What is wrong with tolerance for religious diversity?Just because communists think it's clever to under mind to the moral centrality of the christian voting base by using comparative mythology as a weapon does not mean it will work or that there is no value in it spiritually.We have religious freedom here,and the excercise of that religious freedom is essential to keeping it.More over we believe humanity is generate not born in evil,like Commies and ,some so called Christians,Jews,and Muslims.
I'm tired of stepping on these supposed egg shells with the commies,and with religion.I think the that Jesus was just here to check in with some honesty,and mystery in his own right,and that the tradition was kept alive by the church so nobody else could bury it,but that he was not ultimately here to impose religious rule on everybody.And if he was then I have to depart from his views right there or we need another country for Christians proper.
@cstlljoey7 "more over we believe humanity is generate not born in evil...bla bla commies bla bla jews bla bla muslims bla bla bla" i have but one question... what obscure christian "sect" is... "we"....? are you beginning to understand the problem... ???
Could you possibly use more mixed metaphors? You invoke 1984 like a true fear-monger Your response is exactly like a fundamentalists, so many attacks, that to respond would be exhausting. I understand that you have invested a lot of time in utter garbage and have a lot to protect and a lot of other people's rationalisations to fall back on, but from here it smells like a cow droppings in the universal pasture.
Just meeting extreme statements with extreme statements. Don't come crying to me that you never graduated from Sunday school. I have as much time invested in garbage as you do . I believe we have our own piles to deal with. You stay on your side and I'll stay on mine. "I sat by the ships, a useless burden,
though there are better in Assembly-
so may this strife of men and gods be done with."- Iliad Book 18 Lines 104-107
Except that you cannot refute my garbage in the same way that i can correctly sweep yours to the curb for the garbage trucks.
Im only commenting because you are adopting an elitist position on texts that, however useful they may have been in the past, have worn out their usefulness and would best be retired...
What is the point of a quote from the iliad? What does it serve that modern english and superior thought could not service better?
Not really, the way you legitimise your interpretation, also justifies whatever 'they' want to do with their guns. When in reality, there are no guns.
Evangelical Christianity, as we know it, was hijacked by Darby in the 19th century by a small End Times cult known (touted!) as "Dispensationalism. But it depends how far you want to go back. All fundies (which includes atheists) only see with one eye: they are all incapable of true self-reflection, choosing to look for the devil (or evil) everywhere but where it really is, in the mirror.
I guess you read that once and that makes it true. Just like the people who read the bible once and that made that true. And since i dont believe in any supernatural beings, where do you think i suspect evil to reside?
As for fundamentalism, a fanatical train spotter might be called an extremist, but that doesnt imply that all people who dont spot trains at all, are also extremist train spotters, just retarded rhetoric that you have there buddy.
It never amazes me the amount of people who will dip their toes into the ocean and then think they know what's on the bottom. Until you've made a sincere journey into your own psyche (notice, I say your own psyche, not books, not Youtube videos), all of what you say will always be summed up in some weak syllogism. Wayman's videos are an expression of his inner work. Your remarks are are all just Ego inflation. If you're not going to be sincere, then why bother? But that's your inner conflict.
Youre insinuating that i cannot be sincere unless i reach the same conclusion as you?
Perhaps you are projecting your own experience onto me and presumably others who dont steal quotes from others and use them on comments as your own intellect :)
My comments are all ego deflation. I dont see the need to assign supernatural elements to our existence just because i want to be special.
No, I am not stating that you have to "reach my conclusion" to be sincere. I am stating that you have to be sincere, in the first place, which are not. You just want to argue for the sake of feeding your own agenda, which has nothing to do with Wayman, this channel, or even this subject matter (consciously). Subconsciously, however, it is an entirely different story, and this is real reason why you find Wayman so irritating. You are not separate from what you're observing.
Now this argument has nothing to do with wayman, you are correct, but then you would know all about that since you derailed it and took it into a completely new direction of utter wishful thinking. I dont find wayman irritating, i dont think there is any evidence to suggest that.
What does man possess that God does not have? Because of his littleness, puniness, and defencelessness against the Almighty, he possesses, as we have already suggested, a somewhat keener consciousness based on self-reflection: he must, in order to survive, always be mindful of his impotence. God has no need of this circumspection, for nowhere does he come up against an insuperable obstacle that would force him to hesitate and hence make him reflect on himself.
I have often found, by analyzing people's dreams, that the more outwardly religious the person, the more secretly haunted he is by self-doubt, and his trying convince others, is really his way of working through his unbelief, a fear of an unloving cosmic killjoy. These are my words. God needs you just as much as you need him; in fact, God needs you more: even by your own definition, he is more conscious of what love is than you could ever hope to be.
If it's such a great revelation to you, then, why do you do it yourself? It's funny, no one talks more about God than an atheist; I can never figure that one out. And, as for Santa Claus, I can assure you, as an archetype, St. Nick is far more real than the sincerity of any of your comments.
I dont think that the same standard applies to arguing against something. If someone was arguing to kill you, and you were arguing for him not to kill you, you would not be both as bad as each other.
I can tell you that your assertion that atheists talk more about god than theists is demonstrably false.
I will disregard your last sentance as you seem to be getting frustrated and making bold faced assertions because you have no other way of addressing my point.
Im discussing, and you are doing nothing more than attacking my style (incorrectly), while presenting nothing more than a few quotes that have succeded in making you feel intelligent...
Why would I need to post a quote on Wayaman's page to "intelligent"? I'm kinda like "the Jung guy." (You'll see my comments sprinkled all over the place.) I'm on a real inner journey, just like Wayman is. And you are one, too, you're just less just conscious of it, or else you wouldn't be taking out your anger on his page. No one's calling you "stupid." All of this inferiority crap is just in your head. But if you disrespect him, I will call you on it, because I enjoy his page.
i have no inferiority complex, and you grossly misunderstand. Im not disrespecting wayman, im expressing my lack of respect for archaic texts and waymans preconception that there is a bottomless well of wisdom in them and his noted reflex, similar to yours, to assert superiority over someone elses interpretation when after all, were dealing with stone age myths.
This "bottomless well," is the collective unconscious. & the "superiority" that you feel we emanate is actually a subconscious reflex on your part to resist it. If you want to observer how your subconscious is a true autonomous mechanism complimenting and compensating your waking behavior, record your dreams for a week, alongside a diary. You will see, empirically, how this dynamism works. Your conflict isn't really with W., it's with yourself. That's what's really irritating you. Capisce?
Not in the slightest, i subbed to wayman because he occasionally says something funny, not because i just want to express some irritation. I very rarely comment on any of his videos. You think there is a collective unconscious but you have nothing to back it up, and as a fellow human being i know for a fact you only believe that as a fundie believes his stuff (superficially)
Human consciousness (really, unconsciousness) has been around waaay before people started wearing crystals around their necks and chanting to the sun.
I didnt say anything about crystals, but its still new age...
Anyway, my point was that the wisdom in the ancient text is more what we project into them rather than what were instilled on their creation. If you want to talk about new age with someone then i suggest you find some new age video to comment on lol
I was just making a joke, which is sometimes hard to communicate in text comments. Wayman's channel has to do with comparative mythology (religion), and, more often than not, the works of Joseph Campbell and CG Jung.
Yet that is a basless assertion, i can see why you would like it to be true, but as with everything else in reality, wanting something to be true isnt the best way of understanding truth.
If you really understood the meaning of projection, you would, first, come to terms with the fact that you are never really separate from what you are observing. Just ask any quantum physicist. The same applies for Youtube comments. Until you really understand how all this time you've been projecting, yes, you, your own inner conflict onto Wayman's posts, you're not going to get it. You're just going 'round and 'round n the same circles, and claim you're being "attacked," etc.
Yes, ask a quantum physicist, becase they know all about how the universe works on a quantum level. It all totally makes sense so that anything they say will be the ultimate in understanding. I heard we had a good understanding of quantum reality so we dont need to research it any more LOL.
Shall i ask a quantum physicist about collective unconscious too?
And it is us that is going in circles, not just me, though ive been a clear as i can while you have been making new age assertions.
Do you know who Wolfgang Pauli was? David Bohm? Pauli worked directly with Jung, and Bohm's conception of a holographic universe (in which everything is a fractal subset of every other set), dovetails perfectly with Jung's conception of an implicate order, a universe of acausal interconnectedness, expressed at times by synchronicity. Jung was very empirical! If you were truly sincere, I'd love to dialog with you about this, but you're not. So, there's no need. Peace, K.
First of all you say that i can only be sincere if i dont read books, but have a true voyage into my inner psyche...
Now you are telling me that i have to read the books of two blokes who have no more understanding of the reality of things than you or i, and probably far less understanding than any leading neuroscientist to be sincere.
You have persisted in derailing this conversation that 1) was nothing to do with you and 2)had nothing to do with what you are talking about...
The other interesting thing, is that it seems that i have offended you, while at the same time, i know for a fact it would be impossible for anything you say to offend me. I guess that shines a light on each of our preconceptions and desires about reality and our ability to deal with our own egos.
There hasn't been any offense taken. You don't have to apologize to me. I come to this page because I like Wayman's videos, and a lot of his scholarship is right-on-the money for someone who's never been to seminary. It would be nice, though, that if you're going to talk smack, actually do your homework, and be sincere. If you're not, then, really, what's the point? (That's what it means to be in the grip of a projection.)
Its not been hijacked. You are one of a few billion people who think they can see the true nature of the bible and its purpose. In sociological terms, a good secular education is all thats needed and referring to the bible seems analogous to asking literate adults to read jill and john books, cute, but relatively unnecessary - with the added risk of utter misunderstanding.
Dreams are private myths, Myths are public dreams. I'm trying to wrestle the extremist shotgun from people so we don't become like the text 1984. You would make a good rational response squad member. The literature was hijacked. And you have a bad case of Stockholm syndrome. Every sheep has a pen. I think you wandered out of the pasture.
I highly suggest "Myths To Live By", also by Joseph Campbell. I have several of his books and they are enlightening, to say the least.
If you want to experience a modern version of these ancient mythos, you should all read comic books. Most characters are based on ancient archetypes and the metaphors used can be related to the individual. There are some great books that analyze this cultural phenomenon from a psychiatric and psychological view point.
I have always loved mythology just for itself, and that has come into conflict recently with my new perspectives on religion, I admit, but I get no less joy out of reading the old stories people used to tell each other around the fire.
I will do my best to submit a response tonight, and I know just what I'm going to do.
What is wrong with tolerance for religious diversity?Just because communists think it's clever to under mind to the moral centrality of the christian voting base by using comparative mythology as a weapon does not mean it will work or that there is no value in it spiritually.We have religious freedom here,and the excercise of that religious freedom is essential to keeping it.More over we believe humanity is generate not born in evil,like Commies and ,some so called Christians,Jews,and Muslims.
cstlljoey7 1 year ago
Comment removed
cstlljoey7 1 year ago
Comment removed
cstlljoey7 1 year ago
I'm tired of stepping on these supposed egg shells with the commies,and with religion.I think the that Jesus was just here to check in with some honesty,and mystery in his own right,and that the tradition was kept alive by the church so nobody else could bury it,but that he was not ultimately here to impose religious rule on everybody.And if he was then I have to depart from his views right there or we need another country for Christians proper.
cstlljoey7 1 year ago
@cstlljoey7 "more over we believe humanity is generate not born in evil...bla bla commies bla bla jews bla bla muslims bla bla bla" i have but one question... what obscure christian "sect" is... "we"....? are you beginning to understand the problem... ???
MpowerdAPE 1 year ago
Hey, you are a nice guy. Thanks!
kokesanusa 2 years ago
I just picked up the book myself. I'll let you know what I think.
politicalaficionado 2 years ago
Could you possibly use more mixed metaphors? You invoke 1984 like a true fear-monger Your response is exactly like a fundamentalists, so many attacks, that to respond would be exhausting. I understand that you have invested a lot of time in utter garbage and have a lot to protect and a lot of other people's rationalisations to fall back on, but from here it smells like a cow droppings in the universal pasture.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
Just meeting extreme statements with extreme statements. Don't come crying to me that you never graduated from Sunday school. I have as much time invested in garbage as you do . I believe we have our own piles to deal with. You stay on your side and I'll stay on mine. "I sat by the ships, a useless burden,
though there are better in Assembly-
so may this strife of men and gods be done with."- Iliad Book 18 Lines 104-107
ReligionThink 2 years ago
Except that you cannot refute my garbage in the same way that i can correctly sweep yours to the curb for the garbage trucks.
Im only commenting because you are adopting an elitist position on texts that, however useful they may have been in the past, have worn out their usefulness and would best be retired...
What is the point of a quote from the iliad? What does it serve that modern english and superior thought could not service better?
Aspartame69 2 years ago
I need a good answer to the works of Campbell and Jung before I start packing up the books. let me know when you stop having dreams at night.
ReligionThink 2 years ago
Just because I read a book that dose not mean that I'm an elitist or think I am. If that were the case I would favor all my own videos.
ReligionThink 2 years ago
No, when you denigrate other peoples interpretation you become an elitist.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
I responded to your elitist comment above. The books are not the end result but just a trail guide to get where your going. People forget that.
ReligionThink 2 years ago
Then you just handed the extremist shotgun back to the people who you think are hijacking the bible and legitimised their diverse interpretations.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
No, I just made them responsible gun owners. Hang on I have to get a coffee, then bed. I don't wanna make the most discussed list.
ReligionThink 2 years ago
Not really, the way you legitimise your interpretation, also justifies whatever 'they' want to do with their guns. When in reality, there are no guns.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
Evangelical Christianity, as we know it, was hijacked by Darby in the 19th century by a small End Times cult known (touted!) as "Dispensationalism. But it depends how far you want to go back. All fundies (which includes atheists) only see with one eye: they are all incapable of true self-reflection, choosing to look for the devil (or evil) everywhere but where it really is, in the mirror.
keytoothed 2 years ago
I guess you read that once and that makes it true. Just like the people who read the bible once and that made that true. And since i dont believe in any supernatural beings, where do you think i suspect evil to reside?
As for fundamentalism, a fanatical train spotter might be called an extremist, but that doesnt imply that all people who dont spot trains at all, are also extremist train spotters, just retarded rhetoric that you have there buddy.
Words have meaning. use them. with honesty.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
It never amazes me the amount of people who will dip their toes into the ocean and then think they know what's on the bottom. Until you've made a sincere journey into your own psyche (notice, I say your own psyche, not books, not Youtube videos), all of what you say will always be summed up in some weak syllogism. Wayman's videos are an expression of his inner work. Your remarks are are all just Ego inflation. If you're not going to be sincere, then why bother? But that's your inner conflict.
keytoothed 2 years ago
Youre insinuating that i cannot be sincere unless i reach the same conclusion as you?
Perhaps you are projecting your own experience onto me and presumably others who dont steal quotes from others and use them on comments as your own intellect :)
My comments are all ego deflation. I dont see the need to assign supernatural elements to our existence just because i want to be special.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
No, I am not stating that you have to "reach my conclusion" to be sincere. I am stating that you have to be sincere, in the first place, which are not. You just want to argue for the sake of feeding your own agenda, which has nothing to do with Wayman, this channel, or even this subject matter (consciously). Subconsciously, however, it is an entirely different story, and this is real reason why you find Wayman so irritating. You are not separate from what you're observing.
keytoothed 2 years ago
Now this argument has nothing to do with wayman, you are correct, but then you would know all about that since you derailed it and took it into a completely new direction of utter wishful thinking. I dont find wayman irritating, i dont think there is any evidence to suggest that.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
Let me know when you stop looking for the answer to your dreams in other peoples books.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
What does man possess that God does not have? Because of his littleness, puniness, and defencelessness against the Almighty, he possesses, as we have already suggested, a somewhat keener consciousness based on self-reflection: he must, in order to survive, always be mindful of his impotence. God has no need of this circumspection, for nowhere does he come up against an insuperable obstacle that would force him to hesitate and hence make him reflect on himself.
keytoothed 2 years ago
I have often found, by analyzing people's dreams, that the more outwardly religious the person, the more secretly haunted he is by self-doubt, and his trying convince others, is really his way of working through his unbelief, a fear of an unloving cosmic killjoy. These are my words. God needs you just as much as you need him; in fact, God needs you more: even by your own definition, he is more conscious of what love is than you could ever hope to be.
keytoothed 2 years ago
No great revelation here, just like those religious people who are most anti gay turn out to be sucking cock as often as they can.
I guess you think santa clause is more conscious of love than real people too?
Aspartame69 2 years ago
If it's such a great revelation to you, then, why do you do it yourself? It's funny, no one talks more about God than an atheist; I can never figure that one out. And, as for Santa Claus, I can assure you, as an archetype, St. Nick is far more real than the sincerity of any of your comments.
keytoothed 2 years ago
I dont think that the same standard applies to arguing against something. If someone was arguing to kill you, and you were arguing for him not to kill you, you would not be both as bad as each other.
I can tell you that your assertion that atheists talk more about god than theists is demonstrably false.
I will disregard your last sentance as you seem to be getting frustrated and making bold faced assertions because you have no other way of addressing my point.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
I'm "frustrated"? What am I frustrated about?
keytoothed 2 years ago
Im discussing, and you are doing nothing more than attacking my style (incorrectly), while presenting nothing more than a few quotes that have succeded in making you feel intelligent...
Thats simply projection.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
Why would I need to post a quote on Wayaman's page to "intelligent"? I'm kinda like "the Jung guy." (You'll see my comments sprinkled all over the place.) I'm on a real inner journey, just like Wayman is. And you are one, too, you're just less just conscious of it, or else you wouldn't be taking out your anger on his page. No one's calling you "stupid." All of this inferiority crap is just in your head. But if you disrespect him, I will call you on it, because I enjoy his page.
keytoothed 2 years ago
i have no inferiority complex, and you grossly misunderstand. Im not disrespecting wayman, im expressing my lack of respect for archaic texts and waymans preconception that there is a bottomless well of wisdom in them and his noted reflex, similar to yours, to assert superiority over someone elses interpretation when after all, were dealing with stone age myths.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
This "bottomless well," is the collective unconscious. & the "superiority" that you feel we emanate is actually a subconscious reflex on your part to resist it. If you want to observer how your subconscious is a true autonomous mechanism complimenting and compensating your waking behavior, record your dreams for a week, alongside a diary. You will see, empirically, how this dynamism works. Your conflict isn't really with W., it's with yourself. That's what's really irritating you. Capisce?
keytoothed 2 years ago
Not in the slightest, i subbed to wayman because he occasionally says something funny, not because i just want to express some irritation. I very rarely comment on any of his videos. You think there is a collective unconscious but you have nothing to back it up, and as a fellow human being i know for a fact you only believe that as a fundie believes his stuff (superficially)
Aspartame69 2 years ago
If I am projecting something (anything) onto you, let me know, and I promise, I will thank you for it, and I mean this sincerely.
keytoothed 2 years ago
of course you do, because you said it..........
anyhoo, have fun with that new age stuff.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
Human consciousness (really, unconsciousness) has been around waaay before people started wearing crystals around their necks and chanting to the sun.
keytoothed 2 years ago
I didnt say anything about crystals, but its still new age...
Anyway, my point was that the wisdom in the ancient text is more what we project into them rather than what were instilled on their creation. If you want to talk about new age with someone then i suggest you find some new age video to comment on lol
Aspartame69 2 years ago
I was just making a joke, which is sometimes hard to communicate in text comments. Wayman's channel has to do with comparative mythology (religion), and, more often than not, the works of Joseph Campbell and CG Jung.
keytoothed 2 years ago
Your insincerity, my friend, is the garbage.
keytoothed 2 years ago
Yet that is a basless assertion, i can see why you would like it to be true, but as with everything else in reality, wanting something to be true isnt the best way of understanding truth.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
If you really understood the meaning of projection, you would, first, come to terms with the fact that you are never really separate from what you are observing. Just ask any quantum physicist. The same applies for Youtube comments. Until you really understand how all this time you've been projecting, yes, you, your own inner conflict onto Wayman's posts, you're not going to get it. You're just going 'round and 'round n the same circles, and claim you're being "attacked," etc.
keytoothed 2 years ago
Yes, ask a quantum physicist, becase they know all about how the universe works on a quantum level. It all totally makes sense so that anything they say will be the ultimate in understanding. I heard we had a good understanding of quantum reality so we dont need to research it any more LOL.
Shall i ask a quantum physicist about collective unconscious too?
And it is us that is going in circles, not just me, though ive been a clear as i can while you have been making new age assertions.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
Do you know who Wolfgang Pauli was? David Bohm? Pauli worked directly with Jung, and Bohm's conception of a holographic universe (in which everything is a fractal subset of every other set), dovetails perfectly with Jung's conception of an implicate order, a universe of acausal interconnectedness, expressed at times by synchronicity. Jung was very empirical! If you were truly sincere, I'd love to dialog with you about this, but you're not. So, there's no need. Peace, K.
keytoothed 2 years ago
First of all you say that i can only be sincere if i dont read books, but have a true voyage into my inner psyche...
Now you are telling me that i have to read the books of two blokes who have no more understanding of the reality of things than you or i, and probably far less understanding than any leading neuroscientist to be sincere.
You have persisted in derailing this conversation that 1) was nothing to do with you and 2)had nothing to do with what you are talking about...
Aspartame69 2 years ago
The other interesting thing, is that it seems that i have offended you, while at the same time, i know for a fact it would be impossible for anything you say to offend me. I guess that shines a light on each of our preconceptions and desires about reality and our ability to deal with our own egos.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
There hasn't been any offense taken. You don't have to apologize to me. I come to this page because I like Wayman's videos, and a lot of his scholarship is right-on-the money for someone who's never been to seminary. It would be nice, though, that if you're going to talk smack, actually do your homework, and be sincere. If you're not, then, really, what's the point? (That's what it means to be in the grip of a projection.)
keytoothed 2 years ago
i didnt talk smack... what are you talking about? Perhaps you are reading a little more than what is on the screen?
Aspartame69 2 years ago
Its not been hijacked. You are one of a few billion people who think they can see the true nature of the bible and its purpose. In sociological terms, a good secular education is all thats needed and referring to the bible seems analogous to asking literate adults to read jill and john books, cute, but relatively unnecessary - with the added risk of utter misunderstanding.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
Dreams are private myths, Myths are public dreams. I'm trying to wrestle the extremist shotgun from people so we don't become like the text 1984. You would make a good rational response squad member. The literature was hijacked. And you have a bad case of Stockholm syndrome. Every sheep has a pen. I think you wandered out of the pasture.
ReligionThink 2 years ago
I wager that there is no contemporary lesson to be learnt from he bible that i and many others didnt already know by the age of 14.
Aspartame69 2 years ago
That's it you are NOT winning the book!!!
ReligionThink 2 years ago
I highly suggest "Myths To Live By", also by Joseph Campbell. I have several of his books and they are enlightening, to say the least.
If you want to experience a modern version of these ancient mythos, you should all read comic books. Most characters are based on ancient archetypes and the metaphors used can be related to the individual. There are some great books that analyze this cultural phenomenon from a psychiatric and psychological view point.
Hermetiqa 2 years ago
I already read "Myths To Live By" by Campbell.
You wrote : "There are some great books that analyze this cultural phenomenon from a psychiatric and psychological view point."
Which books ? Do you have any suggestions ?
Thank you.
isobel1982 2 years ago
I have always loved mythology just for itself, and that has come into conflict recently with my new perspectives on religion, I admit, but I get no less joy out of reading the old stories people used to tell each other around the fire.
I will do my best to submit a response tonight, and I know just what I'm going to do.
AbbeyNormal 2 years ago
You are an asset to the Youtube community. Kind regards to you, your wife and family.
TheWisemonkey8 2 years ago