World Opinion: Israel's Right to Exist on Trial - CBN.com

[steute2011]

Israel delegitimizes herself by maintaining a 40+ year illegal occupation, building illegal settlements, committing human rights violations against the Arab Palestinians and ignoring international law / norms.

[slickrickdarula]

this video is bullshit: The Goldstone report called the latest attack against Israel? No that was the investigation of the Gaza massacre. Every criticism of Israel is equated to ''being an enemy of Israel'' such bullshit.

[TheAimanos]

Wow, I cant beleive they claimed the video was fake....

Israel shouldnt be where it is, but its too late to mvoe it now. So there should be a one state solution where arabs are given equal rights. they need to stop looking at the natives like they are scum..

[RnBramwell]

@TheAimanos You are right, there should be a one state solution where arabs are given equal rights. I guess you did not know that there is one state that gives arabs EQUAL rights => Israel. Arabs who live in Israel have more rights, happier women, greater wealth (other than the stinking 'Princes') than most Arabs in Arab nations!

[StraussBR]

i'm not questioning israel's right to exist, i'm questioning their right to violate international laws on the ONU

israel ocupies their land

israeli IDF kills more woman and children than hamas militants

israel blocks ships from entering gaza

that is all documented truth

[RnBramwell]

@StraussBR Self defense is not a violation of international law (IL). And, the very idea of IL is absurd - like Iran, N. Korea, The PLO etc. give a damn about it!

[steute2011]

@RnBramwell There is no right of self defense afforded to an illegal occupier.

[RnBramwell]

@steute2011

Did you miss these 'small' facts:

the Palestinians never had a land of their own?

the Palestinians sided with the losers of WW2?

Israel was created legally, by the treaties formed when the Allies won WW2?

Arabic nations do not give Palestinians land either (Lebanon was more Palestinian than Israel)?

Arabs in Israel live peacefully, except for violence begun by Palestinians?

Israel's politics do more to protect its citizens Rights to Life, Liberty and Property than in Arab nations?

[steute2011]

@RnBramwell Yes Israel was created legally in the land of Palestine. Operative word being "in" not all. My comment refers to the illegally occupied territories, not within Israel proper. You can not illegally occupy and oppress people and then when they resist, kill them and claim self-defense...It's absurd! Why would Arabic nations have to give land to the Palestinians, when they are entitled under international law to the West Bank and Gaza? Even the Golan Heights is illegally occupied.

[RnBramwell]

@steute2011 Well you concede that part.

No those territories were not illegally occupied. Israel was attacked several times, ending the Int'l Law you cite. Those territories were well suited for setting up a military assault on Israel. The IDF fought for & won them for self protection.

The Arabs gambled & lost. *Their* attack was 'illegal', their losses deserved.

The Israelis are oppressing the Palestinians? That is absurd. The Israelis give them 100s of tons of safe goods for free, daily!

[steute2011]

@RnBramwell The basis for the international law as it pertains to illegal occupation is "inadmissibility of the acquisition of territory by war". This clearly defined premise does not make exception for wars fought in self defense. Therefore the territories capture after the 1967 are illegally occupied. Israel is the only country in the world that interprets these territories as disputed. Palestinians "not" oppressed? Check every human rights web site in the world, including B'Tsalem.

[RnBramwell]

@steute2011 easily found:

Your reference clearly applies only to an offensive war. Else, the resolution would be an incentive for aggression. If the defender repels an attacking nation & acquires territory in the process, the former interpretation would require the defender to return all the land it took. Thus, aggressors would have little to lose because they would be insured against the main consequence of defeat.

There is no such thing as human rights, only Individual Rights-(Ur sites fail!)

[steute2011]

@RnBramwell I tell you what, for argument sake, let's say your right on the law. Your assertion that Israel was defending herself in 1967, is completely false. Israel attacked Egypt first in a preemptive attack, which is not considered defensive, because it give the preemptive attacker the right to assume the other side was going to attack. This is why the preamble of UN resolution 242 states just what I said "inadmissibility of the acquisition of territory by war" So YOU fail there!

[RnBramwell]

@steute2011 The preemptive story is not that simple. Israel had suffered numerous guerrilla rocket attacks that killed its citizens. The IDF stationed itself in opposition to the attacks, knowing that the nearby Arab nations (esp. Egypt) were well aware of who the attackers were and were supporting them. Israel relied a great deal on the Suez canal for trade, and warned that if Egypt blocked Israeli use, it would an act of war. Egypt closed the canal, Israel struck. Egypt went to war. . . .

[RnBramwell]

. . . the Arab nations support the guerrilla attacks, & act as dogs biting at a cow, drawing blood & retreating to attack again. The cow rarely fights back, save for the odd kick. Each time it kicks the dogs all scream in fear & anger that the attack was unprovoked. Of course, it WAS provoked. When the cow hooks a dog (Arab Nation) with a horn, everyone calls it aggression etc. NO, the dogs were the aggressors, plainly.  If Israel were not there the Arabs would be killing each other!!

[steute2011]

@RnBramwell You seem to suggest that oppressed and illegally occupied peoples should not resist by any means necessary, while I beg to differ. If you believe that somehow Israel is the victim in this, then you have managed to turn logic on it head. As for you being British Canadian, it is really of no consequence as it pertains to the subject matter. I believe that your views on this conflict are not rooted in right and wrong, but rather something more sinister, i.e., disdain for Arabs?

[RnBramwell]

@steute2011 One more surmised insult, & this is too small minded for me to waste my time.

Yes, I *think* it evident: Israel is neither aggressor nor oppressor, but seeing why depends on several abstract political topics. 500 char points require patience & considerable thought to not leap to unintended conclusions.

1. Nat'ns are not equal & are not people. Some nations largely respect citizen's Individual Rights, many do not. A nation ruled by dictators, deserves no Int'l respect. . . .

[RnBramwell]

cont'd ... Int'l respect only props up the dictators against their citizens. War on them is up to the outside nation. No democracy yet has started such a war, and permanently occupied the nation.

2. Since int'l law treats nations equally, it is unjust. Since there is no overseer, it is meaningless. Indeed, that is why nations must stay sovereign - to avoid World Dictatorship (as USSR & now Islam plans)

Israel is one of a handful of nations that (mostly) respects Individual Rights....

[RnBramwell]

cont'd ... Israel is surrounded by nations that do not. This is particularly true of Palestinians (whose own governing leaders use citizens as shields, & as political pawns). The IDF's preemptive actions, therefore, violate nothing, & are a legitimate protection of its citizens; Int'l Law be damned. Given the endless scimitar-waving of Arab nations, Israel is TOO restrained ─which prolongs the conflict.

Please include my other comments in your judgment of this set. They fortify it.

[steute2011]

@RnBramwell Your reply here proves my point rather nicely. You are giving one variation of what led to the surprise attack by Israel and others will give very different accounts. In the end there is no way to say for certain that Egypt was going to attack Israel. All sides will argue their version of events as fact and I am pretty sure you will be no exception.

[steute2011]

@RnBramwell Now perhaps in Israel there is no such thing as human rights, but I can assure you the rest of the civilized world does in fact recognize human rights! You need not make such ridiculous statements. I know that Israel does not care much for international law / norms / human rights and that sort of thing, but some times you have to just say it rather than try and make outlandish interpretations of established facts.

[RnBramwell]

@steute2011 Interesting, you assume I'm Israeli. I am British Canadian.

Human Rights are a different beast from Individual Rights. Thomas Jefferson once said, "No man has a Right, to that which another man has a Right to take away". Human Rights (UN version, French Constitution etc) all require some individuals to supply something to other individuals (service to the nation, education, shelter, food for kids etc.). Human Rights do not support Individual Freedom, they pave the way to tyranny.

[steute2011]

@RnBramwell Regardless of your philosophical interpretation of Human Rights vs Individual Rights is also just lacking substance as it pertains to the subject at hand. Human Rights are very basic rights afforded all people under international humanitarian law and all nations are expected to respect those rights, which Israel does not.

[smkwaterjack]

@mikeybrumbrum then your not really aware are you?

[mikeybrumbrum]

a world without israel is crazy !

who would lie, steal, cheat, rob, murder and misslead the nations into sin and war ?

[smkwaterjack]

@mikeybrumbrum probably all the muslim nations thats who, along with france, germany and russia

[MCVixenVee]

Zionism is evil !

[MCVixenVee]

Zionism is evil !

[generationll]

His name is BILL BOYKIN

[daflamer]

until terror reach these lefties they be in favor of barbaric hamas and other dark regims