John Black's Wild PPG CRASH!

[elvanioleite]

este se fudeu,acho...

[tailwheelflier]

wow

[jamesbond682]

(2) Would something cause a rotor that strong? You were flying along nicely and then, suddenly, with no warning, your wing collapsed. I am very interested in what you have to say. I'm sorry that it happened to you, but because it did, maybe I and others can read the flight and conditions better.Thank you. James.

[jamesbond682]

(1) I am new to PPG's. What were the conditions and factors that led to this collapse? Do you think that the same thing would have happened with a wing like a Prima 4 (33)? To me it looks like maybe a thermal, but I don't think that is the case in your incident. What would have caused a turbulence that would collapse your wing on that day and time?

[albedran2]

My god, You are one lucky man.

Do you think not keeping the breaks within like ear level played a role in this?

It never happened to me, but i think frontal most of the time is a result of no breaks aplied.

[MrUAV100]

Sorry I meant to put WIND is our main enemy at times for PPG, now we. Typing error.

[PPGAddict]

I did not have a reserve at the time and chose to fly in bad conditions. This was total pilot error. I have since trained with Chris Santacroce and gained valuable knowledge of the sport more in depth. This sport can be as safe as you decide to make it. I also have all types of equipment and am a certified instructor. Give me a call if you have any questions 1-719-246-4834 John

[MrUAV100]

@PPGAddict Thanks for that. I guess we all take risks at times, just to get an hour or two of flight. I also have had some close calls in Cessna, Piper aircraft but this is one type of aircraft that I will make certain 100% that conditions are in my favour. The real difficulty in any flying is that we is our main enemy, rotor and other 'bad air' is invisible.

Glad ou're back flying and hope you don't ever experience this or similar again.

[MrUAV100]

@PPGAddict Thanks for that. I guess we all take risks at times, just to get an hour or two of flight. I also have had some close calls in Cessna, Piper aircraft but this is one type of aircraft that I will make certain 100% that conditions are in my favour. The real difficulty in any flying is that we is our main enemy, rotor and other 'bad air' is invisible.

Glad you're back flying and hope you don't ever experience this or similar again.

[uncagedone]

@PPGAddict

John,

what was the wing and the motor you were flying?

thanx

[MrUAV100]

Hi, I'm pleased to hear that you are at least alive, not too good about the back though :0(

I really want to get into this sport as the PPL fixed wing is full of rules and reg's from the CAA in the UK. It is also expensive as hell to fly a Cessna 172 or similar with rocketing fuel prices too. It looked very scary and one ting I need to ask... Did you have a resrve chute when this happened?

[jolicoq]

how to recover from stall?

[PPGAddict]

@jolicoq The throttle was stuck to full power and I had riser twist.

[jolicoq]

how to recover from stall?

[PPGAddict]

Thank you nerblebun.

[nerblebun]

I'm just glad your alive.

[BrettAubrey]

@MiraclePieCo (above) re your amazing 'terminal denial' crap. Would you comment on a car crash video:

How these "drivers" (more like passive passengers (???)) can watch this crash and think it won't happen to them is beyond me. A case of TERMINAL denial.

Who says they don't think it can happen to them? Just the most inane of speculation with zero foundation! And do you stop driving, flying or walking when you see something bad happening to people doing these? A case of TERMINAL stupid.

[alexiabeth]

Hi Miraclepiece, I am sure with your extensive experience, you could tell at the start of the video, the PPG is flying into wind, so the turbulence come from behind the cameraman. (so you cant see if there is a mountain or not)There is snow on the ground and a clear sky with cirrus, so unlikly this is thermal! Lee Rotor has be know to be the cause of commercail airline and fixed wing crashes. Lots of Airports are known for it, Check out Gibralter on a windy day, or some of the Greek islands

[3habaneros]

the more i see paragliders crash the more i like my hang glider

[dedefuori2]

hey john, just out of curiosity, what wing were you using? it seemed a pretty violent reaction.

[alexiabeth]

@winterka100

In fact the collapsable nature of paragliding wings is a good thing. A safety valve! It didnt break! ok 50 more feet would have been handy for this pilot. I have had people come from HG to PG as they have had incidents in turbulence that have turned the HG upside down, fallen into the wing and broken it.

[miraclepieco]

@alexiabeth Show me even ONE video on YouTube where that's happened. In 30+ years of hang gliding I have flown into rotors strong enough to flip the glider twice. In both cases the wing simply righted itself (as they are designed to do) and kept flying with no damage. The only time a modern hang glider will break is in the event of a failed loop attempt, with massive rotation and tumble - over 10 G's.

[alexiabeth]

@winterka100 Hi, I have neen flying these since 93, paragliding since 89. and I am a Instructor in Both sports (used to run a hang gliding school too. If you think your hang glider performs any better in Rotor, you are kidding yourself!

[winterka100]

@alexiabeth Was that a rotor? If it was, it had a really sharp edge to it. Looked more like a thermal to me. You know more than I admittedly do about paragliders , so can you tell me are there strong thermic conditions where hang glider pilots will happily fly while being avoided by paraglider pilots. I'm under the impression that this is the case.

[miraclepieco]

@alexiabeth What rotor? The place is completely totally open. And yes, hang gliders do perform much better in rotors. It's sometimes a wild ride but they keep their shape and they keep flying.

[miraclepieco]

@alexiabeth What rotor - from a peanut on the ground a mile away? The place is completely totally open. And yes, hang gliders do perform much better in rotors. It's sometimes a wild ride but they keep their shape and they keep flying.

[winterka100]

I'll happily admit that I don't know it all about paragliders.In fact, I used to think that paramotors looked like great fun machines. Please enlighten me on how training could have prevented this crash. Maybe I'm incorrectly assuming that that the pilot wasn't properly trained.

[climb1028]

@winterka100

As someone who has flown a PG many dozens of hours in strong thermic and occasionally just plain turbulent conditions - I know how dangerous the air can be - especially to novice pilots or those who don't train. I have trained enough to feel what the air is doing and predict, prevent or control nearly all collapses the conditions throw my way. In no way am I fool proof - I may still get hurt or die in this sport - but experience (SIV training and time in strong air) goes a LONG way.

[TheNovaAxon]

@winterka100

Thats the same reaction as my grandma last did while seeing a carcrash. She grew up in the 30's, then the average car per inhabitant was 1:10.000 but she didnt adept to 2011. Winterka, grow up & adept, dont be the i know it all better, while hanggliders do kill as well. Training is the key. Blue skies & happy landings

[sundancer84]

terrible collapse in damn danger height!!!! Glad you are alive!!! just scaring me while watching... brrrr.

[ClanHalo001]

was he ok?

[FrekeOne]

You were lucky! While Your back grows back together You could develope some kind of "giant ball" airbag (like the mars rovers had) or a small rocket to deploy the emergency shute fast with the push of a button? I think that could save a lot of lives/injuries over time.

[tailwheelflier]

interesting

[mrmonstercat1]

Never Fly midday ever.

[PPGAddict]

@mrmonstercat1 Thanks for watching and commenting. I actually do fly mid day here on the beach with wind coming off the water and I am a thermally trained paraglider pilot as well. Mid day can be flown with additional risks but definitely not without proper training. The incident above was mountain rotor in it's severest form and if I had weighed all of the information I would have never gone airb gone here this day.

[miraclepieco]

@PPGAddict What mountain? I dont see any mountains even close. A rotor is the unpredictably swirling air directly behind an upwind obstacle. Perhaps there was a peanut on the ground one mile away? Dude, if you can't fly a PPG in smooth winter air without having the thing fold up like a Japanese fan, you really need to reexamine the type of craft you're trusting your life to.

[longplaybrazil]

The detail was that the body was already pointed 90 degrees down. It was at this moment that I thought I would die, as was likely to fall on him and sinks direct, and while I thought I'd throw the book but with the canopy covering me, not come. As the speed of my fall was faster than the advance of the canopy, he reopened completely. I'm still scared.

[longplaybrazil]

Got a descendant of a thermal that took me to a 15m drop, I turned 180 degrees, was so fast that not even remember which side turned (left or right). It was when I saw the canopy coming backwards and followed later by the height of my feet, in front of me!

[longplaybrazil]

On 12th August I had exactly the same experience,12:10 am , I was very shaken and filled with heat, was a transition area between the mountains and coastal lowlands, therefore, was at an altitude of 270m to sea level. At one huge area at 13:00, the size of several football composed entirely cleared and leveled, I was amazed it took me time to think it was going to die!

[CurtShaw22]

Wow, I wanted one of these until I saw this video! I figured as long as my takeoff went well and I avoided trees and buildings and poles I would be pretty safe hanging under that parachute but I guess not! I would rather have something with a rigid wing than something that can just collapse with no warning like this just did. NO THANKS

[dreamweaver961]

@CurtShaw22 Trust me you still want one, Just be informed on the weather and make sure to have a reserve. I am a self taught pilot (I do not recommend) but with proper training and instruction about the weather it will be the most fun you will have. If you have a rigid wing you will have to have a larger place to take off and land. What you watched in the video is the exception rather than the rule.

[lenniepincher]

Comments from PPGAddict are from John Black "the man who fell to earth" ascot were. He seems to be ok now. But broke his back at the time!!

[marco21falcon]

I am sure this has been asked a gazillion times. How did the pilot fair in the incedent?

[hartman12349]

ou ou, wind shear, no response pilot

[galegregory97comcast]

i hope you dont ever do that again john

[abracadabratubele]

I'd rather hang gliding. I do not trust paragliding

[MegaSPORT2]

You looked to be around 75 to 100' up. Were you flying with a reserve? PPG reserves can save you lots of pain with as little as 50' of altitude. I'm glad to hear your ok.

[jwboll]

oooooh. he hit pretty hard. The pole looked like it might have slowed him down, just a little.

Pretty scary to look up and realize you're going down!

[actionjack533]

I had the same type of collapse from 200 feet and luckily ended up in the only 60 foot tree in the area. I was unhurt and missed high tension power ines by 10 feet. There was no wind and it was 5pm in the afternoon. Temperature 75. My chute just collapsed. My instructor says it was a thermal. How are you supposed to predict these things and stay away from them?

[PPGAddict]

@actionjack533 You will never predict everything but a better understanding of weather and conditions goes a long way. Maneuvers clinics over the water allow you to experience in a controlled environment deflations and how to correct them before they turn into potential disaster.

[9secondsflat]

what causes the wing to deflate and collapse?

[PPGAddict]

This was @ 1:30pm and the deflation was more than likely rotor from nearby mountains.

[9secondsflat]

what is "rotor" thanks in advance

[PPGAddict]

@9secondsflat if you look at water flowing over a rock and how turbulent it gets......the air does the same thing. That is rotor.

[dorbie]

@9secondsflat Rotor is a vortex of rotating air usually due to turbulence from terrain or obstacles. It can interrupt laminar flow on wings and even buffet a wing and cause it to fold as it did in this video. What you see in the video is a frontal collapse due to "wind shear", probably in the form or rotational vortex. But you can never be really sure since it's invisible.

[dorbie]

@9secondsflat The wing suffered a "frontal" where the nose and right side was pushed down and under, initiating the collapse and spin. It's basically air turbulance / wind shear / rotor.

[sheepsfoot2]

.what time of day ,,,did this happen.....?...

[GeorgiaBoii32]

damn dude...

[PPGAddict]

Thank you sensi we all learn from mistakes our own and others. I am well healed now and if you look at some of my recent videos you will see better than before :)

[SensiBleu]

Crashes happen. I love motorcycles but have been in three wrecks and still ride. The hard lesson is to calculate your risks, right? From your comments I assume you're all better. Thanks for posting this and happy flyin' - glad you're ok :)

[payntingdotcom]

What is scary about this is that the pilot did nothing wrong. The conditions were good. Clear, sunny, cold. If you can't fly in that, then something is wrong with the sport.

This video got me out of paramotoring, and into powered hang gliding. The wing being collapsible, may be a selling point for reasons of transport, but it is fatal flaw for any aircraft to have.

I was seduced into the sport for that reason. But it is not worth it. The wing is simply too unstable to be trusted.

[PPGAddict]

BCsupport I did cooperate with this production company they sell entertainment but also agreed to also show the side of our sport that is wonderful. John

[Xreay7]

What's appened with john

[wondu]

Was not under the impression that the person was hurt. Sorry if I offended you bcsupport. Thanks for the nice words of reply. Much appreciated.

[wondu]

Does anyone know how i can get in touch with John Black from this video? I am a segment producer for TRU TV's Most Daring and would like to get in touch with him and the person who shot the video for licensing and interviews. Offering money. If you have any information, please send me a message on how to contact him or call us at 323-468-4772.

Thank you,

WD

[bcsupport]

Go some where else. You might as well sell drugs or something else evil. You are trying to make money on something thats has costed somelese thier life or ability to walk.

[flyhghgy]

OUCH! Glad you survived!

[zorackthegrate]

Serious deflation. Not seen that level of activity in a mix layer, rotor sure. Looks like you might have had some wing to weight shift to, but you were already torque spun under the wing - were you on cruise control? Sounds like gas right to the ground.

Thanks for sharing this that folks might learn from it. Did your frame/cage break the fall at all? Heal fast, fly safe.

[tommytipitcup]

You can get nasty bits like that in the winter under high pressure. Strong wind gradients and shear layers. Someone was looking after you that day.

[myndenway]

I don't get it. Winter flying on a clear day. Why should there be a down draft. Those are microbursts and you get them on a summer day as a storm approaches. Cold clear air should be like glass. The glider got broadsided from above the starboard wing. Makes no sense to me.

[wmcs11]

Pucker factor...WOW! No bowel movemwnt for you for the next 3 months!

[tenworks]

I'm the dog, I am just in here taking a sh*t...hey John, had a great time with you today....

[cheapthrillsII]

Tell us again. What exactly caused the sail to collapse and how could it be avoided. Explain the topography around your fly zone including the wind direction and temperature. Thanks.

[mahalo111]

Looks like the only pole around saved you.

[henrywangyi]

so dangerous and good luck.

[PPGAddict]

Actually not very dangerous I just made a bad weather decision. If you choose the times you fly carefully you have little chance of being injured. Thank you.

[maxicardenas]

what was the bad weather decision?

[PPGAddict]

I went up when i had some doubts earlier about the conditions. There were high winds aloft.

[AngeloatBat]

When your shoot initally folded up, was it do to a small wind shear/down draft? Is the shoot actually refered to as a para-sail?

[PPGAddict]

Nikki it was crazy he was just so calm typical Jim lol Hope you are doing well.

[PPGAddict]

Peter thank you I esentially went up flying with a doubt in my mind about the conditions and when I got up i believe I caught rotor off the mountains.

[skagirl23]

Oh Crap is right! Dad couldn't have said it better...I hope you're feeling better, John!!

[Sagge41]

Sorry about the accident, but could you please tell me what went wrong? Did you hit a downwind or what happened?

Peter

Europe

[FlyingMonkey983333]

Dude that was seriously freaky, are you going to fly again???

[PPGAddict]

Itwas pretty crazy but yes I will fly again I love it too much to give it up.

[jxwhee]

Lucky you weren't higher up.

[PPGAddict]

It just worked out right because even if I was lower I would have hit in total free fall and higher who knows.

[PPGAddict]

Thanks Craig..........nothing like falling out of the sky like a rock lol. Broke my back but Doc says Ill be healed in 3 months.

[SAFENAFE1985]

U BOKE YOUR BACK!!! wow thats bad. I really wanna start doing this but id be worried about a collapse.

[craigsunny198]

glad your okay. looked pretty bad on video.

[PPGAddict]

Thanks Dave it is going to take a while for the back to heal not sure how long I will be out of flying but it is too long for me.

[PPGdave]

See, John; that's what happens when you move to Colorado! Come back to Panama City Beach and I'll keep you safe! (Seriously, I'm glad you weren't hurt too badly. You've got a great attitude. I'll save you a spot in the sand and see you back in the air by next summer!)