Why is it so important for you to refute what Ummah films has to say? Why do you go out of your way to make these videos? Is Islam REALLY that much of a threat to you..? You can never really understand our religion, until you've experiences it. So YES , it is pretty stupid to have a historian to try to explain Islam, which most of the time they take the Quran out of context and distort it. It is not like Communism or Fascism because those are political stand.
@Ndahir011 Unsubstantiated and unscientific beliefs all have illogic in common whether they are theological or political. If it is legitimate to criticize the shortcomings of communism, fascism, democracy, the free market, etc, then why is it not legitimate to to be critical of Christianity and Islam? I have never experienced Islam for the simple reason that I am not gullible, I have simply read the myriad experiences of others. None of these experiences answers the illogic of Islam.
@khatera333 I notice you ASSUME I have not read the Koran when I have. You ignore my argument and instead attack me personally, someone you know nothing about. You talk about following the truth with your heart, when emotions have nothing to do with how to determine what is true. Why must you see all those who criticize Islam as hateful and ignorant? Could it be that if you considered my argument you might agree with some of it? Can you emotionally deal with the realization that Islam is flawed?
You made a lot of valid points in my opinion. I myself live in a Muslim country and when 9/11 happened there were many Muslims who were happy and said that this is divine payback basically... I myself know that profit Mohamed advised that when in war not to destroy the towns and not to kill any women, children or elderly... but there are other violent points in Islam.. such as stoning to death, or killing of those who would choose to leave Islam.. may we all be guided to truth =)
I just wanted to point out that most Muslim countries use Shari'a law as well as regular laws to handle disputes. Shari'a law is used mostly for domestic things like divorce and what not ... which would make sense because most of the people in Muslim countries and Muslims and have Muslim marriages.
-You don't see Muslims all over the airwaves denouncing the terrorists because no one wants to hear that. I agree with Baba Ali when he said that the craziest and most nonsensical people are showed on the news to represent Islam, that's what gets views.
- One question: Nationalism is a strong identification of one's social identity with that of a nation or state. What does that have to do with Shari'a law and Islam as a whole?
@gigithemuslim But why don't they want to hear that? If I were Muslim, that is exactly what I would want to hear. If such apologies were made public, they would compete with the news made by terrorists. The reason only terrorists make news is becuase positive stories are not happening.
I do not understadn the nationalism question. What in my video are you referring to?
If for example only american people were allowed to talk about indians on tv, don't you think it'd be kinda odd?americans don't know anything about the lifestyle of indians and having been immersed in the population? (yeah you know ethnology and anthropology, to understand a principle you have to be immersed in the community and it's more subtle than what you think)
So if we censor every muslim from talking about his religion, it's not accurate...Anyways, it was expected by an american...
Americans don't know anything about Indians? What have you been smoking? Who said anythign about censoring Muslims? What are you talking about? It is Muslims who have tried to censor those who criticize Islam by trying to make it a crime in the UN. Anyways, its what I would expect form someone totally uneducated and lacking in any logical faculties.
"the people who are associating islam with violence are muslims!it's muslims who are all over the world doing violent things and they got out of their way to tell us that the reason of their violence is because they believe they are compelled to do so by qur'an and by their religion"
I expect more than people stating things without any facts and generalizing about a minority...You know i would have had admired you if you had done some constructive criticism
Your statement is pedantic and simplistic. I made no statement about ALL Muslims. I simply said that the idea that terrorists are not following Islam is absurd. Using religion to justify violence has been at the heart of both Islam and Christianity. If these are corruptions of the religions, then both religions have spent a lot of their time with he majority of their flock being corrupt. At one time most Muslims agreed with terrorists. Many still do. It is not a generalization to say so.
Ali was talkin about those who go on TV and talk NONESENSE about Islam, no one really cares weater they are muslim or not, as long as they are not misquoting or judging because they are bias,
Frequently when Muslims are disagreed with, they scream bias. I have seen Islamic scholars called "biased" or "islamophobic" simply because they spoke of a fact that contradicts widely held myths believed by Muslims . Muslims must get used to the fact that textual, historical, and anthropological studies will not always agree with their perceptions of the Quran, Islam, and Islamic history. All study of religion turn up facts that contradict dogma.
Clearly you are making assumptions without evidence. How could you possibly know what I have read? Why is it that Muslims assume that anyone who disagrees with them is ignorant? How arrogant of you to assume you have the last word on Islam. Did it ever occur to you that our opinions differ because I know something about Islam that you don't? Your delusion that Islam is perfect does not allow you to even consider that possibility.
You are so afraid of being wrong that you dismiss my arguments without digesting them or even considering them. Sorry to break it to you but there is great disagreement among scholars studying Islam, even among Muslims scholars. And yes I know that Islamic people are called Muslims, everyone knows that.
Your being immature and irrational.How many Buddhist or Quaker terrorists are there? Both religions teach that violence is never justified. Christianity and Islam both teach that there is "a time to kill" and that "oppression is worse than slaughter." These two religions have had the most violent people belonging to them. Coincidence? Jews says Palestine was given to them by God, so they are occupying it now. Coincidence? People do as they believe and believe what their religions tell them.
i stopped immediatley after your argument that when trying to understand a religion, philosophy or concept that anyone who is directly involved in such things are the last people to hear from because of thier bias. bias is something to be concious of all the time when attempting to understand anything but to go so far as to say that being involved in a religion/philosophy instantly discredits that person as bias as opposed to being a veiwpoint that hasa muchmore complete understanding is idiotic
I was challenging the notion that people belonging to a religion always know more about it and always have accurate perceptions of it. It is always good to get opinions form all sides both inside and outside. Anyone who believes in an ideology on faith, is by nature not rational and is going to inevitably believe without reason. This will clearly cause bias. However, they will have insights into the minds of those who believe that cannot be gotten from outside. Does this clarify my meaning?
Is a person who is brainwashed into a cult an expert on that cult? Should we take their belief that the cult leader is god literally and believe him? Should we be impressed by his attempts to discredit police reports that indicate his leader is a con man? And If the cult makes claims about reality that directly contradict what physicists and other experts say about the world, should we take what they say as unbiased? Of course we would not. So, why should I be impressed with a Muslim opinion?
I know I am late but this is the internet as I just watched this today.
I see you were very enthusiastic which is ok. Muslims do not fear people like yourself. Why? Coz you ,unlike some who hit and run, had the courage to state what you thought and I do not think that you would want anger or any other factor to deprive you from further pursuing the issue that concerned You.
I do not actually know where to start but lets first say this is somehow a debate
You try to make a distinction between religion and the people who practice it. There is no such distinction. Religion is a social phenomenon. What actually happens in a religion is its reality, not what is supposed to happen. If we found out that child molesters wanted to help children, this would not change our perception of them as abusive. it is what actually happens in the world and its implication in people's life that matters.
And you base your assertions on what? Read the Koran. Violent books lead to violent beliefs which leads to violent behavior. What is it about this that you don't get? If you think the Koran and other Islamic writings don't contain violence, please challenge me. But, please give me your citations (thats a way we laughable book readers have of actually backing up what we say). As they say, put up or shut up. You will excuse me if I do not hold my breath waiting for a response.
No war was fought in the name of Wicca.... Not Paganism but Wicca itself. There has never been a war, nor an act of terror by a Wiccan group... If there has been I would like to see the proof of this act... I really hope you cant find anything about it but just in case I will prepare myself.
Pagans in the past were very violent, as was everyone else at the time. But currently neo-pagans seem to have no tendencies toward violence. In fact wiccans tend to be liberal and against war in general. To tell you the truth I would rather live in a country of wiccans than Christians. In my experience, wiccans are just so much more friendly.
Why is it so important for you to refute what Ummah films has to say? Why do you go out of your way to make these videos? Is Islam REALLY that much of a threat to you..? You can never really understand our religion, until you've experiences it. So YES , it is pretty stupid to have a historian to try to explain Islam, which most of the time they take the Quran out of context and distort it. It is not like Communism or Fascism because those are political stand.
Ndahir011 3 months ago
@Ndahir011 Unsubstantiated and unscientific beliefs all have illogic in common whether they are theological or political. If it is legitimate to criticize the shortcomings of communism, fascism, democracy, the free market, etc, then why is it not legitimate to to be critical of Christianity and Islam? I have never experienced Islam for the simple reason that I am not gullible, I have simply read the myriad experiences of others. None of these experiences answers the illogic of Islam.
outlawleather 3 months ago
@khatera333 I notice you ASSUME I have not read the Koran when I have. You ignore my argument and instead attack me personally, someone you know nothing about. You talk about following the truth with your heart, when emotions have nothing to do with how to determine what is true. Why must you see all those who criticize Islam as hateful and ignorant? Could it be that if you considered my argument you might agree with some of it? Can you emotionally deal with the realization that Islam is flawed?
SkepticSage 6 months ago
You made a lot of valid points in my opinion. I myself live in a Muslim country and when 9/11 happened there were many Muslims who were happy and said that this is divine payback basically... I myself know that profit Mohamed advised that when in war not to destroy the towns and not to kill any women, children or elderly... but there are other violent points in Islam.. such as stoning to death, or killing of those who would choose to leave Islam.. may we all be guided to truth =)
thelifeuwant 1 year ago
I just wanted to point out that most Muslim countries use Shari'a law as well as regular laws to handle disputes. Shari'a law is used mostly for domestic things like divorce and what not ... which would make sense because most of the people in Muslim countries and Muslims and have Muslim marriages.
gigithemuslim 1 year ago
-Islamic people are called Muslims.
-You don't see Muslims all over the airwaves denouncing the terrorists because no one wants to hear that. I agree with Baba Ali when he said that the craziest and most nonsensical people are showed on the news to represent Islam, that's what gets views.
- One question: Nationalism is a strong identification of one's social identity with that of a nation or state. What does that have to do with Shari'a law and Islam as a whole?
gigithemuslim 1 year ago
@gigithemuslim But why don't they want to hear that? If I were Muslim, that is exactly what I would want to hear. If such apologies were made public, they would compete with the news made by terrorists. The reason only terrorists make news is becuase positive stories are not happening.
I do not understadn the nationalism question. What in my video are you referring to?
SkepticSage 1 year ago
If for example only american people were allowed to talk about indians on tv, don't you think it'd be kinda odd?americans don't know anything about the lifestyle of indians and having been immersed in the population? (yeah you know ethnology and anthropology, to understand a principle you have to be immersed in the community and it's more subtle than what you think)
So if we censor every muslim from talking about his religion, it's not accurate...Anyways, it was expected by an american...
anissa2007 2 years ago
Americans don't know anything about Indians? What have you been smoking? Who said anythign about censoring Muslims? What are you talking about? It is Muslims who have tried to censor those who criticize Islam by trying to make it a crime in the UN. Anyways, its what I would expect form someone totally uneducated and lacking in any logical faculties.
SkepticSage 2 years ago
"the people who are associating islam with violence are muslims!it's muslims who are all over the world doing violent things and they got out of their way to tell us that the reason of their violence is because they believe they are compelled to do so by qur'an and by their religion"
I expect more than people stating things without any facts and generalizing about a minority...You know i would have had admired you if you had done some constructive criticism
anissa2007 2 years ago
Your statement is pedantic and simplistic. I made no statement about ALL Muslims. I simply said that the idea that terrorists are not following Islam is absurd. Using religion to justify violence has been at the heart of both Islam and Christianity. If these are corruptions of the religions, then both religions have spent a lot of their time with he majority of their flock being corrupt. At one time most Muslims agreed with terrorists. Many still do. It is not a generalization to say so.
SkepticSage 2 years ago
i don't like what you're saying and i disagree , but i'm glad you're intrested in islam
Semiha92 2 years ago
Ali was talkin about those who go on TV and talk NONESENSE about Islam, no one really cares weater they are muslim or not, as long as they are not misquoting or judging because they are bias,
sharpjaws 2 years ago 2
Frequently when Muslims are disagreed with, they scream bias. I have seen Islamic scholars called "biased" or "islamophobic" simply because they spoke of a fact that contradicts widely held myths believed by Muslims . Muslims must get used to the fact that textual, historical, and anthropological studies will not always agree with their perceptions of the Quran, Islam, and Islamic history. All study of religion turn up facts that contradict dogma.
SkepticSage 2 years ago
hey, you're excelent
mortemdei 3 years ago
thanks
SkepticSage 3 years ago
clearly you never even read 1 book about Islam not to mention 30.. Islamic people are called Muslims
Zionistsdid911 3 years ago
Clearly you are making assumptions without evidence. How could you possibly know what I have read? Why is it that Muslims assume that anyone who disagrees with them is ignorant? How arrogant of you to assume you have the last word on Islam. Did it ever occur to you that our opinions differ because I know something about Islam that you don't? Your delusion that Islam is perfect does not allow you to even consider that possibility.
SkepticSage 3 years ago
You are so afraid of being wrong that you dismiss my arguments without digesting them or even considering them. Sorry to break it to you but there is great disagreement among scholars studying Islam, even among Muslims scholars. And yes I know that Islamic people are called Muslims, everyone knows that.
SkepticSage 3 years ago
Your being immature and irrational.How many Buddhist or Quaker terrorists are there? Both religions teach that violence is never justified. Christianity and Islam both teach that there is "a time to kill" and that "oppression is worse than slaughter." These two religions have had the most violent people belonging to them. Coincidence? Jews says Palestine was given to them by God, so they are occupying it now. Coincidence? People do as they believe and believe what their religions tell them.
SkepticSage 3 years ago
i stopped immediatley after your argument that when trying to understand a religion, philosophy or concept that anyone who is directly involved in such things are the last people to hear from because of thier bias. bias is something to be concious of all the time when attempting to understand anything but to go so far as to say that being involved in a religion/philosophy instantly discredits that person as bias as opposed to being a veiwpoint that hasa muchmore complete understanding is idiotic
Dirigible0 3 years ago
I was challenging the notion that people belonging to a religion always know more about it and always have accurate perceptions of it. It is always good to get opinions form all sides both inside and outside. Anyone who believes in an ideology on faith, is by nature not rational and is going to inevitably believe without reason. This will clearly cause bias. However, they will have insights into the minds of those who believe that cannot be gotten from outside. Does this clarify my meaning?
SkepticSage 3 years ago
Is a person who is brainwashed into a cult an expert on that cult? Should we take their belief that the cult leader is god literally and believe him? Should we be impressed by his attempts to discredit police reports that indicate his leader is a con man? And If the cult makes claims about reality that directly contradict what physicists and other experts say about the world, should we take what they say as unbiased? Of course we would not. So, why should I be impressed with a Muslim opinion?
SkepticSage 2 years ago
@SkepticSage
Dear SKEPTIC;
part 1
I know I am late but this is the internet as I just watched this today.
I see you were very enthusiastic which is ok. Muslims do not fear people like yourself. Why? Coz you ,unlike some who hit and run, had the courage to state what you thought and I do not think that you would want anger or any other factor to deprive you from further pursuing the issue that concerned You.
I do not actually know where to start but lets first say this is somehow a debate
brain2770 1 year ago
You try to make a distinction between religion and the people who practice it. There is no such distinction. Religion is a social phenomenon. What actually happens in a religion is its reality, not what is supposed to happen. If we found out that child molesters wanted to help children, this would not change our perception of them as abusive. it is what actually happens in the world and its implication in people's life that matters.
SkepticSage 4 years ago
And you base your assertions on what? Read the Koran. Violent books lead to violent beliefs which leads to violent behavior. What is it about this that you don't get? If you think the Koran and other Islamic writings don't contain violence, please challenge me. But, please give me your citations (thats a way we laughable book readers have of actually backing up what we say). As they say, put up or shut up. You will excuse me if I do not hold my breath waiting for a response.
SkepticSage 4 years ago
No war was fought in the name of Wicca.... Not Paganism but Wicca itself. There has never been a war, nor an act of terror by a Wiccan group... If there has been I would like to see the proof of this act... I really hope you cant find anything about it but just in case I will prepare myself.
Briena1982 4 years ago
Pagans in the past were very violent, as was everyone else at the time. But currently neo-pagans seem to have no tendencies toward violence. In fact wiccans tend to be liberal and against war in general. To tell you the truth I would rather live in a country of wiccans than Christians. In my experience, wiccans are just so much more friendly.
SkepticSage 4 years ago
By the way, few wars have been fought in the name of Buddhism either
SkepticSage 4 years ago