JustinGracie's Westboro Baptist Church Experience: Part 1

[WeedwackerWoW]

whats the number?

[OutkastsAndGleeks52]

fuckin creepy ass music!

[cooldonkeyfish]

The thing I like most about it is you were so polite to them and they still were anus holes to you.

[thatUkrainianguy]

wow! she really talked to you?! I think now they just have a voice mail. gee, what kooks...

[orixaguy]

Mr. Gracie, do not fool yourself. It is NOT an exaggeration when they are referred to as terrorists. This is a HATE GROUP who promotes and encourages HATRED. You only have to look into the eyes of any of the mothers who read the WBC's signs upon exiting the church where their son's funeral has just been held. It is an unmistakable look of TERROR in their eyes. A burning cross is a burning cross no matter how you look at it. You are young. Continue to fight against causes like this!

[roark100]

catholic people suck! DX

[IAmJustinGracie]

@roark100 I disagree. Hateful people suck. This video kinda sucks, too. But it is what it is.

[roark100]

@IAmJustinGracie its just that like i grew up in a cathlic family and had to go to ccd it was awful

[WiLBUR719]

bats in the cave

[YouandMe1310]

1. I love that song..

2. How do they.. or actually How WOULD! they kno if ur R a lier or not.. i mean really

[bamlover8485]

MUSIC = WIN.

[tonykeywest08]

haha you thought you were messing with them and they got ya pissed off cha ching

[chimbo91]

I cant get through to them.

Ive wanted to talk to them for ages but no one picks up.

[ItsTimeToADizzle]

pwnd! that church is shit

[apetalxinxthexwind18]

They're so immature, they aren't even listening to you. & Brent/Shirleys husband works at FOOT LOCKER. Lmao.

[RonLarhz]

nice1

[bangbuddy2]

That was brilliant, if I do say so myself.

[WBCinformer]

grrrr youtube wont let me post lol. i have another account called WBCinformer i give what they believe compared to what the bible says. feel free to stop by and check it out if you agree/disagree. i love to debate :P

[kegs666]

Fail deathcore music

[lookseeme21]

Saddam Hussein was abused by the uncle who brought him up. That's maybe made him the murderous abuser he was.

A book (out of print - from the 1950s) Called "I was Hitlers Doctor". The writer said that hitler was the illegitimate son of Jewish father. What else could have been worse then being a "Jewish bastard" (ps I am nominally Jewish) in late 1800s Europe. So Hitler hated himself, it appears. And he projected it out, with special hatred for the Jews. Same warped mind mechanism

[lookseeme21]

I'm totally supportive of gay people. Come out of the closet if at all possible. Don't let these freaks with a church banner scare you. You have nothing to fear but fear itself.

What I would say to the Towson high kids is to be supportive of your gay classmates. All that takes is some balls.

And to the girls at towso - you can make a difference - refuse to date any of the boys that say homophobic things. You can start a hell of a movement there, and be leaders against this trash.

[kuroshashu]

Come on, these people are harmless. They're non-violent; all they do is picket. Besides, I love having them around to point out the hypocrisy of christianity. In some ways they're doing more damage to christianity than Dawkins and Hitchens put together.

[MercuryRis]

ya know thats an excellent point.

[lookseeme21]

They got me involved in the gay civil rights movement. For that, I have to thank this sick MF.

But tthink of all the mental suffering they cause to gay people, and the families of our troops who have been killed.

They are the perfect incarnation of  a hitlerite hate movement under the banner of Christ. God will send these monsters to hell.

[kuroshashu]

I'm sorry, but free speech trumps the sensibilities of gays and bereaved families. Free speech is too important to be sold so cheaply.

Also, I would like to see you try to argue with WBC about hell. These people know their bible backwards.

If you'll let me, I'd enjoy arguing on their behalf with you that, in fact, you're going to burn in hell while they'll be saved. No pressure of course, but I think the bible may actually be on WBC's side.

[j1e3s5]

are u part of the wbc?? just currious, anyway i would love to debate some of your beliefs, if your willing to debate with him why not me right? lol looking forward to our discussion :P

[kuroshashu]

I'm not WBC, just a fan. I like rooting for them for nearly the same reason I rooted for the Joker in The Dark Knight.

But I think that the extremists have the upper hand in scriptural debates, since the texts themselves appear to contain more injunctions to do evil than good.

[j1e3s5]

oh i see, well if we would have our debate i would use the BIBLE as the final athority, and im sure your aware that knowing the bible and being a christian are 2 different things. for example, you know the pharasees right? lol they knew the bible like the back of there hand. but it says they were not saved in the bible. so idk if you read the bible but since your a fan of theres and they wont debate with people you will do lol. just remember that i would use the BIBLE as the final athority. ty

[kuroshashu]

That's fine; I can agree with you about using the bible to judge, although decided which of two contradictory passages is correct could be difficult.

So, which WBC practice do you think most marks them non-christian?

[j1e3s5]

i didnt understand what you were saying about "two contradictory passages" since the bible is 100% truth. so if you could clarify on that thankyou. also your other question they preach that we should hate gays and such, but it says in the bible to "love your neighbor as thyself" so i dont know where they got that from also on a video there leader fred phelps said that the word "fag" is a biblical reference. i have NO idea where he got that from its obviosly a lie enless hes using some other book

[j1e3s5]

you should really check out my other account WBCinformer i have taken videos of them and put in annotations the "truth". oh and another thing where does it say in bible that every little bad thing happening is the "wrath of god" lol anyway if you could give some verses i would appriciate it. thank you :P

[kuroshashu]

Sorry about the late reply

Well, the very first biblical contradiction that comes to mind is the first in the text: when was Eve made? At the same time as Adam, or later from his rib?

The bible may say that one should love one's neighbour, but it also insists that rebellious children be killed. If this is your god's word, you cannot ignore bits because they make you squeamish.

Finally, yahweh isn't above using natural disasters to exact revenge. Noah's flood, for example.

[j1e3s5]

hi its fine, anyway i dont see how adam and eve being made is a contradiction, if you could tell me why you think it is, but to answer your question, i always thought that adam was made first and eve was made from his rib, but that is from memory, anyway about killing your children, they did it because familys were much more independant back then, no welfare or nothing so rebelling against your family could put them in danger thus it was ok back then to stone them

[j1e3s5]

but i also wanted to say that its not a contridiction on the love part, depending on how rebellious they were they could put there family in danger, and i have heard the name yahweh before, what is it? if it is god then yes he can and will use them but for revenge? the flood was used to wipe out the evil people of the earth, can you tell me where it says it was for revenge?

[j1e3s5]

and while we are on the topic, i always loved how fred phelps would say that the natrual disasters, flloods, fires,ect. were gods wrath on everyone,even now. and yes god has used his wrath in this way before, but the bible talks about this and how just because we are having troubles doesnt always mean its becauase we have sinned or its gods wrath. but if it was then when the wbc go through hard times(there shed bursting into flames is one example) they should say it was gods wrath, but didnt

[kuroshashu]

If you read genesis from the beginning; you'll find that Eve is created twice: once on the sixth day and again after Adam plays about in the garden for a while.

I realise that we're talking about a more brutal time, but it's still immoral. Why not simply cast the blaggard out?

In any case, if you actually look, the definition of 'rebellious son' is actually rather soft. It refers to loutishness and drunkeness; neither of which ought to carry the death penalty even in those darker times.

[kuroshashu]

Yahweh is a more accurate transliteration of the Hebrew name for the god of the bible. Many still know him by the older mistransliteration of 'Jehovah', but as far as I know most modern bibles use 'Yahweh' or 'YHWH'.

These "evil" people were killed for their "crimes". Given the strange legal code put forward in the bible, it's unlikely that much of their crimes were actually criminal, but let's run with it:...

[kuroshashu]

If you attempt to argue that they were killed to prevent future crimes, then consider what these people could have possibly be planning that was worse than near total annihilation of all terrestrial life.

What could these poor, pathetic and probably misrepresented creatures have done to deserve not only their own deaths, but the deaths of everything else?

[kuroshashu]

This is not justice. This isn't even clever social engineering; since the chosen ones quickly re-established the same divinely offensive society as that which had been destroyed.

If this happened (thankfully there's no actual evidence for any of this), then it is to action of an incredibly cruel and incompetant god.

[kuroshashu]

No offence to yourself, of course, but the central character of the bible isn't terribly deserving of respect even if it does exist.

Oh, closing note: look up Numbers 15:32-36 for a classic example of the sort of personality with which we're dealing.

[j1e3s5]

you call this act by god "cruel", which i think if similar to the mindset most people have, if a father would punish his children than i dont want to be his child-mindset, because thats all it really is, i find this mindset really weird, since he has offered a way out? XD i now relize that your not a christian, since you dont believe the bible is true, but consider this thought, if the bible is true then all you have to do is believe that jesus is lord,died for you, and ask him to come into you

[j1e3s5]

the problem with your theory is that you see humans as poor pathetic misrepresented creatures, i would say without god we are evil wicked deserving hell creatures, and if you want to know what they did to deserve death all it was was to sin once, god is god, we are NOT god, god doesnt have to keep us alive since he created us not the other way around, you say they shouldnt die since they didnt do "criminal" acts according to yourself and society, again god is god, not man

[kuroshashu]

Ok, where to start.

Punishment is the artificial imposition of negative re-enforcement in order to correct behaviour. How can killing ever be punishment? It's petty retribution.

Yahweh did not offer the victims of Noah's flood any way out: this incident pre-dates Jesus.

Nor has yahweh offered me a way out: I, like nearly every atheist I've ever met, have tried communicating with jesus. On numerous occasions. We fail, so he's either not interested in us or he does not exist.

Continued

[kuroshashu]

Jesus never died for me. At best he died for the species, which is not a heroic act. Imagine if someone out there did choose themselves over billions of others? He'd be a monster.

Anyway, Jesus is said to be immortal. He died for me? It's a contradiction in terms. And it only gets loopier if you consider that some theologys hold that Jesus and Yahweh are one and the same.

Continued...

[kuroshashu]

Then have the bizarre situation whereby an omnipotent deity who's so offended by my misuse of one of his names that he's going to have to torture me indefinately unless I accept his whipping his own avatar to death by way of my sacrifice to himself...

On humanity, I do not regard them so wretchedly: I consider humanity to be a marvellous species in the literal sense. To say that one deserves infinite punishment for finite crime is incredibly inequitous to say the least.

Continued...

[kuroshashu]

Finally, to claim that god has the right to end us because he created us is revolting. I created my son; do I have the right to kill him? Much less torture him? Of course not; that is absurd.

You attempt to add weight to this by saying the Yahweh keeps us alive, presumably through an act of will. However, for an omnipotent being, no effect is too laborious. You expect a parent to keep their children alive with limited resources right? Then why not a parent with limitless resources?

[j1e3s5]

the fact is god will not torture you, not even the demons will or devil, they will be in the abiss, but hell will be torture, i talked to my uncle whos here and he thinks its not physical torture but more mental, since hell has no god and god is love,truth, ect you will be eternally bound to what you craved after on earth. and again i know you dont think humans are wicked but your not god, did you make the human race? dont you think the maker would know best :P

[j1e3s5]

ok to start off with the first statement, please dont use such big words XD i am pretty sure you could find a couple of synonymes for them :P so idk how to answer that but i will try if you restate it for me ty, next statement i assume you say that they had no way out because jesus was not born? the bible talks bout this and i am not 100% sure exactly how they were saved, since it does not apply to me, but i my mom has it bookmarked and i will look into it, but it was by faith i do know

[j1e3s5]

about the last part, how can you say he has not? jesus is your way out XD weather you want to exept him or not is up to you, but alot of ppl say they "try" to communicate with him, but they are focused on there needs, and he doesnt hear them, if you did that then yes he did not want to hear that, i am talking about someone "praying" to god asking/telling him to make life better, 1 he doesnt have to, 2 sometimes it could take years for it to happen, remember your asking him, not the other way

[kuroshashu]

I'm saying that to lay down your life for 20 billions others is more or less ones ethical duty. You cannot claim too large a pat on the back for merely doing ones duty. Especially if you're immortal and you lost nothing in preforming said duty.

I did not say that sacrificing oneself makes one a monster. Jesus is a monster for much better reasons. Eternal torture, for one.

My statement with the long words was only challending your use of the word 'punish'.

Continued...

[kuroshashu]

It's only punishment if it's done to correct wayward behaviour. Therefore post-mortem torture is absurd.

As is redemption through faith. This system has Hitler (a roman catholic) in heaven while Gandhi (a hindu) in hell. See something wrong with this picture?

I've not asked Jesus for anything other than confirmation that he exists. Nothing flashy, just something. Nothing is forthcoming.

Continued...

[kuroshashu]

Also, I'd have you note that while you may think that when you pray, Jesus responds, but people also feel Allah, aliens and deceased relatives respond in this same way.

Seems to me that you're only talking to yourself with a little role-play tossed in.

[j1e3s5]

really? aliens? XD lol, aliens are nothing more than mere demons, masters of deception XD its the only logical explanation. and idk what people that think allah is a god believe, so i cant point out any errors, but since bible is 100% truth, no errors in all this time, i find it hard that there are 2 100% truths XD also i wanted to inform you being a athiest is a very risky bet XD i kinda understand another religion, but no religion? we are in win/win your in lose/win

[j1e3s5]

first off i wont say weather hitler is in heaven or not, though probably is not, idk if he exepted jesus b4 he died, since all it takes is a moment, so no i dont see anything wrong with the picture :P and to say there is no proof that jesus exists? is a bold statement, the bible has been proven its age, through the rosseta stone and other artifacts, i am pretty sure we have a book on it anyway the only thing you need to decide is if jesus really is god, i know its truth, but yes he did exist

[j1e3s5]

god does not have to save anyone, i just dont understand why someone would offer you a way out, and then not take it? btw jesus is not a monster he does not torture you, like i said b4, also it was YOUR choice,YOU will choose life,death.god has made a way out, its your choice.

[kuroshashu]

The bible is quite clear on this point: there is a hell of fire and brimstone. Created by god for the explicit purpose of torure.

Then he decides that everyone who is unconvinced by the triffling evidence availible of his existance is to be thrown into this pit.

Meaning that people like me who seek the truth sincerly and dilligently get to burn while Jim-Bob Half-Wit gets eternal bliss because he was born in the right area and never asked any questions? Please...

This is an insult..

[kuroshashu]

You cannot argue that this is my choice because I don't see that I am choosing. For example; what if you're wrong?

What're you going to say to Allah on your day of judgement? When he tossed you into the pit, it'll be your fault. See my point yet?

You don't see anything wrong with Hitler being in heaven while Gandhi burns? What kind of ethics is this? Whatever you say, you cannot now say that yahweh is justice. That is completely inequitous, as you know quite well.

[kuroshashu]

Ok, the historicity of Jesus. Firstly, the gospels were written between 30 and 100 years after he died; so they are not eye-witness accounts. There's no other account of any of Jesus' life outside the gospels and the gospels themselves all disagree about key points. So, no, Jesus never existed. Or, if he did, then he was nothing like the character in the bible.

[kuroshashu]

Finally, the bible is not 100% true. Spend five minutes on google and you'll find hundreds of errors and contradictions.

And being an atheist is actually a rather safe position. While it's true that one religion or the other maybe right, the one thing that gods hate more than an atheist is a worshiper of another faith. So, on average, I'm a good deal safer than you :P

[j1e3s5]

and bout the athiest thing, i have to disagree, like i said before the bible has yet to reach a error, and so many other religions have been proven wrong. you continue to say god hates a worshiper of another faith more than a athiest? this sadens me that you would think god hates ANYONE. he loves us all, and since the bible like i have stated has yet to reach a error it seems like that would be truth, eh? remember god doesnt hate you, or me, he WILL forgive, if it is sincere^^

[j1e3s5]

hi kuro, idk why you privite messaged me instead of posting on here like we have before but i am gonna keep it on here so everyone can see, anyway you say you have read the bible cover to cover before, but you obviously have not read carfully, yes i have not, but you are saying stuff not in the bible, you say jesus said the apocolypse would occur within theretime but then why does the bible state that NOONE knows when the world will end and jesus will come, is one example i will state more

[j1e3s5]

and the earth states that the world is round? not flat, and i believe it talks about the evaporation system though not sure, but i find it funny that a book this old, proven its age with the roseeta stone, could have these true facts and not be gods word, because we now know that the world is indeed round, but could you give some scripture for the world being flat or the apocolypse thing? ty, i will look for the scriptures that i am proving also

[j1e3s5]

you go to say jesus is a hateful god, but i have proven this wrong before, but this time you go to say his kill count is "2,301,438 confirmed" well what if he has? he is god, again dont make yourself god, he has the right to give and take away, including lives, but where is this number found? i am curious since it is confirmed also you say there is no sin, but there is immorality? then what makes something immoral? what do you go by to decide? yourself?if so remember god is god

[j1e3s5]

you said what loving god creates a hell? well i sure hope a father would punish his childred, dont you? that leads to children being spoiled and such on earth, not knowing wrong, the probllem with this is i now confirm that you have the "if a father would punish his child for doing wrong then i dont want to be his child" mindset. for the mark 3:29 thing if you read further up, i believe it is talking about the demons, so they cant be forgiven, i am not completly sure, but it is about demons

[j1e3s5]

yes the gospels were written after jesus died, where does it say how long? idk so i am just asking if you have a verse or what? and what are these "key points" in which they disagree on? you have left out a lot if you could please tell me ty

[j1e3s5]

you say what if i am wrong and bible is not 100% truth, you also say spend five minutes on google and i will find hundreds? trust me i have before not ONE while its easy to take one part of the bible and compare it to another and say "LOOK A CONTRADICTION" would anyone really read a sentance or even a page of a book, then the end and say they read/understood it? yet so many ppl do that with the bible, another way is to take it out of context or misinterpret it but if there are some let me know:P

[j1e3s5]

well idk what the allah believers believe, but since you have yet to bring a error i have not explained the bible stands as truth right now, and idk why you keep bringing hitler in heaven back up, i said he could be, but probably isnt from looking on his lifestyle, but to answer your question if hitler repented, sincerley to god, and had a changed life, before he died, no i dont see that wrong sry, but you call it sinfull? may i ask you what is sin and is not? how do you determine it?

[j1e3s5]

one last thing, you said "you cannot argue that this is my choice because i dont see that i am choosing" i am kinda confused, if someone said you cannot argue that there is air because i dont see any air, would that make it true? of course not, you are choosing to not believe there is a god, and therefor you HAVE chosen something.

[j1e3s5]

yes hell is a place of torture, but i dont think you understand how god decides weather or not you go to hell or heaven, you say "meaning that people lke me who seek the truth sinceerly and dilligently get to burn while jim bob half wit gets eternal bliss because he was born in the right area and never asked any questions?" well someone could seek the truth there whole life and not find it, so they could go to hell,but we dont go to heaven by where we are born or if we ask questions, sry

[j1e3s5]

your last statment asks why a all powerfull god should care for you? and i have said this before he LOVES YOU, ITS NOT HIS DUTY, sigh, if your girl/boy friend says they love you would you really say to them what? why should you care for me? or question it? i would hope not, you go on to say africans dont believe in you and you dont want torture them, well 1 they dont know you 2 they dont need to believe you your not god, 3 you dont have the right to torture/kill them or anyone,including yourself

[j1e3s5]

last comment for me for now, you say the bible contracdicts itself on faith saves? a verse plz, in that whole message i saw one verse the mark verse, and there are 430 some topics in that list so if you could tell me the number which you were proving, but the bible says "it is by grace you have been saved through faith it is not of yourselfs it is a gift from god,not by works lest anyman should boast" but one last thing plz dont assume like you did in the post on stuff about me i havent for you

[kuroshashu]

I never said that god must care for me. I'd be quite happy to be left alone. But no, the prick plans to torture me, so I'm not going to be very flattering of his am I?

My point about South America was supposed to question the point of belief: why shoud a god care? He can't care that much, seeing as he went to such effort to hide all evidence of himself...

[kuroshashu]

Also, you did assume of me that I've not read the bible. You said as much, remember? That's why I corrected you and pointed out that it's pretty clear that you have not. It's not surprising; the book is rather dreadful, but please give it a go. You'll find out why I and so many others are so hostile to Yahweh.

[j1e3s5]

i did? well could you put the exact words?? i am sry if i did but i really dont think or remember saying anything like that, but yes i have read the bible, but even if you read it cover to cover 10 times and i read a chapter, i could still know more about it than you, reading it and understanding it are two different things, thats why so many people take it out of context, for example you bring back so many things i have already explained, "the prick plans to torture me" god wont i have told you

[j1e3s5]

i have repeated these things again and again, like how salvation works, and you somehow thought i believe hitler is in heaven? he could be, noone knows, and you said it was gods duty to save us a while back, but anyway he does care weather you love him or not, he will ALWAYS love you^^, hmm this does sound like dreadful book XD lol but anyway i believe i also mentioned that africans are not gods? so yes they wouldnt care that much, and i listed a number of other reasons back earlier

[j1e3s5]

"he cant care that much, seeing as he went to such effort to hide all evidence of himeself" 1 what evidence did he hide? 2 if he did it would require no effort, hes god, 3 he does care

[sickerthiings]

Those people are crazy and evil. I can't believe the things they do - protesting funerals, saying thank God for 9/11?

It actually sickens me.

And LOL @ the "I know hon, you're a liar" . They're pathetic.

[lookseeme21]

Phelps family history is that his alcoholic father beat him with an ax handle, and did who knows what else. Phelps is obviously conflicted between his natural love for a father, and hatred of the father.

Ask any psychologist - what people in this sort of situation do - via an emotional short circuit in the brain - they project their self hatred out on others. Simple as that.

I got the ax handle story from an estranged son of Phelps, lives in canada. Found it with google.

[NatSci]

Why did you say you don't have an internet connection..

[IAmJustinGracie]

if i had said that i had been to the site they would have hung up. if i had said i hadn't visited but had the means to, they would have hung up. i was trying to keep them on the line and actually have a discussion with them... didn't exactly work too well, but i tried.

[Solidus951]

JUSTIN

its Brad =]

I think we need to make an example of WBC =]

[lookseeme21]

And parents - the "pray away the gay" groups are a ticket to disaster. 80% go back to being gay - it's their nature, just like for 90-95% we're hetero. The rest of these victims of lies suffer silently, suicides are common. I've met at least 5 people who were married due to societal pressure. After 10-20 years, they finally split up, most are still friends with their ex, involved with their children, but they have ended "the nightmare of their lives

Steve Kay - I'll be at Towson.

[Hulkster1209]

Jesus Christ that's some heavy HEAVY metal you listen to just'