally wrote something about Christ. The words of Josephus could have been changed, but they were NOT made up, which is what's important here.
As far as your "exercise", here's an exercise for you: Go pick a recent event that happened. Then pick 4 people that were there to tell you what happened. If the stories aren't EXACTLY the same would you assume the event never happened??
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 Forgeries are never irrelevant because they convey a falsification and Eusabius, one of the church fathers was known to "doctor" the books. Biblical scholars have alread established that Josephus mention of Jesus were either totally or partially forgeries. As I posted before, these were never used by any Christian apologist before the time of Eusabius.
You wrote, "here's an exercise for you....recent event....4 people."
Isn't the bible considered to be perfect and inerrant?
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger "Biblical scholars have alread established that Josephus mention of Jesus were either totally or partially forgeries." A small minority of scholars reject Josephus' account entirely. A vast majority except it as authentic aside from a few words or phrases that could have been added.
"As I posted before, these were never used by any Christian apologist before the time of Eusabius." As I posted before. Nobody challenged the existed of Christ in writing until the 1800s
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 - I believe that the man existed, but only as a man, that the miracles were later additions which grew with oral tradition until finally being written to paper. I would expect that historians of his time did not write about him because there was nothing to write about. A yes, there were challenges against both the biblical scribes and the belief itself even in the beginning. In later years, as church power reached its peak, it was too dangerous to speak one's mind.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger 2) For instance, Minucius Felix (160-250 C.E) wrote:
"For in that you attribute to our religion the worship of a criminal and his cross, you wander far from the neighborhood of the truth, in thinking either that a criminal deserved, or that an earthly being was able, to be believed God...
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger Some of the new testament is written as early as 48 A.D. That's not a terrible long time to establish oral traditions and exaggerations. It would be unprecedented in all of history for a lie to have spread as quickly as Christianity did under persecution. You say Paul was the founder of Christianity and made stuff up as he went. He was brutally beaten too many times to number, He received 39 lashes 5 times, beaten with rods 3 times, and stoned once. All for stuff he "made up"???
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 - There are two schools of thought, Generally conservative scholars like to bring the date up while mainstream historians give Mark the date of between 60 and 80 AD. The idea of a virgin birth, a man-god, vicarious atonement, human sacrifice (forbidden to Jews) had to come from somewhere and it didn't come from Judaism, therefore, it would seem probable that it came from somewhere like Rome where all of these were part of established pagan belief. Paul was a Roman citizen.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger Don't let this video fool you. These things were not stolen from pagan beliefs
and the virgin birth, a man-god, and vicarious atonement do come from Judaism(Isaiah 7:14;53:5;40:3).
But you never answered my question.
Do you believe that Paul was beaten, whipped, and stoned for stuff that you say he "made up"?
Remember he was killing Christians before he converted.
So let me get this straight. He makes stuff up, kills anybody that believes it and THEN he converts?
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 Isaiah 7:14 is a prophecy for King Ahaz. Read it in context then go down to 16 "Yea, before the child shall know to refuse the evil, and choose the good, the land whose two kings thou hast a horror of shall be forsaken. " Christian misinterpretation, tume. None of the prophecies in the Tanakh are for Jesus.
I doubt that Paul was beaten or whipped. To attack a Roman citizen carried a deah penalty and there is reason to believe, both from Josephus writings and from Acts....
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger 2) that he was attached to the Herodian court . I would be inclined to think that Paul was attempting to gain sympathy and confessed that he wasn't above lying to achieve his goals.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@LoraSinger The prophesy had a dual meaning. It was used in Matthew to refer to Jesus. I don't think the heir to the throne of Ahaz was called "Immanuel", meaning "God with us"
"None of the prophecies in the Tanakh are for Jesus."
Isaiah 40:3;42:1-4;49:3 52:13-14;53:1-12;Psalm 22:8,14,16,18 None meant for Jesus? The New Testament is full of allusions to the OT prophesies.
Your conspiracy theory still has too many flaws. You believe Paul started Christianity even tho he persecuted Christians.
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 You missed the key line, tume " before the child shall know to refuse the evil, and choose the good, the land whose two kings thou hast a horror of shall be forsaken. " Of course the NT is full of allusions to the OT prophecies, it was written USING them. The Tanakh is not about Jesus, tume.
He was trying to quell rebellion. There WERE NIO Christians of the type there are today. There were only Jewish Christians who believed in a fully human "annointed" leader.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 - I don't think the heir to the throne of Ahaz was called "Immanuel", meaning "God with us"
There is no mention of it being his heir. Quite simply the prophecy is made that the woman is to give birth to a boy and before he knows good from evil, Ahaz will have overcome the three kings who were in opposition to him.
LoraSinger 1 year ago
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@LoraSinger "There is no mention of it being his heir."
You missed my point. The point was that Immanuel, meaning "God with us" was speaking of Jesus.
And yes send me the "real interpretations" thelegitqb@gmail.com.
54tumelo56 1 year ago
@54tumelo56 -Isaiah 40:3;42:1-4;49:3 52:13-14;53:1-12;Psalm 22:8,14,16,18 None meant for Jesus? The New Testament is full of allusions to the OT prophesies.
Would you like to have the REAL interpretations sent to your mailbox? Since the OT is written by Jews, for Jews, in their own language and set in their own culture using idioms particular to them, I tend to go with their interpretations.
LoraSinger 1 year ago