Christmas: Christian or Pagan? 1 of 7 (Jim McClarty of GCA)

[Liebhabaer1974]

John 10: 14-16

14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.

=>

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

[jforsy01]

The part about the minister I will have to disagree with, on this comment and the one above.

The Bible is clear that those who sin are of the devil, how much more those who preach sin is ok from the pulpit. Anyone who says we can not overcome sin is a wolf in sheep's clothing and change grace into license for sin.

I believed the lie that everyone sins for 10 years in a baptist church until I learned the truth. I couldn't believe someone in a pulpit would twist God's Word like that.

[jforsy01]

Thank you so much for that information QuietBuck! I have only been a Christian for about 8 months and I was not aware of many of these things. Thank you for helping me understand more of what He wants.

Can you help me though? I dont understand why a picture of a cross is wrong even after reading those scriptures. Isnt that about carved idols? I am only trying to serve Jesus?(Yahweh? Yeshua? Elohim? Sorry, I dont know the proper name?) Are you saying the word Lord is wrong?Thanks again

[jforsy01]

"Have I therefore become your enemy because I tell you the truth?"

"These things I write to you that you might not sin."

"Beware brethren...lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin."

"Pursue peace with all people, and holiness, without which no one will see the Lord"

He will say to many in that day "depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!"

"as He who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct"

"Beware false teachers...in sheeps clothing"

[jforsy01]

It amazes me that a pastor who realizes that christmas is evil is still so blinded to the evil of television. I am sure VH1 that he endorses from the pulpit is full of graphic sexual images just as the rest of cable tv is and yet he acts as though its ok while condemning other things.

Why does this happen? The fear of God is not taught. Sin is not shown as the enemy of God but something that we cannot overcome. Once saved always saved is the lie behind hypocrisy. Sinners are not Christians!

[diligentile]

Hi Jforsy01,

Can show me where Jim endorses VH1? or are you simply bearing false witness?

[jforsy01]

Hi Diligente,

Around 1 minute he says "I have satellite TV, so I hit the little guide to see what's on and I saw that VH1 was just playing christmas music, so I said ok let's see what that is"

He endorsed it by saying that, as a pastor, it is ok to turn to such channels; as well as pay $50-100 a month to allow the world's message to be braodcast into your home.

TV generates lust and greed. Can anyone say they have turned from sin while paying for cable? Do not be deceived, friend.

[diligentile]

That's about as silly as saying you endorse YouTube. Please look up endorse in the dictionary.

[jforsy01]

Endorse: To give approval of or support to, especially by public statement

He said VH1 was something he watched, FROM THE PULPIT!

Anyway, thats beside the point. The real issue here is TV is evil. There is not a single channel that glorifies Jesus. Even the religious channels are full of false teaching.

We know Him if we keep his commands. 1John3. Can anyone say they keep His commands when they pay to have lust, greed, covetousness and the world's ideals brought into their home?

[diligentile]

Whatever, there is a difference in endorsing something and saying you came across something channel surfing... basic language comprehension that you seem to not be able to grasp.

Would you say that you endorse YouTube and what is on it by way of your viewing and leaving comments here?

[jblcva]

Tonight 12/11/09 The feast of Dedication

began at sunset: John 10:22...

Christ Mass is of Pagan origins.

[TheInvisiGyrl]

I loved this, thought it was pretty good. One thing left out... The transition from St. Nicholaus to Santa Clause to rolly-polly fat guy was made in the 1900's by a graphic artist who while working on a Coca-Cola (tm) ad, fattened up the 1800's St. Nick and made him the jolly guy he is today, gave him the white trim which i think may have originally been an animal pelt on the 1800's figure - in the name of advertising. ONLY 100 years later, look at where we are. WAKE UP

[frogdogg68]

dude the most high going to tell the pagan people who celebrate man holidays to depart from me i never knew you.the most high has his days to celebrate and the devil has his days and those days are christmas,easter,halloween,new years etc,etc.the most high days are sabbath,passover,blowin of trumpets,purum,feast of unleave bread,feast of the taberncal people dont celebrate the most high days instead they celebrate man holidays/satan

[jdnmlm]

magicmischief"

Are you sure it doesn't matter? At what time does God approve of idolatry? If it says don't do it in your Bible then maybe we shouldn't do it.

Jeremiah 10:1-8 talks about the traditions and idolatry associated with Christmas. Remember Jeremiah wrote about 1000 yrs before these traditions came to be associated with God. He says, "learn not the way of the Heathen...They cut down a tree in the forest and deck it with silver and gold etc"

It is a don't do!

[stmcgarret]

Amen - you are spot on. Good to hear of others who are holding fast to the word and not bending knee to paganism and romanism.

[jdnmlm]

stecmgarret"

Same.

I am angry that it took me till I was an adult to know I was celebrating something that God wouldn't like. I sat through all the Christmas plays and went to church plays and my parents told me of Santa and pushed these things without even researching them.

And even when I tell them that it is wrong and they can read it for themselves, they say, "Oh that was then in the old testament, we are in the new testament now!"

They surely love the day more than God.

[stmcgarret]

Indeed jdnmlm, but to God be the Glory that he opened your eyes and now you see. I was raised in Romanism before I was delivered and saved by God's grace so I did the whole x-mass gig also. You are correct; many kick hard against the pricks even when shown the truth about the evil day. It is wrong from every angle I have examined it. You can find a lengthy study I did at thehouriscoming d_o_t c_o_m. I traced the day all the way back to Babylon. Blessings to you and hold fast to God's word!

[jdnmlm]

thanks for the link I will check it out

[daro2096]

Morning Has Broken was wriiten by Eleanor Farjeon not Cat Stevens. He only covered it.

[YankeeTom63]

Some parents play Santa Claus, and some parents play God....I know which one I'd Choose!

[YankeeTom63]

There was no room at the inn because there was no money in the hand and the inn keeper was not taking it on the cuff! Damned money changers!

[YankeeTom63]

Freedom of speech and Free exchange of Ideas. :)

[girlsdream93]

please remove these videos

[diligentile]

did you watch them to see what they're about?

[ytany84]

This is no big thing. Jehovah's Witnesses have shunned these so-called "Christian" Holidays for almost 8 decades.

[ygp1012]

Actually your close 2 the Messiah Yahushua's birth but not at the feast of trumpets. Go bact 2 Shemoth/Exodus. 3 times a year all males R 2 go 2 Yerushalem Passover-First fruits-Booths.

The Messiah Yahushua was born on the 1st day of the Festible of Booths.And 2 help proove I can But then U would need 2 understand Hebraic concepts

[petemillner]

Here's a question- can it be said that the destruction and problems caused by the material excesses of Christmas (Look up statistics for average amount borrowed by families to pay for Christmas, and drunkenness, and gluttony) are simply the fruit of the plant whose roots are so firmly planted in paganism/ idolatry?

[stmcgarret]

The truth is that this day is not Christian unless you believe man can take paganism, "baptize" it and make it Christian. The fact that it was not celebrated by the early, apostolic, faithful church should be enough. I wrote a paper on the day found at thehouriscoming(dot)com. The reason people fight so hard to hold to the day has nothing to do with Biblical fidelity but rather because they love the day and don't want to give it up and thus can write off the paganism & syncretism as no big deal

[firebirdhome]

I suggest people look up all the info they can on Christmas so they themselves can say 'so what' with authority. You would not believe the everyday pagan practices we do/have if you simply look things up for their "origins"! So Merry Christmas. My lites and tree are up and there are dinners awaiting. No children will be sacrificed in any of my celebrations.

[firebirdhome]

After 23 years in cult ministry it is quite clear that the Christmas and Halloween warriors are simply putting more religious aggression into their 'faith' which is most likely mundane. I can assume they follow pagan practices too such as wedding rings (Egyptian) and an incredible amount of other paganistic/satanic rituals/practices. I can assure everyone that all this wonderful info requires a 2 word response.... so what. Coming from pagan practitionists anyway if they wear rings... so what.

[diligentile]

Did you listen through the entire series firebird?

If you did, then you would have known that this is about informing people of Christmas traditions and nothing more. You sure make a lot of assumptions that are unwarranted and uncalled for- "a mundane faith"?

[firebirdhome]

Ok fair enough, stike the mundane. However, I stand firm against people trying to force others to actually find guilt where none should exist. That is cultic tactics. Beside ignoring so many other 'traditions' and practices they engage in themselves from rings to hanging crosses or the 4th of July fireworks... be consistent. If you can't see my point, or know that Christ was greater than the Temple, this is a useless discuassion.

[diligentile]

Who is being forced? Once again, it is clear you didn't listen past the first 10 seconds.

Surely you draw lines in what traditions you follow and those in which you say "no thanks" to "it goes against my conscience". No one has set any standard here, merely stating the history of Christmas traditions.

[firebirdhome]

If your faith is so tender, then it is best you do not celebrate a day called Christmas. It is no more a Christian necessity anymore than the pagan practice of wearing emblems of religion, though many have no problem wearing a cross. Christmas is just a day, festivities and gatherings are fun. If no child sacrifices are employed, then again, so what to your terrors of origins. Paul would eat a steak with 666 stamped on it, you're conscience would have you running and squeeling.

[diligentile]

Yes, you know me quite well. sigh.

[FreddyKrugerOFFICIAL]

MERRY CHRISTMAS! And Tradition isnt cancer! Its a wonderful time to see ppl who u love and care about and to have a good time.

[FreddyKrugerOFFICIAL]

Yes i know there are spellling errors. ^^ Great then! :)

[FreddyKrugerOFFICIAL]

!!! What? are you guys kiddin or what? Christmas and new years eve are times of JOY.YES Jesus was not borned in dec. He was born in june i think. But christmas is still a good time to remember and think about the REAL miricale of christmas. And i dont rly think theres anything wrong with the rest of christmas either. Except it is a bit to comercial.

[weeweelegs]

Christians are so inbeded with christmas

they just close their ears and eyes,

tradition is a cancer,, Jesus was more likely born around Sept or Oct, the 25 of Dec is a pagan Sun worship date. Christian should worship the Son

[diligentile]

Did you listen through the series weeweelegs?

[firebirdhome]

What the? Are you insane? What Christians worships a sun god? However, TODAY a sunworshipper is simply a phrase for dedicated suntanners. What a miserable legalistic life some like to live just to follow a crowd of Christians who get a superior kick. Don't be one of them.

[diligentile]

Can you even remotely substantiate any of your wild and pejorative claims that you've made firebird?

1. a miserable legalistic life

2. in order to get a superior kick

Thanks

[firebirdhome]

Certainly. I've read all your comments.

[diligentile]

Which show nothing of legalism or aspirations for getting "a superior kick."

[mrskcinvegas]

heard it was pagean "chose 2 B ignorant" month ago read Jeramiah 10 wasn't well w/ my soul book of Ecclesiastes came 2 mind "there's nothing new under the sun" tried 2 put it on backburner 2 weeks later sister in law found out bout xmas tree not good knew i had 2 research xmas found had pre christian roots that Catholicism mixed pagean practices w/ christianity aka ChristsMass Im exCath Cath is blaspheme 2 real Jesus w/ many similarities to Babylon "nothin new under sun" No more xmas 4 me.

[firebirdhome]

NO!! Read the verses! They chop the tree down, adorn it .... and WORSHIP it. Don't follow religionists. Gods wrath is not attached to a cool Christmas tree. Unless you're worshipping it.

[diligentile]

That's like having a giant Molech idol in your living room and saying, " but I don't worship it or nor burn babies on it, it's just such a joy to have in the home around this time of year."

Anyways, If you would have listened to the series instead of jumping to conclusions, you would know that Jim doesn't condemn anyone who has a tree. That's up to your conscience before God.

[firebirdhome]

Yet your wedding ring tradition from Egypt is innnocent? They believed there was a special connection with the wedding finger and a persons heart, hence why it was placed on that finger. Are you a follower too? Christ is greater than "ideas" like a ring or a tree. Conscience before God over a tree??! Islam started the shoe rack, should I throw mine out too? Should I put up a Big Gulp cup holder rotating on a gold stand with green lites instead? Did you know Christ was greater than the Temple?

[diligentile]

lol, lets carry it to the extremes in order to justify the adoption of pagan practices for the celebration of Christ's birth.

This message is to show where we get our Christmas traditions from and nothing more, and it is clear they don't come from the Bible. Do with it what you will.