the irony of communism and something that hypocriteical scum like billy bragg refuse to admit is that soviet communism was created by capitalist bankers in the USA (Jacob schiiff) and in Britiain (Rothschilds)
This FACT is well documented, and was widely known at the time.
The truth is out there for anyone who cares to look for it.
Fascism is just Socialism followed to it's logical, inevitable conclusion. YouTube comments by revisionism-spouting, holocaust-denying Campus Jackboots aren't going to change that.
I think its time for a defintion: Socialism is the control of the factors of production by the state.
By this definition, National-Socialism was not really socialist; the state did not exert direct control, but rather engaged in cooperative measures with major industrialists. This is Corporatism.
So I think we can all quiet down now and stop calling the Nazis either Socialist or Capitalist. They were neither.
In the US, it was the socialists who opposed Hitler. The conservative America Firsters thought we should let him be. This song was written by Woody Guthrie, a socialist.
But hell, a socialist also wrote the Pledge of Allegiance.
Ahhh! As an "Old F**t" I'm pleased to see that the younger generation have got everything sorted. The past is now a closed book. The state of the world and it's history summed in one line and an explitive. Oh! PLEASE govern us! We need you, YOU ****
Thans for Sharing Saved!! Kind Regards, MP friends
"Here at home and throughout the world people are fighting back against the forces of wealth, privilege and militarism — some because they have no choice, others because they would choose no other course but the one that leads to peace and justice." — Michael Parenti
@tdottim Its called hijacking a word in order to steal votes from traditionally left-wing districts. I did my master's thesis on why people supported Hitler and the use of the term "socialist" by a violently reactionary right-wing party, the Nazis, was an attempt to win support from German working people - it never worked. German workers never truly supported the Nazi cause and the violently pro-big business economic policies pursued by Hitler once in power prove he was no socialist.
@blackiron60 : Yeah I suppose I'd have to tell myself that too if I called myself a socialist. Other than being virulently racist the nazi party ideology stressed the failures of laissez-faire capitalism, economic liberalism, and democracy. Sounds pretty socialist to me. LOL on the "I did my master's thesis on..." line. As if that's supposed to infer instant credibility. And I'm very familiar with the practice of hijacking words for political cause. It's done by the left with "racist" everyday.
@blackiron60 I agree with what you're saying for the most part - anyone who thinks that Nazism is representative of socialism is a complete moron and is watching too much Fox News. But Nazism is not the same as nationalistic capitalism - the Nazis had plenty of anti-business policies, including increasing welfare and taking profits from heavy industry. Also it's pretty silly to use Soviet imagery with this song, considering the USSR was just as terrible a regime at times as Nazi Germany.
@agunatak It would be silly, if you believed all the lies Robert Conquest and other assorted right-wing historians have been trying to spread about Stalin and the USSR for the last 70 odd years. It's hard to take seriously historians whose original sources were from the pro-Nazi Hearst newspaper empire or from pro-Nazi Ukrainian emigres.
@blackiron60 It's a mistake to lump Stalin with the early accomplishments of the October revolution. Stalin was the face of the counter-revolution (in this way he shares a legacy with Hitler), the main manifestation of which was abandonment of internationalism. His main ideological weapon here was the idea of "Socialism in one country". His first victims were the old Bolsheviks and pretty much everyone to the left of him. Denouncing Stalin does no harm to communist principles.
@blackiron60 It's a mistake to lump Stalin with the early accomplishments of the October revolution. Stalin was the face of the counter-revolution (in this way he shares a legacy with Hitler), one manifestation of which was abandonment of internationalism. His ideological weapon here was the idea of "Socialism in one country". His victims included old Bolsheviks and everyone to the left of him. Denouncing Stalin does no harm to communist principles. The Right-wing lie is Stalinism=socialism.
@agunatak I agree that it's ironic/misguided to use Soviet imagery in this song. It doesn't jive with the spirit as I understand it. A real rejection of fascism has to take into account the capitalistic-bourgeois origin of fascism as a reaction to the militancy and internationalism of the working class. What we have instead is propaganda supporting one imperialist side in a war in which all sides were imperialist. Anti-fascism is properly anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist.
@agunatak I agree that it's ironic/misguided to use WWII-era Soviet imagery in this song. It doesn't jive with the spirit as I understand it. A real rejection of fascism has to take into account the capitalistic-bourgeois origin of fascism as a reaction to the militancy and internationalism of the working class. What we have instead is propaganda supporting one imperialist side in a war in which all sides were imperialist. Anti-fascism is properly anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist.
@agunatak I agree that it's ironic/misguided to use WWII-era Soviet imagery in this song. It doesn't jive with the spirit as I understand it. A real rejection of fascism has to take into account the capitalistic-bourgeois origin of fascism as a reaction to the militancy and internationalism of the working class. What we have instead is propaganda supporting one imperialist side in a war in which all sides were imperialist. Anti-fascism is properly anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist.
@agunatak Don't worry, agunatak. When he says fascist or Nazi sources, he means the massive paper trail the Soviet authorities left behind and the testimonies of thousands of Soviet citizens, plenty of whom are not actually fascist. Anyone who disagrees with blackiron60's conclusions about the destruction Stalin wrought is a fascist. See how it works? Logical fallacies trump logic in the mind of the commissar.
@tdottim Hitler was very charismatic and good with words, as most of the world's notorious leaders and dictators have been. He coined terms like 'Jew-Commie', when Judaism has nothing to do with Communism and vice versa, but in doing so he united people who hated Jews and people who hated Communists to engender support for his party. The swastika wasn't his either - it's been used for 3000 years and predates the Egyptian ankh. Historically it was used to represent life, strength, and good luck.
@tdottim Hitler was very charismatic and good with words, as most of the world's notorious leaders and dictators have been. He coined terms like 'Jew-Commie', when Judaism has nothing to do with Communism and vice versa, but in doing so he united people who hated Jews and people who hated Communists to engender support for his party. The swastika wasn't his either - it's been used for 3000 years and predates the Egyptian ankh. Historically it was used to represent life, strength, and good luck.
@tdottim well if you look up the nazi party actually had some comunist influences (not socialist) but those werent really respected in the party mainly as the years went by. the SA had many pan-germanic ultranationalistic-communist inspired members and even Röhm was gay and comunism influenced and hitler knew that for years before the night of the long knives. well i don't have to say that the comunist german-workers nazi branch was erased and seen as an extremist side of nazism.
@tdottim the SA were in fact called "brown on the outside, red on the inside" for their comunist influences.
btw you should learn the definition of Fascism, Communism and Socialism so you don't keep mixing it up as you obviously are. Fascism, Communism and Socialism are three different things (even thought you can call communism in general as an authoritarian branch of socialism)
@tdottim Just because NAZI includes the word "socialism' doesn't mean the NAZIs were socialists. They were, of course, the opposite: FACISTS. And what country was more socialist than the USSR? That's a good illustration that neither extreme works, left or right.
@tdottim better learn some history.....who beat the nazis and fascist back in WWII??? USSR about 85% of the war the rest the other allies........so fuck off...the only one that can destroy fascism is socialism...what was in germany was a fascist regime masked as a national socialsm...no such thing....
blackiron60 - Hey You Billy Bragg I should take my head out of my jazz tilt and oldies rock and such I think I heard of you and now I FOR SURE HAVE two thumbs up for you brother I will download more of your music and maybe try and catch your performance live maybe you come out here to the Coachella Valley in California we have a big music festival each year too, I am Vietnam Vet era
the irony of communism and something that hypocriteical scum like billy bragg refuse to admit is that soviet communism was created by capitalist bankers in the USA (Jacob schiiff) and in Britiain (Rothschilds)
This FACT is well documented, and was widely known at the time.
The truth is out there for anyone who cares to look for it.
crozzerz88 4 days ago
Fascism is just Socialism followed to it's logical, inevitable conclusion. YouTube comments by revisionism-spouting, holocaust-denying Campus Jackboots aren't going to change that.
NiceGuyCody 2 months ago
It would also be silly to leave out the Soviet imagery considering they bore the brunt of the cost of defeating Nazi Germany.
JosephSurface 3 months ago
I think its time for a defintion: Socialism is the control of the factors of production by the state.
By this definition, National-Socialism was not really socialist; the state did not exert direct control, but rather engaged in cooperative measures with major industrialists. This is Corporatism.
So I think we can all quiet down now and stop calling the Nazis either Socialist or Capitalist. They were neither.
Mahacanda 4 months ago
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@dutchjoens No more than the People's Republic of China is Republican.
cfortunato58 4 months ago
@dutchjoens Then we all raise as one and slay the ones who want to kill like Capitalists.
BeardleProductions 5 months ago
Anybody who thinks the Nazis were socialist must think the People's Republic of China is Republican.
cfortunato58 7 months ago 10
In the US, it was the socialists who opposed Hitler. The conservative America Firsters thought we should let him be. This song was written by Woody Guthrie, a socialist.
But hell, a socialist also wrote the Pledge of Allegiance.
cfortunato58 7 months ago
Ahhh! As an "Old F**t" I'm pleased to see that the younger generation have got everything sorted. The past is now a closed book. The state of the world and it's history summed in one line and an explitive. Oh! PLEASE govern us! We need you, YOU ****
acrolith01 7 months ago
Commies, nazis, same filth. Fuck collectivism.
TheREALDanontheMoon 8 months ago
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stalin killed millions?
KantorekBaumerB14 9 months ago
Thans for Sharing Saved!! Kind Regards, MP friends
"Here at home and throughout the world people are fighting back against the forces of wealth, privilege and militarism — some because they have no choice, others because they would choose no other course but the one that leads to peace and justice." — Michael Parenti
MichaelParentiOrg 9 months ago
I thought this particular video take was interesting- USSR vs. Nazi Germany.
MDProgger 9 months ago
@MDProgger especially when the two dictatorships were allied from August 1939 till July 1941 and neatly diced up eastern Europe
backnumber1662 9 months ago
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Communism killed over 20 million + people before the rise of Fascism
madeinEngland64 10 months ago
GREAT song...BUT..."socialism kills fascists?? LOL. I think you need to look up Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei
tdottim 1 year ago
@tdottim Its called hijacking a word in order to steal votes from traditionally left-wing districts. I did my master's thesis on why people supported Hitler and the use of the term "socialist" by a violently reactionary right-wing party, the Nazis, was an attempt to win support from German working people - it never worked. German workers never truly supported the Nazi cause and the violently pro-big business economic policies pursued by Hitler once in power prove he was no socialist.
blackiron60 1 year ago 27
@blackiron60 : Yeah I suppose I'd have to tell myself that too if I called myself a socialist. Other than being virulently racist the nazi party ideology stressed the failures of laissez-faire capitalism, economic liberalism, and democracy. Sounds pretty socialist to me. LOL on the "I did my master's thesis on..." line. As if that's supposed to infer instant credibility. And I'm very familiar with the practice of hijacking words for political cause. It's done by the left with "racist" everyday.
tdottim 1 year ago
@blackiron60 I agree with what you're saying for the most part - anyone who thinks that Nazism is representative of socialism is a complete moron and is watching too much Fox News. But Nazism is not the same as nationalistic capitalism - the Nazis had plenty of anti-business policies, including increasing welfare and taking profits from heavy industry. Also it's pretty silly to use Soviet imagery with this song, considering the USSR was just as terrible a regime at times as Nazi Germany.
agunatak 11 months ago 5
@agunatak It would be silly, if you believed all the lies Robert Conquest and other assorted right-wing historians have been trying to spread about Stalin and the USSR for the last 70 odd years. It's hard to take seriously historians whose original sources were from the pro-Nazi Hearst newspaper empire or from pro-Nazi Ukrainian emigres.
blackiron60 11 months ago
@blackiron60 It's a mistake to lump Stalin with the early accomplishments of the October revolution. Stalin was the face of the counter-revolution (in this way he shares a legacy with Hitler), the main manifestation of which was abandonment of internationalism. His main ideological weapon here was the idea of "Socialism in one country". His first victims were the old Bolsheviks and pretty much everyone to the left of him. Denouncing Stalin does no harm to communist principles.
SC88213 10 months ago
@SC88213 Aye. Trotsky. Animal Farm was a great parable.
MDProgger 9 months ago
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@blackiron60 It's a mistake to lump Stalin with the early accomplishments of the October revolution. Stalin was the face of the counter-revolution (in this way he shares a legacy with Hitler), one manifestation of which was abandonment of internationalism. His ideological weapon here was the idea of "Socialism in one country". His victims included old Bolsheviks and everyone to the left of him. Denouncing Stalin does no harm to communist principles. The Right-wing lie is Stalinism=socialism.
SC88213 10 months ago
@agunatak I agree that it's ironic/misguided to use Soviet imagery in this song. It doesn't jive with the spirit as I understand it. A real rejection of fascism has to take into account the capitalistic-bourgeois origin of fascism as a reaction to the militancy and internationalism of the working class. What we have instead is propaganda supporting one imperialist side in a war in which all sides were imperialist. Anti-fascism is properly anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist.
SC88213 10 months ago
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@agunatak I agree that it's ironic/misguided to use WWII-era Soviet imagery in this song. It doesn't jive with the spirit as I understand it. A real rejection of fascism has to take into account the capitalistic-bourgeois origin of fascism as a reaction to the militancy and internationalism of the working class. What we have instead is propaganda supporting one imperialist side in a war in which all sides were imperialist. Anti-fascism is properly anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist.
SC88213 10 months ago
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@agunatak I agree that it's ironic/misguided to use WWII-era Soviet imagery in this song. It doesn't jive with the spirit as I understand it. A real rejection of fascism has to take into account the capitalistic-bourgeois origin of fascism as a reaction to the militancy and internationalism of the working class. What we have instead is propaganda supporting one imperialist side in a war in which all sides were imperialist. Anti-fascism is properly anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist.
SC88213 10 months ago
@agunatak Don't worry, agunatak. When he says fascist or Nazi sources, he means the massive paper trail the Soviet authorities left behind and the testimonies of thousands of Soviet citizens, plenty of whom are not actually fascist. Anyone who disagrees with blackiron60's conclusions about the destruction Stalin wrought is a fascist. See how it works? Logical fallacies trump logic in the mind of the commissar.
Baibakov88 10 months ago
@agunatak
You clearly know nothing about the USSR or other Soviet countries then. Nor does Bragg btw, he's no more than a pishy social democrat who loves fame.
ourhandsaretied 1 month ago
@blackiron60 wow man, I sure would like to read your thesis, would answer a lot of questions I've had for a long time.
MDProgger 9 months ago
@tdottim Why? How 'democratic' was DDR? Deutsche Demokratische Republik? You're not what you call yourself - you are what you actually do ...
Charuchi 11 months ago
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@tdottim Why? How 'democratic' was DDR? Deutsche Demokratische Republik? You're not what you call yourself - you are what you actually do ...
Charuchi 11 months ago
@tdottim Hitler was very charismatic and good with words, as most of the world's notorious leaders and dictators have been. He coined terms like 'Jew-Commie', when Judaism has nothing to do with Communism and vice versa, but in doing so he united people who hated Jews and people who hated Communists to engender support for his party. The swastika wasn't his either - it's been used for 3000 years and predates the Egyptian ankh. Historically it was used to represent life, strength, and good luck.
foppitpoo 11 months ago
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@tdottim Hitler was very charismatic and good with words, as most of the world's notorious leaders and dictators have been. He coined terms like 'Jew-Commie', when Judaism has nothing to do with Communism and vice versa, but in doing so he united people who hated Jews and people who hated Communists to engender support for his party. The swastika wasn't his either - it's been used for 3000 years and predates the Egyptian ankh. Historically it was used to represent life, strength, and good luck.
foppitpoo 11 months ago
@tdottim well if you look up the nazi party actually had some comunist influences (not socialist) but those werent really respected in the party mainly as the years went by. the SA had many pan-germanic ultranationalistic-communist inspired members and even Röhm was gay and comunism influenced and hitler knew that for years before the night of the long knives. well i don't have to say that the comunist german-workers nazi branch was erased and seen as an extremist side of nazism.
arthurude1 11 months ago
@tdottim the SA were in fact called "brown on the outside, red on the inside" for their comunist influences.
btw you should learn the definition of Fascism, Communism and Socialism so you don't keep mixing it up as you obviously are. Fascism, Communism and Socialism are three different things (even thought you can call communism in general as an authoritarian branch of socialism)
arthurude1 11 months ago
@arthurude1 : Yeah sure. I'll rush out and learn what you think I should learn, as soon as you learn to spell.
tdottim 9 months ago
@tdottim Just because NAZI includes the word "socialism' doesn't mean the NAZIs were socialists. They were, of course, the opposite: FACISTS. And what country was more socialist than the USSR? That's a good illustration that neither extreme works, left or right.
MDProgger 9 months ago
@tdottim better learn some history.....who beat the nazis and fascist back in WWII??? USSR about 85% of the war the rest the other allies........so fuck off...the only one that can destroy fascism is socialism...what was in germany was a fascist regime masked as a national socialsm...no such thing....
iliesko 2 months ago
blackiron60 - Hey You Billy Bragg I should take my head out of my jazz tilt and oldies rock and such I think I heard of you and now I FOR SURE HAVE two thumbs up for you brother I will download more of your music and maybe try and catch your performance live maybe you come out here to the Coachella Valley in California we have a big music festival each year too, I am Vietnam Vet era
persevere4 1 year ago
Jodeos Fascistas hijos de la mierda VIVA EL COMUNISMO HURRA
Buziyo 1 year ago
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THESTAFFIECHANNEL 1 year ago
Great cover of a great song.
EpifanesEuergetes 1 year ago 2
Billy is rockin!
Great video man.
Keep up the good work.
19wally48 2 years ago