Christopher Hitchens - Lost and Stolen Art pt. 1/6

[SpecterWSA]

Im a babykiller and proud of it hooah

[gary031183]

I love listening to a panel of intelligent people actually discussing issues that would matter to the rest of the world if they seperated themselves from the television for a while and went to college. Great conversation! Love it!

[zebdmaya]

Hitch slapped

[Pitfytr]

If Egypt or any of the countries where these artifacts are from have the capacity to take proper care. Then they should be returned to their natural home. Don't tell me the museums are staking a claim cause they found them first!!!

[wovokanarchy]

Cuno states," Claim the modern state of Egypt has on the remains of an ancient civ. of which they have long since been divorced to which they have no concept than physical proximity". How arrogant for a white westerner to claim Egyptians didn't know their own history until white men such as himself showed them. A great example of racist imperialist thinking behind scientific inquiry in the liberal arts. Archeaology is nothing more than sugar coated grave robbing. I would love to dig up his race

[ebola4fun]

@wovokanarchy i can smell your tofu from here

[wovokanarchy]

@ebola4fun What the fuck is ''tofu"?

[smurfieboo]

@wovokanarchy toe fungi

[Defenstrator]

@wovokanarchy It may sound arrogent, but it's also a fact. The knowledge of ancient egypt was mostly discovered by the west. As to digging up his race, too late. From victorian graveyards to the mass graves of war to famous tombs, westerners have had no problem scraping open the dirt to see how their ancestors really lived.

[ivanmikhailov]

I don't know if I'm just in love with Hitchens, but everyone else who speaks, in comparison to Hitchens, just sounds empty. Their comments are without wit, their statements without insight, and their delivery without life. Long live hitchens.

[adsensus]

Bah. This is like when a women gives her kid up for adoption. You separated that from your life... you cant come back when the kid is 12 and say you want custody again.

[stevebritgimp]

To some degree I do think things should be put back as they were, and restored as much as possible. On the other hand unfortunately most of the ancient Eurasian civilisations are now in countries dominated by Islam, and even before Islam people defaced these objects as being profane. So much of the world's archaeology has been destroyed in situ. So it's six of one and half a dozen of the other. Maybe we should return these artefacts, but to the Copts, rather than the Egyptians.

[ficklefiend]

Meh, we paid for it, we held it. Why should we give it back? It's ours now.

[BillKiernan]

we dragged them kicking and screaming into the 20th century, the least they can do is let us keep what they would have let rot anyway.

[handofnergal]

beautiful artwork

[badmofker]

I cant believe how the guy in glasses is justifying theft of a countries and peoples heritage. If my parents died when I was a baby and someone came and stole all my heirlooms. Then I grow up with no knowledge of these items by his justification I would have no claim to them.

I am left wondering if he actually believes what he is saying or he is trying to manipulate the debate for his own agenda.

The items should be returned.

[Mercurybath]

Thats not really a fair comparison, the items aren't your items, but items made by someone thousands of years ago who happened to live in the same area as you. To not recognize the difference is naive. Further, are the items bound to the area they were created at? the culture which created them? the families of the people who actually created them? It's stupid that they were moved in the first place, but why do people who have nothing to do with them claim the right to "take them back"?

[purplesimba]

Sharon Waxman's voice to my ears is like having a hot needle put in my urethra!

[Jackinthehizzle]

I think, for the sake of the art, it should be kept in the place where it is most safely protected (or restored) and where it can be presented to the greatest number of admirers. This, as it happens, is rarely in its birthplace.

By the way, is there anything that Hitchens ISN'T an expert on? The guy is unbelievable. A true intellectual.

[jeremyshambles]

i agree, hitchens most likely knows more about skateboarding than i do, cheers

[Mike3303]

Hitchens pulled off the 900 long before Tony Hawk ever did.

[hd26R601]

Refreshing to see him talking about sth other than religion!

[Arondeus]

@Jackinthehizzle - Spoken like a truly arrogant Imperialist. Tell you what. I'll throw my hat in with your view of justice, and based on that, I think there are many items stored in your home that you simply aren't using to their full potential. I think I would enjoy those items much more, as they were meant to be. Therefore, you must surely be alright with my entering your home and taking those items at my earliest convenience. They will then be put to better use in my home. Thanks!

[Jackinthehizzle]

@Arondeus Your analogy is patently flawed. No individual can claim ownership to ancient works of art, which is why this debate is being had in the first place.

As for your idiotic assertion that I'm an "arrogant imperialist," I fail to see the connection between the preservation of art and nationalistic expansion, and I doubt you're smart enough to explain it to me. Cries of imperialism, fascism, etc. are common "go to" insults for pseudo-intellectuals like yourself.

[Cazador]

@Jackinthehizzle Seriously, the guy is insane. He has three degrees from Oxford, in Economics, Philosophy, and History, yet somehow has also found time to read about and become an expert on every other subject known to man.  The man is incredible.

[Goi825]

@Cazador not to put Hitchens down at all (I think the man's a genius!) but he has a single degree in 'PPE' - politics, philosophy and economics. It is a degree that is offered at a number of British universities.

[Cazador]

@Goi825 Yeah my bad, I mean a degree in three areas of study. It's still too much education for most American to compete with. He knows way too much. I feel like a second grader next to him.

[twooffour]

@Jackinthehizzle

He's not an expert on science ;)

[YesYou123333]

@Jackinthehizzle Yes. On knowing God. On that issue Hitchen's is a stupid fuck.

[Prytanus]

It's funny, I was discussing this issue the other day with my girlfriend, and then I stumble on this video while searching to see what hijinks Hitchens has been up to lately...

I think art ought to be returned to the original countries so long as the original country is politically stable, and willing and able to care for and preserve the art.

Otherwise, |= |_| ( |< 'em.

Look what the taliban did to the giant Buddhas. That's all the evidence that's necessary to argue for western stewardship.

[tasikas75]

Do you realize that half the marbles that were taken are at the bottom of the sea from a ship that sank. Do you realize that they might of been better off not touched at all. The marbles belong to the Parthenon.

[AIDINSWE]

when was this

[illwrath]

A great deal of art was spirited away in order to protect it from the people of the region at the time.

Every major war for the last several hundred years has this happen.

[dgdfhfghgfhgfgffjhj]

I would have been on the side of unconditional return of art to its original location, but I now think that Cuno guy is right.

If this art was just sitting around decaying, with no effort to preserve or protect it, why can't the French or British come in and, with permission of the residents, take it back to their museum?

And why should a new government which just happens to occupy the same general area, and probably wiped out the creator culture, have any special claim?

[spacerumsfeld]

Greeks still exist, and while maybe your argument holds true under the long occupation/instability that country experienced for a while, the fact is there's no reason not to return it now (except that it is an attraction in the captor's museum now).